How SAFE are Locomotives?
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- čas přidán 14. 11. 2022
- How safe are the locomotives that pull North American freight trains? Well, as you might imagine, they're pretty tough!
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i’m a conductor for Union Pacific. crossing accidents sadly happen more than you think. usually depending on what you hit, repairs can be made. you definitely wanna duck though. and in some cases bail out or get to the second motor if you have it. also fun fact while passing other crews, out of curtesy we turn our ditch lights off
Most crews deactivate the ditch lights, and dim the headlights for oncoming traffic. The exception would be if they are meeting at a crossing. In some places where expressways run parallel to rails, some crews will dim down their lighting to avoid blinding the motorists. That maneuver is discretionary, depending on the situation.
Hello fellow UP conductor (im on the GCSU)
@@stanpatterson5033 deactivate? its just a knob you turn its not that deep lol
Courtesy during the daytime and forgetting to turn the ditch lights on and headlights on bright is a good way to find yourself in a decertification event
I’m a teenager considering working for the railroad, so that’s some neat stuff to know there. Thanks for the share!
I learned the other day that the attempt at shooting the cutoff valve wasn't something made up for the movie, it was actually something tried during the "Crazy 8s" run away incident that the movie is based on.
yep, but they totally forgot that this button is supposed to be pressed for a long time, and not just pushed by a buckshot, or birdshot, or whatever they tried.
@@pavelslama5543 Kind of dumb if you think about it. If that's your only option to stop a moving train do you really have time to press and hold the button?
The button is a normally closed circuit and damaging the button will open the circuit and activate the safety feature, I found that out when I hit a fallen tree and it ripped the button off my locomotive
@@Unknown_OohNot totally, I mean it would be better in the end to probably have the button in the cab but it’s mainly to shut off the fuel pump for the diesel which only generates the electric for the traction motors that actually pull these units. This is mainly only in for protection for shutting down a runaway Diesel engine not the train itself.
@@pavelslama5543
Actually it doesn’t. I am a locomotive master electrician and can say with certainty that a properly working EFCO should kill the locomotive immediately. If they actually get shot with a bullet they will shatter as they are made of plastic and brass.
The EFCO works on the normally closed button switch. There are usually three but some locomotives have more. Rio Grande GP30s for instance. The EFCO supplies power from the local control breaker in series, x3, to the fuel prime engine start switch and an interlock on the fuel pump control relay. The FP/ES switch bypasses the FPCR interlock to pick up the coil on FPCR. When the FPCR coil is energized it connects the interlock creating a self locking situation. Any interruption at the EFCO buttons will shut the FPCR down.
When FPCR drops out another interlock picks up D Valve in the govenor to cause the fuel rack to disengage. (On engines equipped with EFI it does the same electronically.)
It will also cut power to the ENGINE RUN RELAY, cutting power to all other valves in the govenor.
The problem with crazy eights is that the officers shot the fuel cap that is located just below the EFCO which was a bigger target and also painted red. It was an honest mistake.
Crashes and/or Derailments are a Daily Occurrence ALL over the US. RJ Corman, Hulcher and a few Other Restoration Companies can’t keep up with the Work.
Yep
Not hard to believe with the shear amount of trains across the United States
@@ATJonzie Also, the insane amount of people that try to beat the trains at the crossings. As we know, in the age old battle of car vs. train, the train always wins.
Derailment with dangerous goods makes the news! Trains hitting véhicules at level cross with fatalité.
Train crew two fear collision fuel truck, school bus. School bus, crew wish they died also!
Never happens here in San Diego because the only type of trains are stupid commuter trains lol
The thing is, in the Crazy 8s incident Unstoppable was inspired by, they did shoot at the train in an attempt to hit the emergency shut off.
Really not a bad idea. Blow an air line or the compressor tanks to send it into emergency or let the brakes lock up as they loose air.
@@Whitebassonly the air breaks weren't hooked up since it was just a yard move.
After watching that movie, I had to do some reading on the event that inspired the movie. I kinda shocked me to learn that they did attempt to shut down the train by shooting the fuel cutoff.
My question, why not just shoot a bunch of holes in the fuel tanks? Granted, probably not the most environmentally friendly solution, but given the choice of the damaged caused by derailment I would prefer the fuel cleanup.
Shoot a bunch of holes in the fuel tanks, the engines will shut down eventually.
I know NOTHING about railroading, so maybe this is a stupid idea to those who do understand locomotives. Am I overlooking something?
@@mattrodgers4878 Shooting the fuel tank can actually cause an explosion, so that will become a problem. Plus, attempting to shoot the fuel cutoff was futile as the button actually needed to be held down.
@@SpheroJr3289 diesel fuel isn’t nearly as flammable as gasoline. You could toss a lighted match into a bucket of diesel fuel and the match will go out.
I have been a railfan for many years, yet still learned a lot from this informative video. Thanks
Southern Pacific had a MARS headlight that rotated-oscillated. It appeared to “flash” and really caught your attention. It had many moving parts and was discontinued due to maintenance cost. The bean counters killed it
I don't blame them. It should have just swept right and left. Much simpler mechanism.
The wig wag module is a much easier design and probably more practical you can find them everywhere. Old cop cars are the most common lol
Those old Mars type locomotive lights really do get your attention. We have a rural train that runs occasionally and it's very hard to tell the distance on the runs that only have regular headlights on.
RRs now use ditch lights which are far brighter, closer to the ground and have the ability to flash. Far more visible than Mars/Gyralights of the past.
The exact reasons I love American locomotives! Nothing against other countries at all but I just love the way they look, sound, the way they operate and everything about our American locos much more.
Negative part is they can’t quickly change direction. This isn’t big problem with America’s long hauls but here in Europe we often change direction of the train. And a turntable would take too much time to turn the locomotive around.
Americans locomotives are very efficient for American routes, but would be pretty useless here, and probably other way would be same. We also have smaller sidings, so having your huge strong locomotives would cost us a wagon length less cargo. But because our trains are shorter we also don’t need so many locomotives.
I love both locomotives each their speciality.
Imagine not using electrified mainlines in 2022
@@einar8019 Electrification is a waste of money that we don’t need. Even Europeans are sick of paying to maintain all that catenary and are starting to look at battery and hydrogen locomotives as alternatives.
@@redpsycho90 that’s exactly how I feel too!
Not really, most countries are pushing to increase the amount of catenary lines. Reason for hydrogen and battery in cargo trains is for “last-mile” from main junction to the connecting customers. At our company we have some customers that only receive 2 trains per day. And no junctions close to it. So in these cases a hybrid or battery style locomotive would be great. Just before the switch towards the customer change over to battery or diesel.
Personally I prefer driving our electric locomotives because they are much stronger then the diesels of same size (and quiet). For me no annoying fuel stops and for company no expensive fuel stops.
Also maintenance wise are electric locomotives less needy resulting in more driving time and less chancing oil time. For infrastructure company they can ask more money for electric time schedule. Comparing the electric timeschedule prices vs diesel fuel usage in our company electric is still cheaper. Even now with the Ukraine-Russia conflict.
Last reason why I prefer my electric locomotives is that I can do regeneration braking. Then I send electricity back on the line for another locomotive to use. In (most) diesel locomotives we don’t have any engine braking so the energy is lost in heat.
But I don’t want to be the private company needing to pay electrification of the HUGE distances of Americans railway system. So I can understand your choices
That bnsf unit will be rebuilt after the insurance dept. Finish their investigation. And railroad terms, if the frame ain't bent it can be rebuilt.
That engine will return in no time. There was a UP SD70M that was demolished not long ago by run away cars at a yard north of me in Palestine TX. You should've seen it in person, whole back half was absolutely shredded to pieces. I watched it get scrapped on site. Of course they took important stuff of it.
A long time ago now, we lived in an apartment in Ohio that was less than 100 yards away from a main ConRail line and about the same to the crossing. This track would have 6-8 coal trains on it daily (12-14 if you count the return). I never saw the engineers, but I could certainly tell who was driving by how they blew the horns.
I've always found the American way of safety for trains really interesting. The large wide noses, the horns and various lights and bells. I think it would be interesting (maybe I'll look into that) for survival rare /injury comparisons between American and mainland European locomotives in crashes. European locomotives do not blow their horns at crossings (except for rail enthousiasts haha) and I doubt their windows are actually bulletproof. Our trucks are also smaller and probably weaker, so maybe things like that could be a factor why European trains have less noticeable safety systems and procedures?
Not to mention European railways do Not need PSR at all
A lot of the times it's also idiots thinking they outrun a train, and cross as fast as possible. Which normally doesn't work as you can see.
I think its mostly due to how long American trains are, costing drivers upwards of 10 minutes at the crossing so people are more likely to jump the gates. Lots of urban areas have quiet zones where trains do not blow their horns because of increased safety measures at crossings, but many rural crossings lack a gate or even flashing lights which is why many of our trains have the features you mentioned.
@@Ty-qx1ui not only that American locomotives Every since the 1900s Were always HEAVlY and MASSIVE for average height of main line locomotives were 15-16 ft tall, I tell you they are Massive compared to British and eoupern locomotives put them on British Rail lines or eoupern these heavyweight locomotives on those rail line and they will cause those rails to Sink in the ground that's Why Railroads in this country is more expanded and Can carry More loads than any other country.
@@bnsflover7062 Thats very interesting! I never considered that
The first locomotive is definitely repairable. It takes a crazy amount of damage to total a loco.
Wow.. i always wondered where the bell sound is coming... Thanks... Great video🔥👌
That first one is easily fixable. It’s also not unusual for railroads to rebuild a locomotive that was in a major accident and put it back into service with new numbers.
Excellent video, very educational. I learned quite a bit. Overall, I think the North American Safety Cab has been a success in saving crew lives. I never knew about the anticlimber, neat stuff. Keep up the great work.
Thanks for watching!
Anytime!
My 10 year old grand nephew and I just LOVE your videos! Thanks and be safe!
The windows are no joke. Engineer friend of mine got shot at once, scared the crap outta the crew but the windows had no trouble stopping the bullets.
Cabooses also had to get bullet proof glass, which is why many cabooses had the windows plated over, cheaper than bullet proof glass.
Y'know since I got into the business recently ngl derailments and such are alot more common than I'm lead to believe. But this videos made me feel a bit safer about the job
Those comfort cab photos are fantastic!
Cool to see CSX 9800 too, just caught that here in Michigan.
I forgot about alerters, I think that would be good to talk about how it evolved from a deadmans pedal to a button. Note NS used a whisker as an alerter at least on their older units like a gp38-2
6:47 mechanical problems can still occur to have the headlights not be on, in Canada the following applies:
Headlight failure: if the headlight on a movement fails and repairs cannot be made, ditch lights may be used instead and the movement can proceed.
If all headlights and ditch lights fail, such lights as available must be used to the point repairs can be made and must not exceed 10mph over private or public crossings without automatic warning devices unless it is known to be clear and will remain clear.
Human error could also be a factor but lights do occasionally burn out for some reasons
There is a crossing near me that the crossing guard has the train horn in it. It sounds like a computer instead of a train horn but when the crossing arms drop, the horn starts sounding off until the front engine passes the roadway. It sounds weird and electronical, but I guess it works. The train horns are a LOT louder.
they call that a wayside horn, ten times more annoying then just letting a train do it.
Only accident I've ever seen was the Hiram Derailment. Had no idea about it till a person at Austell told me. All 3 units are at Juniata shops now. Speaking ofwhich, if you didn't know, NS 8099 is currently awaiting repairs at the Juniata shops in Altoona.
I was told by a road foreman several years ago that the most survivable space inside the cab was against the backwall in the center. But we always get In the floor before we strike trees/semi trucks.
As a railroader, it all depends on the speed and what you hit. Last month we lost two railroad brothers, they rear ended and empty stack train destroying the locomotives...
Is "Don't dump till you hear the thump" still the general rule for most railroads & engineers when it comes to collisions?
0:44 I'm pretty sure the locomotive is gonna be repaired, BNSF once repaired all but one unit from Kismet and repaired a locomotive that was involved in an accident in Cactus Texas that looked like a write off. The H2 paint probably won't survive but I hope the H2 paint survives.
H2 is honestly the worst livery, but I guess it does add a bit of extra color. I really don't care as long as it's not a pre-production ES44AC, those things at least have some significance.
Great explanation! This really interests me a lot how cabs are safe, this really saves alot of railroaders lives! Thanks for sharing! 👍
Unfortunately crews die in those cabs with an alarming regularity.
Good info. The next train I buy, will definitely be looking for that 5 star crash rating.
Unstoppable is based off of the Crazy 8’s incident. Police officers actually did try to shoot the cutoff button, but it did not work of course.
Another fine V12 production!! Love these topics Charles. Keep em coming 😁👍
Thank you!
@@v12productions Your welcome brother and have a Happy Thanksgiving!!
If you ever have a question about csx locomotives, djstrains is a friendly guy and is also a engineer for CSX. He recently posted a video of his opinion on 4 axle Locomotives and he is going to post one soon on 6 axle locos
For those who have seen Unstoppable (specifically the bit with them shooting the fuel cutoff, note thay while the movie took some HUGE creative liberties with the "inspired by true events" that scene was pretty much ripped straight from what happened with CSX 8888. Where they did, in fact, shoot a rifle round at the fuel cutoff.
Thanks for the video!
I love your videos V12! And stay safe.
Great video! thanks!
Quality of your footage and content are second to none mate! New sub from Melbourne, Australia
Thank you!!
Another great video!
Another interesting video. It included some things I was unaware of.
Lots of info. Thanks.
A lot of towns have banned horns at crossings,stupid in my opinion. I've noticed several instances where the lead loco did not have headlights on.
By law we have to have the headlight and ditchlights going over crossings.
Needing a horn at a crossing is even stupider
@@einar8019 How? With how many idiots try to outrun trains it's actually not a bad idea.
Fumes from a ripe shitter filling the cab. If we don't address it, it'll never change.
This is probably my favorite video of your channel and not gonna lie these locomotives are safer than cars or trucks
Interesting info, cool footage!
Another well done video.
Interesting video good to know info thumbs up
What'll be the next everyday occurrence? A cop parking on tracks with a handcuffed suspect?
I remember as a child, many eastern railroads ran their engines "bonehead style" with the cab at the back of the engine to provide the crew more protection.
Good video thank you. The standard cabs we had were cold in the winter. We had to pack paper towels around the doors to keep our the cold air. Then repack them when we were done making a move.
I took that train from Jacksonville FL to Macon Ga. I handed that train off to the crew in Macon. It is always scary to think about it.
I have found wasp's nests inside of Steel bells before. Ones that have not been used in a long time.
I'm a truck driver: Steel coils are extremely deadly for anyone. They're absolutely horrifying and should only be pulled by extremely experienced drivers.
Even better, ship them by rail. They have specialized, covered cars, just for steel coils. Could also load them on traditional flatcars. Yes, you're going to say that not every steel plant (shipping or receiving) has rail access. That could be addressed in the planning stages of starting up a business... build where the rails are.
@@stanpatterson5033 You're correct that rail transport of sheet steel coils is better than trucks. There have been many designs for covered coil steel cars over the yrs. However, RRs would never haul steel coils on a flatcar. The buff & draft forces experienced by the flatcar would toss the coils into the next car ahead or behind the car carrying the coils. No amount of wood blocking would keep the coil where it should stay. Thus the designs for coil steel cars over the yrs.
I live in Canada and i live in a small town in Saskatchewan and i seen alot of CN and CP but i have only seen 2 VIA RAIL are very rare for me. Also very good videos keep up the good work
Train horns and the bells are awesome I just want to here it all day
Nice video very imformative
This shall be another great video 👍
Love the DD pics in Portola
Locomotives are Bigger and Much Safer than the vast Majority of Vehicles they Crush. 👍
Your TikTok about the new video brought me here! Great videos in both short and long format
Thanks, I really appreciate that!
Thats too bad that wasnt the case in the recent collision on the UP's Yuma sub where the well cars punctured the front of the cab of the locomotive killing the crew inside. But yes regaurdless locomotives have come such a long way in a good way as far as safety goes.
Great video, very educational. My personal favorite EMD cab is the one used on SD70ACC's. Just has a mean look to it that I like.
too bad its a POS
Good morning.cool show. Thanks from n\e Oh. Al
Supposedly the LLSL horn signal derives from the Queen of England. When she was aboard a ship it gave the "Q" signal for right of way. Railroads adopted it when she was on a train
Awesome. I wonder if you could do a video that explains how trains with DPUs work on mountains like Cajon Pass, where cresting the top say locos at the front have to slow up whilst DPUs keep
pushing etc. could you explain how this is controlled?
Google locomotive fencing
DPUs are controlled by radio and can be synchronous with the lead or operated separately. The head end could go into DB while the remote is still pushing.
@@r_mon_e correct, this would be called putting the fence up and the engineer can control in certain situations
when comparing/displaying various engines, its great to point out make & model, but i think itd be useful to point out a couple major distinctive features of each one perhaps? To most viewers, every single one looked like the one prior, so a couple comments regarding major distinctions would help us viewers follow along better. Just a thought. Cheers
Good presentation.
Thanks!
8:52
You have to hold in the cutoff valve for it to do anything. They did this with CSXs ‘Crazy 8s’ incident, and it didn’t work for the same reason.
Honestly I just watched this to see train crash but it was also really informative!
Makes me wonder how different safety is for trains in Australia...
Pretty much all the locomotive safety devices in use in North America applys to Australia.
Obviously the newer locos are a little better than some of the older ones. Although a lot of older locos have been retrofitted.
Unfortunately the large number of idiots that run rail crossings also applies wherever you go.
I can speak to the headlight controls for most CSX locomotives, since I was a CSX engineer over 10 years ago. Units of the era of the one shown have rotary headlight switches for both front and back headlights. The switches start at headlight low, then bright, then add the ditch lights. If the engineer forgets to turn the headlights on, when he sounds the horn, the ditch lights automatically come on in alternating mode, which is probably what happened in the video. Older units, and former Conrail units often have separate switches for the regular headlight and ditch lights. An interesting observation I made several months ago when I had a chance to watch the Office Car train pass by is that the ditch lights on the former Amtrak F40s do not alternate when the horn is sounded. Amtrak's locomotives have long had alternating ditch lights, including on the F40s they still had when they became required in 1995. I understand that at least a couple of railroads link the alternating function of the ditch lights to activating the bell, instead of the horn. Let me be clear, ditch lights do not have to alternate, BNSF's do not.
Very interesting. Thanks for sharing!
It's also quite different for people like me who operate over about 3 miles of track with multiple crossing, yet its all private property. We switch out a plant and then shove cars uphill to the yard. There is safety meetings and a thick binder of general good practice rules but to be quite blunt, I'm shocked we haven't derailed more than twice this year with how horrendous the maintenance is. It seems like any one of our GP39-3's is down for major maintenance monthly. They are years past blue card spec and kept together with zip ties. I have photos of this. But hey whatever feeds the world
the fuel cutoff button controls the fuel pump control circuit - which controls the fuel pump control - which controls the fuel pump relay. its normally closed, so if those goons had shot it with some accuracy, it would have shut down.
My dad drives locomotives and he’s never complained about the safety at all
2:11 it’s crazy to think I’m going to the southeastern railway museum on Saturday
In Mexico, all locomotives are required to have metal bars also known as Security Bars in all windows and doors the moment any locomotive enters Mexico for example a Ferromex locomotive in the lower 48 states does not have to include the security bars installed as crime rate is lower here. In Mexico however, they must have the security bars installed regardless of which state the locomotive is in Mexico, i.e, Chihuahua, Tamaulipas, or Sinaloa as the crime rate is much higher there due to lack of infrastructure, lack of police presence, and the lack of space. I need to research more of Mexico’s railways. Also slandered gauge railways have no connections to Guatemala as Guatemala has only narrow gauge rail lines of which almost all but a few are abandoned in the country of Guatemala.
PTC doesn’t prevent idiots from trying to beat the train. Retired engineer 30 years NSRR
8:22 That sounds like a Gram white e-bell, it sounds like what they would record it from, to get the Gram white e-bell sound.
You should have used the footage from operation Smash Hit where they literally wrecked a train into a nuclear flash to show just how much it could take, the footage is incredible to see
I have seen that mate its a class 36 I think and two carriages they put on too it the locomotive weighed 139 tonnes with carriages it weighed 220 tonnes that flask weighed 50 tonnes and it was in the 1980s in england they put the flask on a flatbed and they weigh about 40 to 50 tonnes why I say that is because that locomotive come out quiet good I seen a picture of it upright on some sideing also the track was took away just a few foot from the flask and flatbed so that train hit over 100 tonnes going 100mph I think the kinetic energy rebounded back at the train , I was about 7 years old lol wen I seen that video , godbless you,
Awesome! GEVO'S LOVE THEM🥰
I have repaired very much worse. Nothing appears damaged on the frame and draft pocket. Everything else is more or less cosmetic. It seems a lot worse than it is. When they are wrecked on their sides as in a roll over is far mor difficult.
Composite locomotive mechanic speaking here.
Unstoppable was based on a true story. Iirc the attempted derailing and shot at the fuel shutoff were true. Also iirc the real train was 8888 in Pennsylvania
The CSX Crazy 8s runaway loco incident started in Walbridge OH, not PA & the loco headed southward towards Cincinnati...... May 2001 8888 was an EMD SD40-2............ Goggle is your friend.........
What's that three rail track at the beginning? Where it shows the damaged Loco by itself?
BNSF 7714 is a GE ES44DC from the number series and radiator. (I learned this in a stream last night)
Railroad crossing accidents happen too often because of one simple reason: People make dumb mistakes.
I heard that not long after CN started to use the safety cab that UP (?) borrowed a set of engines to evaluate. They accidentally met head on with standard cab locomotives....Safety cab passed, standard cab failed.
I work for Royhill in North Western Australia. Not to much to hit out here except for cattle but cheers USA for the great locomotives we use 👍
Here’s a little food for thought about the safety of locomotives and some events around the railroad as recently as 2 months. A conductor and engineer were killed on duty in Southern California. Both were killed while going into a siding at Bertram by the Saltón Sea after striking a cut of empty wells. Both were employed by Union Pacific. As recently as 1 week both an engineer and conductor were injured after striking a semi trailer carrying heavy equipment and derailing the engines and head cars. If memory serves me it was a NS train.
Never knew the wide nose designs were actually for safety, I always just thought they looked cooler
Anticlimbers were invented for wooden passenger cars which had a nasty habit of sliding inside the car ahead. Vestibules on passenger cars are designed as crush zones which is why Amtrak won't let you stand in the vestibule while the train is moving. A PCC trolley (anticlimber) hit a bus (no anticlimber) in Pittsburgh and climbed inside the bus.
I'd imagine there was injuries with that kind of impact and the fact there's no safety restraints in these trains for some reason.
I recreated the BNSF ES44DC #7714 Vs. Georgia Clay truck collision.
What was the inspiration for grade crossing horn to be 2 long, 1 short, 1 long? It is the Morse code letter Q.
Owners manual should state "in the event of approaching a collision vacate the toilet immediately!"
When I was a switchman, I threw a rock at a switch engine and it hit the EMERGENCY SHUT OFF on the side...just laughed and kept walking to the shanty.
I've got this one! They are much safer as long as the steering components are properly maintained. If not it may cause oversteer or understeer during operation.
That would be repairable. Platform looked ok the coupler and draft gear pocket might be ok. Cut off and weld the bent sheet and replace the steps, cut levers, handrails along with ditch light housing and mu plug. It would be major repair and billed to the person who occupied the crossing. Lots of inspections would take a bit of time.
I drive Lyft in Los Angeles and to keep safe by flashing lights and honk my horn going through intersections.
Dont forget safety stripes such as reflectors! And brightly painted parts such as hand rails!
And radios!
How about those white boxes on top the locomotive, are those GPS boxes?
I was riding the Surfliner and the window I was sitting next to was shot. It was loud and startling, but the glass held.
Lucky you are alive
The glazing material is not glass, it's most likely polycarbonate plastic, GE Lexan is 1 brand name. Glazing on old Budd-built stainless steel cars taken by AMTK decades ago was 2 layers of polycarbonate, both 1/4" thick. You aren't going to bust thru that with any hand-held tolls or weapons.
EMD cabs are called a whisper cab very safe and quiet cab henist whisper great content keep ‘em coming
After the sd60 widecab the BN had and the sd70ace thundercab that CSX, UP, NS all had
Whisper cab, biggest lie ever. Believe me.
@@AbelG8781 Amen. SD70ACE's should be trailing unit only.
@@sharkheadism BNSF removed the horns on many of them for that reason, no leader position anymore.
@@AbelG8781 Yep. Ride like crap, loud, do not hold the rail, dynamic sucks.....Trail only.
2:03 oh my god 4048 has one good K3L or whatever it is
Link to NTSB cases?