Wow, that makes it worth the £100s-£1000s more than last years model. The Bike industry has got incredibly greedy over last few years. You now pay £1000s more for marginal gains but probably also get a heavier bike. They are all becoming less customizable by using proprietary components. Is this really what we call progress? I think greed is a better name for it.
Just like every other industry. Try putting parts from your Shark vacuum onto your Dyson. From an Augusta 109 on to a Bell 429. Audi to BMW. I used to manufacture headlights for Bentley, Landover, Toyota and others. Unit price was about £5 including labour and wastage. Try buying an OEM Bentley headlight for under £600. I'm not saying it's right. It's just good business.
Have you actually tried riding different bikes and comparing them? Because your comments sounds like what a person who has never done so would say. I rode an sl7, weight 7.2kg. Spent the last few weeks riding a orbea aero 2022, weight 8.3kg. And yet I’ve been consistently breaking PRs on flats and straights non stop since I’ve changed to the orbea which is, gasp, over a kilo heavier than my sl7. So, guess what, weight doesn’t matter. Aero does.
@@87togabito I didn't say today's bikes weren't better. I think you missed my point. My point is that they have got marginally better but for significantly more money. Take an 8 year old 11spd Dura ace Di2. It was only slightly more than a Shimano 105 12 di2 however it was 1 kg lighter. We also see disc brakes pushed onto consumers but even a lot of Pros prefer rim brakes. Plus again rim brakes are lighter and require less maintenance. Again, just to be clear. I'm not saying rim brakes are better than disc. Just are they really worth £100s more? The speed at which prices are rising in the bike industry does not match the speed the technology is improving.
Lol sad act, out of curiosity send us the links to your pbs being broken on flat with those separate bikes, and then also a climbing comparison as well if you will? Would be lovely to see how much you beat those pbs by, bearing in mind the first comment was regarding marginal gains for a ridiculous increase in price xoxo GG
I'm pretty sure I've seen some team riders using the Madone even on TdF mountain stages, so they seem to be happy with the overall bike, even in terms of weight. You can say what you want about the crazy frame design but the bike is lighter than its predecessor and I doubt that the cantilever seatpost is a problem, structurally. Yeah, it is a radical design and you do have many more traditional options if not your taste.
I love how this bike is getting so much shit, as it is the perfect example of everything wrong with the industry at the moment. Doens’t change that it will probably sell out
60s over 1h @45km/h is just a theoretical number. I doubt any amateur could ride this fast. Either you have a massive Peloton in front to save you from the wind (in this case the aerodynamic advantages don't make such a big change) or you ride alone (in this case its unlikely to ride @45km/h average for an hour). In any case 60s advantage @ 45km/h is almost nothing if you ride only @ 32km/h
45 kph includes any wind speed. Still fast, but actually in terms of time, even if you go slower, you will save similar time because the reduced aero gain is over a longer duration. This math was done by Cervelo over 15 years ago. It's nothing new. Slower riders take more time to finish the course. Which means they have less aero savings in terms of drag, but similar saving in terms of time.
You have to buy the Madone because of the looks, the power difference with other bikes is almost zero. Aero wasn’t help you much, it is all marketing nonsense. There are 3 things what really makes you faster. 1 loose weight, 2 train more and 3 make sure you are comfortable on you bike, I think this will saves the most. You need to feel riding as comfortable as possible, this makes you last a lot longer on rides. But this bike is a beauty, I hope to own one sometimes 🙂
Be intersting to see how the seat post holds up after a 100kg plus punter drops it off the curb seated post ride coffee and cake stop. 2-3 months of that will be a real test...... I dont think alot of the bike manufactures do a lot of Punter R&D or Punter testing pre release. Its ironic as they are the biggest market for sales.
Love the look. Got really lucky and bought one in satin quicksilver. it should arrive next month. Tried getting my hands on a new Scott foil first, but that bike shop treated me like crap the second I walked in. I get I’m not pro level, but the general public shouldn’t have to earn their way to a dream bike. The trek shop was really nice to me the first time I was there, and the second time I came in they said “hey Adam” the moment I walked in the door.
every brand that gives you money now has the most aero bike in the world, 20% faster than last year's bike which was already 15% faster than previous, until the next brand gives you money. you are not "journalists", you are sellout clowns. nice description, by the way."(First part of description. Should include keywords in this section. Try to write in semantic language)"
@@Shadowboost Maybe..... Or maybe they just have the best riders, tactics, etc....? Cycling isn't like Formula 1. Given pro riders are all on high spec and similar weight bikes. Probably 99.99% of cycling performance is down to riders and tactics etc, not the bike itself. If you feel bike X is better and more Aero than bike Y then go for it. Pay the extra £££ you might be faster, even for psychology reasons and to you it might be worth it for that reason alone. The Bike industry has gotten very good at selling marketing gains that are almost impossible to prove in the real world. There is a reason marketing teams get paid a lot of money.
@@r0sco_1 what do you mean impossible to prove in the real world? Have you heard about Chung testing or aeroprobe testing? Plenty of people have tested these in the real world, not just velodrome and wind tunnel. Given that Cervelo has been pioneering aero bikes for about 20 years now, it has been shown time and time again that they know what they're doing, from time trial bikes and triathlon to aero road bikes. Margins in sprints have come down to photo finish. You don't think aero can make or break the result? I'm not talking about for me or you, but for the pros, having the best equipment does matter
@Shadowboost If you believe that then go ahead spend an extra few £100. Silly me. I thought it was down to other reasons. I can't work out why Cervelo don't win everything with their Aero advantage. Bookmakers are also idiots. All they need to do is back whoever is on the Cervelo S5 to predict the winner. I feel sorry for all the other teams on such inferior bikes. You've convinced me that all that counts is aero performance. The only remaining thing that puzzels me is that Pantani was over 2 minutes faster up Alpe d'huez than the most aero bike ever created?
@@r0sco_1 They win quite a bit if you haven't noticed. And quite a few photo finishes. It is not ALL that counts. But it can be the deciding factor. Pantani had this one extra thing that gave him 50-100 Watts extra. Wanna guess what it was?
Bullshit aero claim by manufacturers supported by some stupid wind tunnel video footage is apparently all you need to maximum exposure. Nothing about this A formed seatpost thing is more aero than a traditional form, we’re not talking about supercars with diffusers for downforce ffs, it’s a bike. Most likely a good one, but not the best thing ever created. Bike journalism shouldn’t follow all this shit. Remember last year when specialized made “one bike to rule them all”? A few months later they suddenly launched another bike which was lighter and thus the next best thing. I can tell you now the next SL8 will be an all out aero racer, to differentiate with the Atheos, and the SL9 will be the next “one bike to rule them all”. And so the marketing continues..
Wow, that makes it worth the £100s-£1000s more than last years model. The Bike industry has got incredibly greedy over last few years. You now pay £1000s more for marginal gains but probably also get a heavier bike. They are all becoming less customizable by using proprietary components. Is this really what we call progress? I think greed is a better name for it.
Just like every other industry. Try putting parts from your Shark vacuum onto your Dyson. From an Augusta 109 on to a Bell 429. Audi to BMW. I used to manufacture headlights for Bentley, Landover, Toyota and others. Unit price was about £5 including labour and wastage. Try buying an OEM Bentley headlight for under £600. I'm not saying it's right. It's just good business.
Haven't you seen how many stages they've won with it this year, those marginal gains have really paid off.....
Have you actually tried riding different bikes and comparing them? Because your comments sounds like what a person who has never done so would say.
I rode an sl7, weight 7.2kg. Spent the last few weeks riding a orbea aero 2022, weight 8.3kg. And yet I’ve been consistently breaking PRs on flats and straights non stop since I’ve changed to the orbea which is, gasp, over a kilo heavier than my sl7.
So, guess what, weight doesn’t matter. Aero does.
@@87togabito I didn't say today's bikes weren't better. I think you missed my point. My point is that they have got marginally better but for significantly more money. Take an 8 year old 11spd Dura ace Di2. It was only slightly more than a Shimano 105 12 di2 however it was 1 kg lighter.
We also see disc brakes pushed onto consumers but even a lot of Pros prefer rim brakes. Plus again rim brakes are lighter and require less maintenance. Again, just to be clear. I'm not saying rim brakes are better than disc. Just are they really worth £100s more?
The speed at which prices are rising in the bike industry does not match the speed the technology is improving.
Lol sad act, out of curiosity send us the links to your pbs being broken on flat with those separate bikes, and then also a climbing comparison as well if you will? Would be lovely to see how much you beat those pbs by, bearing in mind the first comment was regarding marginal gains for a ridiculous increase in price xoxo GG
I'm pretty sure I've seen some team riders using the Madone even on TdF mountain stages, so they seem to be happy with the overall bike, even in terms of weight. You can say what you want about the crazy frame design but the bike is lighter than its predecessor and I doubt that the cantilever seatpost is a problem, structurally. Yeah, it is a radical design and you do have many more traditional options if not your taste.
My madone 9 H1 700 oclv is 6.9kg with di2 9000 DA
In my opionion the best of the Madones so far. I have the SLR vetsion...its slower.
I love how this bike is getting so much shit, as it is the perfect example of everything wrong with the industry at the moment.
Doens’t change that it will probably sell out
Exactly! I'm looking to buy a Madone now. Went onto the Trek website to buy and they are all sold out. Now looking at nearby LBS for one.
60s over 1h @45km/h is just a theoretical number. I doubt any amateur could ride this fast. Either you have a massive Peloton in front to save you from the wind (in this case the aerodynamic advantages don't make such a big change) or you ride alone (in this case its unlikely to ride @45km/h average for an hour). In any case 60s advantage @ 45km/h is almost nothing if you ride only @ 32km/h
Dirt will do right in the hole
45 kph includes any wind speed. Still fast, but actually in terms of time, even if you go slower, you will save similar time because the reduced aero gain is over a longer duration.
This math was done by Cervelo over 15 years ago. It's nothing new.
Slower riders take more time to finish the course. Which means they have less aero savings in terms of drag, but similar saving in terms of time.
@@Shadowboost I don't get it. when riding twice as fast the wind resistance increases to the power of two
You save more time if you ride slower. But overall the percentage of saving is almost the same at 30kph vs 45 kph
@@dzrdza power of two literally means squared bro and exponential does not mean squared. Some of these comments are insane 😂
i have 4 trek bikes, but, this bike is pure BS
You have to buy the Madone because of the looks, the power difference with other bikes is almost zero. Aero wasn’t help you much, it is all marketing nonsense. There are 3 things what really makes you faster. 1 loose weight, 2 train more and 3 make sure you are comfortable on you bike, I think this will saves the most. You need to feel riding as comfortable as possible, this makes you last a lot longer on rides. But this bike is a beauty, I hope to own one sometimes 🙂
I just listen to chuckle at the shilling :)
Latest Cervelo S5 is the most aero bike in the peloton
Cannondale already said the SystemSix was the worlds fastest bike 😆
@@Numeriwar faster than the old S5 perhaps (depending on wheels). Not the latest one
Be intersting to see how the seat post holds up after a 100kg plus punter drops it off the curb seated post ride coffee and cake stop.
2-3 months of that will be a real test......
I dont think alot of the bike manufactures do a lot of Punter R&D or Punter testing pre release.
Its ironic as they are the biggest market for sales.
From the view of structural analysis, the frame is less stiff with same amount of material.
Every aero bike faster last. I just suck it all in. Marketing speed never unreliable.
I want one.
Love the look. Got really lucky and bought one in satin quicksilver. it should arrive next month.
Tried getting my hands on a new Scott foil first, but that bike shop treated me like crap the second I walked in. I get I’m not pro level, but the general public shouldn’t have to earn their way to a dream bike.
The trek shop was really nice to me the first time I was there, and the second time I came in they said “hey Adam” the moment I walked in the door.
every brand that gives you money now has the most aero bike in the world, 20% faster than last year's bike which was already 15% faster than previous, until the next brand gives you money.
you are not "journalists", you are sellout clowns. nice description, by the way."(First part of description. Should include keywords in this section. Try to write in semantic language)"
2:20 - does it mean SRAM 12sp cassettes (an XG-1290 family) finally starts with 11 teeth?
Just more marketing spin for more $$$
That explains why Trek Segrafedo is winning everything this year then! Wait... hmmm.....🤔🤔🤔
Cervelo S5 ;)
@@Shadowboost Maybe..... Or maybe they just have the best riders, tactics, etc....?
Cycling isn't like Formula 1. Given pro riders are all on high spec and similar weight bikes. Probably 99.99% of cycling performance is down to riders and tactics etc, not the bike itself.
If you feel bike X is better and more Aero than bike Y then go for it. Pay the extra £££ you might be faster, even for psychology reasons and to you it might be worth it for that reason alone.
The Bike industry has gotten very good at selling marketing gains that are almost impossible to prove in the real world.
There is a reason marketing teams get paid a lot of money.
@@r0sco_1 what do you mean impossible to prove in the real world? Have you heard about Chung testing or aeroprobe testing? Plenty of people have tested these in the real world, not just velodrome and wind tunnel. Given that Cervelo has been pioneering aero bikes for about 20 years now, it has been shown time and time again that they know what they're doing, from time trial bikes and triathlon to aero road bikes.
Margins in sprints have come down to photo finish. You don't think aero can make or break the result?
I'm not talking about for me or you, but for the pros, having the best equipment does matter
@Shadowboost If you believe that then go ahead spend an extra few £100.
Silly me. I thought it was down to other reasons. I can't work out why Cervelo don't win everything with their Aero advantage. Bookmakers are also idiots. All they need to do is back whoever is on the Cervelo S5 to predict the winner. I feel sorry for all the other teams on such inferior bikes. You've convinced me that all that counts is aero performance.
The only remaining thing that puzzels me is that Pantani was over 2 minutes faster up Alpe d'huez than the most aero bike ever created?
@@r0sco_1 They win quite a bit if you haven't noticed. And quite a few photo finishes. It is not ALL that counts. But it can be the deciding factor.
Pantani had this one extra thing that gave him 50-100 Watts extra. Wanna guess what it was?
It would have been perfect with a normal seat tube
Previous generation looks better and more expensive
I just want to hit 45kmph on a non descent
Bullshit aero claim by manufacturers supported by some stupid wind tunnel video footage is apparently all you need to maximum exposure. Nothing about this A formed seatpost thing is more aero than a traditional form, we’re not talking about supercars with diffusers for downforce ffs, it’s a bike. Most likely a good one, but not the best thing ever created. Bike journalism shouldn’t follow all this shit. Remember last year when specialized made “one bike to rule them all”? A few months later they suddenly launched another bike which was lighter and thus the next best thing. I can tell you now the next SL8 will be an all out aero racer, to differentiate with the Atheos, and the SL9 will be the next “one bike to rule them all”. And so the marketing continues..
Spot on. Just like the next iPhone will be faster than the current one...
yeah. the most aero bike that never wins almost any race.
Who even rides at 45kph?
It's the combined free stream velocity. So if you have a 15 kph headwind and are riding at 30 kph, that's your 45 kph there
BS