Doom's Ray Tracing Upgrade: A Game-Changer For The PC Classic?
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- čas přidán 8. 07. 2024
- The Ultimate Doom is the ultimate game - and now it's received a ray tracing upgrade? But how do you add RT to a game that doesn't actually have anything like a modern lighting model? What does this upgrade actually do, how does it work and what level of performance can you get from the best and the worst Nvidia RTX cards? Alex investigates.
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Doom 3 and Quake 4 seem like games that would work really well in raytracing since they're so big on dynamic lighting for everything.
Doom 3 needs it the shadows omg
At least Quake 4 have upgraded textures in a MOD.
Doom 3 ray tracing is a wet dream goddamn
The stencil shadows define the look though, they’d probably look cool but will be much more well lit with ray tracing in a way that could spoil the atmosphere. Maybe they could change how the bounces work to mitigate that though.
@@BobsRevenge well they already made the BFG edition which largely removed stencil shadows didn't they?
The fact that this game is still ported on everything and even raytraced shows how much of a legacy it has. Doom 1993 is more exciting to play than some AAA game titles
Yes indeed, i just got a brand new gaming pc 2 months back.
I plowed Resident Evil Village and some other new fancy stuff.
I promised myself right now to finish of a (huge) backlog and exit my comfort zone of regular FPS, RTS, even so... i just had to get my Doom wads and GZDoom and get on with a new wad i never played. :D I mean without those source ports, you would think twice loading up a usermap, those source ports have and do wonders.
Doom WAS AAA in 1993, though today it's team and budget would seem tiny, that's just a reflection on how the industry has grown. Back in the 80's, an official Batman game was made by 3 people in a weekend.
John Carmack almost singlehandedly launched games into proper 3D with his technical genius and decades later he almost singlehandedly gave us proper working VR. Doom is a masterpiece for a reason.
@@worldcomicsreview354 "In the video-game industry, AAA is an informal classification used to categorise games produced and distributed by a mid-sized or major publisher, which typically have higher development and marketing budgets than other tiers of games."
Doom was a small budget game (like most other games at the time) made by a small company with very few (but incredibly talented) people, it was not an AAA game. AAA games doesn't mean that it's a good game, nowadays it's often the opposite.
@@EpsilonKnight2 yep, dude is scary smart. Basically a rocket scientist these days 🤣
i love how the mixture of dated sprites/textures along with state of the art lighting gives the appearance like playing a little paper cutout, running around shotting cutouts in a small dollhouse like box. I know my explanation sucks, but it's just hard for me to get the right words out. I hope some of it makes sense.
I was thinking the same thing!
Yeah it does, it's part of the charm for me too. It's like running around a pixel art diorama.
*shooting
@@alvallac2171do you spend your entire time correcting people's years old comments with slight typos? they're clearly perfectly literate judging by the rest of the paragraph, you're not their teacher and this is not a test you need to grade lol.
I'd love to see a raytraced version of Descent 1 and 2. The lighting in those games was so unreal in the mid 90s, that even today it holds up!
daaamn now THAT would be something i'd dive in! I was right about thinking if there was a way to play Descent in VR like in Quake.
@@ThePhantomPhanto I know Descent 2 had support for early VR headsets, not 100% if D1 did too.
A few years back some of the developers created a spiritual successor called Overload, which has Steam VR support. Yes, it is an awesome experience in VR!
RT Descent 3 would be easier to do.
@Random Platypus with Internet I'm not sure how much raytracing would benefit a space sim like Freespace. At least, not with its original assets. There are multiple missions where you are simply in barren space, with no obvious light source. That said, I'd give so much money for someone to bring back Freespace. Remaster 1&2, and finally finish the trilogy with an all-new 3.
Descent 1/2 are arguably my favourite games ever, i go back and play through them ever year/other year, nothing beats them even today. Also would love to see Magic Carpet 1/2 get the Raytraced treatment, another of my all time old favourite games :)
I think this would look incredible if you actually would run it at the vanilla doom resolutions so the raytracing lights become chunky and pixelated, blending perfectly with all the other assets.
👏👏👏
YESSSSS, thats what I've been thinking
it looks weird, but if it was at normal resolution, it would look phenomenal
Yeah I really don't like when old games get partially upscaled, certain elements like the weapons and enemies no longer fit within the environment they are in.
You can, playing at 360p even adds a crt filter
@@ttvCarn It's like when people play the PC version of the classic Tomb Raider games at something like 1920x1080 and all the sprites for ammo and health pickups are tiny. You'd think in these modern ports they could simply scale each sprites to be something like 4x the original size or something?
This is so cool. They should definitely do Doom 3/Quake 4. Also if they're working on Half-Life IMO it should be with Black Mesa.
It's probably easier to implement in the old HL GoldSource engine compared to the source engine used in Black Mesa. Since GoldSource is a modified Quake engine where they already made Ray Tracing for.
@@Xfade81 we also have source code and an open source version of gold source in the form of Xash3D.
i'd rather see it in goldsource, just for nostalgia; if valve updated the engine to have modern support and and RT render setting the fans would do the rest of the work i'm sure.
Quake 2 Rtx is a different engine than Vanilla Quake 2( idtech something idk i forgot the number) so it would be almost impossible to port ray tracing to gold source. It may be possible in Xash
Duuuude Doom 3 with Ray tracing would be amazing
I'd love to see the original Unreal (1998) with ray tracing!
You can say that again! But Unreal is a game that I wish would be _truly_ remade. As in, given a treatment that, to my knowledge, no game has actually ever gotten, despite the abuse of the term "remake", or the nonsensical marketing term 'remaster'**, etc. A complete _technical_ cutting-edge update of the game while maintaining the strictest adherence to the aesthetic and spirit of the original.
Of course, it is never acceptable to Lucas the original game out of existence by replacing it with the newer version.
** Video games aren't mastered to begin with -- they can't be _re_ - mastered.
Absolutely. One of my all time favorite shooters.
@@bricaaron3978 the last one was pretty faithtul to the '99 imo
@@PrimalShutter Are you talking about UT? I'm pretty sure OP and Bric were referring to the original single player game.
@@kveller555 ah, yes, just had a brain fart
I'd be interested to see what a similar implementation of ray tracing can do to a Build Engine game. Blood or Ion Fury would probably look really slick with some modern lighting.
Blood.... Hell yeah! It would definitely make the brooding atmosphere even more brooding.
Now that's a good next project!
Duke Nukem 3D!!!
I hope we see Doom 3 ray traced soon since that is an open source engine, the original has a unique look but it treated darkness as just pitch black
And it has some great foreboding industrial atmosphere that could benefit.
The game was ahead of its time, they made game look like the shadows were ray traced even though they were not. Almost everything casted shadows on all surfaces. That game could really come alive with real raytraced lights and shadows indeed. And probably get rid of the pitch black look without ruining the atmosphere.
Yeah , doom 3 with better textures and ray tracing would look great
The spinning lights would be challenging as ray tracing usually needs a few frames to build up enough information to look accurate.
@@rowanunderwood True. Doing fast rotating RT lights would probably tank the performance beyond any usability. But what about shadows?
Pretty impressive on the technical side, but I feel it went overboard with the lights intensity, plus some textures are too clean.
With a bit more work on the art side and trying to match the original feel, it can be an awesome way to replay the game.
Same I feel like many of the scenes look worse art wise as the scene is now blown out by the lighting changes
Just make regular stuff a bit light-emitting and (therefore) shadows softer
The barrels in particular are way too bright. Reducing the brightness and making it more of a sickly green glow would help alleviate a lot of the tonal issues, IMO.
@@freedomsflame688 Yes, the barrels and the blue surfaces are way too bright to the point it's hilarious
I think it looks terrible.
When I was learning how to code games in high school (1994ish), DOOM was heavily written about in programming books ("Tricks of the Game-Programming Gurus" by Andre Lamothe, for instance). I remember one line out of this book talked about how ray tracing would NEVER be a reasonable solution to lighting as it takes too much time. Instead, the book taught those lighting tricks you mentioned. Funny how badly that book aged. Other than that, it was a pretty good DOS game programming book.
I remember playing around with ray tracing around that same time. It took many minutes just to render one 640x480 frame in 256 colors on my Pentium 90. Now, we're rendering 30+ 4K frames with 16M colors every second.
Same thoughts today about what will be possible in the future. Should be interesting.
1994: Wtf is a Ghz
@@Osprey850 freeware POV Ray (Persistence of Vision) around 1992, where on my 486 DX2 66MHz 4Mb, would take probably 30mins to do 1 frame of a simple checkboard , reflected in glass balls.
Just looking at this POV is still an active thing
it wasn't even that i used to make doom levels when it originally came out, no real time preview, compile, error, edit, compile. I remember when Duke Nukem 3D came out and you could go into a real time preview near instantly, it was ground-breaking.
Same with CGI, 3D studio, no real time textures, then 3DStudio Max, you could see the textures, lighting in real time, without having to render
Would like to see how raytraced doom and voxel doom would look, especially since the enemy sprites have been remade by hand in the digital sense
I was hoping you guys would analyze this! As always, you deliver the goods.
Same here!
I hope they cover House of the Dead on Switch, it has a performance and quality mode!
Tech is cool, but needs to be corralled to fit within the art language of the game. Lots of potential though.
i don't understand how it could be, it's path tracing, it is trying to add realistic light physics. I am playing it last few days and i think it is a perfect marriage, it enhances the horror, light and shadow, pitch black, the shifting shadows as imp fireballs cast across the environment.
@@richardtucker5938 imo it's ironically distracting & artificial. Personally I like playing on Doom light settings with engine AO & dynamic lighting, and that feels vastly more immersive.
@@SyrupBuccaneer i can get that, but i think it should be respected that this is a new atmosphere given by a systemic change in lighting. If you have the means to play it and experience it non passively, seeing those shadows of demons suddenly appear on a tunnel wall because an imp cast a fireball, you suddenly realise how many demons are just round the corner. This is a new atmosphere, try it if you can. There is room for many a doom rendition.
@@SyrupBuccaneer even more ironic, this is the one lighting model that is not artificial. If doom scenario existed in real life it would look more like this than any other version.
'Far from it' is going a little too far, compared with what the commenter original said, using mods in other versions, this version surely has a more realistic light simulation than any other version, i did not say that is was 'real', but closer than any other existent version, otherwise what would be the point of querying the scene with ray tracing?
Your a little misrepresenting the relationship between shadow size and light size. the closer a light is to the occluding object, the bigger the shadow, a smaller light will produce sharper shadows as the light is more strongly directional and less diffuse coming from a smaller area.
Doom actually has quite a lot of small rooms, with high ceilings and therefore high walls, so relative to light sources, they actually do block lots of light, and create large shadows. So long as the ray cast is accurately adhering to the shape of the light, then this should be physically consistent and correct. I do agree that shadows are too dark in many scenes, as the GI contribution is diminished, but where there are more light sources, and of different colours, two bounces can actually produce some decent enough GI, but as many areas are lit entirely from within and without a large emissive like a sky, the two bounce GI can fail especially as lighting becomes sparser.
For example, cyberpunk has just one bounce of light from the sun in psycho rt, and this helps with ambient lighting in shadowed regions, because it is more omnipresent.
I still note many scenes where GI is plainly evident, again i see this as an increase in realism relative to any other version. This is all by contextualized comparison obviously.
One of the things I love about games going right back to the dawn of them is the relationship between the artistic choices made and the invention of techniques to realise those choices. Doom is a great example of this interplay between artistic vision and technological creativity.
While I find it interesting to see some of these older games with ray tracing applied, I pretty much unanimously prefer the original look simply because they were designed with the technology and techniques used to create them in mind. Aside from areas where there was a deliberate intent to create a certain mood, there's also the matter of aesthetic cohesiveness. My mind is much more easily able to suspend disbelief when all the elements are of a similar fidelity. Having lifelike lighting applied to these assets which resemble pixelated cardboard cut-outs is jarring to me.
I'm a big fan of ray tracing and I'm eager to see it used in more games going forward. But I'm personally more interested to see games where it informs the artistic choices of the developers rather than being tacked on. I'm particularly interested in seeing a horror game make use of ray tracing to good effect. Developers have a new toy to play with and I'm looking forward to seeing them get creative with it.
I suppose that's similar to why the GTA remaster looks so bad. Realistic lighting applied to cartoon character models.
@@roflBeck The lighting is the least of that remaster's problems. It actually wouldn't look bad if they just hadn't changed the original textures and models.
This is what may young self tought the future of gaming would be in a short spawn of time, sadly raytracing took his sweet time to move from cinema to PC mainstream, Toy Story 1 was released in 1996 my child mind tought by the 2000 we would have this fidelity of gaming by that amount of time.
The care that went into this analysis is wonderful. The comparison shots are recorded in engine so they are literally the exact same shot. Perfect for this kind of video. Great work as always DF!
This looks so great. I'm confused why they would choose to get rid of the flickery lighting though. Seems ripe for raytracing goodness.
Ray-traced lights don't update instantly. You'd see a slightly grainy pulsing light rather than a flickering one, they probably tried and found that it looked more like the rendering was broken somehow.
Because real-time GI usually takes a few frames to get results. With flickering lights, you would probably get a smeary, grainy mess all over the place, because the GI solution would never converge.
I was wondering why they ditched the flickering lighting 🤔 😕
I wondered the same. Thanks to the other guys for explaining why.
Thanks for both of these explanations as to potentially why. Now that begs the question of who’s gonna be the guy who figures out a genius workaround for this. That sounds like a fun problem solving mission to figure out.
0:30 - I need more Vincent Price evil laughter in my life
This is such a well made, informative, and entertaining video. I've been a Doom fan for almost thirty years, which is a weird thing to think about, and I'm so glad it gets such a huge amount of work and attention this far after it came out. It's the most evergreen game I've ever played.
Just gave it a go. Pretty amazing, to be honest. The game is still as fun as it was when it came out and the raytracing works ridiculously well with it. Honestly, I'm really impressed. Sure, some things are over the top, others are missing, but overall, for an "algorithmic" emulation of lighting based on the textures and sectors alone: Awesome results.
Change a handful of properties, a few textures to be less reflective, and a shadowless fill light over all surfaces in the entire level to fake light bounces and to get rid of the need of the flashlight. (Although I'd still keep a 360-degree light on top of the player that doesn't affect them so there's still the original "fill" from the game). The tech is amazing, the implementation less so.
@@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire Actually, you can change the flashlight to behave like a 360° "player light" in the options. If you do that, the flashlight button toggles that on / off instead.
@@MR-vg7yn oooh that is nice thanks my dude
Some lights are completely over the top. The barrels look like they have lamps inside of them and flashing light appear broken (even at 12:12) maybe because the ray tracing doesn't do it's thing quick enough ?
The barrels are so overdone, they really just needed to be a faint light source.
*its thing (possessive pronoun)
it's = contraction of "it is" or "it has"
Apostrophes are for contractions and possessive nouns, not pronouns.
*enough?
Really cool implementation of the tech. LIke many have said the light levels are a bit high (those barrels, man) and overall it could probably do with a bit more of a bespoke touch to tweak and engineer the lighting for a lot of scenes to retain the vibe of the originals. That would be its own huge undertaking though.
The dynamic shadows on the sprites is especially cool.
love how the intro is the pistol shooting to the beat of the Doom iconic music
Hahaa nice, this even more of a contrast between old school and modern tech than the Quake RTX mode. One thing they could tweak is the toxic barrel light brightness, it could be a bit less intense, it's a bit overkill imo.
Maybe a of lights needs to be a bit less intese too. A few scenes sure seems too bright than in real life lol
Yeah it looks like some of the super harsh lighting in Deus Ex or something...
It's the one thing that kills the vibe. The side0by0side of the hangar makes it seem like there are fluorescent lights installed above each barrel. It's brutal.
Thats mostly my only complaint. Some of the lights are too intense. The barrels, and hell's red sky. Im not sure the color needs to change, just the intensity
Just a shame the ray traced version loses some of the iconic lighting / planned darkness jump scares & tension. This is what ruined the Jaguar version of Doom vs PC, Jag version's lighting was super scuffed I'm not sure how they managed to ruin sector based lighting with that version.
Some ports used "static lighting" with all areas at full-brightness, either to overcome poor framerates, or because of screens not being backlit (the GBA ports both offered such an option)
Jag version was still better than the 32x version of Doom.
The lighting changes in the ray-traced version are the equivalent of a newbie audio mixer drowning everything in reverb, thinking the more the effect is noticed, the more impressive a job they've done. The effect is supposed to serve the subject matter, and not drown it out for show. And in the DOOM RT clips, the effect is drowning-out the subject matter, the levels, for show. It's tasteless and tacky, and it won't hold up well over time as the novelty of RT wears off.
An all time legendary classic. I remember downloading the shareware version from the BBS (bulletin board) back in the day, December '93 iirc, when you could of course as you can imagine they were pretty busy.
I hope Elon Musk buys Twitter soon as claimed and breaks the site up into classic forums and BBS
Voxel Doom + this addon = be a heaven. Will be release?
I really wish they made it for GZDoom, though.
PrBoom is lacking in mod compatibility. And I can only dream about how this would look in tandem with the CE series of mods that port DOOM 64 as well as PSX DOOM and Final DOOM to GZDoom with extra enhancements and restored maps.
The custom RT version of PrBoom is also fairly buggy even when playing very basic mods. I couldn't even get SIGIL to run, and that one I think uses vanilla textures only and just medium sized maps. It doesn't even properly support Doom 2, although it's playable. But perhaps some GZDoom devs might now be inspired to add some raytracing options to GZDoom as well.
For me I would love to see this with the nightlife map that was submitted for the vinesauce doom mapping contest
I'm happy it runs off PrBoom as it has proper demo support. I've been watching world record speedruns in RTX and it's beautiful.
I can smell my GPU frying from here just thinking about this in GZDoom! You'd need a beefcake of a rig.
@@DoomKid this might not do that much of a difference actually. It coul be entirely GPU sided like in PRBoom, GZdoom alone is only demanding on your CPU while a modern GPU barrely does anything
The PC community is really cool. With RT you can revive old games and give them a new shine (obviously at a performance cost).
@londin engerland I mean there are no benefits playing it at 5000 fps... At some point why do you need a RTX 3090 for such a game? With this RT mod you can reap the benefits of modern technology + the amazing PC modding community.
@londin engerland Are you blind? The RT definitely makes the game look better. Are you one of those people who say: games on console on they original resolution of (let's say 480p) look much better than on a emulator at upscaled 4K... Are you one of those people? Because the RT mod makes this game look much better much more modern.
@londin engerland Yes better graphics = (equal) better graphics. Doom also never really was a stylized game like Nintendo games. Doom was always a game what aimed for realistic graphics, what it wasn't able to achieve back then (with Doom Eternal they almost did). With the RT modification Doom looks better more "realistic" when it comes to lighting, shadow, reflections...
Edit: What do you think about Doom Eternal? Because if that's your opinion you should keep that same energy and hate modern Doom.
@londin engerland Ah yes the "handcrafted atmosphere" that was literally because of technical limitations. Nah dude, RT completely elevates the game. The original, while has its charm, looks very poorly aged now, unlike stylized games of the time.
@@TexelGuy Yes, exactly. The game developers wasn't able to implement RT. I mean even nowdays RT costs a lot of performance. This doesn't mean that the old experience is superior. If they was able get Doom running at 30 or 60fps with RT back then they would definitely implement it (you are CAPPING, if you think they wouldn't).
What I find amazing is that even after almost 30 years people are still finding ways to make Doom look new. I was impressed back when it first came out just how fantastic Doom looked on my 386 DX 4. Now when back-lit sprites creep me out in 2022 that's very cool and speaks volumes about the legacy of Doom.
Does this support manual overrides for specific light placements and properties?
Also can I combine this with fan made high res textures (saw that) and models (would love that)?
Man the OG Doom devs must be freaking mind blown to see how far the community has evolved it to date. It's crazy.
This is really cool for doom modding in general. I definenitly agree that the OG textures look slightly matte, but once a few texture packs are developed with this tech in mind, classic doom will once again look better than current gen FPS.
Thanks for mentioning my doom-on-a-porsche video at the beginning.
Seriously, guys - that's awesome type of delivery - started with April's 1st "WEN" video - it's much easier to grasp on, when you are not so serious in your technicalities :) Please, carry on like that!
works fine even on old Nvidia GPUs. 320x200 CRT mode runs from 55 to 75 on 1660s and 50 to 60 with flashlight on
Thanks for this comment. I have a 1660 Ti and was wondering how it would handle this.
Your 1660s is actually better than any Pascal GPU, Including Titan X at ray tracing. Turing's architecture was much better at RT even without real RT cores, so what you're seeing _might_ be best case scenario for non-RTX gpus compared to someone with a 1060 or 1070.
What resolution is it rendering at, if its supersampling down to 200p, i'm impressed!
you cant run this mod without an RTX card. i tried it couldnt get it to run. told me that i dont have have an RTX card which i dont have.
Love the old school game making. It was such a challenge to do depth of field, lights, sometimes needing to hack into hardware resources. Big kudos to the creators of all games from that era.
I love raytraced doom but I'd love for proper sector lighting to stick around.
first 5 seconds in, that level one track is bringing back so many childhood memories!
I think it just needs tweaks in specific areas, like a second pass through the game to tweak things. That's what I would do anyway, and try to fix or improve the issues you mentioned. The game isn't hard to mod and add a light if you need to, or a candle to a room, etc. Not sure why prBoom is used instead of GZDoom also, as I would have gone with GZDoom but maybe there is a specific reason why or I could be convinced prBoom is a better choice.
adding ray tracing to classic games is the best utilization of the tech -- Quake 2 RTX is a blueprint for what I want out of future games when performance catches up.
The increased performance overhead will always be there/needed....I reveal to you the great equaliser: DLSS.
The area with the upside down cross glowing red literally made me say "wow" out loud. Excellent job!
15:32 THAT CRT SHADER IS GODLIKE, WOW.
This actually is super cool. I would LOVE to see 3D Realms use ray tracing in the Ion Fury sequel. I expect that you could make a really cool retro shooter that blended the styles well if you designed the game with ray tracing in mind. I understand how Doom plays kind of odd in some instances with RTX on.
This is one of the coolest things I‘ve seen on a long time. Great insights, Alex!
Such a good vid.
Keep at it bro, you wicked :)
I suppose I'm on the 'eh' camp.
Classic Doom looks great as it is. The mixture of retro aesthetics with modern 3d lighting techniques clashes with the 2d sprites.
Not everything needs to be raytraced.
You miss one of the coolest raytraced maps tho, E3M3.
There is a room with a poison there but it look like water and it reflects the enemies and the room on to it
Older games like this really show the massive impact Ray-Tracing can have on a game.
@@ramonandrajo6348 yes really, it gives the game a whole unique vibe and shows how significant lighting is to its overall look.
@@ramonandrajo6348 And many times better in most.
@@ramonandrajo6348 This is like denying the sky is blue. "it looks worse sometimes" Oh really a game that was never ray traced sometimes has failures since they never expected to have ray traced lighting? WHO'D HAVE THOUGHT?!
@@ramonandrajo6348 clown tbh my guy. You're too worried about literally subjective opinion.
10:13 We've come full circle with Ultimate Doom now being able to imitate Doom 3.
"Seared into my brain meat."
This is the last channel i ever thought I'd hear a phrase like that.
This gets a golden up.
"With the ray traced lightning, it looks down right SATANIC ! I love this !"
- Alexander Battaglia
- 08-04-2022
My first experience of Doom was when I was in kindergarten, and we lived in apartments. I would often run out to the playground to play, but one day I saw a red SNES cartridge on the ground and I was like "whoa, that's cool!" So I ran it back inside and showed my brothers, and we played Doom on SNES seemingly until it got dark. Then the neighbors came over and got it back because it was their game I guess (they were laughing about it with my parents, so it felt as if there was no issue there). But yeah, that was an earlier gaming memory I have. Unfortunately, it was the SNES version that controls terribly. Doom makes me happy, LOL. This is neat, though I doubt I will play it. I wonder if it works with Brutal Doom.
This is based on the PrBoom source port, and Brutal Doom needs GZDoom, so it wouldn't work.
My first hands-on experience with Doom was also the SNES version. I managed to talk my brother into getting his mom to buy it. I played the hell outta it. Yeah the controls sucked and the FPS was horrid. My next one was PSX DOOM...
9:45 Come on, the flashlight thing is awesome!
Needs LUT/color grading as it's oversaturated in some areas (like the exploding barrel lights) and a dim omni light attached to the player to keep the original light falloff feel. Maybe the lights could also be quantized/pixelated to add to the retro look.
Doom, raytracing, and Digital Foundry? I'm going to savor this.
A gamers heaven, or rather hell
I hope something like this gets officially released for Doom 1 and 2.
It looks beautiful and is a great excuse to replay Doom for the 666th time.
@@ramonandrajo6348 Yes.
@@ramonandrajo6348 Yes.
Sehr gut, very nice Content, Alex! :)
Can I ask what soundfont was used in the production of this video? The SC-55 for E1M3 sounds really good at around 7 minutes in!
Sounds like a genuine SC-55! (not a soundfont in other words)
Just to give an idea of comments- roughly 50/50 split of -'wow looks cool' and -'looks worse/ruins art/ rt is a gimmick
Doom is a classic been around for ages, plenty of versions for everyone, the question to ask is - 'would i rather this existed than not?
Personally i love having this level of light simulation in this game, yes it might look different, but in a dark tunnel i can see those flashes of light from imp fireball in the darkness and suddenly i see shadows long shadows of demons in the tunnel as they move closer to me, tell me that is not atmospheric!? For every way it is different you will also get a new unique experience. It's like cinematic doom, this is a version that deserves to exist, that's why i am playing it every evening right now. It doesn't ruin the atmosphere, it provides an atmosphere that is one you have not seen before, inspired by real world lighting. Is that not interesting? Room enough in the world for a multitude of doom renditions.
💯💯💯💯💯💯💯💯
Not only that, but this was just released. There could be a version that tweaks the ray tracing to be more faithful to the original look with more flourishes, probably would take a while to tweak the ray tracing and level but it could be done.
@@219SilverChoc yes this is all true. I have to mention this, seem some comments saying 'ah but the original has art driven darkness for a creepier tone' and i am looking at the video, and i count more areas of darkness, and also complete darkness in the rt version. Also i am playing the rt version myself, i never experienced pitch blackness in the original doom (because it was literally impossible to achieve)
Someone would have to be crazy to dislike the very existence of this, even if it isn't perfect. It's SO cool looking, for a little change. Just like the other 9999 mods for Doom out there, those who dislike it should simply avoid it!
@@DoomKid It's fine for people to not prefer it, but to say that this looks bad would be going overboard. I think with some updates to specific areas of the game to retain the original intent, this would be an amazing version of Doom to try, but as it is, I'm having a really good time playing it.
i really like how this looks when downsampled, if only i had an rt gpu
Agreed, the downsampled look was way better
I know what you mean about having an RT GPU. I am hoping to have one by this summer...
Very cool stuff. I particularly like what they did with the Spectres. Snazzy effect!
Really takes me back. The difference isn't huge, but it's definitely there. I feel like it probably doesn't translate as well in a video either. Probably have to try it in person and let it really soak in for an hour or two with the sound cranked up.
Very cool. Sure, it looks worse than the original in many cases still, but for a first version, it does look promising. Obviously it needs custom changes per scene to retain the original color palette, but there are some scenes that look very striking. A work in progress for sure.
Original looks more pleasing in my opinion BUT this is such an awesome project!!!
I prefer the disgusting oversaturated look of DOOM - but it’s so so cool how much work went into this ray traced version!
That part with the upside down cross looked amazing!
Love it... but the only thing I don't like about it is the removal of the flashing lights... They need to bring that back.
Wondering how it will work with voxels.
Aren't voxels what they used to build the 3D models from that were used in FMVs from consoles from the late 90s? I've always wondered how they differ from a polygon model
@@dftfire As far as I know it's a completely different tech. Question arose rather from considerations of the current situation with voxels in GZDoom: they are not covered by the lighting rules either by classic doom sectors or by individual light sources.
I've had the absolute PLEASURE of playing Raytraced Doom. It is absolutely fantastic and honestly everyone should try it.
......
Doom 2 works as well ;) just swap the doom 1 wad with doom 2 and you have doom 2 raytraced as well
What a great video. I had no idea that's how 'lighting' worked on the original. Can't wait to play this mod
I tried both original doom.wad and Ultimate Doom's wad file, both resulting in Signal 11 error. I have 1080 Ti and latest drivers so, there shouldn't be any problems - any ideas?
I didn't think Ray tracing would even benefit sprite art?
In the future we'll be playing Doom on our big toenail
But it will also have midroll ads... :(
Imagine this version back in 93/94.....this would have blown everyone's mind wide open!
I just thought about that new modding ray tracing feature introducing with the 40 series cards and how it will "fix" some of the problems you mentioned with ambiance and mood lost with this version . . . then I realised that it could open up a whole new dimension of aesthetics as a creative tool, as - especially in a fantasy game like Doom - the light sources are going to be completely dependent on the interpretation of the modder working on it. Lighting could be dismissed as just a mechanical feature of a game; however, with Doom in particular, upon its release, its evocative lighting was responsible for so much of the dank, foreboding atmosphere. I'm looking forward to a ray traced version of 'Eye of the Beholder' now 👁. I'm still amazed at how far videogames have come since owning my C64; Hover Bovver was the first game I ever played. Interesting times ahead.... 🚀
Just having watched the intro so far, there’s something about the lighting and ray tracing that makes the game feel so much more immersive and three dimensional. It’s like watching an interpolated high frame rate movie for the first time.
Never thought I'd be in the situation that I don't have the required hardware to play the original doom in 2022, but here we are.
God I can only imagine what Sigil must look like, there was already a high degree of atmospheric lightning put in by design
Alex, what remake of original DOOM soundtrack did you use in the last part of the video?
This looks incredible, I'd buy it on the PS5.
Is it even on ps5 or only pc?
@@Sleepysova It's only on PC with NVidia graphics cards at the moment- I'm just saying I'd buy this version of Doom if it existed on the PS5.
@@tm0054 ah sweet
@@Chasm9 it wouldn't be the first time that this game was released on a console.
Ps5 to weak to run this
This is one of the most Blursed things I've ever seen... on the one hand, the mod is next level genius, on the other hand.... Classic Doom with upscaled graphics and next gen lighting effects? Sacrilege! Sacrilege!! It's like the secret levels in Doom 2016 and Eternal.
Agreed. Map editors can make use of the mod and design the levels around the ray tracing but the original levels were never designed to be anything like this. Hence their convoluted appearance.
Agreed, it doesn’t look quite right. You can’t just add stuff like this and call it a day. The pixelated quality is lost and I think it’s to the detriment of the visual aesthetic. Would be interesting to see his without the sterilizes textures. Also yeah. The original levels look terrible with how over bright they are. Cool experiment tho! This would look GREAT with Quake or Quake 2 and of course doom 3
It is so nice that demo files exist in doom, so you could do side by side, comparisons.
A few notes. There seems to be something off with the scene around 1:00, where there's a whitish light that totally makes the floor not look red (even with the sky making it appear red elsewhere), while the walls are still fully red. I'd expect the effect to not be as stark depending on what you're looking at, like a more reddish ground when in the light, and a less reddish wall when in the light. Also, I would have liked to have heard more about the effects of the plasma rifle, as seen at 18:45, along with other weapons that shoot particles non-instantaneously across the screen.
Incredible how RTX makes even this pixel "2d" game look so nice.
The lighting changes in the ray-traced version are the equivalent of a newbie audio mixer drowning everything in reverb, thinking the more the effect is noticed, the more impressive a job they've done. The effect is supposed to serve the subject matter, and not drown it out for show. And in the DOOM RT clips, the effect is drowning-out the subject matter, the levels, for show. It's tasteless and tacky, and it won't hold up well over time as the novelty of RT wears off.
Totally agree. I imagine you need to go through by hand adjusting light source settings for each asset. This demonstrates only how not to do it right.
16:53 that room looks excellent.
This explains SO MUCH why the lighting, the flashlight, etc is tbe way it is in doom 3. Like everything carmack does its technology first, and this is just the sort of design descisions you naturally gravitate towards when adding systemic lighting to doom.
In these kind of benchmarks you should always use non-dlss performance. Iam interested in seeing how much impact X has or how good X Gpu handles a specific game at 4k. Dlls is nice and good and i dont mind seeing it at as an extra option but the raw Performance should always be shown!
If this were a comparison with AMD cards I might agree with you, but really, you can just extrapolate from the DLSS results. Adding non-DLSS results would have doubled the benchmarking time without adding much.
I’ve read that it’s very demanding at 4K, so I doubt it would have been particularly playable anyway.
I think this looks awful but I'd be interested to see a set of maps that are actually artfully designed with this lighting in mind
You say the spectre looks like Predator's active camouflage, I say "the slow blade passes the shield!"
Hearing that music brings me back 30 years like a time machine.
When I first got into Doom's source ports, I used to load every graphic mod you can think of. Today, I feel they all detract from the experience.
Same exact experience here. Nowadays in GZDoom, I prefer turning off the hardware acceleration and using the software renderer to give the game a vanilla look.
@@DeadPixel1105 hello fellow people of culture.
@@DeadPixel1105 Why not just use a port designed to keep things original, like Chocolate DOOM, Crispy DOOM or DoomRetro? Seems easier than going for an advanced one, then scaling it back
@@dftfire I assume it's mostly for (non graphic) mod compatibility.
That's why I'm a loyal Chocolate Doomer.
Honestly, DLSS sucks in this use-case. The added ghosting and smear, I'd much rather run the game at natively at 480p or 720p, since it respects and retains the pixelated look while not causing extra ghosting or smudge. Both FSR and DLSS don't look as crisp... Also, nowadays you can run this version on AMD hardware. On 6600XT you reach 60fps+ easily with 720p (same base resolution as 1080p DLSS balanced). But at 480p (which still respects the pixelated look of Doom) the game runs at around 140fps with 2 polygonal light sources. or 100-130fps with all lights active. I actually much preferred the 480p with blistering frame rate. :)
no lol
@@zk0rned in case of Doom. DLSS or FSR doesn't add anything. FSR adds weird edges on the pixelated graphics. And DLSS adds a lot of object smear. Both being distracting. Added pixelation in Doom does not. It respect the look of Doom.
@@PixelShade I really can't see what you're talking about when I'm looking at videos of it lmao
@@zk0rned it happens in dark scenes. Which is A LOT in Doom. Alex has an example in the video, but downplays how distracting it is. (like always when it comes DLSS coverage). You will notice it once you activate it.
It is impressive how flexible this engine is and what people push out of it.
But I will also like to point that the original 'lighting' and pre-made 'hardcoded' shadows are a masterclass in themselves. These dynamic RT lights are great tech and I will def try it however the handcrafted lights and shadows of Doom or Ion Fury are artful and made to maximize the visual moments of the locations. Check out Ion Fury making-of videos where they explain how they have to handcraft all this pixelworld and colored surfaces to act as lights.
Good job DF as always, I love these technical videos behind games and engines.
15:11 music name?
It's cool from a tech perspective, but I do like the original style better.
I wouldn't say it's "game changing", it's just an interesting novelty IMO.
Since it removes some jump scares it literally is game changing 😉
@@wiegraf9009 Classic Doom has jump scares? Since when?
@@RevolverRez Check out the part John mentions about the monster closet lighting tricks being ruined by RT
It's come a long way since I was playing it from a floppy disk on a 386 with ISA graphics card and mono monitor back in 1993.
It shoud be added that ports such as Doom Legacy had OpenGL dynamic lighting from objects in 1999. There was another port in around 2003 called Vavoom which had lighting from textures, and by about 2006, EDGE was experimenting with dynamic shadows (but they looked pretty crappy). Going straight from the original Doom to this looks like an amazing change, but decades of developments have brought us here.