Thanks for watching this episode. I do want to point out problems with my delivery in this video so I decided to make a summary and some clarification. 1. What Hoederer is not good at and good at - Hoederer is NOT good at dealing with mobs, just like how you wouldn't want Fortress to lanehold by blocking the enemies. S1 and S2 attempt to give him that ability but they are not optimal. I tried to convey this in the video but I realize it ended up being somewhat an oversell of his weaknesses without my proper explanation. - Hoederer SHOULD BE used for dueling elites and bosses, which I admit I didn't put up enough footage for. For stun-lockable enemies go S2, and most of the time just go S3. 2. Synergy with Hoederer - The point I was trying to make was: There is no operator like Suzuran to Qiubai that can give FULL COVERAGE stun/bind to Hoederer. The closest to that IS Aak with module LV3. Though there are ones that should be mentioned so I'm gonna go over them here and their pros and cons. - Mumu S3: (+)Stable bind for 15s; (-)Clones can switch target and not always bind the same enemy, as well as 35s downtime - Ethan S2: (+)Relatively reliable bind rate for 30s, can bind multiple targets; (-)If you use him purely to support Hoederer, you loses out a big part of his attack range; If you don't, Hoederer may not be able to reach enemies bound beyond his range - Dorothy S2: (+)Flexible with timing and relatively high coverage; (-)If this target in front of Hoederer doesn't die long term, she won't be able to supplement bind due to trap placement restriction - Qiubai S3: (+)Damage supplement while providing bind with a good chance; (-)If mostly for supporting Hoederer, her bind and coverage is actually worse than Ethan S2 Sorry for the problems in delivery in this video. I did take a bit of a rush making this video, and I will look to improve in future content.
I'd love Hoederer more if by chance they'll make a module for him which gives atk range +1 or +20 aspd. Currently l enjoy making him crush boss and elites alike while hiding behind my tanks or Specter (because I often play an abyssal line up)
Many don't know this but a Hoederer is anyone who herds, breeds, or otherwise domesticates Hodors. It used to make me sad, thinking about all those unwanted Hodors wandering around all by themselves, but kind hearted Hoederers exist to give these lost souls at least a new daddy.
One important thing about his giant HP pool is that it synergizes very well with healing based on MAX HP, notably Warfarin's S1, it stabilizes him very fast, helps in scenarios where the elite mobs he's supposed to deal with are surrounded by trash mobs, kinda like in ch13, or just making him an actual laneholder. ...Still not worth the hassle, having the meta game in mind.
If he actually tried to heal Hoederer with proper medic instead of showing that 3-star healer cannot support such demanding op as Cruisher, we'd see a very different picture. Warfarin can easily keep Hoederer around 50% HP or even topped.
@@ismailabdulq1492 Ulpian was designed with the AH squad in mind. If HG chose to do the same to Hoederer imagine how broken Sarkazknights would've been.
@@aethermax4695 Yeah ironically the demand seems to be high for stage walk throughs which is the 1 kind of video I try to avoid. So every time I search Arknights it's just scrolling through screens of walk through videos to find something to watch.
It's convenient that Vendela, the new medic in the same banner, focuses on working with high HP operators which Hoederer just so has. Not really worth it but just something I find amusing
Your modules guides have been really useful to me, been planning all year to get this free sanity from drops and will updrade to L3 all 6* ops that have 2+ modules. Thanks to you sir 😊
I’ve seen him stunlock mudrock and big bob with s2, which means he would trivialize that cc map with both of them and golems if he existed back then, which is pretty funny.
I'm just gonna say it right now...if there was ever a support unit that increased damage based on an ally's max HP, Hoederer would be one of the best units with them. He is basically HSR's Blade, but in Arknights.
As for current drawback situation. He might be got ASPD module such as "increasing ASPD during block 10-20 point" and improve his sanctuary effect over 30% at stage 3. Moreover, W need father, don't skip him.
This is the first entry of this series who is about a character I'm not planning to pull for, but I still watched because you make a lovely job explaining what they can offer and what they are weak against. Thank you a ton.
I'm a bit disappointed by this review. You say multiple times how he is not good against hordes of small enemies and then mostly show him fighting hordes of small enemies. That's like showing Mizuki fight against an army of drones. And then you emphasize how his 0 defense is a huge drawback, which it is. But you never mention how enemies also have defense. When you compare a crusher's DPS against enemies with high defense no centurion or Dreadnought stands a chance in terms of DPS (aside from maybe Nearl Alter) simply because the Attack value is so large. You do show once how he only needs 3 attacks against a shield guard, but don't talk about it at all. You do say he should only be used against Elites and Bosses, which I completely agree with, but you don't go into how enemy defense is the main factor as to why. Crushers are meant to crush high defense enemies and they do that extremely well. They aren't lane holders but you treat them like they were for most of the review. I'm not disappointed by the accuracy of the review but the focus on the character's weakness instead of their strengths making it look like they have almost no strengths at all, which is at best disingenuous.
I didn't watch the whole video, only watch where I need to and I know where I need to, but I agree with you that his reviews are biased. So here's what I'll add as far as I can: - Ines is not the best buy for combo with Hoederer's 1st talent, nor Aak. The best options for Hoederer's S3 (up until his banner) are Muelsyse's S3, Qiubai, or Dorothy's S2. I would sure that those 3 can provide CC even longer than Aak or Ines. - He says that Hoederer's S3's True Dmg is not impactful, and idk if 14k total true dmg GUARANTEED is really impactful or not. - Dude just straight up ignored the whole 70s uptime in exchange for 50s downtime. He only mentioned long downtime in cons, but no sight of long uptime in pros. And 40 Initial SP/50 SP is not even a long downtime, yeah it's slightly longer than the usual 35-40 SP. - Hoederer's kit is design to synergizes with other ops, but the only time he mention synergies is during 1st talent's review.
@@congnguyennguyen2494 I agree with your points. I'd also add, Muelsyse S2 is amazing with him. The clone steals ATK and DEF and you get a clone with over 1600 ATK and 250 DEF, while S2 allows the clone to recover 5% HP/s which is HUGE because the clone also has about 6k HP.
When I discuss DPH and DPS it's always based on 0 DEF/0 RES target. It gives a unified standard to compare stats. I do agree that I kind of take it for granted that viewers can understand that high DPH = ability to deal with high DEF enemies(but I do mention this at least once in the video) and low DPS means that they dish out damage rather slow. A point that I want to convey in this video is that Hoederer should not be put in the job of typical laneholder which I see a lot of player tried to and criticized him with that standard. Instead he should be assigned the job for dueling elites and bosses where he really shines. But I get it that I may have try to ship the first part a bit too much that it seems like I'm overselling his weakness. I will definitely reflect on this and try to demonstrate my points better in the future.
@@DragonGJY If you'll allow me some additional constructive criticism, I would like to see some substantiation of some of the wording. Most notably "low DPS". What does that mean? Low can only be low compared to something high. So what is Low DPS and what is high DPS. For example his S1 and S2 are extremely similar to S1 and S2 DPS you show on your Exalter Review. Does Exalter also have Low DPS? And his S3 has 2098 DPS while for Typhon's S3 you show 2048 DPS (without module), so his number is higher (I'm comparing S3 with Typhon because you don't give a DPS number for Exalter S3). Now this point isn't about Hoederer specifically, I just mean if you could show some comparisons to other characters that would give the numbers and wording a lot more meaning.
What modules would you consider giving Hoederer (or crushers overall)? My first idea was Sanctuary as a base effect, but with Hoederer’s base talent I guess DR overall like Guardian modules could work better. Not really sure how to improve his first talent beyond just more damage, but the second one would be nice with a Healing Received increase as well. He’s got pretty plain talents yet a lot of issues so it’s hard to think about what would be a great fix. Shame he took 158 pulls to come home though… my pull plans are in shambles…
It's a small thing, but you can time the on and off of his S2M3 to get extra damage that takes advantage of his extra damage on stun that I believe makes it just barely higher dps than S1M3.
Thanks for the vid, Dragon! Know he's not the greatest, but I'd love to pull for Hoederer. Cool character and great art... but dang, global has the Arturia banner in two weeks. Gotta save for that instead 💀
This might sound really silly, but as a casual endgame player I actually feel like healing him will be a fun minigame. I wasn't going to pull for him, but I got him in 20 pulls looking for Vendela so I guess I'll play around
I got Hoederer for free on an is4 run yesterday, promoted him and only deployed him twice during the whole run, once during mudrock golem stage floor 5 and another in Instinct Contamination, man just gets decimated by running casters and running champions whenever I can't texas+eyja to save his ass. A shame since he has such a cool E2 art too.
You mention qiubai and in the same breath then says he has no support to do bind while she does bind reliably as a part of her s1. Qiubai even has a talent that gives her a 20% chance to bind on every hit(its not reliable without using her s3 but still applies it) Hoederer increase on range from his s3 matches her range to help attacking targets at her max range
The explanation of his skills is definitely appreciated as i was going to pull him anyways (coping for him since DM), thanks for the breakdown! I already have most meta ops to clear the game so I’m having a lot of fun exploiting the odd parts of the kits like making him hit Stainless’ s3 turrets to have them fire for the full s3 duration. Is it optimal? lol He’s definitely not a character for newer players or people who are interested in pushing endgame like cc high risk or high ascs in IS but he’s definitely satisfying to use as big stick hits hard
I know this is trying to look at Hoederer in a vacuum, but based on my testing throughout all chap 13 and anhelation stages, simply paring him with Ines behind him and a Ptilopsis is an insanely strong combo (obv it would be for most guards as well). Ines with s2 m3 pairs very well to keeping his lane holding abilities up to snuff. Plus the biggest reason is big sword go boom and hes cool.
I still... Don't regret pulling for him, if he's still open for synergies then I wanna play him more with Stainless, and wanqing who's soon to come, my only hope is to get enough pulls for shu
Since the six star I pulled was not Hoederer, I will definitely wait until he gets a good module since it's always all about the numbers (also🕯manifesting🕯Lord modules for CN anniversary).
off topic but I feel like ascalon should have a higher advanced impact rating. She would enable some insane but extremely rng clears with her accuracy debuff lol not to mention her cc is great
hoederer synergize well with W as well, as W skills stuns consistently and she increases dmg enemy takes while they are stunned which further improves Hoederer dps, especially with S2
also i just reached point where you say how bad S2 is compared to S1, and it is not, the additional block count makes him hit 3 enemies instead 2 (its basically DPS + 50% for crowd, like yeah on single target the dps stay same but attacking multiple enemies that 1 additional enemy dies sooner than with S1), stuns so can perma stunlock enemies like mudrock golem, and because stun is applied before dmg calculation it means every hit deals 140% dmg, so you get massive dmg thing about arknights phys dmg calculation is that physical atk is reduced flat by defense, therefore there are cases when having massive attack is better than having faster attack with healer like eyja alter hoederer can hold lane with his S2, in fact i used hoederer with S2 during last CC in prison map and he tanked everything until boss reached phase 2 half hp, its when i messed a little and hoederer lost all of hoderer skills have their usage their own advantages and drawbacks
24 pulls 1 blemishine and 2 kafka, this guy just had bad timing after his event is the anniversary and the following operator are either meta or limited
respectfully, yii was honestly not that great of an analyst. his videos were fine for general overviews, but never featured as much details like dragongjy's.
Even if he never made these deep dive analysis videos, DragonGJY is still the maintainer of the module rating sheet and module analysis videos. He's who Yii wishes he was.
@@threehoo fair point, but still, Yii was one of the more well known of character analysis style and a very entertaining one at that. and there is no written rule about successor can't be better than the predecessor. which GJY absolutely is.
Ive always wanted to ask whether the title "hindsight" makes sense? Like doesn't hindsight mean "a look back"? So with the videos looking at new operators ive always thought that it doesnt make much sense. Anyway, solid video as always
I haven't really looked into degen but to be listed as no.1 game changing operators has me now rethinking my pull plans what makes her so game changing as i know very little on her apart from she is has a similar s3 attack range as to irenes and chens
Disclaimer: This comment is my personal opinion and enjoyment, not advice for beginners or a counter to the video. Dragon's analysis is very good and hits the strengths/weaknesses of Hoederer on the head. You want the most optimal advice? Listen to the video. His S1 is quite strong. 4k+ dph every 3 attacks and heals 1500+ hp on that hit. Using Ch'en battery with it is even more fun. Heh. (Or I dare say the forbidden words, spinach, spaghetti, +sp/s for attack recovery skills) I used it for the entirety of Ch13 with the exception of Sanguinarch where I used his S3. Both skills were still lvl 7 only at the time. I did notice that Hoederer struggles to survive still in some situations with s1l7, but killing enemies was a non-issue tbh. He basically killed anything extremely comfortably since his powerstrike does such absurd damage even without masteries. A little bit of healing support is not a bad idea for sure. That being said, S1M3 is good for increasing heal and reducing the SP cost by 1. Huge HPS and DPS boost. There is no point in stopping at M1 or M2, this is a skill that wants you to go full throttle or leave it at lvl 7.
I really want to always say this for people who might hear "older characters replaced by newer ones". If this is your only gacha and the idea of that pisses you off, just know that it's way worse in a lot of other games and in fact, you can still use old characters very effectively :P.
The good older chars still hold up very well, even a few launch chars. But those who were already weak for their era or have kits which are problematic are kinda left in the dust. Tbh i dont really dislike any of the new gamebreaking chars expect Mlynar and Texas. I think those 2 have gone too far and warped content abit too much.
@@laudzaexu still thrives simply for being the best target for buff army. and even then, warfarin is usually enough to make her insane as long as the enemy's DEF is not too high she would pop up from time to time in some modern clears especially with bosses you rather kill sooner than later (like minimalist's drone)
Saying low dps is a bit misleading, since with the crushers sky high attack and how defense works being a flat reduction, they tend to have pretty comparable or even higher dps than 6* guards of different classes. A good example is blaze, as a centurion guard, who has 825 attack at max level 100% trust no module, and an attack interval of 1.2. Her dps is about 688, while Hoederer's 1656 attack with the same circumstance at a 2.5 attack interval has 662 dps, only about 26 lower than blaze. Against an enemy with around 500 defense, blaze's dps drops to 390, while hoederer stays at 462 A more accurate way of portraying the difference is that since his attack interval is so high but his attack speed so slow, he has a tendency to overkill weaker mobs, wasting a lot of his dps compared to faster attacking operators, meaning he can easily be overwhelmed by more enemies as compared to tankier ones, which is pretty much the opposite of centurions. You showed this well in the video when you displayed his s1 getting overwhelmed by a basic trash mob horde, and when you mentioned this in the hindsight review how easy it is to leak mobs between his attacks. Also, you showed it in the video but i think you should have mentioned that using aak skill 3 on hoederer during his s3 will chunk out like 60% of his hp, or almost one shot him outside of it, so be careful of that Outside of that, I think the video highlights his strengths well and his downsides pretty well, particularly that he's very weak against fast hitting or large amounts of enemies, but very strong against slow attacking and high defense enemies, especially ones that deal arts damage like the big sarkaz chain casters, sword dudes or grudgebearers , as well as how difficult it is to heal him with his 7k+ hp pool.
9:28 he talked about and showcased the difference between Aak S3 activations before/after Hoederer S3. The low dps statement seems fair given that it was made clear that Hoederer gets huge dph. Blaze is a bad comparison since she would be able to do 4 attacks or 12 hits before Hoederer even reaches 2 attacks or 4 hits (Blaze: 4.8s, 4atks x 3 enemies vs Hoederer: 5s, 2atks x 2 enemies). 12 hits vs 4 hits would easily favor Blaze for higher dps. It doesn't even account that Blaze has an amazing module that gives her way more atk and adds atkspd to her talent.
Agree completely, this is the first time I fell Dragon did very poor job of actually understanding what the unit is intended for and where are its strenghts. It makes no sense commenting on crusher being bad laneholder against fast physical ASPD. That is like commenting that most tank archetypes do bad damage. Indeed the same with DPS - the point of Crushers is to carry physical dmg hits past huge defence stats, not to fast-shred trash.
I wonder if making a good healer that heals based on HP% (with a cap to account for stuff like Surtr) would make Crushers better as you can then actually effectively use them to tank arts and trie damage as they receive more healing Also, do Crushers really have low DPS? I believe if you ignore skills then Wind Chimes and Quartz have one of the higher DPS against medium defense enemies
Warfarin S1 heals based on max HP so that synergizes well, idk about the DPS, the attack interval is really slow so it seems plausible the DPS would be low despite high DPH, but I haven't done the maths.
hey i really like the video and appreciate the recommendations, however im kinda noob and i dont know operators by their picture alone (especially unreleased ones), could someone please tell me the names of operators at 15:13 form left to right?
You Said the true damage dot is fixed at 200, does that include having the crown in IS mode or would that effect boost it? (Not that it would really be relevant anyway just curious)
I'm 2:30 minutes into the video and I want to mention something for anyone thinking he has low DPS. This is false, completely and utterly. Hoederer's attack stat is extremely high and the bonus damage gained through his skill 3 amps it up even further. The moment you put him in front of any enemies that actually have defense he will out perform lots of traditional dps units, despite having low attack speed. When you you're dealing 1700 damage in a single hit against a unit with 1000 defense you're still hitting for 700 damage. Your average "dps" unit that has high attack speed and a somewhat good damage stat will either deal little or no damage against these units without excess buffs or debuffs. Hoederer is not a swarm killer, he is made to challenge high priority enemies. So once again, this is not a low DPS unit. If you're interested in a proper analysis and breakdown of Crushers DPS go and check out BloopAK's "An Honest Discussion on Crushers" video.
No sir that is not correct. You are mistaking the term DPH and DPS. He has high ATK and can crunch high DEF enemies, that's a description for his high DPH.
sigh. yeah he either needs a substantial attack speed buff or SP regen for s1 to be 'useful' its not too bad. and s3 looks like a skill you drop and then activate 10 seconds later not waiting for it to end you pull him and redeploy him elsewhere if needed. he is most certainly not a lane holder.
i have mylnar and gavial the invincible (both are maxed E2). i may think hoederer is good, so i level him up to E1 now, should i continue or stop there?
hmmm I wonder why the -100hp/sec penalty on S3. Design wise it feels quite redundant, as redundant as a self-stun from the ulti of a certain saint from a certain 8 years long gacha game (though the devs patched it up a few years back) Hope there's a module that patch away the hp drain or simply change the stun to 100% with the hp drain.
Why are you telling that Crushers have low DPS? It is simply not true. Before any skills or talents: Hoederer 630 DPS Gavial 638 dps Blaze 637 dps NTR Knight 709 dps Skadi 676 dps Considering ASPD (Centurions have the fastest and Crushers have lowest), Crushers have better dps than Centurions and lower than Dreadnoughts. And as enemy DEF rises Crushers would eventually outdps Dreadnoughts too. VS 500 DEF enemies: Hoederer 430, Gavial 221, Blaze 220, NTR Knight 376, Skadi 343. With strongest DPS skill, talents included: Hoederer 2141 DPS (1725 vs Stun immunes) Gavial 3584 dps (but has +100 ASPD, so suffers from DEF a lot) Blaze 1400 dps (Stance) NTR Knight 1702 dps (True damage) Skadi 1929 dps So, only Gavial has significantly better DPS than Hoederer. Everyone else is either similar, or lower DPS. P.S. I forgot to add Trust and module bonuses to ATK and too lazy to redo this, sorry.
Sanctuary effects do not stack, only the strongest effect applies. It says so, if you click on the effect in talent/skill description. Still, Sanctuary means that Hoe has effective 18 Arts RES, and it will stack with arts RES buffer like Nightingale - althou I'm not sure which will be applied first - RES or Sanctuary.
Assuming she can land the stun before he hits them she’d work well. Issue is that S3 has a delay and massive cost. You have S2 which has no way to control timing and needs tiles near the enemies, or S1 which is only every 16s. Probably S2 is better, but situations where S1 can work can appear.
Old and pretty weak in current state of the game. Unless you love collabs or R6S verse, I don't see any big reason to pull for her. Ela powercreeps her hard.
If they add hp lose/sec on s3 ( maybe the sword too big and it hurts his arms ) they should add manually deactivate skill for s3 that would be nice When it comes to this kind of banner (mid-low priority) i just do pulls until i got the firts 6 star around 60 pulls and stop. Thanks for the video
As time goes on and on I still feel like Ray should be ranked higher, especially with her performance in CCB2. She's like right next to Degen if you're good at micro and timing. Granted, Degen needs close to none of that lol
Another factor is degen doesn't have any real competition for they way you want to use her while other sniper can do what ray does on a comparable level
I fell you didn't do good job of actually understanding (or at least explaining) what the unit is intended for and where are its strenghts. It makes no sense commenting on crusher being bad tank for fast physical ASPD. That is like complaining that most tank archetypes do bad damage. The same with DPS - the point of Crushers is to carry physical hits past high defence stats, not to fast-shred trash. Everyone is looking on Warfarin S1 for his healing - certainly warranted. But her S2 makes him do over 3000 dmg in one swing OUTSIDE of skills. And Im not saying, that Hoedered is great unit for general use.
![Should You Get and Build Hoederer? | Hoederer Review [Arknights]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/KVg7tRDvQbk/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for watching this episode. I do want to point out problems with my delivery in this video so I decided to make a summary and some clarification.
1. What Hoederer is not good at and good at
- Hoederer is NOT good at dealing with mobs, just like how you wouldn't want Fortress to lanehold by blocking the enemies. S1 and S2 attempt to give him that ability but they are not optimal. I tried to convey this in the video but I realize it ended up being somewhat an oversell of his weaknesses without my proper explanation.
- Hoederer SHOULD BE used for dueling elites and bosses, which I admit I didn't put up enough footage for. For stun-lockable enemies go S2, and most of the time just go S3.
2. Synergy with Hoederer
- The point I was trying to make was: There is no operator like Suzuran to Qiubai that can give FULL COVERAGE stun/bind to Hoederer. The closest to that IS Aak with module LV3. Though there are ones that should be mentioned so I'm gonna go over them here and their pros and cons.
- Mumu S3: (+)Stable bind for 15s; (-)Clones can switch target and not always bind the same enemy, as well as 35s downtime
- Ethan S2: (+)Relatively reliable bind rate for 30s, can bind multiple targets; (-)If you use him purely to support Hoederer, you loses out a big part of his attack range; If you don't, Hoederer may not be able to reach enemies bound beyond his range
- Dorothy S2: (+)Flexible with timing and relatively high coverage; (-)If this target in front of Hoederer doesn't die long term, she won't be able to supplement bind due to trap placement restriction
- Qiubai S3: (+)Damage supplement while providing bind with a good chance; (-)If mostly for supporting Hoederer, her bind and coverage is actually worse than Ethan S2
Sorry for the problems in delivery in this video. I did take a bit of a rush making this video, and I will look to improve in future content.
What about Ethan S3 + Module paired with Hoederer S3
I'd love Hoederer more if by chance they'll make a module for him which gives atk range +1 or +20 aspd.
Currently l enjoy making him crush boss and elites alike while hiding behind my tanks or Specter (because I often play an abyssal line up)
Many don't know this but a Hoederer is anyone who herds, breeds, or otherwise domesticates Hodors. It used to make me sad, thinking about all those unwanted Hodors wandering around all by themselves, but kind hearted Hoederers exist to give these lost souls at least a new daddy.
Didn't bro just donate all of his money to U official so he have to live outside until Ines came and adopted him ???
@@kingjoee6821honestly based
What is a Hodor? I tried to search it on google and it only shows me the one from GoT
@@User-zv8vz theyre joking; his name comes from a French play set in in the 1940s called Dirty Hands
When U-official in squad: Hoerder gains 500% attack bonus and starts sayin *Glory for the queen*
When U is hurt every enemies on screen instantly die
@@user-xc7ul5el8x that’s a funny part
good overview but you forgot to mention the fact that he's really handsome in his strengths category
Truth
facts
One important thing about his giant HP pool is that it synergizes very well with healing based on MAX HP, notably Warfarin's S1, it stabilizes him very fast, helps in scenarios where the elite mobs he's supposed to deal with are surrounded by trash mobs, kinda like in ch13, or just making him an actual laneholder. ...Still not worth the hassle, having the meta game in mind.
Anything is worth the hassle for husband
If he actually tried to heal Hoederer with proper medic instead of showing that 3-star healer cannot support such demanding op as Cruisher, we'd see a very different picture. Warfarin can easily keep Hoederer around 50% HP or even topped.
Ulpian laugh behind him
@@ismailabdulq1492 Ulpian was designed with the AH squad in mind. If HG chose to do the same to Hoederer imagine how broken Sarkazknights would've been.
Another great analysis video, don't know anyone else who is putting this kind of in depth knowledge out there
Cos the demand for it is low in AK (which is sad)
@@aethermax4695
Yeah ironically the demand seems to be high for stage walk throughs which is the 1 kind of video I try to avoid. So every time I search Arknights it's just scrolling through screens of walk through videos to find something to watch.
@@ian59 *and need to scroll through bilibili reposter too
Time to watch this and be reminded how poor my decisions are.
Dont forget that most the operators above him have modules alredy, And have the limited title that give thim a higher priority pull anyways.
I like how Hoederer's damage talent synergizes with each of W's stun and Ines' bind, and wanna bring the squad together, but the upcoming banners...
Huh? This is Arknights. We don't regret, we make use of who we have built.
@@mr.clevertrick8710 Any Arknights operator is meta if Doktah is brave enough
It's convenient that Vendela, the new medic in the same banner, focuses on working with high HP operators which Hoederer just so has. Not really worth it but just something I find amusing
The only thing bigger than his HP is his massive, humongous, gigantic...
Sword.
...booty
But.. nevermind.
Phew..thought you were gonna say *ass*
I can’t help but imagine his hot and steamy🥵 sparrings with Ines
Nah thats not true. Obviously you've never seen his massive commitment to being a U Official Simp.
KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK BRO !!! ❤❤❤🎉🎉🎉
I know this won’t matter for most people but Quercus S2 seems perfect for this guy’s skill cycling
Ines works well with him too
Your modules guides have been really useful to me, been planning all year to get this free sanity from drops and will updrade to L3 all 6* ops that have 2+ modules. Thanks to you sir 😊
You are easily my favourite AK CC for detailed analysis of the content. I look forward to your content every time there is a new event/patch release!
I’ve seen him stunlock mudrock and big bob with s2, which means he would trivialize that cc map with both of them and golems if he existed back then, which is pretty funny.
That CC had ATKSPD- tag :P
I love your pull priority and ratings timeline graphic! Appreciate your guides!
Always appreciate the these analyses, please keep it up!
Thank you for your hard work Mr GJY
Another greatly done episode Dragon, thank you for all the effort you put in explaining everything about the ops
love your content and clean presentation. thanks bro
Great analysis as always
I'm just gonna say it right now...if there was ever a support unit that increased damage based on an ally's max HP, Hoederer would be one of the best units with them. He is basically HSR's Blade, but in Arknights.
In a way, Lava2 and Vendela help those with the highest max HP deal more damage… not exactly the same.
@@slonik0002 I suppose so, but I mean like a buffer. Maybe something of the same caliber as Warfarin S2, for example.
Virtuosa S3 buffs, kinda.
I would say you cooked, but you never seem to stop cooking to begin witg🔥🔥
I hope you continue making content for Arknights. Your analyses are really helpful! ❤
As for current drawback situation. He might be got ASPD module such as "increasing ASPD during block 10-20 point" and improve his sanctuary effect over 30% at stage 3. Moreover, W need father, don't skip him.
This is the first entry of this series who is about a character I'm not planning to pull for, but I still watched because you make a lovely job explaining what they can offer and what they are weak against. Thank you a ton.
I'm a bit disappointed by this review. You say multiple times how he is not good against hordes of small enemies and then mostly show him fighting hordes of small enemies. That's like showing Mizuki fight against an army of drones.
And then you emphasize how his 0 defense is a huge drawback, which it is. But you never mention how enemies also have defense.
When you compare a crusher's DPS against enemies with high defense no centurion or Dreadnought stands a chance in terms of DPS (aside from maybe Nearl Alter) simply because the Attack value is so large.
You do show once how he only needs 3 attacks against a shield guard, but don't talk about it at all.
You do say he should only be used against Elites and Bosses, which I completely agree with, but you don't go into how enemy defense is the main factor as to why.
Crushers are meant to crush high defense enemies and they do that extremely well.
They aren't lane holders but you treat them like they were for most of the review.
I'm not disappointed by the accuracy of the review but the focus on the character's weakness instead of their strengths making it look like they have almost no strengths at all, which is at best disingenuous.
I didn't watch the whole video, only watch where I need to and I know where I need to, but I agree with you that his reviews are biased. So here's what I'll add as far as I can:
- Ines is not the best buy for combo with Hoederer's 1st talent, nor Aak. The best options for Hoederer's S3 (up until his banner) are Muelsyse's S3, Qiubai, or Dorothy's S2. I would sure that those 3 can provide CC even longer than Aak or Ines.
- He says that Hoederer's S3's True Dmg is not impactful, and idk if 14k total true dmg GUARANTEED is really impactful or not.
- Dude just straight up ignored the whole 70s uptime in exchange for 50s downtime. He only mentioned long downtime in cons, but no sight of long uptime in pros. And 40 Initial SP/50 SP is not even a long downtime, yeah it's slightly longer than the usual 35-40 SP.
- Hoederer's kit is design to synergizes with other ops, but the only time he mention synergies is during 1st talent's review.
@@congnguyennguyen2494 I agree with your points.
I'd also add, Muelsyse S2 is amazing with him.
The clone steals ATK and DEF and you get a clone with over 1600 ATK and 250 DEF, while S2 allows the clone to recover 5% HP/s which is HUGE because the clone also has about 6k HP.
@@congnguyennguyen2494Ethan is a way better source of bind for Hoederer than Dorothy and Chew-bye
When I discuss DPH and DPS it's always based on 0 DEF/0 RES target. It gives a unified standard to compare stats. I do agree that I kind of take it for granted that viewers can understand that high DPH = ability to deal with high DEF enemies(but I do mention this at least once in the video) and low DPS means that they dish out damage rather slow.
A point that I want to convey in this video is that Hoederer should not be put in the job of typical laneholder which I see a lot of player tried to and criticized him with that standard. Instead he should be assigned the job for dueling elites and bosses where he really shines. But I get it that I may have try to ship the first part a bit too much that it seems like I'm overselling his weakness. I will definitely reflect on this and try to demonstrate my points better in the future.
@@DragonGJY If you'll allow me some additional constructive criticism, I would like to see some substantiation of some of the wording. Most notably "low DPS". What does that mean? Low can only be low compared to something high. So what is Low DPS and what is high DPS.
For example his S1 and S2 are extremely similar to S1 and S2 DPS you show on your Exalter Review. Does Exalter also have Low DPS? And his S3 has 2098 DPS while for Typhon's S3 you show 2048 DPS (without module), so his number is higher (I'm comparing S3 with Typhon because you don't give a DPS number for Exalter S3).
Now this point isn't about Hoederer specifically, I just mean if you could show some comparisons to other characters that would give the numbers and wording a lot more meaning.
What modules would you consider giving Hoederer (or crushers overall)? My first idea was Sanctuary as a base effect, but with Hoederer’s base talent I guess DR overall like Guardian modules could work better. Not really sure how to improve his first talent beyond just more damage, but the second one would be nice with a Healing Received increase as well. He’s got pretty plain talents yet a lot of issues so it’s hard to think about what would be a great fix.
Shame he took 158 pulls to come home though… my pull plans are in shambles…
A boost to healing received would be very welcomed.
It's a small thing, but you can time the on and off of his S2M3 to get extra damage that takes advantage of his extra damage on stun that I believe makes it just barely higher dps than S1M3.
You are the goat, mister D!
Thanks for the vid, Dragon! Know he's not the greatest, but I'd love to pull for Hoederer. Cool character and great art... but dang, global has the Arturia banner in two weeks. Gotta save for that instead 💀
I wonder a showcase of him using max S1 with ch'en and stainless sp device it would be fun
its funny to see but not that amazing.
imo only need ch'en to really see it in action.
@@ASTUFILLON5 his first skill hit harder than the 3rd thats about it
This might sound really silly, but as a casual endgame player I actually feel like healing him will be a fun minigame. I wasn't going to pull for him, but I got him in 20 pulls looking for Vendela so I guess I'll play around
My man you are single handedly carrying ak youtube content for me. Keep it up 👍
I got Hoederer for free on an is4 run yesterday, promoted him and only deployed him twice during the whole run, once during mudrock golem stage floor 5 and another in Instinct Contamination, man just gets decimated by running casters and running champions whenever I can't texas+eyja to save his ass. A shame since he has such a cool E2 art too.
Thx à lot for this new operator review
they need to give eben 3 mod to make him good. i will be waiting for hoederer
You mention qiubai and in the same breath then says he has no support to do bind while she does bind reliably as a part of her s1.
Qiubai even has a talent that gives her a 20% chance to bind on every hit(its not reliable without using her s3 but still applies it)
Hoederer increase on range from his s3 matches her range to help attacking targets at her max range
Thanks!
The explanation of his skills is definitely appreciated as i was going to pull him anyways (coping for him since DM), thanks for the breakdown!
I already have most meta ops to clear the game so I’m having a lot of fun exploiting the odd parts of the kits like making him hit Stainless’ s3 turrets to have them fire for the full s3 duration. Is it optimal? lol
He’s definitely not a character for newer players or people who are interested in pushing endgame like cc high risk or high ascs in IS but he’s definitely satisfying to use as big stick hits hard
This video has such high production quality, from the analysis to the motion graphics amd editing.
Love your work as usual!
I know this is trying to look at Hoederer in a vacuum, but based on my testing throughout all chap 13 and anhelation stages, simply paring him with Ines behind him and a Ptilopsis is an insanely strong combo (obv it would be for most guards as well). Ines with s2 m3 pairs very well to keeping his lane holding abilities up to snuff. Plus the biggest reason is big sword go boom and hes cool.
Thanks for the video! Saving this for future if I get him off rate later.
I still... Don't regret pulling for him, if he's still open for synergies then I wanna play him more with Stainless, and wanqing who's soon to come, my only hope is to get enough pulls for shu
poor guts even struggles in arknights
Since the six star I pulled was not Hoederer, I will definitely wait until he gets a good module since it's always all about the numbers (also🕯manifesting🕯Lord modules for CN anniversary).
off topic but I feel like ascalon should have a higher advanced impact rating. She would enable some insane but extremely rng clears with her accuracy debuff lol not to mention her cc is great
Ascalon's rating can see more changes, it's still relatively early for conclusions
It may change in the future, it's hard to rate an operator in a short amount of time, wait 3 months at least.
thank you so much for the video
Ines and Warfarin seem to be his best friends.
Honestly fitting since all of them are Sarkaz :v
@@mochalatte8362Ines is not sarkaz
Technically penance has more hp because of her barrier
hoederer synergize well with W as well, as W skills stuns consistently and she increases dmg enemy takes while they are stunned which further improves Hoederer dps, especially with S2
also i just reached point where you say how bad S2 is compared to S1, and it is not, the additional block count makes him hit 3 enemies instead 2 (its basically DPS + 50% for crowd, like yeah on single target the dps stay same but attacking multiple enemies that 1 additional enemy dies sooner than with S1), stuns so can perma stunlock enemies like mudrock golem, and because stun is applied before dmg calculation it means every hit deals 140% dmg, so you get massive dmg
thing about arknights phys dmg calculation is that physical atk is reduced flat by defense, therefore there are cases when having massive attack is better than having faster attack
with healer like eyja alter hoederer can hold lane with his S2, in fact i used hoederer with S2 during last CC in prison map and he tanked everything until boss reached phase 2 half hp, its when i messed a little and hoederer lost
all of hoderer skills have their usage their own advantages and drawbacks
24 pulls 1 blemishine and 2 kafka, this guy just had bad timing after his event is the anniversary and the following operator are either meta or limited
i've had this feeling for a long time.
he is Yii successor.
respectfully, yii was honestly not that great of an analyst. his videos were fine for general overviews, but never featured as much details like dragongjy's.
@@threehoo 100% agree with you
dont bring dragonj down to yii's level
Even if he never made these deep dive analysis videos, DragonGJY is still the maintainer of the module rating sheet and module analysis videos. He's who Yii wishes he was.
@@threehoo fair point, but still, Yii was one of the more well known of character analysis style and a very entertaining one at that.
and there is no written rule about successor can't be better than the predecessor. which GJY absolutely is.
Ive always wanted to ask whether the title "hindsight" makes sense? Like doesn't hindsight mean "a look back"? So with the videos looking at new operators ive always thought that it doesnt make much sense. Anyway, solid video as always
It's probably because he primarily plays on CN and not global.
I know I shouldn’t pull for him but I love Sarkaz
I haven't really looked into degen but to be listed as no.1 game changing operators has me now rethinking my pull plans what makes her so game changing as i know very little on her apart from she is has a similar s3 attack range as to irenes and chens
Excellent video that offers an unbiased perspective on a new operator. Thank you.
Disclaimer: This comment is my personal opinion and enjoyment, not advice for beginners or a counter to the video. Dragon's analysis is very good and hits the strengths/weaknesses of Hoederer on the head. You want the most optimal advice? Listen to the video.
His S1 is quite strong. 4k+ dph every 3 attacks and heals 1500+ hp on that hit.
Using Ch'en battery with it is even more fun. Heh.
(Or I dare say the forbidden words, spinach, spaghetti, +sp/s for attack recovery skills)
I used it for the entirety of Ch13 with the exception of Sanguinarch where I used his S3. Both skills were still lvl 7 only at the time.
I did notice that Hoederer struggles to survive still in some situations with s1l7, but killing enemies was a non-issue tbh. He basically killed anything extremely comfortably since his powerstrike does such absurd damage even without masteries.
A little bit of healing support is not a bad idea for sure.
That being said, S1M3 is good for increasing heal and reducing the SP cost by 1. Huge HPS and DPS boost. There is no point in stopping at M1 or M2, this is a skill that wants you to go full throttle or leave it at lvl 7.
Thank you sensei
I really want to always say this for people who might hear "older characters replaced by newer ones". If this is your only gacha and the idea of that pisses you off, just know that it's way worse in a lot of other games and in fact, you can still use old characters very effectively :P.
The good older chars still hold up very well, even a few launch chars. But those who were already weak for their era or have kits which are problematic are kinda left in the dust. Tbh i dont really dislike any of the new gamebreaking chars expect Mlynar and Texas. I think those 2 have gone too far and warped content abit too much.
Yeah I play other gacha games and in less 6 months(the worst in 3-4 months for meta) the older characters are kinda unusable in a lot contents..
@@CryptidFlame yeah, sad to see siege, exu, and ange is kinda unreliable to use for new content (alas for exu there's many ops that can support her)
@@laudza siege and ange were already falling off before these new age operators.....
@@laudzaexu still thrives simply for being the best target for buff army. and even then, warfarin is usually enough to make her insane as long as the enemy's DEF is not too high
she would pop up from time to time in some modern clears especially with bosses you rather kill sooner than later (like minimalist's drone)
he seems to have a really decent synergy with perfumer, and definitely ethan's bindlock helps him
Saying low dps is a bit misleading, since with the crushers sky high attack and how defense works being a flat reduction, they tend to have pretty comparable or even higher dps than 6* guards of different classes. A good example is blaze, as a centurion guard, who has 825 attack at max level 100% trust no module, and an attack interval of 1.2. Her dps is about 688, while Hoederer's 1656 attack with the same circumstance at a 2.5 attack interval has 662 dps, only about 26 lower than blaze. Against an enemy with around 500 defense, blaze's dps drops to 390, while hoederer stays at 462
A more accurate way of portraying the difference is that since his attack interval is so high but his attack speed so slow, he has a tendency to overkill weaker mobs, wasting a lot of his dps compared to faster attacking operators, meaning he can easily be overwhelmed by more enemies as compared to tankier ones, which is pretty much the opposite of centurions. You showed this well in the video when you displayed his s1 getting overwhelmed by a basic trash mob horde, and when you mentioned this in the hindsight review how easy it is to leak mobs between his attacks.
Also, you showed it in the video but i think you should have mentioned that using aak skill 3 on hoederer during his s3 will chunk out like 60% of his hp, or almost one shot him outside of it, so be careful of that
Outside of that, I think the video highlights his strengths well and his downsides pretty well, particularly that he's very weak against fast hitting or large amounts of enemies, but very strong against slow attacking and high defense enemies, especially ones that deal arts damage like the big sarkaz chain casters, sword dudes or grudgebearers , as well as how difficult it is to heal him with his 7k+ hp pool.
9:28 he talked about and showcased the difference between Aak S3 activations before/after Hoederer S3. The low dps statement seems fair given that it was made clear that Hoederer gets huge dph. Blaze is a bad comparison since she would be able to do 4 attacks or 12 hits before Hoederer even reaches 2 attacks or 4 hits (Blaze: 4.8s, 4atks x 3 enemies vs Hoederer: 5s, 2atks x 2 enemies). 12 hits vs 4 hits would easily favor Blaze for higher dps. It doesn't even account that Blaze has an amazing module that gives her way more atk and adds atkspd to her talent.
DPS =/ DPHit guy 😅and no one use phys dmg for big def enemy just use some art guard, that the point.
Agree completely, this is the first time I fell Dragon did very poor job of actually understanding what the unit is intended for and where are its strenghts. It makes no sense commenting on crusher being bad laneholder against fast physical ASPD. That is like commenting that most tank archetypes do bad damage.
Indeed the same with DPS - the point of Crushers is to carry physical dmg hits past huge defence stats, not to fast-shred trash.
I wonder if making a good healer that heals based on HP% (with a cap to account for stuff like Surtr) would make Crushers better as you can then actually effectively use them to tank arts and trie damage as they receive more healing
Also, do Crushers really have low DPS? I believe if you ignore skills then Wind Chimes and Quartz have one of the higher DPS against medium defense enemies
Warfarin S1 heals based on max HP so that synergizes well, idk about the DPS, the attack interval is really slow so it seems plausible the DPS would be low despite high DPH, but I haven't done the maths.
I cam back to the game after 2 months only to get him because of Ines. Will be back for Virtuosa
hey i really like the video and appreciate the recommendations, however im kinda noob and i dont know operators by their picture alone (especially unreleased ones), could someone please tell me the names of operators at 15:13 form left to right?
Left to right top to bottom in case someone still needs it: Hoederer, Virtuosa, Viviana, Degenbrecher, Ray, Shu, Zuo Le, Ela, Ascalon
You Said the true damage dot is fixed at 200, does that include having the crown in IS mode or would that effect boost it? (Not that it would really be relevant anyway just curious)
The relic can buff the damage.
@@DragonGJY sick I'll take my +100 damage to the bank (I think it's 1.5x right? Can't remember hardly see that thing). Thanks for quick reply
@@13jrohrer ye, so it's just 500 true damage
@@Vadikus2424 ahh right. Hmm it's actually kinda ok then. Still probably not worth the guard voucher ever but maybe I force it for giggles
since Ash will have rerun and might no return ever. I would advise to consider her if ppl havent gotten her.
I'm 2:30 minutes into the video and I want to mention something for anyone thinking he has low DPS. This is false, completely and utterly. Hoederer's attack stat is extremely high and the bonus damage gained through his skill 3 amps it up even further. The moment you put him in front of any enemies that actually have defense he will out perform lots of traditional dps units, despite having low attack speed. When you you're dealing 1700 damage in a single hit against a unit with 1000 defense you're still hitting for 700 damage. Your average "dps" unit that has high attack speed and a somewhat good damage stat will either deal little or no damage against these units without excess buffs or debuffs. Hoederer is not a swarm killer, he is made to challenge high priority enemies.
So once again, this is not a low DPS unit. If you're interested in a proper analysis and breakdown of Crushers DPS go and check out BloopAK's "An Honest Discussion on Crushers" video.
No sir that is not correct. You are mistaking the term DPH and DPS. He has high ATK and can crunch high DEF enemies, that's a description for his high DPH.
Hope his Module in the future can save Crusher archetype
Booogie Woogie!
sigh. yeah he either needs a substantial attack speed buff or SP regen for s1 to be 'useful' its not too bad.
and s3 looks like a skill you drop and then activate 10 seconds later not waiting for it to end you pull him and redeploy him elsewhere if needed.
he is most certainly not a lane holder.
i have mylnar and gavial the invincible (both are maxed E2). i may think hoederer is good, so i level him up to E1 now, should i continue or stop there?
Kinda regret for pulling him but i had to complete the gang. Oh well, it's fine, im fine :")
hmmm I wonder why the -100hp/sec penalty on S3.
Design wise it feels quite redundant, as redundant as a self-stun from the ulti of a certain saint from a certain 8 years long gacha game (though the devs patched it up a few years back)
Hope there's a module that patch away the hp drain or simply change the stun to 100% with the hp drain.
A comment for the algorithm
Why are you telling that Crushers have low DPS? It is simply not true.
Before any skills or talents:
Hoederer 630 DPS
Gavial 638 dps
Blaze 637 dps
NTR Knight 709 dps
Skadi 676 dps
Considering ASPD (Centurions have the fastest and Crushers have lowest), Crushers have better dps than Centurions and lower than Dreadnoughts. And as enemy DEF rises Crushers would eventually outdps Dreadnoughts too. VS 500 DEF enemies: Hoederer 430, Gavial 221, Blaze 220, NTR Knight 376, Skadi 343.
With strongest DPS skill, talents included:
Hoederer 2141 DPS (1725 vs Stun immunes)
Gavial 3584 dps (but has +100 ASPD, so suffers from DEF a lot)
Blaze 1400 dps (Stance)
NTR Knight 1702 dps (True damage)
Skadi 1929 dps
So, only Gavial has significantly better DPS than Hoederer. Everyone else is either similar, or lower DPS.
P.S. I forgot to add Trust and module bonuses to ATK and too lazy to redo this, sorry.
Does Sanctuary stack? If yes, Quercus & co. will have found a buddy.
Sanctuary effects do not stack, only the strongest effect applies. It says so, if you click on the effect in talent/skill description.
Still, Sanctuary means that Hoe has effective 18 Arts RES, and it will stack with arts RES buffer like Nightingale - althou I'm not sure which will be applied first - RES or Sanctuary.
I spent 3 tickets rolling for him and i regret those 3 pulls. That's how good he is.
i'm a simple man, i saw him stun lock 3 golems, i pull :3
Question how would W word with Hoederer? Because don't her skills stun?
Assuming she can land the stun before he hits them she’d work well. Issue is that S3 has a delay and massive cost. You have S2 which has no way to control timing and needs tiles near the enemies, or S1 which is only every 16s. Probably S2 is better, but situations where S1 can work can appear.
No ratings for Ash? Is it because she's an old unit? Hope you'd include her in the next video cause a bunch of players doesn't have her
Old and pretty weak in current state of the game. Unless you love collabs or R6S verse, I don't see any big reason to pull for her. Ela powercreeps her hard.
his s3 is so long, till amiya done being demon lord hoederer skill still has more than half duration.
Waiting-for-buff tier. Unless a healer comes out that focuses on giving +def much more than shining's module y, hoederer is gonna be pretty meh
Or a good crusher module.
hmm dont his DOT last until skill end?
seeing Aak decimate Hoe with S3 gave me a fright
If they add hp lose/sec on s3 ( maybe the sword too big and it hurts his arms ) they should add manually deactivate skill for s3 that would be nice
When it comes to this kind of banner (mid-low priority) i just do pulls until i got the firts 6 star around 60 pulls and stop.
Thanks for the video
.... well, he's great with Ines and W in the base!
Im gonna do Hoederer and Pallas lane combo aside Ines 3:52
As time goes on and on I still feel like Ray should be ranked higher, especially with her performance in CCB2. She's like right next to Degen if you're good at micro and timing. Granted, Degen needs close to none of that lol
Another factor is degen doesn't have any real competition for they way you want to use her while other sniper can do what ray does on a comparable level
crushers actually have more dps than most characters especially if you take into account that there's almost no enemies with 0 def
his second talent really need to do more instead of just giving him small sactuary effect
I fell you didn't do good job of actually understanding (or at least explaining) what the unit is intended for and where are its strenghts.
It makes no sense commenting on crusher being bad tank for fast physical ASPD. That is like complaining that most tank archetypes do bad damage.
The same with DPS - the point of Crushers is to carry physical hits past high defence stats, not to fast-shred trash.
Everyone is looking on Warfarin S1 for his healing - certainly warranted. But her S2 makes him do over 3000 dmg in one swing OUTSIDE of skills.
And Im not saying, that Hoedered is great unit for general use.
his skill 3 is so long, till amiya done being demon lord and his skill still half duration.
I'll bet HG will fumble the crusher module all over again.
Hoederer nerfed himself by using a sword as a weapon.
If he sits on them he would've one shotted every thing on sight.
Hoederer is a good operator with massive but(t).
he is so hot
Nice to see Vigil has company in the basement, he was getting lonely. This guy will never see action.
>never see action in my account
ftfy
Nobody gives a fuck for laneholding.
_ааааааа
you should post more videos a day