Godot Tile Maps Are Dead ...Long Live TileMapLayers
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- čas přidán 6. 06. 2024
- In the upcoming release of Godot 4.3 (currently in Beta1) there is a massive change to the TileMap class. Well, it's dead, or more accurately deprecated and will have no further development from this point on. Instead it is replaced with a more streamlined replacement, the TileLayer node. We will look at how to create Tilemaps using the new system in Godot 4.3 and discuss the pros and cons of this change.
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You can save the tilesets as a file just like any other resource in Godot. You don't have to recreate everything every time. It's not a missing feature nor an error. The way you created the tilemaps is intended to be used only when you know that this node is the only place you'll ever use that tilemap resource. If you know that you'll have to use a tilemap multiple times, you don't create it in the inspector, but directly in filesystem, and that isn't just the way you do it for tilemaps, but for any resource in the engine. I think you can also copy the tilemap you created in the inspector from one node to another by right clicking, but I don't remember, I would have to check that. However I would still recommend saving the tilemaps into filesystem for good project organization, especially for bigger games.
But yeah, I think that TileMapLayers are a nice addition/replacement.
Even if you want to use different images for the tilesets, you can select all the layer nodes and create a tileset and set the same tile sizes, etc, for all of them at once. Then you can select each layer to set the different images on each. I don't remember if doing that creates distinct instances of the tileset for each node. I think it does, but if not, you can simply click the arrow next to the tileset and click "make unique", before setting up the images.
To re-use the tileset between layers, surely you can right click the TileSet in the Inspector pane and save it as a resource?
Haven't tried it but yeah probably
Yes, you can.
Yes, you can
I believe you can just copy/paste (RMB on property name) it without saving. Just don't mark it as unique.
@@lufog i think that's right. local resources (to a scene) are also unique in that scene as long as you don't explicitly change that.
I found out last week what "paint" in the Tileset does - if you create a Physics layer in the Inspector, you "paint" the individual tiles that you want to be recognized by the Collider. So you can apply collisions at the Tileset level for walls, trees, buildings, etc.
So it might make more sense to be called something like physics or collisions then instead of paint?
It can do more than collision layers. And yes, a different name would be less confusing.
@@souvlaki42 no. because it does more than paint collisions. it can paint many other properties. like color modulate, offset, or other custom data
@@souvlaki42No, you can also paint other properties.
@@callyral Yeah, but @souvlaki42 is still right, it should be renamed. true, you can "paint" your properties (even custom ones, which i like) over many tiles at once. But maybe call it "tile data", wether you can paint it or not is a matter of mode of work, not the option name itself.
Also switiching for painting for TileMap should be fixed... it's confusing. Maybe there should be a parenting TileMap node (that contains global shared information), which is composed of child tileMapLayers? Similar how ParallaxBackground contains PrallaxLayers!
You should be able to save the tileset resource and reuse it, right?
yup. once you understand resources in godot... you get it all.
I have to politely disagree with you when you said godot 3.0 tilemap was better. Godot 4 tilemaps missed the ability to rotate/flip at launch but everything else is a huge plus and so much easier to learn/use
Also, you can save the tileset to reuse in others tilemap layers, no need to recreate the tileset every single time you want to create a tilemap layer and you can convert the deprecated tilemaps into tilemaps layers
I went mostly off community backlash on this one. When 4.0 released by far the biggest points of complaint I saw were two fold... C# support and TileMap regressions. Might just be these voices were particularly loud.
@@gamefromscratch
why C# support was a complaint?
@@gamefromscratch I think everyone has different opinions. I loved loved loved Godot 3 Tilemaps, and kinda hate Godot 4 Tilemaps. And from what I've personally seen from talking with people, it seems to be about an even split. Depends on your needs. I liked 3 because it was easier to work with via code, and had near infinite flexability and power if you gave it a good tool script. 4 has a lot of functionality out of the box, but is really rough on the code end and seems limited because for the life of me I can't figure out ways to do some things I used to could do in 3.
@@diadetediotedio6918 because it sucked bad but also because mobile / web export didn't (does) not work at all (now it kinda does but it's still experimental and trust me most things don't work, "Projects written in C# can be exported to Android as of Godot 4.2, but support is experimental and some limitations apply.")
@@gamefromscratch One major downside of Godot I noticed was the web export limitations, which affect game jams. Another common complaint is the lack o mobile export for C# due to .NET 6. GameEndeavor highlighted issues with the scripting features, which I hadn't considered before. However, I still think the UX/Editor remains a significant advantage.
About the part of saving tilesets that I didn't explain, you can right-click the tileset you attributed to a tilemap layer to see the options for saving/loading/make unique
You can save your tilesets as resources on the Inspector and quick load them for each layer you have. Or you can have separate tilesets like you had.
me: I was starting to understand new godot 4 tilemaps
Godot 4.3: "Tilemaps are now dead!"
me Emotional Damage!
Honestly the new system is cleaner, if the Ui could use a few more tweaks.
That's a problem, a huge problem with Godot.
Deprecated tutorials, deprecated API, deprecated functionalities every week.
It's frustrating. Defold has a much more stable workflow, stuff from years ago is still valid today.
I understand that everything must evolve and "programmers must be open minded and adapt", but let me ask this : I am building a game or I am relearning Godot every week?
And that sucks even more when you're expecting to "learn Godot once, build many games after". No, learning this engine almost never stops.
That's why I am straying away from this engine each day...despite loving it once.
Separating the new tile system into layers is nice, but I think Godot has other things to prioritize...
@@alexale5488 If you don't want changes then just pick a version and stick to it?
not a biggie. tilemap layers are identical to the layers in tilemaps just extracted. most properties you set in the TileSet anyways and if you share that among layers its essentially the same. and now finally collision and navigation function on all layers. no more: only the first layer for data. finally the system makes sense. the difference for you is simply: create a node for each layer and set the tileset to it. that's all that's new if you already have a workflow. cheers.
@@alexale5488 "Deprecated tutorials, deprecated API, deprecated functionalities every week."
not every week. this is the firs time in like over 10 years i think. its a major version change from godot 3 to 4. ofc theres gonna be breaking changes. thats the point. also godot has several months for each release are you using nightly builds if things if you have to relearn stuff every week? you shouldnt use nightly builds for production
Tileset is a resource, so you can save it to disk and just re-use it. You may want different tilesets for each layer though.
Separate tile sets for layers is really good. I always tried to separate the layers content-wise only to mess up and find out I'm drawing buildings in the ground layer. This is guiding me better, I like it
"Paint" in the tileset is to paint properties, rather than editing tiles individually.
Besides using a resource already saved on disk, the workaround for not having to set a tileset for each layer is to create the first layer, set a tileset, and right after that duplicate the node as much as you want. All the duplicates will reference the same tileset, if you change tileset properties for one of the layers it will change for all of them.
In a future update a new node will be created to be a parent of the tilemaplayers. I don't remember right now but I think the name is tilemaplayersgroup or something like that. The tileset will be a property of the layer group and when you put a layer as a direct child of the layergroup you will be unable to change the tileset on the layers, you will only be able to change it on the group. It just so happen that this tilemaplayergroup node wasn't ready for 4.3, but since the tilemaplayer does not necessarily depends on it the tilemaplayer came on 4.3 while the group will come only later.
Thank you, great video! Setting up rules for auto-tiling is also crazy nice for laying out roads, etc..
You can save tileset as tres resources - i think most things that are not primitives can be saved as tres eg. spriteframes
After you saved it you can just drag & drop it into the tileset slot on your tilemap / tilemaplayer
One solution can be for a template to save an empty tileset but with the all the other settings then use it everywhere - setting it "unique" before adding actual data so the template tres will remain an empty template
Considering the set tileset is stored as a resource in the tilemaplayer node, you can copy + paste it to the other tilemap layers. After doing so, changing one of the tileset resources will automatically apply the same changes to all other copies.
This stands for any resource in godot tbh.
The Paint option in the TileSet is to paint different data into the tiles, like z index, custom data, physics shapes, terrain bitmaks, etc
TileMap's "layers" property was a pain in the butt to work with, especially if you had more than 5 layers. I expect TileMapLayers will be a huge improvement to workflow.
So, do I need to create a new layer for every Z index? Like, if I have trees in front of other trees, like in a forest, I need to create a layer for each line?
What you would do there is just have use Y sort to order them, Mean it depends, if they just background things you could also just have one image that looks like they behind each other like Warcraft 1-3 did
But you likly doing someting wrong if you end up with that solution, thats the rule in programing.
If what you doing seems stupid then there is 95% chance you have missed a key point of something somewere.
I'm gonna guess that adjusting the Y-Origin of the tiles is enough to achieve that
I fail to see the issue with having to add atlases to each layer manually. In fact I see this is a huge benefit myself, it helps improve separation across all assets at the point of use, my foliage layer only needs tiles relevant to foliage, my props only needs tiles relevant to props etc, there shouldn't be a need to duplicate tilesets across multiple layers (with only a handful of exceptions).
You don't duplicate, you reuse. Hence the resources used are exactly the same as having only 1 instance.
I'm still moving over to and learning Godot. I noticed the new tile system as it pertains specifically to what I'm working on and decided to hold off until 4.3 leaves beta. I like what I've seen conceptually and I feel that not sharing tile sets between layers is intentional for the sake of clarity, the idea being different layers wouldn't be sharing assets in most cases anyway. I agree the Tileset/TileMap tab confusion should be addressed though.
The paint in tileset is to paint the y-sort position, collision shapes etc etc.
You should also be able to save a tileset on the top right-hand side in the inspector I believe. There is also a copy option instead of saving, and then you can paste it on the next layer, at least that's how other UI components work.
I wonder if this will make easier swapping my floor and walls tilemap. I have a project where I generate room, based on common room, but I had issue coming up with a way to differentiate different layers (having different background/floor). I feel like this would make my job easier. Maybe it's worth upgrading to 4.3 :D
Yes, you should be able to save the TileSet as a resource. It's done up in the inspector from the pull down menu on the TileSet entry.
Thanks for the updates 🙏
Resources are saved and loaded in the exact same way for EVERYTHING you just never bothered to look where you save and load resources... like???
I also have problems with the tileset resource as the entity responsible for the collision layer. In all other physics nodes, the main node (e.g. Area2D) has the collision layer and mask properties. The collision shape does not have that property. But in 4.x tilemaps and the new tilelayers, the tileset has both shape and collision layer and mask properties. So if you want to reuse the tileset but change the collision layer, you’re out of luck. Need to make a new tileset resource.
I've been waiting for this feature since I've first heard about it. I have a 2D Platformer tileset that also has background tiles that I want to add a slight parallax effect to and the current TileMap does not seem to have an option to offset individual layers. I could just add them as their own TileMap, but with Godot 4.3 beta 1 currently out they are predicting about a month until it comes out.
@Gamefromscratch: You can save the tileset as a scene and use it in all the tile layers. No need to create a new tileset for each layer. To save a tileset, once you create a tileset from tielset layer, click the arrow beside it and click save. save it and load that tileset for all the other tile set layers. done.
To convert your existing TileMaps into TileMapLayers is also easy. Just click on "Extract TileMap layers as individual TileMapLayer nodes" next to the screwdriver/wrench at the right of the buttons next to your layer menu. You map/level will also of course be converted automatically.
One feature that would be very useful , Would be the ability to paint nodes onto tile objects. It would make putting objects like coins , event triggers and more a breeze to add to a scene.
good, now I can manipulate each layer independently like rotate, offset position, scale without creating new tilepmap object everytime😊
I think that breaking compatibility again is a bit irresponsible. The old tilemap system was pretty poor but was slowly improving. The devs instead decided to start over with the layer nodes, which is much closer to the 3.x approach. I think it’s an improvement and follows the Godot approach of nodefyinfg things. It’s unclear to me if you can share tileset resources between tilemap layers though.
And the new TileMapLayer saved my game. The way they had it with Layers before is good to separate tiles with different code but it failed in terms of visual elevations
You can copy the Tileset without saving it, but you probably should be saving your Tileset as a resource.
Built in tool to convert your tilemap to tilemasplayers. You can also just make a tileset then link it to the tilemap. You don't need to recreate it every time.
I still haven't moved to Godot 4.0+ yet. I'm still using Godot 3.5.
I was literally migrating my tilemaps when you sent the video :0
Can you not select all layer nodes and set the tileset for all of them at once? I think that should create a distinct instances of the tileset for each layer, and you should be able to set the tile size and stuff all at once, or even the tileset image, if you use the same one.
Since the Layers are nodes now, couldn't you just duplicate the TileSet you already made instead of creating a new one?
You can use just 1 tileset for building, ground, etc, with all tools available in godot
You can just duplicate too and I think that will keep your settings. So, create tile set with 48x48 but not atlas and just ctrl+d.
So exactly the same as tilemaps in Godot 4, but instead of creating the layers in the tilemap itself you create them in the node tree.
I don't see much benefit other than being able to reuse layers between scenes. Which I must admit sounds like a great benefit.
This really feels how it worked in old Rpg Maker. Seems very familiar.
I like the new design much better, great change!
Looks like gamesfromscratch is a little rusty on the Godot front when it comes to using the same TileSet resource, no biggie tho, don't blame him, he's busy covering a wide range of things
I am new to Godot and the project I’m working on uses/will use roughly 30 tile set layers. Any idea if this new version will be better or worse for save games? If it ends up bloating my game I’d like to get ahead of it now lol
One way to get around having to create a new tile set for every TileMapLayer:
1.) Only add one TileMapLayer, and create the tile set for that node.
2.) Duplicate that node as many times as you need.
3.) ???
4.) Profit.
Using the old tile maps in 3 was harder because everything was crowded. If you used any of the advance features you were doomed. This way in 4.3 is infinitely better and much more robust and easy to use.
While it has its glitches and annoyances, TileMapLayers are definitely the better way to go and are more intuitive to the way Godot works with nodes. I think it will be 4.4 before this new approach is really refined, but I like it.
Real question. Why would you want to use the same atlas on a different layer?
I am still to start on game dev but it bugs me a little that the bottom layer is the one that shows on top
Think of it as draw order. If you are given a list of things to draw, you work from top to bottom of the list when drawing them. That means later items get drawn over earlier ones.
Cannot see any reason why you would not be able to save the tileset as a resource then load it on the other layers...if it is like other Godot resources you should be able to do it from the dropdown list for the tileset property under the inspector(same place where you created it) will try this later.
Something that could speed things up would be a button on the node to make a blank copy of it with the tilemap copied from the previous layer...but at best that would a small convenience.
Another option would be to duplicate a existing layer before adding any tiles to it...or removing the placed tiles on the duplicate after making it.
Personally pretty indifferent on the change. I liked the old layer setup but this is fine too.
Great vid. TileMaps are a mess no matter what. So, yes, do make more vids exploring the other features. Thank you and good karma to you.
I wouldn't say 3.0 is better. It was way more intuitive for sure but 4.0 once you learn it, it is a lot more powerful and there's a lot more you can do
I'd love to see you cover the navigation layers!
7:00 you just need to put it above the floor lol
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i was curious to see if there are any differences to y-sort behaviour...
This seems Nice but I really wished they make it similar to how Unity handles Tilemap layers that way it will be easier and more organized
Can you please just come to the point? I am listening now for a few minutes, and you get sidetracked every couple of seconds. Just stay on track, thanks
True 😂
The font is too small, mister.
Why not just get a Node2D and trow a bunch of TileMaps in there. This is like instance() and instantiate() breaking thing for no reason.
To be honest, I kinda prefer the Godot3 Tilemaps but this is a welcome change
this new system is better
Staggering. 🤔
Can you ctrl + c and ctrl + v the node before inputting any kind of image in it? Like setting it as a tileset, copy paste it, then input what ever tileset you have
Will this break tilemaps created with Tiled or will it just continue to use the legacy Tilemap? Does Godot typically remove old, deprecated nodes?
Can you make a video tutorial on how to use the Llama.cpp Godot extension to run the LLMs in Godot and how to use them in games??? (attempt 2)
There are some improvements on the tilemap coding side. Some things seem better, but I don't know if I am going to run into any issues. I am still rewriting my code for this.
Hm so what are the performance and memory implications of this? Wont not having a dedicated singular tilemap node in your scene lead to more CPU and memory consumption since the engine has to process more unique nodes 🤔
Thank you❤❤❤❤😂😂😂😂❤❤❤❤
i do this with a tilemap in 3.5
Godot is quick and clean, but the workflow and the UI are not as streamlined or intuitive as it should be.
I've used Godot a few times, and this problem happened a lot especially if you're playing with 2D bones or tilemaps.
I'd love to see a tutorial for using the program Tiled and importing into Godot with this new setup. How does this change that workflow etc. Great stuff as always and I love the channel. Thanks!
Sorry if it is a stupid question, I don't do gamedev and maybe I misunderstand what your issue is... But can't you just copypasta / duplicate the new tilemap layer node if you want to use the same tiles on another layer..? Or is that not a thing in the engine?
I don't see how the tilemap layers are any different than just using multiple tilemap nodes, other than the highlighting. Why'd they need a new node for this?
If it were up to me, I'd have made the tilemap layer node a required child of tilemap and have it inherit the tilemap node's tilemap resource.
thanks Mike,
I guess, time will show what is better...
7:10 this tripping me out, why the most bottom thing need to be on top. lmao
Because the tree structure expands from the top towards the bottom. So nodes closer to the top are also closer to the root note above / before them. Like a branch goes from thick to thin if you follow it along.
@@Dark__Thoughts True. The first node / parent node is the ROOT. So everything expands UP from there. Look at the node tree like you're looking top down at a tree. The first thing you'll see are the leaves or the tips of the branches.
It's a little irritating that the platform devs at Godot are in love with making pedantic changes to their API that provide little-to-no functional benefit. Meanwhile the engine has real problems that aren't being addressed.
To get donations, you need to give people an idea of what you will become (Like a cult leader promising salvation).
Is this unity disaster moment?
Hey Mike, I just managed to build a Godot Android launcher, I think the area of Android plugins is severely under documented, Im not a youtuber, but I could tell you everything I used and everything I had to learn on my own if you wanted to make a quick video on it.
This tools is not there yet.
And its so easy to copy what other apps already done right.
Just copy Tiled or Unity.
Everyone who just finished the first Brackeys tutorial is sad about this.
Not really, it is not a feaure change. They only separated the layers to their own nodes to be less cluted, and you can convert the tilemap node in tilemap layers with one click
이게 왜 의견이 갈리나면, 3.0부터 타일맵을 사용해왔던 유저 입장에선 4.0의 타일맵 시스템에 적응하기도 어려웠고, 불필요한 추가 동작이 많아 최악이었음.. 하지만, 4.0에 들어와서 타일맵관련 추가된 기능들도 많아서, 타일맵 기능이 개선되었다는 소식듣고, 처음으로 이용해본 사람들 입장에선 좋았을거임.. 근데 개인적으로 3.0 타일맵 시스템이 그립긴함..😢
Why would you want to share tile maps between tile layers?
Tile sets not tile maps.
As someone learning Godot and learning about Tilemaps, this new method seems.... dumb.
I'm guessing the goal is to make sure people select different layers when planting a tile which, I can totally see being a problem. Messing around, I've accidently planted tiles on the wrong layers and had to go back and fix the issue.
This distinct separation is probably to try and force users to avoid that easy to do mistake.
Tilemaps are handled incredibly poorly in Godot. I look forward to giving this one a try to see if it helps.
Smashes head into wall... I have spent the last few weeks getting comfortable with Godot's tile maps. why, just why?
hmmm.
gud vid.
Game Engines keep changing best practices.
Unity and Unreal are moving away from their own input system, particle systems etc. for example.
Yo
I'm sorry, you use ms edge??
👍
Adobe killed TileMaps
I fell into the click bait.... 😅
Oh man... windows 11... I'm so sorry.
Tilesets can be saved as resources in the inspector panel, where you select the tileset for the TileMapLayer. That way it keeps all the changes and properties.
I think the workflow can be improved if there was just a single tileset that worked across all layers, and the possibility to add sub tilesets to specific layers, it makes more sense to me instead of having separate tilesets for each layer.
I can see why it was done this way, so it encapsulates a tileset just to work with that layer yet I feel like it should have access to other tilesets and more if needed.
I wouldn't say 3.0 is better. It was way more intuitive for sure but 4.0 once you learn it, it is a lot more powerful and there's a lot more you can do