What is a ''WORLD CLASS" footballer?
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- čas přidán 22. 01. 2021
- How to define a 'World Class' footballer and who should be described as a 'World Class' Footballer?
Was Wayne Rooney 'World-Class'? Is De Gea 'World-Class'?
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1) Need to have a consistent body of high quality work against high calibre opposition in latter stages of international and/or continental club tournaments (Dependent on their team context i.e. lesser expectations on a player who features for minnow nation/small club)
2) Needs to have performed for a minimum of 2-3 years/or tournament occasions (not necessarily in consecutive years - dips in form are permitted)
3) Won 1 trophy as a bare minimum
4) Need to be an important member of their side (relative to their position - do not need to be a 'matchwinner')
5) 'Talent’ level is irrelevant, effectiveness is relevant.
6) Generally recognised as a top 2-5 player in their position at the time of asking (dependant on depth of quality in a particular era - this can be flexible) .
7) ‘Respect’ Factor, are they feared by their opponents or acknowledged as a top player by their peers.
#WorldClass #WorldCup #ChampionsLeague - Sport
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I like how half of the attacking midfielders played for mourinho
I like that, world class talent/ability v world class player is a good way to distinguish between some players.
Talent is a beautiful thing in its own right - it makes a lot of football fans smile and is worth its own weight in gold but it shouldn’t be conflated with cold nosed effectiveness at the highest level.
Was Mandzukic more talented than Aguero? Hell no... and if I want to dominate a league and enjoy my team playing football I’m picking the Argentine but if I want to win a UCL or World Cup - I would rather have the Croatian up top.
11:26 I think you missed the 14/15 season during your assessment of Agueros CL career. He scored in the first leg of R16 vs Barca in a 1-2 loss. He also scored a hat trick against Bayern in a group stage, which was important to get City out of the group stage after a poor start.
Good point - not sure how I even missed that! Still not sure if that overall does enough to tip the scales but it certainly means other players inclusion in that category needs to be re-looked at.
He also has an extremely good record vs the top 6. Definitely not a flat track bully
The Aguero claim is outrageous, he scored goals against multiple top 4 opponents, 300+ city goals 100+ Atm goals. Career spanned 10+ years and by your criteria a league title is enough, well Aguero has 5 +.
Didnt make him a top 3 st at any point in the world
For me it's a player that every top team in the world would want and / or walk into any starting line up of the best international teams.
Thanks you for including Silva
Gooooooolazoooo! for breaking this down in an objective, fair, and detailed manner guys. There are levels to this as you said and we're now all waiting for your H.O.F criterias.
SOON.JPEG
Hey, great content! It’s your channel so yo don’t have to do this but will you ever do a video of young players you think might become world class in the future? Maybe not so obvious players but ones that look like they have the potential.
If I can imagine a player being MOTM in a CL or World Cup final, that makes them world class in my book. Like, if it seems plausible for you to be one of the best players in the biggest games.
Whilst that is an interesting way of looking at it, I would have to disagree. Firstly, it is too much of an hypothetical situation and secondly, players like James Milner or a Park Ji Sung - are just as likely to have massive big match performances in a major final because they have the sort of mentality to exceed their general level of performance and nullify a big star etc.
Hence for me a big performance on the big stage is certainly a major factor, but alone it cannot be enough as the sole factor to determine world class status.
This was a really good video, arguably a great video on this topic. I like the way it was analyzed and presented. I love the various factors to consider ensuring that the discussion was very nuanced.
I would say I find the inclusion of a few Liverpool players specifically Fabinho, TAA and Andy Robertson in this world class category to be a bit generous and premature based on the criteria established here... they've been great domestically and had a formidable UCL presence last couple of seasons... however they have done nothing of note with their respective NTs. I acknowledge that they are all world class talents, I don not consider them to be world class players as yet.
I think back to back CL finals and domestic league win, does enough to push them into world class level. Yes they can do more national team wise - granted - but I expect their recent dip to be a case of lack of hunger rather than lack of quality.
@@PythagorasinBoots they barley squeak in then
@@HIM-lk6of for now yes. Tbh Alisson was borderline and based on recent performance - would not be on the list. Needs to produce another great season to merit inclusion.
At international level players don’t pick themselves so you can’t say that because so and so doesn’t start for his country means he’s bad or overrated. For example Robertson plays for Scotland nobody expects them to do anything at big tournaments, and in case of Trent and Fabinho, the managers of their national teams don’t either like them stylistic or tactically. So when Tite picks Fred over Fabinho , or Southgate picks Walker or James over Trent it doesn’t mean those player are better then them or they’re not world class. Because if that’s the case then, Mount is better than grealish, foden and saka is better then Sancho, Greenwood because Southgate doesn’t pick them over Mount and saka. See how ridiculous it sounds to say things like that
I have to say that this is my favorite football youtube video I’ve seen in a while, amazing job done!
But where is Di Maria in the right wing? Also I believe that Reus would have made this list had it not been for injuries.
Yeah di maria definitely should've been in the list
He would definitely be in the list now. These lists don’t stay still but are ever changing depending on player achievements
@@PythagorasinBoots ofcourse it is easy to miss out on some players i get it. I am guessing the psg era made some people forget about his abilities because he is not on the limelight all the time
Well for me he was world class based on his season for Real Madrid as a left sided CAM. But now he’s cemented himself as more than World class but one of the finer players of his generation especially in a support role.
@@PythagorasinBoots you think you’ll ever do an update on this video? Or make a page for it on the website?
I’m actually the first for the first time ! Great content too mate!
Thanks mate! Planning to release once a week now I’ve got more time.
@@PythagorasinBoots on halaand? And fitting at city?
@@vrishabhadrim3598 good shout - need to do a Haaland one - I’ll probably cover which team is the best fit for him just to cover all bases.
great video
personal question?
your profession?
if u r a journalist i want to see u on a show
I am a Corporate Lawyer and Law Lecturer (for now I'm afraid)
The Aguero take was bullshit.Aguero has the most goals against PL big 6. I don't know how you can say he is not world class. He was one of the most feared striker. Rio, Virgil and Vidic called him toughest opponent
U definitely changed my perspective on what a world class player is
What was your own interpretation!
Zanetti should be on that list.
He pocketed pick messi and won so much for his team and was the only FB maldini hated playing against.
And retired at his peak.
I didn’t put him in as he is an all time great and I think his best work was in the two decades prior but of course he would get in if we push the boundaries to include him by virtue of the 2010 season.
Just curious, what's your take on Thierry Henry?
Legendary Striker!! King Henry,,
Top 5 in the world at one point cmon now
To me, i think Zidane wasn't a world class player, he was a world class talent. And that's what gave him notoriety, and the French media constantly disturbing us during his playing career 🤦🏻♂️. He had patches od brilliance but he was notoriously inconsistent.
I think Ter Stegen is definitely up there, that's the reason Barca have been keeping him.
Playing second to Neur is a shame because Neur is that good.
Probably the best.
I understand your point.
But other than that I mean other than the National Team Level where Stegen doesn't get chances, he's proven here at Barca.
And what about Victor Valdes, he was with Barca during the Pep's era, the best football team to ever played the game.
I want to believe Valdes is up there in the world class.
PS. I'm a Barca fan. (^^)
How much emphasis do you put on team trophies defining a great player?
For instance, is De Bryune a better player all time now that he has the Champions League?
Shouldn't a players performances define him more than trophies won as that incorporates factors beyond his control?
Can you do a world class managers video similar to this
Great idea - will put that in the pipeline.
If we're being honest the World XI doesn't really reward form either, it pretty much just rewards status and achievement with a small amount of statistics taken into account, and don't get me started on anything that involves a fan vote at all, just take a look at the UEFA one that came out a couple days ago. It also obviously doesn't account for systems, positions and roles insofar as every player becomes stuffed into whatever the most in-vogue generic shape is. If we were looking at pure statistical analysis regarding
form, for example Heung-Min Son could be the best Inside Forward player for the past X years because he's massively overperformed his xG for almost 4 years to a point that is absolutely ridiculous i.e double that of any player behind him including Kane, Messi, Lewandowski etc making him the "best" finisher in the world.
Also great video mate, I would argue that there should be a nomination for every plausible position on the pitch as opposed to a World XI to allow for differentiation between systems and roles i.e full backs & wing backs, etc etc but even that would have many problems
@@mashfnch30 Well my plan is when I get round to completing our hall of fame on the website to have a different GOAT XI for every conceivable tactical system as I believe that is the only way to truly guage a players excellence and not have them punished by playing in an unorthodox role.
Bro you are slowly becoming one of my favourite football youtubers
Only "one of" 😢, jokes. Happy to hear that, Roshan.
Same for me
According to this video the players who had a bad European career are not good players I don't agree to this if a striker proves himself in PL then IMO he is world class
if you put veratti in the world class registas, id say put micheal carrick in the world class defensive midfielders
I didn't put Carrick in as he was not world class during the 2010's. He would have gone into the previous decade.
for me, world-class player is a designation for a player which extremely good at their position, has extremely high reputation or popularity and consistency (its mean normally they play for a famous team from top league), key player for their club and national team,,
it is an acknowledgement from players-teammates and opponents-, coaches,, fans, from across the world, not domestic, but the world,,,
players whose has won balon d'0r from every era were definitely world-class player,,
and winning trophy like UCL or World Cup is not a must,,
Winning UCL and World Cup etc is not a must agreed but you must be operating at the business end of those levels and have made an impact. Otherwise there is no way of you being tested against the best. You’ll otherwise be a flat track bully who has only dominated the domestic stage.
My name’s going to be on that list
How old are you brother and what position you play?
Maicon the star that burned out, was better than Alves at his peak
marco reus came to my mind as world class
May I know your thoughts on Ricardo Kaka? Would you consider him to be a "world class" player?
Kaka in his prime was definitely a world class player. No question.
balon d'or winners from every era were definitely world-class player
We want someone in mode of Peter Schmichel or Edwin Van Dar Sar cos they are World Class, Not David DeGea, someone capable of being the Best and can offer at least 5 - 10 years to the Club.
Alphone Areola 30 6ft 5" valued under £20M presently West Ham No.2, potentially world class keeper in the making to Us he's a much better keeper than DeGea, Henderson, Costa & Raya etc... that has all the attribute to be the best.
A Modern Elite Keeper United should sign next if they want to go to the next level, you know where you stand with him
Hmm, Angel Di Maira, harry Kane, Yaya Toure, kompany All world-class in my opinion
Di Maria potentially could be included although he's quite inconsistent - for me his 'world-class' level consists of that spell under Ancelotti where he was one of the key drivers in that side. Other than that, he's always been a support act but he does have a excellent CV - so this is a decent shout.
Kane for me is more of a flat track bully, with not enough stand out performances against elite teams. He could potentially fall into that world class bracket but needs another UCL run or International run ala World Cup/Euros and he would cement his status. ATM I see him similar to that of an Aguero albeit with a slightly better cv in terms of big tournament performance.
Yaya - not enough credentials on the biggest stages IMO. He performed well at Barca, but he was already being displaced by Busquets. His career at City, no UCL's or finals and for the national team he has won ACON but that isn't enough to cement world class status as the quality of teams doesn't match up to Euro's/World Cups and I do not recall any memorable World Cup campaigns by Ivory with Yaya at the heart of it.
Kompany, unlucky with injury. Probably should have been defined as world class if he had not suffered as much. As it is, apart from WC 2018 - not enough of a CV in latter stages of big tournaments to earn world class status for me.
Good video but with all due I disagree with that Yaya point. Yaya won a CL playing as a CB. Won a league title with Gareth Barry as a CM. Won a PL as a CAM with 20 goals while Aguero was out injured for most of 13-14. Gerrard & Lampard missed the Euros so using international football against Yaya wasn’t fair imo
What about M. Klose? I am not really sure myself, but I think, he fulfills your criteria. He has not been outstanding for his clubs but for Germany he was really important. Interestingly he went under the radar despite having scored the most goals of any player in WCs. However if I compare him to players like Suarez, Lewandowski or Benzema I doubt, that he should be world class, but his output for his country (and not only once) has been really good.
Another question for me would be Alexis Sanches. Especially if you include A. Vidal. He has been key to Chiles sucess. I understand, that Vidal has been more consistent on league level and in many clubs, but Alexis in his prime was really good.
Although, I do understand, why you would include Kaka, because he was unplayable for Milan. But those were only two or three years. In the national team he was not that influential. And after going to Madrid, he has not been the same. And one of your criteria was, that a world class player should be someone, who not only thrives in one environment.
And Van Persie?
I think that talent/ability is more important than proving yourself at different stages. De Gea played most of his career at a poor Man United team, so he didn’t really have a chance of proving himself at international competitions and it wasn’t his fault. At the national level, he had a good Euro 2016 but Spain was poor and in WC2018 he had a howler against Portugal but in the end it was Spain’s disappointing performance as a team that let them down, not only de Gea. Does one mistake in one match in your career immediately exclude you from being world-class? It’s also interesting that you only decided that Silva can be described as world-class only after PSG got into CL final. Before that, Silva was already one of the best players in the world and his prime was before the 19/20 season. He also had a good WC 14 and won Copa America 19.
The point is, football is a team sport and the results are dependant on the overall performance of the team, not only on individual performances. You can’t really expect de Gea or Aguero to single-handedly drag the underperforming team to international success’. The likes of de Gea, Aguero, Hazard, Thiago Silva have done enough to be considered a world class players, without being “borderline inclusions”. Just look up their individual awards - De Gea already holds a record of most TOTY appearances as a GK in PL history.
Have to disagree completely about talent/ability being more important than performance level at the highest level. Aesthetics should not determine how 'great' a footballer is. Otherwise players like Ben Arfa and Taraabt would be labelled world class players.
Secondly, De Gea deserves some credit for being a standout performer in a weak side but he also had more shots hit at him to stand out more. The mark of the great keepers like Neuer is that he did that with Schalke but when he went on to play for a giant club and then also for his national team where he theoretically had less work to do but more to do in terms of concentration and dealing with big moments under the greatest of pressure, he dealt with. De Gea in that situation collapsed, because he lacks the character of the truly elite keepers. He has a big fish in small pond mentality and that is not the sign of a world class player. Furthermore it is barely one mistake, since that moment it has been howler after howler so he has not been able to recover from that moment to the point he's a shadow of himself even on the domestic stage let alone a keeper who can be trusted in UCL finals and World Cup Finals.
As for Silva, he's always been on that borderline of world-class but he needed to back it up with a big campaign in the club scene especially considering the strength of the club he played for. It is not a case of Shearer playing for a provincial club in Newcastle, he was playing for a big hitter in PSG and a big hitter national team wise in Brazil, so he needed to back it up with actual results on the big stage. Good World Cup in 14 but also featured in the 7-1 loss in the semi against the first real tough side they played of a really elite calibre (columbia and chile don't really count). So he needed this UCL campaign to cement his status.
As for Aguero, another big fish in small pond type player. Domestic giant with no concrete credentials on the big stage. CL record is pitiful and international record is poor outside of the consolation goal v France in 2018 World Cup. Not a consistent enough record in the backend of the toughest competitions in football especially when you compare it to a Rooney.
@@PythagorasinBoots Silva didn’t feature in 7-1 loss, he was ruled out because of a yellow card. Before that he was great and I’m sure that with him and Neymar, they wouldn’t have collapsed that much.
I think that in order to be a world-class player, you have to have two criteria - talent/ability and performance at the different big stages. Taarabt and Ben Arfa absolutely don’t the latter, so they are out of discussion. Aguero and Mandzukic score in both criteria (even though Aguero never shined in CL or WC, he’s a PL legend and that is already proving yourself at the big stage, unlike in case of Taarabt and Ben Arfa). Aguero wins in terms of talent/ability, Mandzukic wins in terms of performance at different big stages. But because to me talent/ability is more important, Aguero wins in my opinion.
@@kolokolo9889 good point it was Dante who played - my bad.
For me you can’t just base it on talent and ability because what about Le Tissier - there are a whole host of forwards we could name as more talented than Mandzukic. But who is more likely to score and be effective on the big stage? Who is a elite defender more likely to find a handful on the European and international stage? For me it would be a ‘pity’ inclusion to call Aguero world class as his record is below par compared to the other world class strikers we listed who match Aguero in terms of talent/ability, dominated domestically plus made several impacts on European or international stage whereas Aguero is a flat track bully.
@@PythagorasinBoots I get your point. Aside from Le Tissier, there also many really talented players like Jay-Jay Okocha, Mario Jardel or Antonio Cassano who didn’t really do enough to gain the “world class” status. But my main point is that using solely performance on different big stages as a criterium is not always completely fair because football is a team sport. So a lot is dependant on the strength of your team, being in a right club at a right time, being born in a right country at a right time, avoiding injuries at crucial moments, instead of how good of a player you are.
So I still think Aguero, Silva (before 19/20) are world class. Aguero is a lethal finisher, legend of one of the strongest leagues in the world and still scored over 40 goals in CL (more that Suarez for example), that’s a decent record even though most of them were in group stages against lesser opposition. In his prime he was of the best strikers in the world. Did he choke against strong opposition in CL? You can say so but most importantly, it was City who choked, not only Aguero. Aguero still has a great record against top6 in PL to prove that he can play against strong teams.
Thiago Silva’s prime was around 2011-2015 (that’s when he was getting into TOTY’s and World XI’s). At that time he was Serie A’s top defender and was selected in 2014 World Cup Dream Team. Later on, he was very consistent and chosen in Copa America 2019 TOTT. At 19/20 CL campaign he played really well but I don’t think he was that much of a stand-out player, compared to Kimpembe or Marquinhos. And PSG had an easy route to the final and were favourites in every game - Borussia (Silva didn’t play in 2:0 comeback at home), Atalanta, Leipzig - quality sides but not from the biggest top. Even though CL final is another great achievement in his career, I don’t consider it to be the most crucial factor for his rating as he proved himself as a great player before.
Now when I thought about it, de Gea is actually more difficult to rate because in his prime he was in top 3 (some would argue that even top 1) GK’s. But since 2018 WC he’s been in not a great form and we should judge his entire career. But he was chosen 5 times into PFA TOTY - more than any other goalkeeper in PL history. That’s quite an amazing achievement done at one of the highest stages of world football. I always considered his prime to be world class but depending on how the rest of his career goes, I can be convinced that on the course of his career, he’s not a world class player.
So to conclude, performance at highest and different stages are definitely very important to measure if someone is world class. But ones talent, individual ability as a player are also very important and cannot be dismissed.
@@kolokolo9889 You mention the relevant strength of their respective teams but Aguero played for money bags City, a super power team compared to the rest of the EPL in a weak premier league era compared to 2004-2008 and had the team to dominate Europe, i.e. he should have been the player who brought it altogether and scored the goals or made the chances to turn them into winners on the big stage. If you look at most of those City games, they weren't hammered, it was generally quite tight - so his side weren't no hopers or minnows on the european stage.
Likewise he played for Argentina, with the world's best player in the squad, and yet he could barely confirm a spot ahead of Higuain. Now you can argue that perhaps politics played its part in him not being no 1 striker for national side, but he was generally bang average for the national team when given the opporunity to make his mark - contrast that to Suarez, who played for an underdog nation relatively speaking in Uruguay but took that country to new heights and was effective at the highest level.
As for De Gea, once again you are referring to domestic dominance. Where is the evidence when the pressure is elevated above mere domestic football? Domestic football is a good level, but it is not the toughest standard both in terms of quality or pressure levels. Compare the stages that a Neuer has had to perform in or Oblak and compare that to De Gea. World's apart.
If you are one of the best in your position then by definition you are world class. As mad as it sound, Lukaku was world class at Inter, is he consistently world class? Hell no.
di maria
Camiabsso, Torres and mandzukic are far too inconsistent to be deemed world-class in my opinion, mandzukic seems to perform well in losing efforts he has never even scored 20 league goals in his career , Tevez and aguero are more fitting of the title world-class
Might be inclined to agree with you on Cambiasso. Torres injuries withstanding was World-Class, performed well at WC 2006 and Euro 2008 and a thorn in the side against top sides. He had a short peak due to injury but in his prime, one of the most feared strikers in the world.
Mandzukic may not score 20+ a season but not every striker is rated based on goals. He is an effective performer at the highest level, performed in the UCL and World Cup - someone who can be relied upon in the utmost pressure against elite quality.
Tevez I would rate as world class. Aguero more of a flat track bully IMO - very minimal contributions outside of domestic league.
I believe lloris could be included after going far in the champions league and winning a world cup although I understand why he wasn't included.
Its because based on the other criteria listed, he doesn't quite hit the mark. Underrated player though, gets far too much stick off opposition fans.
How about Kante now lol? (After UCL final)
Think he’s elevated himself into more GOAT territory now.
How is Trent here, are u kidding me?
So you're telling haaland is not a world class player? He doesn't perform good on big stages
The only issue is by this definition Harry Kane would not be classified as world class (at least for now). I think there has to be something wrong then. He's definitely a top 5 striker of his generation, the main man for Spurs, big player for England - but of course he hasn't won a trophy yet lol. But that excluding him feels silly.
Talent and game to game performances should count for a lot more imo. Like Thiago Silva being "borderline" when he's arguably the very best of his generation is ridiculous imo. Not getting to final stages of tournaments isn't down to 1 player, and your reputation amongst the public can be skewed/lag behind reality. As a defender, I struggle to think of many better than Silva. Same with Hazard, any suggestion he may not be world class just feels absurd given how hard he carried Chelsea, so the criteria may need some work
Since you made this video I believe the following players have done enough to deserve world class status:
Vinicius Junior
Haaland
Bernardo Silva
Gundogan
Walker
Thiago
Mahrez
Only Thiago Silva is world class among them currently
Kante championship league credentials are questionable?? Lol
What about scholes?
Scholes preceding era so not included but undoubtedly world class based on his United career alone. England career wasn’t amazing but he put in solid international performances in Euro 2000, World Cup 2002 and even Euro 2004 (out of position).
No Paul Scholes surprises Us!
It’s because by 2010 he wasn’t relevant
What is this Liverpool bias
Robertson, Trent, Fabinho ???
They are not world-class players,,,
fabinho closest enough
18:14 watch the video Trent is right there
18:51 Robertson aka Baines 2.0
19:33 VVD lol you did not even give him a shout
fernandinho is world class com on
In terms of talent yes, but what has he done on the big stage consistently? Doesn't come close to the likes of Casemiro...
@@PythagorasinBoots I get ur point
@@momoreadekoya5694 I loved him as a player though, same position as me and learnt a lot from him.
Let's be clear, michy batshuayi is a league above world class
This made me LOL!
This is a Liverpool bias fan almost aĺ the liver of players are not world class the are only 3 VVD, Becker and Salah the rest, really?😅😅😅
Guy you made it easy for the World players list
Tell me where you disagree - keen to hear your thoughts
@@PythagorasinBoots On the professional level most of the players are good then they is special players like Saint Maximin, Zaha, Bruno and Joe Felix. Basically players that have potential to be great players. To be a great player you have to be consistent and deliver in big games. WORLD CLASS players are beyond that, I consider WORLD CLASS players are players than can change game or win the match on their on not domestically but at the highest level which is the champions league or world cup. With that being said if Messi and Ronaldo played for Trinidad or Australia when they rich the World Cup they still need to lift their nation at least ones regardless on them being on a weak national side. That’s why players like Lewandowski and Mane are not World Class. Messi and Ronaldo are on their or class ALL TIME GREATS!!!
Son?
Potentially world-class but in the wrong team - he can play for a bigger team. He's not done enough on the world stage for now, but he has proven he can play and excel on there. Just needs to do it more often and consistently.
Edison Cavani?
Not for me. Not enough evidence on the UCL stage for me. Good record internationally for Uruguay, but has a reputation of choking the finish on the big stage in european club scene. For me falls below world class but still a very good footballer.
Right wing 😂😂 full stop . who else
Paul pogba world class??
Pogba 😆
Just because you’re world class doesn’t mean you’re not a clown either lol. Moving to United an awful career move.
Don’t agree with Firmino
Keen to hear your thoughts as to why?
agreed,, Firmino indeed one of Liverpool's key player on their succession for past three years,, but he is not indispensable, unlike mane, salah, allison, van dijk,,,, which are world-class player on liverpool squad in my opinion
Keylor Navas, Bonucci, Trent Alexander Arnold, Fabinho, Firminho, Salah , Veratti, Jerome Boatenh , Mandzukic are not world class players. They just happened to play on great sides and happened to win. Evra, Mane, Ozil are borderline selections imo as well.
Salah isn’t world class😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😂😂😂😂😂😂