trinities 361 - A Lutheran pastor explains Socinianism and biblical unitarianism

trinities.org/blog/podcast-36... In this episode I interact with a video by Lutheran Pastor Joshua Sullivan at Holy Cross Lutheran Church in Kerrville, Texas. A listener asked him for his views on “Socinianism” and this so-called “biblical unitarianism,” and why they contradict the Bible.
He replies with some descriptions and definitions, and then gives some arguments as to why these sorts of views are unbiblical.
I interact with his video, agreeing, disagreeing, and adding a lot of information - historical, theological, and sociological.
Topics include:
“Socinians” and Socinus
“Arians”
“biblical unitarians”
“unitarian Christians”
Whether unitarian Christianity can be defined by a “rationalistic” methodological stance.
Whether unitarian Christians think Jesus is in any sense “divine.”
Traditional catholic views on generation and procession, and why most unitarian Christians don’t accept these - like some present-day trinitarians!
unitarian views on atonement and salvation
unitarian views on “the holy spirit”
Characterizations of unitarian Christians as “deniers” of various things.
How anti-Calvinistic today’s unitarians are
18th-19th British and American unitarian Christianity
Traditional catholic appeals to “mystery” in the face of theological problems.
So-called “classical theism”
Various traditional catholic claims which are neither self-evident nor taught in Scripture, but which are widely assumed in trinitarian circles.
How to prove an impossibility claim, e.g. it would be impossible for a non-divine Jesus to “fully” reveal God.
Whether worshiping a non-divine Jesus is the sin of idolatry.
2 (literal) definitions of “idolatry”
Whether Scripture teaches that it is wrong to worship anyone unless they are fully divine.
The implications of Jesus’ exaltation to God’s right hand.
Whether Jesus claims essential equality with the Father.
Pastor Sullivan argues that if unitarian Christian views were true then:
the Father wouldn’t be a real father and the Son wouldn’t be a real son
the Son wouldn’t be the brightness of God’s glory or a true image of God
God would have changed, so would not be essentially immutable
the Son wouldn’t be able to “fully” reveal God
Jesus couldn’t truly say that if you’ve seen him you’ve seen the Father
Jesus would basically be like other prophets, and not in a class of his own
Jesus would have been unable to do any miracles.
Jesus could not truly be called our “savior.”
It would be wrong for us to worship Jesus
I explain why, for various reasons, these are not powerful objections to the views of unitarian Christians.
Links for this episode @ trinities.org/blog/podcast-36...
Pastor Sullivan’s video
The Racovian Catechism
An Interview With Dr. Dale Tuggy - by J. Dan Gill
Biblicalunitarian.com
podcast 357 - Seminary student takes Trinity class, becomes unitarian - Part 2
podcast 356 - Seminary student takes Trinity class, becomes unitarian - Part 1
podcast 189 - The unfinished business of the Reformation
The Tuggy-Brown debate: Dale’s opening statement
podcast 358 - Baptist Justice: Samuel Eddy on Scripture, Church Discipline, and the Trinity
Clarifying Catholic Christologies - by Dr. Dale Tuggy
podcast 235 - The Case Against Preexistence
Debate - “Is Jesus Human and not Divine?” - Dr. Dale Tuggy vs. Chris Date
podcast 145 - ‘Tis Mystery All: the Immortal dies!
The aloneness argument against classical theism
podcast 227 - Who Should Christians Worship?
podcast 167 - Lamson’s History of The Unitarian Congregationalists
Biblical Unitarian Podcast 204: An Introduction to the Theme of Misunderstanding in the Gospel of John
Biblical Unitarian Podcast 211: Jesus’ Misunderstood Father (John 8)
What John 1 meant
podcast 70 - The one God and his Son according to John
podcast 52 - John Locke’s The Reasonableness of Christianity, Part 1
podcast 286 - Is the Trinity Essential? - Three Views
What is essential to the gospel, according to Luke?
John 17:1-3, 1 Corinthians 8:4-6; Ephesians4:4-6: John 10: John 20:17; John 5:23; Phil 2:10-11; Act 2:22; John 14:10; John 3:34; Malachi 3:6; Revelation 5; Exodus 20:4-6; Matthew 4:10; John 8:40; John 5:15-47.
Weekly podcast exploring views about the Trinity, and more generally about God and Jesus in Christian theology and philosophy. Debates, interviews, and historical and contemporary perspectives. Hosted by philosopher of religion / analytic theologian Dr. Dale Tuggy.
This week's thinking music is "I dunno" by grapes.
dig.ccmixter.org/files/grapes/...

[@savoirfaire6181]

The name of your channel is priceless Dale! Just bought my wife the 40th anniversary Khan action figure for her 40th birthday. Greatest villain in the history of cinema. Your podcast is great too.

[@samuelcallai4209]

Wow, awesome video. I feel really glad for knowing your channel, Dale.

[@BiblicalBinitarian]

Thanks. This was helpful and clarifying. I can relate to having Trinitarians misdefine and misunderstand my Protestant views also. And don't call me Shirley.

[@moosa86]

Surely you know Shirley?

[@jcgoodman65]

RE: "God would have changed, so would not be essentially immutable" - By this pastor's logic, God's act of creation would have "CHANGED" Him....into a CREATOR?....Isn't is easier to simply receive the truth of 1 Cor. 8:6 ? When you have a child, as a human, it doesn't change your essence, it BEGINS a new relationship....and the child is subject to your parenting, your rules, and your world...