Jiu Jitsu Destroyed My Leg For Life
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- čas přidán 19. 06. 2024
- An illegal BJJ move was done on me which injured me with consequences for life. This is what happened...
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Welcome to the Martial Arts Journey CZcams channel!
My name is Rokas. I'm a Lithuanian guy who trained Aikido for 14 years, 7 of them running a professional Aikido Dojo until eventually I realized that Aikido does not live up to what it promises.
Lead by this realization I decided to make a daring step to close my Aikido Dojo and move to Portland, Oregon for six months to start training MMA at the famous Straight Blast Gym Headquarters under head coach Matt Thornton.
After six months intensive training I had my first amateur MMA fight after which I moved back to Lithuania. During all of this time I am documenting my experience through my CZcams channel called "Martial Arts Journey".
Now I am slowly setting up plans to continue training MMA under quality guidance and getting ready for my next MMA fight as I further document and share my journey and discoveries.
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#BJJ - Sport
Quick update: it's called a scissor takedown, not a standing scissor sweep. My bad. Also, it's doesn't seem to be 'illegal' everywhere, but it seems to be banned in many gyms and some competitions.
Update #2: I really liked this comment explaining their protocol for injury in the gym.
"I know out here, at any of the classes of any style, if an injury like that happened, we:
1. Stop everything and get the injured help, up to and including an ambulance call.
2. Find out how the injury happened.
3. Use the moment as a teaching moment.
4. Potentially punish the one who injured his partner if it was a situation where they knew better.
That should be the base-line for injury protocol."
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Stems Cells are amazing 😉
Dear Rokas, I'm really sorry to hear about your injury and I can only wish you a speedy recovery. I had my leg and ankle broken by a failed Tani Otoshi in Judo and I'm simply disgusted that someone would have even attempted a kani-basami on you. I can only repeat what someone wrote below that you are an inspiration to many people. Take the time you need, focus on the family and getting yourself better and I'm certain you'll find the love again for training and martial arts. Nuoširdžiausi linkėjimai ir būkite pozityvūs bei stiprūs :)
Ačiū
@MartialArtsJourney So sorry to hear brother! Hope you recover well & with as little pain as possible. Unfortunately severe injuries are what made me slowly fizzle out of my love for mma, hope you can still push through. Either way, much respect 🫡 brother
I think the best thing to do is see what happens and don't try to predict what things will be. I had a very bad leg injury, was told after surgery that it would potentially affect me for life, i then got post surgery complications, which was then told would probably affect the rest of my life even worse.
It was terrible news, and went through 12-ish months of pain.
However, i can now say a few years later, i have completely recovered and do multiple sports, and have a very normal life. I go the bjj gym 3 days a week and enjoy it, and continue to roll. Although i make sure to pick my partners, and only roll people I trust to not try reckless moves, or if i don't know the person i will only flow roll them, until i build trust.
Point is, no pain on the injured leg. Is my leg perfect, no, but my leg doesn't cause me concern, and has 98% strength of what it used to be, which is enough for me. I think doctors have to give the worst case scenario, just incase, but honestly they just don't know how your body will recover. And the younger you are the better, so you have that on your side. Stay positive and take every week as it comes. You never know. Goodluck. I wish you a full recovery.
Join combat sports so that you never get hurt in a street fight.
Result: Never have a street fight and get injured repeatedly in training.
95% of BJJ gyms. Dude even got paralyzed from neck down by the teacher showing off on a newbie
@@fraziocolucciio9213 That may be the most extreme thing of this kind I have heard about. Details?
Yeah, in hindsight It would have been easier on me to have been repeatedly beaten that to endure all the injuries I have taken during 4 decades of training.
so true lol, really feels like a waste of time sometimes
@@jorgerapalo2673 happened in SOCAL a few years ago, the teacher rolled on the beginner going way too hard on him and fractured 3 vertebrae in homies neck, and paralyzed from neck down. Dude sued the school and the teacher personally and won multi millions.
Bro that’s *SHITTY* behaviour from all your classmates and everybody at open mat. If you were really screaming and rolling around *and* still nobody came.. find another club. That’s made my blood boil.
Hope you have a speedy recovery man and get back to whatever is next 🙏
Totally agree with this, not normal behaviour to ignore something like that
Not to mention the opponent. I've noticed before BJJ guys dont really know how to do take downs safely (I do Judo and we really do) but even so it seems unlikely he has no clue he could tear the knee with that stuff. Def would never go anywhere near that club again
I used to go climbing with friends. After a year i fell from the wall and ripped my tendon on my left foot, i heard a loud snap. I resnapped it after recovering for 4 months also while climbing. One of the 2 guys i was there with laughed while i laid on my back in pain, clenching my fists and punching the mat to get over the pain. I really distanced myself from him after that. I cant imagine people ignoring you after you audibly break your leg..
For this exact reason this takedown was forbidden in Judo as well, as this happened in competitions as well.
As for the "aftercare": it is a lousy experience, even for an open mat. Martial arts are dangerous and serious injuries can happen. But when they do, people should be helpfull, especially people working there. It is inexcusable that an injured person isn't helped off the mat, taken care of and helped with getting to a hospital.
@@jaap_vanekristhis is the issue with open mat and combat sports there is to much ego and not enough controll or respect
“Everybody kept rolling… including the instructors.” INEXCUSABLE!! Disgusting!! Never train there again, even if you fully recover.
What should they have done? When you are injured move from the mats.
@@tonieins9819 The instructor would have at the very least come over to find out what happened and check on the welfare of the injured student. An incident report is a must to find out what happened and how. The instructor has a duty of care to ensure his students train safely. That means being clear about techniques banned during free rolling when each student begins training at that academy. That means disciplinary action against students that injure other students through reckless behaviour. It means identifying aggressive or reckless students. If need be banning them from entering the school, to protect their students. The instructor has every responsibility. If he fails to take reasonable action to provide a safe training environment he can be sued and lose everything.
@@tonieins9819 i see....you´re one of THEM. smh
@@tonieins9819I've never been anywhere where a man going down would everyone keep going.
Wouldn't matter what the reason everyone would stop until it was sorted.
@@adifferentangle7064 sure the instructor should check on him. but he resisted the kani basami as he himself said. its a dick move to do at an open mat but there seemed some ego involved from both sides.
Sue. Too many idiots in BJJ at the minute that are ruining the sport. A few lawsuits would start to change things.
I agree
@@sephirothfemto Medical Damages and more..all rights reserved should be explained and if not then the business is liable.
Yes, but it could be tricky, you have to prove that excessive force was used, it's the Instructor who technically should be sued- not the student, as he was just following what he was told.
@@pauljohnson6019 If any gym cams was up and CCTV shows excessive force was used as well as the gym owners ignoring his pain on camera then their all liable but i believe the gym would not release this to Rokas due to how it might impact the image of the gym.
@@erikbritz8095 The police can ask for it though, if he reports it to the station as assault.
God I hate people sparring too hard.
You spar with 10 people but the one guy using too much force can ruin the whole mood
It's not about going hard. It's about being reckless. I had guy, who's a wrestler, rip my shoulder in a kimura last day. He didn't know any better but still sucks. Point is, you can go hard af but still be very responsible.
Or life
That was my experience too, an asshole who just wanted to break some bone, and I was the lucky person. I had 6 months without training with my ribs broken, and I am not going to Kumite again.
@pinksupremacy6076 i had the same thing happen to me with a wrestler. My shoulder is no longer the same and I don't train anymore
It's always the instructor's fault. I've been to too many classes where instructors fall back or disappear during open rolls. BJJ teachers should vet new students, restrict dangerous submissions, and police rollings sessions. Few I've met do any of these things.
No one checking on a screaming student-who was on the receiving end of a forbidden technique-is a huge red flag. Awful. So sorry you had to deal with this.
Sounds like COBRA KAI doesn't it? Horrendous.
Sounds like a toxic gym environment, like causing concussions to new student. This shit shouldn’t be allowed to continue without severe consequences.
Red flag? It’s the whole boat. What else would you be looking for in a poor place??
@@deadlypalms yes it does, I was picturing the 'screaming' being the fly that was squished in half by the Miyagi chopstick.
You should call the name out of this place so people can avoid it. What a horrendous response to an injured fellow grappler. We all lend our bodies to others so that we can get mutually better. It's this mutual respect that makes the sport work.
I've been following your journey and huge respect to your humility and approach to sport.
Good luck with your recovery.
Honestly this kind of thing keeps me away from BJJ. As a middle age father/husband, I don’t want to risk crossing paths with some overly competitive psychopath and ending up with some lifelong injury that prevents me from taking care of my responsibilities to my dependents.
I’m sure most gyms are not like this and there is probably a great sense of community, etc… but I can just as easily stay in shape by exercising in a gym or riding a bicycle. Sure there are risks with any activity, but at least I can mitigate them by not doing something stupid, I’m in control and not in the hands of some asshole who may be having a bad day looking to take it out on a stranger
bjj has a poor risk reward ratio
I've done BJJ for over a decade now and I've learned that the best way to avoid injuries is to not roll super intensely. Most people learn this the hard way, I know I did. If someone wants to roll super hard, I just play defensive and relaxed until they calm down. Sometimes I'll even just say "chill out a little, this is how injuries happen". I've gotten some cuts and bruises but no serious injuries (outside of popping my rib, which was when I discovered that going 100 percent isn't worth it
Your fitter at a the gym
It's honestly pathetic, some of these guys training hard for 4 days+ a week like they're getting ready for the olympics, except they're in their 30s/40s and have a day job. It's just a hobby.
@@Zetunez How is that pathetic? If you're training hard four days a week with a day job in your 40s it's impressive. Doesn't matter what the sport is
I injured my knee in a comparable incident at age 14. Now I'm 44, living with knee pain since then.
I wish you all the best.
Has the knee pain been the same for the entire time?
google kneesovertoes der heilt dich
@@Rust_Rust_Rust I have the typical artritis symptoms. As of now I get hyaluronic injections every year and that is helping a lot. Still some pain most of the days, but I'm still very active.
great of you to share that...I guess you're the one he sparred with
@@gobistaff3551Your comment makes no sense, genius.
You know you have a problem when you're waking up in the middle of a surgery to say "like and subscribe"...
😂😂 Yup...
@@MartialArtsJourney But did they? :p
@@WolfKingAka Yup... The surgeon told me he liked the channel the next day
@@MartialArtsJourney whaaaaaat!? That’s awesome, lol.
Also if you have concerns with martial arts stuff, feel free to hit me up. I’ve been a burning out martial arts teacher for about 11 years now and always love to talk about the arts.
Do you practice BJJ only or do you also do wrestling or striking? @@WolfKingAka
Holy shit, that dude should be sued.
Scissor takedowns are forbidden for a reason, doing it against an (unknowing) opponent in sparring is a scummy thing to do
If Rokus signed a waiver before training, that might affect his case
agreed. I do think he should be liable, and that gym should be as well if they don't remove him.
@@BD90.. I don't think you need to sign anything to enter an open mat though, there should be a sign somewhere saying the gym doesn't take responsibility for injuries but I don't know if that exempts the guy, given that it's a generally prohibited technique.
I agree and I think a lawsuit is worth a shot, even if nothing comes of it. I know your medical bills have to be considerable, Rokas. Sorry this happened man, and remember you're also getting older 😆 along with the rest of us lol.
@@midguard7917 Europeans don't have the same insane medical bills as Americans, I'm sure he'll be fine financially.
Sad to see you in a gym like this. 17-18 years ago, I used to train at Reno Gracie in NYC Herald Square area. I tore my MCL and the instructor, Igor Gracie, came to my attention right away. An assistant instructor (purple belt by the name of Gino) gave me muscle relaxers. Later in the evening, Igor personally called me to see if I was okay. Those were good people.
I'm sorry to hear about your injury. That's terrible and I hope you have a swift recovery.
You have been an inspiration to me and so many others since the start of your channel. That said, please make whatever choices are best for you and your own life considering continuing your training. You have given so much to the martial arts community and we appreciate every moment, but you don't owe us anything. Thank you so much for what you do and everything you have done. I wish you a speedy and successful recovery.
You'll get better. Invest in good physio and thinks will get good soon.
The fact that nobody stopped tells me that's a dangerous gym, buddy. I'm really sorry this happened to you. This guy that hurt you is a horrible person, too. 😢
its europe, some of the most godless people on earth
I’m surprised women go to it. With it that bad you’d think that’s be in dangerous of getting really hurt by some dude.
I was rolling with a woman a belt higher than me. I was going super easy and light.. she quickly tried to pull her arm away and her shoulder popped out.. that’s how easy they can get hurt.. over things we think nothing about
@@Sketch_Sesh You make it sound like they're made of paper; Shoulders popping out easily happens to men too.
As soon as this video started, i thought "i bet it was a scissor sweep". Sorry to hear that, and that's awful behavior from that gym. Hope you recover quickly 💪
Damn how did you know? Nice vids btw lol
Thanks! 🙏 Will do my best
@@sugoi9680 If you train BJJ you would just assume it was a scissor sweep, because of the high percentage serious injuries, I've never attempted it or known anyone to attempt it because it's a dick thing to do
@@AJ-wc1rt yep. Even a heel hook shouldn't ruin the rest of your life. I assumed before I clicked the video.
For me it was either scissor sweep or jumping guard that fall on a knee
The fact that your friend was injured too in the same session and NO ONE helped you but your injured friend says a lot about that school. Unfortunately, this is quite common at BJJ schools. The couple schools I tried, both had more advanced students coming to the basic/beginning classes so they can get an ego boost from dominating beginners. I was done and gone. Doing Aikido and taking a bi-weekly private lessons in Japanese Jui Jutsu.
It's that bro mindset.
That person and that gym should be ashamed to call themselves a martial artists. Complete disregard for their fellow athletes.
This isn’t the first story of some random dude doing a kani basami/scissor takedown resulting in catastrophic injury. Shit is dangerous.
I'm not a grappler, but fighting with strangers is kind of an art on its own. You should always focus on not getting hurt. ROKAS, the story you have told us is not a nice one. I hope you have the best recovery possible, and that in the future this becomes just an anecdote with no permanent repercussions. BEST OF LUCK.
Sounds like a good test for identifying a psychopath - just watch out for anyone actually willing to try out such an awful technique. What an absolute cretin.
But how is it avoided / done safely? If it was so hazardous then wouldn't we see it more in MMA?
I believe the strikes in MMA changes the distance and make it harder to achieve that's why it's so rare although it has been seen
@@boliusabol822Just go with it. All it does is sit you on your butt if you don't resist. People resisting by putting their hips forward really screw themselves
Rokas, as a sports medicine professional and bioengineer, I want to share some hope and encouragement. While your injury might seem daunting, remember that the severity is often emphasized to ensure proper care, not to predict lifelong consequences. With dedicated physical therapy and a focus on recovery, you'll adapt and eventually barely notice it most days.
I've faced life-changing injuries to both legs and developed post-traumatic OA before 20, yet I still pursue my passions for martial arts and maintain athletic ability, albeit with some added pain and longer warm-ups. Managing stress, diet, sleep, and exercise can significantly reduce pain, and committed rehabilitation lowers the risk of re-injury or lifelong impairment.
There's also exciting progress in biomechanical implants for athletes, like the MISHA knee system, which has shown great promise in reducing osteoarthritis effects and chronic pain. Advances like these give hope that lifelong impairments will soon be a thing of the past.
Stay focused on your recovery and the activities you love. From one martial artist to another, you've got this!
The best comment!
@@prodigal_I agree. It’s an amazing comment
Did you receive your injuries from martial arts?
@-whackd, among other things, yes. Most of my ligament injuries have been a result of martial arts.
Not to poke you too much but could I have some advice?
Speedy recovery, Rokas! Thank you for sharing this experience.
So sorry to hear about your injury. After having so much fun in BJJ for about ~5 years, I came to the point where I "had" to stop. After a shoulder, bicep, and two knee surgeries.... I had to ask myself what would it take for me to stop... losing a limb?!?! I loved the sport so much but you really are putting your life into the hands of another person and the gyms I went to didn't really help that person respect that as much as they should have... There's still a whole world out there for you to enjoy like you did Martial Arts. Hope you get well soon!
The fact that no one stopped, or the instructors didnt even come and check, is DISGUSTING to me. Our gym, and the half a dozen others we’re affiliated with around here, does an open mat every week with 6-8 schools attending, usually 30-40 active people on a good night.
On the few occasions where someone has been injured to the extent where they yell or cry out, everyone, and I mean everyone, stopped and was respectful. And from the other gyms I’ve traveled to and seen similar experiences they had a similar culture. To me, that speaks to the culture of that gym, and id personally not want to be affiliated with it.
im sorry you got injured man, that’s everyone’s greatest fear who practices jiujitsu, I hope the recovery goes smooth!
Of course! This is beyond bad, it's borderline criminal negligence.
And even from a sociopathic self interest POV, if someone gets hurt they should go see what happened to ensure it won't happen to them.
@@BernasLL That is true. But if you want to avoid something, you first have to recognise that it could happen to you. However, repression is widespread...
The problem is not with this specific gym. I was going bjj for a year every single day except sundays till my injury and I visited three different gyms on my city.... I experienced many injury events and every time I was the only one who interrupted my roll to go to help the guy who was near me and in pain. After one year i had an inguinal hernia where after surgery I accepted the fact that I want to live the rest of my life without pain and focus on my actuall work rathen than trying to make the tough guy. Don't misunderstand me I love BJJ. But nobody cares If you get injured by them. On the other hand I know guys who feel proud that they hit a heel hook to lower belts and destroyed their legs. For me if you want to feel safe and matronal, start mma which believe me it's much more safe. And in case anyone tries to injury you thinking he is on real tournament rather than training room, destroy his face, get up, leave the specific gym and go to another one.
I’ve seen injuries at my old gym before and it was always an “everyone stops” moment. I can’t believe there are gyms where this isn’t the norm
sounds like a 'tough guy' gym
This looks like it's gonna be a story about the scariest part of BJJ.
Yup... Definitely not a pretty story
@@MartialArtsJourney Yeah definitely not. I guess I'm happy at least it wasn't someone who finished a heel hook in training.
Good luck with the recovery. If there is anyone I can believe recovering relatively well from this, it is you.
Can‘t give a thumbs up to the fact that you’re injured but big thumbs up to you and your healing! ❤
Heel hook is also one of the illegal moves. These gyms doesn't taught this? I know at least 10, not three though.
You should watch it. It’s interesting
Your journey is really inspirational to me as a martial artist who also started in aikido (though I didn’t get nearly as far as you did) and who does mma. I’m so sorry that this happened to you. I hope the healing goes as well as it can go and that your next chapter is an amazing one be it in martial arts or something else.
I'm sorry to hear this happened to you! The months ahead will be challenging, but I wish you a full recovery and return to martial arts when your leg is ready. Thank you for the channel, and for sharing this horrible situation with us.
I stopped sparring with strangers on open mats.
broken jaw with life long compications like vertigo and displacements, broken rips, broken knee cap and broken shin. never sparr with strangers.
This sounds like you got jumped walking down the street
really? it can't be from just 1 open mat session
dammm dude, who did you spar with? some gangsters?
Or do because it's never the same, I spar/roll with strangers all the time, but you gotta do it with the mind set of points and clean subs/escapes. Kinda like a slow match but obv not as intense. Some folks just don't care and try to break you tho, they suck and it's always better to not roll with them.
That's good advice
Hi, rehab specialist in pro football and livelong martial artis here, sorry to hear about the injury. Couple things to keep in mind, metalwork can be removed again, it's a careful consideration of the pro's and con's but it's possible, so please don't fully buy into the "for the rest of your life" idea too early. In general, don't wait too long with putting pressure on the leg, don't wait too long with introducing flexion/extension. How long is right can't be judged from distance, you'll need experienced physios to help you there, but in general there has been a shift towards reintroducing joint function earlier than later. What I mean with "too long" is, some patients want to do the process "extra correct" and instead of introducing weight loading after 2 weeks (if that's appropriate for their situation) they think it's better to wait another X days on top or so, same with flex/ex, in order to be extra careful, while in fact this often makes the rehab process worse instead of better. However, in some cases one needs more time, so don't think in these generic time frames that the docs have to prescribe according to the legal framework in medicine. Remember the docs don't do the day to day rehab, so find an experienced physio to organically guide you is absolute key. Also, keep your vitamin d levels at the top end of the range. And lastly, don't preset your mind to the idea that this injury will be affecting you negatively for the rest of your life. The truth is we don't know, it might, it might not - but i've seen too many bad injuries that were successfully overcome also in long term follow ups, especially when patients had a positive attitude, so the most important tip really is to stay positive, calm and open, the incredible capacities of the human body might just surprise you once more. All the best.
Magnesium, vit k2, and calcium(from diet tho) are also key
Thanks for your time to be sharing this bro, my father got in an injury similar to this and I wished I have heard about this earlier. But yet again as you said, who knows if is a life long injury, so I'll see if there something that could still be done about it. Again thanks for your input man
Ye I realized that the "for the rest of your life" thing is almost never the case. At least when it comes to the knees. Don't know about the spine.
Kneesovertoesguy is the biggest example of getting told that his knees will never be the same after many surgeries but now has the best knees he ever had in his life through proper rehab.
@@seeyan9944 you're welcome. Sorry to hear about your dad's injury. Every day that passes by with the mindset that nothing can be changed is a day lost for actually working towards an improvement. Even slight improvements can go a long way for the way one feels, if small things like getting up from a chair or getting out of the car become less painful, it's already a win. Best wishes.
@@deshovel5243 absolutely agree
Holy cow! Of all things to happen. Glad to see/hear you remaining positive about it, but...wow. Hoping you heal fast.
One guy ruined my arm in jiu jitsu fight , he cracked it for finishing the sparing
The commitment to the channel to wake up mid surgery and plug it to nurses is commendable.
Wow your gym really showed their true colors fast! I'm surprised there weren't warning signs sooner. I'll pray for your fast recovery man.
Amazing attitude, it will take you far, GL in the recovery
People should STOP just doing dangerous stuff but if they going to insist the least they can do is ask their training partners if THEY are okay with those moves being used.
Also, if the b-team can literary put up signs with rules of gyms anyone can. Especially when so many people break them.
Every gym should inform their members not to do these moves except for competitors in competitor training.
If you stop doing dangerous moves, then it just becomes hugging each other 🤔
@@bobanmilisavljevic7857 there are different levels of danger. Doing such a move in an environment they are not allowed is just a coward, since you are safe from the move being done to you.
keep in mind the B-team is one of the best gyms in the world. Cannot expect every other joe dick and harry to be at the same level
@@samuel.andermatt so you are saying you like going to hugging practice?
This is horrible bro, hopefully there is someone that can help with your physical therapy. Much prayers🙏🏻stay strong
Thanks. I'm doing my best to build a strong team to help me recover
Hope you get better soon brother. @@MartialArtsJourney
I have followed your content from your first skeptical aikido post. I am sorry for your misfortune. I thank you for your courage and honesty and look forward to the next chapter in your odyssey.
sorry to hear that, may you have a speedy and healthy recovery 🙏
I was paralysed from my neck to the front of my scalp in boxing training, during a drill where we were supposed to only do body shots. This pro boxer gave me a surprise uppercut and hook and laughed. The person was never kicked out of the gym. I feel like martial arts gyms are places where borderline psychopaths have a way too easy time injuring others on purpose and getting away with it. Seriously.
Did you Sue the psycopath?
@@monkoko6441 Nope. It took me a week to realize that I didnt recover, and they would just pretend to have forgotten it.
I'm sorry to hear that. How is your injury today?
@@kullenberg I have no feeling and a lot of muscle problems, dying tissue etc. around my scalp and forehead, but I can still operate just fine. Just chronic pains all day.
@@Sinekyre14 that sucks but I'm glad to hear it's not completely debilitating. If you don't mind, what was the exact nature of the physical trauma? Something akin to a whiplash injury? I've mostly just hear discussion about CTE and blunt force trauma to the facial skeleton when speaking of injuries caused by striking.
Is this where the second aikido arc begins?
Haha, we'll see
haha could you imagine, from aikido to combat sports, to injury, and back to aikido
Nope,,unfortunately he's finished 😢 it's game changer. I had first knee replacement at 35 and tempted faith to my demise. Forced into retirement from job at 43 from knee. Its unforgiving of all joints. Maybe boxing might be option,,speedy recovery
Sorry to hear about your injury but have faith, Human body can be very resilient and he can come back 👍
Now we move to force multipliers aka swords and guns
Sorry to hear that! I appreciate your videos of how open and transparent you've been. Hope you heel fast and well!
Thank you for sharing brother. Wishing you a speedy recovery.
This is the main reason why I left modern martial arts and returned to traditional ones, with less sparring and a more health-friendly mode). Some people are stupid, some are really evil. Both types can ruin your health. I was injured myself and realized - wasn’t worth it.
Honestly man, the fact that you have done sparring in the past will carry on for a LONG time in traditional martial arts. You really don't need to spar as much as people think.
Couldn't agree more.
@@bloodsports94I think the same. Not as much, not as hard. And i'm actually not young). So it’s better to take care of your health, because if you get hurt during training, how will you protect yourself? Or family? Or if you are injured, how will you be able to work? It's better to think more, fight less).
thats why I went back to boxing. You dont have to spar everyday. You can work on technique hit mitts and bags. Go home safe. Im 45 and have young kids. I need to be mobile and be able to be here for my family.
Thank you so much for sharing this. Please keep us posted!
Thanks Jerry!
Sorry to hear that. I've been recovering from knee surgery for the last year and a half myself, but not as bad of an injury. I pray you heal fast and strong.
Lad, having followed your Chanel for a long time, very sad situation, wish you all the best.
Try to check up: PRP and Steam Cells (maybe that can be very helpful to you).
Good luck on your recovery.💪
I'm a judoka and honestly the worst people are the STRANGERS who are so intense and go really hard when you're just doing randori (sparring)... And will do anything to throw you even put you in danger.. Even in competition most people won't do moves they know they can't control (which are more dangerous to the opponent) but some have absolutely no qualm doing it.
When I saw the thumbnail and you mentioned "forbidden move" I instantly thought of kani basami (scissor takedown) which is also BANNED in judo (for good reason)
BJJ practicioners doing takedowns are so dangerous because alot of guys aren't very practiced at is like wrestlers/judoka so they end up doing stuff and techniques they don't understand
This one was interesting. I do stage combat with steel weapons (so, 'pro wrestling lite'), so the closest look I usually get into proper combat sports is stealing versions of the moves.
But that point you made. "won't do moves they know they can't control."
In stage combat, that's *foundational* . The weapons are blunt but they're still actual metal, and human beings are hilariously fragile. We've had to change or remove some thrusts from the big fight we're doing this year because I got hit by them near-directly three times so far. The casualties have only been two shirts and some skin, but that's just a simple lunge forward, with everyone knowing where the attack is aimed and where it's supposed to end up.
The prospect of using a move neither person can control in an environment where you're actually trying to *beat* the other person, without severely injuring them, is horrifying. It's a level of disregard for another person's safety that screams red flags about the person who'd be willing to do it.
I’m a bjj blue belt with ok standup. This week I accidentally injured a training partner going for a takedown. He entered on a single leg, and I countered by locking up a kimura and went for a sumi gaeshi. I failed to entirely square up with him when I dropped back and as a result rolled him off to the side instead of straight over me. When we landed my body weight fell on his shoulder as his arm was still wrapped under my leg. Luckily not a serious injury, but he felt a pop and had some pain after. I weigh over 200lbs so I try to use finesse and be very careful as to not injure people, but takedowns are always a bit risky. I could have executed the technique a bit cleaner and it probably would have been a bit safer, but I didn’t really do anything egregiously wrong, stuff just happens.
@@HerculesLoyd That sucks.. basically the one thing that could realistically happen in a kimura sumi gaeshi that could injure someone, and it happened.
Also I'm perfectly aware that genuine accidents do happen, where there is control but you lose balance/whatever and someone gets injured
@@Drikkerbadevand yeah it is what it is. I’ve been injured by training partners who didn’t really do anything wrong also. Combat sports are serious business regardless, at this point in my life I won’t train anywhere that tolerates reckless disregard for safety.
@@HerculesLoyd The exact thing happened to me. i found that an important thing to a sumi gaeshi is that you totally commit.
Damn, so infuriating to hear this story. I'm also a blue belt, and I always avoid rolling with people who do things like this for this exact reason. In one way or another, it always gets someone injured. If people in your gym reacted like this, shame on them, and if you come back, do find another gym. I train in Brazil in a very competitive gym, if something like that happens almost everyone stops and comes to check what happened and help out, even if it is just talking to you in order to get you distracted from the pain. Sorry to hear this happened to you, hope you recover well
I'm really sorry for your injurie and wish you have a great recovery. Sometimes the fate of us is hard. But you are a warrior, a martial artist, and we not only call ourselves that only for what we do in the dojo or in the ring, but in the big dojo of the life. God bless you, fast recovery, brother!.
Rokas, I wish you all the best and quick and safe recovery!
No matter what this channel will be about in future, I’ll stay here
You’re incredible and strong person!
Over a year and a half ago i suffered the worst injury of my life.
Was going 20-30 percent with a purple belt allowing him to work. We got done with the round and he asked me for another immediately after and i obliged.
30 secs into the roll he had a single under and jumped through with a knee slice with my hips in the air and one leg trapped. I couldnt rotate and he tore my groin.
The groin tear was so bad that it shattered my core. For the first time in my life, i was 42 at the time, i required surgery. The groin healed within 2 months but i was unable to walk for several months and i was severely limited as my core was completely destroyed.
It took me a yr and a half to get back to where i was. I went into a deep depression not knowing if i would ever train again. Really hard times.
My heart goes out to you. I hope you make the decision to get back on the mats and continue training. Much love and peace in your journey.
really sorry to hear this happened to you. Glad to hear you got back into shape
wtf, how to avoid this
@@bartniem9 my attitude is that i roll with everyone. i'm pretty athletic and look aggressive but i dont roll like that. when i was a white and blue belt some of the higher brown and black belts that i didnt know wouldnt go out of there way to roll and were pretty selective. i always thought it was fucked up and then after i got hurt i started to realize that the trust aspect is crucial.
pick and choose who you go with. dont go with aggressive people who are much heavier than you. if you are just flow rolling make it known and if you feel that someone isn't respecting that then just stop and tell them or just plain stop the roll.
you're going to come across new people all the time and it would be silly to just pick and choose who but at some point you have to think about yourself. its not easy to navigate.
after i got back from my injury it took a while to gain confidence not only in my ability but with the other practitioner as well.
of the 10 yrs that i have trained i never heard anyone sustain the same injury that i had. that made it even more difficult to bear. just be smart and tap if you think its too much.
@@bartniem9be careful who you roll with and set ground rules against certain locks
The enigma of Jiu Jitsu: We learn jiu jitsu to protect ourselves in the rare event that we encounter stupid, violent and aggressive people. But in learning jiu jitsu, we expose ourselves to 100X more stupid, violent and aggressive people than we would otherwise meet in our entire lives.
Holy shit, I'm so sad to hear that, we gotta be pick with our training partners, one mistake and it's all over, hope you get better Rokas take care my man
Sooo sorry for you Rokas. My deepest sympathies. I hope you make a swift and full recovery.
I'm sorry to hear that man. I just want to say that I'm sure you'll get over this injury. Keep it tight
Sue him.
Also, name and shame the club so that others can avoid it.
Seriously, I definitely would want to know which one it is so I don’t go there…
I third this
Yeah
If it’s truly forbidden yeah the guy caused lifelong damage
Please name the club at least
Hello Rokas,
even though I wasn't one of your fans and regularly made rather critical comments for a while, I am sincerely sorry about what happened to you.
I hope that the accident was just a bad shock and that there will be no serious restrictions in the future and that aging will also happen without any obstacles.
Get well soon and get fit again soon!
Thanks man! I appreciate us finding common ground even with separating opinions 🙏
@@MartialArtsJourneydude u should sue the guy and/or the gym or at least name the gym so ppl can avoid it. Some guy pulling an illegal move and nobody doing anything, not even the instructors, resulting in life lasting risks is definitely illegal
Very Sorry to hear about the injury that sucks. Keep the spirits up and as people here said find a good PT they can make a world of difference. Good luck on your Recovery.
I wish you a speedy recovery man, it hurts seeing you lie there, had a carreer ending injury as well..
Stay strong! 🫶🏻
Yeah, i dropped out of BJJ after i tore my ACL. And i really loved BJJ. The process of not being able to work out forever, after i worked so hard to get fit really hit me in the balls. I got super depressed. Now 5 years later, after surgery and a lot of gym, my knee is back. BUT, i just feel it isnt worth anymore. Trainig for a fight that never comes with sweaty dudes with such a high risk of injury.
I will stick to the Gym and to climbing now, there is just no reason to do bjj anymore. My health and generell fitness are worth so much more.
I hope you will get well soon!
You are smart.
100% 👍
Im with you, There needs to be rules, if people start poking the eyes and call it a BJJ move. Its not worth it.
There are other martial arts 🥋
Boxing training perhaps? You can get solid defense basics without heavy sparring. You're probably not gonna win a belt but surely it should give you some useful tools?
I understand the type of predator you were dealing with-they need to be closely monitored and kept on a very short leash. Unfortunately, many men my age (59) are suffering from injuries sustained during sparring. I, myself, have experienced a ruptured Achilles tendon and a dislocated shoulder during my martial arts journey. However, I have never been in an environment where a student's injury and pain were ignored-this is unacceptable. While we all understand that injuries can happen, there should always be courtesy and concern from those running the business.
I wish you a swift recovery. Godspeed.
It’s illegal negligence, especially not having any equipment in case of injury. He needs to sue the gym and the sparring partner because none of this is protected under liability release forms.
@@AngryPug76 Take it easy Sal Goodman
@@redrumrabbit take it hard paul badman
@@mastertrey4683 Had to look that up, I was like "is there a breaking bad character I missed "? 😂
@@redrumrabbit No, suing a person for causing life altering permanent injuries through recklessness, and a combat gym for not having basic first-aid or a policy for handling injuries, is appropriate and reasonable.
Your heart and attitude is genuinely inspiring. The fact you were training with long covid is no joke. This is a beautiful time to not only recover bone and tissue, but also your whole system including nerve, immune etc. use this time to heal. You’ve obviously pushed your body for a long time and this may be life’s gift. I think it’s called furious grace ❤️
Keep that chin up my friend. You are a warrior and truly inspiring 🙏🧎🏻♂️
Been following you for a while on CZcams and I really appreciate your genuine contribution towards the world of martial arts.
Sad to hear that people didn't have the basic human decency to check on you at the moment of injury.
Needless to say you shouldn't step foot in that club again , people can achieve all sorts of great things but fall short on being a decent human being.
Really hope that you don't face any more complications down the line and that you're able to recover , hope you continue on your Martial Arts Journey.
Your channel is a big channel so it's important that you communicate about it.
Hello Rokas, you probably dont remember me since I changed my username, but im the guy in the wheelchair you promised to spar when i get out of this chair. Anyways, im so sorry to hear about your injury, thats absolute a scumbag move from your partner. As you know, I live with a spinal cord injury, and it took me years to come to see the positive side of it. Stay positive Rokas, you'll be in my prayers 🙏😢😊
Wow! I'm so sorry this happened to you! I have been following you since your Aikido days. You are an inspiration.
Thank you 🙏
Fucked up, bro. I don't know why some people roll like that. I hope you recover better than expected.
The fact no one stopped to help you is down right unacceptable. An open matt is one of the sessions that an instructor should be on the ball more than anything due to the free nature of it.
I have a five inch fixed blade in a quick draw kydex sheath on me just in case. Solves that problem.
Who do you think he was training with Jesus Buddha and Krishna?
@@shambalaninja3086 Nope, just a bunch of dumbasses
Man, I am SO SORRY to hear this mate! I send you all my best wishes and big luck from England! I truly hope that you recover as quickly as possible and that lasting damage is avoided. Good luck!
Wish you best recovery! I am one year BJJ free... got injured during a takedown by an 'intense' guy. With heavy heart and feeling like a dissapointment I've slowly quit and now I run and lift weights. At first I've felt like a pussy and a failure, but now I don't regret it. Have a difficult job I cannot jeopardize and children I need to feed. Hope you will come back strong and find safer hobby for life.
Man I am sorry to hear that! Stay hopeful and never give up.
So sorry to hear this Rokas, wishing you a speedy recovery 🙏🏽
The fact that no one came over to check on you is crazy. I’m so sorry this happened. It’s possible to come back from even really bad Injuries. You can do this man!
They definitely need to educate the risks of using such dangerous techniques
That assumes the guy didn't know about it though, which is a shaky premise
Hope you get better fast! Thanks for sharing
I'm so sorry to hear about this. Everyone one is on their own journey in life, and there are many twists and turns along the way. Stay positive, and you got this brother.
Not blaming Rokas but this is exactly why I don't do BJJ. All it takes is one guy who goes too hard to destroy you for life.
same. i already fucked my elbow up bc of bjj.
It's cool if you minus the takedowns. Been rolling for 3 years with my worse injury being a dislocated pinky finger. I hardly ever start standing and tap right when I know a submission is coming. You can feel it after awhile.
@@bujindorkJust hit three year mark only to have my elbow dislocated and folded the wrong way.
That’s what I thought, then some idiot goes ham by stacking me and I hear pops. This was during class, not even real rolling. Be careful who you roll with.
@@PM-hh9ur Sometimes its just an accident. Other times though, there are narcissists or people high in psychopathy that join these classes. It might be rare, but when someone like that joins, it disrupts the safety and harmony of the whole damn class. I've encountered a couple guys like this in the past.
Torn my ACL at a HEMA- tournament. Fully torn off. Wrestling was allowed and my opponent shot for a tackle immediately after sword contact. I wasn't expecting it and my heavier opponent was rushing in, so we were tumbling over each other with my knee getting bent in the wrong direction. I am competing again but my advice for you, from what I learned out of my experience, is to take it slowly, but start with light physiotherapy as early as possible. I trained up for a full year before I started to compete again.
Sorry to hear about your injury, but glad you came back.
That's bullshit, its unfair for a larger person to wrestle a smaller person. At the very least there should be wieght classes!
I will guess it was a longsword tourney?
At least you didn't take an arrow to the knee. As a matter of fact, I used to be an adventurer like you....till tragedy struck.
@Kernnichiwa under rated response lol.
I’m very sorry this had to happen to you brother. You always bring such a positive energy to training and videos hope you get well soon.
been living with a similar injury for 15 years. you will continue to experience amazing things and life will take you to amazing places, in many cases because of the injury. be cautious with the pain meds, thanks for sharing, and all the best with the rehab journey!
I do Judo, and tore my ACL last year. The one thing I always appreciate is that all my coaches and teachers emphasize doing things smoothly and as safe as possible to prevent injury, especially after 3 or 4 of us had a string of major surgeries on our legs and knees. Trust me when i say you can "give up" martial arts, but you will have the itch to get back into them. Don't lose hope and remember that this is just a very low moment in your journey. Good luck and speedy recovery!
I know many people here are encouraging you to recover to then continue practicing JJ. Be careful, my friend. An injury like yours, specially when we are not that young anymore, should be taken seriously. Especially in a martial art where bone and joint injuries are relatively frequent. Not being you a professional JJ fighter maybe it is not worthy the risk to suffer another injury like that one, but to make sure to continue living a long healthy (arthritis free) life. All my best wishes. Hope you recover soon and make the best decision for your health and future quality of life.
I'm so sorry to hear this Rokas. You're a great guy and such a positive influence on the space. I wish a speedy and full recovery brother!
Its always the guys you suspect the most in the gym. When I was doing Muay Thai there was always a bunch of young guys who were hockey or football players who I just straight up refused to spar with. They would always throw way too hard and try to take your head off.
Oh, bro! That's so tough! We're with you! Stay hard! And recovery ass good as possible fast!
1:02 Competitive brown-belt judoka here. If there’s one tip I can share with my BJJ mat friends is: know when to take the throw. When in stand-up, if you’re in a compromised/bad position, and your opponent is going to throw you - don’t resist it, and instead take the throw, and land safely. It’s not worth it, unless you’re in the final at Nationals, or similar. There will be more opportunities to practice stand-up, but not if you end up injured.
But someone throwing kani-basami is a dick move - why would he do that? 😮 It’s illegal in multiple martial arts for a good reason!
Great way of sharing your story as usual. I feel for you Rokas. You will make the best out of this shitty situation. Glad to be part of your journey. You are an amazing person.
Sorry for what happened to You... wishes You all the best and swift recovery!
That sucks man 😢 get well ❤ and good luck with the recovery.
Rokas, my friend has busted his both knees falling into a sinkhole on a construction site. The medical specialists told him he will never train martial arts again (on top of his passion for skiing).
He reached out to a guy who specialized in physiotherapy for knee injuries (and a judo black belt) and he told him it is workable, but he'll need to rebuild entire support of his knees with specific physiotherapy exercises. After around 12 months he was back on the mat.
My friends trained with a japanese aikido instructor who lost like 60% of stuff in one of his knees and he still trains, albeit sometimes needs to bind his knee with sth so he wont dislocate his knee, otherwise dude is still fast.
A friend of mine got serious sciatica problems, doctors (3 separate specialists!) said that 6lbs of weight is the limit for carrying, and that being used to pain is the only way. A physiotherapist I know brought that person to full function, no BS.
Dont get discouraged, you are knowledgeable about martial arts, but you dont know half the crazy stuff some medical experts can pull off. Keep your resolve, trust the process and fight on! Wishing you all the best!
I blew out my ACL and MCL 20 yrs ago on the mat. The rehab from surgery is long, but you can come back same as before if you want. Honestly the hurdles to recovery are like 90% mental and 10% physical. You've now learned the important lesson that it's OK to avoid stupid gym wars in training. Like GSP said: "I've seen so many fighters destroy their careers in the gym."
When I came back after rehab, I became super aware of body positioning and posture doing takedowns. I learned to attack and defend with soft knees and to make sure my hips were always in the right place. This made me so much better and I became a legit takedown artist. Injury isn't fun but you will use it as a learning opportunity to get better. The whole point of martial arts is to develop a warrior spirit. Your recovery is part of that training.
I'm sorry to say that, once you get a serious knee injury, your knee will never be the same again. You may feel perfectly fine for many years - even for decades. However, the injury will come back to visit you, sooner or later. Once you tear your ACL, the chances of future osteoarthritis is greatly increased. These days, so many young people are suffering knee injuries at such a young age, many even before they get out of high school. In 10-20 years, you will see a whole bunch of young people - in their 20's, 30's and 40's, suffering from osteoarthritis. Another 10-15 years after that, many will be looking at knee replacements. I'm not purposely trying to be grim and negative. I'm just stating some hard facts that many sports medicine doctors would confirm as true.
Man thats just sad to hear. I hope you get better soon and hopefully continue to roll.
Man soo sorry that has happened hopefully to you. That fact that no one checked on you is a huge red flag in the academy. Wishing you a smooth and speedy recovery.
I broke my foot this winter (muay thai). The mental aspect is definitely the hardest but once I got over it I started to see it as a challenge to train my stoicism and I'm back doing MMA again. Get better soon!
wow great ! howe is your leg now?
@@saddreams3449 As strong or stronger than before, think I overcompensated a bit on the rehab. But it took some time to feel comfortable throwing 100% kicks on the sandbag
@@Staroy 4 years practicing muay thai and I've lucky enough to never break anything. Curios tough how did you break it? Can only imagine a block from the opponent or being handled the wrong way in a sweep.
Good for you bro. Respect
Really terrible to hear about your knee. We have sadly similar arcs through martial arts. I'm a ex-Aikido sandan who transitioned to BJJ. I was forced to retire just before getting my black belt after eight surgeries due to meniscus and hip damage. I'm left with daily movement restrictions (can't squat, run, or jump) and a similar increase in arthritis risk.
I still feel the pain of having to give up training, but I assure you that there's a full life available off the mats no matter how much of your life was devoted to martial arts up to now. Keep your head up and good luck with the rehab.
Tough to hear that sir. near lethal or debilitating sports really need to be regulated and hate to say, should be criminal for what some of the people recklessly do, these are weapons essentially like any weapon, and intentional use can cause serious harm. I did martial arts and kung fu, the knowledge is great to have but using it with intention has rewards and or consequences for its practitioner.
I’m so sorry brother. Wishing you a speedy recovery🙏
oh man hope you have a speedy recovery, so sorry this happened to you
ROKAS THANK YOU FOR THE VIDEO. Im pablo from Chile. I practice judo for 5 years. Few months ago a very toxic guy and kind of violent started to do randori with me, and the guy did like a sleeve pull to take mi hands off his judogi (move that recently the sensei of our dojo said " please take care of your fingers and don't do thad)..... well.. to make the long story short, the guy did that thing and fractured one of my fingers.. first i thought it was a ligament pull but due to the pain i went to Urgency room in a clinic and the phalange of one of my fingers of the left hand was absolutely shattered, they had to put like a needle in my bone to keep that tight.. still now i cant practice judo and im so sad and angry at the time... realliy... i dont know what to do but sadly in the dojos there is a lot of toxic behavior... im with you rokas
I had an almost similar experience once. a freind of my instructor who is a known tough guy (been in over 300 street fights) wanted to spar with us a bit and we did some mat work. needless to say, he moved quickly got e into a choke which I caught so he couldnt get it on and what did he do? grabbed my pinky and snapped it right off. broke the meta carpals in my left hand. took like 9 months in recovery to get use of my hand back and I work with my hands so it was tough. turns out the guy was intoxicated that evening. sometimes accidents happen and other times assholes happen
@@genin69 yeah.... we assume some degree of risk when we practice.. but how to recognize this guys at first hand? i guess sometimes is just bad luck but we have to spar with everyone y gues
@@genin69 "sometimes accidents happen and other times assholes happen"
a lesson many of us should learn.
@@pablogonzalez1240 I dont think we have to spar with everyone. One should certainly seek to engage with different people to better develop your abilities, and indeed, in diversity is strength, but there is a degree of supervision and judgement that should be exercised by the people in charge to keep off the mat people who may be a danger to others or themselves. I have seen it happen in both sides of the fence. I was for a while the one who was "appointed" to take the wind off the sails of people going too hard in open mats. I saw once a challenger who came in with serious self-delusion having to be taken away unconscious and seriously injured because he actually put himself in harm's way thru ignorance. The older I got, the more picky I became, once I realized I had nothing to prove to anyone, less of all myself.
I am so, so sorry to hear this! At the same time, I am in awe with your mental fortitude and attitude in general. They way you handled everything is very impressive. You seem to have such a strong focus on making the life of others not more difficult, even if you are in a very difficult situation yourself.
Whatever comes, I have strong confidence that you will find a way for yourself and be happy - be it training in martial arts, or coaching, or full on content creating, you will find your way. All the courage to you, you are an awesome person!
I'm an old, and I really mean old Kyokushinkai. I haven't been to a dojo in a few decades, though I still practice on my own a bit. for the past 25 years my passion has been whitewater kayaking. There are some danger and risks involved. You want to make sure that the people that you are boating with have had swiftwater rescue training and more importantly, will actually act when needed. I've been on class IV rivers on a few occasions when someone was in trouble and far too many people were just sitting there watching. My core group of paddle buddies includes people who know what to do and will act when needed. Choosing a crew to paddle with may be a bit easier than knowing how a random person who shows up at a dojo will act during an emergency. My point is, it seems that only a small percentage of people are going to help. Wishing you a speedy recovery Rokas, I have very much enjoyed watching your Martial Arts Journey!
I really appreciate you sharing your experience and wish you a speedy recovery.
Ultimately, injury is a big reason I quit martial arts as well. Before the big UFC boom, it seemed like gyms were so much more chill. Then the boom happened, and I started seeing more and more people coming in going way too hard.
I ended up breaking my wrist and the day I was able to start rolling again. Newish guy from the gym I had never rolled with before neck cranked me into oblivion. Decided at that moment to give up martial arts after a 8 year journey and transitioned into endurance sports.
Rokas, your level of patience and positivity has always inspired me. You truly are a martial artist, and an amazing guy. I'm so sorry that this happened to you dude. May you have a speedy recovery and push yourself to new heights.
You have a great attitude about this. I commend you sir and wish you the best!!
Wishing you a speedy recovery man...wow...