How Is Joel Embiid Getting Away With This??
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- čas přidán 29. 11. 2023
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Coach Nick dissects a special part of Embiid's game that is either incredibly skilled or has fans thinking he's just a foul merchant. He brings on Ronnie Nunn, who was an NBA referee for 19 years and director of development for 5 more to get even deeper insight.
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Every single sixers match is Joel's bizarre adventure to the ft line 😂
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Yeah I bet they won’t tell you mj averaged the same amount of free throws. Or Kobe, or any great scorer ever. You just pay attention when embiid does it because he’s the only center in nba history that can make his free throws like a guard.
@@sirfish9824 You can't judge neither the content of the video nor out opinion about Embiid's play two full months later when he's played amazing offense pretty much after this video. It's not that he wasn't playing well by that time, but it was a fair comment on his offensive output. He's been putting up all time numbers lately
@@facundofortes7912bro he’s been putting up all time numbers for 3 seasons now. The only problem embiid has is injuries. He’s literally the best player I’ve ever watched play when he’s healthy.
No but seriously I bet even sixers fans see it clearly
Joel Embiid's antics of foul-baiting is basically if James Harden was 7 feet tall.
Yeah and both are playoff chokers
Nah Prime Harden is the goat of foul baiting they had to adjust rules to control him.
true, but the only difference is Joel's wingspan are so much longer, so he must be able to catch you with his arms, ..meaning automatic foul (not to mention his steps are longer too, much easier for him to jump into the defender
the fact thats its still going on wants me to throw myself off a cliff, fortunately they often dont last in the playoffs
And thats why he CAN'T score in the playoffs...like literally...19ppg in elimination games..lol...
It seems to me that defenders are not entitled to the same space rules that offensive players are. You can be a defender with verticality but if an offensive player forces contact into them unnaturally the offense is given the benefit of the doubt. Worst of all offense players are getting shooting fouls due to this. Embiid in particular is damn near gathering from the 3 point line hurling his body into the defender and throwing up a shot he’s never shot before in his life. Drawing fouls is definitely a skill but I disagree with forcing unnecessary contact and getting rewarded
This is a perfect statement
Perfectly encompasses one of the most important ways in which the game has changed to favor offense, and one of the best things the league could reform to bring the game into better balance.
exactly. that's why this era is labeled "soft" because the game is now rigged in favor of the offense with all the rule changes that the NBA made.
agree, especially those fouls when the shooting players will INTENTIONALLY SWING their arms into the defenders stretch out arms on the side like Harden, DBook, CP3, and lots of players. If a defender was trespassing in the offensive players space to the point that he's hugging him, all the offensive player has to do was pull up and the contact will happen. But on their cases, what they do is swing their arms in a very unnatural way jsut to make a contact. As if they shoot that ugly when open.
@august6281 mentioning dbook as one of those guys is pure hating lol wht did booker do u to losers seriously, the hate yall have for him makes no sense. Is it really jsut that he's continously proved the empty stats idiots wrong? 11:54
It just gives me solace that his antics dont work in the playoffs every year and he always ends up choking. But this dude's whistle is the best ive ever seen.
Considering he only averages around 1 less free throw per game in the playoffs than the regular season, I don't think that refereeing is the reason why Embiid hasn't won a title lol. He's just not healthy and loses to elite teams like the Celtics and Heat which are wayyyy better than the Sixers
MVP of the league, he’ll get his eventually. Jokic won 2 before he got a ring and he’s one of the worst defensive centers in the league lol
@@kaysheye7784 Except the defenders play much more physical defense while committing the same number of fouls on him which is why his efficiency and ppg takes such a massive dip in the playoffs. So the refs do actually give him less fouls given the increased physicality of the defense.
@@kaysheye7784he hasn’t won a title because he plays like a guard trapped in a 7 footer’s body. He relies too much on his jumpshot and tries to draw fouls instead of actually trying to make his shots
@@kaysheye7784 ur right hes just so bad its not even the calls that affect his losing hes just a choker at heart. He didnt lose to elite teams his entire career. 2018 he lost to the celtics with no kyrie and hayward and choked in game 5. 2019 he had one of the biggest chokejobs of all time vs the raptors he averaged 28 on in the reg season and averaged 18 that series with multiple single digit point games. 2021 had probably a top 5 chokejob of all time. 1st seeded 76ers going up against a playoff virgin hawks team led by a 3rd year trae young and a bunch of teenagers. In game 4 they were up 15 at half time, proceeded to go 0-12 in the second half and lost the game. As if it couldnt get any worse in game 5 they were up 20 at half embiid goes scoreless in the last 7 minutes of the 4th quarter and the 76ers get outscored 40-19 in the 4th choking another game. Game 7 embiid goes scoreless in the last 4 minutes of the game with the score tied 86-86 and they lose yet again. One of the most improbable losses of all time, his team was so overwhelmingly favoured vs that hawks team and somehow still lost. The following year embiid leads the league at 31 a game. Vs the heat in the second round he averages 20 and chokes yet again. the following year he leads the league again at 33 a game. he underperforms yet again only averaging 25 vs the celtics and in the crucial game 7 u just know the choke is coming. 15 points on 28% shooting.
As a sixers fan, i honestly HATE this part of embiids game. When shit gets tight, he is way too reliant on drawing fouls instead of actually trying to score. It works everytime in the regular season, but he doesnt get those calls vs good defensive teams in the playoffs
he needs to be more confident in his shot making when guys are not falling for these moves. the issue with these moves is that when they fail, they result in transition buckets for the other team, and are extemely tiring when he has to take hits, fall down and get up again.
Both good points, however when the moves DO work, he gets a rest at the freethrow line, counteracting the extra effort of when it fails.
I don't see why it's an exclusive "Foul-drawing OR smooth-scoring". Why can't we see his ability to utilise the rules to his advantage as a skill? Then see him transition to less foul-drawing in the playoffs, and more body-bashing to get to the bucket when the normal whistles disappear in the playoffs?
@richardanthony7855 exactly. In the playoffs it always leads to turnovers and easy buckets for the other team. It happens every year lol
@michaeljansz4346 I do see him playing more like a center this year, but I worry once fatigue sets in late in the season he will resort back to his old ways...hopefully this year will be different.
Nonsensical statement. When Embiid is healthy, he goes for the jugular. The Raptors series of the 21-22 season is a perfect example of that. Unfortunately, his orbital bone got smashed by Siakam at the end of the last game.
Another reason why travels and illegal dribbles need to be enforced. Offense has to many advantages give defenders a level playing field.
Carrying
Could NOT agree more! If the refs are so picky with how they enforce contact rules (which they should be!), then they ALSO need to enforce travelling, carrying, etc. rules that offense uses to get small advantages that they exploit!
Except travels and illegal dribbles don’t happen nearly as much as you think. It mainly just comes from a lack of knowledge of the rules.
@@peewee0224they do but the rules have been changed so you can travel
That's not a natural shooting motion though. There's no way he can actually make those shots. Therefore, he shouldn't be rewarded with two freethrows for this bs
Some of them, i'd agree. Layups can look like whatever you want them to, which is why they ref shooting fouls on drives. Outside the paint if he's going for a floater / fading jumpshot, I'd agree.
What's the basis if it's natural or not? Some players shoot off of one hand, two hands, wrong foot, from the sides etc.
@@princemjbp695 That's a good question to ask, but i think a good place to start would be where literally 100% of players in the world are consistent - 2 hands on the jumpshot, for instance. Further on from that, factors like "reasonable expectation that a shot COULD go in" (subjective, yes), or even genuine attempt (subjective again, but easier to tell? maybe?) become relevant.
My main point is to say that there is at least two undeniable commonalities to jump shooting (NOT including FT shooting): There are 2 hands on the ball at the start of the shot motion, and it involves SOME form of a jump (might be sideways or barely get off the ground).
There's no rule about how you try throwing the round thing into the circle. Doesn't matter. There is however rules about legal defence and positioning
@@paulranalli3367 You're correct, there is no prescribed rule to the action of a jump shot - I was merely saying where I think it makes sense to start adjudicating "natural" shooting motion, by looking at consistencies across players.
I can't stand the extent to which so many players across positions and teams can initiate contact as the offensive player and get rewarded with a shooting foul. How can anyone be expected to play good defence when offensive players just get rewarded for throwing themselves into you regardless of how unnatural the body contortions require to do so might be.
Jumping into a defender and throwing the ball up isn't a real shot, it's purely designed to draw a foul call. Wasn't there a rule instituted about that a season or two ago?
It's basically called the Harden Rule. It has to be a "natural shooting motion" to become a shooting foul. So, it has to "appear" to the refs that the player is taking a real shot, not just drawing a foul and then chucking it up after the whistle while in the air. What Embiid does to circumvent this rule is to make sure he gets the shot off before the whistle is blown. Players have been doing this forever, but it usually is only beneficial in the regular season. Much more leinency is given in the playoffs in terms of contact. The biggest problem I think is the rule that you basically can't touch a player while he is "driving the ball," which creates higher scoring games, but makes fouls way easier to commit on accident, or for guys to draw them on purpose.
I just don’t see how Embid “beat him” to the spot?
(Somebody else said something similar, and this is a copypasta of my response there) On first glance, I would have to agree, but take a look at Dean Wade’s foot when the “shot” was up. It was over Embiid’s, indicating that technically, Embiid beat him there. Not to say this SHOULD be the case, but this does happen to be legal.
The best way to tell is where the contact occurs on the defender's body. Centre of the chest (or thereabouts), indicates the defender is in "legal guarding position". I place quotation marks around that phrase because it's actually a technical phrase in the rulebook.
Since the contact is not in the centre of the chest (im looking at 3:23), but rather the defender's chest is facing the sideline (rather than parallel to embiid's driving path to the hoop), the defender hasn't had time to get into legal guarding position at the spot (which is why they teach defensive slides in general) which is what they mean by "beat him to the spot".
TLDR: It's not about just being there, it's also about being in the legal guarding position.
@@michaeljansz4346 Exactly correct. This is also why this kind of a foul when the player is not in the act of shooting is called a blocking foul. A blocking foul or charge is sometimes one of the hardest calls to make in basketball, but in this case it's pretty clear cut: you are not allowed to impede the player with the ball by simply stepping in his way. Otherwise, what would prevent defenders from simply tripping opponents?
@@michaeljansz4346 What are you talking about? The contact point at 3:23 is EXACTLY in the center of Wade's chest. And legal guarding position has nothing to do with the offensive player's path, ignoring the having-left-the-ground considerations. The relevant "spot" is the point on the floor directly below the defensive player's crotch, and if his chest is over that point then he is definitely in legal defensive position. (It's more complicated than that, but that is sufficient though not necessary.) 3:23 was a charge.
He simply did not. That was a kind of contact that happens on every drive to the basket.
The PROBLEM is that most other players don't get the same percentage of calls that he gets. If he gets fouled on 10 drives, he gets the call on 8 drives, but when some other player gets fouled on 10 drives, he gets only 4-5 calls. 🤨
THATS WHAT THE NBA HAS TO CONTINUALLY ANALYSE AND IMPROVE.
But Embiid average around 12 free throws a game, on 8 drives he is gifted 12 free throws
Embiid is a center version of harden
Damn, this made me think. When it's all said and done, will Harden and Embiid have nearly identical careers? Consistent MVP frontrunner, regular season 1-man offensive brilliance, playoff underachievement, a long list of failed second stars. How ironic that they played together.
Blah blah blah
@@elstcman5harden is a significantly better overall playoff performer than embiid. Harden only struggles in elimination games (and still has better elimination game stats than other greats at his position such as Wade and Kobe) whereas embiid struggles all around. Harden being a bad playoff performer is an overblown narrative
@@thelegendoof8744 harden doesn’t keep the same energy in crucial must-win playoff scenarios as the energy that keeps him in consistent MVP contention and record breaking regular season performance. That’s an inconsistency of expectation. I understand that you’re isolating his statistics to give a better picture of specific games and overall performance. But the narrative is based around his inconsistent energy and aggression in key moments. Not statistics. He’ll always make good on statistics, he’s Harden. Embiid is cut from that exact same cloth.
But the playoffs are defined by a player’s PRESENCE in must-win games, not their ability to have a good looking resume over the course of their participation. It’s not the regular season. Kobe and Wade have had incredibly aggressive and ballsy games in must-win situations, so their narrative is naturally *COMPETELY* different, despite maybe comparable stats.
@@elstcman5 I just acknowledged he doesn’t perform the greatest in elimination games but so does Kobe and Wade. Too bad elimination games does not = the entirety of the playoffs
Look. Nunn is making a weird call on the first one. We have the perfect position. We see the defender not moving forwards, so he's in a legal stance, sliding over. Contact occurs on the chest, indicating he was on the spot earlier. Maybe the NBA has weird rules, but with FIBA, it's a no-call, or a charge.
I don’t follow how u can see it that way. Wade’s vector is towards the sideline when he makes contact, he’s not in legal guarding position (he’s not squared up to the ball handler)
After reviewing it a lot of times, *and* looking at the rules, the problem is that Wade was moving towards Embiid, and did not plant his second foot yet. The moment he would have, he would've been in a legal position and allowed to slide. Wade actually stopped his forward movement when the contact occurred... BUT HIS FOOT WASN'T PLANTED yet.
@@cptfwiffo Yep, his right foot wasn't planted, and his chest wasn't rotated into legal guarding position when the contact occurred. Good of you to take a look at the rule book to make sure you understand the call clearly! Not many people go to those lengths, and then come back to admit they were initially wrong and "XYZ is exactly why". Kudos bro!
@@cptfwiffo "....[a] the problem is that Wade was moving towards Embiid... [b] Wade actually stopped his forward movement when the contact occurred..."
Cognitive dissonance much?
Also, your foot doesn't have to be planted for you to be in legal guarding position. In fact you can have both feet in the air and be in legal guarding position, so long as your chest front and feet are aligned. That's what's called "verticality".
@@bballbreakdown What are you smoking? Wade was absolutely squared up to the ball handler, who then shouldered him in the center of his chest. His movement incorporated no vector towards Embiid whatsoever.
Isn't Embiid jumping into defenders while he's gathering on the one? Or, is that my imagination?
Just watch the video man. They are clear fouls. What more do you need?
that's what i was thinking. he's jumping INTO the contact and shot chucking, which is definitely in the same family of moves as Harden's foul baiting. Even if the refs have to call lit a foul, I'd like for them to stop calling it as a shooting foul, because it's getting ridiculous. Embiid is taking Harden's foul baiting and changing it slightly for himself and it's infuriating to watch
@@AndrewH1994it’s technically not deemed jumping into him, because he doesn’t change direction or anything, In my opinion embiid should getting called for the foul, but he’s very much riding the grey area of the rules
@@johnredelfs6115 Actually he does change direction (looking at 3:22). But you're right that he isn't technically jumping into him. The rule states that a player has a right to be on the court. That means the first player to a spot has the right to be there, and if another player prevents the original player from being in a legally held position on the floor (by crashing into them), that is a foul. The question is, what constitutes a legally held position on the court? For the defense, that is answered by what the rulebook calls "Legal Guarding Position", a technical definition that establishes a player's cone.
All that to say, it's not a grey area at all - it's rather explicit in the rulebook, which why Ronnie is so confident in making the calls he's making. Notice that he didn't hedge anything in his answers, unlike in some other videos that Coach Nick has done with him.
@@AndrewH1994 I think coach explained it very well in the video. The offensive player is driving and the defensive player is sliding their feet to beat them to the spot. It’s like two vectors converging at the same spot. In the clips shown, Embiid usually beats them to the spot and contact occurs before the defender is in legal guarding position. Embiid is smart enough to rise up for the shot when he feels the illegal contact. Coincidentally, this season I haven’t seen as much foul baiting at all from Embiid in games. At most there is 1 grey play in every couple games. He is getting much more fts this year from aggressively crashing the O boards, grabbing the rebound and getting hacked on the way back up.
I'm sorry. That doesn't make sense at 2:10 Embiid hasn't gathered the ball yet and initiates contact. That means no score, baseline.
Also, stepping off one foot can indeed help with bringing the defender off-rhytm. However, it seems like you're focused on the contact, not if the defender is doing something wrong.
Offense can do all kinds of things, but if defense is doing nothing weird, any contact, weird movement, etc by the offensive player is *his* problem.
You'd be right if it was a shooting foul, but on a drive having 2 hands on the ball is irrelevant. Normal shooting motion on a jumpshot is 2 hands on the ball. Layups are constantly done with one hand, same with hook shots. If embiid is in the paint, it absolutely should be free throws if he's making any sort of a scoring attempt.
And as for Embiid "initiating the contact", you're 100% right! The issue is that Allen has his arm extended out directly in the path of embiid's drive across his body. That's terrible defense, and absolutely makes him vulnerable to this exact legal maneuver. It's not like Embiid is swinging his arms out a mile infront of him - he's bringing them directly up. Where is the responsibility on the defender to not have your arms extended out of your cone?
@@michaeljansz4346 The yap-yap about this play fails to distinguish between two possible calls. If the call is the defender's left arm coning down on Embiid's off arm then the body contact doesn't matter. Impeding Embiid's forward motion, and the movement of that hand to the ball, is a foul, period. But the commentary by Coach Nick says it's the body contact that can't be ignored. But that was caused by Embiid turning his path into the defender's chest, maybe not enough to be a charge but the contact absolutely ought to have been ignored.
@@michaeljansz4346 players can't have it both ways. They allow a lot of carrying (which we do) because embiid could've continued with a spin dribble as well. But you claim he can go up in his zero step, get contact, get two shots, *and if there was no contact he could've continued dribbling to throw the defense off guard*. Nope, just a foul and a player embellishing a shot afterwards.
@@cptfwiffo Why are you arguing? That's literally in the rule book.
@@ballinboxer3676 the point is, he initiated contact while it couldn't be established that he ended his dribble. I'm not arguing the foul, I'm arguing that there was no shooting motion, since you can't be both dribbling and shooting
The game I love is ruined. These legal fouls are ridiculous
Ronnie Nunn is lying, Dean Wade was in his spot, Embiid leaned into him. The refs defined the spot they were going to wrong because Embiid leaned his body unnaturally to force contact. If you lean or put your arms outside the path your legs are going you should NEVER get a call when the contact is not clearly the defenders fault for reaching
On first glance, I would have to agree, but take a look at Dean Wade’s foot when the “shot” was up. It was over Embiid’s, indicating that technically, Embiid beat him there. Not to say this SHOULD be the case, but this does happen to be legal.
@@aneeshramakrishnan1958 99% of the people here don't care about the reason or what the difference is, they're here to circlejerk and collect likes whether it's a legit foul like with Dean, or not with the foul featuring AD. Stop trying to be reasonable with a bunch of yappers.
@@UncleJrueForTueexactly
What are you talking about? Wade wasn't even in the spot. At 3:10 you can clearly see that Wade's feet aren't set as contact is initiated and their feet are basically touching. Thus, neither was Wade "in his spot" nor did Embiid "lean into him" nor did the officials "defined the spot spot wrong". The officials called the play correctly.
And for context, I am a Celtics fan and have no reason to like Embiid or the Sixers.
Cant be n1 cause embiid Did travel after foul so only in NBA IF embiid you Can get both
Its still foul baiting. The defender is allowed to to sideways or backwards while maintining LGP. Embiid is initiating contact while the defender has legal gaurding position. If i bump into someone their body will react, which can then hit me for a shooting foul? Should be a lot more no-calls. If he full bumps into people to bait this out it would even be offensive fouls IMO.
The league also seems to have a problem since people like Embiid gets these calls while someone like KAT or Jokic doesnt. And dont even get started about what people can do to Steph without getting a whistle.
KAT or Jokic haven't mastered foul-baiting like Embiid has. Which is the point of this video.
Also a lot of it is him beating people to a spot and then them sliding.
i think what frustrates people is that so much of embiid's game is him making moves to get free throws, not to score the basketball. because he exaggerates, he gets so many more free throws than non-flopping players who are playing to get buckets and not free throws. it's not ethical and the nba shouldn't reward it; change the rules to incentivize people to score without getting to the free throw line.
Cut it out. Most of his points come from fga. who are you to call it unethical? How is tricking everyone into fouling him considered unethical? Stop crying you not a child.
Dumbest shit I read all day
Embiid haters never fail to make me laugh. I guarantee you never watch full games of Philly but only some few highlights….
theres a difference between selling a call and flopping but they are different rooms in the same house
The comments on this thread are absolutely horrible.
you say embiid gets there first while showing a clip where the defender is clearly there first, embiid just jumps into him. I don't have a horse in this fight, its just odd to be told one thing, while the exact opposite is being shown for me to see with my own peepers.
Yes and no. The issue isn't just whether or not Embiid was beaten to the spot, the issue is also the fact that Dean Wade was still in motion while doing getting to that point. If two trains are crossing paths at the same time of course there's going to be a collision. It's just that in this case the benefit of the doubt goes to the offensive player. If Dean was in his postion and more stationary than the slowed down to a fraction of a second replay, Embiid's charmin ultra soft behind would be called for flopping(as he should).
@@UncleJrueForTue the contact wasn't created by a moving blocker tho, it was created by an offensive player jumping into a defensive player and then throwing the ball in the direction of the back board. maybe that isn't illegal in basketball, but im down for a embiid rule, like the harden rule, to stop foul baiting in "toss up situations" that aren't really toss ups, they just appear as such in the moment.
@@noconsent Contact was created by both of them colliding into each other. If anything a rule should be made to call out of bounds reset to the ball(no shot clock change) OR to initiate a jump ball if there's reasonable doubt against the offensive player.
cry bro let it all out.I love when Embiid gets his flowers for being an expert at drawing fouls
He's not playing basketball, he's playing the refs.
He’s a playing a game as defined by rules and like every single great player in every single field or profession he is bending the rules to his favor.
@@Byronic19134Facts.
Playing the refs to enforce the rules that the NBA defined to enhance scoring? Sounds like you should be angry at the NBA
The refs don't make the rules, he's literally ONLY playing the game.
@@Byronic19134 Embiid is a soft, flopping loser that chokes when he doesn't get his ticky-tack calls and when his begging doesn't work. Beggar MVP.
It doesn't matter what foot he went off of if he initiated the contact. On the Cavs footage you can clearly see Embiid moving perpendicular into the defender. That's a charge. Nice try but red herring. "Guard skills" is the new crab dribble for the apologists I guess.
I assume you mean 3:22. Embiid does initiate contact, but it's about who has priority for that position on the court at that time. There is a very specific definition of what a "legal guarding position" is in the rulebook. If the defender arrives at a spot, but isn't in that position at the time of contact, the priority for the spot goes to the offensive player. The Cavs defender didn't have time to get into this position as ascribed in the rulebook, and as such Nunn asys that Embiid "beat him to the spot", giving which correctly awards Embiid with priority in that instance.
You might think that the rule is dumb, which is completely fair for you to have that opinion! I'm just disputing your assertion that the wrong call was made, as according to the rulebook, it was indeed a block.
You're just flat out wrong. The garden rule was made because he's the one initiating contact. Embiid here is doing the same by jumping early. Its the travelling/foot version of harden hooking his arms. It's like he's hooking the defender with his entire body.
My problem is that while there's contact it's not enough for a call. For other players like Kat the contact is seen as incidental or created by the offensive player so they don't call anything unless they get mauled. Players like Embiid and AD get the whistle for the slightest bump
I don’t know about that, so many of these calls have the kind of contact a ref simply cannot ignore
Exactly.
@@bballbreakdown I agree they should be called. What I'm saying is that other players get this level of contact without a call so it's incredibly inconsistent. Guys like Kat and Jokic are reffed very differently than Embiid and AD. When kat flails around it's seen as him creating the contact and being out of control. When Embiid does it he gets a whistle. Jokic has to be murdered to get a call while AD usually just trips over half the time
@@bballbreakdownThe refs shouldn't be so soft. When you play basketball growing up you call your own fouls and you will get called a bitch if you call to many . Then when you play organized basketball you get rewarded for the non sense .
Stop lying to yourself. Only hurting you.
It's irrelevant why the referees are twisting the rule book to give the foul to the defender when the offensive player initiates and controls all the contact. In the clip, the defender, although keeping pace, is in a legal guarding position and makes no move towards Embiid to impede him; in fact, his verticality is perfect. But the referees have abandoned the principle that the defender has a right to his current position on the floor, and the current mess of bad calls is directly a result of this. The referees have also gotten extraordinarily slack about calling contact on the ballhandler before the shot; "Lets get physical with him" is a dare to the referees to actually call all the fouls the defense will commit.
Referees have to summon the guts to actually call fouls when they occur regardless of how big whiners like Embiid and Harden complain. In each case, the principle needs to be the same core: who initiated the contact, and was it legal? Modern referees are really bad at taking the first part into account.
twisting the rule book? Did you watch the video or you just in your feelings like every casual Embiid hater? Try crying
Wrote all this dumb sh*t 😂😂
@@oreoakalaperoji8314We're not haters, you're a glazer
i cant comprehend how the cleveland play is a foul on the defender.And seing the ref watching the replay agreeing is bizarre to me.However non of these calls are made in the playoffs which explains why embiids playoff resume is cooked at this point
Exactky why he is so inconsistent in the playoffs on some of these drives you can see no intention of actually trying to make the shot
even when hes healthy he underperforms or do you want to tell me that he has always been injured in the playoffs? @@Mr.WayneJr30
@@andrewwood763 You either play or you don't. Against Boston last season he was moving great, him missing jump shots and not able to score the points against Horford and Smart had nothing to do with him being "injured". Those are just excuses for him so everyone else get blame but him. He has the worst production drop offs of any active star player, regular season vs play off's.
@@Mr.WayneJr30 He was literally dunking over the Boston players when he had the chance, he had the lift and was moving well laterally. He couldn't score over Hofford and whats even more sad he was stopped by Marcus Smart a guard on many occasions in the series, he couldn't post him up. He gets exposed every year, when the teams are playing for something.
@@andrewwood763 They will blame Maxi and Nurse for another failure.
@@Mr.WayneJr30 Are you engaged to embiid or something?... Btw pretty much everyone is injured in some way in the playoffs, but sure he gets hurt a little more than other players, after 10 yrs that cant be an excuse, at this point thats just who he is. That does'nt excuse the "MVP" of the league getting clamped by 37 yr old Al Horford, or throwing his entire team except harden under the bus after combining for idk like 20 points on trash FG% (referring to game 7 vs celtics last year) but he probably just had a broken nose, which is impossible to play basketball with, right?... (Sry if im to mean, i just cant stand him)
It's the unnatural exaggeration of contact for me. The Indiana drive he flops backwards to exaggerate the contact. Guys like austin reeves do it all the time and get rewarded
Expose that free throw merchant
this is going to hurt embiid later in his career just like it did james harden. kobe said this foul baiting tactic is not winning basketball. the main difference is that embiid plays great defense but he also finds himself in foul trouble at times. this is not getting him out of the 2nd round.
1. Harden declined after suffering a grade 2 hamstring strain in 2021 as he proceeded to play 53 min on it in game 7 2. Kobe is not a god and is a pretty flawed player himself
I used to watch his trainer teach foul-drawing skills on CZcams, but I can’t find it now. I do think that's one of the skills he learned and practiced. Most 76ers fans don't mind if it’s ethical hoops as long as it works and they're winning games in regular seasons
By the way, many Philly fans make their money from sports betting, which is one of the main reasons, as long as he can satisfy their betting points, that's fine.
Sixers fans appreciate a 7 foot 280lb human being who can do things barely any other players of his size/position have been able to do in the history of the game. He’s one of/if not the most dominant offensive player in the game bc less then 5 players can defend him one on one. He is an offense of himself yet no one respects him bc he baits for fouls rather then be assaulted by slow moving big men all game.
@@mattpierson3435a 7ft 280 pound center shouldn’t rely on jumpshots and free throws as much as Embiid does
@@chrilpy he gets double and triple teamed every play it’s definitely necessary do you watch the games?
@@isbelh1930 What a cynical and asinine take. "Ethical Hoops". Cheating is unethical. This whole issue is about USING the rules to your advantage, nearly the opposite to what you claim.
Siakam did this during his breakout 2019 season. He either goes up during the gather or the 1-step. It really is effective since it messes with the shot blocker's timing.
Another thing: God damn, that was an unexpected ad transition! 😂 It messed with my timing and made me jump as well! Well played, Coach. Well played. 😏
yea man, its so well done that he's the only youtuber I usually don't skip sponsors for
"It's a skill"
It's a skill to do all that and still never make the conference finals. Clearly it only boosts his own regular season numbers.
And I hope he never makes a single one.
There are three types of superstars in the NBA. The kind that get fouls called because they are superstars and the kind that don’t get fouls called because they are superstars. Curry gets grabbed all the time on off ball stuff but it doesn’t get called. Then guys like Harden and Embiid make a career out of getting fouled. Then there is LeBron. Who gets a lot of both.
For a majority of these, he basically said these guys are getting called for something that LOOKS suspicious rather than being an actual foul. How is this different than what Harden was doing before? How does the process matter, when the result is the same?
Idc what Ronnie says here, break it down any way you like, these plays still all look like complete bullshit to me. 2:00 you just explained what Harden was doing and then in the same breath he should be awarded free throws. HUH.
Is that what you got from it? the majority of these calls are suspicious? lol are you dumb or you just joking? yh they bullshit calls to yall emotional lesbians, refs have to be unbiased. Why has Embiid always gotten those calls? Cause he's a genius at drawing fouls simple.
Taking otherwise bad shots (if there was no defender contact) with the target to draw fouls is by definition foul baiting. However, this kind of exploit is not really Embiid's problem, but the NBA's problem in terms of rulings. If there is a way to exploit the system, why shouldn't he exploit it? Don't hate the player, hate the game.
Agreed
nah imma hate the player hes 300lbs and drops to the floor 20 times a game, no one else in the league is doing this bullshit.
@@sined9819 Lebron has done it, Harden has, CP3 has
@@Joshua-qc1linahh u aint fr, did u just drop the 3 most hated active nba players in the league rn to prove a point☠️ u aint smart dude stop
@@Joshua-qc1li none of the dudes you mentioned are 7ft+ and 300lbs
Imagine if Jokic got as many calls as Embiid got.
Biggest foul baiter in the world. Its so annoying. They are GIVING this man a hall of fame career.
God forbid this guy says the refs missed a call...
And this is why his he disappears and his points ppg drops significantly in the playoffs
lol the confidence in your ignorance, I love it. The Internet is your best friend you can actually look it up you know? He averages 1 less ft in the playoffs. there's a drop in fg made not free throw attempts
Some fun Joel Embiid playoff facts:
The best team he's beaten in the playoffs is the 2022 5th seed Raptors led by Siakam and FVV
He averages 22 PPG on 49.2% TS in elimination games(a 9 game sample size)
In NO playoff run has he ever averaged more assists than turnovers
He is the ONLY MVP in league history to never make the conference finals
This year, he had the biggest PPG drop from the RS to the playoffs of any MVP winning season
He turned the ball over 8 times in back to back elimination games against the Hawks in 2021
He's shot under 20% from three over his last two playoff runs
He had a worse eFG% than Russell Westbrook during the 2023 playoffs
With a chance to go up 3-1, Joel Embiid went 0-12 in the second half against the 5 seeded Hawks in game 4, including missing a wide open layup to take the lead
He got stripped by Danilo Gallnari to seal the loss in game 7
Down 3 in game 5 of the same series with 15 seconds left, he missed BOTH free throws to seal the game
All of his offensive numbers(PPG, RPG, APG, TOS, FG% 3P% FT%) are worse in the playoffs than in the regular season aside from FT%
He has only won ONE playoff series in his career where he played in all four wins(2022 vs. Toronto)
He is 0-3 in game 7s and has posted a 49% TS and 5.3 TOs a game in those 3 games
He once got swept in a series despite averaging FIFTEEN free throws per game(2020 vs. Boston)
Over the last two seasons, he has a 9.2 BPM in the regular season(box plus minus) and a 1.0 BPM in the playoffs
WORST OF ALL: HE IS 9/38 IN CLUTCH(within 5 points, last 5 minutes by NBA definition) SITUATIONS DURING HIS PLAYOFF CAREER, WITH AN UNFATHOMABLE TS% of 35.7%
Gotta love it. Thank you for your service.
those were EFFING SOFT fouls.
reason why during the playoffs, they got stunned by real contact and without a whistle
Yet it was a foul 😂
Ok sweet. I watched them play my team (thunder) and they went to the free throw line 45 times. Embid went over half of those 45. Glad I’m not the only team this happens to but this is getting ridiculous
TBF the ammount of fouls called on each team were the same 26 - 27 It's just that embiid turns his non shooting fouls into shooting fouls, which they should be since he turns them into shot attempts.
KAT for the wolves tries some of these same moves but often gets called for the Offensive foul.
You guys notice that none of Drew Hanlen’s foul merchant trainees can do anything in the playoffs? Him and Tatum aren’t the same players when it’s not in the regular season.
I watched both Celtics and Sixers games. Although they have the same trainers, Tatum doesn’t do foul baiting. Most of the time he looks to score. I think it all comes down to personal choice not the trainer.
@@isbelh1930when Tatum gets with in 0-3 feet of the rim he can sometimes try to foul bait but other than that yeah he’s pretty clean
tatum has made it to the finals, what are you talking about
@@curryking1 and he was the worst player on the court in that series
@@johnredelfs6115So was Kobe in his First Finals and 2004 Finals lol... LeBron was also the Worst player in the 2007 Finals lol.... Patrick Ewing was much worse in the Finals than Tatum was in the 2021 Finals lol.. Tatum still has done more in the Playoffs than PG13, Melo, Harden, Embiid, And he's only 25 lol....
Luka is getting hacked all night but are not getting the same calls.
Same with many others. Unfortunately if you're not flailing around and going to the ground they aren't getting the same calls
He doesn’t have the complex for protection
Luka gets his fair share of fouls he's not to far behind embiid
@@midwestent.7010 Source: I made it up. Embiid has as many free throw attempts as Kyrie and Luka combined this season. Luka averages 7.5 free throws per game and Embiid 11.8. That's 57% more free throws for Embiid. That's not even close.
Luka and Lebron are at 13.3 fts per game if you add them up. So Embiid gets more free throws than Kyrie and Luka and only 1.5 less than Lebron and Luka combined.
Luka would get way more calls if he stopped to complain and stare the refs down.
I red that so far in this season Embiid leading in PPG, but then if u remove the free throw points he is out of Top 5, that's explained a lot 😅
But did you remove the free throws for everybody champ?
@@Knitty610 Of course he didnt lol
As a sixers fan the thing that really irks me with embiid doing this is that he’s just playing for the whistle and not actually trying to make a shot. I don’t even think he realizes how big and skilled he is, if he just took the ball and tried to score it every time he’d probably draw just as many fouls simply by being a dominant paint presence, but flailing around like that won’t cut it against better defensive teams and that’s why he stinks in the playoffs
Why would you exert more effort to get the same outcome? Save your energy for when you need it the most
@@simonppp Exactly, going out in the Second Round.
Stole a historic MVP from Jokic by doing this shit
I don't have a problem with most of what Embiid is doing. I don't think these plays are nearly as egregious as what Harden used to do. My problem is when he tries to get a call instead of a bucket in crunch time
Harden drew actual fouls btw
@@thelegendoof8744 actual fouls mixed in with the majority BS calls he was getting, ok sure
@@fdub301 every foul was ethical and legitimate. He did nothing to break the rule book; he used it to his advantage which takes a ridiculously high IQ. Even now, he’s still crafty when it comes drawing fouls.
@@thelegendoof8744 just because they were within the rules doesn’t mean he was getting ‘ethical and legitimate’ calls. Maybe that explains why the rules were changed to make some of those calls offensive fouls. The fact that you even typed that is a self-report.
That ad Segway was clean as hell 😂
Coach, it's the first time since I subscribed to you, many years ago back when you surprised me with your ad transition, that you were able to surprise me again. Bravo ! You got me this time
Booker and Luka do a very similar thing to guarantee foul shots. From the top of the key they drive right and they turn the corner around the elbow. They just pick up the ball and lean in to get contact with the defender. Then they just fall away no matter how little contact there was and they get the call every time. It's the most frustrating thing I see during games.
I don’t know about Luka but Booker is very smart. He switched mode in playoffs lol. he didn’t do that much in the playoffs I think bcz he know that doesn’t work
@@Cococrisp1013 calm down buddy don’t be mad. I said I don’t know about Luka bcz I didn’t watch him play so I can’t say anything about him. That’s it.
@@Cococrisp1013 "I said I don’t know about Luka bcz I didn’t watch him play so I can’t say anything about him" - would seem to indicate that is indeed the case. I've watched a few mavs games and I think it's a both-and situation. He whines and complains, but he also gets fouled a heap without it getting called.
@@Cococrisp1013 I am a fan of pacers😂 I didn’t watch Luka play much. I watched Booker bcz he played in this playoffs that’s why I could say about him. Luka didn’t play in this playoffs. You don’t need to be this mad, if you wanna say he manipulated the rules then it’s fine I don’t care. 🤷♂️ I just said what I saw.
@@Cococrisp1013Why do you bother comment on YT if you are so agressif when someone is not agree with you or is smart enought to say that he wont talk about something hé didn t know ? But yeah you right you can also watch a 2 minutes clip of a player and talk about it.I don t know why peuple bother watching the all game ...
Justifying "foul baiting" will only continue to help further the decline of quality basketball
Foul bating is part of the game and requires high IQ to pull off. Respect the game
You have got me out guard on this ADVERTISEMENT 😂❤😂
Why are you interviewing a nba ref
You should knowthat they protecting each other
1:45 That has been absolutely fascinating and mind blowing, he studied the defense deeply and learned how to exploit it. I actually like this a lot, i want to see what kind of trick the defense could do to counter that. It can certainly make the game ugly, a competition of flopping and fouling without getting caught like is a game of Kaiji which is not very fun for the lay audience, or maybe even expert the audience.
3:44 Insane how you put defenders on a straight jacket, they literally cant use their arms. Its very good and attractive for short players to be honest.
Kaiji the ultimate survivor 😂
@@AbzAden a cultured person
The most frustrating part I think is it’s not called this way all the time. I’m at wolves fan so I’ve been watching kat for years, he has a very similar drive cadence and gets fouled in very similar ways but gets maybe 1/3 the calls embid does. If it was called this way for every player driving this way (cause he’s not the only one doing it) then I’d honestly have nothing to complain about. It’s much too subjective though imo
That one verb into manscape ad caught me way off guard. I was totally paying attention to Emblid when suddenly, out of nowhere, you hit me with how many balls he could put in the hoop. I guess free throws for you Coach?
This ad placement is the funniest and most surprising shit I’ve ever seen 😂
The premier foul merchant
This video reveals why Embiid performs terribly in the playoffs. Coz the calls don't come so easily at that time, and Embiid does these things when things get tight. Except the playoffs really starts getting tight from the second round, which is where he's perpetually been stuck.
He been hurt in the playoffs and had to play 4 on 5 offense because of ben simmons most years.
he averages same FT numbers in playoffs.
He is bad in playoffs because he chokes.
Embiid took the foul baiting lessons of Mr. Fat Suit quite well 😂
Love this show! It’s very entertaining and educational too.
Please bring Ronnie more often! He is a pure joy to listen to!
So basically, the only thing that makes defender's contact illegal is how Embiid pretends to shoot AFTER the contact. There is literally no difference between this and how Harden used to trick referees. It's so funny how the old guy is always the ultimate defender of the referees in your videos.
He’s such a great player, I really his want to like him, but it’s really hard to respect the foul baiting, flopping, blaming his coach/teammates, & lack of humbleness. That’s why I love Giannis, his Mamba mentality, humbleness, & doesn’t complain.
This topic is a bit ridiculous. Offensive players can run in any direction they want, and throw the ball towards the hoop however they want. Theres no rule about natural vs unnatural shot. As long as they aren't shoulder charging, or throwing elbows, it's fine. It's up to the defender to get in legal position, take a charge properly, and/or get their bodies and hands out of the way of offensive players to avoid fouling. Embiid isnt getting away with anything... You cant run side by side with a attacker, and then wonder why youve gotten a blocking foul when attacker decides to change direction toward the hoop. Get to the spot with feet set, or get out of the way!
Fun facts: Joel embiid goes to the free throw line more than Nikola jokic.
Everyone knows that😂😅 don’t need to emphasize this
Fun fact: Embiid has more free throw attempts this season than Luka and Kyrie combined.
Jokic got tossed out when he didn’t agree with the call last time 😅
So he is a elite flopper got it
Master at drawing fouls, A skill
he is making travelings and stepss like crazy and refs love him , Jokic finish games with red handsa and scraches
The thing that really gets me is the "Kick out" motion, where the shooter kicks his legs out hitting his defender. No calls
so change the rules? foul baiting ain't fun to watch, legal or not.
People exaggerate how much Embiid flops, he probably gets more contact they anyone else in the league with how much he works in the paint. Which means other players that aren’t strong enough to stop him foul him. Yes he flops sometimes and it gets annoying but I rarely see him gets calls like Harden used to get, with Embiid there’s contact. Even in the flops he does to sell it, there’s still contact and it would still be a foul without the extra flop.
Okay then. What about the fact that Embiid is yelling at the refs face ALL GAME LONG, even when he gets the call he wants? How long should we wait before he gets ONE fucking technical foul, while guys like porzinis practically get them for breathing too loud?
Not only does he gets bs fouls period he gets continuation on so many non shooting fouls. That’s another part that is so broken
Thats why his inconsistent in the playoffs, he is relying too much to foul calls
Idiot you can literally look it up, he averages 1 less free throw. his problem is his tendency to get injured during the playoffs. Please use your brain. I beg use it.
I do this in pickup, but not to draw contact just to get up before they expect. It’s pretty effective. I wish Joel would use it that way. Just explode off time and score. He could be just as effective that way
THAT Manscape promo was Elite!
You don’t need to watch this video. All you need to know is yes Embiid IS a foul baiter, and he will continue to flame out in the second round every year because he relies on these petty calls in the playoffs.
Losing series in 7 games isn't "flaming out"😂 silly Embiid hater 😂
@@davidbradley797123ppg and 19ppg is definitely a CHOKE...EmSHIT ain't even top 20 player when the serious basketball is being played...
Thanks!
@@davidbradley7971 look at his individual performances. The best chance he had to even make it to round 3 was with jimmy. And he played like shit in that series. His numbers will always be down in the playoffs because he relies on bad calls.
@@reillydavis1100 actually Embiid is always injured in playoffs...
All I'm gonna say is that if Luka had Embiid's whistle he would easily average 40ppg. I really hope defenders start flopping against Embiid just to see what the refs do. At the very least it would be funny seeing both players flopping like fish every play plus Embiid almost never goes for real shots when foul baiting so if the defender's flop results in a no call that would be in the defender's favor since Embiid isn't making the off balance bait shots.
Welll tell him to learn from Embiid goofy. Even after watching this video which clearly states it's a skill, some of yall seem to have learned nothing and keep up with them lazy ass brain-less comments.
Defence needs to be fixed to stop all these blowouts especially the contact around 3pt line so many non shooting fouls called outside the 3
The difference is that other players dont get the same calls that Embiid and Davies gets. I mean Jokic (despite his latest performance against GSW where he got 18 FT) gets bumps and shoves plenty but rarely gets the benefit of the call same way as Embiid and it seems it comes from him flailing less and less willing to do dramatic falls.
Don't forget Giannis. Giannis can run someone over and get the call.
You used one clip of Harden doing an arm hook on a jump shot where the vast majority of the time it was used for on the drive. The Harden rule was primarily made for Harden's use of of these movements on drives since it made it so much harder to stay with him without fouling. It's not a different situation.
Hard to watch. Cant see one foul here... Imagine if Embiid gets Jokers whistle. 😆
I think the thing with the wade play is that it's one thing to catch the defense off guard with their hand on your shooting arm (a clear foul to people watching especially in slow motion), it is another for the defense to basically be occupying their own space and sliding and playing good defense and for an offensive player to initiate contact and then pretend that the defense did something to throw odd the shot by going straight through the body. I personally think the entirety of block charge and legal guarding position needs to be rethought, because from first principles these situations are what you get. If you want a different result you can't just change something small when the issue is the concept of legal guarding position to begin with.
How about an episode where you have him talking about precedence on technical fouls
Will it work in the postseason is the question???
he averages practically the same amount of FTs in the playoffs, he just needs to play better and be healthy
He chokes every playoffs so thankfully no it won’t work
@@kaysheye7784 last year he averaged 33 ppg in the regular and then 23 ppg in the post season that’s a big drop off
has nothing to do with refereeing though, look at his FG% and the fact he's never been healthy lol. Also if you look at the teams he's lost to the most often, they were the teams that defended him the best even in the regular season (Celtics, Raptors and Heat)@@jtwavy4684
How does someone so big and tall, FALL SO MANY TIMES. Embiid is weak 🤣
Oh child
The rules should just go back to handchecking allowed for defense like in the 90s. Players in the 90s pushed off when playing on offense and the defense would allow hand checking. Both the offensive and defensive players both have there own advantage. The offensive players that push off to try to get space and the defensive player with hand checking and controlling where they want the offensive players to go. There are hardly any on the ball defenders that pressure the ball during the 24 second shot clock while putting pressure on the offensive player like lindsey hunter and that they would have to make a quick decision on a consistent basis. When teams double team the offensive players with the ball in there hands, it mostly happens closer towards the end of the game with like 2 minutes left of the 4th quarter. For example, the 90s chicago bulls would play full court pressure defense starting with scottie pippen pressuring the offensive player full court before the player reaches half court. I miss the 90s chicago bulls full court pressure defense and when the 2004 detroit pistons would try to hold teams under 70 points when playing defense. There is too much emphasis on offense and the defenders get penaltized way too easily. It gets annoying when a player on the defensive side of the ball does not bother trying to contest shots and moves out of the way to for an uncontested shot for an easy layup or dunk when it happens a majority of the time or when players don't try to draw charges by taking a charge thru the chest of the offensive player. Most of the players on offense and defense flop way too much and get away with it and it's blatantly obvious when it happens and I'm like wtf, there is barely any contact. For instance when raja bell used to play for the phoenix suns and richard hamilton played for the detroit pistons. Raja bell would always get in the way with richard hamilton when richard hamilton tried to get free from using screens for a layup or a wide open mid range jump shot. Richard hamilton most of the time would run into raja bell chest most of the time because richard hamilton got beat on the spot on defense and an offensive foul would be called on richard hamilton. I have it recorded on vhs when I used to watch the phoenix suns and the detroit pistons in the early 2000's. I would get frustrated because the offensive fouls were on richard hamilton and he would just run into raja bell chest way too much in the same game which causes an offensive foul on richard hamilton. It was when steve nash was the point guard for the phoenix suns and mike dantoni was the coach, every time the phoenix suns get the ball after the opposing team already scores the basketball, phoenix would throw quick inbounds passes as quickly possible with multiple passes to get an open player to try to get a free jump shot, layup or dunk every 5 seconds and this is the game against the early 2000's detroit pistons. The detroit pistons would turn up there defense starting in the 3rd quarter and chauncey billups was on fire and he even made a half court 3 point jump with the shot clock winding down that tayshaun prince almost lost out of bounds and hubie brown was the sports commentator for the game.
Funny transition into the ad
Come to play off he will be cooked again, he wont get as many favorable calls as he's getting it in the regular season. I think refs are doing disservice to him in the regular season because he's thinking he will get the same refereeing criteria in the play off's, he relays on those calls too much , without them he's the inefficient scorer who scores even more inefficiently in the play off's, taking all kind of bad jump shots that he can't make under the pressure.
I get why fans are upset with this, but I'll never fault a player for it. Part of being a good competitor is finding every competitive advantage. That includes understanding how the rules work, how to draw fouls and how to work the officials. This is pretty well acknowledged by NBA veterans. I can't fault Embiid for doing what most (if not all) great players do in working the rules and the refs to his advantage.
Yeah, don't hate the player, hate the game. If there is an exploit, you can't fault a player for going for it.
You're terrible.
Why do we not understand that the issue with Embiid getting these calls is simply because it is Embiid? A lot of people are annoyed with foul calls as fans because they are just fucking annoying and boring as hell to watch a game when there is 20+ FT's being shot. However, the main issue with NBA officiating and they are the worst league by far at this, and that is giving stars a ridiculous amount of calls compared to the average player. James Harden is the best example because every guard in the NBA has a clip you can find of them doing the Harden foul drawing bs and not getting a call when it is identical to what Harden did. The issue is that if Embiid is on D he ain't getting called for those fouls. The amount of superstar calls and favortism shown in NBA officiating is a joke. However, then the issue becomes if they called it like that for the entire game for every player the 76ers and Bucks would play 10 hour games.
Embiid took the juice 🧃 from Harden 😂😂😂
He is a dirty player. Why you have to injure Mitchel Robinson
fake mvp
That play like vs AD there - that's not basketball move, that's wrestling and should be an offensive foul
4:40 nice transition hhhh
I might just be weird but I actually love this part of the game. These subtle body movements and understanding of the rules and exploiting them is honestly really interesting. Seeing players master initiating contact, perfect the gather step, and then mind game the defender with the timing of both is just a unique and very practical use of already advanced skill. These are the skills that separate a good player from a great player.
You're all alone on an island bro
@@jacobsvensson8193 Hes not.