Holden VT Commodore PCM Autopsy
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- čas přidán 7. 10. 2012
- A basic look at whats inside a GM Holden VT Commodore/Calais PCM.
Not sure why there is such a difference between the 2, both cars should have been V6 engines , but not sure if one was a manual transmission. - Věda a technologie
not sure about the VU part, unless i mis-ID'd the model. but I removed it from a VT Sedan chassis. it was fully installed and had not been touched in years until I tore the passenger kickpanel apart to get to it.
unless they replaced it at some stage with a used VU one?
do u know is the pcm,s r different between the vx & the vx supercharged 3.8lt's because i hav a schematic 4 a vx 3.8lt n/a & the color coding is completely different when it comes to the wires in my s/c commodore.
well check around the coil pack for any signs of arcing. i saw this happen a week ago. new plugs leads oil everything after the heads being done and it was the coil pack. does it splutter when you try and move when it's cold?
Very well done, as always.
Keep making interesting videos!
Also, it looks like the two ECUs are more similar than you think. One just appears to be a few years newer. Looks like they removed the plug in EPROM pack and soldered a little 32 pin PLCC version on the board instead, and the large ASICs seem the same, just moved. I suspect a bunch of those discrete FETs and transistors (TO-220) were consolidated into those larger heatsunk chips.
by the way, what is the model/kit number of your new drill/tool set? im thinking about getting one myself.
what an amazing piece of technology an ecu is
I would LOVE to get my hands on a old classic like that!, any old car like that with wooden wheels, cable brakes and the most basic of controls :D
Did that 2nd Unit not have a removeable chip??
the vt motors are the ecotec. vr vp vn etc have the other one.... always wanted to find out whats in side
not sealed in any way ? where is it positioned in the car ?
Pretty intresting to see what is running the cars now adays. Scarry thought. I work on computers and all kinds of stuff, and even build electronics and computers, and to see that this is the main brane to a car just has me appaled!! Awsome video as always :)
Slightly surprised that those TO-220s and other vertical packages aren't screwed down to something. Dave Jones loves to rant on about the dangers of vibration damage with these packages, and a car is certainly a high-vibration environment. I guess they've done the engineering on this and have figured it wasn't an issue.
pink and blue plugs are from vt vx with cruise control the other is with outout cruise control
they are actually really reliable, up to vs commodore , the most common problems that will strand you are: crank-angle sensor, DFI module and fuel pump. if the ecu dies it's normally because of what people do when working on the car ie jump starting etc. I've seen an alt regulator over-volt and fry the ecu and everything, but mum's vr survived 25 volts when her alt reg failed no damage to the ecu or anything else
mmm you know holden.. tell me why my VU stalls when going from reverse to drive when its REALLY cold ;p
how that ryobi drill doing for ya?
failing alts and sensors are a pain :(. but yeh, its not often the ECU just decides to up and die!
Ive taken apart a few ECU's.
A Ford EEC-IV from a Mustang
And two GM ECU's one being a double board from a Buick and the other from a Ponitac
holden ecu's are paired with the body control module, you need a tech 1 diagnostic tool to re-pair them, it's an anti theft thing. so that if you change the ecu only, the car won't start. unless theres something i don't know, like maybe it's a timed thing that locks you out for 60 mins or so then lets you start it
MINE!! Had a 98 VT for 3 years, what a good thing tho. Ecotec for sure
@6:18 rips the cap/mov from its bed, only to put it back LOL i cracked up at that!
true that! aren't many left by now though
behind a plastic panel next to the passengers left foot
The first one is indeed a VT v6, both auto and manual use the same PCM and the v8 uses the 16234531 PCM
The second one with no access panel is from a VX ecotec and is the first of the flash based PCM's
I know they're completely different but on the Honda ECU I worked on, all you had to do to change the ECU from Auto to manual was to remove a tiny resistor on the back of the PCB, stops the engine management light coming on anyway.
basically, the Second PCM has been constructed to SAE Standard J2534; which Enables the PCM to be Flash Reprogrammed via a Tech 2.
They call those chips kalmakers i beleive, after the program/process used to reprogram them
nice job ed.. both thos ECU are V6 but one is older if im correct
I love the user-friendlyness of EFI, its just the really modern cars that are buggy as all shit when they get old.
the difference between them is the programing protocal , types of injectors , type of fueling style ( batch fire vs , SMPFI , the one with the removable Ks chip is a older style and possibly a OBDI set up batchfire . the non removable chip is the CAN/bus style and OBD2 , the second PCM is worth money ( about $40 Us ) the 1st one is scrap . and they are made in the US in Kokomo Indiana ,at the ACD facilities using globally aquired parts . continued
usually under the dash, on the driver kick panel (at least that's where I've observed them being on GM cars.)
I'd say you have a vt PC and a vx series 2 pcm as vx s2 onwards had no removable memcal (eprom) also vt had 3 engine choices. V6, supercharged v6 and v8 :)
Vx has to be remapped by mace engineering or so I've been told.
VN you could pull up fault codes yourself too!
I like how all the chips and even diodes and transistors in "American" car electronics (GM, ford mainly) have custom part numbers. This makes it marginally harder to reverse engineer. The Japanese electronics in cars tend not to custom mark stock parts though. Seems like a waste of money to remark things like 7805 regulators and 2N2222 transistors.
4 engine choices in the vt
The v6
The super changed v6
The 5 litre v8
And the 5.7 litre v8 in the later models
Like it when you destroy suff
yeh, the US would be on the drivers side since its on the left. but yeh, Aussie side is passenger kick panel :D
I bet the rom chip contents now reside in the main controller.
They may indeed be custom, but some companys love to re-label there chips to prevent them being copyed, its a good bet that some of them are not that special.
Simple engine management can be reliable but thease days they love to add computers in stupid places where basic electronics would do. :-(
Smashing disection Ed :-)
you got a drill mannnnnn
So it is an Aussie car, with an American designed engine, that was likely manufactured in Canada or Mexico, that is run by an Asian PCM.
Hulk would smash and not worry.. Eliminate stress.....
Ac delco electronics are assholes. Those are off the shelf devices, but have the holy delco numbers on them. That rubber conformal coating lifts the J-lead devices, causing solder fatigue. Solder reflow brings most of those back. But watching them being tossed on the ground was quite satisfying I must admit. :)
well Ed, since you are a Ford Guy, I believe some Torturing of these Holden Components is an Order!
Yea but could you see a computer controlled efi car still alive 40 years down the track?
I thought you might like this a lot:
autosec org / pubs / cars-oakland2010 pdf
It's a security report about what someone can do with pretty much any modern car. The report is pretty small and worth checking.
Efi or carby? Keep at least one carby with mechanical points vehicle readily available. It will get you away from the zombies after the great EMP event.
too bad you didn't take the connectors too, instead of burning the case, you could send the voltages through the wires (link all the grounds and connect the positives one by one) might be fun watching parts explode and burn~
I remebor the commodore computer i had one.
Not with VN's!!
that's very interesting. yeah i guess electronics are not always 100% reliable
ha! they aren't worthless ,GM actually has a "core value" on them and they rebuild them,some of those PCM's can cost up to a grand new,but the rebuilds cost about $100~275 plus core
those are not "outsourced" they are all made by the US arm of GM ,Delco electronics ,they are built in house by Delco in singapore ! they make them with parts sourced by GM KOREA,GM usa,then where shipped out by the planeloads by air fright to GM plants in australia,germany ,usa,canada uk,&korea,most of the main chips are made by DELCO KOREA,most of the ECM are simular but the Eprom chips vary by make and model and country
They're becoming Extinct, thanks to hoons!!
onthe one withthe removable program module you peel the foil off and you see the untraviolet programing window they used , don't know how many noob mechanics peel them and destroy the programs under flouresent lights .. but I know of several I worked with that accidently did it..
lol. fucks me. could be many of things like the coil pack is arcing over or the type of oil or even fuel injectors.. the white vs does that too but only with a lack of fuel and the plugs are bestbuy go figure eh
Why ask the question if you know the answer...?
i beg to differ, give me efi any day. its much more solid then carbys, especially the stuff thats in the magna and your falcon, its bullet proff. the worst you ever get is a gummy sensor or the real worst case is a fried computer, something which takes 10 minutes tio replace and you can get at any wreckers for $40
Most ECU's are coated in plastic to protect the circuitry!
lol, yeh, its easy to destroy EPROM programs by UV exposure and not many know that!.
did I say that chipping a ECU was bad?, nothing wrong with doing things tastefully (good Intake, exhaust, EFI program and Ignition gear)
its the douches that put generic plastic bodykits, gas-axed springs and loud but ineffective exhausts on that piss me off.
hell, I have a K11 Nissan Micra that I would love to put race spec suspension, clutch, exhaust, intake, injectors, ECU, and ignition gear in!, hell even a supercharger or turbo kit!. nothing wrong with modding, just do it right!
Sounds like you'd prefer to drive a Ford Model T :)
i just spent $220 on oil, plugs, filters and shite
gonna do a full throttle body/ICV clean while im at it.. $115 for bosch platinums *facepalm*
Probably someone that is jealous. He does a good job(aussie 50)
lol, Australia is the king of outsourcing, even our food comes from Asia!!
You should stick one of those into a fire pit to simulate a car fire. You know, for educational purposes.
I guess you've never heard of a rhetorical question, have you?
i think half the problem is ppl look at everything as disposable and short lived. so they thrash and destroy so that everything really is short lived. e series falcons and commodores up to vs are actually reliable if not flogged. amazing that people always blame the car; like it's not the way they drive or that they never service it
in any modern car tunes are everything exhaust tyre cams bigger injectors better ignition gear pistons valves rockers whatever are dumb they cant make any extra power unless told what to do by their ecu / pcm
but it did fry mum's battery, but that's it
It must not quite be radiation hardened!
you need to 'chip' modern cars if you upgrade the intake/exhaust or you'll actually start losing horsepower from the fuel map being so off.
I'm getting sweaty when i remember these stupid electronics drive your car.
Microwave *cough cough* them!
And if a modern car around 8 years old has ECU failure, it's the scrapyard for it. Pisses me off to be honest.
yeh, I see them here all the time. idiots.
half the motors I find have spun bearings
They won't make any Electronics here, it['s all made in South East Asia, (too expensive to make it all here :( )
i make hydrogen gas with the aluminum case and fill large garbage bags up and watch how high they go past the clouds
1/1000'th of a smart phone.
yer I figured they would be reprogrammed and reprinted devices, typical dick move by a big manufacturer.
without the body PCM paired to these their useless anyway.
vs and vr's are the same. hoons suck, they make walking up a residential street dangerous (no footpaths here!)
You will never find those electronic components!
ricer cosmetics don't do shit :p, a set of extractors and a proper sounding exhaust (not just a shitty loud can) actually do good :p
do some homework....