Building a Turbine Car
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- čas přidán 24. 05. 2024
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#3dprinting #physics #engineering #pneumatic #turbine - Věda a technologie
"Cool! is that electric?"
"No it's gas powered"
*pure oxygen*
Technically correct, the best KIND of correct!
Alright pal, you're goin downtown 👮👮
@@A.k.-47- actually only about 20% oxygen, assuming it just came from a bike pump
Outside of America calling something gas powered means an actual gas state of matter not a shortening of gasoline
I absolutely love the compressed air series. the way the way you get to the optimal result and don't half ass it is remarkable and respectable. we all can thank you for your videos.
This! He goes all the way to get a proper result, rather than doing the bare minimum and celebrating it.
@@JellyFishMachineyes, well put. exactly what I had in mind. along with a few others he goes into great detail, explaining it perfectly. not everyone can do that and I bet he is proud
I absolutely loathe it. You cannot power anything with this. It is completely impractical. Compressed air systems are very heavy and very inefficient. He's practically cheating by using a pop bottle. Even a small RC race car would need a MUCH, MUCH heavier bottle to carry significantly more air. Air compressors are quite inefficient as are most air tools. This is why they have been almost universally swapped out in auto mechanics, for example. There are still a lot in industrial use though. There are lots of good reasons they are. But energy inefficiency isn't one of them.
@@tarstarkusz It's like you've never had a hobby in your life.
@@WillowEpp Fun is a good reason to do anything. I don't oppose having fun. Why the heck else would anyone build an RC car?
It might be fun, but it isn't practical.
Really cool turbine exploration and execution. I'm honored to have made it into a Tom Stanton video!
are you currently working on a new video? i love these and i would love to see more :)
[maybe a quick spoiler whats going to be the next one all about?]
@@multiarray2320 more coming soon! No spoilers yet sorry :)
Torque graphs, RPMs, power output calculations, and a pneumatic drill sound? I feel like I'm watching an F1 crew talk about their car.
tbf there isnt much difference, especially if you are so dedicated to get the best result out of it.
Yeah, ONE difference is there, he gets a lower wage BUT more satisfaction wich cant be bought with money.
Yeah, I love it. I mean, the final build is like a top fuel dragster with those fat tires on the back but the whole video just made me think of F1 for some reason. When the turbine spins up, it even sort of sounds like an F1 car. So, so very cool.
Where air isn't being blown through the turbine, the turbine is acting as a fan which is wasting energy. If you block 90% or so of the turbine where there's no compressed air blowing through it, it won't waste as much energy.
It's the same as if you block a hoover, it uses less power so it spins up faster.
That and some shrouding around the nozzle to ensure the air can’t escape/be redirected at the higher speeds.
Also the outer shell rotating is creating a ton of surface drag. Need to switch to a static duct.
It also should be a one-way gear mesh that as the turbine slows it decouples from the flywheel, which means that its slowdown does not affect the power. Only energy in, and no added friction after the air pressure is too low.
Front wheels should also be tiny, and the bottle can be heatshrunk or a 2l vessel could be formed to be more aerodynamic. The bottle shape is not good and the front wheels are not helping with the rotational mass. The wheels should therefore be driven via a centrally mounted hub and with two sockets in order to reduce torque steer. To further reduce issues with the turbine, the fins should only be shaped like the water ones to redirect the air 180° and only on the rim say 1/2cm or less, so a cup or two cups per 'fin' a la water turbine blades and smaller. An additional ring made of metal could therefore be attached to the flywheel to balance it and add additional mass. But it definitely needs a central vertical position with a properly straight axle for both itself and the rear wheels to work. This wobbly jank is fine for a first concept but at high rpms there's not much room for error
Air being sticky and having friction is such an odd thing lol.
The dry ice around here comes in pellet form that fit right inside soda bottles. I would throw some dry ice in that bottle and a little water and run that car for a while. I did something similar with an air powered toy car back in the 80's.
Oh that’s sick, new renewable energy source? Takes the co2 out of the air and puts it right back
Just needs a pressure relief valve. I've been near 2L plastic bottles with dry ice in and when they let go, it's like a cannon going off and you can hear the bang rolling across the hills like thunder. Wouldn't want to be right next to it for sure.
You could drill out the end of a mini propane tank a 1 pounder and replace the normal valve head with a regulator that screwed on and not need to worry about it blowing up from dry ice. Soda bottle can hit 100psi+ with out exploding and 1 pound propane tank can get close to if not above 2k psi. Also water is not needed for dry ice to do it's thing it will sublimate just fine with out it
@@nanaki-seto You do not need to drill a 1 lbs propane tank. Just buy the required fitting. They are super simple designs. Pretty sure propane tanks are tested at 600 psi from the factory. Keep in mind that propane when 100F produces 175 or so psi. So they are very strong tanks. Weigh next to nothing and can hold so much air.
@@ezlectronic7718 At best, it's an energy storage medium. Refrigerating carbon dioxide into solid dry ice isn't free.
Compressed air has to be one of the most inefficient methods of energy storage…
That’s what makes all of your projects with it all that more impressive!
Yes, it's true. Pneumatic Cylinders are widely used in the industry. They have some (small) ambitions to replace them with electric actuators.
But electric actuators are many times more expensive in the purchase. And Pneumatic is simple and robust in operating and maintaining. That's why they stick with pneumatic.
A big part of the losses occur at the compressor in the form of excessive heat within the compressed air. As it cools down it looses energy. Some manufacturers store the excessive heat in paraffin, which heats up the air as it expands, giving some of the energy back to the working gas.
So, there is potential ...
Maybe Tom find's some clever ways to improve the overall efficiency ;-)
I mean I just like the concept of pneumatic air compressors and such.
This should be made an official competition. Only fixed bottle volume and pressure. Who make a faster dragster wins.
Love you man. I remember watching your first ebike build. You're one of the main reasons I decided to switch from Psychology to Mechanical Engineering. I graduate in two quarterrs.
Congratulations ! That's quite a leap
Bravo, mate. Top stuff.
Good luck bro!
Some might say a half 🙃
thank you for being seemingly the only person on youtube who actually discloses their onshape sponsorship.
I've done similar experiments w an air nozzle blowing against blades. I discovered that changing the angle of the nozzle to the blades based on the wheel/blades RPM has benefits. One angle for high torque/ low rpm, then changing the angle as it spins to more of a tangent for higher rpm. Also, I've found that the plastic soda bottles can hold up to 150psi, then regulate down to the usable psi.
That sounds easier than adding a gearbox
I'd love to see a small dragster competition where the only energy storage for the movement is a pressurised plastic bottle.
Bladed turbines, bladeless turbines, piston motors. Driven by wheels, propellers and jet nozzles and hovercraft skirts.
@@cloudpandarism2627 imagine strapping like 4 bottles onto the car, spinning up a flywheel then the car drops all the bottles to lose excess weight and just smokes it
@@yutakawasaki7207 even better.
yes. the air bottle being the only constant
"The Great Egg Race"
Water rockets would take a lot of beating.
You mentioned having problems with air leaks and friction in the vane motor. In air tools, the oil they use both reduces friction and acts as a seal between the vanes and casing. It might be worth revisiting that design, but adding some oil and seeing if that makes a difference.
9:46 I laughed like a giddy child, you have to admit it sounds gorgeous. good work Tom!
That empty bottle powering a high speed motor sets off my "fake free energy" reflexes, even when I know better. Awesome work!
it's not empty, it's full of air! lol
@@kenanjones3481Clever response indeed
I suggest using graphite powder as a lubricant for plastic parts. It's dry but can still function pretty well.
Also, bearings, bearings, bearings. Lube bearings up with really thin oil when they aren't going to generate lots of heat, if any at all, and thicker oil for parts that generate lots of heat. May have to experiment with different types of oil to find the right ones for each part.
one suggestion is to have a a smaller turbine and have 3-4 smaller nozzles, cus right now only one spot on the turbine is producing power, you could half the diameter by doubling the nozzles, won't be a 1-1 unless it's more efficient which it might be
Not saying it won't work but.. friction increases.
@@squidcaps4308 the friction moving the turbine would increases too
If the nozzles were staged it could dramatically increase efficiency. Have three nozzles. Use one very small nozzle as the low throttle. Don't open the second until the first is fully opened, then start opening the second, and so on. Partially opened valves are very inefficient. Having one valve fully opened with two others shut is a much better way to do 1/3 throttle vs 1 valve 1/3 open.
An axial turbine with multiple nozzles and stages would be the way to go; which looks like it's on the drawing board.
See also my comment about incorporating the throttling valve into the nozzle design.
Great video, and very neat concept. This reminds me of the "Turbonique" drag-axles that were a thing in the american drag-racing scene back in the 60s. They were essencially a turbine wheel, driven by a hypergolic fuel, integrated into the rear axle of the car, instead of having a traditional powertrain to drive the rear wheels. Maybe something similar is possible on an RC scale, similar to pyrotechnic starters on early jet engines with a solid rocket motor.
So funny seeing tiny little Hoosier drag slicks.
These sliding blade turbine design can be found as vacuum pump for the locks in a Audi b5 a4 from the 90.They are made with compressed graphite which reduces the friction. If you can get your hands on one from a scrapyard you may have a turbine that can work pretty efficiently with the limited amount of pressured air
Very cool Tom! I like how you’re doing both turbines and piston engines!
Compressed air for the win! best series on youtube
Tom. I'm always happy to see when you upload a new video. Your engineering skills are so inspiring. Every video you upload is such a treat. I've been watching your videos for a long time now, and the only thing I could ever ask of you, is to make more of them. You inspire me to learn new things and do stuff. Thank you very much.
You should get some old worn out vacuum gyroscopic aircraft instruments. The gyros are spun up using very similar turbines. Attitude indicators, DGs, and Turn Coordinators/Turn and Bank should have gyros in them - just make sure they’re “vacuum driven.”
Also you should probably be using jewel bearings for the turbines.
TESLA TURBINE!
Simple to make, but usually inefficient short of very viscous fluids.
@@ericlotze7724 I know, its just fun to talk about Tesla and his zany inventions
@@monstercameronyeah maybe tom should make a gobal wireless power station
@@ericlotze7724 skill issue
That would be so cool
Can you post the files for your turbine designs?
Awesome dyno! Love how simplistic yet functional you managed to make it!🎉
The sounds it makes while powering up and then coasting is pure blissful music to my ears
Finally another Tom Stanton video
yea
I think it would be worth it to make a 2 stages turbine ! You could extract much more energy, but keep in mind thattp be optimal rhe second stage should probably have a different pitch/volume to make use of the lower pressure aif coming in
This video gets a smile on my face, like most of your videos 😁. I am an engineer and I guess I should understand all this easily, but my mind isn’t nearly as practical as yours. So nice to see all your ideas come to life
Awesome man. Love the way you display the data with graphs. Admire you passion ❤️
maybe use the turbine to spin up a flywheel and use some sort of clutch to draw from the flywheel to propel the car.
Would a Nicolas tesla turbine work better?
No
Really good use of your air preassure study. Great project, well done and thanks for sharing
Waiting patiently as Tom gets ever closer to building a rocket engine turbopump :)
In all seriousness, always stunned by your clever mechanical design. Super inspiring.
Tesla turbine?
No torque
Shhhhhhhhhhh don't help smfh
Also don't forget some and deffinatly the tesla TURBINE can be altered by not only using compressed air but like nitrogen gas with larger molecules to water then d3 water or deuterium water also called to a world's collection of fluids oils emulsifiers phewwwwww don't wanna straight go nitro drag car or all tesla right out the gate smh we'd end up needing brakes on the damn thing if you know of their rpm imploding things same direction of centrifugal force expansion lol I've seen it argued nothing explodes it fails when rpm can't be maintained so much in fact only used tesla turbines fit in one hand performing off a pee stream what today's best outside a pallet when combined with 6 inch inlet flow pipe even then 15 mini tesla TURBINEs or so would far surpass today's most efficent oh and f a brake just use a fraction of input enertia by restriction calves n fk the brake n the heat the cost the wearing of brake parts used 24/7 with alot of applied force l.fao cha ching
I swear tesla turbine has a cult following from people without speck of knowledge of any turbine including tesla turbine
Kinda but a Tesla turbine has no blades
Tom, honestly, your projects are awesome
Your 3D printing of parts is so neat. Looking forward to seeing where this project goes.
Super cool project! I love turbines and 3D printing so this is one I'll be following. Keep up the awesome work!
Well I didn't expect to see my local Showcase Cinema in the intro, that's for sure
I let out a small audible shriek when I realized there was a new video. God I love these!
was going through the compressed air engine and now I think I have an idea for improving the efficiency of the engine even further
If you use a reed switch and a magnet in the piston and to release pressure in the piston at just the right time the engine
Can run at even lower pressures than before and for much longer which can increase the efficiency several folds.
By the way I am a student and I love your projects. Thank you for inspiring me.
This guy's content is just filled with surprises after surprises of satisfying overengineering.
Just when you don't expect it, it shows up!
What an insanely dopamine inducing notification I just got for this video
Omg no idea what it is that I love about pneumatic motors, but it's clearly something. I honestly don't care about the part when you use a motor to build something, but I can watch you spinning them up, plotting and optimizing endlessly. I l'd love to see more turbine designes and especially multi-staged ones.
The Hoosier tires was a nice touch.
Tesla Turbine?
This one is not a Tesla turbine, but that would be cool to compare the output of that turbine and a Tesla turbine of the same diameter.
Should of made a tesla turbine
To think I searched stanton two days ago looking for new content and then boom, it was up yesterday. National treasure this man.
タービンブレードについての考察部分も面白いですが、ボトル容器への充填ユニットの仕組みもシンプルかつコンパクトで良いですね。
飛行機に続くとても大胆な挑戦でした。
This comment was written at 4:20 pm Eastern time on the day of uploading
Right now at my time zone it is 3:35 on the same day as you 14 minutes after.
now figure out what time zone this is
🤟
👍Your detailed coverage of the technology and mechanics behind these incredible machines really brings the thrill to life. Amazing video for anyone fascinated by extreme speed and engineering!
Those tires are amazing!
That motor you mention at about 4:20, it's a nice one, but needs oil added to overcome the shortcomings you also mention as well as needing a constantly generated supply of air to keep working without dropping off in performance.
I think you explained well how different kinds of air turbines are handy. Kudos.
You better use one turbine with 3 different sections with different radiuses.🎉 Imagine bicycle gears on the back wheel, where gear is switched to smaller disc, so you can add small mechanism to the air pipe pointed on the gear, to auto swith it on the smaller disc after reaching max speed using the bigger one. You can print such turbine as one part with 3 sections to switch on... or more...
You don't want to exhaust your turbine near the center. You want the opposite, intake near center and exhaust on the outside edge. Then centrifugal force will help speed the air out, allowing you to maximize the power output.
No idea if this is better than the other designs, I just know you did that 4 watt turbine backwards, making it work against centrifugal force as it spins up. It may be worth a try.
I'm so excited for the multi-stage turbines!
Bro I just got back from a long shift at work, and Tom Stanton has posted? Let’s freaking go 🎉
Its funny, the turbine sounds EXACTLY like some hobby-grade or high-speed motor that would be used in a project just like this 😂
Fantastic Engineering Tom! (love the Inertial dynamometer).
My old rocket club (Paisley Rocketeers) took to these PET pop-bottles with gusto, as they made a fine water rocket (which we called 'Aquajets').
Some bottles would burst at 150 psi, but some went bang at only 70 psi. We decided that the safest course of action was to remotely pressurise and launch 'em: above 60 psi, don't be nearby!
Awesome! I can't wait to see you trying out multistage turbines.
Dude the sound of the turbine spooling up terrifies me
Sound is terrific!
I've been into turbines for a while now so this video is awesome! Thank you man!
(water and steam turbines)
Wooooo! Another video. You have become my most anticipated content creator on youtube. Love your stuff!
The little Hoosier tires cracked me up.
8:00 I think the reason the others performed better, is because the "curve" of the regular turbine's paths actually guide the air to exit in the opposite direction (so the force the air exits with, is additionally imparted to the turbine as a reactive force by Newtons laws. In addition to the energy you would get from completely stalling the air by absorbing 100% of the kinetic energy. So in total the theoretical maximum efficiency instead becomes 200% - and more if you can speed the air up! Minus of course any energy that was in the same axis as the spin-axis, since that direction was not touched), while the bad turbine only guides it to exit in a perpendicular direction (it absorbs all kinetic force in the axis perpendicular to spin-axis, but no more).
It is much like how a gravity-powered generator at 100% efficiency has the weight not fall at all, while at 200% the weight start flying up into space! ;)
Soon we will all drive cars powered by compressed air. And we will thank Tom for laying the groundwork.
I seem to recall a compressed air powered car for sale in India a decade or so ago. Can’t remember the details.
Just fantastic!
Try using several nozzles, maybe 3 or 4.
For pressing bearings: ALWAYS apply the force to the parts that is friction fitted. So if you pressing it on a axle apply the pressing pressure to the inner race and as you might guess if you're pressing the bearing into a bearing holder, apply the pressing pressure to the outer race.
Unless you have a bearing designed (trust bearing, conical bearing) for it, they can't take much sideways forces. And it's easy enough to turn/3d print a tool for that.
Fantastic video- great engineering really well explained. Maybe you could try a turbine disc without a shroud- just open blades with a jet in the plane of the disc tangent to the blades and not angled. Like a pelton wheel.
On a gasturbine you have a static ring with blades that get the air to „spinn“ and push the blades on the moving wheel. The blades on the moving wheel „straighten“ the airflow. If you have a multistage turbine the next static ring will to the same until there is no pressuredifference left. So maybe instead of blowing at the moving ring with a nozzle using a distibuting chamber and a static ring might help.
A carbon fiber air bottle off a PCP air rifle can run much higher pressure in a smaller space.
It would be heavier but run through a regulator it could give you way more useable air.
you could totally make a competition out of this
make an air powered dragster that'll go the furthest on a 2 liter bottle of air. The engineering challenges that come out of this would be interesting enough on their own
Looks like a nice impulse turbine. One way to get more power is to use a supersonic nozzle (converging diverging). You can also add more nozzles. Love your videos, so cool!
I think you should try a hot wire resistor in the air stream as it is going into the air motor. You're carrying the battery anyway, so you might as well use it to put some heat into it.
You never fail to amaze with your skills Tom, your parents must be very proud of you.
Yes, having a job is so overrated.
I love that high pitch sound....
Something interesting that could be done to improve the efficiency of this design would be to add a hybrid system, maybe with a super capacitor attached, that allows it to start more easily since the turbine seems to be losing lots of air trying to get the car going. It could then recoup some of the energy when breaking.
Great video! :)
Man is single-handedly showing the world we should have not strayed from steam engines.
Well done Tom. Top work. I tried this for power generation with relative success but I'm interested in the impeller type turbines. Opposite to the one you made that didn't work, where the centrifugal force aids in the exhaust gas. Cheers J
It's amazing to use compressed air to rotate a complete model turbine. Thank you
I've made a similar turbine for a lego pulling car! Sounds really similar too!
You are currently using an axial flow compressor style, which works great for acceleration of large amounts off air, hence why jet turbines use them, instead I would recommend looking into centrifugal flow compressors these are what are used in anything from large generators to helicopters and turbo prop aircraft, as they are much better for high torque applications. Love the project and can’t wait to see where you will go with it!
Just remember, if you want to beat world record you have to dtart from second gear. That is the storry bro!
That actually worked pretty well! Would be interesting to experiment with a big shop air compressor and a turbine that powers a small alternator to see if you could make a air powered UPS. It would not be very efficient compared to batteries but be fun to see if it could be made to work.
Hey Tom, very cool. I took my kids to their first drag strip yesterday ironically and they went wild when the first Alcohol cars both ran on the 1/4 mile at 287mph @ 5.2 seconds. They literally shake your bones.
Wow, I didn't expect this channel could even get more exciting but you did it! I'm looking forward to some turbine optimization
That’s not nice.
@@mikebond6328 Wow I meant "couldn't even get MORE exciting". This is my favorite channel. Thanks for making me aware of this 😅
Use buckets after the nozzle that basically reverse the flow back into the turbine. Simple 1 stage turbines often have a couple of these.
Your compressed air vehicles have come a long way!
That's some impressive fabrication!
In an alternative universe this is how all cars are powered.
for me this day is better than christmass.
Nice work. Air engines/turbines are very capable. There was a man that developed air engines for vehicles decades ago and it worked quite well. There are some videos on that. His design used multiple carbon fiber air tanks designed to split open in case of failure since they were thousands of PSI and could be extremely dangerous. He designed a van that would get 300km per air fill.
Great work as always - may be worth dialling in optimal tyre width so you can steer /put power down with minimal rolling resistance. The more weight you can have over the rear wheels the thinner they can be before they slip. There's also a gear affect from the tyre profile so take that into account when dialling in your gear ratios.
The other thing that might save you some time, the price of battery powered air compressors has come down a lot. Might be worth investing in one to speed up the prototyping:)
Has this research not been done? I do enjoy your vids. It does feel like you are just landing in the planet and re discovering everything again.
My man is doing science fair projects on the regular
Excellent work dude. You are far far far a head than us indeed. Anyway salute to your work. Regards.
For the vane motor they usually use a spring to ensure good contact with the walls