DCC decoder install in an Athearn locomotive
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- čas přidán 22. 11. 2017
- Installing a basic (and cheap) DCC decoder in the very common Athearn HO scale locomotive chassis.
Hopefully this can help some beginners get past the fear of trying this for themselves.
Here is the manual for this decoder (in all of it's random linguistic glory) from the manufacturer's webpage:
laisdcc.com/LaisDcc_Decoders_M...
Link to the decoder I used:
www.aliexpress.com/item/NEM65...
I did a review of a very simnilar decoder about a year and a half ago:
• Cheap DCC decoder: fir...
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As with all of my videos, this isn't the only way to do it.
It's probably not the best way to do it.
But it's how I do it.
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/ pileofstuff - Jak na to + styl
I don't even keep trains (what is WRONG with me) but I had to watch this - just had to see you add DCC to an existing train. Great detail!
Your remarks about slack reminded me of how I know when it's time to turn off the lights, and go to bed:
"I've cut this wire three times and it's still too short".
I have just got back into model railroading after 25 years and just purchased a dcc starter set. I opened up an 30 year old Athearn GP35 to see how to install the decoder. This video was great and showed me exactly what to do. Thank you. I have just subscribed.
I successfully installed a Digitrax DN136D today, thanks for the great help.
Put my first decoder in today after seeing your video short, amazing how satisfying it is to see it run successfully. Thank you and keep up the good work.
The best decoder install video I've seen. Appreciate all the detail and explanation for an electrical novice. Great camera too.
Thanks for that video, have been buying up old athearn blue box locomotives since they are way cheaper to get and install dcc to them, nice to have a video that is not rushed into do this and that. thanks much.
Great video, you covered all aspects of the total install properly. Thank you
Excellent video
Im getting back into it after 10 yr and all i have is blue box, so this vid is perfect.
Thank you.
Very fiddly but excelently mastered. Very interesting and most enjoyable. Thank you.
Aside from my comment below, I found your explanation and photography one of the best I've viewed for installation of Decoders in Blue Box Athearn locomotives.
Great video now I feel good about doing one on two of my DC engines
Great video, I have ordered a decoder for HO/N scale from them (The one you used was out of stock). Cant believe the price $12 and will let you know how it turns out.
This is an outstanding step-by-step video. Thanks for putting this together! Sub'd as well.
Great video keep. The work up very well done
Thanks for sharing, I got 2 dc locos I’d like to convert if I go to do such. Didn’t really think it was THAT SIMPLE!
- JP
I learned a lot! I have a few engines from Athearn I plan to rebuild:
4= SD40-2 engines
3= F59PHI engines
1= SW1500 engine
1= C44-9W Engine
All of my other locomotives and power cars:
Atlas:
1= AEM-7AC
2= C42-8/W
2= ALP-45-DP
2= GenSets
1= GP38-2
Bachmann:
2= HHP8
1= F40PH
1= GE 70 Tonner
Intermountain:
1= Tier 3 ES44CWDC
1= Tier 4 ES44CWAC
MTH:
1= SD70ACe
Broadway Limited:
1= Trackmobile
Athearn:
1= C40-9W
3= SD70/75I/MAC
1= GP40X
1= P42
True line Trains:
1= MP36-PH-3
Rapido:
1=Modernized F40PH
1=FL-9
Kato:
1= F40PH
1= GE P42
Walthers:
1= SD60M
1= B42-8W
1= E-9
2= Metroliner (M.U.)
1= RDC-2
1= GP60 (Modified to E-GP60M- LowNox)
8= R-21/22 Subway Cars
All DCC ready. And more.
Athearn locomotives are ez to convert to DCC but isolating the frame from the motor is very important and make sure the electrical contact from the frame bolster to the truck base pickup is clean so no lube is required on the frame bolster pin. It will get some from the truck gears getting thrown out.
Really helpful video...Thank you.
Good information, I do not suggest or recommend ever filing metel directly over the worm gear and truck gears however. Those are are plastic inside and metal filings will stick in the grease and cause all kinds of havoc down the road, literally. ;) Also with old blue box athearns if you upgrade to DCC I recommend heavily you purchase the newer RTR motors which will also require getting the drive shaft kit that needs sizing and cutting along with the worm gear connector kit to fit the new shafts. It's about 60 dollars for everything but your Athearn will run perfectly on DCC setups, and be much smoother in operation, it's not necessary but highly recommended as those newer motors were designed for DCC. Great video very informative!
I like the challenge of getting the old guys running well with as many stock parts as I can.
Great show of the detailed techniques. Thanks. Would be nice to have captions.
I just enable the captions (auto-generated - hopefully they're not to strange. I might fix some errors in the speech-to-text when I have time in the future)
I had a new gp50 that would stop on the track. I traced it down to the truck swivel pin. It has some black paint that I scratched off. I also pulled the wheels and lightly filed the slots for the wheel bronze bearings. On DC and problems are gone.
At the end you discuss a polarity issue ( my previous note was added mid-video). The polarity issue is because I was correct in what I thought I saw and the chassis was reassembled incorrectly. This changed the polarity of the entire system and why you now have the headlight wire powering your backup light. It works, but remember this when you do the next one.
Really interesting stuff and I believe they run smoother than many of the Triang Hornby locos which I have.
I have a couple of old NA locos and wondered if the motor etc could be swapped over to the Brutish models ?
Excellent
This is an excellent video. The step by step instructions made it easy to follow and do. My only question is why didn't you use both of the alligator clips on the vice to hold those small parts?
It's often more effort than it's worth trying to line up both clips on the Helping Hands and getting them to stay where I want them.
Great how-to. I was wondering about the resister. You said 1k. What I need to know is Watts and %. I found 1k, 1/4w, 5%. Thank you for your time in doing this video.
1/4 watt will be fine. I think that's what I used.
The % is just an accuracy number. 5% is not going to be a problem. (I happened to use a 1%, but only because that's what I had handy) You could use anything from 800 to 1500 ohms and it would work fine with no damage. The brightness would change slightly, more ohms = less brightness..
Excelente me sirvió de mucho
gracias
Great video, I am going to give it a try. I tried Googling, but I cannot find the exact LED's you are using there. What is your source for you LED's and resistors?
I don't remember exactly who I bought the LEDs and resistors from.
It would have been the cheapest seller I could find on e-bay.
Try a search like this one :
www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_sacat=0&LH_FS=1&_nkw=3mm+led+warm+white&_sop=15
www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_odkw=resistor+kit+assortment&_sop=15&_osacat=0&_from=R40&_trksid=p2045573.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xresistor+kit+assortment+30+values.TRS1&_nkw=resistor+kit+assortment+30+values&_sacat=0
You can remove the light bar form the bracket by listening the tabs on the back of the bracket.....
I have one of these trains, it's quit old and might put a decoder in it
i would suggest wiring the lights using the accessory wires supplied with the decoder. wire the lighting to the blue wire as the poditive and the colored wires for the lights.
I was also confused by this. To clarify...I think you meant: he should have soldered the white and yellow wires from the decoder to the cathodes (the ends with the resistors attached) of the LEDs, and then the blue wire from the decoder to the anodes of the LEDs (would have to splice off one time for one of the LEDs. That way you don't need to run that black common to the frame, as he did. Am I correct?
So my concern is, why the heck is one side of the pickup on both trucks and the other on a metal plate? Is it the way the current is transferred? Otherwise excellent tutorial
The wheels on one side of the trucks have an electrical connection to the frame, and the wheels on the other side connect to the strap. All 8 wheels pick up off the track, 4 from each rail.
I've enjoyed your video my question is which decoder fits which locomotive. I've been to their website and find no cross reference charts available. Can you help?
The decoder that I used should fit in most N scale and larger locomotives.
These are generic decoders. They aren't made to fit specific locomotives.
On smaller locomotives you might have to be a bit creative on placement - possibly removing a bit of one of the weights or sneaking it into the cab.
What sort of measures do you take to “tune” up an old locomotive? I’ve got some old Tyco units from the late 70s / early 80s that I’ve been working on. I’m guessing that minor arcing from inside the motor equates to worn out brushes? Any ideas on sources for brushes that old (or replacing the motor altogether? Not really sure if the brushes are easily replaceable in those ...
My usual "tune up" is 90% cleaning and lubricating. Clean the wheel treads, any electrical connections between the wheels and the motor, etc.
Open up the gearbox and get any crusty crud out, re-lube.
After that just make sure the motor is securely mounted and the driveshafts are straight. Check that everything moves smoothly and adjust until it does.
I don't think I have ever owned a Tyco. Not sure what goes on under the hood of those. I would probably troll through used tables at a train show to find a "parts donor" and transplant parts from there.
If the brushes are sparking, try to clean the commutator (if it is an open frame motor that lets you get at it) with a q-tip and alcohol. Might save you a lot of hunting for parts.
Mark Teague, here is an NMRA article on tuning up an Athearn locomotive: www.mcor-nmra.org/Publications/Articles/Athearn_TuneUp.php Hope it helps!
Great video. Thank you! Curious what camera setup you used to film this if you don't mind.
It's a lot more simple than you think.
I explain it (and a few other things) here: czcams.com/video/SP7rDg4A7sc/video.html
@@pileofstuff thank you!
instead of bending in the prongs on the bottom contact strip. just swap the bottom strip with the top and isolate it . then you have two nice prongs to solder lights to on top
With the 3mm led lights you said you used a 1k resistor. But later in the video you said you changed the resistors but never said too what size resistors? What size did you change them to?
I just changed the position, not the value.
Amazing video. I am just getting back into the HO train thing and have zero DCC locos. But lots of them that look exactly like what you were playing with. You probably saved me billions of dollars! Question: when you were isolating the motor, pushing the pins back in on the clip; could you have instead simply taped over the contact strip on the chassis? Could have avoided pulling the clip off and watching the spring launch.
Possibly, but I wanted to flatten down the little spikes and not worry if they were going to poke thru the tape.
Thank you veey much for sharing. Now I can do it myself with aome confidence. Where are you located if I may ask?
I'm in Winnipeg, Canada.
Thanks for watching!
pileofstuff I'm from Cape Town South Africa and I'm in the process to relocate to Canada in this year. If all goes well I would like to meet you someday.
Good luck on the move. Don't forget to buy some warm clothes!
pileofstuff Thank you very much.
I just bought an Athearn blue box SP daylight. My chassis are the strap like the one you have. I'm trying to find out their age is there a way to judge it? Thank you.
They were still making that style in the late '90s. When DCC became mainstream was around the time they ended that chassis design.
Not sure when they started, but it was considered an old design by that time.
Still pretty reliable, though
How did you get the truck and motor apart so you could clean it ? Did you only have to cleean both trucks?
There is a plastic clip on top of the worm hear that holds the entire assembly together.
AIt appears you reassembled it backwards. At the start, the headlight bracket is to the left and the tabs from the trucks for the right pickup are on the far side. As you reassemble, the headlight bracket is to the left and the truck tabs are still on the far side (chassis side farthest from you). This is why I tell people to label everything as you disassemble!
Is there a way to add sound to these old trains? Like a esu loksound?
Absolutely.
Most of the people I know locally use SoundTraxx brand decoders.
The installation is very similar. The hard part is finding room inside the locomotive shell for the speaker.
I don't think I will go to DCC, but that is a helpful video on how to take an Athern apart. I have one that runs in the opposite direction of the other trains. Can I turn the trucks around so it runs the other direction?
Actually, swapping the trucks (move the back one to the front) is probably what you need to do.
If you have a multimeter, you can test that theory before you put it back on the track.
You marked the fly wheel "F" for FRONT; but, you put the motor on the frame with the F towards the ear of the locomotive. You needed to put the F facing the Head Light mount. Because you put the motor facing to the rear, you then put the trucks on backwards when you followed the "F" that you marked on the flywheel. This placed the "right" side truck pick ups on the left side of the frame. I believe this then caused your leds to be reversed.
Yeah, that is probably what happened.
Its surprisingly easy to confuse myself when i'm thinking too much about making the video, and not what I'm actually doing.
but front is actually the long hood on a high nose loco
great video. you said the diesel was noisy how did you fix that. I have an athearn with the body off, it is quiet, with the body on, it growls like an old bear, any ideas. Thank you, I learned a lot
Some insist the "growling" is created by the flywheels not being true (either brass or steel) and they manage to rub the inside of the shell (on scale not wide hood older models). I have a difficult time believing they can be that "untrue" they rotate out of round enough to do that but people have ponted to Model Railroader studies that document the flywheels are not true. Sure way to tell that is being done would be to put something on the flywheels to be able to make a mark on the inside of the shell should they rub against it and then put the shell back on, run and see what happens. What you then do about the flywheels, I don't know (not everyone has a lathe at their disposal). I would say more likely that not, the motor is shifting bc the mounts are 1) old or 2) and when the motor starts to "toruque" w/the shell on, it shift left or right enought to hit the inside of the shell.
How many of us have lost a brush spring over the years?
Come on own up !
....and years later, finding them, randomly.
Hi, I recently obtained an old Athearn GP9 off of EBay. My plans are to strip it and paint it in CP Rail red. I have not seen this driveline configuration on any CZcams videos. It has an up right bulb in the front. No flywheels and the old two part clips for the truck retention. The trucks are different as well. Have you ever seen one of these. The Alco PA1 parts diagram from 1970 has a similar setup.
That's interesting. Any Athearns that I remember have had an almost identical chassis to this. The only differences that I have seen are for wheelbase length or number of axles.
Then again, I haven't seen an Athearn that is less than 15 years old.
pileofstuff thanks. This one is probably from late 1979. I have two like this. The trucks have the Metal outsides and the axles ride in bearings in them. The handrails on the old one are round with a hole punched in them for the handrail. I also have a new old stock Athearn blue box gp9 that has the modern trucks, flywheels, narrow motor and the open top square stanctions. Point is there is a lot of really ancient blue box stuff out there and anyone buying should check the trucks, rails, and motor before buying. My old stuff runs ok, draws .32 amps and pulls well after cleaning.
would you happen to be able to do that to somebody else's locomotive?
if so then what would it cost?
I'm not sure what someone would charge for a decoder installation.
Sometimes local hobby shops will have a list of locate people who do custom work for ther people.
But I don't have the time to take on work for other people.
I've been told a n scale decoder can be used in a small ho scale loco. is this true and can a n scale sound decoder be used?
The only thing to watch out for is the current (amps) rating of the decoder and how much current the motor uses.
Any modern locomotive in HO should be fine with any decoder that can do 1 amp or more. (most N scale decoders that I've seen are 1amp to 1.5 amps).
Check the spec sheet for the decoder you want to use, and then check the stall current of your locomotive (using a multimeter). As long as the loco uses less current than the cedoder's maximum you'l be fine.
I use the DN123 digitrax decoders for my Athearn SW7's, S12, and SW1500 locos provided they have the newer drives with brass flywheels. I also add wire contacts to the trucks so they can get current better.
Does it matter which side of the LED the diode is attached?
Not really. As long as it's pointing in the right direction
What is that "capgon" tape?
Kapton tape: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kapton
Electrically insulating, temperature resistant, flexible, thin. Very handy stuff.
Very nice Video! I have an Athearn HO scale EMD TR5A switcher I need to put a decoder into. www.railpictures.net/photo/14358/ I just need to find time to do it! Not much room in there, so it will get a Digitrax N scale decoder. Thanks for making this!
FFS - A Resistor (R) is used to drop the VOLTS (E) not the amps (I). LED's use ~ 2-3 VOLTS, not the 18-24 volts of a DCC system. Amps is determined purely by the wattage (P) of any load and will only draw enough amps to do the work (watts). P =E x I upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/78/Ohm%27s_Law_Pie_chart.svg/600px-Ohm%27s_Law_Pie_chart.svg.png. Since a LED is usually in the milliamp or less range, according to your statement, a 1K resistor would never allow the LED to light up IF IT WAS REDUCING AMPS. On the other hand though, if you drop the Volts to far, then the PD (potential difference) is too low and the device (LED in this case) will NOT work. As I stated above, they have a working VOLTAGE of ~2-3 Volts. remember its VOLTS that you are dropping, not amps ok
PS: So basically the higher the voltage the brighter a LED will become until it burns its self out.
You use my lingo and soldering techniques. You must work, as I do, in the electronics field.
Yup. Started in broadcast back in the '80s. Did a bunch of live sound, and in telecom now.
These products are banned from import into at least the US and the U.K. as known counterfeit goods, though this is very difficult to enforce. Here is a link to a letter from the manufacture who had their software stolen by Lais. yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=13788&forum_id=10&jump_to=248529#p248603
Thanks. I wasn't aware of that.