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WHY WE WILL NEVER BUY PYLONTECH AGAIN
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- čas přidán 8. 10. 2022
- Our off grid solar power system includes 7x Pylontech US3000C batteries, along with Victron Quattro inverter, MPPTs and Cerbo GX. Ever since installing our DIY system, we have had multiple internal failure alarms when the batteries drop below 70%. In this video, we give an update on our investigations using Battery View, as well as our communications with Pylontech and our supplier.
(Please note we are not professional installers and any videos on our solar power system are 'what we did' videos rather than 'how to' videos.)
SERVTEC Diagnostic Console Cable Pylontech US2000, US3000, US5000 Battery View:
www.ebay.co.uk...
Answers to FAQs:
How much did your solar power system cost?
• HOW MUCH DOES SOLAR PO...
How did your solar power system perform in winter?
• SOLAR IN UK WINTER: Ho...
How long will it be before your system has paid for itself?
• DOES SOLAR POWER PAY F...
How did you install the system?
• OFF GRID SOLAR SYSTEM ...
What fuses did you use when fusing the Pylontech US3000C batteries?
• FUSING PYLONTECH BATTE...
How does your solar power system perform in winter?
• SOLAR POWER IN WINTER ...
How did you wire the panels in series parallel?
• WIRING SOLAR PANELS IN...
What is the Pylontech warranty like?
• PYLONTECH BATTERIES: U...
What appliances can you run on your solar power system?
• WHAT APPLIANCES CAN YO...
How did you update the firmware and settings on the Quattro 48V 10KVA Charger Inverter?
• VICTRON QUATTRO SET UP...
How did you install the solar panels?
• OFF GRID SOLAR PANEL I...
What does your solar power system generate in winter?
• SOLAR IN UK WINTER: Wh...
Do you have lightening protection?
• TOO LATE? Installing l...
Thanks for watching!
Fraser, Rachael, Grace and Albie
The Off Grid Family
Friendly reminder to all people reading:
First thing you do when buying a LiFePO4 battery pack is fully charge them. "Top Balance" is the term that refers to charging every cell to 100% thus balancing them.
Then there is the problem with current sharing. The cabling going to each individual battery pack must be equal, thus having the same resistance. Only then will every pack give you the same current, otherwise one pack will be overloaded.
I have been selling and using those same batteries for years now, and have had great luck with them, in my experience Pylontech has been super to deal with. I have used other brands and have had way more issues than Pylontech. Your dealer should have given you more help and replaced or repaired any faulty batteries straight away.
No product is perfect, it's how the dealer supports the customer when issues arise. Pylontech has always had my back whenever we have encountered any issues.
In my experience it is normal for the manufacturer to not talk to the customer, that is the dealers responsibility.
Bullshit!
I have 2 of the US3000C since March this year, and i recognized the same error as you, but less often. In my case regulary after 2-3 days i got this internal error in the middle of the night. After a lot of reading i found the suggesting of doing a firmware update, here from 1.3 (installed) to 1.4. I did that (with battery view, a version from pylontechs facebook user group) in May this year, and since this time i had around 75 cycles without any problem. For me this was the solution. Fingers cross.
I was going to buy a few 5000s but now no way, terrible customer service, apparently crappy batteries!
Hey mate, Can U tell me what group is it?
Recently bought a US5000 and 3 weeks in the alarm goes off Every time I try to turn on. I am living with a gerator currently. Thanks, best regards.
Thanks for the update 👍. I hope Pylontech realise how damaging this is to their brand. They were no1 on my list for battery when I hopefully I refurb my house in the next couple of years and fit solar and battery storage. But I'm going to avoid them like the plague now.
Glad to hear the video has been useful ☺️ All the best with your future system 👍
Me too. I am discussing now with SOK which are similar price and their service so far is good. I have watched a few teardowns of the SOK batteries and they are very modular and solid construction.
I have only looked at a few of your videos but in my opinion your presentation and information content are exceptional. Chris, UK.
I’m glad you’ve called them out on this, so many CZcamsrs (the biggest on here) never really use the products on a daily basis and will skip to the next freebie they’re offered for review unlike us having to buy these products for daily use with our own hard earned money!
I had Bluetti power oak Ac200p and the first model was faulty and and exchanged with what i can only describe as a return reboxed and sent out as a replacement last year! They didnt answer emails, they tried blaming me despite giving evidence and if i mentioned anything on the socials I would have other “customers” attack me! Turns out from my investigations Bluetti pay staff to pretend to be customers and big up the products online 😂 Not unique to just Bluetti either when you start to look at these battery suppliers (jackery, renogy and Bluetti all employ fake profiles to rave and down play genuine complaints! I eventually got a full refund but they made me wait months for it and rarely replied to emails and even threatened to charge me a refund handling fee! You couldn’t make it up! My advice to anyone purchasing battery’s from anyone is pay on your credit card! Regardless of where they’re shipped from complaints are dealt with back in the mother land and they do not want to refund or accept responsibility for their faulty products! They’ll offer you the earth to buy these battery’s and ignore you once they have the money!
Really sorry to see you’ve had these issues, I help people with electrical installs and one thing I can say is most warranties for batteries isn’t worth the paper it’s written on, after speaking with suppliers directly the moment you mention warranty they get into the cycles, the type of use, blame the install, installer.. it sounds good saying you have 10 years when someone’s investing £8,000 into batteries but after your statutory rights run out the ball is fully in their court. Thanks for uploading this.
Nice to see both the ups and downs of off grid! A real view into your world. Much appreciated
Thank you, we are glad you enjoyed the video ☺️
Thanks for taking the hit to provide folks with the info guys. Hope things all work out.
Thanks for your comment and kind wishes ☺️ We are glad you found the video useful 👍
Hi guys. Sorry you are having problems. I've been using these batteries longer than most and have not really had any problems myself. From what I can see of your system you have it configured correctly. Yes there are some minor changes could be made but none of them should cause the issues you've been seeing. You are quite right to be angry. Your supplier should have replaced that first battery that never worked straight off the bat. I think you should get some advice about UK law and what your rights are as a consumer. The battery with the errors obviously has problems, more than likely with the BMS board rather than the cells. If you've had it less than a year you may still have rights under UK law. As others have mentioned, the problem with these things from China is your limited recourse when you have issues. If Pylontech have an official UK distributor then really they should handle all the warranty claims.
Thanks Nicholas for your comment. As you know, we've been watching your videos for a long time and appreciate your input. Would be really interested to hear about the tweaks. Perhaps drop us an email if you've got time? ☺️
@@The_OffGridFamilyyour contract is with the supplier. Although you have put in a lot of effort you don’t need to. It’s clear that the batteries are not fit for purpose and therefore you have a case against them under the consumer rights act. If they give you a 10 year warrantee then that sets the amount of expected life under the act. Always but on credit card as you have the backup of the credit card company.
The problem with those type of batteries is they are generic batteries build out of a factory in China. Most likely the company that brand a m has little design input so are in effect just reseller. Not your problem though as you contract is with who you purchased them from.
Put them in a rack which has busbars. Use the same length cables to each battery.
This enables you to turn any battery off at any time for service, since the other batteries will stay on.
I have been running 8 Pylontech batteries us2000 since 2017 with our ESS system without any problems. In fact the oldest pack of two have 1564 cycles as of February 2024!
Glad to hear this 😊 Wouldn’t wish the stress on anyone!
@@The_OffGridFamily
I’m sorry about your bad experience. Perhaps I was just lucky (touch wood)!
Just a follow-up to my comment of one year ago. We ended up installing a total of 10 x Pylontech US3000C units. These are matched to 15.1kW of solar panels and 15KVA of inverters (all Victron.) We commissioned our off-grid system on the 10th Oct. 2023 and have not had as much as one second of downtime since. The batteries have excelled. One of the blessings of being in Australia, especially where we are in Australia, is the abauncance of sunshine.So far the state of charge of our batteries has never dropped below 50% after an overnight discharge and has only on three occasions failed to get to 100% by the end of the next day. This is keeping the batteries right in their "zone."
We have a US3000C, Cerbo GX and a 48V 3000 MPII inverter ... no problems whatsoever.
Thanks for the update
I really feel your pain. You should not have to deal with the manufacturer, your contract is with the supplier.
I would have put them on notice and taken them to the small claims court long ago. To leave you with this issue is not on and against UK law (I'm taking it the supplier is a UK company!)
Consumer Rights Act 2015 - The product should be 1) fit for purpose. 2) Satisfactory quality. 3) As described
If any of the above is not correct then the supplier must fix/replace it and sort out the problems.
Sorry if this is not what you want to hear, but by-passing to the manufacturer is not the way and there is not a contract between the two of you, the supplier may want or say for you to do this as it takes it out of their responsibility.
I hope what you have found so far goes well and it proves that battery pack is faulty, but doesn't that leave you minus one battery?
If so, this should be repaired or replaced by the supplier.
Please keep us updated, all the best
Thanks for your comment. The vast majority of our communication has gone through the supplier...partly because Pylontech never replied! We are on it with the supplier now and will be looking to take further steps if things aren't resolved soon 👍
Biggest problem is your supplier. I have installed over 60 US2000C batteries, and had this issue on 1 of them. Took it out of the system, contacted my suplier en got tis answer: it is a known issue with some of the batteries caused bij the build in bms. Sollution: send it back to the suplier, they get a new bms under waranty from pylontech and can change it over. Your suplier needs to fix this not you. when i install a new system, i do a stress test. Is there an error like this one, battery goes out en back to the suplier, this is their responsebility. Pylontech uses their supliers for handling the waranty, just like victron does. That is why they don't answer, they just don't have the personel to do so.
I have no problem with the batteries themselves but for whatever reason my phone will not connect to the app sometimes it does sometimes it doesn't they're telling me that it's because I have an Android phone and it's like you got to be kidding me you can't sell these damn batteries all around the world and tell everybody they have to have an iPhone and if that's the case why didn't you say so😮
how to stress test them? just bit load? and high charge currents?
Your consumer rights will be with the supplier. How they deal with the manufacturer is upto them. Like someone else said below go legal asking for money back and buy from somewhere else a different brand. I hope you get the other side of this!
Thanks for your comment and we think you might be right about the legal route ☺️
I do not know much about Pylontech but I think you can only put 6 batteries on one bank. You can split the batteries. 4 on one bank and 3 on the other bank. There are some youtube videos about that. I hope this help you
Hope you guys get things sorted
Thanks for the video and sharing experiences
Thanks for your comment ☺️ We are pleased you found it useful 👍
Your batteries should be in parallel with the positive and negative at opposite ends. Set the charge voltage to 52.4v on the victron.
@@patricklyons7683 I would also question the rj45 cables possibly faulty or to long unshielded run
Patrick, let's not forget that one of your previous posts on a different video would have resulted in us burning our barn down 🤦♀️
We focus on our own singular issue as we do not claim to be experts and are certainly not qualified to comment on other people's systems or set ups. We only share our experiences so that others can watch and make informed decisions.
We hope all goes well with your Pylontech batteries. Perhaps you would consider sharing videos of your system on CZcams in future?
Whilst we enjoy sharing our off grid life with our CZcams community, we are yet to open our doors up to anyone who watches the channel as our day to day privacy is a big part of why we moved off grid in the first place. Can't have just any old nutcase turning up 👍😁
Thanks for your comment Justin. The batteries are in parallel, and charge voltage is set to 52.4v. The reason we use four cables is because the draw of our inverter is too great for the 120A limit of one set of cables, as per manual suggest ☺️👍
@@The_OffGridFamily Can you share your victron configuration settings please? I have my own 14kwh system running with cerbo gx which is a similar setup to evpuzzle.
@@The_OffGridFamily Just to check, are the cable runs of equal length? (So from battery to the busbar)
Well you made me think twice before going down their route!
I think I will wait until the Tesla Wall starts using the LPO batteries. Not sure when that will happen! 😊
hey mate I feel for you (I'm using my daughter's youtube account here). I live off grid in New Zealand, I am also a solar installer. I have had issues with some lithium brands, haven't used pylontech, but I also doubt these 10 year warranties. Almost all lithium batteries come from China and often from the same factories. if you don't have a good distributer in your country, then it can be a nightmare dealing with Chinese companies. Although lithium has many advantages over lead technology, there is an extra layer of technology and software that adds complexity and potential issues, sometimes I wonder if it's worth it. I do still use lithium for the jobs and clients that require it, but for robust reliability and less headaches I have been using lead carbon. Bulky, heavy, more required for usable capacity, certainly the side of battery disadvantages, but zero headaches and robust long living if used correctly within D.O.D. I don't use lithium myself and I have 3 separate systems. I've been off grid for 10 years, with all of the complications in life ever increasing I don't want to rely too much on complexities and software in my batteries or overseas companies that are difficult to communicate with, let alone stripping systems down and couriering things halfway around the world. good luck mate
Apologies if you’ve already tried these ideas. Firstly, I wouldn’t even bother with that one ‘iffy’ battery that didn’t start up. Put that one in a box and try and get a replacement. Replace all communication cables (bought from another source). Start with 1-2 batteries and try and get it working 100% (use your generator more if needed). When things look stable, add 1 more battery. Let it run for some days and slowly include 1 more battery when things look stable. Have you checked that all Firmware versions match on each battery and are up to date? If you still have troubles, perhaps rollback to earlier versions of the Firmware might be a way forward.
Hope this helps
Thanks for that video. Things can go wrong, but bad cusomer services is an absolut nogo for this product category. We just did cancel our order.
Good on you. I feel your pain on this - that is crap. ... Pylontech as good as admitted it is faulty, yet they are clearly not minded to do anything about it. I have a single US5000 with an Easysolar II GX 48/3000. Only 800w of solar at the moment (small place - I wanted to start small & I have room to double it next year - just wanted to test for a bit, though early indications exceed my expectations. It was to some extent inspired by your vids, so thanks!). However, I am slightly worried about buying another battery following your experience. It was going to be my next step. I must admit mine has been perfect so far, but I can understand your point: it's all OK until it isn't. It seems as if it could be a bit of a lottery with these batteries, and the poor customer service that you have experienced now concerns me. A more general point that worries me: my supplier was excellent on delivery but contrary to my own suggestion, they advised wrongly on a cable and then when I explained it didn't work and asked if I was doing something wrong, they said "well, we're not installers, we can't advise". They advised at the point of sale though. ... So my general point is, if Victron and Pylontech refer to the supplier, but the supplier then says 'no mate, we are not installers - can't advise' - where does that leave folk? Anyway, routing for you & look forward to seeing the next instalment & hoping for some better news. Fingers crossed. Keep smiling. Rob.
Thanks for this Rob ☺️ We are so pleased that our videos have helped but even more pleased that you haven't had any issued with your battery. All the best for your next installation. There is a good chance that another us5000 would be fine, but we understand your reservations!
Great video, I was going to get a Pylontech system, no chance now, thank you
Should be a video about never buying from your supplier again. If they are selling this type of equipment to DIY users, then they should be providing sufficient support to get these systems operational for DIY users.
Great upload, I was put off by pylontech batteries by a solar installer they didn't think they were up to much, what your going through was really what i expected with Warranties on batteries.
I'd be very supprised if anyone had any joy getting any repairs done any time after the first year, and it's put me off going down the battery avenue full stop, your battery seems to be faulty and they should at least be getting it pick up and tested. Like you mention Crap Service and Battery and warranty infact what WARRANTY!!!!!!!!
Glad you found the video useful ☺️ (Sorry for the abuse you received in the other reply)
We had one that would take the system down, I made a video of the startup process showing how it would fire up then drop. PYLONTECH sent a new one and was told they would collect the old one... 7 years later I'm still waiting
To try and help others watching is. Plyontechs appears to like being charged up to 100% and staying there every few days (3-5) and then they seem reliable according to what I've read in many different places online. Some people say its to top balance bla bla bla but who knows. I would say Pylontechs are good for grid tied inverter systems but not for offgrid unless you use your generator to fully charge and hold every few days. I personally have 8xUS3000C grid tied but have not had them long enough to judge (Working at the moment but only 3 months in) I also hammer the crap out of them on a daily basis. If I was to do it again, I Would buy some basic lithium batteries and use the smart shunt with my victron setup. Thanks again for your Brilliant videos. Give it up and congrats on you addition to the family.
Simble Answer - Pylontech US2000 are only for ESS not for Offgrid, because the low Peakpower (60sec 100A by US2000c). You need more Batterys for using in Offgrid, maybe arround 30 - 40kwh capacity.
We had the same alarm issues from our pylontech batteries - we only had 2 and couldn't justify sacrificing one.
In the end, we found a post on a Victron forum where someone suggested limiting the Maximum Charge Voltage in the DVCC settings to 52v. We still had issues at this level, but reduced it to 51.7v and haven't had an error since.
For us, this was a balancing issue between the different battery packs as opposed to cells within a battery (the pylontech hardware can only balance very small amounts of current once they are largely charged). By limiting the maximum voltage, it prevents certain cells being much higher than other ones. We've now removed the limitation and it's all working fine now.
I don't know if it will help you, but figured I'd mention as it was a simple thing to try.
Thanks for this ☺️ It's tricky as the other 6 are working perfectly and are all balanced. We think it's time to send the other one away and get it looked at... if we ever get a reply!
I get what ur doing here, but 52v (3.25v/cell) is way too low to properly charge these batteries to a full charge,,,ever! I would suggest for now you try discharging the problem battery to a very low SOC and then recharge it to 52v & then slowly increase ur settings to allow sometime to absorb as you slowly bring it up to 54v-56v (3.45v-3.5v/cell), this could take some time, days even to achieve with a passive balancer, but may help to reset the cells & BMS to operate a bit better.
Lifepo4 chemistry requires a minimum of 3.375v/cell x 16 = 54v to charge each cell to 100% SOC. 3.45v/cell is probly a very good & safe area, ie: 55.2v. I believe the main problem with most of these server rack type batteries is they have a passive balancer that only shaves a very small current of about 60-120mA from the highest cell when balancing & it must be charging to balance (depending on internal settings of BMS).
Check Andy’s Off Grid Garage Australia for detailed info on lifepo4 & solar tech, he is a wizard. Hope this helps. Cheers
@@evil17 Unfortunately, you make a small mistake. The unit has only 15 cells, not 16. That’s why the voltage should be lower.
As Victron says:
My system only charges the battery to 52.4V
When DVCC is enabled, the battery (via the CAN-bms) is responsible for the charge voltage. The Pylontech battery requests a charge voltage of 53.2V. We have however found that in practice this is too high.
The Pylontech battery has 15 cells in series, so 53.2V equates to 3.55V per cell. This is very highly charged and makes the system prone to go overvoltage.
It should also be noted that a LiFePO4 cell stores very little additional energy above 3.45V.
For this reason we opted to override the BMS and cap the voltage at 52.4V. This sacrifices almost none of the capacity and greatly improves the stability of the system.
@@IPad-OG Thanks for this info, I was unaware Pylontek use only 15 cells, is there any other manufacturers using this 15 cell configuration? I guess this is another way to keep production costs down. This makes sense what u say is going on here, & yes 3.45v is the optimum voltage where a cell can be fully charged, all be it a bit slower to reach a 100% SOC, & 3.5v would help it get there a bit sooner with a little less absorption. Cheers
Very interesting. I had a fight with Ecoflow for over a period of 6 months, and finally, only my video on YT pushed them to refund me. 7 different people in Tech.Service asking the same questions, no solutions, no spare parts, no blueprints, trying to push the fault on me... Their crappy product did stop charging alone, and no way to find the transformer that was damaged, and some other parts. I went to an electronic repair shop, with Ecoflow approval, but as they did not provide any kind of support, no chance to fix it. The worse being at the end, they accepted to change the damaged product for a new one, with less capacity... After 6 months of fight, they finally did refund me, as I suggested since the beginning... Their 3 years warranty, no hassle, etc, was just bulls.it !
We have 'Give Energy' batteries, they are great & have an app so we can keep track of the stored power, highly recommended. BTW don't worry about the trolls, they have no value. Keep the faith guys, hope you are all OK xx P.S we have also just invested in a delta 2 which we charge when the solar is chucking the excess back to the grid. It adds another 1 kW to our storage & is portable with regular socket & USB ports - good as a back-up.
Ecoflow??
@@lipsee100 yes, that's right. A new model with a much higher grade battery than the smaller models have.
Thanks for your support, it's always appreciated ☺️
Funny you should say that about the Ecoflow... watch this space 👍
I don’t know how old all that kit is, but under consumer law it has to be fit for purpose, which it clearly isn’t. Contact your supplier again and refer to the relevant consumer law and tell them you’re ready to make a small claims court claim if they don’t sort the issue out promptly. That should get them listening. If not, put your money where your mouth is and file a claim.
Best of luck!
there is a known compatibility issue between US2000's and newer C version in a battery stack. C's need to be as Master, otherwise they won't talk to each other, and inverter shows "comm fault". I was told by either Pylon or Lux to change wiring on CAN cable, and it worked. But now again, I have similar problem- no communication within system; and no solution, its a DEAD END emailing both for advise. Has something changed? new firmware? anybody knows anything?
Sounds rough, so hopefully I never have to utilise their customer services. Touch wood, 2 years of using US5000 batteries and a Multiplus 2 (5kw) and not had a single alarm from the batteries, it's been faultless.
Obviously you’ve had a bad experience, both in terms of failed units and also the post sales support (which really should be via your supplier and not direct to the manufacturer). Having said that I don’t think this means that the units are bad as a design in general. I have 4 US2000c units and have charged and discharged them to 100% and 10% almost every day for the last 6 months with no alarms or issues. I do wonder if the issue that you are facing may related to compatibility of the batteries and the victron products or the fact that you have lots of cables and connections. It would only take one connection to be bad/worse than the other ones and the load in the batteries would not be evenly distributed, which could result in one or more batteries being overloaded or over current draw.
In your case where you have no grid connection to rely on the inverter to manage the load on the batteries with no backstop of a grid connection to prevent over current draw from the batteries, it’s particularly important that the inverter ensures the current draw from the batteries is evenly managed and within the capabilities of the batteries and in your case this would be around 250A (12.5KW) assuming even loading with 7 batteries in use. I know that for my inverter the batteries set the maximum charge and discharge that the inverter uses, I wonder if victron has the same control in place
I hear your cry for help. Have you resolved the warnings? Internal failure warning sounds really bad, but its just Victron's label for the raw data coming from battery. The batteries are not broken, they are working fine. I work for a Victron and Pylontech distributor for professional installers in Australia. We have resolved this minor cell balancing issue remotely many, many times. It is an easy fix 99.9% of the time. You do not need to buy any other software or hardware products. Is your Cerbo GX connected to Victron's VRM Portal? If you want, I can resolve this for you, usually in a couple minutes with system access.
Question. One of these comments say Pylontec is not good when off grid only. What is your opinion? I have a 8kva Deye with 10kva pannels with 5 x 3000c in town grid tied with no issues...need to put solar on my remote home ...totally off grid...I love the 3000c...but that other comment is concerning...your thoughts pleas5
@@johanbester4484 That comment is just rubbish. From my experience of selling and tech-supporting Pylontech and Victron over the past decade, we only ever had a handful of warranties - seriously, I think it was 5-6 battery modules from thousands of systems. From these systems, a mix of grid-connected and off-grid, but the majority off-grid. And of these off-grid systems, many are located in some of the remotest and harshest climate conditions possible. Super reliable. Nearly 99% of problems occur from incorrectly sized, programmed or installed systems. However, I continuously heard from salesmen of 'self-managed', that 'smart or comms' batteries are a risk compared to 'self-managed or dumb' lithium batteries (BMS only), but this is a smoke-screen to scare you. They do this because producing a 'smart' battery is difficult and expensive and they just don't have the technical capability or financing within their company to produce a battery with all the possible performance and safety. There are no serious scale batteries without full battery communications because it is simply too risky. Battery communications provides accurate monitoring and control of all the critical factors for charging /discharging lithium batteries. Importantly, battery comms allows the battery to automatically manage the inverter/charger for situations such as changes in temperature, or even turn off the equipment to prevent an emergency situation. Another layer of protection. Moreover, without this extra control it means that the 'useable capacity' of the dumb lithium battery must be less to accommodate the lack of fine and accurate charging/discharging - lower DoD. BUT, what if the comms cable gets damaged or falls out of the Pylontech the system will shut down, says the self-managed battery salesmen? The entire world functions on Cat 5 and 6 cable and these guys are trying to convince you that they are unreliable?? Obviously another scare tactic. Not true if set-up correctly, which is super easy with Victron. Program the Multiplus or Quattro as if there was no smart communications from the battery, like a lead battery. If comms from the Pylontech are lost (which just doesn't happen 99.999% of the time), you have a Plan B, the Cerbo GX will automatically switch back to the battery monitor inside the Multi/Quattro. Don't believe me? Just test for yourself. Set up a system and deliberately remove the comms cable from between the battery bank and the Cerbo GX while its operating. It will continue to work, but a lower level of performance - about the same as a 'self-managed' battery. The world's telecommunications function on Cat 5 and 6 cable and these guys are also trying to convince you that they are risky and unreliable - really?? Good luck with your off-grid system. Remember, if off-grid and using a hybrid inverter such as a Deye, the technology doesn't have the inverter 'current surge capacity' of a Victron, SMA Sunny Island or Selectronic with their toroidal transformers, so you should allow for more inverter and battery capacity to run devices such as pumps and electrics motors, etc that require large current to start up. I hope this helps.
What is reporting the error? I don't see a BMS... These issues are most likely comms related, the inverter is not capable of assigning so many or the actual RJ45 cables are faulty.
Edit: Typed this right before the response at 6:13
I have 8 of these batteries, touch wood has been running like a dream added two more new batteries, made the new batteries as master, had the Red danger light "Alarm", lowered the volt charge and float and they integrated with the old comfortably...
I have been looking for these, so thanks for the video, will try something else.
Not good, we also have pylons (touch wood all ok), but you should be able to return and get money back under you consumer rights. If you brought via a credit card, they will also be able to help.
Thanks for your support, we are definitely cranking up the pressure now to get this battery sorted 🤞☺️
you only need a USB console cable to connect to multisibcontrol software. it will show detail down to cell level.
Oh man! I feel your pain with this :-( you are within your right to have a replacement / refund for this unit under UK law. I would get in touch with trading standards and citizens advice if i were you.
Thanks for your comment ☺️ We really appreciate the support 👍
Interestingly on the ITS website they now have the follow *. * In accordance with Pylontech's warranty conditions. The warranty is only valid if the batteries have been installed by an electrician or authorised installer. I don't remember this line in the original paperwork.
Thanks for this video, I was going to upgrade my battery for pylontech in a few weeks, I won’t bother now.
Glad you found the video useful ☺️ We wanted to share our experiences so that others can make informed decisions 👍
have you tested your cables with a cable tester?
No its absolutely not acceptable. Can well understand your frustrations. Since you now have the USB connection and battView hooked up, might want to check if they are all on the same firmware. Yes this is the job for your supplier, whom ppl hv suggested quite rightly so that you, well, sue them. Even if you take that 1 batt out, the bank will still require a Pylon to enlarge in the future should you choose to do so. Im sure you already have, just incase, go through the pins for all LAN cables, patch ones included since they are not the regular pin positions we find in everyday LAN cables. Best of luck and keep us updated.
Thanks for your comment ☺️ We are using the cables that came with the batteries, and they're not damaged at all so should be ok. Thanks for the batteryview suggestion 👍
Thank you for posting this. I feel your frustration, just like me being annoyed by Batrim BMS people asking me money for a short call for assistance on theit € 1.100 costing BMS with failures in it.
I almost pulled the plug to order six of these for €15.000 but hearing this I will move over to a 18s2p configuration with much cheape EVE 280K cells combined with a 123SmartBMS that allows you to make exact fitting configurations in a simple way.
Combined with 3 SmartSolar 250/100 Victron chagers and 3 Multiplus2 5000/48 inverters, I can live offgrid from april to oktober and add a bit of juice from the grid from november to march.
Sadly most products from Chinese products are great until they go wrong, and then there is very little recourse. They are only interested in taking your money. As others have said I think you should take the supplier to court on the basis of goods not fit for purpose, or lasting a reasonable amount of time, especially when offered with a 10 year warranty. Assuming you purchased from a UK supplier they will covered within UK law. Good luck. I won't be buying pylontech now.
Thanks for your support. This is definitely a step for us in future although we had hoped not to have to go to court over it 😩
What I would reccomend is to try to isolate the wrong one. Start removing one battery per time and check if the error reappear. You could eirher end up finding the faulted unit and then replace it or if the error wouldnt go anywhere, it could be some communication issue, maybe even something reallt dumb like a terminating resistor faulted on the CAN bus
I've been thinking about buying 8 or 10 of these but will look for another brand now. At £1000 + a battery you should expect way more help from both supplier and manufacturer.
I know how frustration it gets when you pay good money and get crap in return so hope you get things sorted.
Thanks for your comment. We are glad you have found the video useful ☺️ All the best with your future research and project. We'd be interested to hear what you go for in the end as we are hoping to do a minibus conversion at some point and certainly won't be going down the Pylontech route, regardless of what the devout fans say 😁
I have been pushed towards these by a number of the suppliers I have had quotes from but have been pushing back mainly on the build quality I see from various you tube tear downs I have seen. This seems to confirm my initial thoughts on Pylontec. So far I have a preference for SOK slightly dearer but seem a lot better and now available in the UK, not made a final decision yet though. Thanks for this.
@@marktj1 I too have decided against Pylontech and will go with SOK.
@@gilladams8895
Hi I'm looking at solar in thnex couple of months, the installer has quoted for pylontech 5000 battery 4.8kw after reading the posts I'm reconsidering them, what are SOK.
Dont follow this guys advice. I have designed systems using 100's of them. 0 failures. I have 4 x US3000 myself and they are working just fine after 4 years of cycling. This is what happens when you DIY and dont understand LVdc. His batteries should have been in a single stack with equal cable lengths throughout.
Feel for you pal ..One thing I will say is I installed 5kw puretech .I have a software failure and reported it to them .Within 2 weeks I have a firware update sent to me and a connecting cable all free of charge and couldnt fault them
the problem with rack-batteries is always one, regardless of the brand: parallel. It is impossible to balance them with 100% certainty: in time, if it goes well you have reliability problems and the battery shuts down to safety, if it goes wrong I think you already know what happen... (the on-board electronics that control the entire system can fail, it doesn't last forever like antithing after all) There is an electrical engineer specialized both in high-power industrial implants and in PV installations (I won't mention the video because it's in Italian) who explained the matter very well and also referred to important brands (indirectly of course, without mentioning them by name ) with this issue. One can change as many products as he want, with advanced control systems and smart BMS: they will always have always problems sooner or later. With parallel problems are not a matter of "if", but only of "when" they will happen...a giant waste of money and safety risk
How can you make a storage of hundreds of kwh without parallel?? Do you build cells from a million ah as big as a palace? Or do you reach the target by bringing the voltage to thousands of volts? I don't understand what you're saying.
The parallel has cons since there is electronic management in lithium. but it cannot be avoided in large plants
Feel your pain. I have 8 x Pylontech US2000's - no problems at all for last 2 years... all good. Using a SOFAR ME3000 Inverter
This sounds like a nightmare, sorry to hear of how frustrating this all must have been. I was really tempted to purchase these batteries over the Tesla powerwall as it's much cheaper. This video has totally changed my mind on that!
I couldn't find details about the what Lithium cells are exactly inside the Tesla Powerwall but it they use the standard stuff you find typically in your EV don't install it in your house because it's a fire risk. There have been several issues with the Senec batteries (with NMC cells from LG Chem) as well as LG's own RESU batteries here in Germany this year. The problem is that with the "explosive" type one cell inside the battery pack will start a chain reaction (thermal runaway) you can't stop.
If you install a battery pack based on LiFePO4 cells there is not much that will happen....they are much safer.
Here two videos from Will Prowse were you see the difference:
The explosive type (in this case I would assume it was not the advertised type of battery cell inside that case; in the follow-up video below it is stated that in fact is was the "NMC" type you don't want to have in your house): czcams.com/video/-pu8hs6hmyk/video.html
The harmless type (with additional details): czcams.com/video/D8xNjz73p80/video.html
I have 4 bateries US2000C for about 2 years,and they work very well
We have pylontech and i must say the service you have got is just not acceptable, if it were me i would be thinking about getting a solicitor on the case, they have a bloody nerve telling you to sort out their problems - it really is as you say Crap !
Thanks for your support, we've actually been talking about getting a solicitor onboard today! Let's hope it doesn't come to that 🤞☺️
@@The_OffGridFamily I would actually like to ask you something but not on here, is there an email i can contact you on, its not regarding what your going through with your system, its something you would more than likely be able to answer me because of what and how you have set up your system
i was considering pylontech, not any more, thanks for sharing and sorry they are as much use as wingmirrors on a Submarine, im going to stick with my original plan of EVE cells and a good quality BMS, good luck fella
Thanks for the heads up, Pylontech will not be getting our money, its good in later updates you have got somewhere with them but clearly its not good enough.
Waiting to see if my Fogstar Jakipat Batteries are any good but suspect the warranty is as bad as pylontech, we will see.
Great content - thanks for the insight. Will be staying well clear of Pylontech
why are cables with different length ? Is a bad installation also for lead acid battery. for all software controlled battery is terrible.
You should know that UK Consumer Protection law says that the supplier is responsible to replace or refund a faulty appliance for up to 2 years. The Consumer does not have to deal with the manufacturer, the relationship is with the reseller.
Andy from off-grid-garage is running batteries without communication.
1) charge controllers and inverter should be set up for the correct/preferred voltages for lifepo4, and should not care about what the batteries think about the world, they should just care about the voltages they see.
2) The batteries individual BMSes should protect the batteries regardless. And that's all they should do.
3) Andy uses a victron shunt to have his victron setup keep some measure of the state of charge of the batteries.
So if the battery itself is fine, and just the bms does not like to talk to others, then your system should just work...
But yes, pylontech is crap...
Thanks for this ☺️ Our understanding is that we can't use a shunt with these batteries. We are pretty confident it isn't a communication problem now, so are pushing our supplier for a repair/replacement. The other 6 are working perfectly now that we have removed the battery in question 👍
I have nothing but problems with pylontech 2000c batteries, I wish there was an reliable alternative I would swap out my entire battery back as I cannot spend more time trying to sort out their problems
Wherever you bought it from, take it back there and make it their problem to either replace it or have it repaired in a timely manner. No point getting your knickers in a knot, you have identified the problem, now get it rectified.
Oh dear! You are not filling me with confidence. I have five pylontech US3000C units mounted, connected and ready to switch on. The last 3 units are on their way and I hope to commission them withing a fortnight. I must say that I'm dreading the moment when I power these things up. My units are all individually connected to a common busbar system. I read that I should turn them on without a load being connected and let them all balance first, then connect the load. I'll see how that goes.
Many people seem to get on very well with the new us3000C batteries so please don't lose sleep on account of our video. We are only sharing what we have experienced but you could have a completely different experience. What supplier did you use?
You're right about switching them on without a load and letting them balance first 👍☺️
@@The_OffGridFamily Hi. I'm in Australia and have used ZeroGrid as my supplier.
Call me a pedant but...
Looking at what you have installed it is not exactly a proper install job. I could not live with it myself as it looks like a spiders web. In my experience, if it looks messy that is how it will behave.
I worked on a similar system in an off grid install in Spain a couple of months back.
It went into similar type of fault and it took me 15 minutes of reading reading and 10 minutes of checking to discover a faulty comms cable. I have never even looked at solar / li ion batteries before but it is not much different to what i have worked on in industry for many years. I gave the installer a hard time for not making the comms cables properly and all has been good since
Sorry to hear of your troubles. What happened with this in the end.
Hi you are covered under the 1979 sale of goods act. First when you buy goods the contract is between you and your supplier NOT the manufacturer. The battery you bought has to be fit for purpose, which it is not. You have enough data to support a claim In a small claims court. All electrical equipment covered for a total of 6 years. You need to take your supplier to court,but first offer them the opportunity to correct the situation. It is their responsibility to rectify the situation. You bought the batteries in good faith, they were being sold as working batteries, and your supplier is responsible for selling them as working. All covered in the 1979 sale of goods act.it works the same as you buying a TV from Currys, if it goes wrong you take it back to them and it is their responsibility to sort it out. Exactly the same thing with your battery.
You will always get stupid comments wherever you post. Too many people with no idea. Assuming the firmware is the same across all of them which you can check with BatteryView. I would expect them all to be if purchase at the same time. There are two models of the 3000C but I think yours are the older ones. Lots of BS out there but they should all work together perfectly with or without link cables and BMS connection to inverter. Its a duff BMS no doubt, I would tell the supplier they need to replace it. Did you buy using a credit card just in case? There are lots of under and over voltage cell false alarm issues still going on with the new 3000C's as well and support isn't great in general.
Im building my own bank using 16 grade a eve cells using a 200amp jk bms. One of the reasons is to avoid all those kind of problems. 14+ kw for £2700.
Touche.....I hope we made the right decision! Have jumped in and have 3x 16s 304AH plus three JK's...... Did it because partly a recent test in Oz surfaced all but one well known brand battery had problems.......and it gave me some control over the components.
@@ianpope7061 nice 👍. Finished mine the other day, all top balanced etc, first night yesterday using them, and all good so far 😁
We used these in some off grid systems - but stopped years ago. They don’t perform in the cold (they just disconnect!). Although, as your system is in the house, it should not be a problem for you. The other limitation is the charge / discharge limits. They are too tight for an off grid setup (in my opinion). These are really an on grid energy storage solution - you can use for off grid - but it would not be my choice
The problem with the pylontech is probably a needed firmware update. Because of the chip shortage pylontech installed a different chip than usual. This chip sometimes creates an error. Here the video how to do the update: czcams.com/video/izZphGWnwn8/video.html
i wish i had seen your videos before ordering my us5000 :/
The fact that you have not done the first procedure given by the manufacturer, already puts you at fault, and suggests that you have probably not followed other procedures or prohibitions as well. Then it seems impossible to me that pylontech has never responded. Epever answers me in 24 hours even on questions that have nothing to do with their products.
iMoreover, the fact that you would have received a defective specimen is not a reason to define a crap company. you are right if this problem has some statistical relevance among customers.
It's the same thing I don't agree with people who try a battery 1 time, and they pontificate to everyone that it's a good product. batteries can only be judged after years of use.
Thank god I purchased a system with conventional batteries.
Unless the new equipment has its life expectancy tested multiple times then I wouldn’t spend the money.
The price of those batteries they need to be perfect from day one or a me one right away.
Coudn't agree more. It's a lot of money to spend on something that is... 'crap'!!! 😩
@@The_OffGridFamily I hope everything gets sorted out.
Thank you 😊
Hey Off Grid Family ... David Pos did a video of using bus bars rather than using the double terminals to wire them in parallel. You might want to watch his video in case it might be the solution to your alarm problems. Goodluck!
Thanks for this. We have got them wired in parallel to a bus bar but will have a look. Thanks ☺️👍
Thanks for sharing this! People need to see why buying this crap isn't worth it!
You will have a chance with the UK supplier, but if Pylontech are struggling to shift excess stock or worried about reputation I think you will struggle with China.
We are putting pressure on the supplier now. Fingers crossed 🤞☺️
Thank you dear friend for the advice. You just save me :)
was thinking of converting from wet cell, but you have made me question if these are over complicated with more to go wrong.
Anytime I have an issue with goods that don't perform I'm onto the legal people that are included with my house insurance. Sales of Goods Act would cover this with the people you bought from. PIA but needs must etc.
I have been waiting to buy lithium batteries. My feeling is that few suppliers really know this business and are fumbling in the dark. Your experiences confirms this. I will wait for a major brand with product support and warranty. Lead acid is still the most reliable in spite of limitations. GOOD Luck...
All the best with your Lithium battery purchase once you find something you are happy to commit to ☺️ We understand that it is a big investment and not an easy decision 👍
I just watched your other video about the batteries and your connections. When you showed the battery specs from the manual, the figure of 'charge /discharge' was rated at 37A. At 48V this gives a continuous rating of around 1775W. There were also two figures for around 80A of I think about 60 secs and one around 100A for I think around 15 secs. Doesn't this mean with 6 batteries, theoretically your 10kW Victron inverter should be ok, ie 1775 x 6 = 10650W?
Is it not possible to run them as dumb batteries remove all the communication cables. The batteries should then work as a basic battery if not there is a fault in one. I got basic lithium 12v batteries like a car battery and chained them together for 48v when I couldn't source a rack battery like plyontech.
Supplier issue, not a product issue. I think it's disengenuous to be crapping on a product when it's your supplier who's letting the whole experience down.
hello, do you know the settings of your solar controller?
And do you know Make the Setting? (without communication)
If so, I advise you to simply disconnect all the communication cables.
After having made the settings of your solar controller, your batteries will work normally?
At least you will have eliminated, if it comes from a communication problem, and also if only one of your batteries has a problem? can you see it?
This is what I will do to try to understand the problem??
Good luck
I am using ICC to monitor my Pylontech witch give's me induvial cell voltage in-depth logging. Maybe have a look cat it.
How are the pylontech batteries working now? Are you reassuring that you will never buy them again (and therefore preventing lots of people from buying them by watching this video?) Otherwise, you should include some update in this video to be fair.
I had a similar problem with a 3 pack of up2500, just sending them tomorow for a service check
Sorry to hear this 😩 Hope it gets sorted soon 🤞
Is your battery firmware up to date ? I have heard of US3000c errors. I run 3 x US2000b and 1 x C and they have been great for many years. `~~(touch wood) as with any batterys they need to be balanced correctly I like you were advised charged each battery up fully invidually before connecting them to the stack so that there voltage is the same. (Dip switches have to be coreect too. I use MPP 5048 solar inverter off grid no issues. Going to make a secondary system out of prismatic 280ah cells and a Daly BMS shortly once they arrive. Good luck hope you sort it out.
Also check out Will Prowse and the Off Grid Garage if you havent already.
We had a Powervault stopped working within 5 minutes of the engineer leaving I called them straight away instead of asking the engineer to return made me wait 6 days and there after it was always waiting for the next update to fix the constant crashing after 2 years we got a refund as it spent weeks comatose.
So post sale support is an issue...for others too
Oh PV efficiency was less than 60%
Only repair not replace even though its faulty dead on arrival. That is a joke from Pylontech
I have 6xUS3000 modules for 2 years using the MPP8048 inverter charger without all the other cabling and support modules you have on your wall and no issues.
I like watching for the off grid stuff yes, but I also watch this channel for the accent, not gonna lie
Hey guys, looking to buy a back up generator for the house what do you suggest?
i just bought 2 us5000 and this video has got me worried, can u tell us whats the best way to use them cos iv bought them now, had i had watched this video i would of gone withsome1 else
After ironing out the initial problems we've been okay. How are yours doing?
@The_OffGridFamily well its been 2 months and so far they have been good, but there brand new, so who nos, let's give them a fews and see what happens, but I think I might have to buy a 3rd battery so that the otherv2 last longer
@kingpolu glad to hear it’s going well so far 😊👍
Crap.....
Pay by credit card folks.
Good luck, keep the videos coming.
So many of these kinds of issues are due to design, setup and configuration. Did the DIY'er strictly follow any detailed documentation presented from both Victron and PylonTech on how to INTEGRATE their tech? Experienced installers will know what they are looking at when integrating these brands and tech and understand the issues:
czcams.com/video/TjMIbb7-u6Y/video.html
czcams.com/video/ds4X0D6zPTE/video.html
If you are a DIY'er you MUST establish a solid relationship with suppliers who are EXPERIENCED with their products and have a known reputation for great after sales advice, tips, technical and warranty support. The other thing is you can pay for an electrician who is experienced with integrating this specific technology come check, tune and "certify" your installation informally with you verbally. Someone you trust.
There are so many ways to deal with these kinds of issues without flapping around on your own.