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The New Short Barrel FN SCAR 15P
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- čas přidán 20. 01. 2023
- In this episode of TFBTV, @JamesReeves is at the FN booth to discuss the new FN SCAR 15P, the "pistol" version of the SCAR rifle with a 7.5" barrel.
According to FN: "The FN SCAR 15P in 5.56x45mm is the benchmark for reliability and versatility from a light recoiling, piston-driven platform, now configured in an ultra-compact pistol. This enduring platform enables all shooting positions, locking in any grip on the upper receiver under fire, a 7.5” barrel delivers unmatched maneuverability."
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Round of applause for James resisting the urge to yell and argue for 7 minutes
Kind of silly for some cop to be carrying around. Use a pistol, rifle or shotgun. This would over penetrate! The opposite of what cops should be doing...
@@iamgermane This is in 5.56 (at current). Patrol rifles are already very common. Overpenetration is less of a problem with 5.56 than it is with 9mm, for example, from all that I've seen. (E.g. Vigilance Elite overpenetration test)
Given it is such a short barrel, being much slower at the muzzle than is optimal for 5.56, I'm really not sure where you're coming from on this one.
👏👏👏👏
@@iamgermane Lmao pistol rounds and shotguns penetrate more than 556
@@chad9166 Only at very close range. A rifle round for an urban setting is going to over penetrate.
Look How They Massacred My Boy.
FN should concentrate on making 16" barrel FDE 16s instead of this crap.
Mah sweet baby boy what have they done
Loaf?
Yeah fr would’ve been a good idea if it was $300 less and 300blk
@@dawsoncota3845 I’d pay 300 MORE for them to do it right and make it 300 blackout. This should be an 11.5 if they’re doing it in 556.
Kudos to you James for tackling the 5.56 @ 7.5 topic head on with the FN rep. And in the end you make the key point - some commercial customer wanted it and having it available now to the public can only be a positive.
The FN marketing guys should have been a bit quicker on their feet having a statement out there like „we are reviewing a 300 BLK option“
Except the reason the original gov contracts wanted it is because they had 500,000+ rounds of 556 in inventory, thousands of magazines, thousands of bolts and spare parts for 556, and they're not buying and storing 1 million rounds of 300bo for subsonic and supersonic training and more inventory and magazines, muzzle devices, silencers, bolts...
The gov/leo industry doesn't care about terminal performance as much as logistics. They assume to have 2-10 guys shooting the same target as well so who cares if it's weaker.
@@maximusjoseppi5904 Money plus logistics. Switch to 9x19, same story.
FN offering this one to the public is like a very expensive restaurant starting to offer lunch service. Channel for leftovers, economies of scale, contribution margin. Can‘t blame them - just makes sense.
@@maximusjoseppi5904I don’t think you’re talking about the commercial market here.
@@praharin ya, sorry, meant the original contract
@@nikos6220 ya, true.
Guys this was marketed to the guy that shows up to the outdoor range, pulls out the stockless Draco from the trunk, unloads on the berm drawing all eyes and leaves as fast as he came before he misses his Discord meet for the latest COD loadout skin
...and I put a brake on it too! :-P
And thinks the gov't is listening to his Discord homies because he discusses conspiracies and KNOWS he onto something, Lizard People.
2:32 Who asked for this because of all these years, I never came across anyone who said "Gee what would make the scar sc even better? If it had no stock/brace out the box, a shittier pistol grip, same price if not more expensive, and offer it in an inferior caliber for the barrel length!".
I mean, their biggest custom is the government so it wouldn't surprise me. 🤣
"Why not release it in 300BLK?"
"Well you see the package is short and it's a short package that's short in a short package for operating in super tight tactical situations like waking up in your tighty whities in the middle of the night to find that racoon that's been digging in your trash."
"Hm."
Why not .308?
Would like to see that.
And for this racoon you don't want overpenetration, so you take 5.56 and give it the muzzle energy of .22lr.
@@texasranger24 🤣👍
@@texasranger24 that’s fudd lore.
@@TaylorWilmes it'll do around 2200ft/s and thus about 600ft.lbs of muzzle energy. More than .22lr? Sure. But a .357 revolver will have more energy from the same barrel length.
Good on James for saying what literally everyone was thinking when that thing came out!
Kind of silly for some cop to be carrying around. Use a pistol, rifle or shotgun. This would over penetrate! The opposite of what cops should be doing...
@@iamgermane 556 penetrates less than pistol/shotgun rounds
@@chad9166 No way. A rifle round will keep going long after those pistol/shotgun rounds have stopped.
Dang my boi James roasting FN to their face 😂😂
It's well deserved. FN should know better than this, we expect pointless releases from S&W 🤷🏽♂️
James looks like he is in a dazed and confused listening to the circular explanation of why they are selling a 7.5 in .223.
Perfectly late timing with brace rulings, on top of the 7.5 pipe they’ve been smoking.
Whatever they are smoking, it is out of a 7.5 inch pipe.
Why not make the barrel 3" if the compactness is paramount. You can set stuff on fire with that flash too, which is a win win.
Why not use a handgun. This is some cop's fantasy....
Kek
The short barrel isn't my biggest concern. It wasn't even registering on my radar. My biggest concern with this gun is that the price will be about $3,000 more than it should be, and FN will offer practically zero aftermarket support for it, and will void your warranty if you try to suppress or paint it.
3:13 James’s face says it all lmao. Dude got fed a spoonful of bullshit for a minute and he’s just dumbfounded.
1:34 This one killed me too.
"it's what /the customer/ wants"
Yeah. Because a 7.5" 5.56 is my idea of the ideal home defense firearm. I was as stunned as James to hear that. Just... what?
@@meatsmudge5349 ideal if you never want to hear your wife yell at you again and probably will get your neighbors seeking God again
Can't wait til this is released in 300 Blackout... In about 5 years
Maybe 10
FN is seriously out of touch with the civilian market if they thought a 7.5 inch 556 SCAR was going to get a warm welcome 😂
It’s almost useless. Cool but I see no advantage as compared to an Ak pistol.
Especially with the brace issue
@Dante's Cuckferno and the 762x39 does not lose as much power from the shorter barrel.
@@danielaramburo7648
I thought the bigger issue was proper gassing. AK’s are piston driven so it’s less of an issue.
@@SaraphDarklaw The issue is a 5.56 is fucking useless out of a barrel that short
I feel FN is always 5 to 10 years behind everyone else
Well they had the SCAR PDW 8 years ago, they just chose to be bitches and not sell to civilians.
I actually laughed at 6:00 when he said a big selling point was FDE
Calling out the COD loadout bois fresh from the Spiritus booth,frothing over a 285 dollar backpack 🗿
The FN rep literally talked in circles and didn’t answer James’s question.
I think essentially what he was trying to say was, 7.5in 556 is anemic but still faster velocity than a 5.7 p90 style weapons. They both have comparable size, but 556 ammo is cheaper. I'd never buy this though, waste of money imo
My bet is they planned on releasing it with a pistol brace but got shafted by the new ruling right before the show.
Either way, Should've come out as 300Blackout or 5.7x28.
The 5.7 in commercial loadings is worse than a 5.56 in a 7.5 platform for close shooting… until the powers to be allow us to have military ammunition.
Kind of silly for some cop to be carrying around. Use a pistol, rifle or shotgun. This would over penetrate! The opposite of what cops should be doing...
@@iamgermane The PDW concept is more of a niche thing, rather than a standard issue duty weapon. Besides, likely would be using a SP or some sort of frangible load, not M193 or the like in a PDW role.
@@iamgermane It's not for a cop to carry around while picking up doughnuts and coffee at the start of his shift. This is for protection details and other use cases where a pistol isn't enough. Also, overpenetration with 5.56 is somewhat overblown.
@@ChucksSEADnDEAD Ridiculous to use a rifle round. I guess if a department is not concerned... Look at the incident at the Dept. store in L.A. I think. Police had to shoot some guy and ended up going through him and into a lady in a dressing room. They used an M-4.
Dammnn james called em out on 556 in a 7.5 in barrel lol...i would consider this in 7.62x39 100% that would be sick
300 BLK for poors
😂
People often forget the added benefit of a flash bang. Very tactical. Very cool.
7.5 barrel, not a pistol caliber, and Im sure its gonna be more expensive than just about any other pistol on the market. This is a joke right?
😂😂
Already on the market... And it's more expensive than the overpriced rifle
It's price the same as a regular scar
To FN we’re the joke 😢
Wait to you hear about the MCX rattler
8 years to late. FN never listens to it’s customers in a timely manner.
not true this has basically been a thing for military and law enforcement for ages now, those are their customers, we civilians are the side hustle
@@MrWassup45 the non reciprocating charging handle just added to the scar last year would like to have a word with you. Cope harder for the stock a2 Gucci rifle 😂
@@zoiders Americans will spend 3500-7000 for an hk Sp5 instead because at least we can suppress it without voiding the warranty. If FN wants our money they need to make a more compelling case because despite all their other endeavors...they still want our money, otherwise they wouldn't even bother. Shill much for daddy fn 😂
@@762x69the military specified a non reciprocating charging handle.
@@praharin the military can specify a safety like they did the 320..doesn't mean it's better than the glock 17
Definitely makes more sense in something like 300 BLK
I love how James asked to real tough questions. Too many people kiss up to big brands like FN.
Oh, well--it comes with a color-coordinated discreet carry case. That makes it all better...
You don’t lose “a little bit of terminal performance” with this vs a 10” barrel, you lose A LOT! So much so that energy at the muzzle is only 10% higher than +P 9mm out of an MP5
THERE IT IS!!!! The most expensive/useless pistol on the market!! Haha 😂 somebody should tell Colion there’s a pic rail back Lol
Waiting for the incoming, "you only think that because you need to make more moneh"
Never mind if you throw on a hush cannon it's bye byes warranty ☠️
Should be a 10-13 in barrel and not be more expensive than the full size.
Given the ballistics of the 5.56 round, I have never understood a 7.5” barrel for 5.56. 300BLK makes more sense in a short barrel to me. Pretty much what JJR pointed out.
300blk hasn’t really caught on overseas like it has in the USA. 5.56 is also used for simunitions training. The 300blk version of the SCAR-SC already exists, so I’m not sure why FN didn’t bring it to the civilian market at the same time as the 5.56 version. They could at least sell it as a caliber conversion kit if not the entire firearm.
military contracts probably said "give us the shortest gun you can, keep it in the standard rifle caliber" without much care for real ballistic data. doesn't really make sense for civilians unless they're cloners, but then this isn't really close enough to be a clone.
@@IshiGoturi from what he said about it being marked multi caliber I imagine they'll be releasing 300blk barrels for it soon.
People will buy it anyway, especially if it's used in John Wick 4.
Noooooo! Fragmentation!
Those movies are awful
‘Who are we to question that??’
The consumer 😂
Kudos to James for being a real journalist. Btw Random FN Guy, I’m pretty sure they’ll sit on the shelf 😂
I forgot how many experts were online, and the comment section here was a nice reminder.
The biggest issue with the COD generation, is that ironically, they have no concept that mission drives gear, oh, and they usually have no mission.
There is a place for this weapon, and it is very good at what it was designed to do.
James is acting and dressing like Martin Sheen in Apocalypse Now. Half surprised he didn't say "criticizing a 7.5" 5.56 at Shot Show is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indy 500"😄
James was in top form at the spiritus booth. Next stop on the roast train, I hope PSA
I’m wondering if this will take the 10 inch barrel that the scar 16 can. If that’s the case the it could be worth it just so you wouldn’t need to register it. That is if you want to pay $4,000 for an AR-18 pistol lol. I will say, FN are one of my favorite manufacturers simply because they release a civilian model for all their military firearms.
They stated it has a different gas system so probably not.
7.5 inch 556 barrels keyholes your rounds at 100 yards since the platform was brought to market. I'd like it in 10.5 with a stock and the tax stamp. Why not do an integral suppressed in 300 blackout in the same size. It would be a two stamp gun but would be much better for home defense or a PDW. FN used to innovate now they seem to just put out whatever they have parts laying around for.
Whoever buys this for sees keyholing as a feature not a bug. Waiting for you to get a YT comment saying just throw a can on it...oh sweet summer child
THE FN scar was jealous that the PSA Jackal did so well so they made their own
@yoda x that’s the joke good job
lmfao not even on the same level. PSA is shit made for tacticool doughnut operator
Uh….. this is not what the customers meant when they asked for a pistol version. FN did not understand the assignment.
Thanks James for asking those questions for us it was greatly appreciated
"7.5 Barrel" AHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
Above average if you ask me
James at the 2:38 mark looks like the chad meme personified
FN leadership needs a refresh
Stellar product release given the "rule change." $3699 novelty
7.5" barrel 5.56 is extremely niche; it'll defeat any soft body armor at room distance, and still provide enough penetration depth to meet fbi standards. We're definitely compromising fragmentation at this point, and introducing tons of concussion & flash. I feel a suppressor is a must-have for a 7.5".
If this is like other SCAR products, attaching a suppressor will void the warranty. And good luck finding a suppressor rated for anything shorter than 10”
As a grown man that’s all you have to live for and be proud of
now we gotta wait for the 9mm/5.7 scar PCC
Overpriced & I agree, 5.56 in that short of a barrel makes no sense. Just big fireballs 😂
"Overpriced FN" is redundant
semi automatic flashbang dispenser
They release just in time for no braces and .300 blk out being a much better choice for anything under 10inches
James: "Why a 7.5 barrel?"
FN rep: "Because ya'll are stupid and we know you'll buy it anyway"
What’s interesting to me, is WHY are LE and other customers asking FN for such a small version of this. There has to be reasons and logic from an agency perspective or end user perspective because everyone shits on these shorter 556.
Read somewhere that it was for security details. I'm thinking that means concealable under a sport coat, in a briefcase or small backpack, maneuverability in vehicles, etc.
Short 5.56's aren't anything new. Guns like the G36C have been around and in use decades. The hate is relatively recent because .300BLK has better performance from a short barrel and increased in popularity, but it's a relatively new round still. The agencies requesting things like this likely already have the same/similar weapons so required training is minimal, ammo/mags are interchangeable, and 5.56 is cheap and they likely already have tons of it. PDWs are an extremely niche role to begin with. Civilians don't really have much use for a PDW besides possibly home defense. The ballistic argument is always blown way out of proportion, especially with the abundance of ammo choices for 5.56 these days. The ballistics of 5.56 out of a short barrel are more than good enough at the ranges a PDW is expected to be used, while being more effective than pistol rounds. Size/concealment is the bigger concern.
At the end of the day, for civilians, things like this are really just for fun and to collect the closest thing you can get to something that Mil/LE have. I think a lot of people forget that you can just shoot guns for fun, too. Don't need much of an argument for something besides that to me.
If they actually want it to sell for that high price they should have made the 7.5" barrel 300blk, and sell a 10" pistol variant in 5.56.
So what you’re saying is we get to pay 3-4K to get the equivalent performance of a $500 meme AR build, not to mention a voided warranty with a suppressor.
FN: "we like to change as little as possible from the original Mil/LEO versions of the guns for our civilian offerings"
HK: "what are civilians? you mean the poors? no we don't sell to them"
I hope everyone understands the reason the original contract wanted this configuration is because they had 500,000+ rounds of 556 in inventory, thousands of magazines, thousands of spare parts and accessories for 556, and they're not buying and storing 1 million+ rounds of 300bo for subsonic and supersonic testing plus training along with more inventory and magazines, muzzle devices, silencers, bolts...
The government market doesn't care about terminal performance as much as logistics. They assume to have 2-10 guys shooting the same target as well so who cares if it's weaker.
Yes, 556 is basically 22 magnum or 5.7 out of a 7" barrel. Yes, 300bo/762x39 would be eternally better performing. Just harder to turn a train than a car.
Plus they have M855A1, unlike us civilians.
Though i doubt the effectivity of this for serious use, i appreciate the fact that FN responded to the civilian market, albeit 3 years later. It is certainly a step in the right direction. Take that HK 😜
Don't really care for the price, but I understand his explanation for why they offered it as is. It's the civilian version of a military contract gun. Probably requested/offered in 5.56 for logistical reasons and barrel length for the distance it's planned on being used at. Terminal performance at xxx yards was less important than caliber compatibility and compactness, because it's not designed for reaching out to those distances.
It would be cool to see FN release this in 5.7×28
I mean, i get it. Its a specialized platform for the Govt so they figured the people would want it also. Can appreciate it. What they overlooked is that people are dumb and think "close" is referring to 50+ meters when this was made to tackle a living room. At the same point, there are other options for less that fn should of considered.
Clearly marketed to the one guy that shows up to the outdoor range, pulls out the Draco from the trunk, unloads on the berm drawing all eyes and leaves as fast as he came not paying a dime. 😎
ATF kills braces, FN execs boy's it's time for a pistol!
Maybe if they made it in 25 auto? Or 22 mag?
Real one for the questions 😂 James giving the fans what they want
This in 300blk would have been amazing. With a 7.5" 5.56 barrel it's just a waste. Sure, they have to fill government and agency contracts but just because a government entity has bundles of (our) cash to spend doesn't mean that they'll spend it intelligently. Props to James for asking the tough questions though!
luckily they put a 3" flash hider on it so the barrel is still 10" long but not getting practical velocities
I think they're cool. SCAR PDW is finally available, not gonna complain.
Everyone complaining about the short barrel like you are some using it for work 😂 be happy you have options for shit like this as a Canadian I have no options.
Ha ha - he said he wasn’t worried these guns would sit on the shelf and not sell! Here we are now and there’s a $500 rebate on them because “they are sitting on shelves cuz no one wants a 7.5 inch gun for $3,500 :)
ben voss.. i served with that jarhead in 2/7.. easily the most dangerous guy in sta platoon
It's cool that they're offering something close to what the operators use, I wish more companies would do this. Yes HK, I'm looking at you 😒That being said, everyone is a critic until they get dropped with a 7.5" 5.56. I'm sure this thing would do just fine with some of the heavier bullets like 77 grainers. It'll be even more badass in .300 BLK.
FN have hugely missed the mark.
Let's get one thing straight. The only reason the military at special operations level wanted the same package and with 5.56 capability is not because they plan on shooting peas at the enemy.
This is a multi calibre package designed for 300 blk and is likely to have gone head to head with the sig rattler.
The sole purpose of the request to contain 5.56 barrel ability is purely for the military to train force on force with simmunition which isn't available In the calibres they actually intend to use in battle.
Hence seeing as civilians don't have rafts of simmunition lying around why would we want a pathetic calibre/barrel length. Just bring it to market in the proper intended calibre like 300blk. My god.
"It may be small, but it's fierce"
Over penetration is obviously not an issue for the military when using the 5.56 through a 7.5 inch barrel. US law enforcement is not concerned either about wrongful death litigation as a result of over penetration. For civilians it is an issue. Don’t hate the player making the money, hate the game. James you’re a lawyer, you know this. Lawyers still will make their money, in the end.
AFT says they want less brs, then imo we should flood the market with them. Also this with a collapse stock would be like a honey badger but in SCAR platform
Every. Gun. Needs. To. Come. With. Iron sights.
We kinda do take ourselves too seriously. Like guys - shooting is meant to be fun. Don't like it? Don't buy it. Nothing lost. Half of the guns I own are stupid because they're fun. Enjoy your shit and quit picking apart literally everything you see.
Pretty sure that 5.56 being speed dependent for fragmentation thing really depends a lot on what bullet you're shooting and isn't going to matter too much at the across the room distances that thing was likely designed for.
really not how that works lol
@@enzoswoodshop1052yes, that is basically how that works.
@@enzoswoodshop1052 I wouldn't use M193 in it. That's for sure.
Under 10.5 and the round won't even fragment at the muzzle. This is worthless at any distance lmao.
@@chad9166 M193 and Mk262 won't frag, but M855A1 will. An expanding bullet like Gold Dots or FBIT3 will still expand at lower velocities as well. It all depends on the bullet, and the Special Forces dudes who asked for the SC certainly aren't using M193 like most plinkers do.
Does it use standard AR15 mags?
300 blk
Talk to me when that’s available FN
Also, still waiting on an FNX-10
Will wait for .300 BLK.
This makes me wanna see baby all 5.56 cartridge rifles have a 5.7mm baby sized version.
I really enjoyed meeting you at the Aguila party.
They are about 4 years late and few inches short
6:05
Because a FDE case is discreet…
So they released this scar to compete with the jakl that was released to compete with the scar?
This package should be available for a 300Blk. They indeed dropped the ball on that one, as home defense should be effective & silent. This package was meant for such a scenario.
10.3 should be the absolute minimum for 5.56. And why didnt they go .300 blkout then?
Really wanted to purchase the civilian version of this pistol in 300 blackout like the original SC. 556 in a 7 1/2-in barrel looks cool but that's about it.
I want one -- but stupid brace ban crap really puts a damper on this.
Excellent release timing FN lolol....poor bastards...quick, there's only 108 days left to register it!
Savage Slaughter!🥳👌
Now roast HK, please.
Needs to be a 300blk suppressor host.
I'm waiting for Blackout. And for the rear pic rail to not be able to be construed as indicative of surface area and design intent to be fired from the shoulder.
Brutal lol
So when discussing why a company delays or simply does not launch a civilian version of their military contract firearms, I naturally think of HK, LMAO
This gonna be badass in 5.7
Why the hell wouldn't they go .300BO if theyre doing such a short barrel?
My ears started ringing just looking at that thing.
Bring back the FAL FN
Does it take AR mags
7.62x59 side charging handle pistol is what i want
Bear creek
Can't get this in CT