Neumann TLM 102 vs TLM 103 - Battle of the Neumann "Home Studio" Microphones (Mic Review)
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 21. 07. 2024
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TLM 102 - amzn.to/3puCa19
TLM 103 - amzn.to/2Umei4i
(Affiliate links!)
Today we check out the home studio offerings from the famous Neumann Microphones :) The TLM 102 and 103 both have their drawbacks in my opinion, not limited by the scope of their capabilities, but more so by the limits of you and your environment...ITS YOUR FAULT!! NOW TAKE OUT THAT LOAN! SELL YOUR CAR! EVERYTHING IN THE PURSUIT OF TONE!!!
cough sorry I don't know what came over me.
TIMESTAMPS:
Review: 00:00
Blind/Voice Tests: 10:12
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TOP THREE BUDGET CONDENSERS:
đ„Lewitt 440 Pure - amzn.to/3imNwRh
đ„Neat King Bee II - amzn.to/3JOYATU
đ„Rode NT1 -
TOP THREE BUDGET DYNAMICS:
đ„Shure SM57 - amzn.to/2P1pUXC
đ„Behringer XM8500 - amzn.to/3utvKmp
đ„Shure MV7 - amzn.to/3BfewuF
TOP THREE CONDENSERS
đ„Austrian Audio OC818 - imp.i114863.net/qnGXBO
đ„AKG C414 XLS - amzn.to/3lMAgXq
đ„Soyuz Bomblet - amzn.to/3BDy2Sx
Honorable Mention: Roswell Pro Audio Mini k67x - amzn.to/3BeT9Mt
TOP THREE DYNAMICS:
đ„ElectroVoice RE20 - amzn.to/2UFdyaM
đ„Shure SM57 - amzn.to/2P1pUXC
đ„Sennheiser MD 441 - amzn.to/3S6st6b
MY CAMERA SETUP:
Lumix S5 (w/Kit Lens) - amzn.to/3xKHLVQ
85mm F1.8 for B Roll - amzn.to/3y8GcBF
My (weirdly expensive) ring light - amzn.to/3LIK164
MY STUDIO GEAR:
Audient iD4 - amzn.to/3Svvxst
Audient Evo 4 - amzn.to/3UxLZtL
Scarlett 18i20 2nd Gen- amzn.to/2P4SXtl
KRK Rokit 5s G4 - amzn.to/3dIKubA
Elgato Low Profile Boom Arm - amzn.to/3DNyZKS
MY HEADPHONES -
Audio Technica M30x - amzn.to/3feOfE6
Status Audio CB-1s - amzn.to/3IfcOeX
Hifiman Sundara - amzn.to/3JvDkm1 - Hudba
Howdy everyone!! Here are the affiliate links in case this review helped you out :)
Amazon:
TLM 102 - amzn.to/3puCa19
TLM 103 - amzn.to/2Umei4i
Sweetwater:
TLM 102 - imp.i114863.net/yRxQED
TLM 103 - imp.i114863.net/7mBkL3
Thanks Phil. I made it to that part of the video, and I'm angry about the review, and I'm letting you know in the comments.
this means we must battle.
@@AudioHaze you know heâll beat you, right?
@@AudioHaze We don't have to deal with this sort of thing with Brandon.
@@jonathansellers793 Why? Brandon is mainly focussed on voice over with a little bit of recording guitars and vocals. But that doesnÂŽt represent the needs of musicians and so Phil chooses a more practically relevant approach to mics. At least IMHO.
I feel the same way about both mics
Thanks Phil. In the shootout I seem to like the 102 sound more, especially in the voice over and singing segments. A little warmer and smoother to my ears.
definitely! I totally agree :)
Great vid! I appreciate the help, just purchased the 102. I definitely preferred the sound in your vocal tests. Looking forward to it đ
I just bought a Neumann TLM 103 and stumbled across this channel in the process. For me a 103 is better because i have a deep raspy voice. I upgraded from a Rode Nt-1 and the difference is like night and day. Solid channel and work my G!
Thank you my friend! And enjoy the new mic :)
I'm in the same situations as you were. Right now I got the Rode NT-1 and looking to upgrade to a better mic and i'm considering between 102 and 103 but don't know what should i choose. Can you tell me how is the tlm 103 working for you so far these past 9 months it would mean a lot to me to get some more info. Thanks!!
Thanks, Phil, for lending the TLM 103 to our man here! You rock!
Thanks Phil! With your feedback in mind, I correctly identified both blind tests, but honestly really enjoyed both sounds. Because I very much have a âhome studioâ I do think I will go with the 103 due to the slight advantages in an untreated space. I appreciate the honest and useful review!
Glad I could help!
This is a great comparison, the most helpful one Iâve found comparing the 102 and 103.
Iâm liking how your video style is evolving, it feels high quality, fun to watch, and itâs got plenty of uniqueness that make your videos always worth watching even with all the other quality reviewers I like to watch đ
Thanks! Yeah I'm trying to continually improve, I think I'm starting to land on something semi-professional, but I still need to keep tweaking. Regardless, appreciate you saying all this :)
I've been using the 102 as my main vocal mic for two years and absolutely love it. Your right though, you have to be careful with the room.
As a voice actor I see other voice actors using the 103 more, but my preference listening to your review, was the 102. I have been planning to get the 103 for a while, but now I'm leaning more toward the 102. Great review...thanks!
Tip: get whichever mic you can afford, and learn to love it. A tonal change means little. They both have the dynamic range Neumann is famous for and can be placed differently, EQd, etc to get a sound.
I absolutely love my Neumann TLM102 kit with the shock mount for my home recording studio. Of course I understood that my space would need to be treated properly.
Yeah I love the 102 as well :) in fact its continuing to grow on me, its sensitivity though is pretty intense!
@@AudioHaze Why not make a video showing people how to get the best out of their TLM 102 in a home recording studio? Show them what they need to do to enjoy its benefits and mitigate the problems outside of a full studio?
@@seanwebb605 doubt he can, all I ever see is a microphone getting hit like that is how we use themđ€Ą
This was an awesome video. I happened to need it because I've stumbled between a used TLM 103 and a brand new TLM 102, which are $100 apart. Is it worth the difference to get the TLM 103 in your opinion?
Thank you, Phil. Also, I was convinced the egg carrier was going to be the Neumann shock mount.
HAHAHA omg that would have been so funny, and if it was my shockmount I would've done it
Great work, Ricky! Really enjoying your videos!
Another $100 shockmount you can get for the 102 is the MKS4 (works with the Sennheiser MK4 and TLM 103 as well.)
Also the $300 EA1 shockmount isn't just expensive, it's a pain to use, too!
Thanks for the recommendation and also thanks for the nice words!
I have a 102 and recently borrowed the 103 from a friend to compare. 103 sounds much smoother on my voice, but 102 cuts through much better in a crowded mix especially with distorted rock guitars. 102 also has a less harsh top end to my ears. 102 sounds a bit narrower and focused, while the 103 sounds open but less punchy. Great comparison video đ€đ» By the way, whatâs the song being sung at the end of the comparison? Incredible, I would like to add it to my favorites!
I am using the 102 for every day tasks like discord or recording songs and I am so happy with that.
Great Review and comparison!
Thanks Phil!
Thanks as always Rod!
I have to compliment you. That is one difficult video to produce. Your explanation of the 2 was excellent. I have a TLM 49 that I'm thinking of selling, only because it's just so large and heavy. So I'm thinking of buying the TLM103. But then when you introduced TLM102, it had me thinking.
I was looking for a proximity effect mic and was leaning towards the TLM 103, but now, I'm considering the TLM 102. Since I have other mics, that makes the 102 more tempting
much love and respect on this video mannn.. as a fellow music producer and engineer..
Love your review. Great info, with some tasteful humor mixed in. :)
Que pareja de ambos 2 microfonos (el mismo par) me recomendarĂas para grabar piano acustico un baby grand en una habitaciĂłn no particularmente bien tratada?
Gracias
Thanks Phil. The TLM103is my top choice in my wish list, but for some reason is incredible expensive in my country (around 2k). At the moment I am happy with my Lewitt 440 Pure for voice and my SM57 for guitars, but indeed I want that Neumann.
440 pure plus 57 is a killer combo tho!
How come the tlm 103 is less sensitive? tlm 102 sensitivity is 11 mV/Pa, while the tlm 103 is 23 mV/Pa. Considering this, I don't understand how the tlm 103 would take less ambient noise than the tlm 102. Help me out here please.
thanks phil, we love you!
You might want to check out the Neumann KMS 104/105. They are also advertised for home recording and do very well in untreated rooms.
Thanks Phil! Great review!
What would you buy instead of the 102 for an average home studio?
yup I didn't know why I didn't like my voice through my tlm 102 until I got some better sound treatment. as a bonus, it has given me a great appreciation for everything my sm7b does!
edit: just removed the foam from inside the 102 and it's brighter
I got a TLM103 used for 980$ and I'm not regreting it at all. At this price I just bought a Rycote shockmount. It's my go to mic when I don't want to warm up my Telefunken ak47. Since their prices went up a little I'm really glad I jumped on it.
Thanks Phil. Ricky, where did you get this idea that if a mic needs more gain, it is more sensitive to the environment ? If so, the SM7b should be super sensitive to all kinds of noise. The NT1 is also very sensitive to room noise, it's not gain hungry though. It is the overall design of the mic that makes it more or less prone to catching unwanted sounds. By the way, the sound difference for guitar is stunning. Was it really the same position ?
Two different kinds of microphones. Sm7b is a dynamic mic while the Neumann is a condenser. Big difference.
Dynamics are more directional and can take more spl. Condensers are more sensitive and omnidirectional.
Dynamic mics need more gain to bring them up to the record level. You donât gain a condenser the same as a dynamic mic.
Thaaaanks PhilâŠyou made this possible đđŒđđŒđđŒđđŒđ
Gotta say, I agree with you that, at least in this video, I prefer the 102. To my ears, the proximity effect in the recordings you did here, make the 102 sound warmer than the 103. Wasn't expecting that. I'm curious, if I would've bought the 102 instead of the 103, if I still would've sent it back? Probably? After all is said and done, both the 102 and 103 are beautiful mics. But, I think I'll stick with the 440 Pure for now. If you pair the 440 with some analog emulating plugins and saturation, it really is a beautiful combination of detail and warmth. Another great vid! Thanks Phil!
Yeah the 440 is killer! I haven't made a chain specific for it yet but I would be curious to see how easy it would be to pull off a Neumann-like sound on mine :)
I preferred the clarity of the 103 in all samples. Thanks Phil.
Nice! You have expensive tastes ;)
Getting my TLM 103 soon, very excited
Enjoy it my friend!
Thanks for the video. As far as I know, gain has nothing to do with how sensitive a mic is to environmental noise or noise rejection. Sensitivity is determined by the construction/design of the mic and, particularly, its capsule and polar pattern. Gain is just how loud the mic is, and can be an issue if you have a mic with above average self noise or a less than great preamp. Forgive me if I have misunderstood what you were saying. Cheers.
Sensitivity is the lowest SPL the mic is capable of converting into an electric voltage.
Gain is the ratio between input voltage and output voltage on the preamp.
Dynamic range is the difference in SPL between the lowest electrical voltage above the self noise floor of the microphone and the voltage at which the level of distortion generated internal to the microphone (potentially caused by a number of different factors) becomes unacceptable.
Nirvana is a noise floor of 0dB and a completely flat frequency curve between 8Hz - 50Hz. Let me know if you ever find a microphone like that.
I suppose in some way gain is like turning up the microphone's hearing aid lol
thanx Phill. perfect review!!!
Thanks Phil. Help me out guys
I am a vocalist. I own a 102 and as I live in a heavy traffic area and my room is not treated there is a lot of sensitivity. The 102 even picks horns from miles away
So my question is should i buy a 103 ? or do you have better alternatives? Audio Interface: RME Babyface Pro Fs
Thanks !!
The best mic for this situations is the SM7B. You get the studio quality from a dinamic microphone
cool video.
The truth for me is the price. The problem with mics for me is this: mics of a certain price and up tend to sound so similar, with slight nuanced differences that I feel one can make them work easily no matter which one you choose. And mic placement goes a long way to compensate for slight differences.
I bought the 102 over the 103 years ago because it was signifificantly cheaper and it sounds great. Besides recording myself and recording theater plays I use it in my home office for voip on a mic arm without any shock mount and have never noticed any weird noise from typing, stomping or similar. To me, it's a nonissue
Appreciate you Phil!
Great comparison! By "home studio" do you mean a totally untreated space? Because I have have a small office that I've covered about 80% of in moving blankets and foam. My audio isn't as tight as a full-blown whisper room would be, but it's pretty good. Is that something that should push me towards the 103?
I suppose thats what I mean yes :) any space that isn't ideal acoustically
Thank you, Phil!
I know this is not related to the content of the video, but I need help.
I accidentally dragged/moved 1 track from 2track of stereo recording, but without "snapping" feature, now it sounds out of phase.
But also somehow it's not possible to re-move it again to the original position (matched with its stereo pair) because of some audio cropping process..
How to "re sync" it again? Is it possible?
Also
Thanks Phill đ
Oh dude weird, you can't move it back? You could try some phase reversal tricks on EQ's but this probably won't help. Maybe get tricky with the EQ? But there's definitely got to be some way just to move the track back to its original position right?
@@AudioHaze thanks for the reply. I re-record it again! ^^
Hi ! Don't you find that the TLM 102 sounds more like a sensitive dynamic than a condenser? I find it rather narrow sounding and therefore not good enough for professional folk vocals for instance. Am I wrong? It's a shame because I love the sweet velvety character it has.
Seen quite a few comparison vids of these two mics. I have always liked the 102 better for vocals and acoustic guitar. Now I reach the same conclusion in both blind tests. The 102 is my preferred.
Which mic would you suggest for stepping up my game? The tlm103 or the akg c414. At the moment I own the c214 but I would really love having a neumann.
I personally prefer to c414! One of my favorite, most versatile mics out there, plus better at handling less than ideal rooms
I have the tlm 102 and have used it for many years. Honestly I did notice sensitivity to background noises but didn't really understand why until your video on it. I am a machinist and I decided to fabricate a sleeve that allows me to use my tlm 102 with my audio technicas at4050's shock mount. I'm excited to see how this works for me. Made it out of a hard plastic called lexan.
Thats sick! Would love to see a picture of that at some point. Enjoy the mic!
@@AudioHaze the project is complete and I do have pics. What's the best way I could send some pics to you?
@@AudioHaze If you ever would like for me to attempt to make something for you I'm sure we could figure it out. We have stubs of this material that don't get used. Only thing is that it does require precise dimensions. Obviously I could get the tlm dimensions no problem but the fit on the shock mount would depend on what shockmount you have that u want to adapt to. Either way I'd be happy to help out for fairly cheap. Keep up the good work âșïž
@@PBMatthews254 Thanks for the offer! I'll let you know :)
Get the plugin clarity by waves⊠lol
Thanks Phil! Also what are those more budget friendly microphone thats you mentioned in the beginning of the video that are better home studio microphones?
I'd look to the 440 Pure by Lewitt :) if you EQ out the high end a bit, you'd be left with a comparable sound.
@@AudioHaze sweet thank you, I will look into that đ„
Which is which in the singing segments?
To me the 102 sounds so good and almost rivals u67. Bar the high frequency bump on the 102.
If you can flatten that high end bump it would be as flat as the u67
Ohhh Ricky I always forget to ask you! Which mic do you think is better at *rejecting background noise* TLM103 or NT1?
Oooh hard one! Theyâre both pretty sensitive, and Iâd have to do some measurements, but off the top of my head, I think the 103?
thanks Phil- great video
What mics are best for noise reduction???
Thanks so much Phil!
What mic preamp would you suggest buying? I see that in sweetwater they have a bundle for the tlm103 including a Neve Designs 511, is it worth it?
511 is a great choice! A 1073 is my personal favorite if in the budget
@@AudioHaze What 1073 do you personally own? The Neve?
I got the103 and my voice sounded crystal clear but I was shocked at how much noise it picked up, I was hearing everything going on downstairs in my headphones, I felt like a superwoman with a heightened sense. I remembered your video about it's sensitivity. But for some reason, as soon as I started singing and recording into logic, I literally didn't do anything but it somehow cut out all the background noise and literally just collected my pure vocal CLEAN. My room isn't sound treated and I sang into a quality insulator, bought it with it's shock mount and I am more than pleased with it and very glad I didn't have to worry about the background noise. I also used a cheap presonus interface. So if anyone is concerned about its high sensitivity, it seems to sort itself out as you adjust the gains on your interface and it adapts. God bless you in Jesus name.
Thanks, Phil! Whatta guy!
thanks Phil. well done video.
I'm surprised I prefered the 102 for the voiceover. Any chance of doing a TLM 103 vs LCT 440 Pure?
Perhaps at some point! I'd have to get a 103 to borrow lol
I only have one question: Do you need a shock mount for the spoon?
You're thinking forks.
A shockmount is always recommended....on everything...
could listen and record Ethan all day
Yeah he's awesome :)
Gracias, Phil!
Were u using the 103 shockmount on the 102? And if so, does it fit good?
Could you compare the TLM 107 (if you can own it) and the austrian audio OC 818 ? I would like to know how each one sounds versus the other.
I wish I could but i don't have the 107! Its an expensive boy too
Bra I bought the tlm103 last year as a main mic and ughhhhhh so much harshnessâŠâŠ. Ugh. ONE time I got it decent with a waves c6 multiband for vocals but other than that especially in a vocal booth that is a big no. Got a Austrian audio edge solo, I prefer the tone but still condenser in a booth is boothy and boothy in a way u canât reallly eq nothin. Even past a 200 high pass filter the character is lost What you think about that lewitt you said was ur best mic? U think for vocals in a booth (whisperroom) Iâd be set?
It depends I think on what you want out of your mic! You said the 103 is harsh, well the 440 is even brighter, although brighter doesn't necessarily make it harsher. If you're looking for a different tone, maybe try a darket mic instead of something with a presence boost. Such as the NT1 :)
Thanks Phillip! Prefered the 102 in the commercial and singing!
have you ever tried removing the foam inside the tlm 102 capsule? it would be great to hear some comparisons with and without the foam since it is a very popular mod
I have not! Didn't know that was a thing :)
@@AudioHaze czcams.com/video/OaXZA35y8nE/video.html in case you want to take a look
Thanks Phil, what a king
please tell me I have a poorly prepared room, but I do not like the sharpness, harsh sound of midrange 102, or is it corrected by the equalizer, as 103 behaves in not ideal conditions? .
What does your room and environment look like? Any treatment?
@@AudioHaze poorly prepared, we have a war, Russia in one day fired ballistic missiles all over Ukraine, help us please
@@user-uj6yu1jk2b I am so sorry my friend, Iâm wishing you all the best, stay strong, stay safe, and know the world is on your side. Slava Ukraini.
Just as a random question will a cloud lifter make the 102 less noisy ?
It won't no! The 102 isn't noisy due to any preamp noise or something like that, its just incredibly sensitive to the environment
So if both these mics are not ideal for the home studio setup, what would be a close alternative?
Rode nt1a or nt1. Only like 5db self noise, QUIET ASF!!!!
Thanks Phil! â€
Thanks Phil!
Iâm wondering if I should try to find a CZcams channel as good as yours BUT only reviews mics that are strictly for use in home recording studios? And THANKS PHIL!! (Enjoyed the guitar test segment a bazillion times more than the egg on a spoon test commercial!)
Haha good to know :) maybe I'll make more commercials. And this is probably the upper limit for the mics I'll review, at least for a long time, after a certain point I wonder if the mics are even relatable
That singer is DAMN awesome. Also, whoever wrote the tune is skilled. Creative man. Great writing and performance. I'm an old guy who has run a studio for 30+ years. You guys did that song justice. As far as the mics? Eh...Either mic will work though. I own both, and a U87. And maybe 150 more. Literally. If forced to use any of them, you can make it work. All about what's IN FRONT OF THE MIC. And..ahem...having something actually WORTH recording. Thanks for the cool video. Sub'ing. Keep up the good work.
P.S. I think I watched your sm7b vid...totally agree. Just get a 57 ;-) Unless you're in a radio station. Near an airport. With spinal tap levels of RFI. Then you might actually need the humbucking transformer in an sm7b. Sheesh...great mic, but the hype a while back...damn.
I have the TLM 102 but don't use it much. I think the Rode NT1 serves me better for podcasting. That said, I like NOT having the shock mount that takes up more real estate! My "normal" podcast mic these days is the Blue Encore 300 with a Fedhead Phantom which gives me the warmth of a condenser without much noise and requiring little gain.
Nice! Yeah the NT1 bunches way above its weight class
Although the 103 has a wider high-frequency boost, It sounds crispier on voice, probably because of the higher gain setting you have to set It with? It also sounds more natural than the 102 to my ears.
Word to the wise: even if you treat a room, if the place is too small and you donât have very very thick treatment, you still get a boxed in, ringy sort resonance with a very sensitive mic
What would be the best mid range sorta Preamp for the 102? Something more vintage sounding maybe @audiohaze
Are you looking for a stand alone preamp or a preamp built into an interface? You can't go wrong with an apollo, but in terms of standalone preamps, a 1073 (or perhaps a warm audio remake if thats too expensive) is sort of the standard.
@@AudioHaze I have a Presonus 1818VSL interface so would be looking for a preamp to go with that. What else would you recommend apart from the 1073? Or would you recommend any of the online preamps you can download? Really love your videos by the way, been watching you for ages!
What would be a good condenser that still rejects background noise?
I've found that the LCT 440 by Lewitt performs very well :) its quite a bright microphone, very modern tuning
i like the mic 1 more bassy, what about alternatives to this 2 mics? i think the vanguard is better than tlm 103 and blue bird and bottle cheaper and better alternatives.
thank you Phill! :)
Hey Haze, I use an SM57 with the A2WS windscreen that I really like the tone of when I EQ it to sound like the SM7b.
Out of the MOTU M4, I have to set it to max gain in order to get it to a good volume for discord calls, however that limits me to the point that if I get any louder than normal such as when I laugh or scream, I immediately start clipping, which is obviously no good.
Do you have any suggestions as to what I could use in order to get the mic to be loud enough for Discord calls and such, while still having the ability to scream or get louder than normal without clipping the signal?
I have some settings that I have applied in OBS that I like, but then those only apply when I'm using OBS, and not system-wide.
Thanks fro your time.
Sure! Check out this video, the premises apply to the SM57 too :) - czcams.com/video/-bIurYUN7rk/video.html
I think a good idea would be to get some procesing for the mic thru something like voicemeteer banana or cantabile and compress it so it wont clip on your discord
And with the tlm 107 between 102 and 103? :D
Thanks, Phil!
Thank you Phill!
thanks Phil, nice one!
Thanks, Phil!!!
Dude let's talk about the hair.. .looking solid amigo.
Interesting. Explains a lot. Have been very happy with the 102's performance but completely agree about the sensitivity to the recording space that you use it in. Completely agree.
Thanks Phil!!
I preferred the tlm 102 by a large margin on both headphones and ipad, iphone.
I checked the comments before watching the video and was a bit confused , Thought you might have changed your name to Phil. Thanks, Phil!
Hahahahah
Me da la sensaciĂłn de que con el micrĂłfono tlm102 te da un sonido exepcional y te permite tener un subjetivo cĂłmo dices, o una calidad mas brillante , pero el tlm103 aparte que no te permite fallar en las cuerdas ni en la voz hay que ser perfecto para grabar con el mismo , prefiero tlm103 ya que estoy a horas de comprar, SALUDOS DESDE Bolivia.
Great review
thank you Phil!
Thanks, Phill!
Thank you, Phil
Hey thanks Phil!