Joker's True Origin Revealed: The Three Jokers Conclusion | Comics Explained
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Batman, originally stylized as Bat-Man, is a superhero who appears in American comic books published by DC Comics. Batman was created by artist Bob Kane and writer Bill Finger, and debuted in the 27th issue of the comic book Detective Comics on March 30, 1939.
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Joker's True Origin Revealed: The Three Jokers Conclusion | Comics Explained
• Joker's True Origin Re...
Comics Explained
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I love the idea that Joker hates not being the source of Batman's deepest pain.... So much so that he helps Bats find closure and heal that wound. That is definitely next level sadism, and exactly what I'd expect from The Joker.
Agreed this was amazing
cuz he's a sicko who should be dead across the ENTIRE DC MULTIVERSE yet y'all keep worshipping him to the point he's literally the embodiment of toxicity in DC
@@AifDaimon damn right , all hail joker
@@aceofknaves61 disgusting
It was genius. The Gotham TV series had Jeremiah (Proto-Joker) want the same thing but he just tried shooting Jim Gordon and Leslie Thompkins in Crime Alley. This was smarter and more original. He didn't reenact the scar. He erased it and it worked!
So joker plan was to heal batman so he could annoy him more. That makes sense
He didn't like something other than himself being Batman's #1 issue.
I should do a who's the real zero CZcams commenter legend
He wanted the number 1 spot on his scars list basically. Foreshadowed in issue 1. In the Gotham series, Jeremiah tried to do the same thing by topping/reenacting the Wayne Murders. But this was way smarter and more unorthodox IMO.
It shouldn't make sense, that's the point of the joker, remember that he's the villain
@@Angellance7 It does though.
Honestly, that was satisfying shedding a light on Joker's wife and kid. And yeah, that's one secret that should remain secret.
@@rufust.firefly205 Yeah it’s an interesting little twist/addition that I feel is fine to just stop there. Joker finding out about them would be such a shitshow.
Shouldn’t his kid be older than Jason Todd. Joker’s origin looked like it took place in the 1930’s
So the killing joke origin was a lie all along.
did anyone see the cleaner who took away Jason's note, kinda weird that his company was called "Funtime Cleaners" and he's also wearing all purple like the Joker. I feel like this was a sly way of showing that the Comedian may learn that Jason Todd has feelings for Barbara and he'll use this against him in the future.
Good theory, writers never do things by accident
ngl i asumed it was joker, but he took him to arkham. im too high and its too mind blowing.
I thought the same thing. The uniform colors and name of the janitor could not be an accident. This tells us that maybe there were even more than 3 Jokers and we aren't just back to one.
I thought the EXACT SAME THING man, those panels had to be there for a reason
Joker did say he created the others or they made him, maybe if he is the original whoch seems to be highly hinted at, then he created one last one behind the others backs.
Batman: "I knew Joker's real name a week after we met."
Also Batman: "Morphius Chair, who dat boi? Who him is?"
HA !! I like that reference
I think batman just wanted to check if he was right
In all fairness the questions he asked prior were questions he knew the answer to. You can argue he was still testing the chair's knowledge. It's not like the first question was what is the life-equation the white lanterns had
That’s a huge plot hole.
@@danfalbe9080 Well, Batman could have just tested the chair to make sure then the chair replied "there are 3 of them" it could have confused him.
The biggest takeaways from this series is that:
1) Bruce eventually forgave Joe Chill
2) TKJ Joker's wife and kid are still alive
The second of which could have HUGE implications if this ends up canon.
Can't imagine the Joker wouldn't want to create an successor, his own Robin. Who better than his own kid? Makes me wonder what sort of personality the kid has.
3) Jason has a thing for Barbara and she will never know
If I'm not mistaken this is canon to DC Prime Continuity
@Someone Special I do. It means the Joker was batshit before his dip in the cray-cray sludge.......and one can only guess what kind if hell he'd unleash if he found out his family is alive. Their death was like, half of his drive. I sense another Joker epic coming on....
Oh man I really hope they keep it separate. The last thing we need is tom king getting his hands on this.
I'd like to note: this doesn't just confirm the Killing Joke backstory as true. It also confirms the whole "multiple choice past" thing that Joker claimed as well. We see a few flashbacks of his wife - but NOT the way Joker described it to Gordon. We see her as being afraid of him, needing to fake her own death just to escape him and protect herself and her unborn child. So we can see: he's not the hapless Nice Guy who turned evil after having one bad day. There were always undercurrents there.
Also shows that Batman created the first joker in killing joke when he knocked him into the vat.
@@worldender9388 No, it doesn't. It confirms that he gave the first Joker his appearance. He was already a bad guy even before that. It wasn't "just one bad day." That's just the Joker's excuse.
@@Archone666 I'd say he still created the joker. otherwise he would have probably stayed red hood and the vat did likely have some mental effects as well, meaning he'd also be different in his actions and motivations.
@@Archone666 when he was told his wife died, he tried to get out of being red good and they made him do it anyways, then Batman knocked him into the vat making him more crazy, otherwise pushing others into the chemicals wouldn't just make them joker
@@group555_ That was referenced in an episode of TAS, when Batman was put on trial by his enemies and the Batman-hating D.A. Janet Van Dorn was kidnapped and forced to serve as his legal counsel:
"I used to believe Batman was responsible for you people but now I see nearly everyone here would have ended up exactly the same, Batman or not. Oh, the gimmicks might be different, but you'd all be out there in some form or another that brings misery to Gotham. The truth is, you created him."
The Joker is so evil he made batman face his greatest enemy yet; Therapy
"the note was swept away by just some random guy" - you never noticed you dont see his face, he has a purple suit, and works for "funtime cleaners"?
I wondered if i was the only one thinking that,,,
Makes sense. Killing Joke Joker knows where Barbara lives. I’m sure she moved and I’m sure he followed.
Not gonna lie I don’t know how I feel about Batman and joker having some weird bro code to not expose each other’s identities. I mean he even lies to his kids about him
@@DefNotMyBurner My thought is he doesn't even tell the Bat Family in case it slips and one tells Jason who decides an Alaskan vacation with a hunting rifle is in order, amongst other things.
@@DefNotMyBurner honestly I'd have to see where they take this point before making a judgement. really depends on how they treat it.
@@DefNotMyBurner I don’t think it a bro code, Batman knows it will do more bad then good to reveal his name. Whoever the joker was before is pretty much dead, the joker is all who is left.
And we know the joker doesn’t care about bat identity
The reason why the slippery slope argument works is because Batman is actually insane. His moral code is the only thing that keeps him grounded in reality and if he breaks it, he’s going to become a psychopath.
That's a good analysis
Agreed
I agree with that statement, what I'll add is when rob says people assume it becomes a slippery slope when doing something example drinking and becoming an alcoholic but now he is assuming no one is capable of being addicted to something or that people have an addictive personality or that everyone has the will to just say "I'll only do it for said reason" most people don't have that self control so he's got a weak argument on a double negative so no one wins really.
Kinda just depends on the person if it's a slippery slope or not and for batman as said in your comment, 100% will keep killing if he does it once if real intention.
@@halcyon_official952 exactly
That's honestly a pretty good explanation to it. To any one else it wouldn't but Bruce Wayne would break after just one.
The real joker is the cleaner who took the Jason's letter from the floor. He is the 4th joker the big boss the one who is still hide his self in the shadows & he used the other 3 jokers for his plans against batman...
The criminal could easily not have died too. It's comics.
Hm yeah maybe but one problem. That mans hair is Brown, not Green
@@officerspider7996 the coulor of his hair or skin tone is no big deal he can change it & details like that are nothing for crazy mastermind like joker.
@@metalface_villain ha ha ha... no just to keep red hood emotionaly alone and broken is the easiest way to make him more mentally unstable. Every little step in time it can prepare red hood to be the next new joker.
@@officerspider7996 He is wearing a backwards baseball cap, if you look closely.
If this comic ever gets green lit for an animated movie, my top picks for voice actors for Joker are Mark Hamill, Troy Baker, and Richard Epcar.
They all sound very close to each other but still very distinct
I would love to see that but I was thinking of Mark Hamill being the Clown or Comedian, Cameron Monaghan being the Comedian or Clown and Joaquin Phoenix as the Criminal but seeing all of them would be great too.
Mark hamill could do all 3 voices himself.
@@carlossanchezr.7283 Okay but someone new would be fine.
@@carlossanchezr.7283 Personally I would like to see Mark Hamill's joker, but also John DiMaggio Joker, and Jack Nicholson's Joker as the 3 Jokers, Kevin Conroy as Batman, Tara Strong's Batgirl, Ray Wise's Jim Gordon and Jensen Ackles Red Hood if this gets an animated film, as it'll reflect of those stories perfectly
The voices of the three Jokers if this ever gets animated I would like to see this.
The criminal Kevin Michael Richardson
The comedian Mark Hamill
The Clown John DiMaggio
Honestly as much as I like Kevin Micheal Richardson, imagine if Ron Pearlman was cast as The Criminal and what kind of Joker he could potentially be
JOHN DIMAGGIO DID THE JOKER??
I gotta friggin watch Under the Red Hood now.
@@sandordugalin8951 yes in Batman under the red hood
@Isaac Altman Troy Baker to me is just a rip-off of Mark Hamill and I want each Joker to have a signature sound and not all of them sound like each other at least that's the way I read it in the comic. So that's what I would like to see in an animated film.
The Criminal: Heath Ledger
The Clown: Mark Hamill
The Comedian: The Joker
Jack Nicholson or Joaquin Phoenix?
The criminal: Joaquin Phoenix (hurts to laugh)
The clown: Cesar Romero (duh)
The comedian: Mark hamil
The Criminal: Jack Nicholson, Jared Leto (failed miserably)
The Clown: Joaquin Phoenix, Caesar Romero
The Comedian: Heath Ledger, Mark Hamill
@@TheJotaroKujo yes sir sorry sir
The criminal: Heath ledger
The comedian: mark hamill or The joker
The clown: Jack Nicholson
If you look closely, the "random guy" that swept up the letter was wearing purple, and his jumpsuit said "fun time cleaners", i think its entirely possible this was either another joker poison victim or henchman or possibly the joker himself. It just seems like a weird choice if not supposed to be hinted at being joker related. Making sure jason never gives up being the red hood.
this is the problem with these videos, they're only as smart as the person uploading them.
Or maybe it's a 4th joker ! The big boss who made the 3 others
If he knew the joker's name, why did he ask the mobius chair who the joker was?
To test the chair
He was asking the chair things he knew the answer to to test it did what it was claimed to do. He thought only he knew the answer and it was a final test for the chair.
Beat me to it.
He knew this Joker’s name, but he didn’t know there were multiple jokers. He just thought this was the jokers only name.
dumb question...
It's super hard to believe that Jason Todd's one true weakness is using cheap tape on a love note.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 I know right.
I don't believe he would stick something that personal to a door and leave it for anyone to find. He could've just slid it under the door... Contrived drama annoys me.
Take a look at the company name on the custodians uniform..."Fun Time"
Well, maybe a close second to crowbars.
@@feddy11100 Under the door would have been fine.
BATMAN: "No one can know his name."
Me: "Uh... Joe Kerr."
genius!
His wife had the initials J.W. on her trunk. It's kind of 50-50 if that trunk was her original or Joker's. Her name was Jeannie, so it could be her, but she was married to Joker, so either way Joker's surname starts with a W. That's assuming the trunk was of either of them.
"Jack White" is one of the aliases Joker has used.
@@Aivottaja If the surviving Joker was from the Killing Joke then his name would be Joe Kerr. As it is, if you're under witness protection, having the same name would be very stupid. If Joker can figure out the names of the bat family then he should know her location and name.
He’s used the name Joe Kerr before. I assume it’s just one of his several aliases.
I’ve always assumed his real first name is Jack, and not because that’s his name in the 89 movie, but because Jack is a card in a deck of cards, just like Joker is.
@@PLATINUMSWORDS
Joker likely does know her location and name. In that daydream of his the family appeared almost exactly how they appeared at the end for real.
Of course she has changed her name; she faked her death. But that trunk with the stickers was probably grabbed in a hurry and it's such a minor detail it's highly unlikely she would have changed the sticker to reflect her new name.
Joe Kerr is an obvious pun. It's the one he also used in Going Sane. And I'm not saying Jack White is the Joker's real name. But his surname highly likely starts with W.
"Joker wants to be at the center of Batman's life."
Wait, so that wasn't just a joke in the Lego Batman Movie?
Lego Batman is the best Batman movie. Bar none
@@theprofessorjg I sort of agree. The Lego Batman movie perfectly captured the relationship between the Joker and Batman.
what if alfred is the joker?
The Lego movie parodied the canonical relationship. Watch the TAS episode titled "the Man who Killed Batman." Joker is genuinely saddened by the thought that someone else killed Batman.
The love story angle of Batman and the Joker’s relationship has been a thing since at least the 1980s with The Dark Knight Returns where they have their final showdown in the tunnel of love.
The fact that Joe Chill killed Thomas and Martha because he thought all rich people were the same and were what led to him being poor really mirrors Batman. He beats up criminals because he thinks they're all bad and they're what caused him to lose his parents.
What? Every criminal is bad. How is that even an argument?
@@Solisus It’s not an argument, and if it was why do you think Batman beats up criminals? I edited the comment in case it was confusing, but all criminals are bad was from Batman's perspective
@@Solisus I get what you’re saying but look at Jason Todd. He was technically a criminal but Batman took him in
@@Solisus how about mr freeze hmm??
@@Solisus some criminals are a product of circumstance and they steal or do drugs to escape the reality they are in, not because they are bad people.
Please tell me I am not the only person who caught the guy sweeping the letter from Jason under the door wearing a "funtime cleaners" uniform...... Joker.......
it's like he really doesn't want jason to heal and move on.
Yep yep I saw that. Obviously the joker.
That guy. What a joker.
The tape holding the letter to the door came away on its own, Joker didn't make that happen. Seems like an unnecessary detail if Joker was meant to take it anyway.
@@pirateweasel9998 the guy who swept the note under the door is the one we are talking about.
This is a magnificent companion piece to The Killing Joke.
Yeah now we know that the killing joke origin was somewhat fabricated by the joker and this makes him much more mysterious.
So my question is: which Joker has Harley been going around with or have they been switching up on her?
Ha!!! That'd be hilarious!!!
The clown joker is the silver age joker and the one the Mark Hamill is based on. So it would be the clown joker he is dead now . That’s why this comic is so stupid. They killed the Mark Hamill version of joker the goofy prankster who was with Harley. The comedian joker is the modern joker the killing joke the endgame joker . He is a lone wolf
Harley seems like the kind of girl who would let them run a train on her.
I mean, that's totally within their character to do something like that 😂
@@funkyweapon1981 AIRTIGHT
At this point, Joker's entire personality revolves around his man-crush on Batman and his compulsion to constantly say "Hey, ever notice we're two sides of the same coin? Really makes ya think!"
Maybe that's why Batman is so defensive about killing him. None of the other villains have a strict "never actually kill me" clause in their contract.
That is the case because today’s writers have not really moved the character beyond the Killing Joke.
Johns’ characterization of JazomnTodd suggests that the character has not evolved since the Red Hood return. Johns’ characterization of all the characters are....static and going nowhere.
Geoff Johns ruined The Joker.
It can be more like he’s making him bigger to the dc universe. More like establishing grounds on the joker for a wide scale event. He is the other half of TBWL...
So he ended up making batman the new joker and that's how we got the batman who laughs 😂
@LAVATORR a bromance??!!!
Really???!!!
That makes for some strange bedfellows .
Just saying.
Even when Jason is written good, it’s always in tragedy😭
Written good? Really? I hated this version of Jason. A reckless killer? Please. He's only like that once he came back to Gotham. Once he made up with Bruce he promised to stop killing. This version is impulsive and a cold blooded murderer.
If Joker found out his wife and son lived, I see it could go in two directions. He gets even worse and tries to kill them or he feels that the joke is ultimately him, meet her then leaves them alone forever, before going white knight jack Napier or ends himself, taking the character off the board until someone finds a way to reinvent him/creates a new 4th Joker or something. Maybe one who see himself as a nemesis; an adversary who does thing just to see how it will play out, like some sort of Trickster test people for any possible reason.
that fkn sucks lol
A supernatural Joker would be cool. Like an avatar of the Crawling Chaos.
I loved the ending. My problem with "The Killing Joke" is that it makes The Joker too sympathetic. This shows that he always was a bastard. He sucked as a comedian because he didn't have the empathy to be funny.
The Joker to me would have to be sympathetic in his origins. After all, he’s a human being. Making him some type of horrible person before him becoming the Joker is just classless. Even looking at some of the worst criminals in the real world, they were just like us at one point, but something made them who they are.
That he was sympathetic was the real reason I loved Killing Joke. Because it emphasized the "spirituality" of true madness. Only someone who was atop something (meaning a decent man like Killing Joke Joker before he was the Joker) could fall. It never made as much sense to me to have him been a vicious bastard and a criminal even before he was Joker. A career criminal doesn't have a grace to fall from.
@@RandoLePerson
Except that this Three Jokers story line considers Killing Joke canon instead of possibly just one of Joker's scenarios. I don't know if this a one shot or Elseworlds, though.
This story actually makes his wife worse than him.
@@Aivottaja
Wasn't he abusive or something, I did not pay super close attention to the video, but didn't she say she was afraid of what he would do to her child.
@@strenuousspider9525
That's the off-panel implied retcon to the story, it seems. But they're still using near copies of Killing Joke panels. And in KJ, he wasn't abusive. So it's not clearly stated.
I would love to hear the Mark Hamill voice The Criminal.
If Three Jokers ever gets an animated film, I would want John DiMaggio to voice the Criminal and Mark Hamil and Troy Baker to voice the Clown and the Comedian (Troy as Comedian and Mark as Clown or vice versa).
@@spider-man3042 John DiMaggio would make more sense for the Clown, since he voiced the Joker who killed Jason.
@@elijahconger2432 true
Feels like Jack Nicholson would be great as The Criminal
@@elijahconger2432 I actually think about that but then I realized that the Criminal would be significantly older than the other two Jokers and I think DiMaggio could pull that off. However, I just want those three voice actors to voice any Joker lol there's no fourth voice that would be better than those three.
The only thing I hate is how that simple change with Killing Joke Joker's origin makes him no longer a somewhat tragic character. The whole "all it takes is one bad day..." theme no longer applies as it's being implied he was already seen as a ticking time bomb and potentially an abusive husband.
The whole one bad day already happened once lol. I honestly find it ridiculous if the whole idea of joker is that it took one bad day to be the most sadistic villain ever. It def needs some earlier experiences to make it work. You cannot be the nicest guy then completely turn evil, not any kind of evil but top of the food chain evil if you don’t have some of that initial experience that could trigger that part of you for more.
@@Qthetar disagree because what we see is someone who's trying to make ends meet his life outside his home is depressing and hopeless but the light and hope that keeps him from going over the edge is his wife and unborn child the whole reason he does the ace chemicals hiest is specifically for his family but when he is told she and the child dies that leads to the straw that breaks the camels back then the hiest goes south he falls into the pits and becomes insane thus creating the joker so yes it does take just one incredibly bad day for someone whos down on there luck or in a tough place to snap and we've seen this countless times
@@Qthetar this was also implied in The Killing Joke itself. Jim Gordon didn't go insane, while Joker did. It implies that there was something wrong with him to begin with, BEFORE becoming The Joker.
@Super JLK Gordon didn't go insane because all of the pain that was caused to him could be linked back to a single individual, therefore he could hold that one individual responsible for it. There was no basis for him to blame and set out to destroy the entire world. The Joker's whole plan was dumb because he simply isn't smart enough to see the flaws in his plans once he gets a devilish idea in his head. He overlooks the obvious-- it's why he always loses.
I think part of Joker's pathos is that he is insane and says he is, but deep down he believes he might not be. On the reverse side( and feel free to disagree ) Batman isn't insane and says he isn't, but deep down he believes he might be.
Bruce: "No Todd! Leave my Husbands alone!"
You are so so wrong bad boy.hahahaha
I can’t lie, I’m gutted that babs didn’t get that letter from Jason😭😭
What about Jason man up and tell her like a real man. If she reject him, then he can move on
It was the joker sweeping the note up, on his back it said Funtime Cleaners and it was purple
Asking why Batman doesn't kill Joker is to remove all responsibility for the Gotham judicial system, which needs to sentence Joker to death. Batman's only "responsibility" it to make sure Joker is arrested. A judge and jury is responsible for punishment.
Exactly
Pretty much this Batman isn't at fault completely. All it takes is one fed up blackgate guard, or arkham doctor and its over for the joker.
Exactly, I'm sure being a vigilante is illegal but that's totally different than outright murder.
A judge doesn't have the authority to make up the law or exceed what's legally prescribed, my point being that, In most versions of the mythology, Gotham doesn't have a death penalty.
Secondly, Batman is an outlaw vigilante, not a cop or any other legitimate enforcer of the law. His "responsibility" is whatever he decides it is, and, in most versions of the character, that is supposed to involve cleaning up Gotham and protecting it's citizens from lunatics so that no other family has to suffer the loss he suffered. Sometimes that has even included fighting against the judicial system, including corrupt cops, judges, and politicians.
Also Joe proving that the system works by being remorseful just makes more of it hold weight that Batman is right
I don’t know if we can confirm that the comedian is the one true Joker, he’s just the only one Batman has any knowledge of. The Clown and Criminal don’t have defined origins (that we know of) and Batman says that the Criminal is more like the first Joker they met, but Batman claims to have known his name a week after they met, but the origin he refers to is about the comedian, not the criminal.
It’s weird.
Maybe batman made a mistake on whose identity this was (criminal or comedian)
Perhaps The Comedian was the first made but The Criminal was the first one they met.
Bro, I think you are into something, in the issue #1 in the first pages where alfred is healing Bruce, the radio news reporter said: "A war the joker began when he first appeared in Gotham DECADES AGO". But his (SPOILERS) son, looks like, what? 15?, that can't be, meaby the criminal is the original one, but the comedian is the more important one?.
I think The Comedian was the first Joker... But he acted like the Criminal at first.
And kept ever changing. The other Jokers were copies of old iterations of him.
Like, he made a backup so he changed completely.
The criminal joker existed before Batman
“There is no stopping the Batman”
-Starfire
Only Cockman can
"It's not about the money. It's about sending a message." - Joker
To me, this was never going to end in a satisfactory way everyone would be happy with. But I really like this ending.
The hype was way too much for such a concise and quick story, but it was as good as anything else Johns has written.
Bet in 2-4 years they will bring this back and the joker will try to find his wife and kid and either force them to join him or be with them but without being crazy and the love letter of Jason to batgirl
The ending is just putting things back to the norm though. This story had a lot of potential and then it just ends the same way every batman and joker comic ends
@@emarythomp my guy it's not cannon, might have been if they released it right after Darkseid War, but definitely not anymore. Take it as is, yes it has its flaws, but its proven to be a good story on its own. As Joseph said, it was never going to satisfy everyone, it was meant to be taken as a concise and quick story.
Dude you described what this is perfectly. Couldn't have said it better.
@@kgaventura13 that makes it even worse. It not being canon can allow a lot more risks to be taken. The issue isn’t that it isn’t canon it’s that it’s the exact same ending to every batman v joker story now.
The ending of Jason and Barbara’s subplot was brutal.
He never gets a good ending. He only is spectated as cool from outside the fourth wall. When will he himself experience redemption and fulfillment....
The problem with that sub plot is they only have chemistry in this comic outside that theres non
@@davantebarbain3216 man, I 100% agree it felt force like filler
Well he and Artemis seem to be like the anti version of Batman and wonder women ship so there is that
@@davantebarbain3216 Go Read Batman Eternal then
Bruce: "You don't get it, Jason. Killing him IS the weakness, giving in to my anger, IS the weakness. The strength is NOT doing that. The strength is the fortitude to be human."
Man, that last panel with Jason’s note being swept away was gut wrenching
GOD Damn
The real Joker was the guy who swept away that letter
Or he could be Reverse Flash. "Remember that first time you met her and she said nothing?! That was MEE"
He killed Jason for the second time.
How can that be him when he got arrested?
@mr nom yeah. Jason and Barbara don't need to be together. It would be too awkward.
@@leonarddement4058 I differ
I think people miss one of the best arguments as to why its not Batman's fault: he isn't judge, jury and executioneer if anything the problem comes with Gotham's system. If a psycothic mass murderer gets arrested by the cops and keeps getting out of jail would you blame the cops or the systems for A: not keeping him in the facality (which is difficult in comic universe, and B: not giving out a death sentence. It is not Batman's responsibilty to kill the Joker its the government
This is what I keep saying. Irl dudes get the chair for killing like 5 people. This guy has a body count that could fill a football stadium, clearly and repeatedly shows that he is in complete control over his actions, and keeps getting sent to the mental ward? Over and over again? Someone high up is on Joker's payroll, I'm telling you.
That is pretty true there, well done I never thought of that.
Perhaps the reason its never been done unlike with Luthor who once did almost get sentenced is that half of his Rogues are insane and show signs of getting better or they are shadily used by people like Amanda Waller. Eitherway Gotham needs a much better prison than Arkham
@mr nom Batman didn't "make" him, as much as the Joker tries to make that his narrative to weasel his way further into Batman's life. Batman was stopping a crime, Joker tripped over his own cape and fell in a vat of acid. Batman tried to save him and failed, but that doesn't qualify as "making" in my book. Everything that happened to the Joker was his own fault, as much as he would love for it to be some poetic "Oh, Batman made me" thing. The dude's insane.
Underrated comment
Gotham is in New Jersey, they got rid of the death penalty in 1965.
What I want is a Batman story about the Governor, or a state Senator, possibly trying to get elected/re-elected off of this. To pass a bill that would make the Joker, and other's with such a high body count, exemptions to such a ban, and an point where "crazy" just doesn't protect you anymore.
The story of Batman protecting this person from Joker and others that would be affected, then the aftermath. Perhaps Batman fails, but the bill is passed anyway, and that sets up a catch 22. If Joker, and some of the others, kill one more time they are bound for execution. But if they don't it almost proves they understand their position, and are therefor fit to stand trail.
Would Joker's pardons, diplomatic immunity and such he has gotten over the years allow a good attorney to get him off? Could he even get a fair trial? Would he join Taskforce X over frying? I doubt DC would ever try to move things forward like this, but its the kind of story I want.
Great video rob, keep them coming!
Having revisited the first part, this is a beautiful Batman story about Bruce's healing. It starts off with him thinking of Joe Chill and his parents' murder still being a "wound deeper than others" and ends with him reconciling with him.
This was incredible how Geoff Johns didn’t ruin the killing joke and almost paid homage with this story , he basically blended this into cannon so well! You’d think it impossible to tip toe around this concept but that ending was perfect!
I thought it was weak. we spent all this time waiting just to have that old story validated once again!? The Mastermind was just some throw away despite him being the oldest and most focused Joker. This story feels like an indulgence of the bronze age Joker people cling to but complain about. Making Golden age Joker the focus would have been infinitely more interesting and refreshing. The only thing gained from this story is Batman forgiving Joe Chill.
@@Timquan. and the joker wife is alive and he also has a son lol , what ending would you have wanted , the 4th joker theory? Or another theory ? I’m curious haha
I think it ruined the killing joke. Now instead of dangling a red herring possible history, one choice in a multiple choice backstory, Joker was basically making a grand confession to the cops. A joker with a name and identity ruins the very definition of who the joker is. The biggest riddle in DC for a century, and Johns basically told us the answer as an after-credits stinger to an otherwise good story.
@@Metrion77 I disagree. For a while that may have been the case about Killing Joke but for how many more decades can we go on without properly building on Joker? Him being a mysterious psychopath is becoming rather stale imo. In recent years the Joker has been much more interesting in things like The White Knight or Endgame because it keeps elements of the unknown(Severe split personality disorder, and Possible immortal herald of Chaos that could be as old as Vandal Savage and has been dwelling in Gotham since its existence) without having to sa"we dont know who he is or where he came from. The fact that we knew Jack Naiper was a good guy before becoming Koker adds to the dynamic and tension of him losing control and letting the Joker out. The Pale man being real and possibly being the Joker was a haunting idea for Batman and Gordon because it made them feel like children playing with a giant and only spawned more questions. Imagine if Joker was written like immortal Hulk where Jack Naiper travels the world trying to control the Joker within him. There are many interesting and dynamic things that could be done with his character if People were to stop trying to keep him vague and uniform.
@@Timquan. the problem with your last point is that its not that he has a identity its the vauge and open background that you think is stale that allows him to be interested in the story's you mentioned
Golden Age Batman stopped killing once he adopted a kid.
Yeah so joker wife and her son is still alive im hyped
Thank you for the "slippery slope" stuff! This story line is a perfect example of how that only works with people who have no self control.
LOVED THIS VIDEO ROB, LOVED IT
Three Jokers voice cast :
Mark Hamill : the comedian
John DiMaggio : the clown
Richard Epcar : the criminal
Gives me a new respect for Richard Epcar, I only knew him as Batou and Raiden.
Id have to switch Epcar for Heath Ledge(in a perfect world where hes still alive of course)
I'd replace JM for Nicholson or Dafoe
I'd love to see that personally.
YES
I like the argument you made on the slippery slope because also take into consideration what the other Gotham Rogues would do if they found out Batman KILLED The Joker. Don't you believe they'd think twice before committing another crime? I mean I'd be thinking that if Batman would kill The Joker, THE JOKER...what would stop him from killing me?
YES! Exactly!
@superboy prime both kill indiscriminately. Which mean it doesn't matter if they calm down or not.
My empanadas.
Considering they have an anti joker bunker... I would agree.
I think the slippery slope doesn’t work for batman because In stories where we’ve seen batman kill he’s always never just stopped at the joker even his own father has killed before also there’s the argument for the batman who laughs where he had killed the joker then ended up becoming one, he has multiple reasons why he shouldn’t even kill the joker
That was awesome!! Thanks!
EXCELLENT story telling.
I really liked how the comic was heading, until the very end. "A defined joker? One with a name? An identity? Why, that ruins the very definition of me!"
*2 pages later* Lol yeh here's the joker's confirmed backstory
The joker is a multiple choice question and you just told us the answer that people kept quiet about for close to a century.
But there is potential for the ending. We always knew he had a wife and a kid since it’s mentioned in the killing joke. This story didn’t give a new origin, the only thing the story did is that they are actually alive and they faked their death. Now what if Joker finds out, what is he gonna do 😈.
@@Qthetar Probably try tot turn his son into a Joker and then we’ll have a Joker beyond
@@joshinthesauce4636 i think it would be the opposite actually because joker still misses his family i think hed actually give up being the joker if he knew his family was alive
@@joshinthesauce4636 well now Damien can have his own little Joker when he's older. the cycle repeats
The thing is, this is only a confirmed backstory for one of the Jokers. Keep in mind that while the comedian makes it seem as though he was the original, Batman does note that the criminal is the most alike to the Joker he first met. So possibly this is a confirmed origin for the original Joker if the comedian was indeed first, but it also means the comedian created other Jokers before ever actually confronting Bruce himself if the timeline is to be believed. Which means there really are multiple possible origins for the Joker, all are equally as true or untrue, there's not even any concrete confirmation that this comedian has been the exact same Joker since the beginning, he could just as easily be another replacement with the same characteristics, making up more lies to mess with Batman and, as he says, make the freshest, deepest wounds possible.
The three jokers is the best thing coming out of DC rebirth rn, if god was writing comics rn this is what it would look like
Also illustrating them
@@jujor4149 Alex Ross is already doing that :)
This is black label
@@MrMack49 Still canon
@Francisco Leyva Martin this is not its a fan service story that could have bn way better we waited 4 years for this bullshit...it basically was batman Babs n Jason dealing with their personal issues bullshit
Been waiting on this !
The fact that they showed the Joker with his Family shows that he knows she isn't dead, wouldn't he have killed them or worse if he had found out she ran? And that is if finding out she was alive wasn't enough to cure him. Just feels like a loose end.
Someone disliked the video 14 seconds after it was posted. It’s almost as if their purpose in life is to make other people feel bad. That sucks.
a world where keemstar can thrive is a world that i believe someone would click dislike on this video 14 seconds in.
Maybe they dislike plot postings
when the video already have a dislikes it always bots unless it click bait who would take their time to be the first person just to dislike
Who cares ? I've never understood why people care about dislike
The absolute earliest I’ve been to any of these, and “lemme tell you sumthin!!!”
I love these
That’s it, thanks for coming to my Ted talk
Man... I did not expect this story to actually have a satisfying end. Awesome!
I’ve been waiting for this proper reveal for so long! Thank you Rob for your hard work! You’re a true legend in the comics landscape and yeah! Peace! ✌️
I LOVE how bruce admits to knowing who joker was, he's literally the worlds greatest detective ofc he would know. this has also been a great way to write barbara, she really is the best batfam member imo
I think that was also a way to tell the audience he knew that the Comedian joker was the real one. Makes me wonder why he didn't tell the others.
@@thephilosopher7173 totally! it doesnt mean he isnt going to tell them though.
Absolutely agree about Barbara
So, here is why the *slippery slope argument* is valid for Batman:
1) Victor Zsasz
2) Ra's Al Ghul
3) Professor Pig
4) Calendar Man
5) Court of Owls
These five have NO qualms with killing innocent people en masse and all deserve to die. But when Batman starts to profile others, he'll see similarities between the others and those listed above and it will start a slope where he will fail to distinguish between deserved and perceived. Remember that Azrael, Clayface, Mr. Freeze, Poison Ivy, and Harley Quinn have all killed multiple people and have shown redeeming qualities despite everything they've done.
_Edit_ : if we want to talk about the big issue, it's Batman as "the world's greatest detective". *WHO* The Joker getting help from that allows him to escape all the time? *WHY* is The Joker not held somewhere else on Earth that has better security especially since he's not just a local threat? *HOW* is it that Batman has not mentioned or looked into these??
Calendar Man? I know they made him a creepy psycho in the arkham games but has he ever been a real threat in the comics?
@@archangeltyrael3369 Serial killer that won't stop.
The Arkham Games made Calendar man a literal terrorist, the City stories in Knight of him walking into the Children’s ward of Hospitals covered in infected blood to give hugs, making schoolkids drink the waste from Ace Chemicals, literally planting bombs at foreign embassies on National Peace day. If this is calander man’s wrap sheet I wonder what Jokers done in the Arkham series that they DONT tell you about
@@archangeltyrael3369 Just realized you're thinking of the extra goofy, condiment-king-style calendar man. No, not that version.
@@woskiey I get how that would make him scary but what does any of that excepts the National Peace Day one have to do with calendars?
Omg just amazing this is one o fee my favorite batman story's of all time and I've read a lot of them
Excellent presentation
Also, the problem with the slippery slope argument is that every additional step it infers becomes less likely than the last. But again, a lot of fallacies aren't automatically wrong, but rather exist on a gradient.
This is a perfectly valid argument:
"Alcoholism runs in my family and I'm currently going through a rough patch in life, therefore I should not drink alcohol because I could become addicted."
But if he added "If I become an alcoholic, I could lose my job" it becomes slightly less likely, though still probable.
But if he adds "..and if I lose my job I'll have to pimp myself for booze money, and if I pimp myself I'll be picked up by the Saudi Royal Prince and forced to join his harem, but the friends I'll make at the harem will be the best I've ever had, but one of them will get shot trying to steal one of his BMWs, forcing me to swear vengeance, so I'll take up MMA to learn how to defend myself, but while sparring my training partner will suplex me directly onto my spine and paralyze me from the neck down, therefore I should not drink alcohol," then that would be an improbable argument.
When the hell did Dick Grayson start acting and looking like Jason Todd?
Also the dude sweeping is a Joker. Look at the company name.
whats the company name?
@@Stephen-mk9ey Funtime Cleaners. Could be nothing could be something.
@@Stephen-mk9ey Funtime Cleaners, the same name of the company on joker's weird janitor uniform in "death of the family"
Believe after he was shot in the head but hell I thought alfred was dead
I love how the video starts with Batman taking a break to look through his comic book collection, all meticulously bagged and boarded, of course.
There's a difference between alcohol and murder Rob, when you drink one glass of whiskey you are not an alcoholic, but when you kill someone you are a murderer.
I like the ending. I'm satisfied as a huge Joker fan. But it's sad to see the Criminal go. I liked him.
Criminal is my favorite and who I genuinely thought to be the OG Joker since he was wrinkled and older looking, but I like the idea of making the Killing Joke Joker canon and the “true” Joker
The Comedian is an unreliable narrator. Each one said they were the original at one point or another so he could be lying, just the only one with a defined origin.
The criminal one is the OG joker . He’s older and he even says he was in Gotham before batman. The Comedian joker also says “ I regret making him or maybe he regrets making me “ . So the comedian joker doesn’t even know who came first. It’s obvious the older criminal joker came first he’s the oldest
@@Chris-qr1io I don’t think being old automatically
Makes you the first. What’s the logic behind that? The comedian could have easily went and found an older man who was a good fit for the joker and put him through the process. Being older doesn’t make him the first
If that’s the case then the three jokers was pointless. This whole comic was absolutely pointless. The criminal joker is supposed to be the old 50s joker when the character first appeared. If all these jokers were made recently that makes the whole thing pointless. What about the clown joker isn’t he supposed to be the goody one like the silver age . He would also be older than the killing joke joker . That’s what this whole comic is so stupid. The youngest of the three jokers is the true joker ? How when the other two are decades older than him at least by what age they represent. It only makes sense if it was all fake and the other two jokers were just random people joker brainwashed very recently to think they are joker
Well specifically the joker wants Batman to kill him so he can essentially turn him into the Most powerful joker so yeah it would be a slippery slope if he killed the joker
Great video!
Good video, watched from the beginning greetings from Ireland ☘
That title got me here real quick
The letter to babs from Jason was sad, it would be cool to see what could’ve happened but we’ll never know now.
Been waiting on this.
Rob I read the comic but I was exited as hell to hear you're retell of it bro 😁
Regarding the Last scene with Jason's letter, I didn't understand the significance if its inclusion. Why have it randomly fall? The only thing I can think of is the joker intentionally removed the letter, as the janitor who swept it away had a shirt that coincidentally said "Fun time Cleaners"
4th Joker? - Fun time cleaners, purple clothes.
@@telesian5143 I doubt its a 4th and more so that its the comedian
Maybe 4th, but im still think that Joker not the actual man but a entity of some kind, or a idea, state of the mind or something ephemeral
The slippery slope argument WORKS for Batman. If the Joker is deemed “killable” what happens when the next guy does something almost as vicious as the joker. And the next guy just almost as vicious, and then the next thing you know, the Batman is killing 2 time murderers, drug dealers, and so on. There is no line when it comes to stoping justice. The saying is “Justice is for all” and if that’s true, then “Justice” will indeed be for all criminals. Also the fact of the matter is, is people DO try alcohol “once” and become addicted, people try drugs “once” and become addicted. Who’s to say that when Batman kills “once” he won’t become addicted? Love you Rob but your argument is kinda weak IMO.
Chance it’s simply an example of the slippery slope... I’m not here to
Write a thesis on how and why Batman should
Kill drug dealers, all I’m saying is, it will never stop with the joker, it’ll start with his kill rate and then the next guy and so on, why not the drug dealer? Do you know how many people and families are destroyed every year by drug dealers? Providing an Avenue for people to ruin their lives. Maybe Batman draws the line there? Maybe in 10 years he won’t. All I’m saying is Batman can’t distinguish the line and following the many other examples like Super JLK just gave.
That song at the end was fire 🔥!!!
I actually really enjoy how jonns tied everything together here.
The slippery slope argument does apply to addicts: an alcoholic *shouldn't* ever have a *single* drink. Because it's never a single drink. Addicts are trying to fill a void in their lives, their selves with something that can never fill that void. A physical dependency can be overcome: go cold turkey, sweat it out, take chemical countermeasures. A psychological dependency is far more insidious.
The void Batman is trying to fill is the one created when he stood helpless when his parents were murdered. He's addicted to preventing that tragedy over and over again, in every permutation, on every level (except of course the one he can never prevent. Even if he could reach back in time and save his parents, he wouldn't, because by so doing he'd doom everyone else he's ever saved). He has plans within contingencies within wheels within wheels ad infinitum. He even plans ways to neutralize his fellow Justice League members (the best people he knows) on the tiny chance they might abuse their power -- because he knows if he had it, he would.
He doesn't kill because he knows that if he took the power of life and death into his hands, he'd abuse it, and that's what Joe Chill did. And that's who he can never allow himself to become.
That's what made that moment in Batman v. Superman actually work if the viewer paid attention: It wasn't so much that Bruce Wayne's mother and Clark Kent's adoptive mother happen to have the same first name (and have for decades in the comics, of course). It's that in that moment, with him holding a weapon over a dying man who just wanted to protect Martha, Bruce realized what Luthor had nearly tricked him into becoming.
I think the Batman v Superman “Martha” scene is significant and highly underrated. Always liked that scene and spoke of Bruce’s psychosis in such a clear way.
That rabbit hole is such a slippery slope for Bruce, that it takes an addict’s mentality and commitment to not ever cross that line knowing what’s on the other side if he does.
Way more of a better argument then what I posted.
THANK YOU
No the Superman v batman scene didn’t work because while Luther did trick him he was already clearly killing people throughout the movie. Remember the minigun car scene? Yeah those people are dead unless you tell me explosions can’t kill. Also it doesn’t make sense in any sense of the word. It’s good on surface level but thinking deeper causes the story to fall apart. That was the main problem with Snyder’s writing.
Very well put and thought out, Bravo.
The reason joker won't tell anyone who batman is because to him it's just a joke, and a joke that everyone knows the punchline to isn't funny
The whole point of a joke is to deliver the punchline. If there is no punchline, it isn't a joke. You are thinking of The Riddler. A riddle that everyone knows the answer to is no longer interesting.
It's possible the joker is so much different than who he used to be, that he simply doesn't care to know.
@@LetsGetitBoah that's sort of what they did in return of the joker, when joker found out who batman was he didn't really care, his fight is with the man, not just the costume, because to both of them being batman is a state of mind not just a costume
Awesome job Rob! I loved this series! I was one waiting on this since Darkseid war and have thoroughly enjoyed it! Though I do recognise there are continuity issues with Joe Chill's personality in contrast to his persona during Darkseid War & this series were he is clearly deeply remorseful, still, I have thoroughly enjoyed Johns & Fabok's work yet again. Keep up the great work Rob.
all right. this was clever. very well done
There was a pretty big thing Barbara says to Jim that got glossed over here.
“Nobody is as bad as The Joker”
Rob....Batman already shot someone with a gun and killed him.
Darkseid.
He got better.
*clears throat*
"The batman who laughs."
This outro music is great!
What a great story. I think this opens many more doors and closes some old ones.
I'd always conceded that the Killing Joke was the definitive origin of the Joker anyway. I guess this story was just confirmation of that?
Confirmation in this new timeline
Killing joke wasn't a canon story or even a definitive origin
Not exactly because everyone always goes for Joker falling into a vat of acid inside the plant, but in that story he was outside and he fell in a puddle and laughed at his reflection.
I assume it's because the irony of a failed comedian turned criminal becoming permanently Clownified is hilarious. AHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAHAAAAAAA
Just me?
@@ghostofdeath663 yes in pre 52 it became canon due to its positive reception
@@Anti-HyperLink i think him laughing is him going insane due to him realizing how bad his day and life is so how much worse could it get
3:29 " yeah barbara and bruce have very amazing father and daughter relationship , especially in killing joke , very wholesome "
Not in the comic.
That note falling off the door makes me what to cry. =(
You miss the Barbara and Jim Gordon talk part. That was very important too.
What if the Comedian Joker knew his family was alive as well?
We don't even know if he remembers at all if he had a family. In the killing joke the wife supposedly died, and on the same story Joker states that he doesn't really remember who he was before.
My theory is, he was always an mentally unstable man who kept random people as prisoners in his fantasy world, he told really dark jokes that got him fired, when he fell into the chemicals it didn’t change him at all, but it mixed up his memory so he thinks it could be anything.
@@axrockatansky1791 well in this he remembered them in his dinner hallucination, so he still has some notion
@Someone Special Actually, He’d be the regular villain with the same old tragic backstory.
@@axrockatansky1791 But in issue 2 there is a panel with him imagining himself having dinner with his family.
next issue: Joker becomes a therapist to help Batman find his inner peace and beat his demons then calls him fat
Awesome conclusion thank you
you always know when rob is about to say another thing when he goes "aaaannd.... yeeeeaaaah". sometimes I worry the video is about to end, but he never lets me down.
Damn that was a strong ending to this comic. Didn't expect it to be the Comedian who got the last laugh but its fitting. Just kinda wish we got more of the clown it seems like a story of two jokers more so than three.
I think it’s a lot more interesting that batman doesn’t kill. I’d say he should obviously kill the joker but it’s what makes him who he is that he doesn’t.
And it makes things so interesting between Bruce and Jason in so many stories.
The idea of batman knowing who joker was from the start and of joker knowing who batman was almost the entire time and neither of them acknowledging it in any way 99% of the time is great. ngl
Every aspect of this stories characters revolve around the famous line, “You either die a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain.”
Let me be the first “love you Rob”
Ditto
all my homies love Rob
Same
Creepy...
@@Humblemumble7 wat
It’s not creepy, you weird
I love you Rob! Helped me thru alot.