James Gunn Was Hired To Write Superman Legacy Before Henry Cavill Returned In Black Adam
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- čas přidán 20. 02. 2023
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Basically Dwayne was hoping Black Adam was going to make bank and force Warners to give him the keys to the kingdom.......that obviously didnt work.
I disagree with John’s perspective on why the Cavill post credit scene was there, you can’t say it wasn’t to boost sales, it clearly was. The better question to ask is how much worse ticket sales would have been without it.
it’s crazy bc that thursday or friday it came out the post credit scene was already on twitter so people didn’t have to go
The only reason I went and watch black Adam was because of the Superman end credit
I’m honestly so happy that James Gunn is writing a Superman film. I’ve loved almost all of his films and if he puts the same heart into Superman that he does in the Guardians films, I’m all in!
Gunn’s Superman was being written before Cavills return was anywhere in sight. His movie never involved Cavill because of that, so we really can’t blame Gunn here. Cavill got screwed, yeah. I’m sure they knew about Gunns script but didn’t want to go with it yet because they didn’t know where they’d take the universe. Maybe they would’ve gone with continuing what black Adam set up and that’s why they ok’d it after saying no. And when that failed, they went with Gunns plans. I get the frustration, but this has more to do with the old regime and Rocky than anyone else. If he was never brought back, this wouldn’t be such a problem.
They let that man suit up, go on camera, and help set things up for the next movie in the end credit scene. That's what end credit scenes are for. WB's not innocent. They did him dirty. Doesn't matter that it was promises made by the old regime. The optics are that they're all under the same WB banner. Cavill should have gotten those promises in a written contract. That was his mistake and why he fired his manager.
yup bc he’s dumb as a bag of rocks and the rock set him up too but let’s all hate gunn bc he wants a more hopeful superman
He still got paid it's all good
All blame goes to Dwayne, he knew his movie was ass and wanted to add Henry to save his own ass.
Thats why Henry fired his agent which is Dwaynes wife.
Dwayne and the 7 bucks team have very nefarious ways of taking control over projects. There's multiple accounts of how things happened so can't confirm what's true or not but the likelihood they saw the $$ signs in being the leading production team behind the whole DC universe and were taking steps to achieve that without going through the proper channels....
Sounds like they got Cavill to do the Black Adam cameo because Rock wouldn’t stop begging for it, and then there was likely internal confusion/miscommunication because WB was still an organizational trainwreck at that point, some executive heard Gunn was writing a new Superman project, assumed it was for Cavill since he was appearing in Black Adam and allegedly shot scenes for Flash, and then mistakenly gave Henry the go-ahead to make the announcement. All leading to the extremely believable scenario of James staring at the announcement on his phone in shock saying “ohhhhh shit this awkward.”
I don't think Henry Cavill got hosed by any one person, nor was it a conspiracy. I think the chips didn't fall where they needed to. It's DC's biggest property and as much as I love Man of Steel, and BvS (extended) was fairly good, it just didn't do what it needed to. And by ZSJL, which I adore, it was just too late. Not to mention the shit show that was DC/WB at that time, and even until just recently. Mismanagement, incompetence, and a clear lack of knowing what they were doing sounds pretty on brand. Unfortunate to not get another Cavill Superman, but I am really excited for his Warhammer project.
Henry Cavill fans just don't want to accept that the only people who care if he's back are the hardcore fans.
General audiences dgaf if he comes back. The character was not popular with wide audiences and no one outside of the core fan base cared
Yeah, it kind of comes back to all the Zack Snyder fans who were nowhere to be seen until Warner Bros. showed him the door. Hey, I loved Henry Cavill as superman to, and I am also one of these people that believes man of steel is the greatest superman movie we’ve ever God I love that movie. I went out to see it opening weekend but unfortunately not a whole lot of other people did. Where were all the Zack Snyder fans win man of steel came out? And then they all made fun of Batman V superman for a full year after it came out. Every DC group on social media on a weekly basis had multiple memes making fun of the “Martha “ scene. Yeah they let Zack Snyder go because the fans let warner brothers know they didn’t care for the first two movies they didn’t care about Henry Cavill or Ben Affleck. Some of us did but the majority of people did not. I love both Henry and Ben in those rolls but people forget the whole reason that they were trying to change things up by the time justice league kit theaters was because the first two Zack Snyder DC movies weren’t really receive that well. Now today years after those movies were in theaters you would think they were the two biggest comic book movies ever the way some people act.
I’m a DC diehard fan but there’s a lot of people in the DC fan base that need to learn they need to show up and support these actors and the movies there in when they’re in theaters instead of waiting two or three years later to decide how much they really love them.
💯
@@haz7461 I think that’s how most people without an existing biased into aren’t your typical online comic book fans feel about it. I like DC and marvel but I’m a much bigger fan of DC and I know DC has a universe that would totally kick ass on the big screen.
Do you have individual movies by Superman , Batman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern , Flash, Green Arrow, Aquaman etc. which would lead to a justice league, movie and green lantern, corps movies, to do big stories, like infinite crisis or final crisis or black as night on the big screen would be awesome. But we’re never going to get there win the foundation of the shared universe, would have such a rocky foundation with the way it is right now.
There are some of those DC EU movies that I really love and then songs that weren’t that good. These crazy fans that are just getting more annoying like you said or hurting things more than they’re helping things now. They don’t understand that there’s not enough diehard fans that blindly love everything in that first universe to make it successful. There was a lot of “being dark, for the sake of being dark. “ going on with some of those movies and I’m not seeing a movie can’t be dark but if it’s not done organically it kind of feels a little corny. Plus you’re missing out on ticket sales for families at that point too and I think it’s been proven. You can have really good PG-13 comic book movies. both my brothers have kids that love comic book movies but their kids aren’t allowed to watch Zack Snyders Justice league or the newest suicide squad. I understand there might be some R-rated movies in there and that’s fine but when every movie has to be so dark that it’s not bringing any happiness and you’re excluding people that’s just not good marketing. I really can’t wait to see the next couple decades of DC movies. It’ll make life better I believe.
@@bdr113080 Hi you are right
James, love you. cut down on the tweets pls
They screwed him. There's just no way around it.
They did
No they didn’t lol
The point is did DC know they were going to screw him over before they put him in Black Adam. It goes from DC being incompetent to being sinister.
John really is reaching on this one. No reports ever came out a script was being developed for the Michael B Jordan superman. Caville most likely got done dirty.
The Rock and his production company screwed Cavill. Pretty much all the evidence so far points to that being the case.
simple knowledge of the fact that multiple social media accounts for the studio, including WB itself, SHARED and PROMOTED Cavill's post announcing his official return to the role completely refutes this. Cavill then stated in his subsequent farewell post that it was the studio who told him in October to announce his return. Before Gunn announced his own Superman project wouldn't be with Henry, the internet was buzzing every day with official reports that Man of Steel 2 was greenlit, would feature Brainiac as the villain and that former producer Charles Roven was involved with the project. WB knowingly allowed this all to play out whilst simultaneously handing the reigns over to James Gunn, who they fully realized would not be using Cavill in his script. They did all this while pimping out Black Adam as the pseudo continuation of the Snyder verse with all their innuendos during the lead up to release. It's all very underhanded and you'd have to be dumb or lying to not see it. There is simply no way you can slice this without acknowledging that there was some amount of deception involved... unless of course you're john Campea & crew. The only thing Cavill can be accused of is being naive enough to publicly speak on a role that he only had a verbal, good faith agreement with a studio that couldn't stop screwing him over.
This entire backstabbing of Henry eats me up to the core, WB elites clearly do not consider the fans, and it is the fans whom they are making these movies for, I tell you James Gunn will be the most disliked guy in the moving making history, WB clearly runs their company strictly as business, they don't do these movies for us the fans, I hope fandom intervenes in this matter. Honestly, I don't see James Gunns superman making it in the Box Office. Taking out Henry from the DC universe is the biggest mistake in the history of the film industry, for professionals of such a high caliber this is disappointing Derek.
@@Andy-li2px cope
Agreed. Also consider how Gunn himself has now stated Cavill has been getting dicked around by multiple people in the industry, even Gunn knows this is true. I suspect the thing that is causing trouble to Cavill's career is that he is indeed "one of us" and doesn't like the shenanigans caused by either ideology or money meddling - so at the end of the day he doesn't play ball as much as most other actors.
Remember, it was WARNER BROS. who fired Henry Cavill, not James Gunn!
Gunn chose not to hire him
He was never fired. He was never signed onto a film. Unless he's under contract to appear in a movie he was technically never fired
He had a 3 film contract MOS, BVS and JL. His contract was over and they just didn't offer a new.
That McDonald's joke ready cracked me up🤣🤣🤣🤣 even though where I live it's REALLY expensive
It's interesting how no one is talking about the fall of JJ Abrams. At one point he was said to have a whole DC plan, and he has silently been shown the door.
That was weird. I wonder what went down. As far as I know nobody has reported on that. It was reported they have him a lot of money but then nothing came of it.
It's just part of the business. Henry Cavill has moved on and his fans should do it as well. I'm just glad DC finally has a guy on board
That’s bad business.
I disagree hard when he got hired on to to write the script either at the same time or shortly after they offered him the head of DC role because that type of thing doesn’t just land in your lap it takes months of planning and contracts. So they knew which is why people are pissed. They knew what they were doing when they screwed over Henry cavill and the fans not only that cavill himself said the studio told him to announce his return so we can assume they lied and made promises that they never intended to keep. When it comes to screwing cavill I don’t think they did it for shits and giggles. WB and now WBD has never listened to fans they have their own agendas there is a reason that the only characters 100% confirmed to be surviving the soft reboot are his characters. It shows he only cares about his projects and not what the fans want. I know people are saying that momoa, Ezra, Gadot, and Levi will probably remain as their characters but until Gunn says so that has not been 100% confirmed by anyone. That’s why fans are pissed. Because we have been pleasing and telling them what we want for years and they don’t care to listen at all to what we want.
I don't think it is accurate to say Henry just came back to admit he did the cameo....the evidence is literally in the video he released. He said there will be more to come, he said he can't say much yet but will in time. He also then went on to do a long interview where he talked about there being a new hopeful superman movie. I don't think it was a big conspiracy, but it's still a pretty awful way to treat a person.
Not to mention all of the WB socials reposted it.John just needs to admit that WB committed bad business.He’s so worried about his inside contacts that he won’t say what’s right in front of him.
@@LanceG007 louder for the people in the back...
I've said this in a few of the online circles I'm in. Gunn would have been hired way before Black Adam was ever released. And it's the WB execs stupid fault that they even put Cavil in the Black Adam post credit scene. The credit scene doesn't even make sense in the context of the films story.
Dwayne Johnson just screwed things up when he thought he could help Henry Cavill but got back fired instead.
You'd think he learned about the dangers of talking on Twitter during his Disney days.
Dwayne the one to blame and Garcia they probably told Henry to write an essay telling people that he is offered the role without knowing he's no longer superman so they can boost Black Adam box office
I loved HEnry as Superman but i completely understand why there is a new actor for the role. Henry’s Superman has had his Jimmy Olsen die, has fought Batman etc. Need a clean slate and fresh stories for DCU
Basically Henry had the unfortunate happenstance to be cast in the center of the Snyderverse.
Yeah but there are already talking about bringing old DCEU actors to reprise their roles with a clean slate. Why can't Henry get the same treatment? I guess we'll find out when Superman Legacy releases.
@@dmat606 because by the time the first superman film starts filming Caville will be in his mid 40’s and Gunn has a 10 year plan for the character. Is Caville even going to want to play Superman when he is over 50?
I agree that James Gunn talks too much on social media.
Nah, its good he’s there shutting down these stupid ass rumors.
How could they let Henry announce that he will “officially” be back if there wasn’t a contract. If there was a contract then they did indeed fire him. If they didn’t fire him then he wasn’t officially back, yet he announced that he was? It makes no sense.
the contract he signed for Black Adam probably wasn't a multi film deal. You can announce anything, don't need a contract for that.
@@alexpollock6932 but why did he say that there is more to come? Clearly there is se shenanigans.
@@dmat606 not saying no one’s at fault. He was made empty promises. It’s Hollywood, everyone’s blowing smoke
Why can't they keep Cavill's Superman as part of Elseworlds? We already have a Batman outside the DCEU. Or hell, maybe keeping that iteration alive in an animated or graphic novel format??
it’s already part of the DCEU and that will be reset in flash
Because his Superman is tied to the dceu and even if they tried to separate him and place it as elseworld, there would be no diversity given how powerful his Superman is. U can’t have two justice league level Supermen with essentially the same backstory, but market them as different things and expect them both to turn large profit. Pattinson works because he’s a large enough contrast to what the dcu batman will be, both tonally and conceptually. And as awesome as his Batman is, he’s not JL level so there’s also enough disparity in power to make both appealing in a variety of ways.
Plus, I think Gunn just doesn’t want to muddy the waters with Superman. He obviously doesn’t think cavill has the ability to portray this representation of Superman and I must be honest, if this is going to finally be the definitive Superman portrayal, then I agree with Gunn not picking up cavill. Henry seems like an awesome guy and he’s grown a lot over the years but, he’s a B level actor imo and based on his style of acting, he can’t bring the charm and nuance that we need for this Superman.
Just think how bad black adam would've been without cavill's cameo!
We've known that Dwayne went under WB orders and put Henry there in the post credit scene
lmao thank god the rock is gone bro didn’t even want to fight shazam smh
Rob’s take here is the one that makes the most sense. I’ve watched (and re-watched) his section of this several times now, and he lays out (in measured, common sense reasoning) both the timeline and the rationale behind why the chips fell where they did.
simple knowledge of the fact that multiple social media accounts for the studio, including WB itself, SHARED and PROMOTED Cavill's post announcing his official return to the role completely refutes this. Cavill then stated in his subsequent farewell post that it was the studio who told him in October to announce his return. Before Gunn announced his own Superman project wouldn't be with Henry, the internet was buzzing every day with official reports that Man of Steel 2 was greenlit, would feature Brainiac as the villain and that former producer Charles Roven was involved with the project. WB knowingly allowed this all to play out whilst simultaneously handing the reigns over to James Gunn, who they fully realized would not be using Cavill in his script. They did all this while pimping out Black Adam as the pseudo continuation of the Snyder verse with all their innuendos during the lead up to release. It's all very underhanded and you'd have to be dumb or lying to not see it. There is simply no way you can slice this without acknowledging that there was some amount of deception involved... unless of course you're john Campea & crew. The only thing Cavill can be accused of is being naive enough to publicly speak on a role that he only had a verbal, good faith agreement with a studio that couldn't stop screwing him over.
@@derekwaters8683 Henry Cavill DID return to the role...for one movie. For one post-credits scene at the end of "Black Adam." That's not a lie. That's not a conspiracy. It happened. We all saw it. But facts are facts. Henry Cavill never had a contract for more films after "Black Adam." WB never announced that a contract was in place for Henry Cavill. WB never announced that "Man of Steel 2" was happening.
Because it wasn't. They just gave out this vague sense that Cavill was back in the role with no real specificity of what that meant. And yeah, I'm sure it was probably to try to drive up hype for "Black Adam." And you know what? That wasn't a lie.
I know a lot of people are disappointed that DC isn't moving forward with Cavill. I really enjoyed him as Superman. But if I were him, I wouldn't have agreed to announce sh-- unless I had a signed contract in my hand.
@@derekwaters8683 "the internet was buzzing every day with official reports that Man of Steel 2 was greenlit"
No, that's not true. The internet was buzzing with reports that they were LOOKING FOR WRITERS. That's not the same thing. In fact, it's not even close. WB actually HIRED a writer who completed a screenplay for "Batman Beyond" starring Michael Keaton, and that movie never even got greenlit. Michael Keaton had no contract (that we know of). All that means is that someone was paid to write a script, the studio read it and said, "Eh, no thanks."
And, in this case, they didn't even get that far. They were *LOOKING* for writers. That means the actual *WRITERS* didn't even have a contract (much less Henry Cavill). And the studio didn't "announce" this. The internet did.
I'm sorry this didn't work out, but this is not a conspiracy. This is just business as usual in Hollywood. Studio offices are practically filled with screenplays that are commissioned but never see the light of day.
It sucks, but it's true.
The only thing that doesn't sit right with me is, that why would you make him announce it and make a fool out of himself? You made him announce it for a 2 second cameo? That is not what Henry said in his post. He said I'm back as Superman. Back for what 2 seconds??
@@k-slate3588 L take read my other reply to you
Henry Cavill is a dude that wouldn't use tongue during kissing scenes with Amy Fking Adams because it was unprofessional..... if he wanted to fire Garcia, he would have just fired Garcia. Facepalm
@@derekwaters8683 I'm pretty sure most actors don't tongue kiss each other in movies. Unless it's consentual, it's not supposed to be a real kiss. Any actor would get a pretty bad rep and likely miss out on a lot of good roles if they did this.
James Gunn can say write the narrative as he sees fit due to being in charge of new-DCEU. If Henry spoke out against this, he'd be ruining his reputation, find it a lot harder to land roles etc.
Gunn obviously knows more than he has shared, he doesn't want to point out specific people. He said the prior regime dicked Henry around and it's clear they did. Since he and Safran are running this ship now I'm expecting better management
Safran has been around from jump and also it was David Zaslav who brought him back and he’s still the top guy.It’s ok to admit that WB and DC are still the shit show they’ve always been.We were told we weren’t getting multiple Batman and look how quickly that changed
@@LanceG007 idk how much Safran had in the Cavill/black adam movie. If zaslav was there than it's him that people should be upset with. Gunn was hired to write a story and then became the head at the studio so he isn't obligated to have anyone else other than his picks to be in the movies. Now there is a clear chain of command so let's see how this goes
I can say I only went to see Black Adam in theatres cuz I heard Superman was in it
What does it feel like to be duped like a sap?
04:05
I don't wanna be an instigator or anything but WB hired a trailer company to re edit suicide squad, and they also thought that the BOP Was going to be a good idea, they decided to release a cut of the JL that THEY KNEW IT SUCKED... and the list can go on and on. So I really don't think it's crazy that they thought that just a Henry Cavill cameo in Black Adam would help the box office
Black Adam was 15 yrs too late, Rock looked old and tired in that film.
I don't think there's a conspiracy here and I don't think that some people made efforts to screw Henry over. BUT I do believe that there were LACK of efforts to be straight here. If James Gunn was already writing a Superman story at least six months ago and if the people at WB were aware that then what they should've done is to approach directly to Henry or his manager and have an honest and no BS conversation behind closed doors so he could've been more aware of what was going on and have clearer idea of what his chances of coming back actually were. Would Henry ever agreed to shot his cameo in Black Adam if he knew that a new script without him in mind was being written?? I don't think so, and it seems to me that blaming the poor results of the box office in black adam is just an awful excuse. Henry and The Rock should've been AWARE of the fact that someone else developing a script, and they weren't. That's on WB and their LACK of honesty they tend to have with the talent they work with
I Said this last week James Gunn needs to chill with all this social media. We don't need a play by play in 2023 the new DC doesn’t start until 2025, sir focus on the studio and get back to us at the end of the year
COMMANDMENT #1 of movie discussion channel: Thou shalt not talketh shit of WB and get screenings taken away.
*WB totally lied to Cavill.
I fucking died at John’s THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY!!!! 🤣🤣🤣
Whole things is a mess and it started in 2017 with Josstice League, WB listening to the haters and critics and panicking. They did the same thing to Donner after superman 2 so he left and the franchise plummeted, done it to Burton after Batman Returns and then schumachers run crippled the franchise, tried to capture lightning in a bottle with Singer and a superman movie made specifically for the reeve fans and critics in 2006....it bombed hard and then done it again to Snyder after BvS and brought that goof Whedon on for JL to appease the haters, critics and the result it failed.
Do I have faith in gunn? with some of his projects sure, I am buzzing for Mangolds Horror Swamp Thing, an R-rate Supergirl:Woman Of Tomorrow, possibly affleck directing Brave And The Bold BUT I am 50/50 on Superman Legacy, I hope its good I really do but even with gunns updates I am still not convinced.
Am I gutted for Cavil absolutely and I wish he had more movies and cameos, maybe in the future I dont know, but I have 3 awesome films with him as superman in MOS, BvS UE and ZSJL not to mention the awesome cameo on BA.
I also understand gunn wanting to put his own stamp on a superman project like every director does when doing a super hero movie or TV show, time will tell with me and I have to wait and see.
Truth!!!!
@@TheWormwoodComets yep
They screwed him. They told Henry one thing, and did another.
A couple of executives with no power lied to him. The people in charge with real power didn't lie to him.
@@AM-dk3wy I completely agree. The success of Black Adam shouldn’t have determined HC’s fate.
@@Dru2037 The whole situation with HC was a complete mess. No respect for the actor in this situation.
I think the first mistake was thinking that Black Adam was going to pull in a billion under most circumstances regardless of who was playing him, it's Black Adam , the problem with the previous management is that they green lit B list and C list characters that don't draw without a plan for the A listers , Black Adam should never been given the green light ahead of a Superman or DCEU Batman film, average movie goers just dont care about the under card without them in play
Guardians 3 trailer looks so damn good. Losing James Gunn in MCU is a big loss. MCU would be so much better with him helping to build it.
I'm not even a fan of his Superman (I think it's always story over actors) but they really did him dirty and Gunn constantly rubbing it in is starting to get ridiculous.
If DC have announced a release date for Suoerman, then they have been planning it for a long time. Movies, especially something as expensive or as complex and as SFX and design heavy as a Superman movie, take years to make.
You guys have your heads in the sand with this one lol
Do a majority of fans really believe dc can't find a better superman than caville? I want to see someone new already and I think the best time to rip the band aid off is during this transition. This is really just a companion piece to old news we should have already digested over a month ago
Now I see why he fired his management. It was never going to happen and he’s doing black Adam scenes
A lot of people did go see black Adam, because they knew superman was going to be in it, and I am one of them. So who knows how much less the box office would’ve been if no one knew Henry Cavill was in it. At the same time many of the Henry Cavill fans act like a man of steel made $2 billion. It made 600 million that’s it and that’s not even a lot in ticket sales compared to the movies back in the days with smaller ticket prices. I did like Henry Cavill a lot but it’s time to move on. If you think Henry Cavill is hard to move on from imagine being back in the days and Christopher Reeves was no longer Superman.
Exactly. Not to mention, BvS only made $850M when it should’ve made well over $1Bn, and then Justice League made $200M less than BvS, and Henry played Superman in it.
I also doubt ZSJL brought in that many subscribers for HBOMax either. And as you mentioned, we all know how Black Adam did.
The fact is, there’s literally no proof a Henry Cavill led Superman movie would do well at all. A clean break is exactly what needed to happen.
Wasn't there an article late last year amid Black Adam that one source said that its a "Wild West" at WB with all the projects being in development
That what happen when you have to many cooks in the kitchen.
In my opinion Tyler Hoechlin is the best Superman and Clark Kent. Both are equally important. And I’m glad James is as active as he is on Twitter. It’s not his fault fanbases can’t handle the truth.
This looks like they were actually never going to make Henry Cavil Superman movies and instead only use him the same way they're doing with Ben Affleck. And the solo superman movies would be like how mat reeves batman is. Which is probably why he's younger.
Hmm that makes some sense but why not have him in The Flash instead of Cara?
Black Adam's marketing, especially towards the end, was so desperate. It was essentially "come see our movie, we have Cavill as Superman...please, PLEASE!".
They knew they had a turd in their hands and they tried to salvage that turd by slapping Cavill on it. And they failed.
Henry Cavill should go to the MCU & cast him as Hyperion
Way too active on social media 💯
Rob:"Next movie we're fighting"🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
lmaoooo the road map. a 1 mile road.
That still has nothing to do with James Gunn. Anyone saying it's his fault is not listening to what happened.
💯
If Henry Cavill SuperMan Was In The Movie For 5 Mins Or More Not Just 2 Second Post Credit Scene Cameo The Movie Would Have Made More Money At BO.
not as much, be fr bvs had the trinity and didn’t hit a billion
They screwed him period
No Snyder and The Rock did.
How about showing some love for the Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur series. 🦕
The amount of hoops that John does for James Gunn is legitimately impressive.They screwed Henry and the moment Black didn’t do big numbers they pulled the plug even they they didn’t get a china release which I still didn’t understand.But please knock it off with these excuses for Gunn.They snaked him plain and simple
Even if they did fuck him over, what does that have to do with Gunn?
@@Pietothesky Gunn fired him knowing that he never wanted Henry ever as his Superman.All these other things he’s saying is irrelevant to the overall point which is he just doesn’t like Henry as Superman and should just be man enough to say that
@@LanceG007 i don't see how this puts James Gunn at fault. He was not the one who told Henry he was coming back. Some other executive did, probably David Zaslav. Gunn was made incharge of the DCU and he wanted to do things his way. I don't think you should blame him for the incompetency and idiocy of another.
@K-Slate I don't think WB would let him do that, incompetent as they are, I don't think they would let him do PR suicide on their behalf just for some engagement.
@@k-slate3588 simple knowledge of the fact that multiple social media accounts for the studio, including WB itself, SHARED and PROMOTED Cavill's post announcing his official return to the role completely refutes this. Cavill then stated in his subsequent farewell post that it was the studio who told him in October to announce his return. Before Gunn announced his own Superman project wouldn't be with Henry, the internet was buzzing every day with official reports that Man of Steel 2 was greenlit, would feature Brainiac as the villain and that former producer Charles Roven was involved with the project. WB knowingly allowed this all to play out whilst simultaneously handing the reigns over to James Gunn, who they fully realized would not be using Cavill in his script. They did all this while pimping out Black Adam as the pseudo continuation of the Snyder verse with all their innuendos during the lead up to release. It's all very underhanded and you'd have to be dumb or lying to not see it. There is simply no way you can slice this without acknowledging that there was some amount of deception involved... unless of course you're john Campea & crew. The only thing Cavill can be accused of is being naive enough to publicly speak on a role that he only had a verbal, good faith agreement with a studio that couldn't stop screwing him over.
This is what happens when there's too many cooks in the kitchen and they arent clearly communicating with each other. We know that dywane johnson pushed hard for cavill coz he wanted the movie where cavill and him goes up against each other. Then when gunn came in as the new head at DC studios he ripped up those plans to start afresh.
I think it's important to remember that Cavill said he was coming back as superman; not that there were any plans for Man of Steel 2. Had Black Adam been successful, it would have been hard for Gunn and Zaslav to not greenlight a Elseworld sequel, given the Rock's influence in Hollywood. Zaslav is directly responsible to WBD's investors after all, and they doubtless wouldn't have been happy with DC just cancelling a successful series with a bankable star. It's the exact same reason Joker and The Batman Part II are still going forward; those specific versions of those charachters are just too popular to abandon. And it was pretty clear that Black Adam 2 was going to feature a Black Adam vs Superman conflict. But then Black Adam flopped, and Gunn/Zaslav saw no reason to continue. Superman: Legacy was always planned to be the next solo Superman film.
I agree with what you're saying, but MAN... that post credits had so many cheers from the people that DID watch it (I went a few times). WB would've been way better off PR-wise without that cameo. They should've been a lot more straightforward.
Black Adam 2 could have easily been under the new Elseworlds brand.
For what reason would they make a second one, when the first one didn't make money? XD
Nobody even asked for a black Adam movie in the first place 😂
“McDonalds” 😂😂😂😂😂
That was hilarious 😂😂 out of no way
First Brandon Routh
Now Henry Cavill
Who’s next
John is playing a little coy with the notion that they wouldn’t do something like that. John’s smarter than this
I agree with rob's comments, I think this has more to do with the rock's aspirations of taking over dc with black adam, his ex wife (sorry can't remember her name) used to both of thier agent, after this kerfuffle Henry switched agents... coincidence??? I think not, I think it was DJ counting his chickens b4 they were hatched, and Henry just got caught in the crossfire.
The Rock is the one to blame
John’s first argument isn’t fully valid, if they believed Black Adam would flop they could’ve used Henry to sell as many tickets as possible, not necessarily to make it “successful”, they could’ve believed Henry would make the movie sell better but not necessarily think Henry could be successful in his own franchise
My guess is that this started as a contingency by Zaslav in case Black Adam failed. Gunn would’ve been into negotiations to become the head of the restructured DC Studios at this point, which is why he took on writing responsibilities. It’s also why nobody else at WB would’ve known about it because all this was happening at the highest levels. Since Zaslav’s instinct ended up being correct, they pushed full steam ahead on this script that wouldn’t have otherwise gone forward had Black Adam been successful. All this goes to show that you should see the next few DC movies if you want more because I’m sure they’re lining up reboots for all of those films should they underperform.
I wish Dwayne Johnson would have lobbied WB for Henry Cavill as a co-star (vs cameo). Maybe a more featured Superman role would have led to a better Black Adam script & movie and better box office? Having Supes in the flick would have pushed Black Adam more villainous, which in my POV was sorely needed. Who knows? Maybe that would have given Henry a better chance to stay on?
Everything else aside, I would love to see Jon Hamm play an elseworlds, Kindom Come Superman if they ever do it.
The amount of disrespect......... frog leaping Routh, Cavill & Tom Welling for the KC role in exchange for Jon Fking Hamm....
Hey McDonald’s is expensive now
cant cavill exist in elseworlds?
YOu doN#t make a 200 million dollar movie just to keep an actor
I’ll start by saying I liked Cavill’s portrayal. But the fact that those movies didn’t become some of the most dominant ever, is an indication that something was terribly wrong. Not the forum to discuss this but a reset is the only hope they have of future dominance…. Which it should be. This is Batman, Superman, Wonderwoman and Aquaman for goodness sake. How do you f___ that up as hard as they did?
lmao just like u i’m everywhere but superman fans want that boy scout superman that gives people hope🤷🏾♂️ idk what to tell u man
Honestly this is stupid. Gunn should jus not respond on Twitter…nor should they announce projects too far in advance if they ride on a different movies making a billion. WB should’ve brought back cavil, they didn’t. They brought in Gunn and he wouldn’t go back even though by then black Adam was shot. I do think plans changed and personally I hate this. Gunn just be quiet til movies are released..
John you're working awfully hard to defend a company that clearly screwed Cavill over. Everybody in management had to know that Gunn's movie was not for Henry Cavill but they paid him to film 2 cameos and had him publicly announce his return anyway...lying to him and all of us. I call that despicable and the blame goes on all of them as far as I'm concerned. Gunn could have been honest from the beginning and I guess he got tired of taking all the heat and decided to throw everyone under the bus with him but at least we know the truth now
I’m sure they knew, yes. But it’s worth noting that Gunns Superman movie was being written before Cavills return was anywhere in sight. His movie never involved Cavill in the first place because this was before a DCU or Cavills return was a thing, so I still don’t think he should get the blame here.
I equally blame Cavill and his agent for pitching his return so hard without any actual future projects in writing aside from the cameo that Dwayne Johnson campaigned so hard to the WB executives.
@Kwami Verser We will have to agree to disagree because you can't tell me that they were planning to make 2 or 3 different Superman movies at the same time... If they weren't gonna use Cavill they should have never brought him back to do the cameos and then told him to go publicly announce his return... I still maintain that's despicable because they lied to him and to all of us.
@@craigwhitley1529 you know that studios do that all the time right? They were writing a reboot for Spider-Man while they were working on Spider-Man 4, same with JJ's Superman Flyby and Batman Vs Superman in the early 2000's. And not only that but there was no contractual agreement with Cavill only a verbal one and that wasn't even with the head of WB if I recall correctly. If you want to blame someone blame the Rock for that.
@Quetzalcoatl Yes, I know they do it all the time, and I still think it's despicable. Having him film cameos for both Black Adam and the Flash to then reverse course is bad enough but to have him publicly announce his return when they knew Gunn was writing an entirely different movie and that they certainly wouldn't be putting multiple Superman movies in production at once, is just wrong IMO. A verbal agreement is binding, but Cavill would obviously never sue the studio even if he were advised to do so because he might want to work with Warner brothers at some point in the future... Plus contracts aren't usually signed until a script has been agreed upon and they know how many appearances they want the actor to make so while I agree Henry should have gotten something in writing it would have actually been premature given the way the business typically works. I just think it's a horrible look for a studio that already has a lot of the fan base angry about the whole reboot idea to begin with but me being upset isn't gonna change anything. I'm just expressing my opinion.
They said from beginning they were not going to have multiple Batman's etc. They have Gunns version and Cavill and the black superman is still being written. It doesn't have to be contiguous. Where is the connection and continuity? At the end of the Flash will we be given a new Flash and after seeing a Supergirl there might be a new Supergirl in the woman of tomorrow. Talk about not knowing what you are doing. This is not looking after the brand.
Or WB thought all these Cavil lovers would come out the wood work to see that side show that Black Adam
I thought it was obvious that he was hired to write Superman months before he took over DC. When he announced it on Twitter, he mentioned that he had been working on it “for awhile.” When this started getting in headlines, I was surprised by it being breaking news.
11:48 Rob, people saying "blank will be what blank want" is literally how this stuff ends up so polarizing.
TWD and lying marvel James Gunn screwed Henry cavill Superman and Henry cavill doesn’t deserves this embarrassment after he announced he is coming back to be Superman again! This is why I will never support TWD again! This is disgusting!
@@AnointedFlow the more lying marvel James Gunn open his mouth, the more disgusting and lying and disrespectful and hurtful to Henry cavill! But most of all to the fans who are faithful to marvel James Gunn and was thinking that he’s going to rebooting from scratch and the only reason he fired Henry cavill Superman is he’s going to a younger Superman. But now things are starting coming out from his own mouth and it’s starting to smells like a dead rat! Disgusting!
the more that is revealed about this situation, the worse it gets. its clear wb hasnt changed one bit, and it worries me for the future of the dcu. i really think if superman legacy doesnt live up to expectations, this whole thing will unravel again. they really should stop talking about it, because the more they reveal the more people its pissing off, and could potentially hurt the future.
I trust James Gunn, I’ll wait to see what’s coming. We haven’t even got a trailer or nothing. People need to move pass this already. If superman was so good then why his movies were a 60 on the rating 🤷♀️
@john campa you got a scammer who just contacted me 😂
Lol
Those if not some of the samw executives askew why superman didn't just return to krypton when he got older during MoS 🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️🤷🏾♂️
This is just like the amazing spider-man all over again. If you guys overwhelmingly love Henry's movie, then Batman V Superman and Justice League should bust the box office some more than it did. If anyone is to blame, it's not Gunn for sure.
This is why I keep saying that all 3 Cavill Superman fans won't have much effect on the box office
For the love of God, can everyone just move on? There is a new universe being built on the scraps of the last one. The last wasn't any success, so let's not act otherwise. I do love Henry's superman, but I love Superman isn't just Henry! Superman is Superman, let's enjoy what is to come and I'm happy that the person on top of it all knows his comics!
Well said.
@@garretmc494 grateful*
@@garretmc494 if Thanos saw the first suicide squad I would be rooting for that blood to shed!
Damn Warner Brothers Discovery for not making a Man of Steel Trilogy when they had the chance
Too much damage has been done. I would've moved off him myself.
@@trevonpernell0814 Henry Cavill will always be the Best Superman ever all these Haters that's why the DCEU died because people criticize movies too much they can't appreciate a good movie that's what's wrong with the World today
@juanmata9814 'They can't appreciate good movies.'
Tell that to The Dark Knight Trilogy, Avengers, Infinity War and so on.
@@trevonpernell0814 you see my point? Well the Haters can go straight to Hell for hating on Best Superhero movies ever made
We already had a Peace Maker Superman. It's called Brightburn lol
But it's not gonna serve the new DCEU. Without him it's just sounds dumb af
The question will be answered. People will talk.
Talk about beating a dead horse.
As much as I’m not a fan of James Gunn running the show, but I do think he should off just stay of social media.
nah just don’t respond to everyone
@@Wolfhunter5607 agreed I should of just said that 🤣
Henry Cavill as Dr Doom?!
Eh, I hope not ... I've always found Cavil's acting to be kind of wooden. Can you really see him doing Doom's Latverian accent?
He just can't win huh?
Fans blame Gunn for bring him back for more movies just to then fire him. There was never a plan to move on Without him, he's lying about that
Now they are mad at him For It always being the plan to move on with a new Superman. After Black Adam?
"McDonald's" 🤣
Here we are have a man who is willing and still able and thankfully still with us to play the man of steel. Henry wants it we want it, It's basically clear cut but obviously to me that WB continues to make difficult. Henry cavill is the Superman we need Period