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Dark and Darker vs Nexon: Massive Update
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- čas přidán 18. 08. 2023
- Dark and Darker is saved
by @kirareacts • dark and darker about ...
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Channel Editors: CatDany & Daily Dose of Asmongold
If you own the copyright of content showed in this video and would like it to be removed:
/ catdanyru
If you look into steams response to Hasbro vs Atari lawsuit on Neverwinter Nights 2 and how steam has handled that it shows what steams response will be. they will never re-add the game. never winter nights 2 got removed because of the legal battle and even today after it being over and done for years, thousands of petitions, and even people begging Gaben, it has not been re-added to steam.
This game will sell like hotcakes and gaben wants his share. Ain't no way they deny them
@@linkastart even if this game sells hundreds of millions of copy and steam takes 30% and makes hundreds of millions of dollar, i doubt they would reinstate it. Since any lawsuit from nexon could easily cost them that much and potentially cost them their safe harbour status, there are much easier and less riskier way to earn that hundred million for valve. How i see this goes is that the studio head will go to jail (just like the head of gaming in nexon who did something similar when he created tera online and got jailed for few years), nexon will come to some sort of agreement with Ironmace as a studio and take a cut while they continue to develop it.
You may be right, especially if the case remains in Korea.
And what makes you or anyone else think that its Steam's/Gaben's decision?? Theres no evidence at all that after winning the lawsuit Hasbro asked to republish the game on steam and were told no. For all you know Hasbro just didnt want to give steam a 30% cut of the sales and so they made deals to publish it elsewhere that was more in their favor.
@@linkastart Neverwinter Nights 2 was new, only been up for a week. was removed. people too this day are petitioning for it to get re-added roughly 25k signatures. it gets ignored. it sells on GOG. i remember people who had CD keys for the steam version where selling them for up to 400$ online.
Steam is very very serious about even the slightest chance of copyright issues. The only way its getting back on Steam is if the legal stuff is completely done with which won't be for a long time.
there wasn't anything for nexon to stand on...the files in their case were all unreal engine assets that everyone with a key has access too. They just tried to scare them, and failed at it.
@@johnevans3562 tell that to the guy who created tera online after he left lineage 2 production and got jailed for this same charge in korea. That guys is the head of gaming at nexon right now, he got fucked once and went to jail for 3 years, he knows they got a leg to stand on. The studio head is very likely to get charge and jailed in korea.
@@johnevans3562 That isnt their case/argument, you know that right? They're suing them in Korea for things like unfair competition prevention and trade secret protection. Essentially arguing that the Dark and Darker developer who used to work for them infringed on their "trade secrets" and engaged in unfair competition. They're arguing that he worked for them developing a game behind closed doors but then ran off to make an imitation of it and sell it himself before they could finish theirs. Now you can say whatever you want to about your personal opinion on the matter but Korean law is Korean law and they have a good case here and very well may win.
@@gotouchsomegrasstoday This is completely incorrect. No one went to jail in tera case. They received suspended sentence, so they didn't actually go to jail.
@@gotouchsomegrasstoday TERA is different though. My understanding is that the Source Code in that was definitively stolen. Not inspired or copied, but straight ripped the source code to pitch TERA to a Japanese developer who then reported the stolen code.
Dark and darker is in pre release and it is more enjoyable than 90% of games on steam. Im hoping we get a console version because it would blow up so fast.
Console dark and darker would be trash sorry to say
Its the best game out there right now.
@@HurdAround agreed
Inventory management is going to be hard
@@animetiddies8320 yes but I could see them adding a loot all button and loads of other games on console you can organize inven with one button unlike pc where you have to click and drag and click and drag and click and drag
Why do many comments in this video support Dark and Darker?
1. The team leader violated serious corporate rules in Nexon and was fired because of it, while P3 project (original project of Dark and Darker design).
-ex. attempt to take team members to the other corporation, and save project data into a private server.
2. Then that team leader takes about 50% of the P3 project team members into the new corporation IronMace, and finishes the project as Dark and Darker.
3. Because of No.2 reason, P3 project lost core members of game development, so Nexon could not proceed with the project.
This is why almost all Korean gamers support Nexon even though Nexon has a bad image in South Korea.
I think most people who support IronMace just want to play Dark and Darker again even if it is made with crime (charge of industrial spy by
Prevention of Unfair Competition law).
There is a lack of concrete evidence to support the claims made by Nexon. It's crucial to approach their statements critically and not unquestioningly accept their assertions. After all, Nexon is well known for evil corporation.
This aged bad😂
댓글창 보니까 대부분 넥슨을 악이라고 보는데, 넥슨이 피해란 피해는 다 봤는데 왜 넥슨이 욕을 먹어야 하는지 전혀 모르겠네 ㅋㅋㅋ
넥슨은 지금 돈 퍼주고 시간 퍼줬는데 개발자가 그걸 가지고 도망갔다면 누가 잘못한거임?
생각도 못하는 바보들이죠 사실상. 지들 믿고 싶은 것만 믿고 여론에 휩쓸리는 사람들이나 마찬가지에요.
It doesn't mean much - it was dismissed without prejudice (can be filed again). The court simply declined to be the venue for the complaint.
Dismissed without prejudice but with suspicion of nexons true motives. Judges own words. If they appealed it the judge would likely dismiss it with prejudice almost immediately unless they could prove Korean courts can't properly litigate the case, which theyve already failed to do. Unless something massively changed in the Korean courts their appeal will never be approved.
@@Vultin1 Nexon tired this case in Korea and failed twice didnt they?
@@Vultin1 "... unless they could prove Korean courts can't properly litigate the case, which theyve already failed to do", source?
@@Tyyin. source?
The reason there arent any clones yet is because, this is going to surprise some people, game development is hard. It's time consuming and requires a significant amount of manpower. At least if someone wants to make something good. First impressions are everything and no competent dev wants to rush a half assed product and miss their one in a million shot. Guarantee you there are similar games being made as we speak. But game development is hard it's still too soon for anything actually decent to be ready
There are many clones popping up on steam right now actually. Look at "Dark" and "Greed is Good"
FYI they arent as good as DaD
@@aaazririssaaxcaartttrvirue9863 Well Dark and Darker has the advantage of their lead dev having already built and tested all the systems and concepts and designs etc on Nexon's budget with Nexons team. So all he had to do was take that knowledge and then make his own game with it. That's literally the point of the lawsuit FYI. So as much as you may like the game there's a very real chance it will get shut down. Whether other people's renditions of the genre will be better or worse is anyone's guess none of us know yet.
But there are already clones popping up. "Dark" and/or "Greed is good" are both clones of dark and darker and I see a lot of the same assets in them.
@@reqhart See there you go. Obviously people are working on things. But nothing has actually been released yet. It's pretty easy to slap some assests together and take some screenshots or quick videos. It's a completely different thing to release a working and fun game. Hasn't happened yet for a reason.
“Maybe I’m wrong” god I love to hear it
Honestly this game doesn't need steam. We never use to have launchers, and the game is just fine without steam. Without steam getting a cut, will keep prices in Devs pockets too
Nexon is probably going to win the case in Korea and the game will shut down again. They are arguing that he stole trade secrets and engaged in unfair competition. Their argument is that he worked for them developing something behind closed doors, but then ran off with all that knowledge and design concepts and made an imitation of it so he could sell it himself. It's a strong legal case no matter what people's opinions on the matter are.
There's no argumentation that he built smth behind closed doors, It's about using a nexon servers for files + arguing that he has taken assets developed by a team (he was a part of) in Nexon and he (+ other devs that left) used the same assets & code to build Dark & Darker.
If there's nothing in his contract or clause on after contract termination period that prevents him to develop a game in the same genre/similar game --- which some companies make u sign --- and if they have built the entire game and its code from the ground up and manage to prove it ---> Nexon will lose the case.
It's a "strong case" for Nexon if they have evidence + prove that Ironmace used Nexon assets/code (or he had a clause not to developed a similar game/similar design).
---
Ironmace already stated (publically) that they've built the game with their own assets/code + unreal store assets, which would be extremely stupid definite thing to say (publically) if not true and can get you into even more legal trouble for lying/deception + malicious intent instead of just PR rigged talk with statement that you're going to battle the claim in court.
Logic postulates they are not that insanely stupid and the more probable logically thing is that it's the truth.
@@6kembe4orba Nope. In Korea they are suing over violating unfair competition laws and trade secrets. Korean laws are not the same as American. They are accusing him of taking all the knowledge and design concepts that came from their "P3" project and running off to hire his own team and make essentially the same game with that knowledge which, as the name implies, they say was a violation of unfair competition laws and the stealing of trade secrets. For example, during his time at Nexon while working on "P3" he probably learned all about what kinds of things do and dont work and how to structure everything based off all their internal play testing. It's not just about "making a similar game" it's about taking all the things the P3 devs learned and tested and then running off with that knowledge to make a competing product essentially screwing them after They funded the project that he learned everything from. They will likely win.
@@6kembe4orba He was accused of stealing code and assests which is why the police got involved. They decided the theft accusations weren't strong enough to justify arresting him and hes not a flight risk so they'll let the two parties settle things in court. Nexon is accusing him of violating the unfair competition prevention and trade secret protection act. Which defines trade secrets as: information, including a production method, sale method, useful technical or business information, that is not known publicly, is the subject of reasonable efforts to maintain its secrecy, and has independent economic value. All Nexon has to prove is that he took INFORMATION such as "technical information" that was acquired while building and testing their secret P3 project and then used it to build a competing product. All the things learned and developed during their internal testing and play builds can be considered technical information, along with things like code. If he took that information and used it to build a competing product (which he did) Nexon will win the case.
@@6kembe4orba IM can't prove the development period of the game where all the game concepts development and approval took place. The unity store assets argument is pointless because nexon aren't claiming ownership of those they're saying its the ones used as placeholder in the original game.
Oh they aren't stupid, they're just not telling the whole truth and the people who're listening to them fucking are given how hard it is for people to get any actual facts of the case into their head.
@@kavinh10 this was hard to read - it looks like a bot made comment or translated by google. Edit it properly with proper punctuation + your points/arguments made clear cause this is a mess.
I will comment only on the 1st sentence as that's the only one that makes complete sense both as an argument and as sentence.
This a bold claim by you and it's pure speculation - we'll see how the court case goes.
It doesn't mean anything, Ironmace just won't be bleeding money into legal proceedings in NA.
Yeah I haven’t really wanted to buy it just yet, since they haven’t settled the court case. When they do and if it’s in their favor I definitely will buy.
Why do you care about the case
@@lovropeter9988because you could lose money, so why spend it if you can wait.
@@randomnobody9229yeah after the assets gets claimed it will be rereleased in some state most likely anyway.
@@randomnobody9229How though? If you had a good time at the movie theater, and then later found out the movie you watched isn't being shown anymore. Did you lose money?
@@Cimo8 The better equivalent would be buying the movie and then no longer being able to watch it. You're not purchasing the movie at the theater.
궁금하면 번역기 돌리던가 해라.
넥슨은 근본이 인디게임 회사였다.
그리고 어쩌다보니 규모가 커진 넥슨은 여러게임을 만들어 볼려고 시도했었다. 하지만 번번히 실패했고, 작은 회사 시절에 그들이 도둑맞은 게임도 적지않다.
하지만 그럼에도 인디게임회사에 지원하는 것을 그들은 결코 멈추지않았다. 힘들다는 것을 본인들도 알기에.
앞에 선 기업으로써 먼저 보여주고 싶어 했다.
넥슨의 강의 들어보거나 대회 참여해본 사람들은 안다 그 사람들이 게임이란걸 얼마나 사랑하는지를.
이는 넥슨의 적자로 이어졌다. 그이후로 시도한 가챠 문화는 일본에서 처음 시도해서 성공적으로 이어졌고, 하나의 게임문화로 자리잡게 되었고,
넥슨은 재정적으로 여유가 생기고 대표와 직원들이 바뀌면서 인디게임에 더 많은 지원을 할 수 있게 되었다.
그렇게 각 잡고 만든 프로젝트를 훔친
'돈만 밝히는 끔찍한 아이언메이슨'은 반성은 커녕 사과조차없다.
굉장히 무례한, 이런 범죄기업이 성공한다면 게임업계에 더 이상의 발전은 기대하기 어려울 것이다.
제발 지옥에 쳐박히고 다크앤다커는 중국에서 표절해서 양산형되길 바란다
다크앤다커는 넥슨의 품으로 되돌아와야죠 ㅋㅋㅋ 아이언 메이스는 말그대로 법이란 이름의 아이언 메이스로 맞아서 공중분해 당하고 손해액만큼 보상해줘야지 ㅋㅋㅋ 나가죽을것들 ㅋㅋㅋ
Wait, you said that dark and darker looked "way too early in development"? But the stuff they showed in nexons project whatever screencaps made it look like closer to what dark and darkers first playtest revealed, given the timeline wouldn't that prove that they did in fact rebuild dark and darker from the ground up?
just go through the subreddits updates. Nexon has no case. Dark and Darker was built from the ground up by the devs. Nexon was trying to claim regular Unreal Engine assets as stolen by Dark and Darker devs, obv that’s not how it works. Nexon is just money hungry, they never were going to win any case.
@@KiazaKadaj How are they money hungry from people with no money?
@@frostdracohardstyle u realize the game has already made millions of dollars right? they want to win the case for a settlement of 100 mil or more god u are so intelligent bro
This isnt worth the arguing bro 😂. What are you even on about bro
@@puntacana7550 you ever consider that you use the word bro too often?
As much as I love the game itself, many ppl are misunderstanding the situation. The real problem of IronMace is that the "Game Design" part of Dark and Darker was clearly done in Nexon which is huge and critical part of any game dev cycle and also taking very long time. so what they did is, used Nexon's money and men power to build game design and brought it to their new company and built on top of that with those 3rd party assets. so their claim of "we built it from ground up" is totally wrong argument, because they definitely have stolen "game design" from Nexon.
There are clones they just died because of lack of exposure.
Well devs just might show their game to nexon and they will get all the exposure they can get 😂
Just a heads up - Hunt: Showdown - came out before dark and darker and is a PvPvE with a Cthulhu Western theme. Highly recommend it, by Crytec!
im 100% under the impression IronMace's few employees from nexon DEFINITELY took things. But the main thing here is, Can nexon prove it, figure out what it was, and / or provide that information without leaking absolutely everything they may consider a "trade secret" or so they worded it.
Based off what evidence? if you don't mind me asking.
@@Vultin1”under the impression” I say that because honestly who knows.
I don’t need evidence to have an opinion based off of how the leadership of IronMace have acted lately,
The issues that arrived, but I’ll be open and say, I’ve bought the game, I bought red stones, and I enjoy it and am happy it’s out.
@@zninebiggs4911 fair enough, watch out for those crossbow skelllys
@@Vultin1 the dev in question had a court filing against him to turn over the content on the server he setup without authorization he deleted everything and there's email logs about him telling his partner to do it. there's also the fact that the placeholder assets were the exact same ones used in the original project and the korean games developer union not stepping in at all to defend him. Not talking about you but people who think it's one sided and IM are innocent tend to be the same crowd who get all their news off malicious influencers who say what their audience wants to hear rather then the truth.
@@Vultin1디스코드에 아이언메이슨이 범행사실 인정한것도 한국에서는 증거가 된다.
He didn’t join a game, he’s hiding his balding.
I mean a hat is for outside not inside while your gaming lmao.
What about Summit1G
Ironmace should win. I don't actually give a shit about the truth of the situation, I just want Nexon to lose.
Why does the thumbnail asmon look like he's in a Mr. Beast video
Huge is a bit on an overstatement.
Dark and darker clones would probably get the crap sued outa them by nexon
If that happens and dad doesn't have Nexon code it will actually helps in favor dad case instead of Nexon. So if a clone release on ea probably Nexon won't do anything unless they are dumb
@@NeDixTV
True. You can copy a concept, just not copyrighted/trademark assets.
If someone made a superior version of Nexon's games without their assets, Nexon can't touch them.
Why would they, tho? It's not like they are ex-employee from nexon too?
안타깝게도 다크앤다커 출시에 관해서 넥슨이 법적으로 할 수 있는 것은 없습니다.
한국이 게임으로 열정적이긴해도 정부는 그렇지않기에 오히려 보수적이고 개편이없으며 게임에 해당되는 법안이 따로 있지도 않습니다.
그래서 게임을 도둑질당한 많은 기업들이 , 이로인해 피해를 보았습니다. 물론 이긴사례도 있지만, 대부분은 작은 회사들이라 빼앗겼죠.
한국은 공정거래법이란게 있는데 게임은 이에 해당하지않았습니다. .. 여전히 정부의 관심 밖입니다.
넥슨, 그저 그들이 할 수 있는건은 소송을 크게 키워 인디게임회사들이 많은 도둑질을 당하고 있다는 것을 알리는 것입니다. 그들은 질 가능성이 높다는 것을 알고 있고, 자신들이 피해자인 것을 알고있습니다.
이번일로 도둑질 당하는 많은 게임회사들이 있다는 것을 알리는게 그들의 목적입니다.
이로 인해서 한국에 제대로된 게임 법안이 마련되었으면 합니다..😢
The case in South Korea is not against IronMace or DnD in particular. It's against Nexon's ex-employee mr.Cho and it has been dragged on for almost 2 years without any proves of Nexon's claims.
Cho admitted to a lot of nexons claims. The question is whether he used the stuff he took from them.
he literally admitted to all the crimes clown. there's no proof because he deleted all of it before Nexon could take it
If only you give the source for that?
10:03
If Ironmace is in the right, they should counter-sue Nexon for the most devastating amount possible.
Asmon definitely not bias he definitely supported it
He supported the bigger company as is always the case, before the lawsuit he said it is a good game then he says they are 100 guilty
Well, he keeps saying that he thinks someone at DnD did something wrong and gives Nexon the benefit of the doubt. How is that not biased? And how the f is what Asmon thinks that a DnD did something, without even providing arguments, relevant at all? He shouldn't even be saying that imo, but yeah, extremely popular content creator bubble.
I mean it was kinda shady what they were doing after the lawsuit. Especially with the mods supposedly doing that fundraiser without permission from the devs
"Is he joining a gang? His hat's backwards" yea if it was like from the late 90s to early 2000s
When the game is in Steam/Epic I buy it
Why isn’t anyone trying to pull for a dark and darker type mode on the Diablo platform. Would be a Billion dollar game.
hunt showdown and tarkov tried it in the fps genre, too hard core and skill entry level made it just a niche.
@@kavinh10 right but Diablo already has the infrastructure for it. Super generic reusable dungeon layouts, Loot systems, extraction mechanics in the pvp zones. Think about a dungeon 3 times the size of a regular one with 4 teams of 3 in there.
@@Bumblebeetunes Diablo pvp is played by pvers bro. No pvpers enjoy it. Arpgs are just spam simulators
@@jacobbatchelor7877 you must of misunderstood me. I didn't recommend making an ARPG. I recommended using their platform to make a Dungeon Looter/Extraction PvP mode. League Arena attracts an entirely additional player base than the original format, so I wouldn't just assume only PVE'ers from Diablo would be interested in trying it.
becouse its not
its incredibly niche game, its only popular becouse of the drama
Hey tho I just pretty much evacuated to Houston from Cali. That hurricane is coming for Cali right now at about 150 mph
dark and darker hit me harder than most games in the past couple of years, its really really good, it was recommended to me by the Pantheon: rise of the fallen creative director.
Hahaha
@@lordcarl3094 skill issue
@@lordcarl3094anything that buffs your health is not bis. Do you even know what bis means? That’s called a garbage roll and you take the L and sell that gear for cheap or wear it not expecting much
@@lordcarl3094 You have a stash like in Tarkov. Pubg doesnt have that. Sounds like immense Skill issue to me.
@@lordcarl3094 this comment was straight up schizophrenic 😂 if your internet sucks and you disconnect from games, obviously that will annoy you. I’ve only disconnected from one or two games in the past 150 hours of gameplay, and they have option to reconnect now so I don’t have the same problem as you. And so you are telling me gear means genuinely nothing? So if I have all legendaries that stack weapon damage and face someone from the same class with all default starting items, it’s a 50/50 crapshoot on who wins? You don’t understand this game enough to talk about it honestly
If I cant play this on Steam, im not downloading any sussy launchers. Next
Didn't Nexon make that counter strike zombies knockoff? lmaooooo and maple story?
The link in the description isn't the right one, links to the previous update of Kira's on Dark n Darker
“Massive news” the court is in Korea…
Oh, so just like 90% of the election cases, this case was not evaluated on merit, simply dismissed on a technicality. Got it.
Lemme save you sometime, nothing happened more info soon
Know facts before you yap, basically
What makes me curios in favor for the devs is the fact that some employes left their jobposition in a megacon structure to follow their former teamleader (the one in the line of fire for stealing the data) into a unsecure startup-company and redo their last projekt in a way obviously for everybody to be a copy even its build up from scratch
Why would a team of people take such a risk knowingly?
My bet is: Nexon lies. They did cancel the project. Of course in my country that wouldnt automaticly give them ownership for it. Legaly they still had no good cards. The employes must have thought Nexon has zero interest in the projekt anymore. And I bet this was true until the hypetrain ringed all the bells. If this helps the devs, I doupt it.
So, biased comment
@@mfulan7548 its just something that made me curios. Nothing in it for me. The report could be not accurate, or I miss another info that would explain. Just a little bet without coins. Bias is completly different. Oh and I bet against the devs as you see , in legal terms as you see.
@@bAtACt1X Ohh, ok. Sorry, my bad
Why would a non-compete be needed for a copywrite claim?
Sounds like IronMace? wanted to have the American courts ajudicate this case, however the American courts went, No this issue belongs in South Korea ajudicate it there. Honestly, I think Nexxeon is going to win this, solely because the game was half Designed by them.
agree, ironmace wants the american court to ajudicate this because they have a chance of winning. In korean court, they are guarantee to lose. Nexon's head of gaming got jailed in korea for the exact same crime when he was working on Tera Online after he left the studio creating lineage 2, he was jailed for 3 years. Nexon knows what they are doing when they filed the lawsuit.
It was literally Iron Maces Lawyer who asked for the US case to be dismissed. Nexon wanted the case in the us for a potential bigger payout
Eh idk about that, Nexon has already tried to go after them twice, maybe more, previously in Korean courts and lost.
More like because Nexon will get a Korean judge that they have in their pocket.
Wait .... I don't know it's Nexon, didn't they made Grand Chase & Elsword
I thought Nexon already tried to press charges in Korea , but failed twice?
No.
Oh shit, it's kira
biased because i love dark and darker but Nexon has to know that if they win and release another version there will be a decent bit of the base that will avoid it. Not only because of the lawsuit but also because all of their games are microtransaction hell
Im checking everyday if its back on the steam, so hyped but i cant spend my money, im loaded on steam from the old cases
I still think that, from the evidence I've seen, that Ironmace is likely in the wrong.
Ironmace will win, just look at the signs.
this game have great concept
3:27 To do business with Steam/valve or Epic Games etc. even in the slightest, you must agree to arbitration to resolve any disagreements of substance. Arbitration is a big tool at the disposal of large game platforms which is absolute shit. Glad the case is getting kicked back to where it should be being handled.
Steam should add DaD again, just block it in Korea xD
There's already an ongoing-case similar to this happening in the U.S. where the focus is all about trade secrets (Nexon's main point of the lawsuit). It's Tesla vs Rivian, where Rivian was hiring/poaching (ex-)Tesla employees for the obvious reason of those Tesla employees possessing exclusive knowledge that can be applicable to their own products as a rival company. IMO, this plus any potential non-compete clauses/arguments, makes it really hard for Ironmace to win the lawsuit since they've already admitted to working on P3 (iirc) as employees under Nexon. Ironmace's only advantage is the contention with IP copyright since they didn't copy code or models verbatim. However, copyright has little relevance since this is about trade-secrets/non-competes being exclusive to ex-employees which Nexon has Ironmace dead-to-rights for. The copyright issue is only just the direct result of infringing on trade-secrets/non-competes in this case.
Regardless of David vs. Goliath bias, Nexon has an actual case/reason to go after Ironmace imo. If they don't, it sorta sets precedent in Korea that it's perfectly fine to infringe on these matters which could lead to all sorts of issues in the industry.
@@support_mage The reasoning is that Nexon is losing potential future profits, because who is to say they wouldn't decide to bring that project back up in 5-10 years and retry it with more ideas? But to be honest, I still don't know how I feel about this situation.
@@support_mage Don't forget the speicifc wrinkle in this one though, this isn't just previous work or abandoned project. Nexon's project had to be stopped because the employees got poached by the fired ex-lead during active development. Inspiration by itself is fine, but it doesn't include actively sabatoging the very project that you got the inspiration from in order to achieve said inspiration.
Its possible that DaD sticks around after the trials in SK depending on how it pans out in the copyright segment, but assuming similar but less agregious case (Tera) at the minimum the ex-lead and potentinally other employees are looking at least 3 years in prison. The ex-lead's defenses in the Korean case doesn't help either: he admitted to breaking written contracts/agreements that he signed on the very same day and for stolen work data his defense was that Nexon told him repeatedly not to but didn't enforce right away, so he is fine. And when they did enforce it through a written forensics investigation agreement that the ex-lead signed on, he then and went on to fully wipe the server containing the data before the investigation could happen.
This whole case has been such a great lesson on cognitive biases. There's so much cope and mental gymnastics people are engaging in because they liked the game, and people are allowing this to destroy any kevel of rationality they may have previously posessed.
@support_mage Exactly. It's like two people going into a movie theater and watching the same movie and coming out with completely different ideas of what it was about. One person remembering scenes, another one doesn't, denying they even were there, etc.
@@support_mage Also, I wouldn't really call what Ironmace did "inspiration" as P3 (by Nexon's account) was the exact same premise of being a medieval Tarkov like DaD. Inspiration would be like FFXVI taking inspiration from DMC. They're still both completely different games with different goals, themes, mechanics, and etc. DaD vs P3? Not so much. They basically thesaurus'd the game(P3) with store assets as far as calling their game "inspiration." And, as others have mentioned, the history by which Ironmace came to be is shady at best.
I don't see the hype, but I hope D&D wins because I hate corporations
this is the channel that made me download channel blocker
LET'S FUCKING GOOO!! When you getting on it ASMOON! FUUUURK
Arbitration is not done by the courts. The entire reason for arbitration is to not go to the courts but to have a third party (arbitrator) to look at the facts and make a decision.
I'm just shocked they haven't settled out of court yet
Nexon wants them to immediately stop working on the game, fire all employees previously employed at nexxon, and pay them damages that are enough to bankrupt the developers.
I haven't bought dark and darker because of this lawsuit. otherwise i would have bought it on steam, so they lost tons of money. I'm positive others feel the same way as far as where they purchase games.
It’s also stupidly overpriced. $35 for this crap? No thanks. It’s like a $15-20 game at the very most.
@@pete5516Youre crazy. This game is an easy $35 purchase. Its worth so much more, its such a good game and its very clear you dont play it.
Most people wont buy because its not on Steam but I dont understand that. Its Dark and Darker who gives a fuck what it is on. If its brought to steam, itll most likely swap over. Its not worth losing all this gametime over what platform it is on lol. Its so ridicilous to me but asmongold viewers be weird sometimes.
Yet people pay 70 dollar for a piece of shit game as DIablo 4 lmao. Got more hours in this game than that garbage.@@pete5516
@@MrBloodsplatt I have played it, and I enjoy it. You are crazy for assuming and putting words in other peoples mouths. I just wouldn’t pay 35, the game is poorly optimised and to be frank it looks like crap
It feels like Nexon is intentionally sabotaging the developers of D&Der. The only reason for Nexon sueing them in America seems to be that it draws out of the legal process. It feels like Nexon is trying to starve them out to set an example of what happens to people who decide to leave the company.
This is all speculatory, I don't know enough about Korean (business) culture or the finer details of the case to say anything of actual worth.
They didn't 'leave' the company they were 'fired' which is very hard in korea. Usually when the big bois in Korea kick out an innocent worker(whether they were lazy, or lack capability or whatever reason) they force them to resign because it is almost impossible to fire a permanent employee that did not do serious demrit against the employer. D&D clearly stole the game from Nexon, which is why even Koreans who hate Nexon(Because here are many Koreans who don't play Nexon games and unlike in the case of America everyone knows nexon even if they don't play their game) says Ironmace is the villian in this case.
"Massive update" lol
The games $35 and I have 150+ hours in it already. If I get $1 an hour out of a game then I’m happy. I got my moneys worth. Been having a blast with the boys pooping on kids and taking their cookies! I spend more than $35 on a tip for my bar tab for a single night of drinking lmfao 😂
Why the hell is it not back on Steam then?
if the game should not exist, but it does exist. so obviously that's a problem
I play this game. It's great. Worth the money.
Agreed having a blast
Same, can't believe people still think they would lose or ""cashgrab and run""
@@messerchin Some people just dont wanna buy the game that they can lose in a month, its a wasted money.
@@sallee132I can think of worse ways to lose $35USD xD
@@sallee132 dawg i live in a poor 3rd world country and i still bought the game 35$ is like 2 weeks worth of food and im having a blast best 35$ I've spent on a game with thousands of hours worth of entertainment i wouldn't be mad if the company lost the legal suit cuz i still enjoyed it , you could say it's also an investment cuz ur able to make some real money in this game if ur smart enough
If this game ends up getting pulled because of Nexon then I hope their company gets shelled by NK
CZcamss really gotta start giving a cut to the creators you're reacting to...
It's so weird that CZcams is so cool with reaction content, but demonitize the fuck out of anyone that does edits for livestreams (Jerma for example)
why? the creator only gains from this video. 99% of the people watching this would have never watched the main video, and i'm sure now if people think his content is good will go over and subscribe. It's ridiculous that people get upset over free exposure
@@FishEyess because this requires the content he didn't make in order to create. 90/10 split original uploader/react person.
Isn't this the case about assets that Nexon is claiming belongs to them but in fact it's an asset package for Unreal Engine 5 available for everyone to use?
No, it was never about the asset. I suggest watching the previous video about it.
It was never about assets really. Ironmace keeps peddling this as a copyright issue, but it was never about that. The main case is closer to that of non-compete cases. An example of this would be when rival car companies hire ex Tesla employees and they start applying what Tesla does to that car company, resulting in similar systems probably infringing on patents. I think this happened with Tesla vs Rivian iirc, which is still ongoing I think?
@@Pearcen not a new thing in the industry btw, the Metro series started on a stolen STALKER engine around the time part of the STALKER team went to work on their own game, which became Metro 2033. STALKER DNA is still visible in Metro, especially 2033.
@@lukkkasz323 that is true from western game development point of view, but korean are bit different. Look up the case of tera online vs lineage 2, same thing where tera was created based on prototype of lineage 2, the head of the studio got sued and went to jail for like 3 years. Said head of studio now work as head of gaming at nexon.
@@Pearcen Yeah there was only like 1000 code matching generic game elements like torch_1 or something.
I just want it to come to steam i dont play games anywhere else but steam for security trust and support reasons so i hope this means it comes soon.
Steam overlay hogs a gig of your pc’s ram and uses a bunch of other resources, most people with mid end pcs or above don’t need to worry about it but it’s worth considering that steam is inefficient and full of bloatware
Overlay Optional@@pete5516
bloatware is better than chinese or russian spyware(+coin miners)@@pete5516
Ofc Tips did not pick up Dark and Darker because Tips is clueless...his not a gamer he's just another opportunist.
I think if Dark and Darker wins in South Korean court over Nexon then it probably will get back on Steam but only if they win in court and only after all the appeals are done. The reason why is it would have proofed that it isn't breaking the law and the DMCA claim was an overreach but also for Valve to put in to the store what people want to buy.
No They Can't win Nexon.
FUK STEAM! Coffee Stain Publishing all da WAAAAAAY!
It was Ironmace who proposed dismissing the case in WA. Nexon pushed for this lawsuit to happen. This lawsuit got thrown out according to Ironmace's will and their arguments.
This IS a strong W, don't be ridiculous.
Kira got a girlfriend and is wearing her clothes
too bad it's not free again such a shame
Takes game from Nexon because they don't want it to be monetized like Nexon, then proceeds to monetize it like Nexon.
Not even close
Nexon is one of the founding fathers of P2W. Ironmace doesn't come remotely close.
you know that majority fo settlers in america were north asian?
Hat being backwards means being in a gang?, Asmon is weird sometimes. Sometimes if your hair is messy and don't wanna bother, you wear a hat, if you are indoors or with a streaming mic in front of you, you wear it backwards to not get in the way.
He’s kidding. Out of touch is the joke.
It was a joke
as soon as it hits steam im buyin
Can’t wait for the game to get to steam so I can see these whiny noobs in the dungeon
I think dark and darker is guilty as s*** for stealing the game but I don't care I love the game
So a giant nothingburger of a video? I want my 20 minutes back.
dark and darker team are not going to win this. nexon have provided too many evidences to back them up
BG3, Dark and darker. Best games of the Year for me. I didn't try the AAA game's. They looked shitty. D4 looked shitty. You can tell how good a game is by the way people just can't stop learning about them. BG3 and dark n darker are those games.
Ok, the thumbnails are jusy getting weird now. What is that creepy filter?
Hey look, Asmon reacting to one of Kira's videos 👀
That will butthurt some people that want to sink Kira for talking about the plummeting stories of web3 😆
another trash "premium currency" game
People are happy that there's a dismissal because a great game is moving forward in its legal process
Loved you in netflix amber heard documentary!
I wish nothing but the best for the developers and the entire team who works on the game!!!
Your comment got stolen by a bot 😔
So when i played dark and darker it was kinda ok i guess. But i hate Nexon with a burning passion.
So 35 dollars just so i can do a "Go f**k yourself!" to Nexon is worth ngl. If Iron Mace actually wins (which is unlikely) my sides will be in f**king orbit lol
Remnant p4?
Hope this buries Nexon to the ground, a company everyone should stay as far away as possible. Good lord, they are such a bad joke!
i dont understand they stole the game from nexon? but nexon have no good games so its not possible
there is alot of clone games already in the making
dark and darker is cool but like its kinda shit in that you can get 1/2 shot constantly..
the only people with gear are the people who are good at the game everyone else is naked
you have to outplay someone with decent gear on HARD to have a SLIGHT chance at winning
basically you can play with subpar gear which does literally nothing or you go naked 10 times and then go big dick mode 1 time theres no real progression feel in terms of gear its either amazing gear or literally worthless gear might as well be naked
Does Asmon play Dark and Darker?
He touched it a little bit
I don't care this game is terrible. I deleted it from my steam account, because it was so bad. And usually I don't do that.
Skill issue
Iron mace chad status
Big
Big news w