Mortification in Borderline Women, Narcissistic Men: Let Me Go, Give Me Life
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- čas přidán 8. 05. 2020
- Full text here: samvak.tripod.com/faq01.html
The False Self in Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) is akin to the host personality in Dissociative Identity Disorder: to moderate and to switch between self-states is a secondary psychopath and to regulate the resulting repression, denial, splitting, dissociation, and other infantile defenses in an attempt to maintain self-constancy rather than object constancy.
Mortification is an extreme and intolerably painful form of shame-induced traumatic depressive anxiety.
Consequently, the Borderline patient seeks mortification in order to feel alive, not free: she seeks to introduce novelty, thrills, and reckless risk taking into her life via chaotic drama. It is the only way she can experience transformation and also the only method open to her when she feels like self trashing, self-punishment, or self-mutilation). Mortification in Borderlines is self-inflicted in preemptive abandonment and the Borderline then copes by becoming dissociative (disappearing) or by displaying traits and behaviors of a secondary psychopath (making others disappear), or, more commonly, both.
Buy most of my books in Amazon www.amazon.com/stores/page/60...
One of the best insights I have ever heard about the BPD after mortification: “Either YOU have to disappear or they do.” Explains so much irrational behavior. Thank you, Dr. Vaknin!
I thought I was in a twin flame relationship
This is hilarious😭😭😭. Alot of truth to it honestly.
Millions and millions of people thought and think the same, I think.
Me too!! Holy shit
TRUTH!!!
😂
"I wasn't wearing my glasses through part of it which traumatized them" I laughed out loud and replayed it. Lol
"...the number of casualties is exceeding my subscribers." 😂😂😂
How dare people be traumatised by not wearing glasses. Im now traumatised by their trauma!!!
@@helenwoods1467
And I am not traumatized by seeing a picture of you in a mask🙂
Don't hide your beautiful face🤍
😂
@@victorlopez9530
L
I am completely obsessed with your channel professor. I suspect that I am a borderline and have been listening to every word you have said about borderlines several times over. Your videos have provided me a real breakthrough to understand who I am and make sense of my toxic behaviors that I can't control most of the time. Thank you for breaking all of this down so thoroughly. Your the only person I have been listening to for weeks.
You are tremendously essential to my recovery. Thank you.
We are here & we are listening…past the 8 minute mark & to the end 🫠
Yes. I always wondered why we always were so strongly drawn together for years. I'm too emotional and it's hard at times to regulate my emotions which sets him off often in rages. However, he said it's one of the reasons why he loves me. He would always say "you being so emotional makes me feel somewhat normal." We went years too with the mutual fear of one of us abandoning one another. We both had the same fears of intimacy and abandonment but we behave differently in our defenses. I was smothering and he was distant. But when I pulled away as BPD's do, he would chase and triggered his fears and would love bomb.
Omg my relationship was similar
Damn, what a load of fun that must be. Sorry. I know it's actually difficult, I just can't help rolling my eyes at the irony of the NPD/BPD dynamics.. surely, a match made in heaven... or hell, whichever you prefer.
It’s a hot mess! Lol. I am familiar with this myself. Ugh. It’s all so clear once out of it.
perfect....
Thank you for articulating what I seem to just start to understand about myself and most of my relationships. Very embarrassing to say the least I'm just grateful for the clarity and being honest with myself .
Yet when they’re mortified, whether self induced or otherwise, they are some of the most vindictive people on the planet!
I’ve never been vindictive.
You put so much time and energy to educate people. Your work and observations are very interesting! Thank you 🤍
Super good stuff, Sam. Thank you. It makes clear how a sweet but sometimes emotionally struggling former partner easily abandoned her decades-long narc husband and all their friends, moved away briefly, pursued me, then years later abandoned me and all our friends.
She would even say, 'It's strange... I don't miss him or our friends at all.' Naturally, her ex wreaked all kinds of narc Hell thereafter, some of it criminal, but we weathered it.
She once asked during an emotional struggle, what was wrong with her and I remember saying that it seemed her personality maybe needed a little 'defragging' like files on a hard drive. Eventually, even our friends could see that she was disassociating as she began making paranoid accusations just before abandoning us all returning to her narc ex.
I was a 'designated rescuer' then and have since learned to use better boundaries. Once I understood love-bombing and the npd/bpd dance, her eventual hoover was pretty easy to dismiss. No more drama roller coasters for me.
Again, thanks for your deep insights and invaluable lessons.
Sam is sooooo funny
@@PISTOLAS98 > Yes, it was unsettling and exhausting participating in a high-conflict Drama Triangle that in hindsight was a bankrupt investment from the start.
@@PISTOLAS98 > I got involved because she was cute, a curiosity, in distress and I had much to learn about drama triangles and trauma bonding (thanks Sam and others). All the best to you and yours, Gabriele.
'designated rescuer'* , I like the term, for the past year I slowly became exactly that for a new lady 'friend'.
It took me about 3 months to realise that something is off, and about another 3 to try to put together What The Hell Is Going On. My first guess went leaning towards DID, but slowly it became an educated guess that is more akin to BPD.
Unbelievable experience. Excruciating and heart wrenching.
* - the exact quotes from her towards me would be 'you are my medicine (and I think I love you)' and 'you are the one I need'. Both in what I reckon were distinct love-bombing phases.
@@agingchill9012 would love to have a talk about your experience
This is the most useful information I have garnered from your videos. Thanks you!
I am addicted to this man and his sense of humor!!
My false self is very passive aggressive. I like to be alone, but always feel I need a reason other than myself to live for.. a baby, a boyfriend, a partner, a husband. Very dissatisfied with everything and everyone. I don't like something I let it go easily. I long but I'm afraid. Breaking out has been crazy ASF.
It seems to me that as long as humanity is a hierarchy, there will always be a conversion problem between respect & compliance.
You are amazing. You have opened my world
Sam. You have opened up a part of me, that I have been in desperate search of. You are so dead on, in fact, you explained me- better than I could explain myself. I do things, and just couldn’t figure out why I am so destructive. Impulsive. Emotional. Why I feel like nobody understands me. I’ve always felt like my emotions were so much more heightened than everyone else’s. I dissociate . I hate how I’ll be immature, like a goofy child- it embarrasses me. I didn’t realize until now that that’s actually my false self. I have so so many questions for you. I was raised by an extremely narcissistic mother, enabler father that I believe isn’t even himself anymore. I was the scapegoat without a doubt but mom says I’m “her favorite” 😂 WHAT.
I 100% believe my golden child little brother was abusing my daughter sexually- and that my parents covered it up purposefully. They adopted my daughter because I’m an addict. I believe I was made to be an addict- they put me in psych hospitals and rehabs before I ever tried drugs. I was a shy nice sweet girl, I really was. I still am, minus the shy part lol. My 5 month old son somehow suffocated when my mom was watching him 2 years ago. It haunts me. I feel like maybe it was purposeful? Maybe not? Some say it doesn’t matter because my son is gone, but it matters to me. My thoughts and emotions are rampant, I’m dissociating, self destructing, don’t know what to do- where to start to make it stop. I’m begging you to please help me.
Thank you Sam
7:46
You opened my eyes
Sam Vaknin, thank u for the video!!
Thank you profesor 🖐🏼
I never understood why my ex, spoke of the judgements he received from his exes, with such pride. Now i realize it's his way of unveiling conveniently, and seeing the truth about himself, without actually admitting that he exist daily in a false-self. Wow, narcissist are some twisted beings...
My fiancee also does that and I am wondering why is that such a funny thing and why he talks about that with pride...good to know why...
@@karmenzustra2700 why get married to a narc ? wth 🤦♂️
Love your insight. Would you consider doing a video on CPTSD in women? Thanks.
I felt the previous video was excellent. Thank you for your body of work. You have helped me so much.
I had to listen, rewind, listen, write it all down, and listen again, to understand. He's just so intelligent, he pushes the limits of my brain.
I love your sense of humor and these petty peoples give you so much good material 😂
The narcissistic man I was with he is just existing not living and good a devaluing others just to feel normal
Wow best explanation! I learned so much!
I wish Sam would do a new video on the comorbid NPD/BPD man.
I believe Jeffrey Dahmer to be a great example of a man with bpd and NPD.
This is fantastic and extremely interesting. Thank you. I was married to narc (most likely) for 10 years. Horror story.
If a borderline woman seeks to disappear, why does she seek validation also and intimacy?
Mental illness often involves dissonances which generate inner conflicts. Watch the videos on dissonance.
@@samvaknin I will, thanks for the response
I loved your book and respect the author. I am Überhappy every time you upload a video. I am enjoying this new wave of vids.
Absolutely splendid. 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆
How does Co-Morbid BPD-NPD (often covert NPD) fit into this analysis which shows an inverse internal-external mortification process. Generally this being a rather common pair in co-morbidity may pose a theoretical issue in such a dichotomy.
Considering a spectrum of behaviours & shifts along cluster B symptoms how a double dynamic can be constructed to accommodate opposing behavioural patterns....& finally is there a treatment at all, as likely BPD treatments may not be effective here.
Thank you.
I love your intelligence and the inane things you mention that people pointed out 😂
Thanks professor Vaknin
Why do they disappear when they are not there?
thank you for you insight, your true plunge into pathology.
I’m borderline. Perhaps that’s why i don’t find any of this difficult to understand.
I feel like Nine Inch Nails should sample some of your lecture work in their music. I don't know if it's the name, but I always want to listen to some nin after watching one of these videos haha.
After listening to all that, I can see why people run from them. I have a family with autism which is also on the dsm, but being the daughter of a mother who behaves like this, its no wonder we have gone no contact ourselves. Thank you for all that Sam.
Run from which one? The Narc or the BPD or both? 😂
Thank you Sam for reading that excerpt from the book. Not sure what she was until the discard. She loved elephants and had a snake tattoo. I may be grasping at straws. Feel bad for the kids left in the wake of her suicide while moving on to the next and being wifed up. To bad the guy has my similar characteristics. Same truck, motorcycles, first name and quiet personality.
Being aware that BPD occurs within a spectrum, how realistic are the probabilities of a BPD person to have a relative successful relationship if under the proper treatment?
Depends on his/her age. The older, the better the prognosis.
@@samvaknin thanks Professor.
It’s almost as if the narcissist heals us through our emotional trauma from them. I ran from fear when he hurt me and abused me and lied. He ran also. It’s almost like you use yourself through them to get validation.. then when your done your done.. so the narcissist stays the same but you change what your attracted too.. it’s werid. I manipulated myself into getting validation from a empty vessel and stayed .. because I thought I needed someone to love me. He is abusive and manipulation and etc .. but why can we change, why don’t the narcissist along with all there other traits .. they have tons of traits but they mirror back your co dependent issue and wanting to be loved .. but they don’t really have that.. or I guess some do.. but there shame forces them not to change or want help. Sometimes they run from you because your the shame which I know I showed mine him. Freaked out
Yes!
Thank you, Sam, for yet another enlightening video. If I may pls ask, why the Borderline seeks mortification to feel alive yet her main preoccupation is to NOT be?
She feels alive when she is no more, when she vanishes (usually into another person).
@@samvaknin omg... BPD woman here and as I pulled away from my ASPD boyfriend because I sensed him loving me differently I remember thinking that I missed the days when I fit inside of him.
Sam can you please do a video on borderline men? My ex boyfriend seemed initially what you describe as a covert doormat but when I discovered he had been lying to me he turned into some type of psychopath ..devoid of empathy. I later talked to his ex wife who told me he had been diagnosed a borderline after a suicide attempt after she discovered he was a porn addict. Both of these things he hid from me. If you could do a video on a borderline waif man and how he abuses and cons I would appreciate it.. I’m still trying to understand what happened.
Watch my videos on covert borderlines.
@samvaknin Please tell me which book to buy, that includes the borderline women please.
I haven’t written a book about BPD, only academic papers.
@@samvaknin Thank you. I guess you will be producing one soon. Which book explores borderline, and secondary psychopathic behaviour?
@@samvaknin I have my fingers crossed that one day you will. The information that you have provided in all the videos that you have made, are of tremendous help. I feel so educated, I have learned such a great deal, so many terms that I had no idea about, I now grasp and understand myself and others on a much deeper level. I would love to hear an exploration on the "failed" narcissist concept. I'm not understanding the "how" and "why". Thank you for everything that you do, you have changed my life in such a deep way. Can't thank you enough
@@JoseRRodriguez hearing you 💯, outstanding point, I concur
Lol.....luv the humour 💪😂✍️
What is the name of the Salvador Dali painting referred to?
Galatea.
@@samvaknin Thank you!
I only seem to be attracted to narcissistic men. I distinguish early in the dynamic, that he is a narcissist but I stick around until devaluation and then I paint him black as well & seek out his replacement. I see his Hoovers as a ego boost but I know it’s fleeting so I relish in the idea, he didn’t destroy me. I’m still here.
Lol relate. I USED to literally think: I’m an apex predator, hunting the hunter when Narc men would try live bomb & try entrain me with underhanded slights disguised as compliments. I’d smile on the inside, pretend to take the bait, pretend fawning & proceed to eff them up busting their fantasy bubbles & playing dumb about it. Which in itself i realised was messed up. Pretending like I wasn’t hurting myself… and living the past & not making choices to have the real experiences I want to have instead. Choosing to recover was like dying. Excruciating
Thank you for your videos. I believe my heart finally broke so hard that my Borderline self left me. I’m not scared of losing anyone. I forget large chunks of time. Lol did you mean mercury retrograde.
My husband was so abused I can hear his little boy. He grew me. He is immune to pain. He’s still prisoner both ways. I wonder do I report his father? Yeah, both of our inner children are about 12. He’s SUPER loyal to his abuser. I have did and secondary psychosis. People say my voice gets different and I don’t know. We married, but every time he flirts I know he lies cause his voice changes. I had borderline due to trauma too. We were just triggering each other…he left me here and is in prison. I switched, we got so mean, but I’m sure he lied too. Under the bus. I can’t think about anything else and feel hopeless
I was thinking of going to California and leaving here. I can’t look for him.
This is definitely me but never been diagnosed with bpd whewwww
internally mortified.. why does this video seem to abruptly end? I am entitled to see a full video. No kidding... Question:
Can someone with ASD be influenced to express BPD or NPD traits, as in brainwashed (by hyper focusing on your video's for example), into a certain mindset and then start to show certain behaviors as explained in your video's. OR is that person possibly an ASD with an undiagnosed BPD/NPD and then someone (external object) entering the shared fantasy and destroying it from the insight through mortification and then exiting the scene leaving the person completely shattered???
The question no one is asking: If our partner is a narcissist or borderline, then how likely is it that we are we boderline or narcissist? :D
Because he's answered that in many videos ;)
@@YOUAreTheSecretToLife And what is the answer?
Or which videos?
I've found that with Sam's overwhelming knowledge on these topics, that instead of picking and choosing "pertaining" info from specific videos, I just watch them all! If anyone is dealing with ANY piece of these issues, they're gonna need ALL the information.
@@YOUAreTheSecretToLife This is a good example of crazy talk, or I call it circular talking. No actual information is given, just circular talking. This happens when you know someone wants a fact but instead of just providing said fact, the person strings a circular conversation. And now, I am sucked into your world. I'm going no contact. Thank you for helping grow.
@@Chris-0113 Lol. At the very least I would say I was controlling and a blamer but not certifiable. I sense a little blaming and gaslighting, and failure to realise you own baggage. You are obviously a classic Narcissist. :D
I'd like to understand in basic terms how they truly compliment each other.. as basic as lego or a jigsaw puzzle?
Adrienne Kneebone I reckon it has to appear complex like a jigsaw puzzle... but no matter the situational differences, at the end of the day it’s a shared fantasy to discard. To trigger the biggest and worst abandonment wound or ego death to the level that the false self dies, and the true self hidden behind narcissistic walls is released.
From my personal experience: the male borderline feels complete with a female narcissist because she makes him feel validated with her excessive idealization and love bombing. The female narcissist greatly enjoys the narcissistic supply provide by the borderline’s intense idealization.
Is there any medication that can be for a board line woman
Borderline. Search the channel for treatments for BPD.
@@samvaknin I have been in a relationship of some sort not a conventional one by any sort ,I've been with her for 28years I've become codependent ,as I have high functioning autism and I am learning more and more about her and all her traits unfortunately for people with high functioning autism they too persistent at trying to make relationship work and with her age mid 40s and alcohol abuse and her self destructive behaviour and random sexual behaviour is getting worse . And I would like to thank you very much I only wish I knew then what know now.
Lol make sure there are no more casualties
I'm feeling very empathetic with crash dummies.
But Sam there has to be a way for the narcissist to revert to the true self. The methods may be unconventional. Majority of them would never even bother, but some of them, who are aware of their tendencies would explore such methods. Isn’t it?
There has to be a way for you to do some homework before you waste my time. Search the channel!
Healing and Curing Narcissism
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yes yes wen my dad or anyone of course wen ur morified u might go for warmth nnn gets the opposite effect thats wen i feel.impulsive nnn have horrfic abanson ment bit latley i fesr peoole i cant cope only with certain family members its veey hard i feel very suicidal n have attempted ittimes why am i a bordeeline why cant it stop do i can feel grown up n not just wadre my life
In reference to the entire video: you are not wrong, Mr. Vaknin.
Oh, he knows ;)
Yes, traumatized.. The most are already traumatized.. 😂
The more they know.. the more shit they have to overthink.. Most thought, : I have done the home office...
😜.. But shit cannot be overthink.. It still stays shit..
YUP
A borderline with ocd wouldn't forget the favourite person when out of sight isn't it, and would obsess on the narcissist to annihilate and forget herself so she is not of importance to her own self?
OCD has to do with anxiety-reducing rituals, not with memory or with object or with object constancy.
I have BPD and I’m obsessed with my favorite person, an ASPD man. I started pushing him away when the love bombing started to lighten up and turns out I pushed a little too hard and now he’s giving me the silent treatment. The other day I thought I was going to lose my last shred of sanity bc he was so much all that I could think about it was so overwhelming.
How is narcissist relationship with transgender man? Would you please explain on this topic more? Thank you
Lmfao good luck.
I dont think im borderline
Soooo reue u sound me as bordwrline exactly true bordwrline does wannt to keep epole at arms lenght that they know will disaprive or cause threat to my esteem 2 years eith narcacust its horrfic the delaueation n yes go week come back he cannot dooo anything warm for more than a few ddays so i guesa thats why they both trt get higjs for w while togwther my dad calks me a drama,queen buuuut it destroys me wen its sed i feel humilated
❤🤘