Is there a critical period for learning a language?
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- čas přidán 18. 05. 2024
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Ever wondered if it's too late to learn a new language after childhood? In this video, I dive into the critical period hypothesis and the debate around how long the window for easy language learning really lasts.
Sources:
Critical period in second language acquisition: The age-attainment geometry: www.frontiersin.org/articles/...
The Critical Period Hypothesis in Second Language Acquisition: A Statistical Critique and a Reanalysis: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...
Wikipedia: Critical period hypothesis en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Critica...
Cognitive scientists define critical period for learning language: news.mit.edu/2018/cognitive-s...
⏲️ TIMESTAMPS:
0:00 What is the critical period hypothesis
01:01 How long is this critical period?
03:45 The ideal age to start learning a language
05:15 Factors that affect our success
7:39 Is there a language acquisition device?
9:45 Does age really matter?
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❓How old were you when you started learning your second language? Let me know in the comments!
I started studying Japanese 4 months ago. I am determined to at least get to level 5 or 4… I will turn 76 this July .🌻
Amazing! Good luck.
頑張ってね
Awesome!!
期待しているぞ。励むといい。
I am 67 years old and began studying Japanese 5 years ago. Go for it. 頑張って!
I feel like the bigger problem is that as an adult you're simply too preoccupied with other things on top of language learning. Children just have so much time for passive exposition.
No doubt that is a significant factor. I feel that most adults just don’t listen, they are too inflexible.
we need to be patient and enjoy the process .. !! easier to say
This, if I lived in my parents basement and could study languages all day I can't even imagine what I could achieve in a single year lol
@@hijackbyejack1729 As long as you still go out and use the language! :D
Really? If that were the case children would be better at learning everything better than adults. Turns out the opposite is the case and I defy you to name one other thing children are better at learning than adults. Bc they have more free time.
I began studying Spanish at age 68. My study became an addiction. I am 75, B1-B2 and lovin’ it! Having a blast being fluent!
Que lindo hermano mio! Dios te Bendiga!
@@eduardoantonionaranjo7972 ¡Mil gracias! Eres muy amable. ¡Un fuerte abrazo!
💙🙏🤗you are the inspiration for others
I don't fancy spoiling your fun but.. You can't teach an old dog new tricks 😅 Anyway, keep on learning and Greetings from Spain.. Cordiales saludos 👍
Yes! 74 years old and have gained proficiency in Spanish. And now I am using CI to acquire Swahili. I, too, am having a blast.
I was 21 years old when I've started to study Spanish here in Brazil. I think I was 33 years old when I've started to study English, and 36 French, and 42 Italian. I'm 44 years old now. I'm very happy and proud because I can talk to many people.
How WONDERFUL !!! Its all in the determination.
It is time to learn russian
There is no limit for learning a language. I am over 40 yo and I am learning Spanish on my own.
47 here and i try russian !! good luck for the spanish
And how well do you understand and speak it?
Felicitaciones, espero que logres avanzar mucho en este idioma, es muy bonito, muy versatil
61 started Spanish 1.5 years ago. Still struggling, and getting discouraged, but I do understand most of what I read. You have to stay motivated.
36 trying german korean and italian at once.
Not much hope for me Steve 😢started at 81 but enjoying it 😅
the process matters, the goal is nothing, sorry for dogmatism and my french
stay alive
There is a critical period for learning a language - it is today
This is the correct answer.
I am 57 years old and i use comprehension input as method of learn English...It´s very fun.Never bored
💙🙏🤗you are the inspiration for others
Learning how to learn seems more important to me. At 64, I am able to acquire more skills faster by prioritizing and knowing what works for me.
Yep😊
I was 10 when we started learning English at school. It was an ordinary school and I used to be jealous of kids who went to better schools with more hours of English and native speakers as their teachers. At university, I did my best to become as fluent in English as possible though I believed that I was far and hopelessly behind those lucky ones. Life proved me wrong. Now I'm fluent in English and Portuguese, I also know some Swedish and started Arabic at the age of 43. And I agree with what Steve keeps saying - don't memorize, acquire. Books, songs, movies - they created the language environment which allowed me to acquire languages without leaving my home country.
One thing I've noticed is, if you have a good ear for music, you have a better ability to sound native like, if you also work at improving your accent. Also, actors are pretty good at picking up accents.
Absolutely! I'm a pretty good mimic and find that I can hear the sounds or phonemes of other languages and reproduce them quite well. (Done a fair bit of amateur acting too and play a few instruments)
@@neilt4475 not american actors lol. none of them can do even a semi convincing british accent
For what it's worth, I started learning Spanish by myself in my 30's, and years later I started with Mandarin Chinese. I am more interested in new experiences with a language than tests and levels, and last year I wrote and released a Mandarin-language album and then went to China to promote it. It is on my channel for anyone interested. PS. I am a member of LingQ, have read The Way of the Linguist, and even bought the Yale in China flashcards. Thank you Steve Kaufman for all your hard work dedicated to the encouragement of language learning. I appreciate you very much 🙏
Where did you study Mandarin? How to start learning this?
@@juanwick8820 You are already in the right place. The wisdom on this channel will show you the way.
So encouraging Steve! Thank you! I have found a way of using LingQ that is really helping me. I watch a CZcams video in Spanish without subtitles. I then import it into LingQ and watch it again, this time reading along with the video and clicking on a few words to get the definition if I can't figure it out. This is definitely a fun way for me and I am learning more because I am really enjoying it. Thank you so much for all of your hard work in making language learning easy!
I'm watching your videos and sometimes I feel you speak in Czech language. How good I understand you. Sending regards from Czech Republic.
I just did 6 months of Spanish and was able to understand and converse with people on a recent trip to Mexico… I’m 45.
🤷♂️
I love your stuff Steve. Keep up the good work 😊
As always an articulate precise and honest account. Thank you
I am English age 76 and still learning English. I also learnt French and German at school and have learned them as an adult as a hobby. Then Spanish when my son married an Argentinian. In my opinion it’s the time and emotional effort you put in. I know I will only be fluent in English but love being able to communicate in the other 3 languages even if it is only with taxi drivers for whom that language is also foreign! I understand quite a lot but speaking a foreign language is so much more difficult.
You are the answer of this question before Even watching
I always enjoy your insights, especially on CZcams.
Steve, great video, as always very usefull insights!!!
Your explainations about language learning are persuasive and encouraging for me. And I believe that one of the reasons of hardship for elderly learners is that they've already established their lifestyle and culture in their mother tongue. Then it's hard to immerse themselves to the new language world. Thank you.
It’s only too late to learn a language if you’ve already given up.
I completely agree with Steve considering myself as an example because I acquired two language after my native language , and now I am in the process of learning Chinese lang in which I have found my reason to learn it so , what I have learned while learning these languages is Motivation , fully exposure and engaging yourself into the language activities as much as possible .
I'm glad to hear you.
My daughter just turned three. I speak Dutch with her and my wife speaks Mandarin with her and she has picked up Spanish in about four months by going to a daycare in Spain. It’s incredible! Being bilingual re-wires your brain to learn new languages easily.
that is the age
¡THE ABILITY OF READING IS A CRAZYNESS!
I am currently reading a lot on reddit english conversation and it's helping me a lot in a way that i am able to understand the 80% steven's talking about .
I acquired an ablility to read large texts on my own language but i imputed it into my english target language and it is working hughly , i recomend you to do that , read a lot no matter if you struggle at the beggining just primarely get the skill to read fast and understandeable so you at the momment to read in and listen in english you reach to understand better .
Another thing that helped me a lot is do not anticipate what people are going to say in the future , just let the words talk by themselves.
Age no issue - just need -like Steve preaches - MASSIVE input. 我学习汉语❤和❤西班牙话
You're the biggest example of this not being the case. I always tell people about you whenever they tell me something akin to "I'm too old to learn X language"
I can confirm. He name checked you during his last live video. 👏
Since subscribing to LingQ 24 days ago my linguistic world has expanded so much. Spanish learning has tripled, at least, in speed of learning new words, Added Chinese today and installed simplied Chinese (PinYing) Mandarin Chinerse keyboard into Win 11 and typed "horse" and "bird" into flash cards. One suggestion I have to improve LingQ is to add support for Yiddish, but not Yiddish using Hebrew characters but rather romanized Yiddish such as "A Beesser Mench" == "An educated man".
I learned a little French in high school, but later was married with kids and a job. I didn’t have time to study. I started Ukrainian on Duolingo at 59.
You mentioned older people needing explicit explanations for grammar rules. Well Duo doesn’t offer anything like that, but after seeing how words went together, I picked up a lot. I started seeing what was a feminine suffix, and so on. There are a lot of cases in Ukrainian and I won’t say I’ve got it all straight, but I feel it does a great disservice to us when people say we’re too old to learn.
I’m finding it much easier now that I’m retired and no kids to look after. I can study uninhibited by a work schedule, whenever I want, as long as I like.
I’ve always been a learner by nature and there is evidence that by continuing to learn throughout life keeps the brain more able to do so. Use it or lose it, as they say.
Thank you so much
I'm 64 and have been studying English for a long time... Now I want to start with French 😊
I would be curious to match personality traits of the big 5, especially openness, agreeableness and conscientiousness being higher.I suspect that would corollate. Then extroversion, agreeableness and neuroticism would affect how much accent correction is desired by each person.
I took two years of French in high school and dabbled with language apps for years, but nothing stuck until I was 44 and decided I wanted to see if I really focused on it, could I learn a language. Turns out I sure can, and I really, really enjoy it. New lifelong hobby and I'm only a year in!
Yeah eh I can say that you can adcquire a lenguage quickly for a long time , but for me after of 50 is more slow, I'm 17 years and I can see that my english have mistakes but I adquire vocabulary whithout study almost 600 words and fast I have a level alround B1 and I don't studied ever and anything , is automatic (I haven't exposed in the lenguage for much time I see one video for day that I like and I have 1 month in that , i have a open mind too and always I was learning everything about everything , that is good for my neuroplasticity (sorry for my mistakes and good luck , you can do it🎉)
My case:
Spanish: Mother tongue, no problem but I have forgotten some of the grammar and vocabulary.
English: Studied it at school and in private lessons until the age of 18. I now speak it fluently because I came to live in an English speaking country.
French: Started learning it in evening classes, on and off over some years, after the age of 28. I could never learn it properly.
Steve Is the best
I believe children have an extremely strong desire to learn a language, as it is the only way for them to survive and/or connect with their closest and most important people - their parents. A multilingual parent of a bilingual child here.
I'm 27 and started learning Polish 2 years ago and started getting 1-2-1 lessons on Preply a year ago. This has given me hope that I will eventually get to a B2 level one day!
As the old saying goes "One is never too old to learn". That's all there is to it! I am 52 years old, I am still alive, kicking and, well, keeping on learning new foreign languages.
I believe that the Defense Language Aptitude Battery test is based for the most part on recognizing and applying "patterns". How well a person tests in this determines which tier of languages they can qualify to take instruction in [I believe there are currently four categories, ranging from Cat I (the easiest) to Cat IV . So, your point on recognizing patterns is well taken.
I am 68 and British, and I have just started learning French. I am loving the challenge and I am eager to get up to a good conversational level. We are never to old to learn, and it’s good to challenge the brain as we get older.
You can learn a foreign language at sny age if you desire.I am Russian,I am 72 and I am able to study with great pleasure,my level ls B2.We are retired and have much time for learning.If l were younger ! would learn French.The main thing is practice,but l haven't got friends abroad.I don't know how to practice my knowledge.I understood you very well.Thank you
Вы молодец! Смотрю ваши видеоролики и хочется учить языки.
You never miss 🔥
you can become fluent in a restricted field, and adequate in general conversation, but many people never quite lose intonations of first language. no matter, study at any age, it's good for mental health.
I am retired and spend 2 to 3 hours every day studying French. I enjoy the language and the culture and I have spent several months almost every year in Paris since retiring 8 years ago. I studied Spanish in high school and in college but my focus over the past ten years has been learning French. Etudier le francais est mon passe-temps.
Im 14 years old studying korean and really it is a struggle still for me. I forget when I use the knowledge I learned if I don't use it or go back and review it, but because Im in the US and not even close to Korea, I don't have anyone to talk to so whenever I learn Vocabulary and grammar, I always think will I remember any of this? when will I use it. especially when I'm studying and come across words to study I always tend to think negativity like should I really learn these words right now, how can and when will I use it because I have no one to practice with. Korean is my first ever language I studied, and Its so hard to immerse myself because I don't know how since its my first language I'm studying, and Im not sure how I can learn vocabulary and use them in sentences that Make sense. . But right now I'm like really really willing to learn it since want to study in Korea which isn't until like 3 years but it's a big motivation for me to study right now. AHh
Keep going! It’s a slow process but just stay persistent and don’t be discouraged! Korean is gaining a lot of traction so I think it will be really important in the future. My two cents without being too long winded is follow these tips: 1. Don’t give up. 2. Once you get a general basic vocabulary, read a book of interest (that you’ve already read in English). This way you can focus on the words and grammar and not get lost in the meaning. Do this while also listening to the audio book at the same time. Set a calendar date for yourself to get a tutor and stick to that date (it gives a sense of urgency and also a “ready or not, here I come” mindset to start speaking). 3. Commit to doing a lesson with a language partner however often is feasible for you ( a legit tutor is way better than a friend or family member. If you can afford it, spending the money for a tutor is worth it). For me, I commit to one lesson a week. And I’m planning for June to be a challenge where I do 15 lessons in a month. 4. Journaling is underrated. Just write about your day in your target language. One or two paragraphs is plenty. Or however frisky you’re feeling that day. Feel free to come back to this comment and ask me anything. I’d be happy to help you if I can. And if I can’t, I can help you find resources that can be of use
I started learning languages other than my natives (English/Spanish) when I was 30…I am now about to turn 34 and I’m learning Japanese (started learning from English, but now I’m just using Japanese to learn Japanese), Italian (from Spanish), Korean (from Japanese) and I’ve dabbled into Mandarin Chinese….in that order. It is definitely possible. Also, the more languages you learn, the easier it is to pick up a new one…
It is interesting to listen to the experience of students learning a language at university when they have no prior experience. Often they enter the university to study two languages, with one at a B2 level in entry. Students seem to report that they spend most of their time on the beginner language and almost neglect their B2 language. They go to become proficient at c1 or c2 level in both languages and usually spend long periods studying abroad where their beginner language is spoken. So my conclusion is that a critical factor is the exposure.
I started studying español at the age of 46, 8 years ago and voy bien hasta ahora.
Hi sir I am form Algeria I speak Algeria accent in my country i explain more about Algeria accent it's a combine between Arabic french and special words and expressions have created from people during the life of this accent many people in Algeria couldn't speak the real Arabic language cause they use it just in especial place like a school but for me is different I learnd speak in Arabic first from school and After I developed my Arabic language when I watch many things in Arabic from the internet, and i couldn't developed my French language cause I was this language and i stayed week I learnd the English language for six years it's alright could speak a little bit but I didn't become fluent the Spanish language i started to learn since a weak but I don't care about the Alphabet of Spanish I learn and acquire from listening and speaking my goal is just to speak in Spanish
¡Madre mía que frikis somos!🤓 Es muy interesante todo esto. Espero que encontremos pronto las respuestas a todas estas preguntas.
I just started a B1 ( that's intermediate) Spanish Class, and I'm the youngest in the class at 57! I'd say the oldest person is probably about 75. The other people all seem pretty motivated, and several of them speak multiple languages. So yep, don't ever think you are too old. If you can remember how to conjugate a verb, you can do it. 😂
you can reach c1 depends on your effords
I learned German and Low-Saxon at age 3, English at age 12, and Scandinavian I picked up around the age of 16, but never very well, same with Hebrew at age 50, it is hard when you get old..
In my case, I was monolingual, I only spoke Spanish until I was 22. But At 22, I went to Brazil because I wanted to study there. Long story short, I needed to learn English and Portuguese. I studied hard both languages. What I did was study some grammar and read a lot of books in both languages (using audiobooks to hear as well). In the end, I didn't make it to the University but I learned both languages at a decent level, I could read fluently in both languages and I could even understand movies at the end of that year (A lot of people say my pronunciation in both languages is actually very good. But I must add I continue to improve in both languages and now I am 33). So, I think motivation is key, and reading a lot to get the grammar as you are having fun reading is more important.
I would also add that I think is waaaay easier for me to learn languages now than it was when I was younger. I am learning German now and I am having an easier time learning :)
I would like to know, is there anyone else who has encountered something similar to this?
Older and wiser😊❤ and smarter
One gets smarter and learns easier but also one is better at forgetting!
Very good question Steve 🤔👏 8 languages are enough including Arabic ? Sufficient, right? Добрый вечер 😊
Children are around the language 24/7 and it takes them how long to be able to read a novel in their native language?
Exactly. Adults _massively_ underestimate the amount of exposure a child is getting. By the age of about 7, a child has had _way_ more quality exposure than an adult will _ever_ get (and they got it intensively), even if they did their 1-2 hours a day, for 3 decades. That sucks for us adults, but it is what it is.
Some of my students are in their 50s and 60s and, as long as they study enough, they're making decent progress.
There's a document by the FSI* that says that the average age of the students there is around 40, that they do pretty well and that age seems to limit how "native-like" you can become (accent, grammatical details etc.) much more than how well you can function in the language.
As for my personal experience, I'm 35 now, and I haven't really noticed a difference yet.
* "10 lessons from 50 years of theory and practice in government language teaching"
I would say - it depends, as always. I am a native Polish speaker. I have started my language adventure with English and German as I was approx. 10 years old. And I am still in this process - I am still learning. Now I am over 40 and I find it very challenging to learn greek... and I thing the "WHY?" is - I do not have any good reason to learn it... I have tried it for fun but I need a "real" reason, like e.g. to live/ work abroad.
I’m curious about your comments on Chomsky’s Universal Grammar. I’d never heard it argued that it constrains L2 learning - I thought that Krashen (among others) are basically Chomskiests in terms of belonging to various linguistic schools of thought.
Thanks for another interesting video, Steve. :)
I saw a documentary many years ago about people who didn't learn any language before the age of six years. They had a lot of difficulty with speaking. The explanation given was that the connection between certain areas of the brain and the various parts of the mouth used for speech wasn't developed.
Level of Autism is an important factor. Autistic people recognise patterns more than other people and are able to endure the boredom of repetition much better than those who are not Autistic. The high level of Autism of Daniel Tammet enabled him to learn Icelandic in 1 week for example.
Another factor I wonder about is dialect. If somebody learns an English dialect at home before they go to school of any kind and then learns another dialectic at school will that give them more language learning skill?. Does polyglotism run in families? If a parent is good at languages will their children be?
Tengo 38 anos, y he estado aprendiendo espanol por siete meses y medio ahora. Me comienzo para aprender espanol en el doce de septiembre este pasado ano (2023). Como un crisitiano, mi manera prinicpal para aprender ha estado por leyendo la biblia cada dia en espanol en mi estudios biblicos personales, memoriziendo canciones de adoracion en espanol, y por asistiendo a la iglesia espanol entre los servicios de mi iglesia prinicpal cada domingo, donde el pastor es de cuba y mas de la congregacion son de cuba tambien, juntamente con algunos mexicanos, venezalonos, y nicaraguenses tambien. Yo quiero aprender espanol porque mis abuelos paternos eran de michocan en Mexico, pero yo no aprendo espanol cuando yo era un nino, entonces yo aprendo ahora. Me deseo es para ser fluido por mi cuarenta cumpleanos en septiembre 2025! Yo creo fuertemente que en el tiempo de Dios segun Su voluntad yo aprendere espanol. En mi opinion es simplemente sobre estar disciplinada cada dia, poco a poco, paso a paso, y teniendo paciencia, muchas paciencia! Bendiciones a todos en sus viajes de aprendiendo de los idiomas diferentes!
Sholem Alechem, Rebbe Koyfman! Hey, Steve, it has come to my gnosis that your parents were people from Ashkenazi origin from the Austro-Hungarian Empire. I've been learning about the germanized Jews of the Empire on my Hebrew studies major, it's quite a fascinating milleu that produced many authors. Hasn't your background enticed you to explore Yiddish and Hebrew? No offense to German speakers, but Yiddish is the version of German that sounds cool. Zait gezunt!
Great video (one of many, of course), not least through the visual and audio effects. The tears and whining of Chomsky are my favorite 😂
I'm a Thai and i started learning English when i was a kid.(I can't remember how old i was when started.).then now i'm 15 and learning italian(now b1) and german(now a2)
*Thai is my mother tongue(native language).English is 2nd.Italian and German that I'm learning are 3rd and 4th.
I would want children to learn other languages, but in a positive way. If the class is disliked, it might discourage language learning. Speaking of Czech, my mom and grandmother used it to hide information from me. I was so frustrated on a trip to Czech Republic hearing those familiar sounds, yet not understanding.
Yes! It is absolutely right that learning a foreign language is a matter of time spent with the target language.
I love this video
I enjoyed this video, it is a very non dogmatic overview of language acquisition by older learners. Children are exposed to a simpler form of language, no complex vocabulary or structures, they have huge amounts of time to devote to language acquisition and they practice language daily in a relaxed and fun environment so they get massive exposure. I know a Russian Lithuanian who has lived in England as an adult for 19 years, and his English is barely intelligible. I know an Austrian who has lived here as an adult for well over 30 years, he is 70 now, and speaks near native level English. I met a German nurse who came here as an adult, her English was native level, only the inability to pronounce the th sounds gave her away. children learn naturally to native level, adults can or can come close, but it seems many don’t.
My grandmother onlspoke Polish no English in 20+ years. I only learned a few words. English is my native language. . I learned Latin 1st in High school then French (high and college I'm fluent in French. ..then Spanish, Greek and Italian in my 20s . Next Japanese in 60s and now Chinese at 70. It just tales Time and continued effort to build vocabulary. I read French the most. Spanish and Italian listen to Music. I can read Japanese slowly...Chinese only read pinyin, speak well, hard to understand when I hear at full speed. There are levels of language fluency in every area Speaking, Listening, Reading and Writing.
I met some people who moved to Italy when there were still relatively young 11-12 and they didn't sound native to me despite having gone through their education mostly in Italian. They were very good but clearly not native. On the other hand there could be other people who moved here at the same age who do sound native. I would say that after 11-12 it's not guaranteed you'll be native, while before 10 I think it is
in my opinion, it really depends on the type of material someone is exposed to. a baby can't really get anything from a university course on Arabic, but if you submerge a baby fully into an Arabic speaking world, they're going to pick some up eventually. if you dropped an adult into a setting where all they did is passively listen for two years straight, they'd probably have an easier time trying to speak whatever language they were learning, too.
on the other hand, if you know your language learning process pretty well and know what works best for you, I can't imagine you'd make slower process than a baby. in my experience, just because something is "the most effective" way to do something doesn't mean it's the best way to do it; if you're learning a language and not having fun, you're hardly going to internalize anything since the brain works best when at play and relaxed.
i started learning Japanese when i was 27 and I'm well I'm my way to being N5 lvl by the time I'm 75
My wife who is Japanese, aside from her native language, she is fluent in both Mandarin Chinese and American English. I think some people just have the ability to pick up languages better than others. I myself am fluent in American English, Mandarin Chinese, Taiwanese, and Japanese. Also I’m thinking about picking up Italian or French which I took three years in high school…I’m in my 50s and think it is absolutely doable if you aren’t shy about making mistakes.
I speak 5 languages and I never learned English in school.
Okay, let me give you an example. I don't know the word "doable" from your text. What is possible in life sometimes when you don't know some words that are important for some reasons.
Use your second language as a hobby, why not..
EVERYTHING is doable with time and determination.
I'm too old, but I'm doing it anyway.
love that spirit
Hello Steve how's it's going? I wanna learning vocabulary the languages
I have been living in Germany for almost 3 years and am 59 years old, I still have a lot to learn German, but I can work and talk with native speakers. It is possible to learn.
I am a few months away from 70 and learning french!
I've read some studies of heritage speakers vs. adult learners comparing their nativelikeness. In Spanish, not only do heritage speakers make less gender errors than L2 speakers, they can be told apart on a brain scan by their reaction to gender errors. I'm a heritage speaker of both Spanish and French, and there are some Spanish nouns (e.g. orden y origen) which I tend to put in the wrong gender because Spanish disagrees with French, but my mental representation of gender, as far as I can tell, is native because I was exposed early (to a lot more French than Spanish, but the grammars are very similar).
Ages and critical periods do not matter. If you want to learn a language you will do it - pick up vocabulary, grammar, whatnot, and hone your prononciation as far as you like it.
The key points in learning a language are obstacles you got in, motivation and predisposition. But younger people may be more motivated in a sense of "going on with their exploration of the World". The upper groups are more conservative and feel less easier to start something new.
But here comes the factor of predisposition. Why, apart from compulsury languages, we have or had learned at school, we chose for our our own studies this language and not that one? Is this the aftermath of some sort of genetic memory or the regars from our previous lifes?
one thing about this topic is that while maybe things would have been better if i started learning earlier during my childhood we didn't have the internet and other handy modern things and i didn't know about the best ways to learn a language i was learning English back then because of movies and video games my grandma tried to convince me to learn French but the shows on the French tv channels were worse and i couldn't just buy video tapes and books in French without a long journey .and now imagine trying to learn it if you lived in America or japan even harder. i still had the advantage of living close to France and if i tried to learn Japanese back then it would have been very annoying and expensive.
i know polyglots existed long before my time .the guy who made the video was one .but i think even Steve said he didn't start learning most of his languages until the early 2000s when he could get mp3s off the internet .and he learned other languages because of unique events in his life before the internet like living in japan for a few years and working in china in the 1960s and learning French because he is from Canada. so he had access to more French media than in many other countries and i think back then French and English media was more on par with each other .but it couldn't keep up with America in the 80s/90s my grandma claims French was considered more important than english during her childhood .but she is only slightly older than Steve and she is probably biased because of our region and that she still doesn't know English today .
I am from Latvia and my best second language is Russian (10 years of school + the Soviet Union), but my Latvian is better than my second language. My third language is German (5 years of school), but I left it in school 30 years ago and never used it in my life. Or my third language is English, which I never had in school. With English, I had receptive bilingualism until the age of 34. Literally, I didn't know anything about my ability to understand this language until that age. I have got the sound of English from American movies with a double soundtrack. These movies were shown in the Soviet Union when I was 16-17 years old and English was not the main language in those movies.
@@vogditis yeah I live close to Russia and your country was technically part of Russia when you were young. so it was easy for you and English movies were the only ones that were popular world wide before the internet. nowadays we can choose to watch movies from anywhere but back then it was only regional + English. and you were not successful with German because Germany was too far away and German movies were not on TV outside of German speaking countries. so for me Russian would be too hard since Russia is far away but Germany is close to where I live so it would be easier. but nowadays it's not a big deal anymore since I can use the internet to watch Russian movies or German or any language.
I saw this video somewhere, can't for the life of me remember where (might've even been an article), that talked about why adult migrants often don't achieve fluency while their children do. Basically it boiled down to something like exposure, and how early you start trying to speak. The claim was that if you force yourself to speak before you've heard enough of the language, you won't have formed a proper image of what the language sounds like in your head, and your pronounciation is going to be off. Adults are going to have far greater pressure to speak the language early, as they may have to communicate with the new language for work or other matters. Adults also tend to have more static social circles, which are more likely to consist of people who don't speak the new language. This means less exposure to the language, on top of adults already having far less time to spend on exposure than children.
So, ultimately, it boils down to the amount of input you're getting. Assuming an adult was getting the same amount of input as a child, I'd bet that adults learn just as well as children do. In fact, adults have plenty of advantages that speed up the process particularly in terms of vocabulary where loanwords are rampant and related languages are a thing. Concepts also often transcend language, so when learning the word 'freedom' in a new language, you won't have to learn the whole concept of freedom from scratch. Obviously the implications of the word might be different, but you'll at least have a base to build on.
I might’ve watched the same video yesterday: czcams.com/video/yW8M4Js4UBA/video.html&ab_channel=BeyondLanguageLearning
Reading and listening is tremendously helpful, and it seems to transfer to other skills (writing, speaking, grammar, pronunciation) to some extent. I've tried input-only learning, but I don't think it's optimal.
Most of my students on iTalki already knew some German before we started - I never had the impression that students who started on LingQ have better (or worse) pronunciation than students who used other apps or went to group classes.
Every day has critical periods to learn things
The critical age is one year to two years old, I taught my kid English as a second language at that age, and have her watch the TeleTubbies on the BBC... she picked up English in no time at all, and no, she did not confuse it with her Dutch or German. Teach kids languages at that age, not at age 12... By that time it is hard to learn a third or 4th language..
No it isn't.
I know lots of people who started their 1st foreign language at 8 and learned their 2nd foreign after University and their 3rd and 4th after 35 and they speak them well enough to get g jobs with lots of complicated language requirements. Not all parents can teach their kids and not all kids have access to languages before they are about 8 or 9. That is especially true about older generations.
Personally I am much better at learning languages today than I was 20 years ago when I was a teenager. I think the main challenge for most older people is actually incorporating that language into daily life when you're probably already set in your ways, hobbies, and activities.
I am a native French speaker. My mother is a native Spanish and German speaker. She learned French when she was 22 as she came to the country. We never spoke anything else than French together ; her French is flawless and she completely passes for native. Given this experience the stronger versions of the critical period hypothesis make little sense to me.
Passes for*, not "passes off", the latter means something different
Isn’t learning a language a continuous endeavor like exercising to be healthier; isn’t simple effort better complex avoidance?
44 yo here, native spanish speaker and I´m learning russian, french and chinese at this moment.
critical period hypothesis가 나온 이유는 이러하다. 원어민(natvie)화자들은 만 3세쯤이 되면 자신의 언어에서 끊임없이 발전할 수 있는 토대가 갖추어진다. 이는 문자 혹은 단어의 학습이기 보다는 듣기와 말하기의 학습인데, 읽기와 쓰기는 또 다른 영역이다. 듣고 말하는게 가능하면 문자를 배워 읽을 수 있고, 읽는 것과 문자를 떠올리는 것은 차이가 있기에 그 철자를 떠올려서 외우는 것 혹은 소리값과 철자법의 차이를 학습하여 쓰기 과정을 익힌다.(여기서 쓰기 과정이란, 정교한 쓰기 과정이기보다는 말하는 것을 옮겨적을 수 있고 철자를 대체로 틀리지 않을 수 있는 그러한 과정을 의미한다. 우리가 유려하고 정해진 형식 혹은 그보다 더 발전된 방식에 맞추어 글을 쓰는 것은 또 다른 영역이고 앞으로의 설명에는 필요가 없다.) 여기서 끊임없는 발전이란 무엇인가? 생소한 외래어나 외국어의 단순 번역이 아닌 모국어의 생소한 단어를 들었을 때 어색하게 느끼지 않으며, 그 뜻을 습득하여 비교적 적합한 맥락에서 말하고 읽고 쓰고 또 다른 의미로 확장할 수 있음을 의미한다. 이것이 우리가 말하는 원어민의 조건 중 하나이다. 원어민의 조건 중 두번째는 억양이다.(악센트, 리듬, 억양 등의 종합) 모국어 화자는 큰 노력없이 구강 구조의 문제를 제외하곤 올바른 억양을 습득할 수 있다. 위의 2가지 조건을 원어민은 만 3세쯤되면 토대를 완성할 수 있다. 그러나 특정한 나이 이상의 화자의 경우는 원어민과 동일한 조건이 주어지더라도 두번재의 조건은 차치하고 첫번째의 조건조차도 달성하지 못한다. 이를 통해 착안한 것이 바로 언어 학습에는 결정적인 시기가 존재하며 나이가 어릴 수록, 태어날때의 모국어가 아닌 외국어도 모국어처럼 습득이 가능하고, 사람마다 차이는 있으나 특정한 시기를 넘으면 저 2가지를 습득하는 것이 매우 어렵지만 예외는 존재한다가 그 가설의 골자이다.(나는 지금 이 글을 쓰면서도 논문이나 엄밀한 형식이나 의미 전달을 요하는 글을 쓰는 것이 아니여서 단어나 문법에서 살짝 문제가 있는 글을 쓰고 있음을 알고 있으나 모국어 화자로서 불편하지 않다.)
하나 더, 같은 모국어 내에서도 세대가 다르면 외국어만큼은 아니지만 소통과 단어 사용이 저해되는 경우가 상당히 존재한다. 마치 외국어를 얘기하듯이 어색한 단어가 생긴다는 것인데, 이는 언어의 특성상 대화 상황 혹은 읽는 상황을 접하지 않으면 그 뉘앙스(어감)이 죽어버리기에 외국어와 다름이 없는 단어가 되어버리는 것이다.
이 2가지 요소를 고려하여, 나의 경우는 영어를 grammar based learing으로 배워, 읽기는 가능하나, 확장적인 의미를 갖는 어구들을 부드럽게 읽기는 어려우며, 말을 할때는 단어의 글자가 떠오르는 아주 병신 머저리같은 상태인데, 이를 극복하기 위해 개인적인 여러 연구를 진행하였고 6개월 정도의 시간이 있어 오롯이 영어에 투자했으나 결론적으로 english natvie가 되는 것은 실패했다. 한가지 궁금한 것은 내가 원어민 화자와 동일한 상황(교정해주는 사람들, 말을 충분히 걸어주는 사람들 존재)이라면 만 25세의 나이에도 언어를 습득할 수 있을까인데… 그런 상황은 올 수 없다는 것이 안타깝다.
뼈대가 되는 발음과 억양이 어떤 나라의 발화감을 만드는데(발화감은 내가 만든 말로, 특정 언어가 발화 시 가질 수 있는 구분 가능한 특질을 얘기한다.) 발음이 조금 달라도 억양이 비슷하면 마치 특정 나라의 말처럼 들리는 특이한 현상을 관찰했다. 여기에도 무언가 있지 않을까 싶은데 내가 논문 찾을 능력도 없고, 검색 능력도 없으며, 찾는 것에도 큰 흥미가 없기에 답은 알 수 없다.
My brain is better now at 25 then when i was 18,but ofcourse back then i had Bad Habits,i think gym workouts help to improve your brain😮
Took up German at 55, nine months in, I was able to converse with people in Germany.
How many known words should I attain on LingQ before I start trying to speak in my target language? 15,000? 20,000+?
I start at 5,000
I began learning English when I was 25. Now I'm 28 and my level is b1. I want to reach c1 level, but I 'm feeling that I stuck not improving in my learning journey.
Try the app where you can speak to a native speaker on the internet. I can’t remember the accurate name but something like italki.
I'm 39 years old and currently studying both Italian and German. I'm learning them both quite well. No, the age limit thing is not true. It's a mental block, not biological.
Yes. It’s harder to learn a language in my 70s than it was in my teens. That’s no excuse not to work on it a little every day.
I recently traveled to another state and - gasp! - _everyone_ spoke with an accent, even the native English speakers! The funny thing is, they thought that _I_ speak with an accent. How preposterous!
60 and starting to learn Japanese!
Don't worry, there are 18 year-olds struggling to learn Japanese. It's a quantity game: hours of exposure is what matters.