Massive 1954 Motorola 24 inch Black And White Console Television
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- čas přidán 12. 11. 2021
- attempted to resuscitate old TV, not all are saveable
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![Electronic Circuitry Diagnosis And Fault Finding! [Repair]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LC7OjuYAOQE/mqdefault.jpg)
This was my grandma's TV she gave us so us kids could watch it in the basement. I still remember sitting on the floor and watching Alan Alda do the promos for a new show coming out called MASH.
this very one or same model?
I would think the reason that CRT's are measured diagonally is because they started out being round, so the size was basically the diameter. Then manufacturers found ways to make them square-er, so they would fit in smaller cases, but the most important measurement would still be the distance between the corners. I don't think that's cheating.
When my wife and I married in 1973, our first television was one exactly like this one (except it had its back!). It was a gift from my father-in-law, and we used it for several years.
Dumont Royal Sovereign (1951) had a 30" CRT.
I agree. My Dad was a GE employee and bought a top of the line console "Ultravision" TV in late 1954, similar in appearance to shango066's Motorola. It was designated 21", but that was the corner to corner measurement of the CRT. The viewable diagonal was about 20". A common portable TV measurement was 17" with viewable diagonal of 16".
TV sets had a safety glass in front of the CRT, to protect room occupants from flying glass should the CRT implode. Spontaneous implosions did occur. I recall a statistic of about 50 a year with millions of TV sets in use. In the early 1960s, the bonded CRT went into production, with the safety glass bonded to the CRT. The improved integrity allowed manufacturers to push the corners out, so a 17" CRT became a 19" with more of the picture corners visible but not increasing the size of objects on the screen.
In the late 1960s, a Federal Law was passed which required manufacturers to measure the viewable picture, addressing the "cheating". A 19" screen became a 18" screen. It was hard for salesmen to explain that a new TV with 18" screen had the same size as the customer's old 19" screen. Manufacturers tried to eliminate the diagonal measure and quote square inches of viewable area. That did not go over well with customers, either. A next generation of CRTs was developed, basically increasing picture size. A TV might be labelled 20" with the additional notation "Designated 21" in Canada". (Canada didn't pass a similar law.)
The story on the bonded CRT: Corning Glass Works was making the CRTs and Pittsburg Plate Glass made the safety glass. Corning worked with adhesive manufacturers to develop the clear bonding adhesive, allowing them to make a CRT and safety glass assembly, taking the safety glass business away from Pittsburgh Plate Glass.
Correct
Shame about the tube. I remember my parents rented a 24" b&w tv when I was a little kid. Watching the tv engineer fix it is what got me interested in electronics and my first job was an apprentice tv engineer.
When I was in High school I worked for a Dumont dealer who was in his 80's. This dealer had a really nice 30 inch tv that you mentioned, it was HUGE. Every year he used to display it at the county fair.
The "DuMont Royal Sovereign" ‽ Can't post links in the comments, but if you google that, picture should come up.
When I was a kid in the 80s I looked forward to Saturdays because of Saturday morning cartoons like Bugs Bunny and the Road Runner and coyote.
Nowadays it's Saturday morning, Shango066 just dropped a video.
Nowadays I just look forward to making another day. Heh
How sad it had to end like this. I've been looking forward to this set in particular since Shango let us all have a peek at it a while back. I really would have liked to see this Moto rise and shine
Come into my parlor, said the spiders to the flyback.
That set was loaded with them! Even at the end, one of them resected and was moving about! Haha!
Whenever Shango posts a video it makes my day.
Same feeling here 👍🏻
One of Motorola TVs I restored had this same issue, 100% dead CRT. It did produce a picture and had a heater to cathode short. I was able to source a replacement CRT and restored the TV as I really wanted to save the TV. The cabinet is all Bakelite. I also have my grandfather's 21" Motorola TV and it had a rebuilt CRT in it when I got it. Motorola really did aim for serviceability as both my TVs are just as easy to pull the chassis as yours was. Since I rarely ever plug my Grandfather's TV in, I just recapped it but I never changed out the seleniums. When I restored the other TV, I used a wire wound resister that had a sliding tap on it to adjust the resistance. I used this to get the voltage where I needed it after installing silicon rectifiers.
same. EVERY Motorola B&W set I've ever run across has had a stone cold dead CRT. EVERY SINGLE ONE.
what a Kool 1954 motrola back and white console tv when I lived at home with my mom and dad mom and bout a motrola cloard tv console in 1963
Tacky ass gimmicky antenna setup. Give that man a cigar! 😁
It would be an interesting experiment to try to zap the tube back into conducting. Charge a high voltage cap about 1-10nf to 1-2kv and connect it to the cathode and grid. Maybe that would zap it enough to where you could use the beltron.
i've done that with filaments on radio tubes before when i had no options for replacement, i have an electrophoresis power supply with 100-3000v constant current constant voltage output at 300w, if you dial it to 2kv and set the current to 5ma it will dump a short pulse of power into a short then regulate at 5ma.
this won't work here because you'd need a ton more voltage, the grid is easily 3-5mm from the cathode and in a vacuum thats gonna need 100+KV to bridge, a better attempt would be to go from filament to cathode where the distance is about 1mm or less still you're gonna need 20-40kv to bridge that and you're probably just gonna blow everything up.
another thing he could try is flipping tube upside down so the cathode wire is on top and tapping
Diagonal measurement of picture tube screens made them fairly compatible with older round screen tube measurements.
Nothing like catching a little torkocrinkulator action on CZcams.
I have the 21" version of that, though maybe it's the 1955 version. It has a super-early germainum diode detector (which sadly was leaky). The 21ALP4 CRT on mine is the original and was totally dead when I found it - however - following your teachings, I whacked the neck and did several jolts of rejuve and it finally woke up enough to produce a picture. Virtually all paper caps were dead shorts and the tuner required a very deep cleaning, but it's actually a great little performer now. Too bad about this one though!
what was the symptom of the leaky detector diode? all my sets use germanium didoes as detector generally the oa81 type
@@MrHBSoftware If I recall, replacing the diode resulted in better contrast and overall better picture. The schematic on mine shows it was a CK706 (it was red, Raytheon branded I think) and I replaced it with an 1N60.
Is it possible to rebuild the picture tube on these?
@@timothykeith1367 Antique radio society in New Jersey does it. Search their videos
Dumont made a 30" B&W back in the 50's. It was a glass/metal roundie, probably a 50 to 70 degree deflection type. Tube was similar to the type 19AP4, except almost twice as large!
Love to see him find one of those!!
And here I was, intending to post about a Soviet 65cm (25.6") black-and-white TV from the 70s.
Damn, 30" round?!
@@xenaretos Like to see that soviet tv too!
@@volvo09 In the early 50's! I am used to seeing the smaller or round screens from back then!
As a kid, we had a ca. 53-54 GE B&W TV that was really massive. It went through numerous service calls and CRT replacements until we got fed up and replaced it ca, 1964 with a Zenith 19" luggable from Polk Bros.
By the 70's. I was working for Motorola and they are out of the TV business. The MOT always made solid iron. Well engineered and built. But business management was less than solid.
Having watched one get resurrected which spent 20 years in the desert, i'm surprised to see this one stay dead.
There were a few 27" B&W sets made using either the metal cone 27AP4 or all glass 27EP4, 27GP4, 27NP4, etc.. Both 24 and 27 inch sets are very hard to find now. I've only seen one in person and it was too dam big to fit in my hatchback :(
I had a beat up Magnavox as a kid. It was big and ugly and I didn't keep it. Along with many round colors. I want them back!
you would be perfect to adopt this set the cabinet is in nice shape for its age
no desert rot
"It looks like a little city" - Bjork -
Boy how I would love to adopt that set. But I just cannot afford the shipping costs. You come up with so many great sets that I can only dream of finding. Being on social security makes my tv hobby tight.
Thank you for offering these marvelous old sets rather than disposing them.
My dad had a Zenith radio & T.V. repair shop in the fifties when I was a kid. I remember him picking up a radar crt tube from the army surplus for like $3.00 and making a wood cradle and several wiring harnesses so he could work on the chassis on the bench and have a picture tube right next to him. I'm 68 and love watching you work!
Shango's videos rock.
Would have never got to see these old sets, thanks Shango!
ive seen bob andersen fix a tube once with a similar issue, and he used a trick where he heats it up big time, gives it a knock and it welds the broken connection internally back into place again
Greatly appreciate the wealth of knowledge you provide. I really look forward to the videos you post. It’s given me the confidence to take on a ‘59 Magnavox B&W combo unit I just rescued. Thanks so much!
This channel is so freakin awesome! Thanks for showing us this stuff!
You gave it your best shot on that CRT... I was hoping to see the high voltage be the issue. Must have been a smokey fiery show for the family using it!
HANK! THE TV IS ON FIRE AGAIN!
Get the Jiffy Pop.
That looks exactly like the one that my great grandfather had in his home! Wow! I love console TV's and miss them dearly. We had a beautiful Magnavox TV in a real cherry wood cabinet. It was part of our furniture. We took good care of it. It was the focal point of our living room and where you might put a special decoration for Christmas, or your report card, etc...
Kinda like the car industry which always advertised the horsepower of engines using unreal methods.
Here is more food for thought. In the early 1960s 1961 1962 Magnavox made a 24in television floor console. If you can get your hands on one of those that tube I am sure will fit in this Motorola TV. The neck of the Magnavox tube is thinner so you will need to change the CRT socket but otherwise the Magnavox tube is a 6 volt tube and it should work out if you can get your hands on one. Just some food for thought in case you really want to restore this Motorola. This Motorola is a really really nice TV to get going
Motorola always did things their own way. Another example would be the "Placir" circuit board. I had a 23 inch color 909 chassis that still worked strong when I retired it in the late 1970's.
I did this sometimes, but the Soviet CRT were of such low quality that it did not last long. But this set at least deserves the restoration of the cabinet for a museum or a thematic interior.
Measuring picture tubes diagonally is a win - win. Not only is it the longest dimension but it accounts for any variation of aspect ratio by being able to ignore those. A right triangle of course has one dimension for the hypotenuse, but the two sides can be various lengths. Measuring and reporting those can be somewhat ambiguous so we like the dimension of the hypotenuse instead...
A shame about the picture tube. Would have been a nice restoration project. I agree the quality was there, but back then those sets cost a family a fortune. They were a fairly major investment for a family.
I saw a live Dumont commercial with Wally Cox that had a 30 inch screen. Wally Cox got nervous and froze. Saved by another actor.
I restored an RCA 21-S-548NU floor model and the chassis slides out very easily just like this set. Everything plugs into the chassis and the picture tube stays in the set. I have it working beautifully and the serviceability it has is unmatched so far. Only downside is I have to put the chassis back in the cabinet and hook everything back up before seeing if the image is better. I really admire Zenith Porthole sets where the picture tube stays on the chassis so you only have to put it back in the cabinet when you know everything is working correctly. I wish more companies today made their tech equipment as serviceable as tube equipment.
I hope it can be saved .
you legend been looking forward to a new video from you :) sending love from the uk !!!!!!!
Cool set Shango0. All my best. Oh and hope you can get it to work some at least.
My dad worked for Motorola from early 50's (Augusta Blvd in Chicago) and from about 1961 or so he worked at their new factory and hq on Grand Ave in Franklin Park IL. He worked his way up from line worker to regional area warranty service tech. He and one other guy were the techs that were put on very difficult repeat warranty issues (particularly with the Quasar solid state stuff). As for this tv, we had the exact cabinet version of this tv but it must have been a year or two newer because it had 3 knobbed controls exposed (bright, vert, hor) where your set has a cover. It definitely didn't have that antenna gimmick. What I have always remembered about this tv was the sound quality. It had (I think) an 8" round speaker that had incredible very clean bass response with good volume output. I don't recall this tv causing problems and we used it until we got the new rectangular 25" color console sometime in the mid-late 60's. Then my dad gave the b&w to my uncle and he used it in his rec room right up to the 70's. My dad use to say that to be one of their engineers you had to be a genius to get hired lol.
I love your sense of humour, I fix Covid testing robotics in the biggest lab here in Ireland for Perkinelmer, which can be fairly intense, but I will take your sense of humour in with me next time I’m in the lab on a PITA repair! Thanks from one engineer to another Pád.
a job that should be secure for many years to come...
I had a combination Magnavox with stereo and 15 inch speakers and 27 inch tube, probably early 60s. I had to get a rebuild for it and they needed my old tube to do it. It had a reasonable picture when it was done but I was just starting out and screwed up the alignment thinking I could tune it up like a radio. Between that and it kept popping like it had a high voltage problem I ended up scrapping it. A friend took the woofers and built some speakers with them that he thought sounded awesome till we started actually realizing what decent sound was. My tube was a 27XP4 if I remember right. Wish I had some of the antiques I was playing with back then.
I remember that was the last black and white my parents had in the early 60's. A gift from the grandparents I believe. Then we got a 13 inch color tv which we watched the moon landing on.
The first moon landing was only in black and white.
I had a black and white up till 2009. Used during the many hurricanes we had in the summers as it would run off a 12V battery. B&W seemed to make the sharpest picture at the time.
My parents got a new set similar to this one in 1961, I think they called it a 23 inch; that was the largest size available then, I think. The cabinet was almost the same, but I never saw the chassis. It was a relatively cheap set, since it didn't have a UHF tuner. We got the VHF Chicago channels, and local channels thru an older set top UHF converter box leftover from the old TV that died(a 1953 Crosley).
I would have stopped when I saw the crumbling yoke, as it is irreplaceable. Once I read a brochure for equipment to graft new necks onto CRTs with bad guns, doubtless someone still has this, but it seems very unlikely there is a new neck for this jug in existence anywhere.
Am pretty sure that is the exact same set my Grandpa had in his living room. I didn't work and had a colour TV setting on top of it. Made a nice TV stand.
My grand parents never tossed their 1950s set when they stopped using it. It stayed in the format living room until my uncle passed away and the house was sold. I now have the TV in my possession and it lives again.
Aw, too bad. I love Motorola stuff and it would’ve been great to see this monster work again. I’m surprised the PhotoFact service folder mentioned a UHF provision, I thought this was made way before we even had the set-top converter boxes.
This was top of the line! Love it! ❤
Sizzle pony crackle point🤣🤣🤣
That's called a directional antenna, dude. It was back in the day before onmi - directional ones came out. I can remember as a youngster having to get on the roof and rotating our antenna after a storm came through. We had 3 different ones on the same mast, one for each channel. Yes, all we had was ABC, NBC and CBS local stations. We had one UHF station operated by the local Junior College and used rabbit ears to get that one. That 24"er would have been state of the art back then.
For resurrection you could actually use filament as a cathode, though it should be transformerly isolated and the picture would be blurry and meh, but it might work
Pictures in Sams were shot on 8 X 10 film. My wife and I used the Deardorff camera. My wife also used the newer Deardorff and other equipment residing in my basement these days.
The reason they measure diagonally is for fair comparison between round and rectangular sets, Since round sets with a mask on have a smaller usable area then a rectangular set measured horizontal/ verticaly
It may not be to difficult to replace that 24in tube with a 23 in tube with a shroud around the 23 in tube to compensate for the one in difference. You are a smart intelligent creative person I am sure you can figure it out. Some kind of thick rubber border around the 23 in tube will definitely compensate for the space. Try it you have nothing to lose at this point that is a beautiful looking set. Plus you have the patience of a saint. If anybody can do it you can.
Deader than a dead thing, R.i.p C.r.t
My parents had one of these monsters in their basement, my dad worked on that thing constantly he was a TV repair man part time. There were always issues with the power supply, he finally got irritated with it and I helped him take it to the dump
Beautiful piece
the bronze metal makes me feel fuzzy
Absolute beauty of a set! Wish I had somewhere to put a machine like this.
I used to work on video games. They came out with these monster cabinets using 32 and 36 inch tubes. Previously we had 27 inch. I noticed the large CRT would always go dim in a year or two. After 5 years, you could not see the screen. Is it possible, they use the same gun and it is over powered for such a large screen?
The two-rectifier arrangement was used with a center tapped power transformer secondary for full-wave rectification. I was tempted to buy a pair of those old-fashioned selenium "grates" in new OEM condition from our local electronic supplier to see if they'd have less switching noise than the modern potted bridge rectifiers I use in my little tube audio projects, but the price stopped me cold in my tracks.
That schematic has fossils.
I was fortunate to save a 24 inch Crosley slated for disposal. Only a half a day in the rain. It was passed over due to weak CRT. I haven't checked it out for myself. It still displays wonderfully even if it doesn't play. It's like a refrigerator cut in half for a size comparison.
We had one of these when I was 12 to 13. I have a picture of me taken on my 13th birthday with the TV in the background. My brother and I used to go purchas TVs at a local thrift store they would keep them in the as is area towards the back storage area of the thrift store. You just pick your choice of any tv for five dollars a piece. We got home and plugged it and it played like new the CRT was in great shape. It would have been junk if it haven't played I was a little 12 year old and my brother was a 17 year old dimwit. He's still dimwitted to this day just a much older dimwit.
That bird in the background at 20:07 sounds like someone cranking a tiny engine...
I still have my parents' old '54 Zenith console cabinet, that bears a striking resemblance to this Motorola. Have a future project idea to mount a modern flat panel TV-monitor in place of the screen, with a mini AV receiver behind the flip-down control panel below it. Dragnet, American Bandstand, Lone Ranger, ect. are a few of many first run programs brought to me through this set as a child.
Wait a little while until we have reliable organic light emitting diode sets. Otherwise, that sounds like a fun project and I think it would really be a centerpiece of your living room.
Hey Shango
My grandfather had the same set
It was in the basement and it still worked...i can remember watching
cartoons on the thing...sadly he died from a stroke 8 years ago and the set was sold at the estate sale :(
If only I had the thing I would find a way to ship it to you for a restoration!!!... Awesome video!!!...
About 15-20 years ago, I had a look at a mid 50's 27" either Magnavox or Motorola B & W console tv the people across the street where throwing out. Unfortunately, the crt neck was broken, and the back and knobs missing. I passed on it. To me, it's disheartening when I have an otherwise good working tv, but the picture tube is bad, and no replacements.
Flyburn & “black beauty” for the win …
3:47 I miss the days where it was expected that the vendors provide all docs if you want to repair on your own. Right to Repair FTW!
I got a 1965 packard bell rpc-39 stereo console two weeks ago but the power amp needs a rebuild and the turntable needs a relube but the preamp/tuner part is still good so I use a nad integrated hooked up as a stand alone power amp, but when I get it fixed, I would not be surprised if it outlasts most modern electronics in my house
No academy award for you that needle was supposed move at the end for dramatic effect but didn't even budge.
Used to watch Johnny Carson with grandma in the den on a set just like that 😢 but never letterman because grandma said he was vulgar !
24:40 As someone who does component level repair on modern PC's, that looks like an absolute nightmare to me. Like someone ignited thermite on top of their component storage and after it worked it's way down through all the drawers of parts, that's what coalesced at the bottom. I would have loved to have seen one of these actually assembled, I don't know how the schematic isn't just a picture of a plate of spaghetti and meatballs.
I seem to recall being sent out on a call for a 27" B&W in the 70's but don't remember what brand or CRT manufacturer.
Nice looking TV, Motorola had nice clean designs.
My family owned a television like this made in the 50s, which I viewed as a small child in the 60s. I believe ours was an RCA. Brings back memories.
Sometimes turning set upside down helps weld the cathode, when cathode fails tend to fall down over, tapping right way up drives them further apart, upside down helps bring it back into contact
intresting video though wasn't an actual rescue. just out of curiosity, what is the difference in the beltron between rejuvenate and restore?
@10.00 mins "crunchy crunchy" I lost my shit LMAO!!!
Any chance of getting a replacement CRT instead of this fish tank?
Can't win them all, no connectiom when you are tapping on it means it cannot be welded back ?
Remember when 25" TV was HUGE ? Now my 60" LG seems excessive...
Klooky Doobler! Gonna be my exclamation for the day. :)
Subscriber here and shortwave fan since a teenager, sadly it's almost gone nowdays.
Anyway, i used to have a NATIONAL ( I think) with a hammered silver paint on a metal box that was hot and give me a little zap if i was also touching the floor.
Been thru 2 GE P990 and ZENITH TRANS O.
YOUR vids sure back sone memories!
Thanks
Wonder if you've come across a National SW ?
Great Video on this old TV. Will You have a part 2 Video for this Motorola TV? I hope you get it working, To bad about the CRT being so Dead.
"Sizzle pony crackle point"
Man that had me laughing.
The Dumont TV my parents had in the '60's was in a blonde wooden cabinet on 4 legs. We constantly slapped the side of ot to get it to work better and the tubes were always failing.
Maybe something like a Speaker coil connected to the crt neck could be used with a signal generator to make the parts inside the gun resonate and start working again?
I have "fixed" plenty of old lightbulbs by tapping them etc to make the broken wire inside make contact and self-weld itself back in place, not the same thing but i imagine a broken wire could do the same inside the crt
I would recommend trying a rejuvenation using the Beltron. I have had similar emission dead CRTs brought back to life (more than once), what have you got to loose? Start with the Clean function, then move onto the full Restore. Apparently, some piece of debris in the gun shorts out the emission. That CRT has been asleep for over 50 years so, who knows?
Still, that would be a nice one to work on!
Shame about the tube. Are dead spiders essential for correct operation of the high voltage?
Yes ! They are considered sacrificial 😁
Gotta RCA that looks like this... must have been a popular furniture design of the 50's....
Yep, I thought this one was the same as the 1954 Magnavox I've got, so much so that I had to double-check. The control panel is different, but it is remarkably similar in style otherwise.
The 1954 Bowman baseball card set looks very similar for their border lines
I don't know. The thing seems to be baked. Maybe some obscure technique could revive the CRT.
I remember some tips from the guy where you picked the tube lot in the last week video. Something about applying high voltage to regenerate emmissions, but not sure if that applies to a dead tube.
Cool Antenna!
thank you
YES! CRT Testing!
Dumont did make a 30 inch round. I have seen a 27 inch rectangular that supposedly had slightly more area than the masked off Dumont.
That's a nice set
I have a very similar GE cabinet shell I found at curbside pick-up. I put 2 pieces of 1-inch pink styro down and slid my 19" color SANSUI unit into it, Just the right height for the remote to work, only drawback is the A/V outputs are on front, need some 90-degree RCA jacks so I can get the tube right tight to the oval screen.
Urk.... How much would it cost to send that CRT to a rebuilder? Just the shipping costs for that tube would be insane. And yes, I know you still have flyback and yoke issues on top of the usual capacitors....
Test capacitance between the filament and the cathode. I have confirmed cathode lead failures that way... not that I could fix them without glassblowing skills. :(
I did have a GE Ultravision with a 25ALP4 CRT. It was late 1950s, hot chassis and selenium rectifiers, bad flyback - I never got it to work, but with my current knowledge, I'm sure I could have had it work. That was one scary big glass bulb and I was terrified of it imploding on me. Chassis was mounted in the wooden cabinet above the CRT.
Also, scored a 1956-1957 Motorola, and I think it was about 24"-25", hot chassis and selenium rectifiers. I did get that working and used to invite my classmates in Electrical Engineering school over and we'd watch TV on it as recently as 2005. CRT was weak but watchable, and the vertical output tube was weak but I never got around to replacing it. Chassis was vertically-mounted to the left when you were behind the set, and I think it was copper-plated too. I have a photo of the set with Jon Stewart on the screen.... [sigh]
Then there were the Electrohome Educators - "Now with theft-proof knobs!" the owner's manual bragged. They were 23" black-and-white sets from 1970, almost like they were built to watch the Apollo landings in classrooms. Very, very cool.
I lost all of them in a fire in a storage unit, so alas they perished in 2012, along with over 20,000 tubes I had collected starting as a kid in the early 1980s.