Why horses are so hard for video games to get right
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- čas přidán 6. 08. 2022
- If a horse is in a video game, that means someone busted their butt to get it there. Horses are WEIRD - they're massive animals with weird bendy joints and many, many gaits. It's no wonder why so many games choose to simply treat them as transportation. Even so, some games go the extra mile to make horses unique and meaningful to the gameplay - and they benefit from it massively. Here's why horses are so difficult to get into games, and what we're missing out on when horses aren't given their due.
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#breathofthewild #eldenring - Hry
Learning more about horse anatomy and how their legs work actually made me anti-horse so I hope you enjoyed this final glimpse into how horses work in video games. - Simone
What do you think about drifting horses in Knightfall: A daring journey?
Based.
ever since i learned horse’s legs are like their fingers, i have become an anti- horse girl
"wack-ass bendy legs"
I still want a game that's like truck driver simulator but it's horse riding simulator
Another detail about BotW horses that I love is that as you grow your bond with your horse, it will behave differently. Newly-caught horses that have a more stubborn personality will chew angrily at the bit, shaking themselves after you dismount, and they may wander from where you last left them. But after you gain their trust, they bob their heads happily when you approach and wait patiently exactly where you told them to!
I never knew this! I always ended up with a pretty much completely tame horse too quickly to ever realize...
You can also give your horse different saddles and headgears and mane and tail styles
I love the personality of the horses in BOTW and the animation was spot-on, but the way Link holds the reins always killed the realism for me.
@@WhatIsMyPorpoise The spotted horses are easier to tame, I don't think they act all stubborn. They also have worse stats, but they're quite pretty! The solid color horses on the other hand have the better stats and take a long time to tame, so you see grumpy horses more when you take one of them from a herd.
@@Lissbirds Makes you wonder if that Link had ever ridden a horse before. Or knew that much about them.
Never knew horse legs were made out of rubber and magic, but now that I know it makes sense
I believe Kangaroo legs take this rubber tendon adaptation to the extreme; they use very little energy when traveling because the force of their land re-stretches the springs in their legs to give them energy for the next jump. Like the whole world is their trampoline.
It’s also why horses are so fragile… you have to protect those bones and tendons because if they break there is nothing you can do to fix it. Their guts are also super fragile because they don’t chew cud like almost all other grass eating animals. Owning a horse is mad stressful. They look solid and powerful, but they die if you look at them sideways.
I love that in botw, the developers knew people would get attached to their horses, so they added a whole horse god to revive horses if they die 😭💕
Yep you can revive horses but not the champions.
@@celtichound9889 man that would need a REALLY big endura carrot
@@celtichound9889 also I dont think malanya has any domain over any non horse soul, so he can't revive them.
I killed my horse because it was stuck in a steep mountain rocks. His name was Chesire. I’m still sad, it was a year ago.
@@meikoluvv you can press ZL and it will force your horse to do this weird trot forward and get them out of situations like that no matter what
I'm surprised that there wasn't a mention of how janky and unnatural the Skyrim horses are. They can climb sheer cliffs. They have head tracking but, they look at you straight on, like a predator 😂. Also they can totally deal with you turning into a werewolf in front of them, but not if you smack a chicken. If your horse sees you commit a crime it will tell the guards. Very realistic horse behavior
Man those horses are just trying to be mountain climbers and upstanding citizens, why you are roasting them so hard??
there are much worse horses than the skyrim ones, they are nicely shaped and beautiful atleast
the spider-horses are such tattletales
Red Dead Redemption 2 has spoiled us, the attention to detail in the horses models, animation, controls, sound design, and even their AI is just insane
*H O R S E B A L L S*
Before playing RDR2, I kinda liked horses. After playing RDR2, I'm horse crazy and I can't wait to meet one IRL.
and the testicles. can't forget the testicles.
The little horse head icon pops up with a plus sign and I don't know what these horse points are but I will pet that horse all goddamn day to collect these horse points
In real life I find (big) horses rather scary/intimidating, but I love them in RDR2. I brush them a lot, compliment them as much as I can, and feed them the best I can get. And give them nice, fancy names of course :-) I will usually only ride female horses, because I love the much gentler way in which Arthur talks to them.
hopped a ride on a spotted pony in botw just to leave it by a shrine. i figured it would run away but when i returned to the shrine hours later it was still there. i was so impressed by her patience i caught her and named her Virtue.
What? My cat's name is Virtue!
@@dhisufiroafrozenseraphimdragon I'd like to see a game where you ride a cat .
@@Metqa you could possibly achieve this with gta mods
@@Metqa There's an indie steam game named Calico in which you can do this. They have many various animals of many sizes
Awwww!! This is so wholesome
The first time I got the royal white horse in botw I returned to the stable, not realizing that I then had to name it. In a blind panic I named the horse “Zelda”. (I mean, 50% of the royal family is named that, right?) I always laughed imaging Link having to explain to the princess at the end of the game that he named his horse after her.
As someone who thought for years link's name was zelda....
Naming your horse Zelda is very valid.
When I caught it I looked up the name of Zelda's horse and named mine Storm.
Yup, panicked too but I went for Epona😂 the color is COMPLETELY wrong but well. Can't change it now
I named mine Artax from The Neverending Story..
Was about to mention how Torrent seems to be not just a magical horse breed, but a *goat* hybrid with some sort of bovine, due to many similarities between those and Torrent, while it passes as a horse due to its size and rideability, but now... I'm five videos and three tabs into "how do goats walk" search. so I'll get back to you on that
PLEASE make this your niche!
was looking for this comment, devs made it clear he wasn't a horse and i wanted to make sure someone said it. They described him as Yakul which is Mononoke's big animal she rides. The closest ive gotten to are Serow? Which is a subsection of ungulates related to goat and antelope typically medium to small in size
@@cruzgodinez3863 Yakul is prince Ashitaka's mount, not that of the wolfgirl called San (= princess Mononoke).
As soon as I saw the way it walked up that hill I thought that it looked like the reference was goats. They move their feet just like that when they climb.
I feel like Torrent is a horse-yak hybrid…
The thing I especially liked about the horse AI in BOTW was that when you were on a path, you could let go of the control sticks and the horse would just keep on the path. You could sit back and enjoy the view and take a breather
Horizon Zero Dawn too! Both horse-autopilot games released within 5 days of each other. Coincidence? Probably. 🤔
The Witcher 3 did this as well iirc the first game that did horses correctly for me
The fact that Monolith did the heavy lifting for BOTW's world design, and the existence of this auto-run feature is no coincidence. They always love to give you an opportunity to simply take in your surroundings. This is a staple feature in Monolith's Xenoblade Chronicles series, famous for its stellar world design.
@@zilliq Although I do agree that Witcher 3 did do a really good job with horses, we can not ignore what a buggy and glitchy mess Roach is at times in that game. I mean, Roach spawning in super weird places was common enough that they flat-out made the Gwent card for Roach be Roach standing on a roof.
Sounds like RDR2
It always bugged me how the horses in dragon age inquisition are just slightly too big. They look like they were made by someone who is afraid of horses.
I’ve always thought this too! I adore DAI to bits and pieces but the sight of my skinny Lavellan romping around on a GIANT super MEGA horse just… hurt my soul a little bit every time
I was like "what are you talking about the horses in DAI weren't that big" and then realized that the inquisitor i spent most time with was a hulking qunari dude so ofc the horses looked normal... for him...
@@nerugiganon lolll, i never played as a qunari... but that's probably one of the reasons why they made them that big.
I laughed out loud and startled my cat when I got to the end of your comment. It's so true. I'll think of this every time I play that game again.
I never thought they looked too big... but clydesdale farm horses were the first ones I got to ride when I was little, so they kinda shaped my internal idea of what size a horse is.
I recently did a no teleportation run of botw and it made me appreciate my horses so much
Every time I've played BotW since I first beat it I've banned teleporting explicitly because I got upset when I realized I had basically stopped using my horses entirely. The game is honestly so much more fun when just getting anything done involves planning out your errands into more effective trips anyway, and the horses feel so good to ride and the world so pretty I don't even mind the travel. Unfortunately, there's a ton of area and terrain where you can't take them though, which kinda sucks.
@@mori6434 I agree! I for sure got the most out of the game playing it without teleportation - despite it being my 4th time playing it, I really felt like I got to know the map better and I spent more time in each place because I wanted to finish everything I could during my time there. I'll admit doing quests like Tarrey Town were made much more difficult, but like you said the environments are so beautiful that I didn't mind travelling - I also felt like I got better at fighting because I would stop to kill monsters on the road. I have to say I'm pretty sick of seeing the NPCs getting beaten up by monsters though haha, I wish there were more unique NPCs for that other than the 2 or 3 pairs in the game.
I feel like even with the DLC it was way more fun - revisting each Divine Beast and travelling to the new shrine locations, plus walking around the Plateau again felt so nostalgic to the start of the game! To get around some of the difficulty taking my horse places I equipped the dlc ancient horse gear so that I could call my horse wherever I wanted (as long as it wasn't Gerudo or Eldin of course). I also LOVE looking at my heros journey on the map, seeing each place I went and how I went to each of the shrines in a planned out way, where I strayed from the paths to explore.
@@elliottapp5611 ooh, yeah, the ancient armor! I remember having a good laugh when I learned you could warp the horse up to the plateau and just destroy everything. I love trying to involve them in as much as possible, hunting, fighting... I've tried to fight all the boss monsters on horseback and it turns out hinoxes are hilariously easy to run circles around and kill with a giant sword. Lynels will totally kick your ass on the other hand, which actually makes sense because they are just as fast and maneuverable as a horse, but they also have the brains to bust out their bow when you get squirrely and put a stop to that nonsense. It's so fun to find all the ways horses either make things easier or harder and there's emotional weight to deciding whether to risk your horse's life. Plus strategic weight, if you risk getting stranded with no horse a long ways away from a stable and you aren't teleporting. It's so interesting how the experience can change depending on what your priorities are
Ride your horse to Kakariko village, and dismount in the carrot patch. Watch the fun. That's how I treat my horses.
@@elfiefromangelcity6142 ooh i've never tried that before!! absolutely adding that to the agenda
One of the things I always find interesting about BotW or RDR2 horses is how memorable horses become when you're forced to go to great efforts to get them. I can't remember what Cassandra called her horse (or if it even had a name), but I sure as hell remember my BotW horse, Oreo (black with a white stripe going down the middle) or my RDR2 horse, which I called Woodrow Wilson. And it's been years since I played either game.
Kassandras horse was called Phobos, the only reason i remeber that is because its one of the two moons of mars (the other being Deimos, also a name we hear in the game). But yeah, putting effort in getting a horse makes you appreciate it more and being able to name it is also a big plus!
My red dead redemtion 2 was called Ducalion after one of my favorite literary characters and my botw was Kabuki because he had a white face with crazy long hair.
I loved RDR2… I wish my Xbox didn’t decide to die before I got to finish the game. I was at the epilogue part II….. I was almost there. 😢
My horse in BotW is also named Oreo :) lol
My favorite horse was names Shackled because it was a grey-black horse. I took so much care of it but I didn't ride it into the final mission. I guess that that would have hit emotionally more. Instead I rode my white Arabian as a symbolic gesture, showing that Arthur ended up being the true leader of the group...
I love horses. Especially Skyrim ones, when they let you climb straight up mountains!
But not when they report you for murder
Damn snitches
So True LOL
"...when they let you climb straight up mountains!"
BOTW horses: "instructions unclear, I cannot walk up mountains easily."
God, Skyrim horses suck so much
I was waiting for them to mention Skyrim horses XD
It always freaks me out how horses have that extreme-looking joint right above the hoof and how their entire bodyweight is supported on a near (or greater than) 90⁰ angle. It always makes me feel like their ankles are definitely gonna shatter with every step. It's incredible that they can just drop so insanely much energy into such a relatively small joint, landing at such a wild angle, and it doesn't just snap the tendon and shatter the ends of the bones there.
That evolution stuff is whacky!
Horse legs are worryingly fragile, and once they break they can never be fixed. Their guts are the same way. Owning a horse is mad stressful.
That's why, when you're training them as youngsters, you have to build them up slowly and carefully. I didn't start riding my young Arab for more than a couple minutes at a time until he was four. You have to be very careful not to over stress their joints & tendons, and build muscles slowly while they're still growing, or you can literally destroy them. I've seen the sad results of incorrect training and/or working a young horse too hard, too many times. 😢
@@HughLlewellyn Your comment out of context is worrying lmao
@@xcalium9346 Lucky we have context then, eh? 😄
As someone who grew up with horses, BOTW really made me feel like I was interacting with a horse in a way that no other game has. I found myself shifting my weight like I was actually riding and clicking my tongue at the horse like I used to do. It just tuned into the dormant part of my brain that holds the horse-related muscle memory. My mom used to be a trainer, so I showed her the game, and she had the same reaction.
just wait until u play rdr2
Same. Wish I could play it. I've watched a bunch of videos and love it.
Same here! (Rode horses for a decade before quitting). I would find myself rocking back n forth whenever the horse would start cantering out of habit and would find myself pleasantly surprised when I see link riding with the correct posture and going into a squat whenever the horse would jump. The part that made me the most giddy was seeing Link's feet positioned in the stirrups correctly.
I always name all my video game horses after the McElroy brothers, but I'll add Simone into the rotation now.
"Don't animate more legs than you have to."
FromSoftware has entered the chat
LOL I was literally thinking this same thing as I was editing it. Those hands... - Simone
fromsoft: add more legs. You call that a horse? Add legs coming out of the back.
@@Geopzdarksouls And an eye throat.
My favorite game with horses is definitely Red Dead Redemption 2, The horses are magnificently detailed and Rockstar has put so much work into them, it just amazes me.
It's a shame Rockstar abandoned RDR2 like that, It's truly my favorite game of all time.
Yep absolutely same
Radahn doesn't just use his magic to ride Leonard - he stays with him and doesn't devour him, even when his curse compels him to devour everything/everyone else he comes across 🥺
i am so happy to see botw getting its flowers in this video for doing a good job with horses!!!!! i think that catching and taming your first horse in botw is one of the most memorable parts of an extremely memorable, good game, and you can also name them and give them mane & tail makeovers! plus there's the specialty horses in the game--the Big horse, the white horse, the skeletal horse, and honorable mention to the Lord of the Mountain, all of which serve to make horses in general feel like a big and important part of the world!
I think my only complaint - which is like, barely a complaint - is that there are so many "special" horses that if I wanted to keep them all I had to give up some of the horses I had caught, since there wasn't enough room in the stable. I wanted all the special horses, but I also had emotional connections to the ones I had caught. Not a big deal, but it would've been nice to have a bit more horse inventory! - simone
@@polygon oh i very much agree...having to say goodbye to one of your OG speckled horses from early game to keep a specialty horse was definitely a bummer, i wish you could keep more horses--even 10 instead of 5 would have been a huge improvement. also the side quest where you have to give that guy on his way to the gerudo desert a horse for 300 rupees.......i caught and tamed a new horse just for him but it still gutted me lol
Don’t forget Epona :)
@@polygon this is why rdr2 story mode frustrates me!!! There's only 4 horse slots !!! Wtf!!!
It would be neat if there was a quest to fix up the old Lon Lon Ranch ruins in Hyrule Field and gain more horse slots.
Epona is a great horse in the narrative, the way she only likes link because he knows her song, and then recognizes him seven years later and malon also recognizes link because epona likes him is just amazing
I never really noticed issues with the animations for the horse themselves. I just always notice bad rider animations. They're almost always so stiff, like as though the rider was glued to the saddle. Some take it a little extra farther and make the rider bounce around a little bit but then they just make it look like bouncing around; I wouldn't want to have to be that rider when they want to sit down later.
I forget exactly which game but I noticed it actually had the right animation for riding a horse at speed. I think it was Red Dead Redemption 1, and dispite having the rider lift themselves up and try to follow the gait, they were doing so _backwards_ to how it works. Seeing it made me think that I must be feeling the same feeling jazz musicians feel when you clap on 1 and 3.
The horizon games are great for riding animations, even tho Aloy is technically riding nOt a horse (it's a machine but it's pretty close)
One of my favorite things with my horse in RDR2 is brushing and petting. I got my main horse off a radiant encounter. She accidentally killed her owner, so I adopted her.
No mention of Ghost of Tsushima? Sometimes when loading saves, your wake up nestled against your horse before getting up and giving the horse a gentle smack to wake up. Or feeding your horse an apple. Generally doing horse care for the horse you named earlier on. Kaze o7
I was thinking of GoT the entire video. You only have a choice of a few horses but Jin calls them by name the whole game, sometimes when you run or mount up. Great time.
Yesss, my boi Nobu was a real one. I’ve named horses in other games after him. They really did it right in that game.
That game is vibe incarnate.
The horses GoT are integrated beautifully.
The animation cycles of the horse are beautiful in Ghost and riding it feels like second nature. I love to walk in that game but the horse is just a second protagonist next to Jin.
Kaze was the bestest of the boys!
I'm imagining a world where instead of the graphics showcase for a new console being the new kinds of car details they can add to driving games, it's the new kinds of horse details they can add to horse games. E3 trailers showing the new muscle-sliding-under-skin effects, developer interviews about the fancy new weight distribution mechanic that will make riding so much more realistic on the new console.
VR horse riding games!!
@@rearcangeli this will probably make you very sick very quickly, but also very happy
You see a glimpse of a non-car-dependent society.
Don’t let it fade away…
nah, players only care about how big the textures are /s
Each strand of horse hair having it's own physics, graphics!
I think Ghost of Tsushima did a good job adding the horse to the narrative. The horse you pick is a character, and you grow to love them as your trusty companion. I never cried over a horse so much since I saw the movie War Horse.
I thought that movie was... not so well done in terms of horse. The horse was running happily towards someone too clearly in that scene between the trenches. Ears perked and all. That alone turned me off from the whole thing. They should've fixed that in post-production. Or just "glued" the ears back.
You outta play shadow of collosus if you ever wanna cry for another horse.
...incredible game by the way
I recommend you read the book, in the book the whole story is told in the eyes of Joey (the "main horse" in War Horse), it's one hell of a masterpiece along with Black Beauty.
As for Black Beauty, I recommend reading it too, that one will surely make you cry all kind of tears. Black Beauty (the name of the horse) has a very messed up story, as messed up as Joey's (War Horse) story. Black Beauty saw a lot of stuff during his life and the book gives a lot of details in certain moments that the movie won't show for... "family friendly" reasons
I was mortified in BOTW when my first horse died! I also love the fact you have to bond with your horse.
You watch it go from ears back, arched neck and one back hoof raised ready to test you into Termina, and ignoring your directions. Over time you gain its trust to the point the face tracking kicks in. (And I love feeding them apples to make up for riding them at full speed….
Great video! Thank you!! ❤️❤️
I feel that this is Simone’s excuse for talking about horses for 12 minutes.
yes
"lovely ... smart ... hug it ... when ... sleeping....."
--Simone in the unused footage from this vid, probably
I love riding *Agro* in _Shadow of the Colossus._
I don't know how "realistic" of a depiction it is, but riding her through the vast lands was amazing.
Agro is animated all kinds of wrong anatomically speaking, especially the front legs. It's literally the only reason I haven't played the game, my dumb adhd brain can't deal with the Horse being Wrong
Agro is the only horse I can think of in games that you actually RIDE. Every other horse the moment you climb on you just become the horse, be it Skyrim or Horizon zero dawn you aren't riding the creature you are it. Agro has his own very basic ai. Hell atry to avoid obstacles slow down if you get too close to things etc. It makes it feel like you're steering a living creature not just possessing one and running around in its body.
@@batfurs3001 agro's animation isn't the best but if you compare it to other horses from games on the ps2 it's MILES ahead of it's time. Agro's legs animate all the way up to his body where most 4 legged models from the ps2 error have a hilariously still torso and head while their legs are cycling like crazy.
@@batfurs3001 Is it really that wrong?? Not knowing a ton about horses, it always looked SUPER natural to me. I'll need to pay closer attention next time I boot it up because now I'm very invested in this haha
@@strayiggytv The way you ride is one of the features that sets Shadow apart for sure, even now so many years later. I think most players who are used to "driving" the horse around start the game wondering why Agro is so hard to steer, maybe even getting frustrated at the "bad controls". Once you realize that you're supposed to just point him in the direction you want to go and trust that he already knows how to run, it all makes sense.
jackson galaxy was playing stray and he mentioned the difficulty in animating cats as well. apparently stray is very faithful to cat behavior, but it took a long way to get here.
Stray was very convincing to me (just a random cat owner) except for the bits where the cat leans on boards to knock them over, and the bits where the cat does what someone tells them to do
@@Geopzdarksouls "and the bits where the cat does what someone tells them to do" Pffft, hahaha! XD Yeah, cats really are more like "As if, peasant!" aren't they?
How is cats knocking over boards by leaning on them unrealistic, though?
@@catbatrat1760 your average cat weighs between 8-15 lbs (3.5-9 kg), depending on the breed. These are strays so we'll say they're on the lighter end, bc they're going to have trouble finding food. I doubt they could knock over wooden boards just by leaning on them.
@@snakewithapen5489 Ohh, okay! That makes sense! Thank you for clearing that up. ^w^
Once when I was playing RDR2 I went seven hours without saving and I got onto a train, but for some reason the train crushed my horse, Boxer, while I was riding on it and when he respawned next to the train station he was dead. I had had that horse since getting to Valentine for the first time so I went back, played that same seven hours all over again and Boxer survived up until the end.
I saved a horse from those hillbilly murderers and named her Ember. I loved riding her but I found myself at a rock face and she slid down and died. I hadn’t saved since the day before and of course the game auto saved after she died. I was not gonna replay all that I did so I just kept continuing on. I think I kept my save of when I still had her so it’s possible for me to go back in time to see her again
omg I LOVE how this turned out, thank you so much for this wonderful conversation and the video, Simone!! 😍😍😍
Oh I should add: Horse Tales Emerald Valley Ranch is coming to Switch, but ALSO to PS4, PS5 and Steam 🥰🥰🥰🥰
Alice thank you!! My favorite part of our convo is still when you were describing how you'd cry watching horses gallop, and then I started crying telling you about how I cried watching horses gallop! 🤣🤣🤣 - Simone
@@polygon THE UNIVERSAL HORSE GIRL EXPERIENCE OKAY!!!
Thank YOU Alice for raising awarness to our beloved video game horses.
gonna be honest, i might move on from sso to emerald valley when it comes out :joy:
One of my favorite things about the horses in Breath of the Wild is how you can just sit back and let your horse follow one of the many roads while you take in the scenery. I've spent hours just letting my horse take me where it will and soaking up the beauty of the landscapes. And I'm sure it wouldn't feel as good as it does if the mechanics weren't so loyal to real life movement.
Also, you can feed them apples and carrots straight from your hand 🥰
They'll also dodge trees and other obstacles on their own, which really makes them feel like creatures with minds of their own
This is also a mechanic in RDR2, if you set a checkpoint on the map then engage cinematic mode the horse will take you there without any steering so you just nudge it along every so often and watch the scenery go by
There's a lot of controversy in (what remains of) the RDO community on whether horse temperament is actually a real stat in the game or if it exists entirely in the players' heads. Some of the devs who worked on RDR2 have vaguely referenced such a concept in passing, but actual details are scarce to non-existent. In practical tests, the horses in RDO appear to have identical temperaments.
I don't know who's right and who's wrong. I don't know if the horse temperament stat really exists as a mechanic. All I know is that I can't take my black Arabian to Saint Denis with me, because she will take literally every opportunity to throw me off in front of an alligator in the hopes I will get eaten.
Her name is Soot and she is a bastard and I love her.
man my arabians are the same way. only horse that doesn't yeet me off is my shire lol
I always ride the Thoroughbreds and they don't throw me off that easily, most times they don't even flinch at a cougar. Rachel (the post game horse you get in the story mode) was my bravest horse so far and she is amazing. I never liked the arabians in this game bc they are so tiny and squitish
I think it's pretty well established by now that temperament isn't a thing. iirc someone on the subreddit even bought like 200 different horses and came to the conclusion it's all random. everyone says the turkoman is brave for example when every single one I owned threw me off at the slightest threat, meanwhile my nokota which is supposed to be a skittish race horse will stomp alligators to death
I believe the only horse that seems to actually be somewhat more skittish is the Arabian (maybe Rockstar decided it was too perfect stat wise), the rest are all just a random chance of them bucking you. However one thing you CAN do to keep any and all of your horses from bucking you is to equip the Slow & Steady deadeye ability card. When your horse starts panicking just use your deadeye and they won’t buck you so long as you have it on.
Turkomans are the best horses for me. When maxed they don't throw me off the ground easily when we came across a snake or a predator. And also, they don't get scared easily when they got shot when I get swarmed by a bunch of Lemoyne Raiders
I think there's another important aspect to video game horses besides animation that this video doesn't totally cover, and that's how they control. My favorite video game horses are the ones that don't feel like just "the same human character but faster now." Again BotW does a great job with this, the horses are responsive but they feel like a separate creature that Link is controlling. They need to slow almost to a stop if you want to make a sharp turn at full gallop, tend to automatically follow roads unless you move the stick, subtly weave to avoid trees, and suddenly stop and rear back if you come to a cliff. It's a total contrast from something like Torrent, who is very cool with his double jumps, but doesn't feel particularly horse-like to control.
One of the things that kinda fell flat for me in Pokémon Legends: Arceus is that you can't ride your own Wyrdeer, Ursaluna, etc. It's cool to have them be established characters in a sense, but I don't have the same bond with the mounts as I do with my own team, and that's a shame because I use them so much. Also, that you can't throw items from any of them except Basculegion...
I wholeheartedly agree. As someone who’s favorite game is Breath of the Wild and enjoys horse riding in that game so much, I was bummed that you can’t do as much with them like in Zelda games. The mounts feel kinda distant to me, whereas I would rather put myself in danger for my BotW horses (or, if you don’t want to move away from Pokemon, I’d rather put myself for the team when encountering a pretty scary wild creature). Imagine if I could control Wyrdeer and Ursaluna’s gait like the deer and bears you can ride in BotW. Imagine flying on Braviary like a Loftwing from Skyward Sword. Imagine petting them and giving them treats, establishing a stronger bond between you and your mount. While it’s cool Pokémon made them pseudo-gods but I would have loved to connect to them like my own.
Oh man. That game is such a strong and wonderful concept of Breath of The Wild/Pokemon cross over and it ends up falling flat because the Pokemon feel lifeless. Horse ,animals and evem monsters in BoTW feels so alive, while captured Pokemon in LA feels like replacing Link's weapons with them.
Isn't there an option if you have a Basculegion of your own, for example, a female on your team (She gets a white stripe all over her body instead of the red), you can ride around with her instead? I may be mistaken but this would have been a cool detail.
I loved how the horses handled in BOTW. It wasn't just walking faster. It actually felt like I was directing a living being. I wish they could have fast traveled with me so I could have used them more often
They can! You can get the ancient bridle and/or saddle (I forget which, it's been a while) and they'll teleport to you when you whistle! I use my horses so much more when i have that.
@@batfurs3001 I mean, that's DLC, though, right? It would be nice if it was in the base game.
@@bluelfsuma 🤦♀️ completely forgot about that. I bought the game well after release and the DLCs came with it
They couldn't turn or stop on a dime
They didn't like sliding down rocky hills
They'd get spooked and rear, they run from frightening things
They kick things that scare them
They snort as they gallop
All things real horses do. The work they put into the horses in BOTW is spectacular.
The great thing about them also is that when you this trott thingy and point at one direction, you can have them run in a circle.
I used to do that with new tames, to gently redirect them back into the circle whenever they got stubborn and walked out, so it felt like I was actually training a horse
I went bananas when I found out you could hand feed horses in BOTW! I’m privileged to get to work around real horses and I have to say. They are incredible hell beasts. So accident prone. I rode one that would try and stare at mushrooms mistrustfully as we rode by them. He lives outside! He sees them every day!
Yesss finally I’ve found my people! I feel like this feeling is so hard to explain to non-horsey people. I loved this video but thought you could have touched on Red Dead Redemption 2 more, Arthur’s horse is really important to him and as a result players come to really care about them whether they’re horsey people or not. The type of horse you choose also has a big impact on the kind of game you experience and your play style, and by the response a lot of the players had to the ending of the game it’s clear to see that the detail the developers put into the horses was well-worth it
Yeah, I was also disappointed they didn't talk abt RDR2 more, i think it still wins over BoTW bc there's more details to them and more interactions such as cleaning and feeding them, petting while dismounted, the different horse sizes and breeds, etc.
you can feed your horses in botw too but it probably doesn't have anything on rdr2
Yes, I loved this video. I can't play RDR2 or BotW because I don't have the systems for them, but I've watched numerous videos, mostly for the horses, haha. I shared this video on Facebook for my horsey friends who will understand because they're all horse-happy too. 😄
Playing Oblivion after playing Skyrim felt really weird. The horse felt like a rubber skateboard and not a big creature who could clop around all kinds of terrain and foolishly attempt to fight mythical beasts ten times the horse's size!
Have started The Witcher, haven't gotten to meeting Roach yet. I also know there is another horse in Metal Gear Solid V.
Reminds me of the animators for Legends of Vox Machina. Trinket the Armored Bear has 4 legs, thus is a pain to animate. I imagine the Pokemon show ran into a similar issue.
Roach isn't in the Witcher games until 3 so if you're playing the first one you have quite a ways to go until you meet her
The LoVM animators also didn't like animating horses, which is why they're only in like one episode lol.
Yeah, I can only imagine how hard it is to animate Pokémon like Rapidash or Mudsdale
I think our girl Roach DEFINITELY falls into the rubber skateboard category. Although the armor is amazing looking
@@seth7570 But she has so much personality, and such a deep voice 😂
Speaking of main character horses, Roach in Witcher 3 is the champion. That special quest with her is magnifique.
Sad that in the book lore, Geralt names every horse Roach as they often die. But he seems to care for them nonetheless.
I love it that he names all of his horses the same thing! 1. Cause that's something I would do, as an autistic guy, & Geralt is *very* autistic. & 2. It kinda seems like he sees all of his horses as this one nebulous being of Plotka. It's not a horse, that's a Plotka now, & once a horse becomes a Plotka, that's his horse. Geralt is a horsegirl basically
when I first found the stables in breath of the wild I was like "this is my life now, Link is gonna do all the things about the horses until there is absolutely nothing horse related to do" and so I did and it's one of my favorite things about Zelda in general but breath of the wild nailed it cause I did it because I wanted to and not because I had to.
Ocarina was great and started it so props to Ocarina!
I feel like a lot of this applies to any animal in a game that you can interact with, be it dogs, cats, horses, birds, whatever. It’s so much better when you get that option of befriending an animal, especially if it comes with neat features like being able to find stuff for you, but it also has to be done right and feel like a companion as opposed to an accessory or another tool from your bag.
To paraphrase Drawfee: "it is impossible to draw a horse"
unless it’s a Jacob horse
Love the BOTW horse mechanics (and everything else about that game). Heck the first game I played with a really memorable horse friend was Ocarina of Time with Epona. Zelda creators can really nail the emotional impact of horses, apparently.
nintendo money
i only realized now that zelda didnt have horses in the 2d games
I can't believe how little they talked about Red Dead Redemption 2. That horse death broke me.
I remember while playing BOTW, I found a black horse with a white blaze, mane, and fetlocks. And he had great stats. I named him Rook. We rode everywhere, escaped so many dangers, but then in the Tabantha tundra we were overrun by moblins and Rook was killed. I GASPED SO LOUD! I was shocked! I immediately turned my game off and went to my last save file, cause I was like "no, we're not doing this without Rook". This was before I knew about the Horse fairy, lol. But still, kudos to that game for making me actually freak out a bit.
I had a beloved horse accidentally jump off a cliff after me in BOTW and it was TRAGIC. I also reverted a save, lol
thank you for representing the horse girls Simone
Always!
I love Torrent in Elden Ring for the simple fact that I don't have to go looking for him after wandering off, he's just a whistle away. Lost plenty of horses in Skyrim that way.
Shadowmere can't be lost. That's why I've always done the Dark Brotherhood questline.
@@romxxii somehow i lost shadowmere. Idk how, but he disappeared and was never found again
Yeah I feel you on Skyrim xD I used to just get the soul horse as soon as possible and pick that as my main ride
I have always loved Agro from Shadow of the Colossus, and how she was actually a character and felt alive, so I'm honestly kinda dissapointed that the video glossed over it, and that there isn't a review on her blog. Would've loved to see an analysis on the movement and feeling!
+
I LOVE that more modern games are taking the way that horses act more into consideration. Bonding and horse care has made the game much more immersive, they are characters in games and should be considered a partner not just a mode of transportation.
I saw horses in the title and was like, this has to be a Simone video
Horse girl life 🌟🐎
damn u right
I miss being able to ride horses. As a kid I took lessons, I went on trail rides every birthday. But then I became so allergic that touching one made my skin burn and being within smelling distance of one would turn my eyes red, swollen, and watery.
That allergy was devastating to discover.
I have a mild horse allergy. My allergist said that it would take some extra work to custom make the right serum since it's not a common allergy, but they could do a series of treatments to reduce how bad the allergic response was. Just something to know exists as an option, though it's a big commitment to get the monthly treatments.
try Curly Horses, a breed with curly hair. many allergic people don't react to Curlies; maybe you are one of them!
@@niji.sateenkaari8835 I've heard of them; the price tends to be a fair bit steeper, though I am now closer to where they're raised than I used to be on the east coast.
As excellent and fun as this video was, I wish there was a shoutout for Ghost of Tsushima, definitely up there in terms of realism (minus surviving impossible falls lol) but also that the player gets to choose the name and is called that by Jin throughout the course of the game. Even at (spoilers) near the end of the game when your horse saves you but dies in the process, I felt that loss so profoundly. An excellent game that I think did great horse representation and bonding for the main character
Seeing that scene from Shadow of the Colossus STILL gives me chills and triggers an emotional response. To this day, no matter how many play-throughs I do, that moment has impact.
i GASPED out loud when that scene came
They get them right in Rdr2. They actually feel like horses in that game
Learning that a horse can't squat well makes me feel even more appreciated to them. I had one almost lay down on me I guess because it started to squat and it got startled and lucky for me, I didn't get squashed. 🤷🏼♂️
Well. Technically. That's not a squat. The "knees" they're talking about are, anatomically speaking, wrists. It's more like a push-up, except you're supporting your entire weight on your fingertips, you have your wrist bent and the rest of your arm already in a normal position, and you try to straighten your wrists.
Tl;dr horse anatomy (derogatory)
Another fact about the horses in Breath of the Wild that I found absolutely spectacular was when you just tame the horse but it still doesnt like you, it will try to bite you and pin its ears when you idle on it. I absolutely spent hours in the game after finishing it just slowly riding my horse around the environment just enjoying it.
I gotta mention that I enjoy Simones pacing a lot. "it's General Radhan, who is my Boyfriend! :) Rest in peace :/", "Let me tell you about feet." and "it's because they are abominations of nature that walk on their fingernails" were highlights in this one. Very nice comedic timing :D
The tolt did get animated, in the game Star Stable Online, and they actually did a pretty great job!
i'm literally playing Red Dead Redemption 2 on PC right now as you uploaded this. it's basically Barbie Horse Adventures for adults.
I love how In Breath of the Wild the horse mechanics are just a little difficult because it makes it feel like I’m actually on the horse.
You should've used starstable as an example too! Its their bread and butter to make the horses move as close to their natural breed!
I was looking for this comment!
00:00 when you watch Polygon alone.
00:02 when a family member walk in.
great video! One thing you didn't mention is all the whacky stuff that happens with collisions, especially in open world games!
Smaller animals and bipeds (like humans) are relatively easy because they have small collision boxes (mostly capsules, sometimes boxes or spheres) that extend upwards, so calculating if they are in front or partially on a rock or some kind of elevation isn't too hard. If that bit of collision goes over a cliff it's easy to say when they should drop.
But horses have a huge span from the front legs to the back legs so any kind of elevation becomes weird because you somehow need to calculate the angles it can realistically stand in without tumbling over.
Rotating is pretty hard as well because there are smaller collisions a horse should be able to pass over but things like trees and branches can get into the way. You can get stuck on all kinds of stuff (RDR2) or have to find ways to just turn off collisions on everything you pass to enable relatively smooth movement at the cost of realism (witcher 3)
In my opinion, this was not an issue in RDR2 unless you're thinking of different scenarios than I am. "A horse should theoretically be able to navigate this relatively small obstacle because they can fit in this small space or step over these small objects" isn't the same as a horse actually wanting or being willing to do so. MOST horses will not confidently navigate tight spaces or precarious surfaces for almost any reason, they will stop dead and go around, or jump over them in an overreactive way. Horses in RDR2 do both, or they fall when hitting something fast or stumbling over something tall. All of these reactions are realistic IMO.
Its an entire sport (sports? There's so many) dedicated to having precise control of horses and being able to navigate tight spaces in this way. You can search "AQHA Trail Championships" to see examples of what I mean. Horses are huge and most actually don't have very confident control over their bodies in ways that would allow them to maneuver in delicate ways, and even if they did they're still prey animals that have natural fear of novel situations so they tend to avoid unsure things. To be honest if horses in RDR2 DID willingly get up-close and personal with objects until the very edge of the collision boxes it would really take me out of it because they would feel significantly less "alive" and autonomous. Because its perfectly realistic for horses to avoid stuff like that, and trip over unexpected things in their way. They can't actually See their feet 90% of the time so its an art form really, conditioning them into having that kind of control AND building up a bond with them enough that they would listen to a rider telling them to enter virtually any position or traverse virtually any surface.
Edit: Side note, another little spot of realism and RDR2 tip for anyone reading who didn't already know. You are way better off just trusting the horse to navigate for themselves in RDR2. If you struggle with running into trees and rocks all the time, stop steering while you're riding. You're tripping the horse up by not letting them watch their own way. You can just mash the run button and they will dodge out of the way of obstacles automatically and keep running straight the way you pointed them. If you're trying to make a quick getaway in the middle of a shootout, just tap the analog to point them where you want them to go and then leave it alone, they'll take care of the rest.
Man, this video sure is timed oddly. Yesterday I was drawing my Breath of the Wild horses and today I see a video about video game horses.
I was - am - a horse girl. She was shut up about 10 or so years ago when I got more interested in dinosaurs and birds over horses to the point I thought she was dead. One Breath of the Wild later (my first playthrough was 2020) and she has reawakened with full horsey glory. I wanted a pure black horse, so my first horse in Breath of the Wild is a pitch-black horse with a white blaze. His name is Bel and to this day he is still my favorite horse. He’s taken me up mountains and down valleys. We have explored every nook and cranny of Hyrule. He’s joined horse races. He’s saved my life multiple times. He’s actually died himself and rose from the grave. He fought Ganon, nearly get crushed by him, and LIVED. He was giving me trouble first times around but after many treats, pets, adventures and close calls, he has become the best companion a horse girl could ever ask for.
Surprised at the attention to detail BotW had with its horses. I loved how you could control its gait. You can also feed it apples and carrots out of your hand and give it pets when you’re on it. You can also give them cute makeovers if you’re at the right stable. And when you let them go on autopilot on paths so you could just enjoy the view, ahh. That’s bliss.
And yes, horses are indeed weird ass freaks of nature. I draw lots of animals and study their anatomy to get their proportions right (not to mention, I am a biology nerd and will study anatomy and biology for fun) and I know horse anatomy to an extent. Walking on their fingernails aside (other hoofed animals like deer and antelope do this too, their hooves ARE nails), the really freaky part about horses are their toes. They only have one toe on each foot (hence why only one hoof on each foot). For context, humans have five. Now imagine out of those five toes, your middle toe starts growing longer and bigger while your other toes shrink and shrivel up. That is the horse toe. Yep. Look it up if you don’t believe me. Have a nice day folks. Apologies for my English for it is not my first language.
I'm so glad you mentioned the Inside Nature's Giants dissection doc! It's one of my faves to go back and rewatch bc horses are just such interesting creatures and it's amazing to get an inside look at how they work!
I’ve only ever seen two or three horses in real life before so it’s something I’ve never noticed haha
if videogames cant get horses right, obviously the solution is that our videogame protagonists should ride giant dogs instead. like great danes, bernese mountain dogs & labradoodles
if two legs are easier, everyone should ride giant ostriches. Chocobos were ahead of their time!
This is the thing with The Last Gaurdian! The developer wants the player to spend time bonding with Treeco and learns her body language. Treeco is neither a cat or a dog, so they can be more laxed with how accurate they have to go with animations and player won't be able to tell if they get something wrong or not.
@@Geopzdarksouls horsebirds!
I really love horses is Horizon ZD: the animation team did an amazing job at that game, and running animations for horses and Aloy are actually a little bit randomised on the go - so the main animation of you just going around the world doesn't get stale.
YESSSSSSS
"if someone wants to try animating the tölt I think they get a medal just for the attempt"
Star Stable Online: alright bet
I love these video essays about strange parts of video games.
I love the horse animations in Breath of the Wild. I haven’t played RDD yet so I have to say the BotW horses are the best I’ve seen in a video game, they feel so lively. They also have interesting social interactions- I don’t know what exactly triggered this to happen, so it might have been coincidental, but I had two tamed (but not yet registered) horses stood next to each other, and they were grooming each other! I think they do the same to Link when he’s close, it was very cute and very memorable
I'm doing an animation of a horse trot for school/ my portfolio, and this video was super helpful and gave me lots of good stuff to think about while working on it, thank you!
honorable mention to Epona. in terms of earlier games, Epona in the original publications of Twilight Princess is what made me a video game horse snob. The emotional bond in the early game just for her to be captured and abused to the point where she doesn’t recognize you and you full on have to wrangle her back; all for the story beat of not just saving her but immediately turning around to save the community taking refuge in Kakariko Village. And for the first and only time thanks to the wolf mechanic, you can talk to Epona and whats the one thing she uses this opportunity to say to you? Please turn back. Every other animal will comment on how noble or powerful you are as a wolf, but Epona is bonded to the human Link and thats who she wants to be with. Mechanics are incredible and fluid too, but they somehow botched that in the HD port to the Wii U. im honestly a little bummed how much of a back seat Epona took in botw considering shes one of the most iconic and influential horses in gaming
I feel so infinitely seen by this video, as a person who spent at least 70% of my BOTW time riding around places, taming every pretty horse i saw, and looking for all the "secret" or "special" ones. I'm surprised you didn't mentioned the Witcher 3 in the whole "horse as a character" type thing, but maybe it was just too obvious an example 😌
Yeah, but can you pet the horse? Can you pet Roach in Witcher 3? I only read the books and Gerald is a huge horse girl.
He's the best horse girl representation that we have
You can't pet Roach in TW3 and it is honestly a crime. Book Geralt and TV Show Geralt are more appropriate horse girl rep than the games, unfortunately 😤
As someone who has taken equine exercise physiology classes I am crying tears of joy right now that someone else noticed and appreciated game horses so much!! I also love the personality of the Breath of the Wild horses with their adorable face and head animations. Those little horsey lips are animated perfectly!!
Fun fact about horses during the gallop which also enables them to move so fast is how they breathe. 1 breath per one 4 beat gallop movement. Their internal organs act as a piston in their body sliding back and forth during the gallop to pull and push their diaphragm, enabling them to breathe far more effectively than bipedal animals at full run. Their breathing is rhythmic with their galloping movements! This internal organs sliding and behaving like a piston to pull and push their diaphragm only occurs in the full 4 beat gallop gait, not the 3 beat canter, or 2 beat trot gaits.
i need simone horse back riding vlog!! learning to groom and handle and lead and steer, and lots hugs and pats, is essential.
I love the mane quest and I’m glad seeing it get mentioned on polygon (again?)!! ^w^
Thank you
simone thank you so much for the work ur doing for the gaming horse girls ✌ ur so right for this
also check out Astride and Star Stable Online for good horse girl video games :)
im trying!!
Thanks
Thank you so much for this! I've been wanting to work on a horse game for a while and it is going to require a huge amount of effort into accurate horse movements. I... don't think this type of horse game has actually been done before, but I'd love to find out to see how they accomplished it. The resources and info you give in this is absolutely priceless, so thank you again!
Horses in BotW are simply one of the absolute best parts of the game. I try not to use the quick travel often just because I love riding them.
My favourite is the giant Gerudo horse. I named it Balrog, the shadow and flame.
I appreciate any polygon video, because they are always interesting enough, even if it isn't exactly my niche. Great work as always.
the absolute joy I get when my interests like video games combine with a love and understanding of horses... I feel like Simone gets me specifically, as a nerdy horse girl. Thank you for the horse video (also fun fact horses walk around technically on their middle fingers so they're kind of always flipping you off)!!
Also in case simone or another nerdy horse girl reads this, there's an indie horse game in development called tales of rein ravine that actually is going for realism in the riding mechanics and it's really fun. There's a realistic jumping mode where you have to actually get the striding right for the horse to jump and I think it actually helps develop your eye in real life
I used to teach dressage, and I would help my younger students understand horse gaits by having them be the two front or two back legs and we'd move together to get the gaits right (we could do walk, trot, and canter, but gallop, not so much ahaha). It was always hilarious.
This is great. Thanks for talking to a horse artist & enthusiast to discuss this. I follow her blog and it was cool to learn more about her!
One game that I don’t hear people talk much about is Ghost of Tsushima. For example, Jin will talk to his horse while riding and he is shown resting with it after every completed area. (Spoiler warning) I was heartbroken when my horse died in the beginning of Act III, and the game really doubled down on that when Jin gives his horse an honorable burial and even has flashbacks of him telling his horse “someday we’ll go for a peaceful ride.” I loved going to Iki Island too, you’re separated with your horse right away and your first task is to find it, after which your horse is more bold, has a bit of attitude, and gained the ability to charge thru enemies after being on its own and having to fend for itself for a bit, even saving the life of someone
Edit: one thing to add is that you can’t give your second horse the same name as your first one, something small but it’s the little things that count the most
I’ll be buying her game SO HARD. I’ve been a horse lover all my life and have been searching for great horse games for years. I feel so seen! This video was so cool!
Shadow of the Colossus had a really incredible horse mechanic, and between learning to animate myself (walk cycles, mate) and this video i now have way more appreciation 🖤🖤
I'm so happy to see more recognition for horses and how hard it is to animate them. There's been so many times where I'm like, "damn, if they could just animate their legs properly... " whenever I would see a horse in a videogame. I'm so happy Alice is doing more research and helping to solve this problem. From one horse girl to another, kudos to you Alice and Simone :)
I absolutely love BotW’s horses. Their animation is so fluid. I remember seeing a trailer for a big AAA game, and the gallop looked so janky to me. Like the horse was barely moving it’s legs at all. It was like the horse was animated to move like a toy with stiff joints. Unfortunately, I can’t remember what game it was, but I’ll never forget how dumb the horse gallop looked.
Was it Immortal Phoenix Rising? Because their horse animations are an absolute embarrassment.
Have you heard of Star Stable? Its a horse based game, with perhaps not the most interactive with the environment horses but the most accurate otherwise. There are plenty of different breeds with varying models and texture, as well as some breeds having their horse's gait, like the tolt among others.
I guess I've been watching too many hoof trimming videos and game play videos to get this on my page, but I wasn't disappointed. Growing up I wanted to be a farrier or a horse vet, but not much need for it in the 'burbs. The best description I've heard for horse leg tendons is that they're like shock absorbers. Plus it's crazy that they're prancing around on their middle toes. The Paso Fino gaits are probably my favorite and are fun to ride, though I've only ridden a Puerto Rican Paso, so no trocha. I've never played any of the AC games, but omg those stiff necks were atrocious, but sorta hilarious.
I kinda love that BotW has stocky draft horses b/c Shires have always been a personal favorite of mine and it did save the animators some work because not only can lightweight Link ride them, but even the larger riding enemies can too. Ngl, I wish they had had Link switch to a semi-standing position for the high speed gallop, because ouch...Oh and the fetlocks are stiff; that bugs me, but the fluid neck movement, gaits, and the various colors and personalities made it so much fun!
8:50 HOW DARE YOU MAKE ME RELIVE THAT 😭
Hell yes give us all the great Horse Girl ™ representation! I love seeing Alice's influence grow!
Could never really determine why some horse animations were uncanny valley weird. Now I know it's because horses are weird. Thanks Simone!
Also, now I miss the extremely short lived series Pat's Pets.
red dead has my heart for so many reasons, especially the details to the horses, giant white gypsy cob named calypso, back arabian named tulio ,, just so much fun
I can say that RDR2 and BOTW to a slightly lesser degree many times would pull me up short. I've spent so many years around horses and these games got it so right. The movement is great, but the little details and bits of personality you notice in a pet are clear. It felt like I was looking at something real at times.