Hey, Jordan; thanks so much for the Sansui woofer surround replacement video! Well done, very clear and informative. Can't wait to tackle the pair I just acquired. Cheers! R
Good video. I have been looking to make my own cloth surrounds out of t shirt cloth and was kind of sold on that Idea until I saw your video. This makes more sense. I have refoamed woofers before and I am sure the ones you did sound as good or better than new. And this method looks alot better than the tshirt method i saw in other videos. Thanks. Now to find some 3 inchish surrounds to cannibalize for my speakers. Thanks for a good video
Thank you for the video, I have a pair of SP 5000’s and my surrounds were much more difficult to remove. It was a battle but I got it. My woofers are 15” and am ordering those now.. Thank you so much
Hello! And thanks for this Video! I have two 14" Sansui speakers and have embarked on this project! Bought the two Surrounds you suggested and have it in place after cutting it. I'm intimidated by the gluing... I had a real difficult time getting those cardboard things off the front of the surround. Everything is looking good so far. I have checked and double checked the alignment. Another intimidation point... But in the end I think I've got it! Thanks a lot! David West - Houston area
I did the same thing to my sp-2500s a few years ago. Makes a huge difference on bass response! I no longer have to crank them so high to get bass out of them. Also replaced the caps in the crossover. Great speakers
Well dang. I used to come across these vintage of Sansui speakers back in the 1990's - bought a couple pair and thought they sounded like crap due to lack of bass response. I noted the woofers on those things barely moved ! Well there ya go.. Cloth surrounds got rigor mortis. Those things will rock now, for sure & of course now I'd like to get my hands on an older Sansui speaker.
Interesting, the re-foam kits for other speakers always show gluing the foam the opposite side up... This almost seems more logical to glue it this way. Only thing is you don’t get to see the cool looking red side. 😎 🔈 Nice work sir!
I've read in several places JBL was the supplier for those older Sansui. Someone suggested softening up the cloth surrounds. Then adding the dark speaker dope. Do a Google search, IIRC it was for the SP-1500. It listed the chemicals required. Less trouble than a refoam. Of course yours being separated, new surrounds was needed.
Because of the age, might be worth replacing the caps in the crossover. I've just done this on my 30+ year old Wharfedale E90's. I find it gave back detail to the sound, well worth the cost and effort.
Totally true with old paper was and electrolytics caps like the ones in these sansui speakers. My hearing isn't that great so I'm not sure if I'd be Able to tell the difference.
I had a set of E90’s in high school 30 years ago. They were given to me used by my uncle. I only had a 40 watt Kenwood integrated amp (solid state) but those speakers could play at concert levels while barely tickling the power meter needles on the amp. Amazing sound. I did have to reattach all 4 woofer surrounds to the frames as the glue “perished”, and later on all 4 midranges did the same thing. My parents got rid of them when I went to college. 😪 My current home brew speakers pay homage to the old E90’s by having wheels and handles to roll them around.
Thanks for the video. I have a pair of sp- 9500 that need new surrounds. They're 16 inch woofers so I'll have to see if I can source surrounds that big
Very interesting indeed! I'm definitely going to check my SP3500, I always thought they were lacking some low end. But I still switch between my JBL 4312 and these (love the wide soundstage), maybe the JBLs get´s a strong contender now! Thanks Jordan! Update: I got my Cerwin Vega foams and have taken out all parts. Testing all the speakers with my speaker cables, but I only get sound from the Squawkers nothing from the three horns (maybe I´m doing something wrong...)... Strange, but I will refoam the woofers and clean up the switches and see (hear) if they improved...
had a pair of utah celesta coax 3 wys,( bought for a hundred bucks in 7(), on a lark in mid 90s,I used some rubber cement to coat the fabric woofers,armor all on the rubber coated suspension joining the cabinet, resulted with more capacity a lot more than the 30 watts they were rated for,they finally burned out in early 2ks
well i bought some ystrdy and they had movement and the edge on one of them became loose so i reglued it and sound awsome.untill they need work then ill refoam them.thanx
Nice work! But must ask one thing. Is it not important that the new rings are made out of same material so it will get same stiffness as original? So the resonans and stuff is matched to the cabinet and so on. I'm no tech in this area so not sure what words to use but I guess you know what I mean.
How critical are the surround dimensions? I’m looking at refoaming my SP2500’s, and I’m a little lost trying to find some that exactly match the original surrounds. I think I need a 10.5” OD and a 9” ID, with a 3/4” roll?
Hi Jordan. Really appreciate your video from a couple of years ago and want to try your trick for cutting down the CV surrounds to fit the Sansui woofers. I will be getting them from Simply Speakers. Was there a particular model or will any 15" CERWIN VEGA pair of new surrounds work for the SP 3500 woofers? Thanks you for any info, Rob
Great video ! I have some AT15 foams from Simply speakers but the roll width seems too wide and the inner edge rides up. Which CV foams did you use in video ?. Thanks Nigel
@@JordanPier The width of an AT-15 foam roll is 3/4", but the space between the end of the cone and the woofer frame on the SP-3500 is only 5/8". How did you overcome that?
@@deekay2 i made a cut to break the circle, then overlapped until fitment was adequate. Trimmed the excess till the ends met, then made a small seam cover from the trimming and glued all down while keeping the vc centered
Just wondering out of pure curiosity, is the straight splice the best to go with in this situation in terms of strength, or fidelity? Would other types of splices fail or cause unwanted motion of the speaker cone?
This has the least probability of failure given the way the surround moves in a linear manner. Of looks aren't concern the piece cut can be glued over the seam for additional re enforcement, but I haven't experienced a failure with the seam and rubberized adhesive alone.
Jordan, do you have any experience in removing the crossover from a Sansui SP-5500X speaker cabinet? I want inspect and service the capacitors. I removed the speakers for service and the nut beneath the tone adjustment knob. The crossover seems to be glued in place but I don't want to break anything by pulling yo hard. Any insite?
Rubber seal around the edge is probably gone tacky. Make sure the control nuts have been removed. It should be the only hardware and maybe a couple screws (don't remember) that hold the board in.
Very inspiring. Don't know if you still respond to comments but here goes. When I put the surround in the way you show....black side up it seems to restrict the movement of the cone. It is kind of jammed in the gap. When I lay the surround orange side up it fits fine and the inner edge lays perfectly on the cone for easy gluing. The other way the inner edge seems to stand up and needs to be pushed. All speaker foam replacement videos that I have watched have the rounded (in this case orange side) up....Does it really matter as long as the cone has movement and is attached to the surround? Thanks! Jon
It’s been a couple years. How did that Sansui foam surround repair hold up? I want to do my SP-3509’s , wondering if the Cerwin Vega 15” surround is way to go or do you have a better 15” foam suggestion. Will the Sansui 15” foam be better that CV’s. Ron
They're still working fine. You want to get surrounds that are as close as possible so you don't have to cut them down too much. Cv surrounds are really no different than any other, except that the fronts are painted hot orange.
I have a set of Sansui SP7500X I got from a friend for free. Using them as my first trail and error restoration project. The 16" woofers look like identical and have a similar lack of movement, but the cone and surrounds look to be a single piece. Considering a similar repair, but carefully and precisely as possible cutting the cone from the surround. Thoughts?
That's what you have to do - cut the surround portion from the cone. Fresh exacto works well for that. However look and see if the surround has what looks like a sealant on it first. If it does see if it's hard and brittle - warranting the repair However if it's just pleated paper it's actually designed to be that way and replacing the surround in this scenario may cause the woofer to bottom out too easily
Jordan, I find myself wondering about the state of the spiders. Have they also stiffened up over the years? It appeared to me that the one that you fixed still was stiffer than it should be.
Surprisingly it's the other way around. I find as they age the spider gets loose and sloppy, causing voice coil sag and rubbing. However with these having stiff surrounds (and for who knows how long?) The spider likely gets less exercise and less fatigued which is likely why I didn't see that in this instance
@@JordanPier In my time, I've noticed that the spiders aren't as affected by age, and seem to maintain themselves well. With the stiffening of these surrounds, however, it made me wonder about the health of the spiders. I restored the woofers on my mid-70s Gale 401's in 1992, and the spiders then were in excellent and consistent health. I need to get back into them to restore the crossovers sometime sooner than later.
Jordan I was looking at your video on your Sansui SP 3500 repairing the Surround on your woofers. What I would like to know is what kind of cerwin Vega surround foam are you using? I’m looking at some on eBay it’s the ATW-15 AT15 AT 100 speaker Foam. Will that foam work? I appreciate your feedback
I would like to know how you used a Cerwin Vega AT-15 foam surround on these when the AT-15 foam surround has a 3/4" wide roll but the outer cone to inner frame size on the Sansui SP-3500 woofer is only 5/8"? UPDATE: I see that you pushed the surround down in the gap, squishing it in. Not ideal to have the foam roll "squished" in between the gap but I guess it works.
It works. The other option is to find something closer, or even trim away the very edge of the cone - around 5mm worth depending on the woofer. Did that on some SP-3000 where no surround made was close enough. Worked beautifully.
Keep an eye out on eBay. That's your best bet. If it's silent, check flex wires going between the terminals and the voice coil. Sometimes the flex leads fail
7:53 yikes! Those slots are actual holes on the dust cap. So with that brushing and blowing, you were close to filling the air gap with dust and crap...
@@JordanPier At first I thought the same, but between 19:20 - 19:27, I can clearly see the reflection from the aluminum coil former shining through the slots. Even if there's a mesh behind the slots, fine dust might be brushed through it. I would use a vacuum cleaner while brushing, to suck away all the flying dust.
Thanks Jordan. I haven't bought a CD or any music since all of those greedy laws went into effect, and I will probably never buy any more the rest of my life.
Yes, if you have the proper tools, can cut the old one away precisely and attach a new surround. However the surround must be chosen properly for the correct roll type or you'll bottom out the woofer. Most of these sansui woofers from the x generation we're short throw.
@@romanbarrett4361 the roll width and height determines the travel of the speaker along with the spider, which holds the voice coil. If the roll is too large, the cone will be allowed to travel too far, causing the voice coil to smash into the back of the magnet (if the spider was not designed right or is tired) Too small a roll, and you've made no improvement over the paper
What I did was keep the original material of the surround fabric, exactly the same problem, I glued it again, and with lectra cleaner and a brush, I applied to the entire surround with that solvent, softening it and leaving it in its original condition, being fabric it will not affect the solvent, soften the old material and like new, here they are working: czcams.com/video/ZLXcNSWW3ZQ/video.html
Nice work. I love clever solutions to problems of lack of replacement parts.
Hey, Jordan; thanks so much for the Sansui woofer surround replacement video! Well done, very clear and informative. Can't wait to tackle the pair I just acquired. Cheers! R
Good video. I have been looking to make my own cloth surrounds out of t shirt cloth and was kind of sold on that Idea until I saw your video. This makes more sense. I have refoamed woofers before and I am sure the ones you did sound as good or better than new. And this method looks alot better than the tshirt method i saw in other videos. Thanks. Now to find some 3 inchish surrounds to cannibalize for my speakers. Thanks for a good video
Thank you for the video, I have a pair of SP 5000’s and my surrounds were much more difficult to remove. It was a battle but I got it. My woofers are 15” and am ordering those now.. Thank you so much
Hello! And thanks for this Video! I have two 14" Sansui speakers and have embarked on this project! Bought the two Surrounds you suggested and
have it in place after cutting it. I'm intimidated by the gluing... I had a real difficult time getting those cardboard things off the front of the surround.
Everything is looking good so far. I have checked and double checked the alignment. Another intimidation point... But in the end I think I've got it!
Thanks a lot! David West - Houston area
I have a pair of sp-1001 and there extremely stiff, after seeing this I'm definitely going to replace the surrounds on them, great video 🤘
I did the same thing to my sp-2500s a few years ago. Makes a huge difference on bass response! I no longer have to crank them so high to get bass out of them. Also replaced the caps in the crossover. Great speakers
Hi Ed. What kit did you use?
Well dang. I used to come across these vintage of Sansui speakers back in the 1990's - bought a couple pair and thought they sounded like crap due to lack of bass response. I noted the woofers on those things barely moved ! Well there ya go.. Cloth surrounds got rigor mortis. Those things will rock now, for sure & of course now I'd like to get my hands on an older Sansui speaker.
very nice speakers good job
Good job man, respect !!!
i have some sp-1500,s and this'll come in handy when i finally restore em
Interesting, the re-foam kits for other speakers always show gluing the foam the opposite side up... This almost seems more logical to glue it this way.
Only thing is you don’t get to see the cool looking red side. 😎 🔈
Nice work sir!
I've read in several places JBL was the supplier for those older Sansui. Someone suggested softening up the cloth surrounds. Then adding the dark speaker dope. Do a Google search, IIRC it was for the SP-1500. It listed the chemicals required. Less trouble than a refoam. Of course yours being separated, new surrounds was needed.
I Have 2 pairs Of This Sansui Sp3500 Speaker’s and They Work Absolutely Phenomenal still enjoyable great SoundStage up till now
Very nice please take care of them
Because of the age, might be worth replacing the caps in the crossover. I've just done this on my 30+ year old Wharfedale E90's. I find it gave back detail to the sound, well worth the cost and effort.
Totally true with old paper was and electrolytics caps like the ones in these sansui speakers. My hearing isn't that great so I'm not sure if I'd be Able to tell the difference.
I had a set of E90’s in high school 30 years ago. They were given to me used by my uncle. I only had a 40 watt Kenwood integrated amp (solid state) but those speakers could play at concert levels while barely tickling the power meter needles on the amp. Amazing sound. I did have to reattach all 4 woofer surrounds to the frames as the glue “perished”, and later on all 4 midranges did the same thing. My parents got rid of them when I went to college. 😪 My current home brew speakers pay homage to the old E90’s by having wheels and handles to roll them around.
Thanks for the video. I have a pair of sp- 9500 that need new surrounds. They're 16 inch woofers so I'll have to see if I can source surrounds that big
and they CRANK.i got them paired with my KLH L 830s and man it sounds awsome
Very interesting indeed!
I'm definitely going to check my SP3500, I always thought they were lacking some low end.
But I still switch between my JBL 4312 and these (love the wide soundstage), maybe the JBLs get´s a strong contender now!
Thanks Jordan!
Update:
I got my Cerwin Vega foams and have taken out all parts. Testing all the speakers with my speaker cables, but I only get sound from the Squawkers nothing from the three horns (maybe I´m doing something wrong...)... Strange, but I will refoam the woofers and clean up the switches and see (hear) if they improved...
Thanks for the great info!
I own these thanks for the clues
Great vid as usual! With a title including ‘stiff woofer’ you might be getting a new but slightly disappointed audience!
had a pair of utah celesta coax 3 wys,( bought for a hundred bucks in 7(), on a lark in mid 90s,I used some rubber cement to coat the fabric woofers,armor all on the rubber coated suspension joining the cabinet, resulted with more capacity a lot more than the 30 watts they were rated for,they finally burned out in early 2ks
Exactly what I need to do to my 3500s.....could you cue me in on exactly what gasket you used....I will need to see if I can get a few! Thanks!😀
Nice video I always thought the cloth surrounds get hard over time I bet them woofers give out decent deep bass now.
I have a Marantz HD44 with cloth surrounds, sounds like new.. and my other vintage speakers i change rubber foam to cloth, very nice sound now.
@@nopochoclos the cloth surrounds are fine it is when they have been treated to seal them, the sealer goes hard over time.
I have a Sonoco Sonorac Corp very similar to Sansui, the rubber almost rotten , very jelly not sticky but almost no bass too
well i bought some ystrdy and they had movement and the edge on one of them became loose so i reglued it and sound awsome.untill they need work then ill refoam them.thanx
I wonder if my large Kenwood floor speakers are suffering the same? They lack bass and the woofer surround looks similar.
Good work. What is music without a sound foundation?
Did you mention the product number for the 15" Cerwin Vega surrounds? I have a pair of 3500's and 2500's that are going to need re-foaming. Thanks!
Contact adhesive works pretty good for this application. Unfortunately, you only get one chance at placement. Once it makes contact, game over!
Slight overlap of the new foam surround would have been fine also. I have used slight overlap when I refoamed many pairs of The Smaller Advents.
Wouldn’t it suffice to glue the butt ends of the compliance together after you are sure of the size but before you glued circumferences?
How do i measure surround foam. I need new foam and I’m not sure what size to buy new one ... what do i measure?
Nice work! But must ask one thing. Is it not important that the new rings are made out of same material so it will get same stiffness as original? So the resonans and stuff is matched to the cabinet and so on. I'm no tech in this area so not sure what words to use but I guess you know what I mean.
How critical are the surround dimensions? I’m looking at refoaming my SP2500’s, and I’m a little lost trying to find some that exactly match the original surrounds. I think I need a 10.5” OD and a 9” ID, with a 3/4” roll?
Sansui has weird sizes. I usually have to cut one that measures slightly larger down and cover the seam with the piece I cut.
Hi Jordan. Really appreciate your video from a couple of years ago and want to try your trick for cutting down the CV surrounds to fit the Sansui woofers. I will be getting them from Simply Speakers. Was there a particular model or will any 15" CERWIN VEGA pair of new surrounds work for the SP 3500 woofers? Thanks you for any info, Rob
Any model will work. The at-15 is the most popular 15" model
Jordan Pier Thanks!
Great video ! I have some AT15 foams from Simply speakers but the roll width seems too wide and the inner edge rides up. Which CV foams did you use in video ?.
Thanks Nigel
The at-15 is what I used. You have to cut the surround and remove a section, size it and glue it back together. The video fully illustrates this
@@JordanPier The width of an AT-15 foam roll is 3/4", but the space between the end of the cone and the woofer frame on the SP-3500 is only 5/8". How did you overcome that?
@@deekay2 i made a cut to break the circle, then overlapped until fitment was adequate. Trimmed the excess till the ends met, then made a small seam cover from the trimming and glued all down while keeping the vc centered
Just wondering out of pure curiosity, is the straight splice the best to go with in this situation in terms of strength, or fidelity? Would other types of splices fail or cause unwanted motion of the speaker cone?
This has the least probability of failure given the way the surround moves in a linear manner. Of looks aren't concern the piece cut can be glued over the seam for additional re enforcement, but I haven't experienced a failure with the seam and rubberized adhesive alone.
Thank you for the explanation. Happy new year.
Jordan, do you have any experience in removing the crossover from a Sansui SP-5500X speaker cabinet? I want inspect and service the capacitors. I removed the speakers for service and the nut beneath the tone adjustment knob. The crossover seems to be glued in place but I don't want to break anything by pulling yo hard. Any insite?
Rubber seal around the edge is probably gone tacky. Make sure the control nuts have been removed. It should be the only hardware and maybe a couple screws (don't remember) that hold the board in.
Very inspiring. Don't know if you still respond to comments but here goes. When I put the surround in the way you show....black side up it seems to restrict the movement of the cone. It is kind of jammed in the gap. When I lay the surround orange side up it fits fine and the inner edge lays perfectly on the cone for easy gluing. The other way the inner edge seems to stand up and needs to be pushed. All speaker foam replacement videos that I have watched have the rounded (in this case orange side) up....Does it really matter as long as the cone has movement and is attached to the surround? Thanks! Jon
So long as surround doesn't hit the grill it's fine.
@@JordanPier Thanks! They are working great!
It’s been a couple years. How did that Sansui foam surround repair hold up? I want to do my SP-3509’s , wondering if the Cerwin Vega 15” surround is way to go or do you have a better 15” foam suggestion. Will the Sansui 15” foam be better that CV’s.
Ron
They're still working fine. You want to get surrounds that are as close as possible so you don't have to cut them down too much. Cv surrounds are really no different than any other, except that the fronts are painted hot orange.
I have a set of Sansui SP7500X I got from a friend for free. Using them as my first trail and error restoration project. The 16" woofers look like identical and have a similar lack of movement, but the cone and surrounds look to be a single piece. Considering a similar repair, but carefully and precisely as possible cutting the cone from the surround. Thoughts?
That's what you have to do - cut the surround portion from the cone. Fresh exacto works well for that.
However look and see if the surround has what looks like a sealant on it first. If it does see if it's hard and brittle - warranting the repair
However if it's just pleated paper it's actually designed to be that way and replacing the surround in this scenario may cause the woofer to bottom out too easily
Hello
I have the same problem. Can you tell me the reference of tvis cerwin vega please
Jordan, I find myself wondering about the state of the spiders. Have they also stiffened up over the years? It appeared to me that the one that you fixed still was stiffer than it should be.
Surprisingly it's the other way around. I find as they age the spider gets loose and sloppy, causing voice coil sag and rubbing. However with these having stiff surrounds (and for who knows how long?) The spider likely gets less exercise and less fatigued which is likely why I didn't see that in this instance
@@JordanPier In my time, I've noticed that the spiders aren't as affected by age, and seem to maintain themselves well. With the stiffening of these surrounds, however, it made me wonder about the health of the spiders. I restored the woofers on my mid-70s Gale 401's in 1992, and the spiders then were in excellent and consistent health. I need to get back into them to restore the crossovers sometime sooner than later.
Jordan I was looking at your video on your Sansui SP 3500 repairing the Surround on your woofers. What I would like to know is what kind of cerwin Vega surround foam are you using? I’m looking at some on eBay it’s the ATW-15 AT15 AT 100 speaker Foam. Will that foam work? I appreciate your feedback
I think I used a 15" Vega with an angled attachment
Gotta cut it to fit as in the video
I would like to know how you used a Cerwin Vega AT-15 foam surround on these when the AT-15 foam surround has a 3/4" wide roll but the outer cone to inner frame size on the Sansui SP-3500 woofer is only 5/8"? UPDATE: I see that you pushed the surround down in the gap, squishing it in. Not ideal to have the foam roll "squished" in between the gap but I guess it works.
It works. The other option is to find something closer, or even trim away the very edge of the cone - around 5mm worth depending on the woofer. Did that on some SP-3000 where no surround made was close enough. Worked beautifully.
Hey Jordan do you know a source for a w114 woofer. One of my sp3500 woofers has gone kaputt.
Keep an eye out on eBay. That's your best bet.
If it's silent, check flex wires going between the terminals and the voice coil. Sometimes the flex leads fail
7:53 yikes! Those slots are actual holes on the dust cap. So with that brushing and blowing, you were close to filling the air gap with dust and crap...
Nah. There's a fine screen behind the cap. I would have never brushed debris into the gap.
@@JordanPier At first I thought the same, but between 19:20 - 19:27, I can clearly see the reflection from the aluminum coil former shining through the slots. Even if there's a mesh behind the slots, fine dust might be brushed through it. I would use a vacuum cleaner while brushing, to suck away all the flying dust.
Thanks Jordan. I haven't bought a CD or any music since all of those greedy laws went into effect, and I will probably never buy any more the rest of my life.
Coincidence... i just refoamed my AR 4xa an hour ago.
i have 2 6inch snsui speakers 80s same problem here
👍
I have a pair of sp 7500 x sansui speakers is it possible to remove the paper surround and replace them with rubber or foam surrounds ? .
Yes, if you have the proper tools, can cut the old one away precisely and attach a new surround.
However the surround must be chosen properly for the correct roll type or you'll bottom out the woofer. Most of these sansui woofers from the x generation we're short throw.
@@JordanPier what do you mean by the correct roll type ? I'm not going to attempt this myself but I'm trying to learn .
@@romanbarrett4361 the roll width and height determines the travel of the speaker along with the spider, which holds the voice coil. If the roll is too large, the cone will be allowed to travel too far, causing the voice coil to smash into the back of the magnet (if the spider was not designed right or is tired)
Too small a roll, and you've made no improvement over the paper
Billy Idol till Tuesday ACDC Groove Line. I can get all the pop stuff instantly not the blues so much. I know why you use that Billy Idol song too
The Billy idol track gets waaayyyy down there in the bottom registers. Easily reveals resonances or intermod distortion on cheap amps
Isn't Sansui gone now? You probably couldn't get parts at all.
what glue is it?
www.springfieldspeakerrepair.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BSC
Hi jordan exelen video name of the glue please thanks sr
www.springfieldspeakerrepair.com/products/bsc-0001
Why on earth would you place the surround upside down.?
This was how the original was installed. If you place the roll facing outward it will bump into the grill, making for undesired noises
That was actually the norm back then.
What I did was keep the original material of the surround fabric, exactly the same problem, I glued it again, and with lectra cleaner and a brush, I applied to the entire surround with that solvent, softening it and leaving it in its original condition, being fabric it will not affect the solvent, soften the old material and like new, here they are working:
czcams.com/video/ZLXcNSWW3ZQ/video.html
Man, put your camera on support and work with your both hands! Please!
Using such a legendary speaker set for background music...sad...they need to be cracked up