The Identical Sudokus
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- čas přidán 14. 06. 2024
- ** TODAY'S PUZZLE **
Some constructors exhibit a level of genius that it is just a privilege to behold. Jay Dyer's Dimorphism breaks the mould with 2 linked 6x6 grids - that look almost identical. But they will break your brain :)
Play the puzzle at the link below:
tinyurl.com/mva8jjf5
app.crackingthecryptic.com/su...
Rules:
In each grid, place the digits 1-6 in cells such that each row/column/region contains all digits once each. Each grid contains six 'sum cells', one per row/column/region. The value of a sum cell equals the cell's digit plus the digit in the same position in the other grid. No digit can appear in more than one sum cell in the same grid. Sum cells may be in the same position in the two grids. Along a red line, the cells' values form a non-repeating set of consecutive numbers in any order. Along a blue line, the sum of cell values is the same in each region the line passes through. White dots connect cells with consecutive values. Not all dots are necessarily given.
** NEW KIDS' SUDOKU HUNT JUST OUT **
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/ crackingthecryptic
** NEW GAS PACK: VOLUME 2 IS OUT **
The new GAS (Genuinely Approachable Sudoku) pack is out on all platforms here:
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60 original puzzles by Clover, Bill Murphy and Philip Newman!! Earn party hats and dinosaurs with these brand new puzzles!
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You can input classic sudoku puzzles into our software and help support Sven, the programmer responsible for the wonderful user interface we all use to play these puzzles everyday. The app also comes with 12 handmade puzzles from us:
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** ORDER OUR UPCOMING BOOK HERE **
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▶ Contents Of This Video ◀
0:00 Theme music and rules
4:43 News and special announcement for Leon
8:57 Patreon Announcements
11:08 Start Of Solve - Let's Get Cracking!
▶ Contact Us ◀
Twitter: @Cracking The Cryptic
email: crackingthecryptic@gmail.com
Our PO Box address:
Simon Anthony & Mark Goodliffe
Box 102
56 Gloucester Road
London
SW7 4UB
(Please note to use our real names rather than 'Cracking The Cryptic'.)
▶ SUDOKU PAD - Use Our Software For Your Puzzles ◀
You can input classic sudoku puzzles into our software and help support Sven, the programmer responsible for the wonderful user interface we all use to play these puzzles everyday. The app also comes with 12 handmade puzzles from us:
iOS:
apps.apple.com/us/app/svens-s...
Steam: store.steampowered.com/app/17...
Android:
play.google.com/store/apps/de...
ALSO on Amazon: Search for “SudokuPad”
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Thanks again Simon :)
I wish I had my phone out when he saw it but he's absolutely elated and all smiles. You've made a young man very happy this evening.
I definitely will remember so send some pictures your way when we go. X
Nick & Elizabeth
Simon, I know you worry that people are shouting at the screen. No doubt some of them are shouting because you missed something. But many of us are shouting in delight that we've finally figured something out. 💜 Thank you for the generosity of your kindness and joy.
I like to believe thay the people who DO shout at their screen about missed logic or what have you are doing so in a gentle, ribbing sort of way, all in good fun, and not out of any negative intention.
Simon solves tons of puzzles that I would never be able to crack, and at least when I see something he missed, it's in full acknowledgement that the only reason I found it is because laid out great logic already and I just happened to be looking at/thinking about the right cells
@@OwenSmith-qg3sn Currently 33 minutes in and exactly this. Have spotted a bit of logic that resolves a bunch of stuff, but Simon just isn't looking at the right thing and not noticing it. Just want to point out a couple of cells for him to think about, as I'm sure it will come in a second once he looks in the right place asking the right question. Until then, he seems a bit stuck
we shout because we see something that we never would've seen were it not for Simon's logic in the first place. It's a weird response to be sure. Many of us are literally standing on Simon's shoulders seeing something that we could not see on our own.
Thanks for the video! I actually set this puzzle sometime last year, inspired by Zetamath's Vignettes, then other things kept distracting me from posting it. I'm glad you enjoyed it, it was definitely an interesting challenge to set.
Thanks for this puzzle, quite the head scratcher that early logic of the 6s then 5s on blue fooled me into thinking it would be quick, took an embarrassing length of time for me to finish. Very good puzzle.
You're a genius. We all know this. But this was insane!
your puzzles are astounding! i just completed this one and thoroughly enjoyed it
I have not done the puzzle myself, but I am curious about the solve path, is it possible to go in the opposite direction filling in the left and then leading over to the right? and would that say something about the left/right brainness of the solver?
You know it is an amazing puzzle if Simon misses a 3 in the corner.
Now what does that say about missing 2 of them?
Phenomenal!
Simon, I was in tears when you talked to Leon. That was one of the most heartwarming things I’ve heard from an older person to a child. I love how supportive, caring and heartwarming you are. You remind me of one of my doctors. He has a similar character. 🙂
Leon & parents, I’m heartbroken for your loss. Have no words except a lot of strength through this horrific time. My thoughts are with you and Otto.
I have always thought that a kid would be very blessed to have Simon as a parent.
@@kathyjohnson2043 agree!
Thank you for your kind words, Leon and Otto are my boys, it was a brutal 18 months sadly, but CTC really had a magnificent impact on us :>
@@w0rmblood323 The grief your family has endured and are enduring is simply unimaginable. I hope you and Leon have the time of your lives in Egypt.
@@w0rmblood323 my heart goes out to you and your family. I know the whole CTC community sends our love.
I have a new favourite Simon quote: 'we are probably going to have to do some colouring, which is slightly terrifying."
2 Identical Sudokus, each more identical than the last.
You are a remarkable person Simon. Such respect for how you handled and talked to Leon. This channel brings such love and warmth.
@David Rattner well said, my friend!
37:12 "You're going to be shouting at me" ... well, to be fair... yes 😅
By the way, Phistomefel gets lots of (deserved) credit, but Jay Dyer puzzles are the creation of a genious
Loudly and repeatedly.
Yes, I could not have reached that far in the puzzle, but I was shouting at him for 10 minutes that the left-hand cell had to be A.
He needs to have an avatar like Phistomefel.
Took me 2 days, had to sleep on it. 5 hours battling with Jay. She is outstanding. :)
It's uncanny how I'm always one step ahead of Simon when I watch a solve.
Mind you, I'm also one step ahead of Messi when I watch football.
At minute 37 I was not shouting at you at all. I was cheering you on all the way to your realization because I knew it would make you happy to see that beautyful logic and the fact that the left grid cell can't be 3 or 4 is so much more important than it looks. I get excited with anticipation when I know you will see something and love it :)
@30:06 A still can't be 3 or 4 though because r5c5 in grid 1 has to be A because it adds to the 6 in grid 2 to get to the equal sum. I'm sure you'll spot this eventually, it's just where I am in the video atm.
Immediately when A is place at 27:34 we know it is 5, because r5c6 in the left grid also has to be A. And we know A is at least 3 because of box 5 in the right grid.
And A can definitely not be 6.
This channel has made me quite interested in custom sudoku puzzles, and yesterday I actually made one with a custom rule (multiples/factors) for the first time, that was very fun to figure out how to arrange it so that it created a unique solution
Please share your puzzle on the Discord server :)
Can't wait to try one of your puzzles. :)
Good job adding in chapter titles, and thanks for putting the rules at the start of the video. We also got a Mario ad, so looks like the CZcams algorithm supports the changes. Keep up the good work!
This was an amazing puzzle, so beautiful and the interconnectivity between the two grids was amazing
What a cool puzzle! The way the sum cells point from each grid to to the other in a non-reciprocal way is a real brain-bender.
Usually when I give up on a puzzle it stays gave up on, but this one was so compelling it kept drawing me back in. Finally solved it on Day 3. What a wonderful construction.
Simply amazing !!!! Jay has done it again. What a stunning puzzle.
I love this guy so much, this channel has a wonderful community for a wonderful hobby. It makes something that could be super logical and cold very joyous
I had to turn off the video for a few moments to compose myself after listening to Simon’s message to Leon 😢. Simon, your response was absolutely perfect. Much ❤ to Leon and his parents. You are all very special people. Sending hugs and prayers through the ethers.
Had to compose myself also. Perfectly written my friend.
@@davidrattner9 thank you, David.
I typically skip straight to the solving, watched that segment after reading the comment.
The thing that never fails to stun me with both Simon and Mark is the general ability to store the rules in a way that can be recalled later. I tried this puzzle and missed two critical points in the rules - that the special cells are unique digits and that they are not necessarily in the same position in both grids. As luck would have it, I managed to get the correct special cells in the left grid identified, but that was more or less where it ended. Well done!
I love that I was able to solve a puzzle with a video this long.
This puzzle is the sudoku equivalent of The Regulators and Desperation, novels by Stephen King and his pseudonym Richard Bachman. Same characters. Same location. Wildly divergent stories and universes that linked up.
When I started to watch this video, I was a bit like "meh, the rules sound mighty complicated, not sure if I'm going to enjoy watching this". But when he started working on it, I could really see those "but that must mean..." moments coming one after another, and it was a lot of joy to watch.
Jay Dyer is an absolute genius
"We have achieved specialization." -- Simon got to be one of your best quotes!
Jay, this puzzle is absolutely amazing! Every time you come up with something mindbending, your next puzzle is even more so. I dream of the day I am a good enough solver to complete one of your 4 or 5 star masterpieces.
The fascinating thing is that the right grid preserves the box division of the left one (digits 1-6 in 3 rows and 2 columns). Nice!
46:12 For me, I usually suck at Jay Dyer's puzzles but this one, with the exception of initial blunders, was a walk in the park, and a delightful one at that
I found using Sven's pen tool circles incredibly helpful in marking the sum cells, leaving the colours available for normal numbers. Thank you Sven, Simon and Jay.
Just mind blowing phenomenal from you again jay dyer!!!
44:30 "we have achieved specialization" totally cracked me up 😂
‘You’re going to be shouting at me’ haha I certainly was
Wow! I'm really glad I stuck with this one. It took me over 3 hours to solve. What an incredible puzzle. I was almost sad to complete the solve, I was so enjoying it. I feel like I have just levelled up my solving abilities. Thanks, Jay! :)
That was an amazing puzzle. Wow! 1h38m for me, would love to see more like this. Everything from Jay Dyer is true genius
Really creative puzzle design. Lots of different techniques and types of reasoning needed, and plenty of back and forth between the two puzzles.
I had a lot of success using letters as placeholders in this puzzle. On the right side it was fairly trivial. On the left I had to figure out where to start. The renban was appealing but unhelpful. The set of non repeating sum value spaces helped a ton more.
Yes, yes, as you said, a brilliant genius of a puzzle idea. I like multi-grid puzzles and gattai-type puzzles (which autocorrect wants to change to "gateau" which is also OK, I suppose, but not the same thing at all ...) and I appreciated how you went about solving it, Simon. I was not shouting at my screen at all because you were not stuck with something obvious sitting out there - you were working on other things. I don't see the point in shouting about something that is not terminal to a puzzle solve, really, because I know you're thinking about something, and you are focused somewhere that I am not. I also don't feel it necessary to shout at the screen because I am pretty sure that you can't hear me ... pretty sure. Thanks for this wonderful video, Simon!
33:20 "Many of you have already figured this out."
I had been shouting that G1R5C5 had to be the same digit as A from the moment that you put A into the puzzle (27:10), because it's a sum digit on Grid 2, so it must add to the same as the 2 natural digits on the other bits. Then, I quickly worked out that it was 5, just from the overlap of what digits were available (1256 on Grid 1 and 345 on Grid 2). 😀
I swear that while you are a genius, seeing like 95% of stuff I miss, my ADHD brain will just latch onto that last 5% really quickly and watching someone miss it for so long is wild. I was so happy to see you work out the logic at 36:28.
37:20 No, I wasn't shouting at you, I was just waiting for you to spot it. The one thing I find most annoying is knowing where to look and what to look at, and I think this is a great example of it. It's fairly obvious when you ask the right questions, but until then you can be looking for other bits of logic that you can't do yet. You are willing to spend more time than I normally willing to to find these things.
I also think you have to look at both grids a lot more. There was a point you were looking at where 5s went in the left grid, and considered a cell which on the right grid was special. As such, the 5 would have been impossible, as it would have broken the sum region. Truly an evil genius had to make a puzzle like this one.
What a beautiful puzzle this was! Really daunting in the beginning and then a wonderful chain of deductions.
Absolutely stunning.
As Simon noticed, those grids also differ in the arrangement of wide lines marking boxes. That makes the dimorphism less surprising to me. Now I wonder if anyone can create two sudokus, identical except for the colours of the lines, and with two utterly different solve paths. Perhaps entropic lines in one and mod-3 lines in the other, with symmetry broken by a Kropki dot?
lol is this the first time Simon has noticed it differentiates between "the solution is correct" and "looks good to me (puzzle does not include a solution)"? It's been doing that for ages!
Strangely, this puzzle gave me the "yay you solved it!" message after completing only the left grid. Perhaps they expected me to finish the right-hand side first? Either way, delicious piece of logic here!
It also seems 3-in-the-corner animations only apply to the left grid as well😀
Now! I see there's a playlist of Phistomefel's puzzles. Where is Jay Dyer's one?! We. Need. It. BADLY.
Leon, if you’re reading this, I feel your loss. I’m sure we all do. I hope you enjoy your trip this summer, you’ll be okay. Cheers.
So trippy a puzzle, really enjoyed that
58m56s. I really enjoyed that. The presentation of this puzzle is fantastic!
I happened to solve this one yesterday on LMG, a fantastic puzzle as expected and I was looking forward to watching your solve!
Congratulations on your solve; this one is way beyond me.
31:45
I think the two different line rules is fogging Simon’s brain from the fact that because the line segment is from 9,10 and 11, and the corresponding sun cell in the left grid can only be 1259, that makes the line segment 11, the left grid r5c5 a 5.
In this puzzle, it pays off to jump over to the other grid as soon as one gets stuck, due to the sum-constraints.
31:14 "We know that [A] is at least equal to three ... and it can't be a 6." [so it's 345] - Now combine this with the fact that A also lives in the left r6c5, which is pencil-marked as 1256. ... 37:01 "Oh hang on hang on no no no this is 5 this is 5!" ... "are you going to have been shouting at me" (I like the grammar here) ... this is one of the cases where I actually was talking (not shouting, my wife is already trying to sleep) at the screen, true.
I also colored the right grid (I used slightly different colors - green stayed green, blue and orange were swapped, and I had yellow instead of purple), and then the left grid too (with all colors different).
Let's Get Cracking: 11:08
Simon's time: 1h9m10s
Puzzle Solved: 1:20:18
What about this video's Top Tier Simarkisms?!
The Secret: 4x (06:15, 06:25, 07:29, 1:10:48)
Bobbins: 1x (47:34)
Three In the Corner: 1x (1:20:03)
Scooby-Doo: 1x (1:12:31)
You Rotten Thing: 1x (1:02:31)
And how about this video's Simarkisms?!
Hang On: 23x (01:01, 01:47, 02:21, 02:21, 11:23, 18:03, 37:01, 37:01, 42:41, 42:41, 42:46, 43:08, 43:24, 46:01, 55:50, 55:50, 56:45, 1:02:01, 1:02:10, 1:11:15, 1:11:15, 1:16:58, 1:19:21)
By Sudoku: 11x (28:00, 38:31, 46:22, 47:38, 53:18, 58:00, 1:10:30, 1:10:36, 1:12:52, 1:15:45, 1:17:15)
Sorry: 7x (28:42, 33:16, 46:37, 48:49, 58:41, 1:11:18, 1:20:05)
What on Earth: 6x (00:48, 20:32, 29:46, 33:21, 1:05:06, 1:19:15)
Brilliant: 6x (00:28, 06:26, 08:19, 09:48, 1:21:08, 1:21:15)
Ah: 6x (23:17, 24:36, 29:54, 1:02:06, 1:10:42, 1:19:52)
Surely: 5x (1:01:27, 1:01:30, 1:01:30, 1:10:45, 1:15:29)
Beautiful: 4x (38:04, 1:06:24, 1:17:29, 1:18:41)
Wow: 4x (45:34, 56:45, 1:08:15, 1:20:03)
What Does This Mean?: 4x (20:14, 38:53, 1:14:58, 1:17:58)
I Have no Clue: 3x (20:27, 1:17:58, 1:20:13)
Nonsense: 2x (20:46, 24:13)
Clever: 2x (32:19, 1:07:48)
Going Mad: 2x (42:30, 57:49)
Bonkers: 2x (19:10, 22:56)
Obviously: 2x (04:33, 1:13:40)
Nature: 2x (1:07:23, 1:12:11)
Pencil Mark/mark: 2x (1:11:34, 1:16:07)
Cake!: 2x (06:07, 06:28)
What a Puzzle: 1x (1:20:31)
Naughty: 1x (34:29)
Break the Puzzle: 1x (22:11)
Ridiculous: 1x (1:06:24)
Take a Bow: 1x (1:21:22)
Discombobulating: 1x (14:28)
Shouting: 1x (37:13)
Bizarre: 1x (18:53)
Think Harder: 1x (1:06:31)
Stunning: 1x (1:21:29)
In Fact: 1x (1:13:24)
Progress: 1x (48:38)
Most popular number(>9), digit and colour this video:
Ten (20 mentions)
Five (121 mentions)
Red (58 mentions)
Antithesis Battles:
Low (2) - High (1)
Even (3) - Odd (1)
White (5) - Black (0)
Row (12) - Column (11)
FAQ:
Q1: You missed something!
A1: That could very well be the case! Human speech can be hard to understand for computers like me! Point out the ones that I missed and maybe I'll learn!
Q2: Can you do this for another channel?
A2: I've been thinking about that and wrote some code to make that possible. Let me know which channel you think would be a good fit!
I really enjoyed this puzzle!
two 3s in the corner and zero songs for them 😪
I came to say this!!
Great solve...interesting puzzle.
Incredible puzzle - solving it is difficult enough, setting it must be 10 times more difficult.
What a fun puzzle. Took me a long time. As usual, when in doubt, start coloring cells.
1:04:00 "Is there a way of forcing 2 digits on a Renban line to be the same" . . .
I very much liked this puzzle! 🤠
Both times when colouring the grids, you can just start by giving different colours to all of the sum cells. The colouring of each grid is quite straightforward from that point in each case.
Why do I get the feeling that this puzzle is a prelude?
That would take me 2 weeks as this took me 5 hours over 2 days to solve.
Heavy on the maths again
(Not 2/3s of the world - I don't even know the number < pardon the pun]
I'm doing Mark's again.
Solved all my own! Took about 3-ish hours, from what the refresh says. This was a bit of a tough one! Had to solve all the digits in the left puzzle by lettering them, and then seeing which digits could be what number wise using the 5-cell and 4-cell red line, the white dot, and the Sum cell that was given in the right puzzle. That seemed really really hard to crack, for me at least. After that though, it placed all the digits in the left puzzle except 2/3, and then I could finally proceed to the right puzzle which solved really quickly. Still, quite fun, breaking down the cells into digits using r5c6 was a great break-in (that took about 2 hours of looking at other cells, because I can never quite tell how you're supposed to know where to look) despite how much I struggled with it :D
The puzzle in the software has a bit of a bug right now, by the way. It said that I had solved the puzzle as soon as all the digits were placed in the left puzzle, but I hadn't finished the right puzzle yet. Not sure if that's a weird quirk with the coding, but given you have to solve the left puzzle first it seemed odd to me.
Yeah, that's how I solved it. Left side first. Three hours....maybe four if I'm honest. Took me ages to realize the trick with the 6's...the one that Simon got in 5 minutes.
68:45 for me. Marvelous puzzle! Love the interaction between the puzzles!
27:08 on my desktop + 49:56 on my phone = 77:04 total time
I spun my wheels for like 20 minutes on my phone, so had to swap over to my desktop and a bigger monitor. I got the 6's in the second box really quickly and had kinda decent work figuring out the sums on the long blue line. I did a bunch of coloring and it all got confusing (14, 23 pairs, which digits where special on each grid, trying to do regular sudoku with colors instead of letters).
I didn't find the logic too hard, just keeping track of everything.
39:16 You already DID the logic for what's next with the region sum line from r6c1 to r3c4. You worked out it's region sum had to be at least 5, so since r3c4 can't be 5 it must be a sum cell, which places all the remaining sum cells.
this is one where i think the spartan Pure Minimum Logical Rules Explanations that puzzle setters like to give kind of underserves the puzzle and impedes understanding what the goal even is. the sum cells are explained and then just dropped off abruptly without any explanation of what they're meant to add up to, and then it went on to explain the lines, of which one of the reds was just on its face impossible, and it wasn't until simon started running through things and noted the specific use of the word 'value' that it finally made sense. and like, maybe understanding that is part of the puzzle or whatever but it feels less like some sort of "aha!" logical connection to make and more like a piece of sneaky semantics that's easy to let slip under the radar. something like simply highlighting every instance of the word "value" in red or bold or all caps or something would be enough to make the whole fundamental idea of the puzzle far more clear
I found the pen tool was perfect for marking sum cells.
I cheat a little on this one: I stopped the vid for a while just before you find the 5, and I started to solve it by myself. I am happily surprised I ended up in just 54 min, less than the usual long of the vid (most of the time I need twice the long of the vid to solve one of those for my own).
1:44:15 (over two sessions; one hour last night, the rest this morning) ... just, wow
Incredible puzzle(s)!
INCREDIBLE PUZZLE
Chapters are not correctly cut. Patreon shout-outs were given at the beginning of the solve chapter (🙄), and happy birthdays were not classified as a separate chapter.
👉 Edit: Thank you Simon for inserting the missing chapter about Patreon announcements and fixing the beginning of the solve chapter.
There's no need to give fragmented shout-outs during your video. Please just mention the first three solvers, then compile (automatically, if you like) a *list of solvers* including solving times. Fragmented shoutouts are ineffective and time-consuming. They are also incomplete because you don't provide solving times.
I am perfectly aware that some people loves hearing their names pronounced by you. Consider, however, that most viewers, including new viewers, are not Patreon subscribers and they are never mentioned...
See *lists of solvers* automatically provided on *Logic Masters Germany,* for instance.
Some people already replied to this comment that I posted yesterday, but Google for some reason deleted it and I had to rewrite it.
To Leon and your parents, I am sorry for your loss, and pray for your strength.
As for the puzzle, that was a big challenge for me. Took me 1:56:08.
What a clever puzzle, and what a clever blighter I must be to be able to solve it lol.
Well that puzzle felt rather sporty
I'd like to see more of this sorty
You can guess my surprise
And the look in my eyes
When I finished as solver three forty!
I don't think that I would have even figured out the ruleset without you. I do think that things would be easier if you deleted non-essential colors after you are done with them.
solved in 42:56 - I didn't even notice the difference at first, then the construction was very impressive from there
I put in the first 6 digits at 1:59, then spent 10 minutes making no progress at all beyond shading one more special cell.
Eager to see what I missed!
You got further than me.
After leaving this comment, I immediately realised what I'd missed, and went back to get a little bit further. 20 mjnutes attempting the puzzle; but stalled at placing the last 3 sum cells. Disappointed in myself there
@@AngelWedge Don't be disappointed. We all can't be Simon like everyday. :)
I guess I just misunderstood the rules… I assumed any non-sum cell must not have a value, and should be ignored. I thought it was “every cell has a digit, some cells have values”, but it's “every cell has a value, for sum cells use that rule, otherwise use the cell's digit.” Back to solving I go
I'm only dissatisfied that you were able to solve the long red line without actually counting them up to twelve
I see Alfred Hitchcock in the puzzle design.
30 minutes in and all I can do is say the region sum is 11. Compare the grids!
this was stunning Jay. I shudder to think how you fine-tuned this once you'd thought of the initial idea
You have a tendency to get obsessed with one part of the puzzle and try to keep pushing on it without checking whether there's easy stuff in other areas. So here you got focused on the right side doing complicated logic with A when you could easily for a long time have noticed that the 1256 had to be a 5 because the region sum had to be a minimum of 9 in the bottom left and couldn't be twelve because the top right couldn't be a 12.
That you didn't even use the kropki dot in the top left is a sure sign you sweated some other part much harder than intended by the puzzle setter
I was pretty disappointed when Simon didn't use blue for the special cells in the right-hand grid.
I figured out R5C5 long before Simon, and was seriously frustrated that he didn’t see it.
I'm so sad you didn't finish the easy shading on the left hand grid to solve.
I just want to thank you with all my heart for this treasure cave of brain massage, if that makes any sense to anyone :)
52:36 I know which one is A. Blue is B you can ask where r2c3 goes in box 2 of right grid, and find that it can only go in r1c5 which you already proved is A, so since blue is also in r4c3 and A is in r2c3, blue must be B.
Jay D is the very interesting and creative person with brilliant ideas!
I am confused about these rules and I am surprised that there doesn't seem to be a lot of other people here who are also confused. The rules define the "value" of sum cells, and says there are 6 of those in each grid, one per row/column/region; the rules don't define the "value" of any other cells than those six. But then it also says the white dots connect cells with consecutive values ─ and those are in the same column, so how can they both have values?
The value of a non-sum cell is simply its value - the number in that cell - as usual
It just allow you to be about to put a sum cell value of 7 if need be. :)
@@ipudisciple Thank you. The rules clearly use the terms "digit" and "value" differently, which is not "as usual" as far as I know. I think the rules should be edited to add something like "otherwise the cell's value is equal to its digit".
@@AndrewKay For this problem I decided not to give it a go.
If 2 sumcells have the same pos doesnt that create an infinite effect..which ones first?? Or is it only once?
No, because the rule says you only add the _digit,_ not the _value._
The value is digit plus digit. No iteration involved.
Now, someone will make a puzzle where it goes back and forth the same number of times equal to the smallest digit. Boy, Jay is such a genius. :)
What a brilliant puzzle, and what a brilliant solve. Intriguingly, the regions are rotated -- vertical on the left, horizontal on the right -- but they didn't need to be. In the right hand grid there could have been vertical regions and they would still have been valid. I wonder why Jay broke symmetry like that when he didn't break it anywhere else? (Also, Simon: two 3s in the corner and no song? Horror! :>)
The summed cells wouldn't have been distributed to one in each box if it was vertical boxes in the 2nd grid.
@@SourabhDas95 Pretty sure they would have. Which region would have been wrong?
@@davidstorrs Boxes 2 and 4 would have 2 red cells each, and boxes 1 and 5 would have none.
There may have been some other way to do it, but I used that rotation to be able to tell which of the two possible patterns of summing cells along the red 12-cell line was correct. The wrong one broke sudoku in the right grid by putting the same digit twice into a region. That wouldn't have happened if the arrangement of regions in the two grids had been the same.
Looking for the link to Sven’s stream..
27:52 for me. Rly good puzzle, i almost forget to solve it.
My English is not the Best, but I would guess by the given rules there couldn't be an solution or do I missunderstand the sentence " No digit can appear in more than 1 sum cell in the same grid."
This rule broken right at the beginning where you set all sum cells in the right Grid as Six so the digits appears 6 Times.
And by this facing you cant solve the long Red line with 12 consecutive cells because you need All number from 1-12 but using the 6 in the Left Grid (L) and the 6 in the right Grid (R) to get the 12 you cant put any summed 11 in the grids because the 6 of 6+5 is allready in both grids
So the possibilities for the consecutive of 1 to 12 is not given and the Red line rule would be broken or else the appearing digits rule would be broken
So by the given rules it's not solveable or my unterstanding of english is wrong
Pls correct me and explain me the difference thx :)
Okay never Mind a few Minutes on I guess I understand the missunderstanding more or less.
Searching for different sum cells allows to get the missing digits. But then we dont have "6" sum cells but 6 to 12 where each digit musst appears at least once per Grid and then the other are allowed to Double more or less.
It's an cofusing rule and not enough explained for me personaly that the sum cells goes only one way.
Meaning the left sum cell number gets increase from 4 to 10 but the corresponding 6 stays a 6 for the blue line.
For my english skills it's not explained that way and I could solve that puzzle ever
trying before watching the video but I don't understand the red llne rule "Along a red line, the cells' values form a non-repeating set of consecutive numbers in any order." The long red line is 12 digits long - how can that possibly work as written with only 6 available consecutive digits?
You need to bear in mind the rest of the rules, which change the values of the cells
The rules are very specific to use the word values rather than digits
Still makes no sense to me ─ the rules only define "value" for six special "sum cells" in each grid. Am I supposed to interpret this as meaning that other cells don't have values, in which case what do the white dots mean? Or does every cell have a value, in which case how can you have 12 distinct sums of digits from 1 to 6, when the smallest possible sum is 2 and the greatest is 12?
@@AndrewKay Digits which aren't sum cells maintain their normal value. Obviously in a normal grid you would say the value of a cell is the same as the digit in the cell. There is no ambiguity because there is not any other interpretation that makes more sense. If you really want to be pedantic, the 12 cell renban must have 12 distinct values. The sum cells can provide values up to 12, so non sum cells must provide values beginning at 1 or ending at 18. The most logical set of values is 1-6 since these are the digits you are entering.
@@BryanLu0 My reading was that the rules only define "value" for those 6 cells in each grid, and the other cells don't have values, so that the 12-cell renban line did not need to have 12 different values. My best guess for the white dots was that the rule only applied if the cells had values, so my logical conclusion would be that those cells cannot have values.
I think the rules should explicitly say something like "otherwise the cell's value is equal to the digit in that cell".
So this 6x6 version was the example puzzle. Can we get to the real one now? 😅