Dalai Lama - Verbally attacked by a Shugden worshipper (Oslo, Norway)
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- čas přidán 9. 05. 2014
- In may 2014 HH Dalai Lama visited Oslo in Norway and held a speech about "Cultivating Compassion in Everyday Life". After the speech he was to answer some questions from the audience. He then got verbally attacked by a Shugden worshipper. It was tried ignored, but HH Dalai Lama wanted to answer him. (Cell phone camera quality).
1st Shugden is not a religious issue, its worship of evil spirt. 2nd Shugden became a political issue, Chinese Government funding Shugden group and those protester to travel around the world to protest His Holiness Dalai lama. most protesters are from England NKT Kalsang Gyaltso students.
I feel empathy to Kalsang Gyatso. May he have better life in every year.
***** If you understood the Dharma you'd know the Dorje Shugden can never harm anyone because he's a Buddha. A qualified teacher could show you the real meaning of those texts, I pray you find one soon.
Gen la Khyenrab Steve you called your self as a Gen la, so funny and so arrogant, its clear sign student of fake geshe called Kalsang Gyaltso. who called himself as a second Buddha so funny and so arrogant too. perhaps you don't know many years ago, your teacher Kalsang Gyaltso used to be His Holiness Dalai Lama's disciple like all other Tibetan elder monks. One time monks on debate His Holiness saw Kalsang Gyltso so arrogant while debating and His Holiness asked in public where he from and advised him don't be arrogant, and from then he got angry and hatred towards His Holiness Dalai Lama. He still practice these negative emotions arrogance and hatred towards His Holniess, and teaching his students like you how to be arrogant and hatred through his practice. Ignorance students from NKT are quite pity, they hatred His Holiness Dalai Lama such a world peace maker, promoting human values and religions harmony around globe, no need to mention about his recognition around the world and all kinds of awards he received around the world.
Gen la Khyenrab Exactly.
***** Dear Khyab 'Jug, just to say that Budha Shakyamuni is my main spiritual guide. He help me overcome all my obstacles in meditation and give to me, all the time, great advices through his words. Because that I am budhist. But, I had never meet him in person and I know that, in dualistics terms, will be imposible to meet him directly. But just in dualistic terms. Blessings.
Dalai lama is a Bodhisatva sees every one with pure equanimity and loving kind
So is the DL saying that Trijang Rinpoche and Song Rinpoche, (his teachers) are also wrong? Because they gave him the practise of Dorje Shugden. I don't understand why he makes others abandon the practice because he had a bad dream about it? Seems a bit of a flaky argument to me.
Secondly, it doesnt sound to me that he is being verbally attacked, the guy just asks for the DL to open a dialogue with the Shugden practitioners which he ignores. I feel that as a leader he should show accountability for his actions and enter into public debate with the Shugdens. If he is right in his actions then he has no reason not to do this.
Lastly, I do not intend to write for arguments sake, I am merely writing my view as a freethinker myself. I truly wish that there is a debate on this topic with the DL because I think it will help bring harmony among the different traditions.
firstly teacher should be respected, but if teacher says jump from roof, will you??? Obviously no if I have brain.
Secondly, is there any consequences having dialogue, if it seems more like monologue...
So far the DL has not ever agreed to dialogue with Shugden practitioners, even being asked for many times. We are waiting and will keep asking.
look up tibetan empire. in today communism atheism shugden is a cartoon and a relic ur embarrassing Buddhism as a philosophy that it is and ruining it bad practices that is useless.
His Holiness is not saying that his teachers are wrong. Secondly His Holiness didn't had any bad dream(Don't talk shit). His Holiness is speaking through experienc,he can tackle the bad magic easily whereas common people like us it's difficult..so he doesn't want others to get the bad experience. His Holiness is the living buddha all his advices are only for good sake. FYI if u wanted to follow or workship the spirit. You are free to do so. You are welcoming ur bad omen. Good luck to the spirit followers
public debate? if this happen in old Tibet before 1951,anyone will be immediately punished (death or jail,mutilation,cutting out eyeballs,etc) if oppose this supreme god king.
long live dalai lama!!!!
Thank you His Holiness . Long live ..
Long live the dalai lama
I am Shugdenpa and I find the protesters who use insults and vulgarities to be disgraceful! Especially their silly chant of "Dalai Lama stop lying" just like spoiled little brats. This is no way to resolve differences and only you are hurting the Shugden practitioners side of debate with your childish antics. Please, if you cannot control you emotions then don't behave in such a way in the name of Bhagavan Dorje Shugden. You are not helping with such behaviors.
Wow, I’ve never met a Shugdenpa before. Also, you are totally right!
unfortunately we dont have enough cosmic knowledge to understand this complicated issue.
Shugden worse than bin laden
Provide proof.
Because they destroyed Tibetan United and they represent Chinese
ngawang sonam That isn't proof, it's a statement. You could just as easily say, "Because they come form the planet Zarg and have flippers for hands.". Proof please.
***** They weren't praising Dorje Shugden for harming people. It requires being inside a lineage to understand what the teachers of that lineage teach. Sadly you have followed the false Dalai Lama who has led you out of Je Tsongkhapa's holy tradition and into a nonsense of his own making.
***** No, they're not lying, you just don't understand what they were talking about.
Shugden practice is not a Religion but just simply practice worship of spirit. Thank you so much His Holiness the 14th Dalai Lama for showing us right path to be a pure Buddhist. Long Live His Holiness Dalai Lama!!
Proof?
kkhechog Proof, you should ask Shugden, he him self called as a Geluk pa's sprit, when he enter into Sakya monastery and asked Sakya master take him as a protector, when Sakya master asked him who are you? he replied i am sprit of Ghaden.
Sonam ten My knowledge of Dorje Shugden comes from my direct experience of him, yours comes from your poisoned view of the world. For you, everything you hear will confirm your belief that Dorje Shugden is bad and so you will never experience the truth. But you have nothing to support or excuse your harmful actions except stories you twist to suit you.
For everyone who have been criticising H.H The 14th Dalai lama as a liers, politician and etc. For his entire life he has been taking care of 6 billion refugee Tibetans. And he is not dividing Buddhism. He is just trying to convey the message that D.S is harmful for yourself. please mind your language before you point out on him. Long live Gyalwa Tenzin gyatso.
Long live His Holiness, I take refuge in his sacred teachings 🙏🏼
Why is the DL so passionate about dividing buddhism, and talking about his imaginary evil spirits? Makes no sense at all! Shouldn't he be teaching Dharma instead? Why do people keep believing this lying polititian?
for your very kind information, he is not a politician. lol. And he is not dividing Buddhism.
what? dividing Buddhism. well, you should go to the origin of this story, how this conflict has aroused. this isn't about banning shugden or giving no right to them. they manipulate whole thing, do you know why your "" shugden"is called Dolgyal. how it come to be false acclaimed Devine, maybe you are just blindly following the leader. well, you should follow them knowing the reason. you consider it as superior as Buddha and I am sure no one mind or doesn't care whether donkey call himself as tiger.
+sammy gurung Buddhism is about logic and rationality, the dalailama is about superstition and opinion. He's not genuine.
Your comment doesn't make sense!
+thenameisSonam l lanchesterreview.blogspot.co.uk/2015/06/the-false-dalai-lama-who-changes.html?spref=fb
how do you know if DL is right or wrong? is there clear evidence to avoid bias and just get the truth?
His Holiness Is Chenrezig/ Avalokiteshvara/ Kwan Yin …. It’s very bad to speak against His Holiness
brave man thank you !! so sad that the tibetan government don't want any debate or communication with us ! we are also tibetans and since this ban what ever if thats right or wrong the facts is that is harning a lots of tibetans and hate and suffering is between tibetans that is what is hapening
Dorje Shugden is a malevolent spirit, and the Tibetan spiritual leaders - separate from the government - tell people worshipping this being is dangerous, that's all.
+Tenzin Dickey - You are one of the Tibetan generations that had never known the real Tibet and born outside of Tibet but unfortunately been brainwashed by your parents and grand parents who escaped Tibet not due to persecutions by the Chinese but the fear of losing grip of their lavish living and the fear of revange from the millions of salves that had been liberated by the Chinese. The Dalai Lama is not representing the entire Buddhist community in the world of almost 1 billion, but only a small faction of about 10 milion known as Tibetan Buddhism under the Mahayana group. Buddhism will live through eternaty and seeking for an illutioned independent Tibet or the condemnation of the Shugden communuity has nothing to do with the spread of Buddhism but more of human greed, power and the Dalai Lama and his family, deeply involved in politics. There is no issue at hand as to the disunity of Buddhists as all Buddhist sects practise the teaching of the Buddha and respected the other non-Buddhist rituals like the Tibetan Buddhists in having the most religious rituals. Please be enlighten and open up your "third eye" by taking the trouble in reading both the pros and cons from the internet, books, maps and then conclude it by reading the passage from the Dharma on "KALAMA SUTTA". May you and people like you be enlighten, well and happy and not to follow a blind faith or beliefs.
Bernard Tan you got brainwashed and you still don’t know I have real pity on people like you
To be honest, the moderator is much more lacking respect in interrupting the Dalai Lama when he asks for the next question - just to lecture the Dalai Lama that they have carefully selected questions already and this is not the place and would be unfair. That was really really disrespectful.
About the Dalai Lama and Dolgyal (Shugden): Buddhism is not about that. Buddhism is about the teachings of Buddha. And it's clear: if you dont act out of love and compassion, if you act in anger and with hate, then you are on the wrong path. Please study Asangas teaching about being a Bodhisattva:
"As long as the Bodhisattva acts because of love and compassion, everything is the act of a Bodhisattva.
But when he acts because of anger he can not do good for himself or others,
Asanga comes to the conclusion: To have anger in yourself is not the practice of a Bodhisattva, to follow it the Bodhisattva will not do what he should do, and from that results finally the fault in the ethics."
Been here and there for couple of years may be less i am trying to get this Issue as close as Possible......Some says Its Banned and continuing Blaming His Holiness and Some says its not Banned it is His Holiness who while studying it very Close realized not to Follow DS not anymore . . . . Well ..We have realy great Tibetan degree of Masters and Philosophers across the world ... now Hundreds against a Million vote officially goes in favour for those Majority believers however i realy thout a lot whether they are Hundreds or we are in Millions we all hv came from the same ancesters same roots same Origin rite i would rather think of our Struggles for Independence from the Communist Regime ..common this has to be our most Purpose ... We Must Stay United for god sake we have lost many Brave Souls already .. .Why is this unnecessary quarrel over Spiritual issues ? Why i hear the hatriotism within our community ? Let me put this in short ..i dnt cr which God or Dieties u Worship or follow in times i can only Show you how much i luv for my Countrymen and for My Country as it was to my Grand parents . Those Tears in their Prayers hoping to see atleast a glimpse of Tibet befor leaving this world and His Holiness good Health thats all they wanted and look at us Fighting within Ourselfs ..n not far a day we start killing each other is that u realy want ??? its Heart breaking my Brother......continues......
I have a fulfaith on Dalai Lama. My love and respect will not going to vanish. But some time I feel sad to see some of our Tibetan brothers and sisters are causing problems by preaching wrong infromation and thoughts to innocent childrens of the god... Who are blindfully, accusing and come to the conclusion of the issue without throught reseach. You can speak you mind, it is not bad thing, but if you accuse without proper proof then it is very bad because you are spoling other mind. Please do research without bias... and then speak...
may blessings be upon those false people and false teachings from Anti Dalai Lama
David, you should not be commenting on a great world spiritual leader like the Dalai Lama without knowing any details, regarding his beliefs and hurt the sentiments of all his Buddhist and non-Buddhist followers all over the world. Dalai Lama had spoken on Shugden out of his own experience,because at one time he had also followed Shugden.He has enough wisdom and experience to know the ill effects of such worship.He always gave the people an option and their own discretion wheather to follow or unfollow Shugden.Dalai Lama has no need or attraction for wealth and power and is a simple monk, which I think you know already.Shugden is not a part of Buddhism.
But he might be acting due to blackmail by Illuminati. Their techniques are to threaten to murden your family etc if you don't say what they want. Their agenda is to cause separation and chaos, so dalai lama may not have a choice but to do this. He's actually renouncing all his own beliefs and teachings and to go against them is very distressing. I suspect he's being forced but no one ever considers that, they keep saying it's his own choice to go against dorje shugden etc and to have said on TV that his followers can harm and kill his dorje shugden practicing monks and nuns etc. Why can't they question him being forced to do this? It's how globalists control powerful people and they could actually help him overcome this instead.
you cant win an argument with god
Yes, His Holiness is flowing with an ocean of wisdom. Om Mani Padme Hum 🙏🏼
Is there any way to allow children to take drugs no way so same this spirit is not right so his holiness advise them ,listen it or not upto them if there is ban then how they have organisations and monastry in India like inside Tibetan colony in Delhi and South India,so please they are lying actually they want to run gelug tradition into spirit worshipping and against other sects
I think the monks who were expelled from their monastry for their practise of Dorje Shugden had no choice but to set up their own monastry, otherwise they would have nowhere to live and practise. That doesnt mean that they have not been ostrasised from the tibetan community and do not experience threats and intimidation. There is evidence to prove that they do. I can send you links to the evidence if you would like to see it. I found it very easily on the internet, it is not hidden.
rachael victoria wisniak When they were first expelled they had nowhere to go and were living in terrible conditions. Their monasteries wouldn't even give them the letter of expulsion they required in order to get help from the Indian authorities. Fortunately they did get help from people with some compassion and were able to set up a monastery. Now the false DL & CTA say, 'they have a monastery, there is no problem'. Deceptive in the extreme.
kkhechog i think you sre misguided in this regard. The monastic land and property is divided among those propitiate shugden and others. They were given equal share of land. Don't ever try to deceive others. I am not bothered about your belief and i respect your choice to propitiate shugden. But don't lie about little things to defame others.
kunchok Sonam Sorry but no, when they were first expelled they weren't even given the appropriate paperwork to be able to find accommodation elsewhere. To say they are being assisted by those who are actively persecuting them is ridiculous. Their expulsion was shameful and they continue to face harassment and persecution, this is the truth.
I sympathy for you for not able to understand the problem. you should listen to what His Holiness said and what they have done. The monks were given choice to propitiate shugden or not. His Holiness said that he would not talk about shugden again if majority voted to maintain the practice. However only a meagre percentage of monks decided to propitiate the shugden which is about 900-1000. Though they were not allowed to remain in the monastery, they were given their own land and property on which they have shar gaden monastery today. You can't change the fact. His Holiness never told us to be rude to shugdenpas. however it is our choice who i should have relationship with. No one can force me to have relationship with anyone. IT IS NOT ABOUT DISCRIMINATION...IT IS SOCIAL BOYCOTT ....
THERE IS NO BAN.....if you choose to insist, then you should visit India and see through your eyes.
Thank you, FreedomSeeker, for critically examining the dangerous and misleading actions of the Dalai Lama and supporting these important demonstrations with your video clip. It was about time the public finds out that there are Buddhist worldwide who have the guts to stand up to his so-called Holiness, questioning and denouncing the abuse of power that is being done to countless human beings in the name of Dharma, mainly in parts of the world the West didn't know about.
What degenerate times, so sad!
Thank you for your support.
What proof u have that shugden is evil spirit? I had been with shugden for many years and i have documented many of his teachings and predictions. By looking at them, he is a great scholar, kind teacher and his teaching is full of guru devotion, karma, compassion, how to lead meaningful life. I haven't seen even an atom of negativity in his teaching. One time at monastery, we were not studying good and often go to watch movie. One day while in trance, shugden said to us" when u have all the spiritual resources and excellent teacher as ur guidance, don't waste ur time, instead with great sense of urgency make your life meaningful otherwise when all these conducive factors are passed, you will regret so much." also he said, those who go and watch movie, why don't you watch the great treatises of buddha and commentaries by both indian and tibetan masters, you would find so many beautiful things in those". From that moments, i stopped going to cinema theater. So tell me, how can i possibly think his as evil spirit? I cant, he had been like my parents. Now because of HH ban, we can't see shuden directly via channel. the reasons given by HH are not beyond reasonable doubts. i follow truth, not person.
Then carry on with your truth and have a happy life ahead. Why to make scene and be irrational..??
Tenzin Phende Make a scene? We have been asking for dialogue peacefully in the face of his constant berating and harmful speech towards us. That it has come to this is a sign of his utter disinterest in dialogue. We would love to 'live and let live', but he is not so harmonious in his actions.
If your religion teaching you harmony and peace what is the point to become a rebellion? And As per you His Holiness is a simple person but for us he is a reincarnation of Lord Avalokiteśvara. And if he is mentioning the negative causes of worshipping Dorjee shugten, their must be a proper reason. His speech to the audience was just to aware the people who unawarely blindly following evil spirit (dorjee shugten) . He didn’t pressurize others in terminate worshipping . How stupid are you for couldnot understand the simple logic. I do not understand people that if someone goes to do good for their cause then they assault them back. nothing can happen to these assholes.
look up tibetan empire. in today communism atheism shugden is a cartoon and a relic ur embarrassing Buddhism as a philosophy that it is and ruining it bad practices that is useless.
Asshole Dorjee.... He's the living buddha. What else proof you want shit head.
Thank you International Shugden Community !
Dalai Lama, STOP LYING !
Give religious freedom !!
Dalai Lama, STOP LYING !
brainless and irrational accusation is baseless. Do you know the meaning of religion first??? I don't think so.
You are so funny.
If I was brainless, I couldn't even speak my mind or answer you.
Why are you Dalai Lama followers so blinded and radical, some even aggressive ??
Most of you have bad language habits, are angry and are not willing to reflect or listen. So sad !
Meanwhile he commits crimes against humanity. You know, it´s all a huge show with a lot of money involved, very well organized. Very well !! There is so much political, financial and cultural interest behind the DL's quest which he smartly disguises behind a religious curtain. But finally, he's a politician, that's what he was educated for, as a kid he didn't even have a choice. The West has been blind to this fact for WAY TOO LONG !!
And you followers are the victims and made believe that China is Evil. So you are afraid everybody around you not following must be paid by China, which is the funniest thing I've ever heard. I don't want their money if there should be any, we use our own. When I attend Dharma Festivals or demonstrations, I pay everything from my own money and time, that's not always very easy, but gives a very good feeling. And so should you.
Just follow the Dharma and Buddha's instructions, don't be part of a Sangha split that's happening right in front of YOUR eyes.
BUT, when we see a reason to shout out against injustice, we open our mouths and do it. As easy as that. Nice to see that there are so many Buddhists in the world who all join for the same cause, not even being from our tradition. The Dharma Wheel is turning and moving . . .
Come and join us !
Be happy and smile and relax. :-)
join you, seems like I'm walking on brink having eyes. I'm not Zombie.
Gen la Khyenrab
Thank you, Gen la Khyenrab. Looking very much forward to meeting you in October in NY.
Joerg Sternhagel .. Dalia lama mentioned only the causes and the consequences after worshipping dorjeeshugten. He didn’t forced anybody to stop worshipping. If Chinese political CIA agent dogs has paid you enough in making such statement and putting allegation against Dalia lama makes you happy. Then please go ahead. Because, the money which you earn with the greed from those Chinese political dogs , won’t digest you oneday. Support them and get ready to pay the heavy result one day. Because these Chinese political dogs are nobody’s relative. And they can became heavy to anybody.
Dalai Lama is not better than shugden! Dalai Lama was CIA and RAW helped two faces terrorist.... Under his command many Chinese and Khambali tribes of Nepal were killed..... When China kicked his ass.... Bharat was hiding his it's tail between legs .... Late Nepali king Mahendra gave him shelter and many Tibetians.......after his tried to assasinate the king ..... After he fled to Bharat with almost 16 boxes of Gold which was belongs to hard working Tibetians......as he said " forgive them bye do not forget" Nepalease forgave him ..... But almost two months ago he lied to whole world Buddha's birthplace persuaded by the country were he received daal and chapati....I knew then that is the beginning of his end. " truth can be be hidden long .....especially fake spiritual leader, real terrorist like him" Dalai Lama! Confess.... I will be forgiven.
Lol, RaviPrakashKumar, where do you get your source of info from??Your comment is full of vile and toxic.They show full of hatred without any coherent evidence or solid baseline.Yes ,Nepali government gave refuse to Tibetans but in cold and unspeakable manner.Tibetans were treated in worse by many Nepali locals with racism,discrimination,verbal abuse and sometimes even physical.Dalai lama never took the refuse to Nepal because Nepali government could not provide the security for his safety and that's why Dalai lama has never been to Nepal.Many Hindu Nepali local always expressed problems against Tibetans and towards their culture.Nepal is Hindu dominated country just like India but it was Buddhist country once during the Lichibi dynasty in ancient time.Many Tibetans have already fled from Nepal to abroad.Nepali government and many Nepali people have always one sided approach,bigotry towards Buddhists in Nepal.Nepali government tells the whole world that Nepali people are 80% Hindus which is irrelevant and false statement.Since Nepali government have not practically scaled the general Nepali population in religious base then how could it be there are 80% of Hindus and only 20% of other Nepali..Actually Buddhist population in Nepal is more than 40% or higher.
Now argument with Buddha was born in Nepal comment.I am so tired or the world had enough by the Nepali people flooding with this comment in every social medias.Especially those Nepali who does not even have basic knowledge of Buddha dharma.The rest of the world do not even care about the birthplace of Buddha,The most of Buddhist world care about the teachings of Buddha not the Buddha's birthplace.When Shakyamuni was born in Lumbini (Kapilbastu) which lies in current day Nepal,there were many kingdoms in the whole Indian sub continent including Nepal.Kapilbastu monarch had closer ties with many kingdoms which are in India now such as Vaishali,Maghad etc etc.Marriage customs were common within these Kingdoms.Even though Shakyamuni was Born in Nepal,Nepal had failed Buddhism and acted with great oppression by the Hindu kings just like in India during the Shunga dynasty by the Pushyamitra.20 years ago, Lumbini was nothing but the wasteland with no signs of holy place.If it was not the effort of the international Buddhist community, Lumbini would have been still unrecognizable wasteland.
I approve this message because I am just ordinary born and raised Nepali who has seen the time of migration of Tibetans in Nepal and also the periods of oppression towards Buddhism in Nepal until this day and age.Also I have many friends who are crossbreed of Tibetans and Newari.Newari people are the natives of the capitol in Nepal.They were merchants and were trading goods with the Tibetans from the generation in ancient time.