Van Gogh Watercolor Review - Wooden Box Set
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- čas přidán 5. 07. 2018
- Today we're going to review Van Gogh Watercolors by Royal Talens. I broke down the art supply review video into sections so you can more easily pick and choose what you want to hear about. Also, both pictures at the end are made with Van Gogh brand watercolors.
$70 isn't cheap. Considering there is one Van Gogh set with 18 half pans and 2 tubes...and that runs in the high 30 dollar range. And that set includes a brush, sponge and palette. So I was expecting something more from the wooden palette itself, you know, to make it worthwhile and spending $30 extra... I wish it was worth it, it's just not.
Also, something to note is that I didn't snap the pans in correctly to the box. So if you tighten BEFORE putting the pans it they should be held much tighter. I actually never had to do that with any of the other pans/palettes I own so...hey, the more you know. It makes such a satisfactory clicking noise when you do it. XDD But still, the palette feels terribly cheap, I'd recommend getting the metal tin instead, which is the same price but is seemingly much better made. Also there are financially better options out there than the metal tin version too...
Product Description • Van Gogh Watercolor Re...
Palette • Van Gogh Watercolor Re...
Paint • Van Gogh Watercolor Re...
Brushes • Van Gogh Watercolor Re...
Conclusion • Van Gogh Watercolor Re...
Materials Used/Diff. Watercolor Set options I mentioned:
kit.com/LemiaCrescent/van-gog...
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*How my reviews are run:*
1) Buy the Product
2) Read the product description to my audience
3) hold the product to the description
4) point out things I notice
*To those who love Van Gogh Paint:*
I agree, I like the paint, I said I liked the paint. I said they're beautiful. I said they're translucent. I said they're real nice and they promise really good lightfastness ratings. The ONE potentially bad thing I mentioned...is that these paints have the tendency to lift. If you like lifting, then gosh darnit...these paints are a dream for you! If you like layering, it's going to be frustrating depending on how you paint.
*"You didn't let the paint dry before you tried to lift."*
Wrong. I dried it with a hair dryer. The paper was bone dry, and as you can see, I lifted the majority of the colors from the page. Fair to mention, is that Royal Talens' website says that some colors do lift more easily than others, this is in their "FAQ" section of the website.
*"You picked the wrong paper, that is why they lift."*
I tried Arches, Strathmore, and Canson watercolor papers. These are pretty standard brands. Someone said Van Gogh on Fabriano watercolor paper works well. I can't confirm this.
*"WHY DO YOU HATE THE BOX SO MUCH? lol."*
A strength of the Van Gogh line, is affordability. The paints are extremely well priced, especially when buying the tubes. I am very harsh about the box, for a very good reason. The box set costs $70 and you get 24 pans of paint. If you bought the tubes you could get 24, 10 ml TUBES of paint (multiple half pan refills) for the SAME price as this set ($70.80 on dickblick for 24 tubes -July '18). This is MUCH more cost effective than buying the wooden box. You might be saying..."well I want a palette and I want the pans and the brush and the tube and I want it all!" If THAT is the case, there is STILL a better option for you. You can get 18 half pans, 2 tubes, 1 brush, 1 sponge, and a plastic palette...for $37 on amazon. (amzn.to/2JcFVRL)
My question to you, is that, does that crappy wooden box LOOK like it's worth the extra $33 dollars? Sure, you get 1 extra brush and 4 pans of paint...but is that somehow worth the extra $33?
*"I don't understand what you're asking about lightfast ratings."*
Is there a difference between a brand that conforms to a standard and then tacks on "under museum conditions" and a brand that conforms WITHOUT that extra phrase tacked on? Are they both of the same quality even though one has that and one doesn't? Does it ONLY conform to the standard of quality IF it's treated in museum conditions? Or does it have the same lightfastness as the other guy who conforms without "under museum conditions" tacked on? I want to know what the language means and if there is actually a different standard these are held to because of it.
To be abundantly clear, if I saw this on ANY OTHER BRAND, I would also be insanely 1) curious and 2) confused by it. I'm not out here trying to kill Van Gogh, I just want to know what it means. And I want it to be official information and not just people guessing. I think this is a fair question to be curious about. :P
*"You're too critical, you weren't like this with Sakura Koi."*
If Sakura Koi promised me the world, I would hold them to it. *I look at the packaging and that is what I base my expectations on.* If Sakura said that Koi had outstanding lightfastness I'd...well...first, I'd be very skeptical because I've used them before. XD; Second, I would look into that and if they said "under museum conditions" I'd have the same wtf does it mean festival in that video as I had in this one. XDDD "Promise less, and then over-deliver," is a good motto to have. Promise the world and then confuse the hell out of me and not answer my emails? Not so great.
Also insanely fair to mention, was that I didn't' spend $70 on my Sakura Koi set. :/ That was like... If I remember right..like 24 colors for around $20 on dickblick. With a brush and sponges and the palette. So yeah, their price point makes sense. I never said they were insanely great paints. But you get something pretty good for the reasonable price. Even if they were $20 and they then promised me their first born, you better believe I'd look into that. XD
*Edit: several years of people being angry later....*
*"Clearly this lady has buyers remorse! What a brat!"*
Honestly, I don't feel that way at all. I don't regret buying this set for a moment. I buy things, try them, and then review them. I spend money to help others make more educated decisions with their own hard earned money. I also end up donating most of what I review to people who don't have supplies so...lol I just feel embarrassed giving something so cheaply made to someone else... They deserve better. And honestly, so do you, the customer.
*"CLEARLY YOU HAVEN'T RESEARCHED BEFORE PURCHASING"*
I couldn't find any reviews on American websites that talked about if this was a good purchase or not. It's one of those things where you know what the quality of a watercolor tin is.... but you don't know if this wooden box is going to be decent quality. Thus, I bought it. You know...to review it. To help other people decide if this box set is worth the incredibly high price.
If the box wasn't garbage quality you best believe this would have been a glowing review, even if it was $70. A quality wooden box woulda been bomb. And honestly, it has to be quality or it's simply not worth the price.
*"You're so nitpicky- it's dishonest"*
Wow, sorry I'm so honest that it must then become dishonesty.
*Lets recap:*
PROS
-Paint is good quality
-It's lightfast
DEPENDING ON PREFERENCE
-Soft Color Palette
-Easily Liftable paint for scrubbing purposes
CONS
-Van Gogh customer service is unresponsive.
-Box is constructed like garbo.
-Brush came damaged.
-If you buy this box set as opposed to a different Van Gogh set you're missing out on: A) Having more paint B) Saving considerably more money C) Having a better box to hold your paint.
What you guys need to realize is that you can get all of the pros without most of the cons for significantly less money by buying a different Van Gogh paint set. This isn't dishonest, it's reality.
*Final thoughts for this Edit*
Over the years, I've toyed with the idea of taking this review down because I feel like it has sincerely hurt so many fans of this brand. Lets be honest though, this brand has, as one person put it, a "cult following." That mentality of you're either "with us" or "not" is extremely unappealing to me.
On one hand, I feel bad because so many people seem unnaturally upset by this review... On the other hand, I feel bad because it's an honest review that can save people a lot of money and potential disappointment... Also, I'm sure if I did end up taking it down, which I feel compromises my integrity, people would somehow think it was for some self serving reason.
One thing that I find ironic is that as much as I disliked the box... people have whole heartedly defended this art set to the point of attacking me as a person. I've been called names and accused of some not great things regarding my character. It's strange, I can't say I've ever treated someone that way over a box or brand of paint... I guess my point is, not everyone here can say the same.
Just a note (I know this is old) - all paints are graded the same for light-fastness. The fact that some companies choose to add the note "under museum conditions" or not, doesn't make a difference. That being said, most experienced watercolor artists I know advice for people to make their own tests by making a swatch, covering half with some black tape (or cutting half of each color and sticking it in a drawer) because fillers in paint, paint mixes and other things during the production process might influence light-fastness, even though the pigment itself is graded very light fast. The problem here is that you made it seem like this is a problem with the Talens company, but this is a general thing.
i think under museum meen under controle environment like were the temperature stay stable n the moisture level stays the same to no shifting in temperature n moisture n dryness but that just my taugh hope it help
These colours are student grade and this is the reason behind their lifting abilities. When student commit any mistake, then they can correct it by lifting . Hope this helps
@@gitikaasiwal6746 There are not just "student grade" paints. They stand up there with the better paints
Set it off sis lol
Van gogh is my favorite student grade paints!! Waaaaay better than Sakura koi or Cotman.
about the museum conditions, i did see that on other products - for the most part it just means keeping it away from light, harsh light and day light, and use a uv-resistant frame
What other brand also uses these terms? SUPER CURIOUS!
I just wonder how it compares to other brands who don't tack on "under museum conditions." How can they both conform to the standards? One must be more effective than the other or else "under museum conditions" would not be tacked on? Or is there absolutely no difference with or without adding that term on? If that is the case, then these suckers are extremely lightfast compared to actual professional artist brands who don't proclaim every color is "+++" or "I" lightfast. D: The mystery continues! I wish they'd actually answer my email though.
I'll probably have a better answer when I run my own lightfast tests. I just want to get a few more brands before I put that video together. I:B
i literally went all through my art stuff trying to find this lol xD and i have no clue where i saw it. i think it might be the polychromos pencils because they have this on the faber castel website on their FAQ
What does the lightfast rating mean?
The lightfast rating indicates the items resistance to fading. *** = Maximum fade resistance (100 + years) (Tested Under Museum Conditions); ** = Very Good fade resistance (25 + years); * = Good fade resistance (5 + years)
so from what i understand they are tested for lightfast under the same conditions of museums exposure - which means if they are tested for lightfast then they are all under museum conditions?? so many questions lol
Plus museums keep their painting in special boxes, make sure that the storage room is cool and so on. I worked in an museum archive for a short time.
Stephanie - that also affects the lightfastness?? i didnt know that lol good to know
"Faber Castell Polychromos" and "Sennelier L'Aquarelle" also use it
Van Gogh watercolors are the one I used the most. Cheapest high quality color where I live (And also Lukas watercolor). I acutally bought an empty Schminke palette and filled them up with the colors that I really needed. Plus most colors from Van Gogh are vegan.....so....
Good news, Schmincke's Akademie line is also vegan :)
I really don't know what kind of super colours you have access to if Van Goghs feel like trash to you, but maybe the American markets are priced differently. At least where I live they're among the best hobby & student colours price+quality wise. They react to water well but also have a lot of pigment. I don't think the lifting is an issue if you work from light to dark colours and wait between layers, as I've been taught to so with water colours.
"The museum conditions" is a *standard phrase for measuring lightfastness.* Has nothing to do with Van Gogh specifically. That means just in a controlled environment the paints can be compared to others, and at least here it's taught in basic art schools. A south-facing sunny window is hard for any paint but can vary from place to place and "under museum conditions" is a way to measure more evenly. It means that under museum-like uv-protection +++ lasts very vivid for a hundred years, which is a LOT for watercolours.
The "half pan" (I don't even know the English language specifics for the word) is Van Gogh standard size. That's the size they usually come in all of their boxes, so you maybe shouldn't be that surprised if you know the brand. And the metal bits of Van Gogh palettes *can* be pressed together.
"One hair is bent back" is also a packaging error, not a product quality thing. :/ I've liked your marker review videos but I really think the "review" of the box itself was too long.
Like I understand if you don't like the box, but it's more a taste issue than a real problem with the product.
J F Idk, I think it's a quality problem. After all you pay for the box and if the box sucks then it shouldn't be as expensive as it is.
J F yeah I completely agree with what you are saying c: the Van Goghs are SIGNIFICANTLY better then Winsor and newton and they are priced really fair for what they are, like a half pan costs me ~2,20€... and really, I’ve used them and they are amazing and don’t lift much on good paper
a half pan costs you 2.20?! A tube costs me 30 cents more...
Half pans seem pretty standard as far as all watercolor brands go in my experience.
Never said the paint was trash. I said the box was trash.
The issue with "under museum conditions" is that it is on some brands (other people have said) and NOT on other brands (as I've seen with my own personal collection). So what is exactly the difference with the wording and how does this effect the product, if it even does at all? That's all I want to know. But Royal Talens customer service never e-mailed me back.
About the metal and the snapping pan, I had edited the description, but hey, probably nobody reads it anyway.
As for the video being long, I have links so you can skip to the section you care about.
*However, I do think the box is very important to this review in one regard.* The product is $70 and comes with a pretty shitty box that feels very cheap. And there are other options like the blue tin which I'm sure I would have liked much better than the wooden box. Then there is the 18 pans, 2 tubes, 1 sponge, 1 brush, palette set - and that one goes for in the high $30 range. So for the extra 30 dollars, I was hoping the wooden box would be a nice quality, but I thought it was cheap. But hey, you might love the box! And that's cool! I, however, expect more from a $30 box.
As for the brush. I don't care how the brush was damaged, or how you want to describe the damage. It doesn't change the fact that it IS damaged and it sucks to receive something you paid for, in less than ideal condition.
Hope you're having a nice day btw. No hard feelings. Bros before boxes. :>
There’s a very simple answer just buy a museum.
I mean what artist can’t afford a museum to keep their paintings?
lol love your sarcasm and sort of humor. You made my day.😊
Under Museum conditions generally means that the artwork is framed in acid free conditions, usually with fiber mats not paper mats, and many museums use mats that also act as a sort of filter to protect the paper.
More importantly, it means the glass used is UV coated to filter out harmful light rays and this has the largest effect on light fastness. Consequently, UV glass is more expensive than regular glass. It also means that the painting should be hung out of direct sunlight. Museum conditions may even mean with no natural sunlight coming in at all, but I'm unsure. This is all I know from working as a framer at an art supply store chain that does museum quality framing. Hope that helps.
I love Van Gogh colors- very affordable and vibrant!
take the pans out of the metal part and bend the metal tab forward to make it tighter and slip the pan back in. you could also take out the whole metal piece and it looks like you could fit 4 rows of pans and maybe stick them down with double sided tape.
i wonder if poster tack would be good for sticking them down, or does it dissolve in water?
Hi Lemi, I usually dont comment on things, but Im trying to be more actively participate with creators I like. Plus you asked questions that I have some kind of answer to.
The whole idea of putting the watercolor test in the sun is to see how well they last in full exposure to sunlight. Suppose you paint strips onto a piece of paper, then you cut that in half, with half of the strip on each cut piece. Then you put one half in the window exposed to sunlight, and another in a drawer. A few months later you can compare the two strips to see how well they fade. The more lightfast they are the less difference in color.
Im pretty sure I have seen under museum conditions on other brands or when Ive searched up lightfastness.
Its unfortunate that the customer service you received was bad. Ive sent them an email in the past concerning some gamboge I found not having the same lightfastness rating on their website. They found that the paint wrapping in archives or something and told me that it was genuine gamboge and therefore less lightfast. They even sent a tube of modern gamboge so I could test if they had different colors.
I hope this is helpful!
Hello Heidi! Thanks for commenting. :)
People say they've seen "under museum conditions" before but I'm wondering what brands do that? And how do those brands differ from the other brands who don't tack that description onto the lightfastness section of their color charts? IS there really a difference? Why do they make that differentiation if they're no different from any other brands and their lightfastness standards? XD
I wish I had better sunlight here so I could do my own testing... But I have so many trees and lots of shade so it doesn't work that well. :
Hi again, its really weird that notifications dont happen(i turn off push notifications but it doesnt show on regular notifications)? i was just curious if youd replied, and checked the video again.
I had checked again and I'm not sure where I saw "under museum conditions" before but maybe it was on a royal talens product lol\
Maybe ask a friend with good lighting for help testing?
Yes! it was very nice of them. I actually have made several comparisons on different brands and I think rembrandt is closes to the original gamboge. The modern mix is even more transparent too. New gamboge from Daniel Smith is an entirely different color lol.
I consider the Van Gogh full artist grade personally after testing them, regardless of marketing I find the way they work is vey affected by the paper and lifting for me seems very effected by which paper I’m using more than even the paint. I think I’ll skip this box as it’s over priced for what you get. But I love the tubes. I want to get the burnt sienna as I am still unhappy with my current burnt siennas. I never noticed the lifting issues but sometimes you want a very liftable watercolours for various lifting techniques for that reason they are a good option such as by putting down a blue flat wash for a sky and using a crumpled tissue and dabbing in clouds. Also ideal for fast washes over lineart (done in waterproof ink). Museum conditions means no sunlight even from a window on the art, and in a protective frame; best is uv protective glass. In a building that is not incredibly hot, cold nor extremely humid. So... most houses in a glass frame on a wall that does not get direct sunlight shining on the frame. I know I looked into this whole lightfastness thing before it’s annoying. Also the way a paint works can be more or less ideal with the paper and technique used. Thanks overall a very informative video thanks for helping us make informed purchasing decisions.
good explanation.
Waaaaahhh, you are really talented
I am disappointed by the plastic pallette. That is the only thing I would change to make it worth it for me.
These are my favorite watercolors tbh 😊💓 They are very pigmented and affortable for me as a student so they work great for me ! I just think the price-performance ratio is very good~ Btw great artwork c: 💓
EDIT: I just noticed that where I live they are much cheaper. 1,50€ per half-pan
To be honest, for the price you wouldn‘t really expect a porcelain palette , etc... ;) The pans should not move in the holder, if you placed them correctly. The metal ledges need to be pushed in beforehand, then put the pans in, it should make a click sound as it is placed. Another tip: to do the lifting test, try dabbing on the rubbed, wet part of the swatch to see how it stains. If you don‘t, the water sits and dries there and would be not so beneficial for knowing staining levels.
It is after all student grade paints and they do contain some brighteners in some of them, making them a little less transparent. That being said, Van Gogh must be one of the best quality watercolour paints at this price point!
Oh, and their claims about lightfastness...I think it‘s rather too naive to nick pick on their words. It‘s marketing, every company that makes watercolour paints that I know has done more or less the same - because they want to sell their stuff! (And the claims are usually not entirely false) I find the whole debate on lightfastness a little ridiculous actually. There‘s no ‚completely lightfast‘ paints. If you want to look after a painting, you take care of it by framing it with proper glass, and not display it in ‚direct sunlight‘ (WHO does this??? In Museums the paintings are NEVER in sunlight and there‘s probably a reason for that.....)
And...them writing „pans“ rather than „half pans“... if you know the stuff, you know it means half pans. If you don‘t(as a beginner), you get to know that pan is a term for these little plastic thingy to hold the paints, and that it comes in two sizes. It‘s not that necessary to know whether it‘s half or full pan paints, in my opinion.
Just looking at the picture is enough to see it is a half pan..
I really love these watercolours!
I like your straight forward approach. Not sugar coated. I have used extensively and own just about every " western" watercolor and a few from the east. I agree with every thing you say. Except ,You like these paints more than I. . For the price get white nights. I find these chalky, have hard time making a quick completely graded wash( tends to be streaky). These were given to my grandson to use till gone then promised to replace with " better" paint. My advice to beginners is to start with a cool warm triads ( 6 tubes) and learn to mix. Remembrant is overpriced...get da vinci.
OMG I love your negative wet in wet. I am really a 1 year old art baby and I know I love wet in wet in all sorts of ways. Van Gogh was my first paint 18 mos ago. I have since become addicted to handmade process paints, I will go on ad experiment. Thank you so much for this review. I love the box set for it's collectable beauty and function of the quality paint, the best of student grade. Van Gogh paints it will last longer than you, if hung to standards, which I cant tell you yet. Lightfastness is not always important. Why the heck am I saying all this? I Love Van Gogh paints and always will.
Also I think most Art Supply light fastness ratings are based on museum conditions. I'm pretty sure that this is because there are too many variables outside of museum conditions to accurately give a rating of how long a piece of art would last.
Generally, any piece of art will not last as long hanging in a house, but depending on how much sun it gets, the glass used, humidity, and acid in the frame materials, it can be pretty close in a home.
Finally, artwork stored in an acid free portfolio and kept out of the sun should do well, too.
I really wonder if the labels are all based on museum conditions. Like, they take into consideration if you have UV protected glass BEFORE they give you the rating that's on the tube? I would think that the tube rating wouldn't have anything to do with UV protection ALREADY being in place, the UV protected glass would be in ADDITION and only help improve lightfastness AFTER a piece is made... (I hope this wasn't confusing with how I wrote it just now. It reads a bit weird. XD;)
But then again, I've never seen another brand write that down before, so it really caused me to question everything. Maybe one day the Van Gogh representatives will get back to me with an answer, until then, I guess it's up to our guesses or unless someone can prove otherwise? It really is terrible though, I'm super curious and I like black and white answers. XD;
Also thank you for the other comment! It's extremely helpful to anyone looking to frame and display an art piece in their home! Hopefully other people will see your advice. :) Thanks for taking your time!
Basically, you need to lightfast test your own supplies. I suggest it with EVERYTHING. Inks, pencils, markers, watercolours, acrylics etc. Just make up double swatches, one you keep inside in a draw, and the other you stick up in a window in your home that gets the most sunlight. Leave it there for about 3 months, maybe longer if you're in a colder climate. After that time, compare between the charts. If the one in the window has lightened more than the one in the drawer, it's not lightfast. That being said, avoid putting any sort of artwork in a room that's lit up with natural light, or scan everything you make. Scanning also helps for other stuff besides preserving artworks.
I suppose it could be a fun exercise for a video, but that being said, student grade watercolours aren't usually that lightfast, and because every brand is different, with different ratings and variables, you must do your own testing.
LemiaCrescent it's also worth noting that UV glass from a frame shop is expensive... so it's also a bit of a racket. I mean, yeah, beautiful frames are worth paying for... But you can also just order such glass for any frame over the internet and hope it arrives in good condition.
Likewise, there are DIY sprays and applications for UV coatings, like sunscreen for an existing frame, but I've never personally used em, so can't personally recommend them.
The biggest thing is to always use a mat to make sure UV coating doesn't touch the art. Because I guarantee no paper would survive contact with what's essentially sunscreen for glass.
LemiaCrescent 100 years in museum conditions isn't actually much to write home about. Museums are the pinnacle of art care. Can you imagine if the real Van Gogh's work started to fade badly after 100 years? In the hands of those who would treat your art like a treasure, 100 years is virtually nothing.
Not that light fastness is the end all. I'm sure you use and love tons of cheap supplies, all artists do. I'm just saying that's not as high a quality claim as it sounds.
Lots of art supplies boast much higher certified ratings.
I love these paints, for me they're perfect
We only get good reviews then company send us free goodies. I appreciate your honest opinion.
I know it’s been a while since you first posted this but I’m just now exploring these paints and ran across your channel. I like the review very much and found it helpful. I agree that the paints are great but the palette needs a lot of work. I tend to assume student grade paints don’t offer the lightfastness of professional paints so I don’t generally use them for much more than practice pieces. I do have a question about the lifting-how do they compare to Sennelier? It’s a brand I like and even the pro grade paints lift easily, which works well for some kinds of painting like with botanicals. What is your opinion of the VanGogh series compared with Sennelier in this regard? Thank you!
if you like transparent watercolors i totally recommend Paul Ruben watercolors, they have beautiful pigmentation, color pay off, and they're professional grade, also there reasonably priced, i recently bought a 24 half pan set and it was only $38.00 usd on amazon.
I like your picky reviews much more than all the „wow everything art companys send me is so great!“ because with your reviews I can decide if what you complain is important for me or not - for example if you complain that they don’t mix well I know that would bother me too. If you wouldsay the colors are too earthy I would say „doesn’t matter for me, I love earthy colors, so I buy them“ - so thank you and keep on 👍🏻
I recently bought one of the Van Gogh tubes, since my watercolor of choice (Ph. Martin's Hydrus) doesn't have a Naples Yellow Red option. I immediately noticed the lifting, which was actually what brought me to your video. I have worked with quite a few brands and was really... shocked, by how I couldn't properly layer (with my normal painting style), and I needed to investigate. With the lifting, when I used the color mixed with the Hydrus, it made the mixed colors also lift waaaaaay too easily. To be fair, the Hydrus colors are pretty solid and take work to reactivate on the paper, but that's just what I'm used to and prefer.
One other thing I noticed was that the Van Gogh pigment wanted to travel to the edges of my wash, making hard edges. It made an interesting effect, but wasn't what I wanted. When I tried to soften the edge with a smidge of water, the lifting just... made a big, pale line of a mess. Did you have the same issue or notice it with the other colors?
I got a tube of Schmincke Naples Yellow Reddish and was able to return to my normal layering methods.
TLDR- Thank you for the review, I now know I wasn't alone in the crazy lifting of these paints. Many other reviewers didn't mention this facet of the product and I'm grateful that you did. Excellent review.
Lemi, you mean to tell me your house ISN'T a museum??? Everyone know that real artists live in museums.
Hermetically sealed with no daylight? Sounds legit :lol:
Reading the lightfastness conditions I would be wary about using these. Museum Conditions means under artificial light, minimal UV exposure and controlled humidity. Basically, it means that if you hang this on the wall in your house and the room has a window, you can expect some fading over time.
I love all your art and you inspire me everyday
LISTEN TO ME I KNOW THINGS!
Okay cutie I LOVE you and your art, but really, you are way too nitpicky with the set. First things first, I know this set can be differently priced in different regions, and yes, they are currently 42€ on my amazon and that’s much, but I would have WISHED that you did some more research, like with the lifting and the under museum conditions. Because “under museum condition” means that they are lightfast under glass and technically museum light, and it’s fairly standard. You can look at lightfast test for the individual pigments at places like handprint, but the main point is that the pigments they picked and the concentration they are using of them makes the paints mostly lightfast. Like, they are not using pigments like ... let’s say PG8, which is for a fact not really lightfast, but rather pigments that are, like modern pthalos or mixes to have mostly non toxic lightfast alternatives.
And about the lifting problem, I don’t really know which paper you were using with this, but personally I didn’t have any problems with it on fabriano studio. It’s lifting like the pigments in the paint are supposed to, and yes it’s about pigment size and somewhat about if it’s an organic or anorganic paper, mulling and the pigment in general! My tubes are 2,70€, my halfpans are 2,19€, but I am from Germany, so...
I thing they are significantly better then cotman, and that for the same price.
I really don’t want to get angry, but I really hated how you did do NO RESEARCH BEFORE BUYING, at least in the way you described your process... it might be only me, but I take like half an hour to buy one tube of paint, and for a set I watch at least a few reviews...and look at things like how they are listed on other sites...
Anyway! If you do salty reviews like this, maybe you could do them in the way that we know you are about to nitpick, because with this review you really make people, who heard great things from other reviews, very confused I would imagine.
I still like you and your art, don’t worry
ILY, not trying to be a dick, but I wanted to respond to your concerns. Read everything in a lighthearted, not-hating-you tone please! 8'D:
To be perfectly honest, if I was buying a product for myself, for my own life, not being on youtube, not being involved in anything... I would research it extensively as to not waste money in advance.
lol HOWEVER, for me actually reviewing a product, I don't think it's fair to review an item based on anything other than what it is labeled as. Or what the consumer readily sees before buying the item at a store or a website. It's up to the company to describe what you're buying and then deliver based on those promises. I think expecting anything more out of something that you're reviewing isn't fair to the company itself.
So when I review an item, I review the item based on the item's packaging. After all, that is what the company is promising the buyer. I don't base my reviews on other people's reviews. I don't base my reviews on things I can dig up on the internet. So going to someone else's website (handprint) that isn't affiliated with Van Gogh, to learn more about Van Gogh, isn't something I will do for a review. If a company has something great, they should flaunt it in their OWN packaging/marketing. If not, it's not my responsibility to dig up other people's findings to try to promote a company who can't promote itself.
I understand that people want to store their art in museum conditions with the UV protecting glass, the conditioned air, out of the sunlight, blah blah blah. I get that is how people want to store their art to get the most life out of it as possible. I get it. I'm not debating that. I know what a museum is. I get it.
My question is: why advertise it "under museum conditions"? Why do SOME people say under museum conditions and other companies don't? Does it matter if that language is tacked on, or does it not matter at all? Is it conforming to the standards, or does it ONLY conform to the standards ->under museum conditions? XD Or maybe part of the lightfastness ratings is that every single brand under the sun expects a UV glass attached to the artwork and THAT is where the ratings come from. That the UV glass is ALREADY taken into consideration at the time a color is labeled lightfast. Or maybe they're just warning the buyer, "hey, maybe you should slap some of that UV glass on dis bitch." I don't get the language and think that maybe companies in general should be more straight forward with the language they use. It doesn't matter if it's Van Gogh or not, if I saw that label on ANYTHING, I would question what that means as I've never seen that before. I guess Van Gogh was the unlucky company that I've first seen this language with and so it's in their video. Unfortunate for them, but it is what it is. Whatever...it ...is...lol
As for the paper affecting lifting, it very well may have something to do with it? I have used some pretty well known brands so far, Arches, Strathmore, and Canson, being 3 different kinds. All had similar problems, hot pressed or cold. Testing on 3 different brands of paper I think is kinda generous in this regard, but maybe Fabriano is the answer to the lifting problem? I have no idea.
Anyway! thank you for your comment, I hope this better explains where I'm coming from with my thought process. :> Also your icon is just so cute! I love the colors. x3
@@LemiaCrescent Wow, this is a horrendous way to speak to someone who has taken the time to share their knowledge about subjects which you specifically asked them to respond to you about in your video. Dress it up with a little "lighthearted, not-hating-you" intro all you like, it's disgraceful. You seem like a very defensive person, who does not take healthy criticism well. Annikania may not have expressed themselves in the most impartial way, but you are the content provider - you should be setting a standard with the way you speak, and your own bias/ignorance / lack of knowledge on the subject matter of the video showed through. That's why you're getting defensive. Because anyone with slightly more watercolour knowledge than yourself can see that you are talking about something which you could use a little help on, and you bite their head off.
It's quite obvious that Annikania isn't telling you to just watch every review by other youtubers, they are telling you to just generally educate yourself on the medium itself first.
I agree, I think you should take the time, to learn the terminology before you make money from a monetised video about something you really don't deserve to speak on.
Find out what these terms mean, find out which companies use these terms, use your inference skills, ask yourself questions, like other fantastic art youtubers do.
Ask youself:
Which companies use terms like "under museum conditions?"
Where are these companies based?
How old are they?
You only need to do a little research to know that it's quite a European thing to mention terms like this in their descriptions. Mainly old, European art houses do it. Therefore, this is a cultural thing, for which brash reviewers who do not understand to context of the words will usually get flustered, and begin to blame the company, rather than a simple case of being lost in translation. Better, level-headed reviewers will actually do their research and produce a video which is not just a great review, but actually an educational tool.
For this reason, I disagree with you on a major point you make - no, the company in this case did not have the fault, or hold the responsibility to 'promote' this item to you anymore than it already did, because the main misunderstandings that have surfaced here have come from your lack of understanding of generic terminology used throughout certain parts of the watercolour community.
Please think about this and consider this when you decide to make future reviews on products that raise questions, because you can be sure that anyone who knows slightly more than you do will be here to tell you that - and if that's the case, it's the content provider's responsibility to set the standard with the way they talk.
Evie Rodriguez actually, I think you and the op were extremely condescending. It's literally a free review. It costs you nothing. If you don't like it, bitching about it is pointless, stupid, and rude.
Candorsmayhem again, very similar unnecessarily rude language and tone to the content provider. Not a surprise as the standard being set is so low. Case in point.
True!Do your research!! I got the museumquality lightfastness taught to me at school.
And I m reading so many reply s to this v8deo of people who also are angry and or explaining that you are very very wrong and seems to be very like you didn t want to like them...maybe to amgry about not being called back?
I love your art
I wish i could use water colour like you but im still working on my skills
Them saying 'museum conditions' is them being honest...as apposed to most others. Regardless of any company's lightfast rating, you shouldn't display them in a way that gets a lot of light.
the glue you mentioned, would that happen to be gum arabic?
I have plastic palette. My first impression was pretty bad but then I compare it to White Nights, they like day and night(white)))) VG a good quality product, it actually have mixing space and good brush.
Nice
You can put a drop of gum arabic under the colour in the pans and let it dry. Then they do not fall out all that easy.
gum arabic is water soluble and a bit brittle though
Can anyone help me decide? I’m choosing between sennelier la petite aquarelle (£40 for 24 half pans), white nights (£60 for 36 whole pans) or talens Van Gogh (£35 for 24 half pans). I’ve included prices because they’re super variable to the prices I’ve seen everyone paying in videos! Thanks :)
Umm I'd say white nights has a deeper and richer color range. Sennelier and van gogh have a very soft color palette, which I personally really like. (Personal preference, nothing wrong with liking stronger colors of course) Of the 3 options white nights is the only "artist" quality set. Though for a student brand, van gogh boats excellent lightfastness (despite my issue with their wording which apparently offends everyone lol). So if price is a huge issue, this one is cheapest of 3. White nights full pans are HUGE, they give you a ton of paint. But also it's the priciest on your list.. but you do get a ton of extra colors compared to those other sets. I'd probably go with white nights of the 3 if stuck on an island lol. :) I hope my rambling helped! XD Do let me know what option you ended up with and what you think of the paint. Best of luck. :)
@@LemiaCrescent thank you so much that really helps!! :)
I have the tin one and it looks more fancy than the wooden box 😆
I'm sure it's better crafted, too. :( I regret my choice to get the wooden box.
LemiaCrescent yeah I've noticed the difference in quality too
@@rori_doodles93 i have a tin box and a reviewed wooden box. yes, both van Gogh. what difference in quality are you talking about exactly, may i ask?
your work is amazing
Here Early!
I am not an artist, nor can I even doodle at all really but I do love art videos and I have a masters in art history so I know an awful lot about art and lately I’ve been learning a lot about art products from videos because I find them very relaxing, I love the level of your critique, It’s no puff piece… And because of it I subscribed I have a feeling that I like what you have to say about a lot of different things. Thanks for the content!
Nice review, thank you.
Subbed. Came from holly Brown colab.
the photo edits XD
HOBBY LOBBY had them at a $1.49/tube about 2 yrs ago
Us in the netherlands say: van gog so: van goch)
Royal Talens does offer only one size of pans, the ones, others brands might call semi godets, half pans, Pfännchen or whatever. A look at the Royal Talens homepage would have answered you that question. So it's absolutely okay for them to write 24 pans, isn't it? If you ever really compare the size of the different (half) pans from the brands Van Gogh, Daniel Smith, Schmincke, Winsor&Newton, Lukas, you'll find out, they are not the same size. Not from the outside, and not what can be filled into the inside.
The palette in this watercolour set is made from plastics. A porcelain palette that size would have cost at least half the price of the whole set. But think about this: Van Gogh is a student grade watercolor brand with fillers in the colours, but with artist grade light fastness at the whole range of colours, often because they use much more modern pigments, than other brands do. There are "artist" grade watercolour brands, which don't offer that high lightfastness over there complete range of colours. Lukas, Schmincke, Nevskaya Palitra, Sennelier, all of the have some real weak colours in the range of their high quality "artist grade" brands. I would always use and prefer Van Gogh watercolours instead. The same goes for opaqueness of colours. The whole range of the colours is transparent, some are semi transparent. On other brands, you'll find a lot of opaque or semi-opaque colours.
Royal Talens also offers artist grade sets, so a artist grade set from "Rembrandt" (order number 20838624) that is comparable to the Van Gogh one, with a wooden box, 22 (!) colours, this time a porcellain palette and a brush from series 110, size 4, around 3-4 times the price of the Van Gogh set, that "surprisingly" only offers a plastic palette instead. (Just checked the price: 41.99 € for the Van Gogh set, 151.45 € for the Rembrandt set, at least in the country where I live.)
I personally don't really like water-color, it's harder for me to get colors right.
It might just be me being garbage at art, but eh.
And always a pleasure to see your vid in my notification box Lemia
Yay im early. ❤😊😂❤
thanks for your review; i am thoroughly turned off from buying and that is a good thing
Hiii Lemia!! How've you been?
I bought an 12pack of Winsor&Newton watercolours for 30€and I am quite happy with them.I saw the van Gogh watercolours in the store as well but the price was ridicilous.
You din t live in Europe I guess? Cause thats due to them being shipped across the world and that kicking proces up..that and middke men between each shipping and selling to eachother who also wants to get his or cut of the deal ...Qor is as example 13 dollars for 1 tube and Daniel Smith is as unaffordable to me as well..
It’s around a hundred and it comes with a plastic mixing palette?! D8< hell naw!
I AM A LIGHT FAST MIS POSES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! thus i dont know how to pose during a light fast test
I've worked in a museum before and generally museums will dim their lights to preserve the light fastness of a piece. There are humidifiers in each room to keep the pieces in perfect condition. So yes the paints are pretty terrible in terms of light fastness
No thats not what they meant by that term!
i really understand that you are really picky but damn a little too much for a student grade watercolor, i mean you complaining. It just felt like you were never going to stop. Sorry but i thought it was nice they went the little extra mile to give a nice box and palette and two nice brushes ect....
Student grade or not, it cost $70. I'm here to tell you if it's worth it or not. I personally didn't think it was worth the cost, and in retrospect, I would have opted for tubes. But I'm here to blow the money so you don't have to, and give a brutally honest review. Sorry this isn't helpful to you.
...It's also not really "nice" of them, it's marketing. Even if you toss in "extra items," it's still chalked up as extra profit for them and more out of your own pocket.
i've never heard anyone dunk on these paints so hard lol, not that it's necessarily a bad thing you're brutally honest, but van gogh is imho one of the best student grade watercolors out there. the only ones better i can think of on the spot are maybe schmincke akademie, which are ridiculously pricey for student grade and white nights, which technically aren't even student paints. i obviously have my own issues with van gogh watercolors, and i agreed with a couple of your points, but all in all i feel like you were a little too harsh on these, especially since you said you like sakura koi, and those paints are imho way worse.
LemiaCrescent You gave 70$ for a wooden box, a plastic mixing palette, 2 brushes (1 sable) and don't know how many perfectly lightfast and nice pans. For that much, over here, I can buy about 7 5ml tubes of Daniel smith, which are just as lightfast and well-behaved. I honestly wonder what you think value is.
Not sure why you're "fighting" me, Dr. Phil. I complimented the paint and the price point of the tubes. It seems we're in agreement about the paint. I honestly think the wooden box blows, it's not cost effective. You can get a plastic palette, 18 pans, 2 tubes, paintbrush, and sponge for like... $37 dollars. Why would you blow the extra 30 dollars for the shitty wooden box? lol It's not like 4 half pans, and one brush is making the $30 a cost effective solution.
Honestly, Dr. Phil... I'm really beginning to question what YOU think value is....8D LOL Sorry, I'm just having a little fun with you at the end.
All reviews are done in accordance with what the product promises you on the packaging. It has always been this way on my channel. (also, lets just ignore that I complimented the paint, but..whatever lol )
If Sakura Koi, at the time of that review, promised great lightfastness (under museum conditions) I'd have the same festival in that video that I have going on in this one. Hell, it might have even been worse. Having used them before, I'd be skeptical.
But yeah, there is always the same process. It begins with reading the product labeling and then looking at the item critically to see if it readily meets the description. And as always, If I stumble across weird stuff, of course I'll point it out. Because, I mean, weird stuff man.
Saw some people complaining in the comments, but I personally appreciate how honest your reviews are! I was considering buying these paints and if I am to buy them, I want to know EVERYTHING that's wrong or not optimal with them. Of course, it's unlikely to get perfect paints for cheap, but you need to decide what you want to sacrifice.
Nevlynnei I would agree, except many of the complaints are misunderstandings/a result of not doing enough research. I would honestly not use this review to decide wheither or not to buy these paints. Not hating on her, but this definitely isn't one of her better reviews.
@@birdseyeview164 trye you better off using Owings art review about this paints
Your nit-picks give me life, honestly. I loved this review xD (Also, I feel you with the brushes, one little hair back drives me nuts.)
Glad to hear this review from you, I was thinking about buying them, but I found them to be very expensive and I really didn't like the packaging because it made them look kind of cheap? But they weren't cheap, otherwise it would've been fine. Also I think there's just much better watercolours for a similar price and I ended up going with another brand that directly told me what it was.
Them Jules if you can get the 12 set or the 12+3 set for like 15€, which is the store price here in Europe, they are definitely definitely the best thing you can get in the price range. She is waaaaay to critical here, I used a lot of really expensive brands, like the m graham ones, Daniel Smith, schmincke etc, and they are by far the best student grade paints there are. And yes, they are looking not as fancy as schmincke pans in the way they are packaged. But schmincke horadam pans cost at least 5,20€, and the Van Goghs 2,19€, so there might be a correlation somebody didn’t tell us
I live in Germany and at my store the 12 pack costs about 26€, if that's an uncommon price then I guess my disliking in it is justified, if it's actually 15€ normally, I'd agree that that's very reasonable
Them Jules the 15 set in the pocket box is at 13,60€ on amazon... maybe you should get it there xD and it’s definitely worth that price, don’t get the Winsor and newton cotmans they are really pale, and from experience I can say some of them fades after only two years on my walls
Annikania Well I have some I like right now, but if I decide I need new ones I might check them out then ;)
Your videos give me alot of information I started watching after the sakura pens set and I enjoy all of it. It helps to know what I'm gonna buy
I'm glad you find the information helpful! :)))
I think it was a fair review, I would have felt the same after spending that amount of money, I would have been dissapointed. I find you always give a fair honest review and don't know why so many people have got annoyed, you do these reviews to help US. We can then make up our own minds weather we want to spend OUR money on these items!!!!!
Detective Bob Ross (lemi) the mystery of the Van Gogh paints
Your voice sounds like 'Louise' on the Bob's Burgers animated television series. If you're not the voice of Louise, you should be!
100 years museum condition.
10 years Los Angels apartments condition.
For the price, I'm not surprised these are half pans with plastic (not porcelain). If you want a cheap palette (that's not plastic) you can use plates / dishes which are pretty cheap if you hunt around at the Goodwill.
Also, isn't lifting a good thing? Lifting specifically opens up more watercolor techniques to you. If you are working in layers, you need to let each layer dry (use a heat tool) before you paint over it and lifting won't be a problem.
I dunno, $70 isn't cheap. Considering there is one Van Gogh set with 18 half pans and 2 tubes...and that runs in the high 30 dollar range... I was expecting something more from the palette itself. I regret the decision and decided to explain why to my audience. You know what is really great though? Those deviled egg dishes that are made from milk glass. Those are so pretty and work really nicely as wells. :>
Some people like lifting, I'm not a fan. Some people like to get the white of the paper back, I'm not much for that. I plan where the white of the paper goes and I layer accordingly. But if you like the lifting technique this is definitely a really great option for you. Also, the paper/paint was completely dry between the layers. It reactivates very easily and is lifted away, very notably so compared to some other brands I have.
indeed that s how you prevent it lifting on you.And yes lifting easy is a plus in watercoloring
It's unfortunately really common here in europe to have incredibly vague, often useless, item descriptions. It's really infuriating and bizarre, but it's just A Thing. When i order brushes it's always a fun mystery what size they'll actually be. I love the van gogh watercolours, my only frame of reference is the W&N cotman pans which feel like they're all binder and no pigment in comparison.
I think you give them such harsh review because they did not give you an answer for your mail hhhhh
I got a notif from this 36 minutes ago.
Im confused, how come theres no 1k views yet?
Shout out to the people angry at you for reviewing paints.
Good video Lemi!
My question is... Have they run a test for a 100 freaking years in a museum as well as in a house in Arizona or wherever to see this?? That’s always what I think when I see these things on paints. Is there a guy waiting for 100 years to say... “yep... now it started to fade... there, see it??”
And actually, does it start to fade at a 100, or is it going to be completely faded by then??
So many questions!!!!!
LOL Just one house in Arizona that has tons of swatches in the windows and some old man like...the keeper of the art supplies. Gets paid by companies to watch over the results. XD
LemiaCrescent Yes! Poor man! That’s the only thing he did for a 100 years! But then they change the formula and a new batch of swatches comes in! I can hear him say “ohh, come on!” 🤣hehe
Or imagine: He gets there one morning, he sloooooowly makes his way there only to realize he forgot his glasses, he thinks that everything looks the same so he slowly walks back home, little does he know that everything faded just a teeny tiny bit.
Ao Tora haha ohh this poor old man!!! 🤭🤣
tip: always doubt brands' lightfastness ratings.i had a couple paints in the window for a few weeks and most paints did not fade at all, while for example a highly rated schmincke prussian blue did fade significantly. do your own tests if you want to make sure you're using high quality products. my tests on the van gogh pants showed them to be highly lightfast, but again, don't take anyone's word for it and try it yourself.
You know, I heard that you should always do your own tests because the labeling is not always accurate. I've seen people do their own swatches and stuff proving things are better or worse than the label says, so you never really know. D: I think this is a very honest and helpful comment for people trying to get a better idea of their watercolors capabilities. :> Now if only I had a window that gets large amounts of sunlight and isn't blocked by trees. :( ......
IN A WINDOW! Yep...that not weird that watercolors faded....that s not a way to test lightfastness.
The othe brands might have something added to prevent fast fading in full sunlight temporary but not over years and years
I love Van Gogh watercolors, but this wooden case is disappointing
The lifting part annoys me soo much because that causes the colours to bleed into each other even though it has been dry for hours. So if I put a light grey next to the madder lake colour all of a sudden everything is red. I find that super annoying.
Also I'd love to see you make a lightfast test with the van gogh's. Swatch them out and leave them in the light for a couple months and see how they changed.
Hey Lemi How's it going gurl!! **Fingas Yo Wai**
Lol why are people so salty in the comments? I feel like there should be a warning, don't want anyone to go over their daily recommended amount of sodium.
666 views
Sorry but you are saying van Gogh completely wrong. Van Gogh is from Holland and I’m from Holland but whatever your videos are always amazing!!😁
scarlett Yasmyn To be fair, my friend was studying Dutch and I've heard her trying to learn quite a lot of the complicated sounds you have, it's not that easy! :D
yeah, it's the American pronunciation. I know in other English speaking countries it's said more like Cough or Golf with a very phlegmy end.
Yeah Dutch is a very difficult language😅😅
thats the american english pronunciation though, my american friends say Michelangelo completely different than me lol
That's how all our art teachers pronounce it, so blame them.
The also teach us that primary colors are Red, Blue and Yellow rather than Magenta, Cyan and Yellow.
I read a lot about a lot of different brands across different mediums and I've never once seen lightfastness ratings under museum conditions.
for the price, palette should not be plastic
can you talk about that you shouldn't take advantage of the art friend PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Early
There aren't simply "student grade" paints. These are paints used by many professional artists. I use Van Gogh and Daniel Smith. They are both excellent paint. You seem like...well, uninformed.
Most people aren’t dumb. Have you never watched CZcams to see that most people bend the tabs on the metal part for the pans. This is the first time I watched your reviews, I’ll not be subscribing. And omg! One hair bent on your brush? When you get older you will find that it happens, even on student grade items, and on artist grade. You really need to do your research before buying something I think?
She does need to do her research and not fuss about what she fussed about! Oefff I m not subbing either!I own a set if those paints.The paints are great.
Hi Lady i think you must have regretted making the video while you were still pissed for buying a badly priced wooden box you didint need, if you had bought their 12 pan metal tin little box you would be in love with them... And people are mad because in a lot of countries Van Gogh is the best they can get and usually Cotman, Reeves etc but Van Gogh really is the best in this range by far so thats why people didn't like the way you presented these paints to possible newcomers.
With that said all i want to add is that i think you are getting the whole lighfastess "under museum conditions" the other way around, It's my understanding that these tests are made under standard light conditions, and what these might be? Well, Museum of course cause most of us would like our work to end up there or on a nice living room away from direct sun which is almost the same as museum, so I believe this is the most accurate description, if a brand just says "oh well its 100 years triple A lightfast" that is already incomplete info, is than under museum conditions? harsh direct sun? special UV lights 24h a day? so that's my opinion, plus always do your own lightfast tests under direct sun if you are in doubt, but even that can't be standard depending on where you are on the earth's hemispheres and at what time of year.
Thanks and best to you.
If it's a student-grade paint it will definitely be plastic, not porcelain.
im not gonna ruin the 69 by liking. this was a nice video thought
That box looks terrible wow!
ParadiseofDarkness I would be worried that it would warp if there is spillage.
I wish I opted for the tin or something else. :< But! Maybe it'll help others to make that judgement call before they spend their hard earned money! :)
If I ever spill on it, I'll let you know. It would definitely absorb water though as it doesn't have a waterproof/resistant finish.
LemiaCrescent Oh indeedy, specially if they didnt show the inside of the box pictures all to well. Then unexpected artist gets trash from not knowing. I can say from my hobby is making wood boxes or wood butterfly ornament. It looks like their box was an after thought to none wood making box expert wiuld make. Specially hearing from you they glued the hinges, thats sin unless you screw in screw nails then glue for extra making sure it stays. My lord I was beyond befuddled.
LemiaCrescent omg you didnt even do that. Even doing see oil would help, I expected like from them (because most companies do.) they would have lacquer coat. But they didnt. Dear lord.
Half the vide is you talking about your pet peeves about the box 😂 This is a watercolor review not a box review.
Overly critical and nitpicky.
Whining tone distracts from review
Stopped watching as soon as you pronounced it as Van Go. Cringed too hard
Ashpyxiating I’m from the Netherlands. and just like how most Dutch people except foreigners saying “Holland” instead or “the Netherlands” it’s pretty universally expected to pronounce “Van Gogh” like how Lemi pronouns it. It’s not cringy, it’s how most people who aren’t Dutch pronounce it.
Foxy_ Trot gurl, i am too. The English at least try to pronounce it correctly even if it turns into van goff. That’s still closer than leaving the last 2 letters out. It’s not ‘universally expected’ it’s just how Americans butcher the name because they think he was French, because he painted so many paintings there, so they try to pronounce it the French way.
Ashpyxiating first off addressing the “British people at least try” part. I don’t think that’s an accurate thing to say. How they pronounce stuff is really dependent on how they read it and how they interpret that into sounds (think of the word trough). American and British English are different in pronunciation and that has nothing to do with “trying”, it’s based on dialect. Just think of how they pronounce tomato differently, of aluminum. Second off the part about “Americans trying to sound French, because they think he’s French.” I’m sorry but that statement doesn’t make sense. Americans read Van Gogh as Go because A) they don’t know the hard G sound and in English and B ) they interpret the GH sound as nothing, think of the word “though” same ending and they pronounce the ending. It has nothing to do with them thinking he’s French, it has everything to do with how they would pronounce a group of letters based on their own language.
Foxy_ Trot lol ok girl, have fun defending Americans. I am not going to read your entire novel. Fact remains that she pronounced it wrong, i cringed and stopped watching. You brown nosing Americans has nothing to do with that 🤷♀️ funny how you speak for them, yet you’re Dutch? Plenty of people have told me they pronounce their name in a French wat because they thought he was French. I am generalizing jusr as much as you yet you don’t even notice 😂 doei!
Ashpyxiating Excuse me while I “generalize” here, I have never once heard someone’s reasoning in America for pronouncing his name Van Go because they thought he was French. We do pronounce it as Van Go, not because we thought he was French, but because it’s spelled Gogh, and like “though” we will say it that way because it’s more natural to us and how we pronounce words. The fact you can’t watch the rest of the video just for the sole reason she didn’t pronounce it the way you do is just sad. You could have missed out on some very important information all because you can’t see passed your own nose. It’s honestly hilarious you think you know the reasonings we pronounce words when you have never bothered to ask someone who’s first language is English.