Brewing the same beer on $300 v $3000 systems
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- čas přidán 28. 11. 2017
- We took two all-grain homebrew systems and brewed the same batch of beer on both - a London Porter. See brew day and our blind taste test to identify which beer brewed which system.
$3000 system featured is the electric Blichmann BrewEasy.
My brewing gear:
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Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 13.72 gal
Post Boil Volume: 11.72 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 11.00 gal
Bottling Volume: 10.00 gal
Estimated OG: 1.056 SG
Estimated Color: 35.5 SRM
Estimated IBU: 28.1 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 65.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 66.5 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes
Ingredients:
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Amt Name Type # %/IBU
18 lbs 6.0 oz 2-row English Pale Malt (2.7 SRM) Grain 1 72.1 %
3 lbs 4.0 oz Brown Malt (58.8 SRM) Grain 2 12.8 %
2 lbs 4.0 oz Caramel 80 (80.0 SRM) Grain 3 8.8 %
1 lbs 9.6 oz Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain 4 6.3 %
3.00 oz Fuggle Pellets [4.30 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 22.5 IBUs
1.50 oz Fuggle Pellets [4.30 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 5.6 IBUs
2.0 pkg London ESB Ale (Wyeast Labs #1968) [124. Yeast 7 -
Mash Schedule: BIAB, Medium Body
Total Grain Weight: 25 lbs 7.6 oz
----------------------------
Name Description Step Temperature Step Time
Saccharification Add 62.84 qt of water at 160.4 F 153.0 F 60 min
Mash Out Heat to 168.0 F over 7 min 168.0 F 10 min
Sparge: If steeping, remove grains, and prepare to boil wort
Notes:
------
byo.com/storie...
Muntons Pale Ale malt
Alt yeast: White Labs WLP002 English Ale
Ferment at 62F
I like the cheaper system. It’s more hands on and gives you something to do. The Blichmann is more automated and consistent. It’s like the difference between a traditional smoker and a traeger pellet smoker. To me it’s more fun to be more involved. Both are great systems with pros and cons. Enjoyed the video.
This "cheap homemade" system is leaps and bounds better than my system lol
Same here bro, same here 🤣🤣😭🍻
I have an all in one system cheaper and easier to use than their cheap made system haha
These guys crack me up. This gives me emotional support for my first brew. Thanks boys.
Stir the wort with the immersion chiller, will chill in half the time.
And aerate
I love the idea of putting the hydrometer in the auto siphon and taking the reading that way! So much less mess and no foam to get around!
Great way to prove a point: You don't need fancy equipment to brew good beer. Good video!
It's like having an expensive car!)))
I feel like a lot of people think home brewing is expensive, but you can generally get what you need for about $100. More money makes things easier and a bit better, but you can make a lot of great beers with under $100 of equipment.
Now that i've got all my brewing equipment I can get everything I need to do a brew for 50-70 dollars depending how much grain I use and how much hops i use...
@Foxhound - What are you making that costs over $50? Double IPA? Barleywine?
@@rods6741 we are literally making a grapefruit IPA right now. Receipt with new grain bag and all for 5gallon batch 85$.
I have no idea how I ended up here, but it was an interesting watch all the same.
I was growing carrots 30 min ago.....bloody youtube
Pretty much what everyone says when they end up watching a Salad Fingers video
Yep me too... somehow went from watching NHL highlights, to a lotus lock puzzle thing to this, youtube has taken me on quite the ride this evening.
Just opened Beer. Before surfing CZcams today. I sould Be mad that Google knows More aboth me than I myself... Nice video by The way.
Same, i got sent here for searching carbonation tablets xD
im elated that you made this channel, as a new home brewer im very excited to gain tips and tricks from you guys! cheers!
The fermentation makes a massive difference, and I have a couple of observations.
For me, you were more interested in aerating the wort than in keeping out dodgy wild yeast or bacteria. I've found that splashing it into the fermentation vessel is enough.
Secondly, on old fridge is a great place to ferment. A small electric radiant heater on a thermostat will keep the temperature at the right level (varying it slightly can help as fermentation proceeds) and works brilliantly. You rarely get a stall, and it's faster.
I'm actively considering a Grainfather (just for ease of use really) but to be honest it's the bottling that I find most laborious.
Yeah good tips. We do have a temp controlled chest freezer with heating and cooling now. And yeah bottling is awful - kegging all the way!
Kegging is not for me (at least for now) so I found that pressure fermentation + iTap is super practical combination :)
I'll just say this: I'm a massive hefeweizen fanatic and I've tried quite a few in my life throughout my travels around the globe. When I decided to do my first ever home-brewed beer, I went for a (almost) traditional Hefeweizen. 50/50 pilsner/wheat malt, Hallertau and keeping the IBU around 13-15. The differences I made came mostly from being new to all this and boiled my wort a little bit longer. The final ABV % was 7.8 but it was the best hefeweizen I've ever had and I still can't reproduce it.
Bottom line: Gear does not matter that much when you love what you're doing. I literally made my first 20-30 batches of beer in my backyard, next to a lemon tree.
Lol chill your beer open top below a tree to keep sanitized 🤣
I learned that an immersion chiller will work much faster if you stir the wort. It also helps to get the temperature uniform in different parts of the kettle.
I was lazy and did not stir one evening and noticed it took longer but not long enough to worry about. What I didn't notice was that the temperature showing one the gauge was not the same as the average temp of the wort when I racked it to the carboy. lesson learned
Personally I enjoy all the hands on with the 3 pot method. I am in control of everything
it's not about the brewing system... it's all about the operator.
It's not the wand, it's the wizard.
This.
It’s the size it’s the motion
The main difference is... the ease of brewing, not really the beer. We moved from BIAB (arguably the easiest way to make all grain beer) to a Grainfather and it was still a world of difference during brew days.
Would be fun to see this experiment scaled up, use as many different systems as possible and make the same beer. Wouldn't be the easiest video to make from a logistical standpoint, but it'd be fun.
Exactly. Perhaps a more expensive system creates a better tasting beer - perhaps not. A lot of what you're paying for is convenience and consistency. Love that idea of a video with a whole bunch of systems... extract on kitchen stove through to something automated like a Pico system.
If you don't mind me asking I do a full scale 50L BIAB (no sparge) pot on a gas burner and it works really well and is easy.. I hit a 70-75% efficiency and consistency is good.. however I do think about a GF from time to time.. my question is do you think it is worth the move and are you glad you made it?
MrOnihige I have also thought of getting a Grainfather to break into all grain brewing once I move later this year. One thing that has always kept me away from all grain brewing is the ease of setup, cleanup and brewing. If something like the Grainfather makes all of those things easier and helps create more consistent results, then that is something I would consider. Noting, of course, that in the end, the ingredients and the operator still make a huge difference in your results. I would appreciate and be interested in your thouhts and experience so far.
I love a London Porter...apart from one time when I got waaaay overcharged at £9 for a single pint at St Albans. Even more of a reason to homebrew.
9 pound a pint seems to be about the going rate these days...... Left london about 12 years ago and it was less than 5 pound!! :(
I just watched this random(to me) video here, because of bear and i like the video. Now im reading the comments, and you guys are so informative and nice "Cheers"
Beer brewing is so cool.
And in the end... I learned nothing
Nothing better than watching beer being brewed, 'cept maybe brewin' beer.
drinking beer comes v close tho
its midnight and I have work and somehow ended up here from pacific rim sound track
Good job brewing, and a good video.Cheers !
Great comparison.
More malt in the stalled ferment probably just the perceived sweetness as not as much sugar was eaten by the yeast! Awesome I'm off to brew in my bag!
The homemade system allows for spraging where as the electric system does not. This gives you higher efficiency, meaning more fermentable sugars available to the yeast. This is likely the reason for the higher alcohol content and the different flavor
Yes the home made system was more efficient for sure. We tried to account for that in each recipe to get the same OG.
A few years back, I spent about 3k to upgrade from my coolers to modern equipment. Now I don’t even use that equipment. I get better and more consistent results using my igloo coolers!
Cheers 🍻
Brulosophy are pretty good at their taste tests. They do three opaque cups, two with the same beer. Then you get to see if you actually can taste the difference and pick the odd one out. And you get to give your preference on which of the three tastes best to you. That would be much better than "I knew they were different, I just forgot which was which!"
Yep, I agree, that's what we'll do next time
I’ve never had a stuck fermentation, in 10 years of brewing, not one. I mash in a Home Depot orange, 10-gallon cooler with a false bottom. I rarely aerate. And I I’ve won 3 out of 6 brewing competitions I’ve entered.
The audio volume swings are more extreme than my pregnant wife's emotions.
I find the British strains, like WLP002, look quite chunky. Nice video, keep brewing!
such a great idea for a video !
The "chunky" yeast is from a process called agglutination. Some strains have higher agglutination then others.
You can fight it a little with a magnetic stir plate in your starter.
Saw the Yellow tail in the background. One of my fav reds.
When I brew with my wife, we make her oatmeal stout recipe with WLP002 yeast, and it is pretty chunky like that....
I once made a sandwitch with letuce. Tasted better then in the stores.
The biggest difference between a high dollar brewing rig like the Blichmann (though I have had pro brewers tell me that you are paying a lot for that Bluchmann name) and the ballin' on a budget home depot coolers is not going to really show itself in a one batch faceoff. I'd bet that you would notice a big difference across 10 batches of the same beer. With the Blichmann you would get better consistency across multiple batches than you would be able to achieve with the coolers. Both will make great beer consistently, but the Blichmann will make the same great beer consistently.
Yes I think that’s really our take too. The temperature control of the Blichmann should lead to consistent results.
If you brew a lot of beer on any system you can learn to make as good of beer as your ingredients will allow. It is all about process and repeated trials and maybe small inexpensive system upgrades. I would put my inexpensive but well designed with a few hundred brews days rig up against any high price system.
Cool gadget for aeration. However there has been some studies that show aereating with oxygen is much more effective and quicker to do.
I bought a stone for next to nothing, some tubing and a small oxygen tank. All for under $20. You need about 10 seconds to get the job done.
Who knows perhaps that was the issue with the fermentation stalling. I noticed they used 2 different containers and two different people performed the aeration. I bet that was the issue.
Maybe there's no big difference in taste, but i think it's easier to make beer with a more expensive equipment. Also if you want to make more beer, a better system could make it faster.
What did you use to Aerate? It looks easier than pouring back and forth like I've been doing!
I started making commercially and in true craft beer standards, I just multiplied up the small scale home brew kits. Only real improvement I made was on filtration of sediment but besides that.. DIY
Random question...was the FG on the cheaper system measured by a refractometer instead of a hydrometer?
If so, this would almost perfectly explain the "stalled" fermentation and why it didn't taste like it. If you check out a refractometer calculator online that can account for alcohol (which skews the final reading) you'll find the following:
OG of the cheaper system: 1.057
FG of the cheaper system: 1.032
1.032 in Brix is: 8.00 P
If you plug in a starting gravity of 1.057 and an ending gravity of 8 Brix you end up with: 1.016
Desired FG: 1.017
Just something I thought I'd throw out there...
Todd West thanks Todd, I like your line of thought - that we actually had the correct FG all along and it's just the measurement that was wrong. Unfortunately it was a hydrometer that gave us that reading - we'll need to find a different excuse for our failings :-)
I have found more expensive equipment (in my case) actually can make life more difficult, time- and effort-wise.
For example switching to a plate chiller with pumps and FVs with removable fittings & probes has now lengthened my brew day due to more sanitation, assembly and cleaning afterwards. Bottling using CO2, a beer gun and kegs vs bottle wand has also made bottling 2-3 times slower.
HOWEVER, while most of these things won't make your beer better per se, they do remove a lot of the human and environmental variables meaning beer is more reproducible and the quality of the finished product doesn't vary as much. For example I hit my OG more predictably now by using a home made automatic pumping grant and sparge system and my beers ferment more predictably now by switching from directly pitching yeast packets into a beer in my closet to a temperature controlled stir plate starter and a temperature controlled fermentation. My bottled beers fizz is more consistent and predictable due to being able to carbonate them with a CO2 regulator instead of relying on yeast (noticeably on very big beers).
However the best beers I've made are still split between when I used a plastic bucket, hot water urn and a lot of back power lifting things up and now. All that has improved is the consistency in quality between beers.
I completely agree. I wanted consistent repeatable results which my system seems to be giving me. Regarding the plate chiller I've actually started going back to using my immersion chiller now. Getting that plate chiller clean has been a real difficulty, which negates a lot of the benefits given my immersion chiller isn't a whole lot slower to cool wort.
I'm making mead and i've been lead astray by books and comments with my first attempt. You don't need to aerate dry yeast after re hydration, it should be all prepped by the manufacturer from all the information i have found. It's different if you're using your old cake or liquid yeast.
Yeast looked strange... Could be stressed yeast maybe? Would explain the lowish FG
I've been making ale for 3 decades and currently have about $175 invested in equipment. How... because my kitchen equipment doubles as my brewing equipment. My 3.5 gallon stock pot makes chicken stock as well as boils wort. My electric stove does a dandy job of boiling the wort. The bulk of my expenditure was in crown capped bottles. Their brew may have fell short of the target alcohol level because of using all grains. A possible explanation may be an over abundance of non-fermentable sugars using all grain. My DME wort starts out at 1.060 and ends up at 1.008 for an alcohol level of about 6.7%. I am using Nottingham ale yeast. Also I am careful not to aerate the wort. I don't understand why they were whipping air into the wort since I was under the impression that O2 adversely affected the brew.
That's cool to see how you've improvised what's sounds like a cool brewing setup. Goes to show you certainly don't need fancy equipment to make great beer. Aerating the wort prior to adding the yeast adds some O2 back into the wort that was lost during the boil. Once the yeast is added then we were sure not to further oxygenate the beer.
Thanks. Btw, you gave me an Aha! moment by answering my question about aeration. Makes sense to me. I tend to splash the wort when I transfer it to my primary fermenter which must do the same thing. All I know is when the wort is cool enough to pitch the yeast in about 2 hours I get to see airlock action. Next morning it is so vigorous it looks like the wort is being boiled. After a hiatus of about 18 years I just started to brew again. In the past I used a hopped syrup called Dogbolter's which was exported by Firkin brewery in London UK. Since it is no longer available I decided to come up with my own formula for a dark and heavy ale which I am calling Fragarach Ale. (Drink a glass and you'll answer any question truthfully! ) I began with 3 gallon batches just to get back in practice and have bottled my third batch of 5 gallons. The 4th batch I just racked used the same hops as before but instead I used the 1st wort hopping technique. Before racking I measured the SG to see how far along the process is and as is my wont I drank it rather than dispose of it. Definitely a keeper!
I didn't know Firkin used to ship a malt extract syrup. Pretty cool you have made the own
It was under the "Goose & Firkin" logo. Mind you the last time I was able to get it was in the early '80s. Actually I wasn't trying to recreate Dogbolter's but rather come up with a brew that would satisfy my taste. I'm the type of person that drinks Italian roast coffee brewed in a drip maker without milk or sugar. I eat Habaneros raw and use Ghost peppers to make my own chilli oil. So to put it in Lt. Worf's terms my ale is a warrior's drink! ;-) At this point in time I'm tweaking the recipe to get the carbonation level right. The current batch of ale is carbonated at almost the same level of Guiness draught. I want it a bit more fizzy. I don't bulk prime since I am loath to aerating the ale so I add the sugar to the bottle. The last batch was primed at 4g corn sugar per 600ml. I'm going to prime a couple of bottles of the next batch with 5g and 6g respectively. I go by weight since it lends to reproducible results.
All grain has nothing to do with sugars its all in how it was mashed. Your DME was made from all grain that was correctly mashed then dried then dehydrated. My all grain sub $300 1/2 barrel (15.5 gal, 58L) all electric 3 tier system has recreated almost every style of beer with quality results. Yeast needs O2 for reproduction health it is after fermentation you want to avoid aeration. Keep those yeast happy!
Interesting guys, like the content!
My American ale yeast also went chunky it had a really strong smell when it ferments
Did the beer turn out OK? Seems that's just the way with some yeast strains
Here is my bet before I watch the video: You’re gonna say the $300 set up is just as good.
I was wrong! You didn’t say the cheap system was better!
great vid, the difference in results seems to be in how much labor you had to do. You're gizmo did all the work (sort of) and You also priced the $300 system without factoring labor and skills of the people working in it even though it was just your buddies. You still came out ahead.
Chunky yeast is pretty normal with some strands, wouldn't have stopped me using it. Not sure what your fermentation procedures are or what yeast you used so tough to comment on why it stalled.
Cool video, I almost went with the blichmann set up, pretty sweet set up.
Reaction Brewing, yes, it looks like a highly flocculant yeast, which can be a good thing, since it makes separation of the finished beer from the yeast easier.
Probably your enzyme fortification through consistent temperature on the blichman system.
Thanks man
I know this post is old, but I'm new to beer brewing I've only made one batch so far and I haven't moved from kits yet. You mentioned the scottish ale from brewers best in the video. Have you made it? Do you have a video? Is it a good early brewer recipe?
Fermentation is everything
To add to the chorus of know-it-all Home brewers (is there another type?), something is amiss. Dark grains tend to increase final gravity by a few points, maybe into the low 1.020 range depending on OG. I’ve had some stouts end that high and taste great. 1.056 to 1.032 means something is wrong. I think it is important to determine what the proper final gravity of the recipe should be so you know where it should end up. In general, stick to a known recipe, mash around 150F, chill and ferment around 70F, oxygenate well, and use a reliable neutral dry yeast (US-04 maybe for an English clone?). Take it from a fellow home brewer who’s brewed his fair share of dumpers. Cheers!
Good tips. Curious to hear why you recommend dry yeast?
Dry yeasts are reliable, high cell count sure bets when it comes to brewing. I have used pure liquid cultures for years and they make great beer when handled and treated well. But for beginners, or in cases like this video where final gravity is too high for unknown reasons, dry yeast eliminates the biggest variable in any beer - fermentation. Brewers tend to obsess about the hot side processes which effect the beer less than proper fermentation. Good reliable, neutral dry yeasts include US05 (for America styles), US04 (for English styles), and 34/70 (for lagers). They are nearly foolproof.
Brian Schneider
How did you take your hydrometer reading? Looked like you had your trial jar in your carboy? What's the reason for that?
Both looked great. Shame about the gravity and that yeast wasn't playing. Still drinkable..
Homemade set up all the way for me. It's how my set up rolls..
Good viewing
Cheers
RedDog Brewer has
You all should have compared system efficiency over taste. Each system is different and attains different efficiency. It would have been good to follow that over the taste, since this experiment was looking at system comparison and not the system and fermentation outcome.
Remember, it matters on the grain bill (more dark over light malt and vice versa), pH of the mash, & mash temperature. If you were unable to match these figures for both systems, then the wort outcome of each system will vary, which also affects fermentation. Then had you all fermented with the same built starter and in the same temperature conditions for all carboys, you would truly have an accurate taste testing between the two beers. All those factors definitely affect the final product.
Overall, it looked like a fun time and I'm gathering that's all that truly matters.
Hi Sam, yes all good points. We did measure and match on pH reading, mash temperature, and original gravity. But that's where the controlled conditions ended. We used the same yeast starter yeast, pitch rate, and method but created the starters independently, and fermented at our own houses, so again some differences there. But yeah, science aside it was a fun experience and comments like these have given us some tips for what we'll change when we do this again.
What's your fermentation setup like compared with the homemade?
Peter Stilwell Peter they are both quite similar in that respect - a temperature controlled fermentation chamber.
great comparison of "systems"!!
Hey nice video. Can you tell me what plastic piece you used to mount in the drill for the whirlpool?
Cheers
For me, the real test would be to repeat the process on both systems to see if you get consistent results from each.
SD Jon yep that would be a good test. We enjoyed the beer so will likely make it again.
I have question I hope someone cam answer. What system or version do most breweries use? I know that it would obviously be scaled up but just curious and would love to know
Using PVC and vinyl with high temp H2O, you're already losing the battle with the all-foodgrade Blichmann system. Switch to CPVC and silicone to lose the vinyl taste and leached chemicals.
blichmann is super low quality stuff
I did not see what temps you mashed in at on both systems? This may be the cause of the fermentation issues? The Blichmann will hold the mash point more consistent that the cooler will. But you can still achieve great results with a cooler. Nice production guys.already subbed. Cheers!🍻
As little as I know about all-grain brewing at this point had me thinking along those lines. Were the mash temps on the econo setup higher? With the gravity being almost the same, this would be the only difference that I can think of other than yeast health. Maybe combining and then dividing the yeast would equalize that piece.
Both systems followed the same brew schedule and our mash temps remained quite close, as did pH and OG. The Blichmann system certainly allows more precise and adjustable temperature control but I don't think we were too far different there.
Did you overbuild the yeast starter and split it evenly between the two worts? In the video one guy pitches the whole Erlenmeyer flask so I'm not sure if the starter was split beforehand.
Mike L. Yeah we both created a yeast starter independently. One for each system.
I’m with Short Circuited Brewers. The temp is the super important thing in brewing. Miss by 1 degree or temperature rising speed will allow the enzymes to stop or continue. Is the Blichmann correct? Is the homemade system correct? It’s up to the brewer.
So I really want to compare some of the best home Brewing systems. I've built a one of a kind system and need to fine some one to put it to the test! Anyone in NorCal up for the challenge?
$300 vs $3000 is good, but what about any system vs a $75,000 home built system?
exposed lid during immersion chilling i wonder if it got any wild yeasts
Was thinking that too. Especially outside on a warm day
Given the Gravity after a month it doesn't sound like much wanted to chew on what was in there
I have chilled this way for years on about 25-30 different beers. Never had a single issue.
curt, my homemade set up would make those guys cringe, but i make 45 gallons of beer one shot, used it for 15 years , never failed, open fermentor and all that. total ghetto setup can work good if done right
It wouldn't matter. The volume of yeast pitched is going to be millions of times more than any stray wild yeast, and domesticated yeast is a much more aggressive beast. It will kill anything in its path. You can ferment without a lid for any style and not notice any flavor difference. You just need to seal it up before it stops fermenting to prevent oxidation.
Sounds like the yeast wasn't up for the job or a temperature issue during fermentation.
What you should have taken away is that yeast and the fermentation conditions can account for up to 70% of the flavors we taste in beer. Without having identical pitch rates, fermentation temp control, and fermentation vessel volumes....the two beers will always turn out different.
Next time, brew a 10gal batch...then split it into two 5-gal fermenters...pitch the same volume of the same strain of yeast, but ferment one at 65° and one at 70°. Two different beers result.
That would be a great test. We brew 10 gallon batches split between two 5 gallon carboys as standard so it would be simple enough to modify the fermentation temperatures of the two carboys and see what differences we get in ABV and taste. I think this may be the inspiration for a future video :-)
I use Bell's yeast a lot, which I cultured up from their commercial bottles. They use this proprietary strain for most of their commercial beers; Stout, IPA, Brown, Amber, Wheat, etc. (everything except Lagers and Belgians, I believe)....they ferment at different temps to get the different flavor profiles for each beer while using the same yeast strain.
I believe it is only "proprietary" because they have used and cultured their yeast for decades...this set of selection pressures resulted in the yeast they have now, which is different from anywhere else.
p.s.- attenuation issues (or wort fermentability) are usually associated with the mashing process and grist ingredients. The highly kilned crystal malts and roasted malts have less convertible starches due to the heat they are exposed to in processing....if you are making your own recipes, you should read up on ingredient balance and wort fermentability. Then look at the mash temps, a few degrees either direction will greatly change the wort characteristics.
I really like the video! But you're comparing not *just* the wort making process: to do that you'd need to ferment the two worts in the same conditions. It would be interesting to split both worts and ferment each using both methods. Then you'd get a picture on what matters most: Fermentation, or extraction? For this perhaps also it wouldn't hurt to use a portion of exactly the same yeast starter culture for every primary.
MMM Porter!!!
Great video, and great idea! Where are you from, guys?
colinete Thanks! We're in Raleigh, NC.
Using such vastly different glasses for the blind test is ludicrous. How can you put any validity in a blind test when there are variations in the testing methods between subjects?
austin4x glad i’m not the only one who noticed such an obvious flaw
'every beer has it's own glass'. If you try a tripple from a pint glass instead of a bowl type glass, it will taste different and smell different. just as coffee tastes different when either from a glass or a mug
where to buy these small blackboards for the taps???
158F is a little hot for good conversion but not horrible...as long as it’s what it says it is. I have the gas version of the Tower of Power module and love it. But that high of temps could be part of the attenuation issue.
As far as the yeast goes I’m assuming you used WLP002 or Wyeast English Ale. Either way that yeast is a super floculator...meaning it clumps up really well and then drops to the bottom. No issues with the clumping but maybe with the amount. Didn’t seem like there much in that Erlenmeyer flask, but I could be mistaken.
Thanks for the experiment though. Fun to watch!
Nicholas Parker we normally see a loss of about 6F in pumping through the tower so set it +6 over the mash temperature we want in the mash tun. So we were mashing closer to 152.
That makes sense. Thought that number was during recirculation. It could be older yeast, not enough yeast, drastic temperature fluctuations. Some English strains flocculate & drop more easily than others. It's good you guys at least enjoyed the beers!
Lagunitas mashes at 160F for all their beers. Stalling at 1.030ish or 1.020ish isn't the mash temp. Could be cell count or O2 conent.
This reasoning is a touch suspect. The mash is not only operating in the tun with the grain in it. The whole volume of liquid distributed between both pots is full of starch, enzymes and sugar. If half of your wort is at 152 and the other half at 158, you can bet the enzymes are in an effect at 155.
Yeast was chunky because high flocculating yeast, some English yeasts are like that...
I don't think it's fair to compare the two because the final gravities were so far off (and both were well under-attenuated).
Looked to me like you mashed at 166 Fahrenheit... if you mashed the whole time at this high of a temp that explains you low alcohol content...
You get a better mash by step mashing, starting at lower temperatures releases simpler sugars easier for the yeast to digest.. slowly raising temperatures until all starch has been converted...
Did you do a starch test?
Great video anyway I love your setup
Thanks for your kind words. The video is a bit misleading in that respect. We did heat the mash up to 168F at mash out but prior to that we were mashing much lower (I forget the number but around 150F or so).
What strain of yeast?
For that, I'd use Wyeast 1968.
London ESB. (My favorite strain.)
steve
Yep, that's the strain we used too
Is there a recipe somewhere? If you mentioned it I didn't catch it.
Those final OG's are .....crazy high. Must be like a syrup. In a hot country I suggest do not aerate the wort and pitch direct with yeast enhancer keep in a 18-24c place if you can or place wet cloths around it to evaporate heat. Too much excitement & not enough fermentables for yeast to be happy I think. Failing that check your mash temps, as a 69c - 72c mash will also come up short on fermentables. I know you know this but its pretty obvious two beers fell short.
good video
mmmhhhmmm yes...but, Which one was the better beer?
With out mash temps, it's not really possible to tell why fermentation got stuck
Good video!new subscriber
Go back and watch the video, little care is put to sanitation and processes.
Really cool video but I’m interested in the name of the music??
Did you guys calculate yeast cells? A non-calibrated thermometer with a high alpha-amylase temperature ramp could explain part of that, but that's too much. I'd bet you got insufficient amount of yeast cells or at least not enough healthy yeast cells. Also add zync during the last minutes of boil and get a food-grade oxygen tank, that hose-drill thing is only visual and is not really adding nearly enough O2 into the wort for a healthy fermentation - an aquarium O2 pump/filter would be much better already if you're not willing to get a tank with a manometer :)
Yep, those are great tips. For the yeast starter I cold crashed it and pitched only the yeast that fell to the bottom - possibly we were short of yeast cells there. And have since upgraded to a CO2 wand to get some real oxygen into the beer.
What about the Brewer's Best kit?🤣
Just a bunch of dudes been guys
How did the Brewers Best beer turn out? You said there were 3 beers in this comparison?
Ah yes we didn't show the tasting of that. Not so bad actually. Over the years we've brewed some great beers with Brewers Best kits.
I love watching the brits make a brown ale and have a lovely time. It never gets old. Come to California and we will make a 7% IPA on the same system. cheers. oh wait, you chaps invented the IPA ? mind blown..
‘Chunky’ yeast sounds, and looks, a bit suspect! Great vid, I reckon it shows that you can brew on a £300 system just as well as a £3k system but some people have lots of money to spend!
Fowey River Brewing yeah both systems do the job. The more expensive one adds convenience more than anything.
Homebrew How-To If I had that kind of money I might be tempted. I know someone who spent four thousand dollars on a crystal Fabergé bong. Can ANY style of beer and ale be made in the Pico? Most important to the less conservative home brewer given to dangerous experiments.
I think do it yourself might prove to be more fun and more educational.
The brewery that makes Gulden Draak is entirely automated. It is still a very top shelf strong quad.
But for home brewing purposes you need to be in a better than average financial situation. Many start home brewing because of the savings.
Nothing wrong with chunky yeast. There are a bunch of strains that are extremely flocculent.
That is a massive variation in FG. The yeast clumping like that is possibly the issue, perhaps too hot? I would have pitched more yeast before packaging.
Good video nonetheless.
I did cringe when I saw the open, cooled wort being airated outside. Rather move indoors to minimise chance of infection .
I think the yeast strand was probably the wrong choice. The reason I think this is because both stalled. I’m probably wrong about that but considering what you guys did here, nothing was done wrong or bad in my opinion. So, that tells me maybe the yeast strand was wrong for that brew. Maybe next time try a simple yeast which doesn’t impart much flavor or anything else and is considerably strong such as US-05. Other than that it was a great experiment. Again, this is just my opinion...not fact.
P.s. the homemade system is a 3 tier homemade gravity system. I have that same set up 😁
Thanks, "3 tier homemade gravity system" sounds a bit better than "the homemade one" :-)
CAT SPOTTED
CAT CAT CAT
Cooing wort openair below tree branches?
Adds a bit more fun to brew day - the wild yeast lottery :-)
Is that what matters in the end? A real alcoholic would probably argue that Blichmann's was better.
RedSaint83 ha that's true, a full 1% more of the good stuff :-)
Those are very high f.g.
At what temp did you mash?
Why did both yeasts stall? Regardless this was a great video! Very nice production and really interesting concept. Well done! Cheers!
I know absolutely nothing about brewing, but, yeast, if there is anything alive at all when introduced, should just need a couple of hours, at most a day, to be back up in quantity to what "should" have been there in the first place.
The dead yeast might make it taste different, but the fermentation should be going as normal until the sugars run out, or the alcohol content kills the yeast.
In this case i'd wager a guess that it was the sugars that ran out, but as i said... i know about zero when it comes to beer brewing.
Factor that differentiated the two... sugar content when adding the yeast.It is of course nothing but a guess, but if one system is better then the other at something along the process of preparing, and extracting the sugar, then the end result will be just that. If anything that also means that they would have gotten the higher target alcohol content, if they managed to extract the last bits of sugar as well. Unless of course the one system managed a perfect result, and that the expected sugars simply wasn't in the grain. age could be a factor, but i doubt it...
I think you're right not getting all the fermentable sugars out of the grain bill most likely resulted in the two diferent gravities and resulting abv. May have been the yeast's ability to ferment such sugars too, although they did use the same starter for both so that shouldn't factor in too much.
Probably underpitched or something. Maybe didnt mix good enough. They never mentioned what strain they used. I would assume some highly flouclating yeasty like 004 , but who knows.
It says what yeast is used in the recipe in the description text: London ESB Ale (Wyeast Labs #1968). While I've not used this exactly, I have used WLP002 which is supposed to be White Labs' version of the same strain, and that one could definitely be considered "chunky" (this is related to why it flocculates so easily). This is to say, the chunkiness is just the way it is, it's not that anything's wrong with the starter (probably).
Without knowing the details of the fermentation schedule, I'm not sure I could say for certain what went wrong, but I do recall reading that this strain has a tendency to drop out really easily and needs to be roused back into suspension to complete fermentation.
aint that shit just going to be mega plasticly all that hot water on the plastic containers and plastic tubes
No consideration that the 1.030 beer stalled due to poor conversion during the mash?
Fermentation Adventures it's certainly possible. We both hit the OG target so thought mash conversion went well.
If mash temp is low you can still hit target OG but have more unfermentable sugars. The result would be low attenuation and more malt flavor in the beer. Check your thermometer calibration.
Yes! I meant high, not low.