Cross-voting in Rajya Sabha polls, on India being a ‘dictatorship’ | Hafta 474 FULL EPISODE
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- čas přidán 20. 05. 2024
- This week, Newslaundry’s Abhinandan Sekhri, Raman Kirpal, and Jayashree Arunachalam are joined by The News Minute’s executive editor Sudipto Mondal.
On the cross-voting during Rajya Sabha polls in Karnataka, Sudipto points to the similarity in ideological stance of the state’s three major political parties. “There is no difference between the average BJP guy, the average JDS guy and the average Congress guy,” he says. Raman adds that in Himachal Pradesh’s RS polls, some members of the Congress knew beforehand that MLAs of their party would vote for the BJP.
DiscussingDilip Mandal’s article responding to Dhruv Rathee’s video on India taking a turn towards dictatorship, Abhinandan says it’s a weak critique since debunking an idea with “whataboutery” is a nihilistic argument. Sudipto believes that nihilism is an important form of critique for the oppressed classes who have been kept out of power systems for centuries.
This and a lot more. Tune in!
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Y'all should criticize random Sena
It feels like a cult
The main crux of the argument between Abhinandan & Sudipto was Dhruv calling Modi a dictator. But where the arguments of Sudipto make no sense is the point wherein Dhruv never called Modi a dictator. In his video, he only pointed out the patterns of how the Central Govt behaves these days which can be an indication to dictatorship!
Don't question Stupido?
@rakeshbabu9884
exactly my point!
Well articulated
Modi is dictatorship
Well he asked modi a question in vedio please check rightly why he mentioned modi ? He indirectly pointing modi well it was directly but still it was way to directed you can't deny the fact he target central government which is bjp and a pm can only be a dictator it was direct attack in political sense.
On a side note, this is what most of us miss about the "old" Hafta: respectful yet spirited debates. Keep Hafta free for a few months for non-subscribers, then take it back behind the paywall. Most people don't what they're missing.
The most blunt argument made by Sudipto. The whole point of acknowledging the reality of an oppressive regime is to safeguard the option for the betterment of future, especially for the exploited. If oppressed engages in dismissal, we wouldn't be an independent nation today. The vanity of being a non participating political audience can only be afforded by people on top of the pyramid. The oppressed should always fight for their share of equal right cuz no one else would do it for them.
It's really great to see a good and respectful debate between the panelists.😊
Dhruv never said India is a dictatorship, he said that we show the sign of dictatorship. It's like someone warning about the flood and you are telling him what about the flood that came 50 years back.
Exactly he even said this in yesterday’s video that’s we’re heading to dictatorship, I don’t know why people don’t listen carefully ‼️
Ambedkarite Mandals vs Savarna Commies wonderfully hilarious
If emergency was wrong, then why repeat it?? As children we were told that what ever we do we should own it, rather than say that I am doing it because I think it is correct
So are you still a kid who thinks emergency is on?
Just because a wrong deed has been committed by someone in the past, it cannot be used as a excuse or an argument to justify the deeds being committed now. That makes everything in existence a pointless cycle
Thanks
Welcome abhi da
The argument given by Mr. Mandal on Dhruv’s video was like when our PM has given examples of Rape case happening in Rajasthan when he has to give statements on Manipur and all the seriousness of the Manipur incident was neutralised by one statement.
Thank you Newslaundry for this analysis
शानदार सटीक बौद्धिक निर्भीक बेबाक एन एल के लिए कोटिक आभार साधुवाद सलाम
On the contrary, one must learn from the past and not repeat the wrongs done in the past.
Not repeating the past is good but leaving the past as it is, is bad idea. If anything is done wrong in past than it must be rectified else it will be get repeated
Great podcast guys.
Congratulations. God bless you.
Yayy! A full video of the podcast. I’ve been a subscriber and would love for you guys to make the entire video available for subscribers at least. Much prefer this format to the audio podcast. Please please consider it!
Great work
16:43; The bulldozing spree is just one part of the bjp’s strategy of disfranchising the anti bjp votes comprising of the muslims , dalits and obc’s who predominantly live in these slums invariably built on government land for want of any other alternative housing facility. Similar exercise was done in the US by the pro-trump administration to disenfranchise anti-trump votes comprising of the blacks and hispanics by manipulating the conditions to be eligible to vote. For 2024 the bjp doesn’t want to rely on the EVM alone hence these bulldozing
If bjp wanted to disenfranchise obc, sc/st or muslims then why is it that bjp vote share from thes e groups increasing for the bjp? Are the people stupid or is the opposition stupid? Perhaps you are stupid?
We are living under the dictatorship of Modi and that's the fact- what's the point of this argument? Please watch Dhruv Rathees's video carefully where he made it clear point by point how systematically all pillars of democracy are being destroyed and the minorities are being targeted as the Jews were in Germany. Doing whataboutary is only diluting the danger we live in today- I fully agree with Abhinandan...
minority did you just said minority the minority which don't want CAA NRC UCC the minority which throws stone the minority which kicked out kashmir pandits the minority which want to remove modi so they vote for congress the minority which has 3rd largest land holder waqf board a village in tamil nadu and a temple is under waqf board open your eyes partition happened because of minority
@@rajeshwariaski6026they are not the only minorities if I say so
@@Dragonfruitxd82 minority became majority majority became minority its all the truth
@@IamSuperman154you are here too ? 😂 Sham sharmas propoganda videos arent appreciated
Great podcast through and through.
If wrong has been done in the past, it does not justify me doing another wrong today.
This logic is absurd.
The point is if in the past india wasn't a dictatorship with the same sort of activities then now also india is not a dictatorship.
@@Aditya__Mishraso that is just generalizing the extent of exploitation and making it more casual on the basis that we were always like this
@@lukeross494 similarly it can be said that the current narrative is a propaganda as out of two culprits one is demonised more as per personal preference, and no objective conclusion is being made.
Great effort towards establishing the fact that need of this hours 💯 full power to you all lovely people out there 🙏 keep rocking this planet ✌️👍👌🤘👊🌀💗💫🕊️✨
Is India becoming prosperous and powerful? I am more concerned about that now.
India has potential and it's natural to grow! But the problem is many things are going wrong way and I believe we will face some of the issues of China and American in India which we could have avoided.
Also, being right is more important than being powerful!
Best hafta in years!!
By the way one thing is common.
Modiji in Tamilnadu
Twitter trends #Gobackmodi
No one literally No one does it better.
Just to clarify I am a Hindu born in North-JH and staying in South-TN and still a Hindu btw
But the actual TN is not what main stream media shows TN is much more peaceful and welcoming for all when compared to many North states.
Dhoni is correct after JH for me too TN is my second home.
Lovely people's
Always appreciate your well informed and nuanced take on subject of interest, will buy your merchandise, hope that contributes.
Enjoyed this full video format 👍
Thank you hackers 🙏🏻
No discussion on Rameshwaram Cafe IED blast in Bangalore ?
This podcast was recorded on Thursday. The blast occured after that if I'm not wrong
What should be discussed now? Let the police investigate and catch the culprits.
Hope they do some investigative journalism in this blast...and not just random passing discussion bcos Karnataka is Congress ruled ...😔
The manner in which NL gave a pass to TMC over Sandeshkhali is astounding...so not expecting much from NL in the Bangalore terror blast also.
When do we need investigative journalism? When the investigation doesn't reveal sensible results. Let us wait.
Good work guys, keep it up.
Very nice
Yes
how come this hafta is available in full for all?
never mind. got my answer
Sudipto's point is actually brilliant! He simply meant be it in the present or back then; people didn't care about lower castes communities. I feel instead of dismissing his point, he simply wanted his statement to be heard and acknowledged - as is. Because that is the very truth of what marginalised communities have gone through. It is definitely not a 12 year old argument, and is much more serious topic. Unfortunately, the way his point was acknowledged / countered showed a lack of empathy.
His argument is calling Indira a Brahmin wadi is dumb
Quite frustrating argument even amongst intelligent people although i respect the argumentation. It is nihilism though - given that the point is to say this can’t be a dictatorship because people before have been authoritarian, and all of it is exploitative. Erasing gradients is absolutely useless- just because Congress has been terrible doesn’t mean BJP can’t be worse, and if anyone thinks Modi’s regime will not harm the subaltern any worse than previous regimes they’re fooling themselves
Where is DHRUV sir ???
Kejru ka Sir GERMAN SHEPHERD Germany mey baithe MODI ke khilaf naya KHICHIDI paka raha hey...🤭
Sudipto Mondal is a gem, brings fresh and relevant points in discussion.
Superb Hafta, Sudipto made the difference, good job
~ (48:00, 50:00)
the point abt 'let the palace burn':
imo, it's a loss-loss for everyone in that scenario; those who are part of the political discourse, as well as those who are not part of it.
we know how it's a loss for the former, but how is it for the latter?
because even though the past was cruel to these communities, they still had a chance to fight for their rights & die trying.
instead, if they choose to remain indifferent, u don't need to be a genius in maths to see that the chances become nil for any future changes.
let me make my point crystal clear with the example of ambedkar ji.
if he had had similar ways of thinking, he wouldn't have done what he has done for the marginalised communities.
he made sure that their voice was heard and was included in all forms of political & intellectual discourses.
every day is a struggle.
for each individual, the struggle is different.
for some, it starts from level 0, for some it's level 10.
and for some, it is level -10.
at essence, my point is - being indifferent is not the solution.
if I remember correctly, there's a quote by george bernard shaw - “The worst sin towards our fellow creatures is not to hate them, but to be indifferent to them: that's the essence of inhumanity.”
if u wish to be a part of the discourse, u have to fight for it.
thank u for reading❤
why full ?
What happened to the Chhota version?
I agree with Abhinandan that it is irrelevant to compare the contemporary politics with past. It is like saying that if a person got slapped 20 years ago, anyone is free to slap him today as well. What was wrong 20 years ago is wrong today as well.
Bhootkal ke dushkarm vartman ke dushkarmo ka auchitya nahi ban sakte.
But you gotta remember the past. These guys never talk about the past!
@@dipanshusingh9790 talking about the past in the context of today's political problems is relevant only if the intent is to find solutions to the problems of today.
Forgettig past and voting for them again is good I guess then
Having 5 star celebration with yasin malik is good I guess then
@@yogeshpattewar4419 it's quite frankly the same as celebrating the release of hindu extremist rapists. But you again miss the point as usual. Remembering the past is one thing but to use it to justify the horrors of the present is utterly stupid.
❤️
Really loved the discussion. I wish this could be made available here for free for people who're unable to subscribe with donations.
You got it....we the people are lemmings 😢😢😢😢
5:05 thank for this - let’s talk about
Finally a rational opinionated person who has a perspective on why the rise of the right wing is a logical result of the breakdown and hypocrisy of the left.
Everybody knows it. That’s how people who’re not establishment liberals at least, understand what has become possible for the right but that’s no reason to stop calling out what is happening now, especially when it’s getting irreversibly worse
Honestly i personally beleive the left can do better on the topic of Islam.
My cousin tells us the full Ramayana with connecting bolly wood songs. Very talented. Very interesting.
34:27 eklavya can also say heres my hand why u choose middle finger ?
The Modi advertisement was really bizarre and in poor taste.
It is not that we have enough to live good life but we have lot to lose and also that it is very easy to loose out voice in midst of garbage
Four unemployed friends on a Monday afternoon 😂
And you the unemployable commenting this
Sudipto is wrong in saying we brought it upon ourself. That is a myth. These forces existed always and look for a way in. Bjp, rss, right wing mentality always existed. We did not bring it upon ourself. This always is a fight between good and evil.
Who names thier channel name as newslundry.
Anant’s papa owns 50% of Indian media. Entitled kids like Anant require PR to build up their image. Other wise who would he be other than billionaire papa’s son.
Even after this news flood he will be billionaire papa's son.
🎉
1:18:40 This bit is definitely true and I can personally attest to it through my own experiences, though I will not blame the BJP party directly. It's more due to freedom given to various dals like RSS, VHP and Bajrang dal. Their members constantly try to establish base at various education institutions by trying to exploit weakness of administrators, so that they can try to get audience with students so they can spread their propagandas and convert them to their own cause. Many people including the administrators are afraid to speak up against these groups. They act like common Gundas who will not harm you physically, but socially and emotionally.
Do the interview show Sudipto, be the voice! On your 5th episode I will become a paid member hahaha
Past is a place of reference, not a place of residence.🙏 45:47
Why would any private player get into Farm insurance when the risk is high.
So, we will blame the one who got us here(past), as they deserve,
But we want blame the one who is doing that, that's stupid!
We can't solve problems of years old, we only have present!
do that story
Criticize random Sena , sometimes they are unreasonably strict and u must criticize them
Please bring Anand Vardhan back!
Bring more of someone like sudipto for counter views. It was interesting
They won't. People who give a broader perspective are against the values of NL. This guy won't be invited again on good topic panels
@@user-eb2cc9cr8g you sound like a bhakt gang member.
@@vikram1262 you sound like the sound I make when I fart.
He'll still issue with app.... have some shame.. same issue 4 years ago 😊😊
Sanghis attaching them man
brahmin patriarchal sanghi conspiracy
@@Vivek10010 naam mein kumar hain matbal saala Kalua hain
So Rathee should not have done the video
Mr. Mondal is really wasting time. When one panellist is talking about something absolutely unnecessary and just to prove a point go on and on about it, trying to show of knowledge, just for the sake of it. Is this not really the purpose of discussion. Most of us are listening to this discussion with a lot of seriousness. Please have better panelists who can actually contribute by talking about current issues with a sense of the seriousness for the reality.
No political party should be in mire than 5 years, at the most 10 years. Citizens must understand it
No one in News Laundry had an idea that this News Minute guy will be such a pain in the ass 😅😂😂
Sanghi and Dilip Mandan fan, News Minute Executive Editor was out of syllabus for NL 😂😂😂
If a person as radical as Mitch McConnell says he can't stand with trump. Think about how radical must he be.
Its very difficult to digest that even news laundry had only half information about Sandeshkhali issue. The actual reason behind the arrest of Seikh Shahjahan was the continuous protest of village women in Sandeshkhali with out any political affiliation. Yes BJP had made a atmosphere against TMC in this Sandeshkhali issue country wise through their media influences and also because Independent Media like you did not focus properly before hand. But you people also did not know that not only BJP, Left and specially their youth fraction DYFI protest all through the state, even one CPIM member died because of Police atrocity in one of the disobidence protest in Baharampur. The CPIM party offices which had been close from 2016 onwards opened first time after that. ex CPIM MLA Nirapodo Sordar was the first person to be arrested because Police thought he was the person who gather those women to protest against Shahjahan and Shibu Hazra
IMHO Abhinandan lost the argument WITH newsminute guy. Great arguments
Not really, but the NewsMinute guy made some thought-provoking arguments that I generally don't hear from the Indian RW. Overall, a good exchange of ideas.
Every revolution needs flowed ideology.. hindutva ( flowed ) is a revolution indeed ... good for the country
I was born in 1977, the year CPIM came into power in Bengal. I have lived 23 out of their 34 years rule in Bengal, and I can tell that it was the most safe, most beautiful, most memorable part of my entire life. Sudipto, please stop spreading misinformation about the left rule in Bengal in Newslaundry.
Ref: your statement from 41 minutes, in this video.
because you are a rich guy. But your economy is in the shitter. that counts for nothing?
@@jitkr1489 I am really amazed to see how you came down to personal attack without even knowing me. You already decided I am rich and you already decided that "my" economy is shitter and you already linked "my" economy with my richness.
I am fascinated by your intelligence. A typical Indian!
You are either rich or unemployed @@bondhutto, who else has the time? yeah the government in west bengal was a clusterduck; but we are seeing the same clusterduck repeat on the national scale.
@@sridhar6788 You still don't have anything else other than attacking me regarding my wealth or employment. Logic is missing.
Have a great life ahead.
@@bondhutto No but I have standpoint theory to show that your perspective is isolated to yours own. which is why it is personal.
The numbers dont lie, they are similar to the numbers that the centre currently puts out. The rich got richer and the poor got poorer. The middle class vacated the state in droves.
Jayashree talks really fast and it's very irritating 🥺
That guy in green hoodie's argument already invalid because he and Mandal saying the things that Dhruv Rathee didn't even said. Dhruv never in his video said that India has became dictatorship. His point of the video was that we are heading towards dictatorship. Infact i would like to give few important characteristic of a fascist country and you decide yourself with open mind that how relevant is thay right now. For example, integration of cronyism, pseudonationalism & religious fanaticism in politics, control over mass media, protecting the corporate and suppressing the farmers and labourers, finding a common enemy as unifying cause, fraudulent elections, ignoring human rights, sexism, obsession with national security and punishment. So These are the few characteristic and you decide by yourself. Also remember that it's not about right or left when it comes to this. We have example of both right and left when it comes to dictatorship in history. It's more about Dictatorship versus Democracy.
If we compare two scenarios and look through anti-caste perspective, one could say anti-caste is not entirely nihilistic. The two scenarios are:
(1) India under Modi.
(2) India under the British.
The popular anti-establishment perspective of India under British was that Brits were colonizer, looting India, were draconian and took freedom away from Indians. The popular anti-establishment perspective in India under Modi is that Modi govt is dictatorial, draconian, kills dissent, etc. The perspective in both these scenarios actually is not popular, and at best, minority upper caste perspective, who have never been affected by the prevailing caste dynamics in the country. The rationalistic upper caste never realized what British was doing to India, same was bieng done by them on lower castes. The upper caste awoke and called for freedom only because they were now oppressed under British.
Now, let's look the conditions in both the regimes and how these two administrations affected the life of fellow Indians. Conditions of oppressed lower caste people improved under the British. Although they had no intention of improving the life of oppressed caste people, they only disregarded caste to make administration smoother. Dr. Ambedkar realised this and didn't want independence of India with caste dynamics remaining intact, instead he wanted independence in a slower scale so that the transfer of power is equally distributed among various sections of society. He understood that independence would only mean transfer of power from colonizer to oppresive upper castes.
Coming to the conditions of lower castes under Modi, I would say, their condition has not improved drastically, but since BJP has to consolidate its vote bank by bringing OBCs/SCs/STs under Hindutwa, it has to have some commitment towards the oppressed people and maintain a level of power sharing with the oppressed, though BJP as its core ideology goes, is certainly, orthodox Hinduism (which is obviously caste-centric), but this is of no concern to opressed caste people so long BJP continues share power with them.
This is the reason prof. Dilip Mandal is not trying to be very rational by opposing Dhruv Rathee. Because the rationalistic stance is not free from caste bias. Dhruv criticizes BJP, but when results of caste-census were declared by the Bihar govt, which showed sheer disparity, Rathee remained silent and never brought up such an important issue. He cites Manusmriti for explaining what Dharma is and how good Hinduism is. In his entire videos, there is a meagre 1-2 videos on caste-issues, which is a existential issue in India. This is the case, by far, for most rationalistic persons out there speaking for India. They never like to talk about caste issues which is so fundamental and root cause of most of the problems in India. They join hands with right wing politics on caste issues.
Conditions of oppressed under the NDA is actually a little bit better wrt to congress as at-least BJP tries to appease oppressed from time to time by sharing power with them like making CM/PM/PS from lower caste background and other concessions. The moment BJP acts against the interests of Bajujan samaj, they would be thrown out of power. The moment other parties realises the need to withold the interests of lower castes (which are the majority), they would come to power which is why Rahul Gandhi and the congress is continuously demanding caste based census pan India. Congress is starting to understand they cannot win without the support of OBCs/SCs/STs which is a good sign!
Lastly, one must remember that BJP is not friend of Ambedkarites and Bajujan Samaj. The relationship between them is, at best, a diplomatic relationship, like the trade relationship which takes place even between opposing nations. In fact, non of the upper caste parties like congress/aap/bjp etc is friend of Bahujan samaj, the bahujan samaj just want their rightful representation in every areas and whoever gives them their rightful ownership, they can have a relationship with the bahujan samaj.
Legend
Some people never understand, Indian subcontinent is only part of the world where people value emotions.
West and their people had never felt that. They had not been framed so (mostly)
Election is game of swinging people into his side.
The better you learn the art the better you will perform
People who have been to Ayodhaya dham have seen How celebrity and all common pilgrims were going mad for little-little things. Like Children.
This shows their silent emotions.
& INDIA had been democratic in functioning, since the rest world didn't even know to write.
Indians know to maintain balance.
Aayenge to MODI hi
"Twitter argument, where people bring up facts to counter a point, not to prove a point".
-Jayashree arunachallam
Probably the most thoughtful comment here but not debated back and forth because the other gentleman pivoted.
Fool me once its ur mistake,fooled me twice i'm a fool so pls don't be the fool 😅☮️
Meltdown of Abinandan is crazy 😂
move to Akamai, rather than cloudflare
better bot management
बाबा रामदेव की जय उसकी प्रोडक्ट से मेरी दादी की पथरी ठीक हो गई जो में कई सालो से झांसी के डॉक्टर को दिखा रहा था
Bro can tell from personal experience doctors from jhansi suck
I have a theory that some people are inherently evil. And no matter how much exposure they get, that trait won't change. They just use their intellectual exposure to make their 'inherently evil and ridiculous' point sound cryptic and intellectual. Sudipto, Meghraj (from Kashmir), Anands (both Ranganath and the lawyer), etc. I am not sure it's shudh-desi-ghee dementia mascareding as bullshit positions or plain evilness. Need more experiments to confirm I think.
People are choosing best among the worst based on history of various parties and current Gov
51:21 We gotta pray that this guy never goes broke or else we will have a serial killer in our streets lol.... But man u did urself dirty by saying this Lol
34:26 lol
Hate against peaceful community not only happens in India. It is happening across the globe i think they are only responsible for this because they never doing reform in their community. All terrorists org are only from one community and who forget yesterday banglore bomb blast. So these kind of events people never forget.
Daddy dhroo should also speak on sandeshkali. Or maybe he isnt as quick as manipur issue this time bc the peroetrator is not bjp or a hindu even though victims are mostly all sc st category WOMEN....
No dalit activiist groups have outroared...hm i wonder fkn why
1 Dislike from me for CLICKBAIT Thumbnail
Free again why??
Ayega to Modi hi
Who amongst this panel is a SC or ST or OBC?
No one, leftists uc dono wor hai
True … Kannadigas don’t have hindutva ideology… I think what we need is Kannadatva🎉🎉🎉🎉. Yes Bhiwandi is true story. And agriculture problems are far more deeper than what you guys discuss, no land reforms will happen now and no one will agree for it. Forget revolution and nihilism. No one builds these , they happen and no one will ever get to know if they are coming.
Why don’t business is taken by govt when your so called educated business men failed and show loses
New channels have become PR agencies
India is becoming dictator because opposition is not winning any election.😢😢😢😢 Its like if we win then we are democracy if u win then modi os dictator😂😂😂😂😂
Chandigarh case says hi