The Genetic Heritage Of The Red Hunters - 40K Theories
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- The Red Hunters are somewhat unique amongst the Adeptus Astartes, in that they are not only closely associated with the Inquisition, but the chapter’s records - as well as the very minds of their warriors, are repeatedly erased. Because of this, is there any way to accurately determine the identity of the chapter’s Primogenitor Primarch?
Intro theme and additional audio editing by Officio Audiorum
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Additional artwork by Joseph Castillo Losloso, Alexandr Babak, Martin Roca, Waruhameru40kart,
Igor Zhovtovsky, Salvador Trakal, Dagahaz, Boris Tsui, Louisa Wilhelm, Aylameridian, Baklaher, A-tarzia, Albert Sargsyan and Alexander Moroz.
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Master class from the master himself.
Holy throne this one was dense. Third listen and I’m still unpacking it. :)
Thank you ^^ it turned out better than I expected!
Well, there is another traitor legion that similarly revered the Emperor as a god, were faultlessly loyal (to those they saw as worthy of that loyalty. Sort of) and had red armour at the end of the heresy...
I was thinking the same
I imagine you doing an april fools as jerry springer doing primarch paternity tests
I think Maury Povich would be better in that regard ;)
15:53 In the short story the Blind King, the Dark Hunters were founded with just shy of 100 battle brothers sometime in M38. While I agree come the era of the Great Scouring that new chapters would be 1000 marines strong, that probably isn’t the case for much of imperial history.
Oh, that's really interesting. Thanks for letting us know! Where's that story from, out of curiosity (an anthology, White Dwarf etc)? I can't seem to find it on the Black Library website. :(
@@40KTheories the short story's full name is Dark Hunters: the blind king by Paul Kearney. I'm finding a couple of pdf sources out there but no official sale
The mind wiping has to be either a tradition, or it's required for the chapter to function.
If it's tradition, that could imply that the chapter was created from captive renegade astartes who were offered mind wipes and service instead of death.
If it's necessary, that could imply that contact with daemons is likely to awaken something in these particular marines.
It could also be a cover story for a memory affecting geneseed mutation.
I'd bet my rosette on them being Word Bearers.
Awesome video as always! Cavill Protects =C=
That was my bet too, maybe from left behind gene seed post heresy or loyalist word bearers who sided with humanity during the Hersey.
Possible. Consider that the reason there are no grey knight primaris is that cawl was forbidden from using traitor gene seed. We know he did, but of all the secrets that the highlords know one is the founding pf the grey knights. At least one was probably from a traitor legion. Hunters having close ties to the inquisition may be why cawl left them alone. Maybe they were loyalist from traitor legion and it is a secret the ordos know. Is this cawls way of pretending to adhere to guillimans dictate? Maybe. Could also be that their geneseed being from the emperor is considered sacrosanct.
@@mrbreck1 I don't know if I'd say the Hunters have closer ties to the ordos than the Grey Knights, but rather, more of a subservient role, somewhat more disposable, and nowhere near as trusted, hence the memory wiping. And yeah, I'm pretty convinced that the lack of GK primaris is due to their geneseed coming directly from The Emperor, tho, does Cawl even know they exist? But whatever the truth is, I do know, Cavill Protects =C= lol
@@mrbreck1 the grey knights had multiple loyalists from traitor gene seed in it, including a thousand son who I think was their first leader.
@@RomanvonUngernSternbergnrmfvus and as shown in the novel Pandorax, their original progenoids were removed and replaced with new ones (as demonstrated with the former Dark Angel, Epimetheus).
If the Red Hunters are mind wiped after each encounter with Chaos; that means that whenever they fight Daemons or Neverborn, they do so as rookies.
So, doesn't that mean they take many unnecessary casualties?
Very Grimdark, but also very stupid!
Especially when other chapters deal with the knowledge of Chaos just fine.
Indeed, but when you work for the inquisition, survival is barely an option.. 😂
@@ravager2-636 The last time the Inquisition tried to force Astartes to "forget" Chaos, the Space Wolves got annoyed.
Ok, but they retain their instinct and martial capabilities. Their cognitive memory just gets blocked off so they don't think about daemons in their sleep. Keeps them from being portals for possession. Not so stupid as you think.
@@Mameoth Last I checked, most space marine chapters do wipe the memory of their lower-ranking marines, and the officers still get hypno-conditioned to compartmentalize the memories, only to remember past experiences with daemons when faced with the enemy again.
Bunch of freaking dogs, whelps barking to the leash of their Inquisitorial masters. Don't trust them at all, great video Remleiz ^^
Easy, they are sons of [DELETED]
Pfft! Don't be daft, they're obviously descended from [REDACTED]
Love this video and has given several ideas for my ordo Astartes chapter I am currently making
If I have to be honest, I think this would be the case of the Inquestion, over a long period of time, possibly after the Reign of Blood, would hand pick Astartes that they deemed the purist to create a whole chapter in the wake of such heresy.
But how come the Red Hunters have been around since the 2nd Founding?
@@robertnelson9599 Even back then, the Ordo Malleus would be looking for more Astartes that showed purity. Having just the Grey Knights back then just would not be enough.
@@robertnelson9599 From what we could find, there's actually no evidence of them being a 2nd founding chapter. The only claim we could find comes from an uncited and unsubstantiated claim made by the Wiki (this claim _was_ also made on Lexicanum, but the day we started asking for a source citation on Twitter, Lexicanum deleted it from their site). The closest we could find to anything regarding their origins is from Siege of Vraks book 3 in where it states that the Red Hunters are rumoured to have been founded at the request of the Inquisition. If you know of a definitive source that outright claims they're 2nd Founding (ideally with page number) then please let us know!
Wonderful video as always :3
They sound like Imperial Heralds to me. Not ancient, created by radical Inquisitors in M38 or M39. Possibly Chimeric. God Emperor, can you imagine a Chimeric cross between the 17th and the 13th, bred for absolute obedience and zealous faith by a radical Inquisitor? That's my theory.
Thank you, Red Hunters are my favorite
My head canon has always had them down as derived from the Word Bearers, a case of using those who understand the dangers of the warp without them actually knowing it. Especially important to mind wipe give the Word Bearers and their father are still out there
Awesome episode Rem 👍!
Thank you!
Worshipping the Emperor like fanatics makes me think of Word Bearers
Great to see my favourite chapter
Numerous other chapters fight chaos almost exclusively and never undergo a mindwipe. Goes to show how dangerous their missions are in particular... Or how loyal a lapdog they are to the Inquisition.
Funnily enough there was at least one instance (in the 5th edition Grey Knights codex) of the Blood Angels being forced to undergo a mind wipe after fighting daemons, which is interesting at least.
Inqusition glazers number 1
I do believe in the death guard theory myself
Word bearers
I think the Red Hunters and similar Inquisition linked chapters are underused. A way to get "normal" Astartes to be alongside the Inquisition
It's clear that they're "Ultramarine Successors". Yes. Ultramarines. Who definitely have everything to do with them.
Emperor be Praised!
Ok, so. Here's my thinking.
Option 1) This is a chapter of Word Bearers who stayed loyal to the Emperor.
Option 2) It's a chapter of former-Chaos marines from various chapters, who were raised in the Traitor Legions. They never served the Imperium of Man, so they can be redeemed. And the Emperor uses the same tricks to turn them to Him as the Chaos gods used to turn the traitors back during the Heresy.
Either way, they worship the Emperor as God because that is who he is to them. The God they've worshipped since the time of Horus, or the God who granted them Salvation from the Ruinous Powers.
I’ve never understood the purpose of keeping chaos secret. “Know thy enemy, know how to destroy them.”
The basic idea is that if people don't know about Chaos, then they are less likely to succumb to it.
It seems like the answer to any questions involving newer chapters that are loyal to the Inquisition or the High Lords of Terra is either traitor Geneseed or chimeric mixtures. Seems like there are a few hidden foundings and Bellasarius Cawl hasn't been the only one experimenting with the Astartes.
Word bearers, no doubt.
Why do Inquisition even erase Space Marines memories of Chaos? All of them face Chaos followers at one point or another. They also know the truth about Horus Heresy, so again, why?
It does on the surface seem odd. But even First Founding chapters have been forced to undergo it at least once. There's a bit in the 5th edition Grey Knights codex in where the Blood Angels are mindwiped after fighting alongside the Grey Knights.
Thank you.
I'm going with word bearer successors. They're considered religious extremists by other hard line religious chapters because they're overcompensating or doing what their dad did and go overboard with the whole "the emperor is a god" thing
5:55 sorry if i am just wrong but isn't that the melanochrone as opposed to the mucranoid which is the the "overskin" used in hostile environments that needs to be activated via an external chemical cocktail prepared by an apothecary as opposed to the melanochrone being the multiradiation shield of the melanochrone ?
The Raven Guard have a deficient melanchormic organ, but they lack the mucranoid entirely. The mucranoid protects an Astartes from extreme changes in temperature (be it in the form of intense heat or unrelenting cold), whereas the melanchromic organ darkens their skin in response to the amount of radiation present (such as via sunlight or whatnot).
@@40KTheories ooooh thanks for the info nice video as always
(monotone) All hail the Ultrasmurfs.
10:40 - That's a suspected source of the gene-seed of the Sons of Antaeus, which would explain their durability, even by Astartes standards.
It seems to me, regarding starting number of marines on founding, they simply could've...only been made on-paper, and just spent some time recovering after the fact
Amazing video, I need to know how u didn't pass out from the lengths of some of those sentences;)
Happy you did this theory my friend.
Question do to gene purity is there any reason to rule out them being of Dark Angle decent?
The main reason would most likely be due to how rare Dark Angels successor chapters generally were pre-ultima founding. It's not impossible, it's just that there's little else to support the idea overall. By the same token you could even argue that the chapter are potential White Scars or Iron Hands successors.
Was talking about this during the live chat when this premiered, but I forgot to look it up snd can’t remember the name.
In reference to the Flesh-changed TSon bursting into flame and the possible connection to the Flame Falcons, whst was the name of that Horus Heresy Audio Drama?
I believe it was called "Thief of Revelation".
@@40KTheories 👌
What about a Exorcists succesor chapter?
The reason the Grey Knights don't have Primaris is they'd have to give Cawl a sample of their geneseed to facilitate him giving them the technology to make Primaris. Can't have an outsider finding out who their Primarch is.
16:15 that's just dumb, geneseed should not be able to just be swapped like a shirt. yes, I know the founding grey knights had theirs swapped, it remains dumb and I'd rather ignore it and pretend they died with their original ones
Word bearers successors definitely.
I collect Red Hunters and wrote my own background for them since the lore is so scant. Here is my lore for them:
During and following the Horus Heresy, the imperium had to deal with Marines that seemed to be loyalists amongst traitors. Maybe a squad or company from a traitor legion that were able to escape their traitorous brethren. Maybe a company or squad from a loyalist chapter declared for the warmaster, and a small loyal group kills them before turning themselves in. It was to address this issue that the form and function of the inquisition began to take shape. Marines that were cleared of being heretics were put together into a task force known as the Red Hunters. They were tasked with hunting heretics and traitors as recompense for not being able to prevent the fall of their brothers.
Due to this chapter’s intimate knowledge and extensive contact with Chaos, it was decided that they would not receive new Marines. The chapter's numbers dwindled as attrition took its toll. Following the disastrous 21st “Cursed” founding, the inquisition decided to revitalize the chapter so that they could take a crusade to track down and exterminate any cursed chapters that betrayed the imperium. So, during the 22nd founding, the Red Hunters used unknown geneseed to bring their numbers back to that of full chapter strength. They were also supplied Primaris Marines in the closing days of the 41st Millennium.
My red hunters don't do the whole mind wipe thing and don't worship the Emporer as a god (in my lore these were misleading rumors spread by the Red Hunters themselves.)
Should have called them Word Keepers this time ...
Why not Custodes remnants, maybe altered with another progenitor gland? Their secrecy is only matched by Alpharius, while their loyalty is absolute, as would be their devastation after failing their duty.
That seems unlikely due to the fact Custodes and Astartes are created through vastly different means (surgical alteration and gene-seed implantation in the case of Astartes and bio-alchemy in the case of Custodes), with there being literally only 2-3 people in existence as of M41 who know how to even make a Custodian.
@@40KTheoriesThank you for the heads up; i'm deep into Horus' Heresy lore but can't quite find the time for those fine tuned facts. Just hoping GW won't be taken over by the genestealers😉
I think they are from the Word Bearers. Their devotion to the God-Emperor may be a clue. I think most of the chapters being founded and it not being known from where makes me think they are traitor legions.
They're the living image of Rogal Dorn
Let's go
Given their fanatical devotion, wouldn't it make sense that they were created from the geneseed of the Word Bearers? They were after all created under the directions of the Emperor himself, so it's not entirely unthinkable to assume that perhaps with the right conditioning, it was their purpose after all to be unquestionably obedient to such a fanatical extent. Just a playful thought, because entertaining almost any other possibility would've been extremally boring, in my humble opinion. Their chapter colors aren't too different from the XVIIth Legion's
Nar they were created using a mix of world eaters and night lord geen seed
Fine. Liked, subbed and comment,lmao 😂
I think a fully developed Space Marine of one lineage may be genetically incompatible with the progenoid gland of another Legion. Thats what i think. ;-)
There is a precedent in swapping progenoids however.
Within the novel Pandorax, it is revealed that Epimetheus had his original Dark Angel progenoids removed and replaced with Grey Knight ones. So this shows that such a procedure is indeed possible.
Red, extreme and fanatical worshiping of Emperor as god, unknown origins, sounds like Word Bearers
Well...
The Red hunters have as much of a connection w/ Grey Knights genetically as they do w/ the Sisters of Battle. The big "I" needs common Astartes rabble for the light work. They're tools like the Thunderw...'ere Minotaurs are for the big cheese. Hey, they could be related to the Angry Marines (Marines Malevolent)! 😂
Dark Angeles
Word Bearers?
They are definetly a Word Bearers successor chapter
They sound like Word Bearers to me. But the Inquisition or Imperium would never use Traitor geneseed to make chapters right? Never ever, the Minotaurs are totally not Iron Warrior successors, nor the Carcaradons sons of Konrad Curze.
Loyalist WB blackshields warband who submitted to authority and agreed to be mindwiped.
No support for this theory lol
=I= are watching 👀 👀 👀
Do they have a battle cry, and can they even remember it? 😁
If they do, it might be inscribed somewhere within their fortress monastery.
Now I wonder how TTS Emperor would react upon hearing about this chapter.
They could be loyalists remnants of the word brearers.
Why does this sound like 40k theories as read by AI?
Because you're being paranoid. It's not AI. We will never use AI on our channel, be it for narration or artwork.
#supportrealartists
I have them as Emperor Children descendents.
An interesting idea, I'll admit :)
formenor.blogspot.com/2023/07/black-reach-space-marine-captain.html
Word Bearers gene seed obvs
y
No one tlks about my loyalist alpha legion this way, but keep up with the misinformation!