The BEST Tankless Water Heater - Stiebel Eltron Tempra Review
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- čas přidán 23. 07. 2024
- What's the best water heater for you? Tanked or tankless? Natural Gas or electric? In this episode, Jordan gives his reasoning on why he thinks the Stiebel Eltron Tempra Plus is hard to beat. (LINKS BELOW)
Unlike their tanked counterparts, tankless water heaters do not use energy when there is no hot water demand from the house. This allows them to be more energy efficient when used in the right application. The electric versions are much better than their gas counterparts when it comes to ease of installation and air sealing after they are installed. Gas versions require both combustion air as well as an exhaust port. Whether they are mounted thru-wall or installed inside with a direct vent coaxial inlet/exhaust, you will have a time getting all of the details right to ensure a well sealed house. The electric version, on the other hand, makes it easy to install anywhere without the need to ventilate.
We decided to install this water heater in the mud room that sits in between the kitchen and master bath. The central location allows for short runs to all hot water taps in the house and reduces waste.
The electric version is also drastically cheaper than a quality gas unit.
One major requirement to consider is the MASSIVE amount of power this thing requires. The 29 shown here requires a 200 amp services into the home and can draw up to 120 amps at full capacity! You will want to plan for this behemoth well ahead of time and make sure your electrical design allows for such a large load.
Would I install it again? Yes I would. But I would also seriously consider a heat pump water heater. They can be more efficient than a tankless, and the current draw is DRASTICALLY smaller, making it easier to retrofit into normal electrical designs. My only hesitation at the time that I built this house was that the heat pump water heaters were new on the market and had some reliability concerns. I need to do more research to see if a heat pump makes sense for my next build, or if the quality concerns still exist.
Do your own research here: (AND BUY SOMETHING TO HELP A BROTHER OUT!!)
Stiebel Eltron Tempra Plus -amzn.to/2IscTiu
Rheem Hybrid Heat Pump -amzn.to/2WtLMNV
Great video! I love the way you simplify everything and make it understandable. I'm looking into a electric tankless as well, this really helped out! Thanks!
Great review, great points, great information, great all around!
Awesome...appreciate the recommendation!
Hey, way cool dude.
Been too busy for about a week, finally sat down watching a couple videos and saw this one on my list.
After watching I had to back to see the couple of your's I'd missed. Good for you with "Smith House", wishing you the best.
About this one, I like how you explain about moving the tank location to a more central usage location.
Another feature of multiple elements, which adds to the efficiency, is the ability to turn one on and have it stay on when there is a lesser need rather than cycling. Electric or gas, when it's on there is a band of output where it runs the best. Having 3 elements isn't just about being able to ramp up to address need, but also running what you need when you need it. They could do this running all three with a variable draw, or a buffer tank with all 3 just turning intermittently on, but neither of those ways are as efficient.
So, good luck and may your efforts be rewarding and rewarded.
And up here in Washington we say "hot water heater", which makes me wonder what is it about that shirt you're wearing? I recognize the state, but the lettering is a bit faded.
Great video. Those are the two options I'm considering, also.
I purchased the rheem 50gal for my "sleeping cabin". It's 450 sqft.
What sold me was it can operate at 500w total, which was perfect for this off-grid cabin. The benefit is "free" air conditioning of the space. In the summer I dump the cold air back into the erv and recirc around. In the winter I dump directly outside.
Some of the features like wifi this and that I think are silly,. But I whole heartedly recommend this unit.
I’m a plumber in sc and I love you and Matt’s channels and i call it a water heater. It’s not heating hot water isn’t heating water. I prefer the Navien 240a tankless gas water heater because it has a built in circulating pump and a buffer tank so there a no cold spots. I do like the way you set up your system. The feature in your tankless is most likely designed for a house that doesn’t have pressure balanced shower valves.where we are natural gas is almost everywhere. Also the Navien can be converted from propane to natural gas within ten mins. so if you build in a rural area then when natural gas is available in the future there no need to change the water heater.
Thank you. Shopping and this helps
We switched from a tank heater to a Stiebel Eltron six months ago. Should have done that years ago. On average, 90% of the usage is arond 38 degrees celcius (100 fahrenheit). So you don't have to mix cold water to it. And, there is no need to heat up to 60 degrees as in a tanked system, only to 40 degrees. We als have a remote control in the shower, so you can set any temperature you want when showering. Love it!
Your remote control for the shower...are you using U by Moen?
That's awesome! Have you had any trouble with the high limit switch tripping? I have had mine for six months and mine keeps tripping.
Which unit did you go with?
Thank you Jordan for posting. I need a new water heater and weighing my option. I live in Florida, hurricane central, and have well water. You review has helped my decision. Don't think I really need the Plus model but good food for thought.
How do you like your unit and which did you choose? We are in FL as well and deciding
We took a different approach. We have 1500 gallons of propane stored which makes power outages much less of an issue. Both our generators are dual fuel (gas/propane). For hot water we're using a Rinnai tankless (with built in recirculation pump) - in a power outage it can be run off a deep cycle battery & small inverter. For primary heat we're using a wood burning stove (with external combustion air intake) and a Rinnai wall heater - it only draws 114 watts, so it can also run for quite a few hours on a deep cycle battery & inverter. If power demand is high I have a 8000 watt Honda generator, if demand is low I have a Honda EU2000i. Thus far this approach has worked extremely well for us.
Love seeing people using Honda generators. They are by far the best generators on the market and cannot believe they do not offer standby generators. No, I dont work for Honda. :)
Seems like you would have a marginal efficiency gain (but big quality of life improvement with time to hot) over a resistive tank type heater, but in the specific case of a power outage you would need a beefcake generator to support a decent flow of hot water vs the tank type or heat pump humming / trickling along. Is that something you gave consideration to? Did you explore twinning a heatpump with the tankless electric?
Can you install these in series to get a rise from 40f-120f 5gpm?
I have the same one works great
What I'm not so clear on is does that set up require a water storage tank to draw the water out of or can the Elton be hooked up directly to a from the oil boiler or the main water supply line into the house. Thanks for the video though.
You say 3 40A double pole breakers, but over here in Trinidad and Tobago manufacturers recommendations is 3 50A double pole breaker. For the same specs of Water Heater. Will that be a problem
I, too, have had Stiebel Eltrons since they were first available in the States. I had them in Switzerland and thought they'd work well in America. They sure did! I never had any issues with them. I also never noticed any increase in my electric bill. Mostly, I didn't have to continuously heat a tank. What's not to like? You just gotta make sure you keep that little screen at the units inlet clean. For my 5,000 s.f. house in North Carolina, with 3 full bathrooms, kitchen, and powder room, I used two (2) Tempra 36 units and could run hot water endlessly with multiple people taking showers. Because they drew more power than my panels had available, separate panels were permitted and put in my garage. Totally worth it. Maybe cost me about $800 more, total, by not going with tanks and/or conventional tankless. I easily saved that money over the next two years.
Do you run the two heaters in tandem? Or do they feed different fixtures? I'm in Washington state and can get 40f groundwater. Was going to install two of these in tandem one to raise the temp to 80 and the second today get it to 120f... Would that work?
Ya same question. Did you run them in tandem?
James Hooker Sorry! I did not see your message eight months ago. No, do not add these in tandem. The inlet on the second tank would receive water that was too hot. It should heat the water just fine without having to receive supply water which is already heated.
Keith Ryon see last response
Keith Ryon what I did is split these up in the house… Two bathrooms and the laundry room on one unit, and then the kitchen, other bathroom, and the powder room on the other unit. Worked just fine.
Thank you for posting! Really informative. Could you comment on the longevity of the unit? How long have you had it, have you had any issues with it, etc.? Thanks again!
I am just now replacing my Stiebel Eltron from 10 years ago when they design wasn't as good, but it's ran awesome till now. Burned a coil out finally.
Thanks for the information. If power goes out, can unheated water still pass through this unit?
Lived in a place a few years back that had 2 water heaters in series. Incoming water first went into a drain-back-type tanked solar heater. The water then went into a traditional gas water heater tank before going out to the rest of the house. That second tank rarely had to kick on and as a result I had some very low utility bills there. I know solar-thermal water heaters have largely fallen out of favor (nowadays most people just go full PV), but if they are well-installed, they work amazingly well. BTW, this was in Utah, and even though it snows there every year, you rarely go much more than a couple days without seeing the sun during the winter.
The big issue with Solar Thermal HW is stagnation: During summer months the collect so much energy that it overwhelms the system. In some cases you have to cover up the solar thermal panels. In winter you have to remove the snow and use antifreeze.
@@guytech7310 You must be thinking of a different design. There was no antifreeze or covering up of the panels required. There is a pump and it only runs: A) when the sun is shinning and B) the tank temperature isn't high enough. When the pump isn't running all the water drains back into the tank in the conditioned space inside leaving the pipes outside empty so there's no overheating or freeze danger. As for snow removal..if you don't get enough sun in the winter to melt it quickly on its own (like Utah and much of the western US), you're right, solar thermal probably isn't for you.
What does a code 65 error code mean on a Streibel Eltron Tempra 29 plus electric tankless mean? My contractor installed it as part of my home renovation 2 yrs ago and the alarm sounds about 5-6 times a day in the winter when my heat is at 70 degrees or higher. I have a 750 sq ft apartment in a row home in NYC and am only one person. My electric bill is the highest it's ever been (1k mth) and my house is always between 65-70 degrees. I have a water radiant heat system that he installed. He's come back to "fix it" 5 times and has yet to stop the 30 second beeping alarm so I turn my heat off at night so it doesn't wake me.
I heard it is impossible to add recirculation pumps to their tankless unless you have a dedicated recirc line - is that true?
So I noticed this water heater has one in and one out and the out (according to the description) is hot and the inlet is cold. How do you get the output for cold water?
Hey Jordan, the link to the Rheem is broken. What model was the Rheem you support?
So do you have a 29 KW generator to run the water heater during a power outage?
Hi Jordan - we are in a 4k s.f. rental house that has the Stiebel Eltron Tempra Plus! No manual & trying to figure out how to use less flow, still keeping the water hot. We are having trouble with opening the faucet say, half way, & trying to have it not on full blast flow (like in the kitchen.) What am I doing wrong? It goes cold each time. Same with the bathroom sink...less flow, & it goes cool. Can't I have warm water that's not on Niagara Falls full blast? *Help* (anyone else please feel free to chime in!!) Thanks from Naples!
Very interesting Jordan! I will consider it in my new home. I would suggest @Cirrus for a shower head (4L/min for 120$ USD) and @Aerated for faucet (0.2L/min in mist mode for 40$), it could be easier one your tankless water heater ;) !
I bought this Stiebel Eltron 239223 Tankless Water Heater - Tempra 29 Plus - Electric, On Demand Hot Water, Eco, White, 23 two weeks ago. Best decision I ever made electric tankless water heaters are the only way to go, especially with the price of fuel nowadays and never run out of hot water and I have three full baths.
Tried to buy from your links and they weren't working for me. But your video convinced me to install this. Myself. Wish me luck! Jennifer in Dripping Springs TX
What size of generator do you use with the water heater?
thanks bro
I've had that exact unit installed in my house since 2010. I've had zero issues with it. Simple maintenance of cleaning the strainer and if your water has high hardness levels; flushing/descaling the unit with white vinegar on a yearly basis.
The variable flow is a good feature for the houses that are located in cold weather climates. The ground water can easily be below 50'F in the middle of winter. Even with 3 40 amp 240 volt breakers, these types of units can only heat water to a certain temperature at a given flow rate.
The "Plus" option is for people that desire a defined set temperature of water output.
In today's market, I would change my decision and install a "heat pump" product. I feel that they are a far better unit even though they require a much larger foot print.
TechSkills do they have technicians to do the install. I’m interested
@@Findingmyvoice120 Yes installers are plentiful for both types of units that I've mentioned. Be sure to check out the installer's licensing and references so that you have a quality and problem free installation.
I'm very interested in your reasoning for wanting to go with a heat pump product. I'm actually looking to go from traditional tanks to tankless in order to claw back some space and aesthetics... thanks.
@@brois841 : My main reason is this: I live in Michigan and even with 3 dual pole 240 volt / 40 amp circuit breakers powering my on demand water heater, during the winter months the ground water temperature is low enough that the water flow is reduced quite a bit in order for the heater to put out the desired temperature. This is exactly how the unit is designed to perform. I still get plenty of hot water, it just takes longer. If we have multiple guests then they have to take turns instead of being able to accommodate multiple bathroom showers at a time. This isn't a problem once the ground water is above 55'F
If you live in a warmer climate and the ground water doesn't get as cold or you will only have one shower user at a time ... then there are zero negatives to installing this unit.
@@Real_Tech_Skills that makes sense, thanks.
I see you used 3 40a 2 pole breakers. If you were short on space in a panel couldn’t you use a 120a 3 pole breaker instead?
Any thermostatic or pressure balance shower valve will mitigate temperature fluctuation due to a change in volume or pressure in the supply. Hot water heater is sort of appropriate with storage style water heaters seeing as the water is already hot or at least warm when the burner fires, but an instantaneous water heater is only heating cold water!
Will this work in NJ well water?
Stiebel water heater, reset button is on but not working
.pls answer.
What model is that tub? Im 7ft tall. Thanks.
I actually have this Rheem XE50T10HD50U1 Performance Platinum 50 Gal unit & it does an amazing job. However, I need more capacity (wife & kids) & I was thinking about placing a tankless after so that when by hybrid supply does deplete I can continue to produce & if I have the temp settings on the tankless lower theoretically I shouldn't use the higher power demand (tankless) until the hybrid is empty. Any thoughts, suggestions, & or reasons not to? I'm along the same homestead setup. Middle of the woods/Farm-all-electric- Gen backup. Thank you!
I'm not the expert on putting water heaters in series. However I have often thought the solution you proposed would be ideal for supercharging your capacity when necessary, while idling back when not needed. It probably doesn't make sense from an roi standpoint, especially as cheap as hybrid water heaters are now, but if you coupled a small hybrid with an on demand, you could have your called and eat it too. Let me know if you do this and send me some pictures
@@JordanSmithBuilds You got it Chief, will do. Thanks for the feedback.
That feature is mainly focused on the commercial users. Sanitation requirements mean the temp must remain constant in commercial use.
Can you give me an update on this Unit today? Our Eemax went out only after 4 years and they won't Warranty. Thank you.
The unit is still fully operational. We have had no issues so far.
Jordan- thoughts on tak less vs heat pump these days ? I’m hearin, no pun intended, these are LOAD and if have to locate inside, very cold in winter…not so efficient …
I have the same heater. Just recently the hot water pressure has dropped. I flushed it out with no results. I haven’t changed anything for this to happen. Any idea what it might be?
Going to put this one in our house
Anyone used a tempra 12 plus? I’m about to install this inline with a 50 gallon water heater.
Why not install a small tank storage and recirculating pump with timer and i think should solve the flow issue and can be installed in mechanical room just a idea
We are building in a fairly remote area of Texas right now and went all electric except the stove top and gas fireplace on a propane tank. This way I can one day put solar on the backside of my metal shop and my wife doesn't have to see those ugly panels on "our pretty house." And maybe one day a standby generator. Our plumber recommends Rheem so we went with the Rheem heat pump water heater and putting it in the insulated garage next to the water softener and well tank. This way it will AC and dehumidify the garage...how much it helps we will see....it is hot in Texas after all! :)
Robert, How is that ac working in the garage? I’d love to replicate if it actually works for you.
how can i install this unit pls ??
in some areas the cost of electricity could be just 2 cent pro kilowatt at night and I would consider to install a plastic tank for 150-200 gallons under the garage floor and heat water by cheapest rate and keep the electric tankless water heater in system for purpose only if I need extra hot water
What do you think about using a cheaper, smaller electric tankless heater under each sink cabinet?
That is what I'm planning to do, hot water as quick as possible. Some redundancy as well, not likely multiple units will fail simultaneously. If one fails, I will still have hot water somewhere in the house.
You didn’t have a flush out valve ?
With 6 people in that house I'm surprised that a 29 kwh electric heater can actually produce enough hot water for everyone. Do you have to make sure that you don't have 3 showers going at once in the morning, especially during winter? I'm in the process of building a new 4.5 bath house and I'm installing two 27 kwh Ecosmart tankless electric heaters because I didn't think one would be enough. Also going with 400 amp service to make sure I've got enough juice for the water heaters, 8 tons of heat pump, potential electric cars in the future, and so on.
Rinnai RUR98in or Navien NPE-240a. Gas tankless with recirc all the way.
How big of a generator does it take to run everything? I do like the compact size. Does it have the cleaning issues that gas tankless heaters have?
60AMP @ 240VAC ~= 14.4 KW. You probably need a 25KW or larger generator to be able to use it. Not a good solution if you need to run a generator for a long term power outages lasting days. With a Tank WH you could use a much smaller generator, since you probably only need to dump in a 500W to 4 KW (Depending on model\size)
@@guytech7310 I suppose you could disable two of the three breakers while on generator and then take one shower at a time. It would seem important that the generator modulates its power and usage of fuel since the water heater is a very intermittent demand. What is interesting about Jordan's system is the price is only a few hundred more than a standard electric tank and the space required is minimal while still providing constant hot water. Clearly having a properly sized electric service is key since many houses are wired for only 100 amps.
@@rj.parker Depends on how cold your water is. If you have a deep well it always going to be very cold. In my opinion a propane system is the better option.
@@guytech7310 My experience with propane used as a daily fuel resource is that you will run out a time a two and certainly you won't have a full tank available for emergency use when you need it. Propane also costs about the same as electricity for heating purposes, requires venting and is inherently more dangerous in a house since it sinks to the floor. The nice thing about propane is that it keeps for decades at a time unlike most other backup fuels.
@@rj.parker For Backup (Generator) fuel use Diesel. I recommend Propane only for DHW & cooking since you need need Kilowatts of power on a generator to use electricity for DHW or cooking. No way would I recommend using Propane for a long duration Power outage since its has a low energy density compared to Diesel and you need propane to be delivered by a propane truck. Diesel can be DIY via Jerry cans.
FWIW: I also will be installing an outdoor boiler for winter heating & can also be used for preheating DHW.
No way your going to power that water heater with a generator, but tanked WH could work with a generator or with PV Solar. Another possible option is a hybrid, a small sized hot water tank feeding into a tankless. the Tank WH could be set a low temperature so its not wasting a lot of power, and a tankless can kick up to the desired temperature.
For my home I am using a propane tankless HW & Heater system that uses a buffer tank. My home is well insulated to the point it would short-cycle the boiler. The Buffer tank will pre-heat the DHW. I am also rural and thus use Propane so that I can get hotwater & heat when the power is out. Also have a propane stove to cook with when the power is out. Electric Stoves & tankless WH use a lot of power.
You can have problems with Legionella bacteria.
Thank you for correcting yourself when you said “hot water heater!” You even chuckled when you caught yourself, because, we both know, it’s not a “hot” water heater, because if the water was already hot, you wouldn’t need to heat it. 😜😂
Put PV connected to a DC element into a tank and use it to preheat the water that goes into the tankless heater.
Warranty?
Several reviews about that steinbel electron catching fire on Amazon. Rheem might be a better option.
Good to know. I wonder why?
Can I use this to warm my water in the indoor pool? Please reply anybody! Thanks.
Of course, but it would be running an awful lot. You should look into a dedicated unit, like the stuff that Raypak makes. Alternatively, you could use an outdoor heat pump to warm your indoor pool much more efficiently than a resistance heater, like the above or the Raypak stuff. Good luck!
@@benjamingamble2407 no - you need to get a commercial unit that had 100% duty cycle.
@@ppal64 Agreed!
but...if you had natural gas in this house, would you not have went with that?
AO Smith Vertex or Rheem Marathon
So what is the reason you are selling your house?
I just got a bid from a plumber today and on the quote it stated: HWH = Hot Water Heater.... from a plumber!!!
29 KWh is equal to 100KBtu which will take care of a couple showers only, or around 2 fixtures. Depending on how many bathrooms in this home and the ground water temperature, it is likely undersized. Depending how much you are paying for electricity, propane will likely be cheaper. Also if you are in an area prone to power outages, it would be much easier to add back up power for a propane tankless water heater since the power usage is less than 90 watts under normal operation.
heat pump water heater with a tank? Not a fan
Are you still satisfied with this tankless water heater after the past couple years?
Yeah, update would be nice.
All elements work all the time when heat is called for and are modulated. Fact is you only save about $100 on not heating standing water, advantage never run out and save room and some $. Set it to lowest setting you can need 115F for xtra efficiency. Heat pump is most efficient.
Unfortunately, you need over 131 f at the source to kill Legionella bacteria which is naturally occurring and spreading. Then you can use a mixing valve at the shower or at the water heater to reduce it a lower temp. It is true that Legionella primarily sickens and kills those with preexisting diseases but setting up properly will be important as the bacteria mutates.
I luv ur house can i come visiting lol
With 6 people in your house, that 50 gal rheem you linked might not be large enough
You thought you were going to be “Energy independent“ with a freaking 29,000 Watt water heater??!
Id like to understand this as well. How would we go about supplying the electric if there was an outage for a week, month, or even longer? Id feel much better, more secure, if our family could do this - these days you never know, and as a mom, i feel it is my responsibility and duty to take care of my children - and there has been so many warnings. The main limiting factor these days stopping us would be: 1) money, 2) time for researching / learning / implementing / maintaining, and 3) know how / skill set to be able to implement. . At least youtube is awesome, a true gift; giving each of us the opportunity to help teach one another.
Great if you have 3 phase electricity to your property. If you don't then forget it.
I'll bet Jordan gets a fruit basket from the electric company every Christmas.
The amount of kwh used would not be higher than a standard 30 amp tank water heater unless hot water usage went up because continuous hot water was available. It would just be higher electric demand for a shorter time. In residential the electric utilities don't tack on demand charges. Plus there are many larger heat pump houses with electric strip backup equaling that demand, eg dual systems with 15kw each.
Hot water heater. I don’t care if it’s wrong.
Let me know I own a tankless specialist company in Houston....it is a hot water heater...and electric tankless are a bad idea for 99% of people.... especially when not building....
Bad choice. Heat Pump w/ tank is far far far FAR more efficient and will use 1/3 the power and cost the same. On top of that you also then have the option of adding Solar Thermal easily. Buy stainless steel or Plastic tank version and the tank will NEVER fail.
Heat pump type would only be more efficient if it was ducted outside or outside itself other wise you are stealing heat from your house which then its only as efficient as your home heating system plus the cost to take that heat and put it into your water, this us all only applies in primarily heating climates like i live in. If the opposite the it would help with your cooling load
@@SupperDadder What idiot would NOT do that? Guess you are a classic case of "anyone can be a barking MORON" so better point out the obvious.... just in case someone with an IQ lower than room temperature is listening...
@@w8stral calm down
And he actually mentioned using a heat pump water heater in the video so....
Propane is better
What's the deal with leaving Matt? Should have a honest vid explaining wth happened. Sure wish you'd dress more professionally - t-shirt seems amateurish
OMG!!! one cares who far you leave, just talk about the water heater.