How to Build an IEM Rig Using the Behringer XR18 or Midas MR18 - In Ear Monitor Rig
Vložit
- čas přidán 9. 07. 2024
- How to build an In Ear Monitor rig using the Behringer XR18 or Midas MR18. IEMs are becoming increasingly popular for musicians. More and more bands are creating their own ear rigs so that they can go anywhere there is a provided sound system and use their own monitor rig while a tech mixes Front of House. Of course, it also works for using your own PA as well.
Besides the consistency of having the same monitor system gig to gig, there's also the efficiency that comes with the rack packaging to speed up setup and tear down. Also, with much of the rig staying connected, there's less chance for mispatches and other problems. And with proper labeling, an easier time troubleshooting if there is an issue.
Really, the process shown here could also work for the Behringer X32R as well. And the concepts work with any monitor mixing system.
While the example is using wired beltpacks, if there are wireless IEMS being used, then it's just a matter of connecting the XLR Aux outputs to the transmitters instead of the wired beltpacks.
This video is a live sound tutorial for musicians and techs wanting to understand the concept of an in ear monitor rig and how it all connects and interfaces with the house PA.
The concept of a separate monitor system with a split to the house sound system is something that has filtered down from large scale concerts and arena shows to smaller venues as the technology has reached a point that the needed equipment is in the budget of many musicians these days.
Having an ear rig is great for festival shows where setup and soundcheck time is limited, and having your own, preset in ear mons is a major time-saver and performance booster.
~~~~~~~~
►Patreon Page where Patrons have access to script files, other PDF tutorials, Behringer X32/M32/XR18/MR18 channel and scene files, and other audio production information:
/ alanhamiltonaudio
~~~~~~~~
►►Sweetwater Affiliate Links:
►ART S8 Splitter on Sweetwater
sweetwater.sjv.io/3eZKMy
►Behringer XR18 on Sweetwater:
sweetwater.sjv.io/baNBrm
►Midas MR18 on Sweetwater:
sweetwater.sjv.io/rQDKqd
►►Amazon Affiliate Links To Equip Used/Shown/Mentioned In Video-
►ART S8 Splitter on Amazon:
amzn.to/3Ys4MsU
►Seismic 16 channel Rackmount Split Snake on Amazon:
amzn.to/2YvZT7B
►Behringer MS8000 8 ch Splitter on Amazon:
amzn.to/3od1fgl
►Elite Core Fan to Fan Snake Cables on Amazon:
amzn.to/3knZb47
►ProX Racks and Cases Amazon Store:
amzn.to/3n34hoi
►Furman M-8Lx Standard Level Power Conditioning, 15 Amp, 9 Outlets with Wall Wart Spacing, Pullout Lights on Amazon:
amzn.to/3EWKlt8
►TP Link 1750 Router on Amazon:
amzn.to/3oeuXSm
►Behringer P1 In Ear Monitor Beltpack on Amazon:
amzn.to/3p5DAjU
►KZ ZS10 Pro earpieces on Amazon:
amzn.to/37Q8mnJ
►Behringer XR18 on Amazon:
amzn.to/2LfTpmO
►Neutrik Pass Through connectors (male) XLR Plug to XLR Receptacle - NA3MDF on Amazon:
amzn.to/3bZ3kqw
►Auray RS-2U Rack Shelf on Amazon:
amzn.to/3H5YEh1
►Gator Rackworks Rack Mount Universal Knockout Panel Accessory for Cable Management on Amazon:
amzn.to/3F2oKj7
►White Electrical Tape (useful as label tape) on Amazon:
amzn.to/3koPcLL
►Gaffers Tape on Amazon:
amzn.to/31P5OGg
►Shure Beta 52A Kick Drum Microphone on Amazon:
amzn.to/3D2iNBX
►Stellar X2 (Narration Mic) on Amazon:
amzn.to/3ggUWFq
"As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases."
"I can earn from affiliate link purchases but this comes at no additional charge to viewers"
~~~~~~~~
Suggested videos:
►Behringer XR18 Monitor Setup Tutorial:
• Behringer XR18 Monitor...
►Sending FX to Monitors XR18/MR18/X32/M32:
• Wondering How To Send ...
►Cable Management For Live Audio:
• 11 Tips for Stage Cabl...
►Patch Order and Input Lists For Live Sound:
• Stage Plots, Input Lis...
►In Ear Monitors On A Budget:
• In Ear Monitors On A B...
►Pro X Rack Assembly Instructions and Review:
• Assembling a ProX ATA ...
►Behringer X32 Monitor Setup Tutorial:
• Behringer X32 & Midas ...
►Top 5 Frequently Asked Questions About the XR18 (and MR18):
• Behringer XR18 Top 5 F...
►Five Tips For Better Live Vocal Mixes:
• 5 Tips For Better Live...
►5 Typical Mistakes Behringer XR18 and Midas MR18 Users Make:
• Five Typical Mistakes ...
►5 Typical Mistakes Behringer X32 and Midas M32 Users Make:
• 5 Typical Mistakes Mad...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
►Facebook Group:
/ livesoundproduction
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
#LiveSound
#AlanHamiltonAudio
#IEMRig
#InEarMonitors
0:00 Intro
0:16 What Is the Benefit of a Dedicated IEM Rig?
0:35 A Splitter is Needed for an IEM Setup
0:41 XLR Mic Splitter Explained
1:15 XR18 / MR18 Inputs
2:27 How Do I Rackmount the XR18?
3:00 What cables are needed and how to connect them
5:46 XR 18 / MR18 Outputs
6:29 Hardware options and tips
Thanks, Alan! This is exactly what I’m wanting to do. Your videos are well thought out and to the point!
Thanks!!! :)
Appreciate the videos, they are the best live sound ones out there.
Thank you!
To avoid wasting a rackspace you can just cut out holes in the rackears on the XR18 and throw the cables through! It works wonders :)
Good suggestion.
Or flip it the other way so all the connections are on the inside
I used a mill to cut holes in the XR18 rack ears to pass cables in order to keep the "front" facing forward and to eliminate the usage of a rack space just to pass cables.
@@KLRCAT Yes, definitely an option. I posted a photo in the last 1/4 of the video of a rack with the XR18 turned around backwards. It was during the part where I was talking about users finding the best packaging configuration for their needs. I should've highlight that more. I think the original narration even mentioned it, but ended up getting cut for time/pacing.
@@chenlmax I agree. That's what I'd do for a permanent situation. I knew everyone doesn't have the tools to do something like that so I just showed the simple solution... But I mentioned in the video users finding the configuration that worked for them and their own situation.
on fire once again! great vid dude!
Cool! Thanks!
I’m new at all this but I know I need this. I’m going to watch this video a few more times until I understand it thoroughly. Love your videos, they have helped me a lot.
Thanks!!! :)
Same here...i've watched it 3x now and still digesting information from it (as a n00b). Wouldn't you also have to label the splitter to ensure you plug the instruments into the right numbers night after night? 🤔
We use a similar slightly larger version of this. We have 3 A8's feeding an X32 rack combined with an S16 snake. We also use the Behringer P16's to run our IEM's. The S16 snake is to submix a few things to get down to 16 channels on the P16. Toms are on one channel, overheads and hi hat on another, 2 keyboard sends on one, and electric and acoustic guitar on one send. We have 22-24 inputs depending on the gig and a 30 foot analog snake to go to FOH.
Great video! I set this up a few months ago and I wish I could have watched it beforehand! Some comments:
I found that mounting the XR18 into the rack backwards was best (plugs facing inward). Since the cables that plug into the XR18 don't change from gig to gig, I thought it would be better not to have them sticking out and potentially getting knocked around. It's easier to route the cables inside the rack that way also.
Also, our IEM transmitters have a pass-through that we run to another panel on the rack. That way, we have both wireless and wired available for the same monitor signal just in case. Maybe a transmitter/receiver fails and we have a backup plug available for a regular wired on-stage monitor.
Alan mentioned that you can bring your own mics for the gig so you don't have to adjust the XR18 settings for the house mics. We do this and really like it. Our monitor mix is consistent gig to gig, plus our singers feel comfortable with their favorite mic in their hand. We even use our own XLRs from mic/instrument to our rack, so the house production team only has to run their cables from the rack to their FOH mixer. This is easy for them and they LOVE that they don't have to mix our monitors.
This is a really great setup. Highly recommended.
Thanks! Yes, turning the XR18 around is definitely an option. In fact, there's a photo in the video with the XR18 turned around when I'm talking about ideas for different configurations. In fact, pretty sure the original script contained a section talking about mounting it backwards, adding a rack drawer, and some other options but that part of the narration just got cut for time and pacing.
But it's a great suggestion. Especially, since there's not much to see on the front of the XR18 as far as meters go or any control LCD window. And it keeps it neater looking in the front since the XLR tails for the XR18 never have to be seen in the front of the rack. They can just live inside the rack, wire tied and pulled out of the way.
Thanks for watching and commenting with the great suggestions and advice ! :)
FINALLY!!!!!! A video that actually explains what you're using and how to put it together and use it...THANK YOU!!!!!
No problem! Thanks for watching and commenting!
what ever
This is SO helpful - thank you so much!
Thanks!
It was really informative. i want, you daily upload such as around same video. Best of luck
Thank you!
Good stuff Alan. Thank you.
Thanks for watching and commenting! :)
Thank you 🙏 Great content!💥
Thanks!
OMG thank you for mentioning labeling the source to the house.
Yes, very important step. It makes things so much easier for the house/event provider when the band does that. It also got mentioned and highlighted in this new video:
czcams.com/video/d2YJw3epXRY/video.html
Thank you for taking your time to explain it to a noob 🙂
Happy to help!
Just me or does the narrator sound like Cole Swindell? 😂👌🏼 Appreciate the tutorial man! 👍🏼🙏🏼
Ive been using a nearly identical setup with an X32 Rack, P16s to drive the wireless IEMs, and two S8 splitters for 10 years now. FOH loves not having to run monitors and the band loves always having the same mix.
It's almost always an easy day when a band can just hand the sound system provider their FOH tails, has control of their own monitors, and lots of experience using them. FOH can concentrate on FOH, and the band generally has their IEM mix ready quickly with so much already dialed in and consistent from gig to gig.
Great video! I feel like I had it commissioned for me ;-)
Thanks!
Also useful if you want to do a multitrack recording on the XR18 while using the venue mixer for mixing!
Yes. Good point! And along those same lines, it works for a dedicated mixer for a stream mix too.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio yep! And if you need more IEMs, the XR18 also has Ultranet, 16 channels that can be individually mixed per person :) if you run out of aux/main ;)
@@djazz0 A P16 is something I don't have, just because I don't really have a need... but it's something I wish I had just so I get make a video or 2 demonstrating it and the flexibility it can bring to a band (or church audio setup).
That Ultranet flexibility is pretty cool.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio I don’t have one either. We have X32 at church and I recently got an XR18 to use home and on small gigs. But having the possibility to expand is great! Even if its only 16 channels.
A bit of advice from XR18 and ART splitter user: First, use the ART s8-3way splitter instead of one on the video which will give you an ability to plug FOH wires straight to your splitter. Mount XR18 backwards and run all cables inside the rack as XR18 does not have any control knobs or buttons any way, so you will never interfere with it unless you need to swap cables which you most probably never do on the stage. (The only downfall is the phantom power which can be only fed through front output of this splitter, so you will have to ask FOH for 48v incase you need it)
If you don't want to mount XR18 backwards, you can cut holes in both rack mount ears of XR18 big enough for all XLR cables thus you wont use 1 unit of your rack.
There's a shot in the video showing an XR18 mounted backwards. It's probably in the last 1/4th of the video when I mention users can customize the setup to better suit their needs. Unfortunately, I probably should've pointed out that reversed XR18 rather than just showing it when I said that because I'm not sure a lot of viewers caught that option.
Great video! Something to note is that while this is the ideal professional setup, the logistics of this setup for local gigs with multiple bands can be painstaking and troublesome. You need to be in clear communication with your sound man ahead of time about your rig and plan to set up first and leave last for ideal set transitions. Unless, it is a reputable venue with plenty of stage hands, this setup will irritate your sound crew and cause delays in the show if you are having to switch house lines from the main stage box between bands.
In my experience(if not multi-tracking the set), the best solution is a "self contained" setup. Use your own mics. Each band member is responsible for plugging their mic into the XR. 1 kick, 1 mono OH, (maybe 1 snare if time permits). House handles their own mics and the band handles theirs. You will need some kind of split situation for vocals or anything that can't be double miced/DI. I use Line 6 Helix for mono vocal split into XR and one out goes to FOH main mic line. Much more consistent and less tedious than coordinating with a sound man who has no clue whats going on. With good mic placement, EQ, comp, & verb; you can make 2 mics on the drum kit sound massive for IEMs.
Yes, good point. In the stage plot/input list video that I mention in the video and link to in the text section, it mentions getting the promoter/booker/organizer a copy of your input list and stage plot as soon as the good is booked (if not as it's being booked). And then also to assume the sound company/production provider won't get it and to try and provide them a copy yourself as soon as you can (with your contact info including cell AND email).
And then lastly, to have those material with you when you show up at the gig, ready to provide them to the production company.
Advance as much as possible and email is great since it creates a paper trail.
We're usually pretty happy to see a band show up self-contained and just needing racks and stacks from us, or racks and stack and FOH. The only fly in the ointment is when they have their own mon rig and mics/DIs, but with us doing FOH, and they have some weird patch and it's all done by numbers.
So they are handing us tails telling us Drum vox is on 1, Lead vox is on 2, SL vox is 3, Acs gtr is 4, SR vox is 5, bass guitar is 6, kick drum is 7, snare is 8, keyboard is 9 and 10 with the right channel on 10, Toms are 11-13, guitar is 14. 15 is skipped because it doesn't work. 16 is hi hat, "unless the drummer is using his pad and then the pad will be 16 and then it will be 18"...17 is OH... and 20 is for the RF mic nobody told us they needed....
That's why I kind of belabor that point in the video to label the house end of the tails with the source. No transposing numbers necessary to go from a seemingly random, spaghetti patch, to more of an industry standard patch.
I see where the x-air 18 has ultranet but I think it is only used by Behringer, so you would need to purchase their monitors which are not inexpensive at $250. per unit and you might need six, also they are not belt pack in size. But i do like the fact that it uses cat 5 as opposed to big heavy cable snakes.
You can also turn the x air 18 around backwards since you really don't ever have to mess with those inputs if you have shallow lids.
Yes. Definitely true. In fact, in the last 1/4 of the video where I'm talking about viewers making decisions that fit their own needs with how they build the rack out with their components and packaging, I have a picture of a rack with the console installed in it backwards.
Great Video Alan. Is there anyway on the software to lock out the bus lines, so your sound guy or band mate doesn't accidentally blow your ears out? Thanks in advance!
On X-Air Edit there's not, well, I guess you can put a limiter in the bus outs or use compression with a limiter setting... But beyond that something like Mixing Station app lets you limit musicians to just their own mix.
I ASSUME the new Behringer Android and iPad amp has the same options, and there was Q Mix that you might look into to see what it does.
Honestly, since I'm either at the other end of the snake or else the musicians have their own monitor control via apps, I don't know what most are using these days.
But I do know there are apps, possibly beyond what I mentioned, that let you lock out anything except the musician's own mix.
That said, I'm not aware of anything that would help if your monitors are from FOH and your FOH engineer is a gain tweaker. That's ALWAYS going to impact your monitors. That's one of the benefits of a separate monitor console and analog split: Nothing FOH does has any impact on the monitors, and nothing you do has any impact on FOH. That is touched on here:
czcams.com/video/tGX3Ofs1l_Y/video.html
If you need a more compact splitter, Network Sound makes a 1U 16-channel splitter - 16FDBSPL
Hi Alan, first of all, great information! Secondly, what brand and length of cables did you use for the short fan to fan snake from the splitter outputs to the XR 18?
The short fan to fan is an Elite Core snake. I think I dropped a link in the video description text. I know you can find them on Amazon.
Took me a little longer than I intended but I finally got this finished. Please like and share to help get the channel traction. Thanks! LMK any questions or comments.
►Patreon Page where Patrons have access to script files, other PDF tutorials, Behringer X32/M32/XR18/MR18 channel and scene files, and other audio production information:
www.patreon.com/AlanHamiltonAudio
~~~~~~~~
►►Amazon Affiliate Links To Equip Used/Shown/Mentioned In Video-
►ART S8 Splitter on Amazon:
amzn.to/3oxuyL1
►Seismic 16 channel Rackmount Split Snake on Amazon:
amzn.to/2YvZT7B
►Behringer MS8000 8 ch Splitter on Amazon:
amzn.to/3od1fgl
►Elite Core Fan to Fan Snake Cables on Amazon:
amzn.to/3knZb47
►ProX Racks and Cases Amazon Store:
amzn.to/3n34hoi
►Furman M-8Lx Standard Level Power Conditioning, 15 Amp, 9 Outlets with Wall Wart Spacing, Pullout Lights on Amazon:
amzn.to/3EWKlt8
►TP Link 1750 Router on Amazon:
amzn.to/3oeuXSm
►Behringer P1 In Ear Monitor Beltpack on Amazon:
amzn.to/3p5DAjU
►KZ ZS10 Pro earpieces on Amazon:
amzn.to/37Q8mnJ
►Behringer XR18 on Amazon:
amzn.to/2LfTpmO
►Neutrik Pass Through connectors (male) XLR Plug to XLR Receptacle - NA3MDF on Amazon:
amzn.to/3bZ3kqw
►Auray RS-2U Rack Shelf on Amazon:
amzn.to/3H5YEh1
►Gator Rackworks Rack Mount Universal Knockout Panel Accessory for Cable Management on Amazon:
amzn.to/3F2oKj7
►White Electrical Tape (useful as label tape) on Amazon:
amzn.to/3koPcLL
►Gaffers Tape on Amazon:
amzn.to/31P5OGg
►Shure Beta 52A Kick Drum Microphone on Amazon:
amzn.to/3D2iNBX
►Stellar X2 (Narration Mic) on Amazon:
amzn.to/3ggUWFq
"As an Amazon Associate I earn from qualifying purchases."
~~~~~~~~
Suggested videos:
►Behringer XR18 Monitor Setup Tutorial:
czcams.com/video/5gzsEErKdb8/video.html
►Sending FX to Monitors XR18/MR18/X32/M32:
czcams.com/video/e_XsfTV36vU/video.html
►Cable Management For Live Audio:
czcams.com/video/nYZ9nrPGswo/video.html
►Patch Order and Input Lists For Live Sound:
czcams.com/video/FE2KRj8vEEc/video.html
►In Ear Monitors On A Budget:
czcams.com/video/FOon2wEZss8/video.html
►Pro X Rack Assembly Instructions and Review:
czcams.com/video/kkt9lEnJ8nY/video.html
►Behringer X32 Monitor Setup Tutorial:
czcams.com/video/Vz9E6FaCatQ/video.html
►Top 5 Frequently Asked Questions About the XR18 (and MR18):
czcams.com/video/x9wciA2wFd0/video.html
►Five Tips For Better Live Vocal Mixes:
czcams.com/video/oP4sdpkkNhY/video.html
►5 Typical Mistakes Behringer XR18 and Midas MR18 Users Make:
czcams.com/video/EilVDp39A9g/video.html
►5 Typical Mistakes Behringer X32 and Midas M32 Users Make:
czcams.com/video/tP7dO2Za6bw/video.html
The followup to this video (just published today) is all about the settings used in the XR 18 or MR18 when used as a dedicated monitor console, as well as some specific info about the mixer's hardware outs and interconnects to the beltpacks or transmitters.
It is here:
czcams.com/video/Zf83kolgVzk/video.html
You should pin your comment to the top so people see it easier
Hey Alan, love your videos! They have taught me everything I know about using my XR18.
My band is trying to get an iem setup for venues where we don’t run our own sound. I have heard about the seismic splitter with built in snakes, but some of the reviews said if phantom power is ran through these that it will fry the inputs on the other board, I.e. if the FOH runs phantom to drum overheads, it will fry those channels in our mixer. Do you know anything about this?
Sounds like someone is inventing the 'possibility' of problems based on the Seismic not having transformers. But lots of splitter snakes don't have transformers. And they don't have problems with phantom power even if it's on at both ends of the snake.
There's always the chance some antique mixer might have an issue due to poor design back in the day, but I wouldn't expect any name brand mixer to have an issue that was made in the last 30 years.
The only question I'd have about the Seismic is build quality... and even that would only be how well the ends are soldered on. So not exactly a huge problem, even if that would be the case since it would just be a matter of reflowing the ends. And that is just something I wonder about, not something I have knowledge about being an issue.
But the main thing is... phantom power won't be a problem, even if both boards accidentally have it turned on.
Dave Rat discusses this issue. The short answer is not a problem. czcams.com/video/_8UTGcuAtd0/video.html
I own the 16 channel seismic splitter (see one of my videos on my channel) and I have used phantom power many times without an issue (granted, it was only one device though each time). My guess is that you’ll be fine:
another excellent video!! glad I found it! so line 1 & 2 is high impedance..does it mean i can connect my passive bass and guitar here without di?
If you're using a splitter, then you'll need to use a DI. Otherwise, you lose the ability to split the signal at mic level to a FOH console.
OTOH, if you're using the XR18 as the FOH console and using it for mons from FOH, no splitter to a house console, then you can use 1 or 2 for passive bass or guitar.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio how bout a regular mic on line 1&2 is that okay too? Im bought a cable snake box and im thinking line 1 & 2 reserves for the bass and guitar to save me some money so i dont need to buy di boxes. But the cable snake box is xlr female so that doesnt work with guitar instrument cable...feels like i need an adaptor here from 1/4ts to male xlr. If that makes any sense...
Thank you so much for this! Quick question. If I were to use Shure PSM300's as our In-ear transmitter, would the signal be compromised if I had to use an XLRF to TRS cable to go from the XR18 to the transmitter? Or is it better to get a transmitter that only has XLR inputs?
A mono XLR output into a mono TRS input is perfectly fine. No issues with that type of a setup... and it's the preferred way to do it.
Then only caveat is if you go from mono XLR balanced to a stereo UNBALANCED TRS input (or vice versa)... you never want to do that.
@AlanHamiltonAudio, thank you for the videos. I’m a fellow amateur/intermediate sound man, who runs sound for various bands, as well as my own band gigs.
My question is when you run into sound guys who do not like receiving a band who runs their own ears. I have set up like this before, where we provide our own rack, and a fan to the FOH. Even after providing a tech rider well in advance, I’ve run into sound guys who simply hate this setup. What are your thoughts on that? Do you think the sound guy is inexperienced, or doesn’t like to step outside of their comfort zone? I’ve even gone as far as giving up trying to set up the predetermined IEMs for my band and running the house monitors by the sound guy because they were so grumpy about us bringing our own.
Any suggesting on how to deal with a person, or situation in that regard? Me being a fellow sound guy, I’m doing everything I possibly can to be accommodating to them.
I'm a big believer in letting the band be the band. As a one-off provider, I'm just there to facilitate their show, not to micro-manage them or produce them. It's GREAT when a band provides their own ear rig and tails. It's only slightly less great if they have some weird non-standard patch, and poorly marked tails. Nobody has time to cross-reference a bunch of numbers against an input list that has everything in a non-standard layout. But that would be less about letting a band do it, as it is just grumbling that something that should go smoothly is not because the band wasn't really all that experienced about how things work from their end.
I'd say any provider that balks at a band providing ears and tails is not really a provider at all. It shows both a lack of experience on their part and a lack of professionalism. They are more a soundperson with some equip that wants to run the equipment versus provide the equipment. There's nothing really wrong with that, as long as they hire themselves out to bands that fully understand that and expect that. But it crosses a line when they hire themselves out to festivals/events (or even clubs) where the role is PROVIDER and system tech first, soundperson second.
It gets a little more understanding if a band shows up, and without advancing it, wants to use AES50 and tie into your system that way. Logistics, preparation, and just how finicky AES50 connections can be... especially when the band is throwing a whole bunch of unknown variables into the equation at the last second like it would be at a throw and go festival, all can become issues. That's just the opposite of ears and tails. Ears and tails, when done right, simplifies things for the provider.
I'm not really sure how you handle that, except to hope the promoter/organizer is experienced and professional enough that THEY understand and you can go above the 'provider's' head to tell them you're troubles with the provider IF you can't get the provider to actually do their job.
Fantastic video! Is there any REAL advantage of using the ART S8s vs a regular snake? They're very expensive compared to normal snakes, so I'm trying to figure out if having a "ground lift" and those other electronics are really worth the price difference with the ART S8. Thanks!
Very small benefit that is usually not necessary. All else being equal, an iso split can be a nice luxury and having a ground lift (pin 1 lift) available is a nice option too. Even if that option is something 'try' to cross off the list when troubleshooting a problem.
But the reality is you'll be fine with a passive split in almost all normal situations.
On thing though, when buying new, names like Whirlwind or Rapco/Horizon, won't likely be cheaper even if they are just passive rackmount snakes. EWI and Seismic are more likely lower priced alternatives. Build quality of Whirlwind or Rapco/Horizon is typically higher... but split snakes aren't brain surgery and if you can solder you can likely fix most issues that might come along, even on those lower priced units. Even if they have poorer QC on soldering for example.
Would did setup still work if using an analog mixer as the FOH Console? And still be able to control the 6 monitor mixes through the Behringer software/app?
Yes, definitely. Any console at FOH would work with this system as long as it has enough channels. And your Behringer software or app controls the mon mixes on the X-Air.
Thank you. Is there any rule of thumb or reasoning to if the bands own monitor mixer or the venues foh mixer should provide the Phantom power in such a scenario?
There is no hard and fast rule per se'... But typically mon world supplies phantom. And when you have your own mon rig, if you supply phantom it's just one less then to rely on FOH for. You don't even need to mention it since you have it covered. Though as a convenience you can certainly tell the house tech "We have phantom covered on our end of the snake".
If FOH accidentally has phantom on, it's not going to hurt anything, even if both consoles have it turned on. And if using a splitter with isolated splits on one side of the split, that power can't get past the transformers anyway, so the other side HAS to supply phantom where needed.
So, if using a splitter with an ISO side, I'd give ISO to FOH and use the regular split for mons and let the monitor console supply phantom. If it's a totally passive split then either side can supply phantom power, and if both sides accidentally send phantom on a channel, it's not going to matter or hurt anything.
Great video. My band does a lot of gigs where there is a shared drum kit used by multiple bands. I often come across resistance from the house tech in repatching to their stage box. Fair enough when there are 20 minute changeovers. What has been your experience?
We usually use a subsnake to the drums... 8-12 channel... sometimes bigger but that usually covers it. So we just unpatch the subsnake from the main snake so the band can patch their tails, and give that drum subsnake fan to the band to connect to their splitter. And then repatch the subsnake 1 to 1 back into our house/stage snake once that band is done. That is if the band is using the shared kit, but their own ear rig.
If the band isn't using the shared kit... then we still use a subsnake. Just one extra subsnake... and run that to the unshared kit and to the house snake. So the shared kit stays mic'ed and connected to its subsnake... and the band using their own drums has an entirely different subsnake to patch their drum lines into. Either that subsnake goes to the house snake (AKA house splitter) or it can go to that band's ear rig. Either way, we unpatch the shared kit's subsnake from the house head, and either patch the other subsnake in 1 to 1... or it goes to the band's ear rig and we patch the tails into the house rig.
When tat band is done, it's super simple to just put our subsnake from the shared kit back into the main snake since it's 1 to 1 patched.
Even if the shared kit gets struck, we'd still likely handle it this same way... with the lines (or mics) marked to get back to their proper places on the shared kit... never actually disconnecting the drum mics from their cables and leaving them neatly coiled somewhere around the drum riser. So, the mics aren't getting shared either. Either the band with their own drums uses their own mics, or we just supply more drum mics for their kit if they don't have their own. It probably doesn't take 5 mins to do any of these swaps as far as the sound system side. The drummer setup will be the slower part.
That's way it generally happens except in the rare cases where a promoter/organizer has some rule where all bands share backline and all bands agreed to that, and then want to 'negotiate' something different day of show. But that is between the organizer and the band(s) to sort out, and how rigid the organizer/promoter (or their stage manager) is going to be.
Does the Behringer MS8000 do everything needed to set this up? It is cheaper than the Art splitter... I am confused on the outputs of the MS8000, there is a direct out and a 'link out'..
It does all you need. It adds an extra feature that may or may not be more trouble than it's worth. So normally, you have 1 input per channel and 2 outputs per each of those same channels. One output for the main/house mixer and one for the monitor mixer. The MS8000 has a link button on some channels and when you engage that it sends that 'linked' channel to FOUR outputs. If you need to send a channel to 4 outputs, that's handy. But for normal operation you just need to send a channel to 2 outputs. So if you happen to accidentally engage that split button, instead of your kick being in channel 1 and coming out of the two channel 1 outputs, and your snare in channel 2 and coming out of your two channel 2 outputs, you'd instead have your kick coming out of the two channel 1 outputs AND the two channel 2 outputs.
I think some people have said they remove that button on the channels that have it just so that doesn't accidentally happen somehow.
Of course, just realizing it has that feature means you should recognize the symptoms if a button would get accidentally pressed... or even know to check the buttons in the first place.
I considered that seismic audio unit because it was so cheap. The problem is that are only uses of y splitter and not a transformer. This could allow for ground loops and all kinds of buzzing if you're not lucky. The first sound engineer that I came across when I suggested this told me that they wouldn't let them hook it up to their system. In addition, box like that art unit that you have or the behringer ultralink etcetera also has individual channel ground lifts just try to solve problems. It's more expensive route but it's well worth it. In addition, you can just hook up a laptop and record your whole show in multitrack with this setup.
There's no real problem with a transformerless split. For something like that Seismic my concern would be build quality more than anything to do with transformers... and even then, more just a matter of a poor solder that might need reflowed because it wasn't soldered good to begin with and transport/handling causing a break in a connector.
Any sound engineer that wouldn't let you connect a splitter to the system because it's transformerless is a fool to be honest with you.
Plenty of people use and have used transformerless splitters and even just Y cables with no issues. And things like phantom power being ON at both FOH and MON consoles is a non-issue with modern consoles. And by 'modern' I mean since at least back in the 80's...
So, if that was his concern, it's not a concern.
Other than that, there is no real (real-world) concerns with transformerless split.
I have a Horizon transformerless split that's done countless large shows with no issues at all, and when Horizon built it I had them put ground lifts (pin 1 lifts) on each channel. I've never needed to use one.
With proper system interconnection a pin 1 lift on the snake has been useless. Either the gnd lift on the DI fixes the problem or it's a bad line... or a musician is using a speaker cable as instrument cable by accident.
I've had countless acts connecting to the system using tranformer and transformerless splits and never an issue at all.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio I have heard that since modern xlr impedances are. So high, grounding issues between them shouldn't be a problem. However, I wonder about extreme circumstances like running power from the neighbors house or a generator. Also that 70 year old fender amp that shocks you're lip when you're singing. Lol.
I'd rather have something like the Behringer X32 that has outputs on the back rack an XLR patch bay and a DI rack mount so you can plug and play everything in front and all the other wires would be in the back. You could reverse two XLR outs on the patch bay if you were running your own sound and wouldn't even need to access back unless you were needing to run a snake for house sound which would still be incredibly easy with the use of an XLR splitter.
Is there anyway to make the L/R output on the XR-18 act as individual AUX sends so this could have a total of 8 IEM's connected in Mono?
Well... sort of... but it's pretty convoluted and you really need to think about signal flow when you do it. And if you have musicians doing their own monitors, they have to be pretty aware of this too. And there's still a major amount of compromise needed too...
You'd basically have to use the pan control as a pseudo send... and it would be really easy to find yourself in a situation where it doesn't work for the band because of the compromises necessary, and their unwillingness to live with those compromises. Let alone, someone just screw up because they don't understand the concept and adjust something they shouldn't.
Hi Allan can we use passive speakers with XR18?
The XR18 doesn't have any amplifiers built in so it can't power a passive speaker without adding an amplifier between the mixer and the speaker.
Hi Alan, thanks for the video. Just a question for you: If you use this kind of setup for ONLY monitors (NOT FOH) Could you use the 17/18 channels for, say, a stereo keyboard input and then send the MAIN L/R to the FOH snake and thus gain 2 more monitor channels over the 16 channels?
You could gain a 7th mix, a stereo mix, by using the L-R of the mon console Xr18 (It would be kind of convoluted to try and get 2 more mono mixes out of it versus just a stereo mix since it would involved some fancy pan work)... But I'm not sure what you meant about "then send the MAIN L/R to the FOH snake and thus gain 2 more monitor channels over the 16". Oh... wait.... you mean sending those key lines to the L-R outs so you don't need to split those last two channel I think...??
Yes, of the top of my head I can't see why you couldn't do that.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Yeah, that's exactly what I mean. However, with 17/18 being joined into one Aux channel, you can only really get one extra channel (mixed) instead of 2 (17 AND 18). Or... that's how it seems.
Hi Alan love your content, just a quick question I was running sound for a small festival with around 10 bands, the second last band had a Xvive iem for the singer so I plugged it directly into the singer’s monitor link on the stage monitor. I got terrible feedback until I unplugged and connected the xlr direct what was I doing wrong?
I'm not sure I'm following... Powered wedge I assume? You left the wedge turned up (or even turned on) AND connected the XVive to the monitor pass-thru?
If that's what you did you should've just either turned that monitor down (entirely) or (to avoid making level changes on already set equipment) just unplugged the XLR input from the wedge and connected the XVive transmitter there.
That way, the transmitter is probably as close as possible to the musician and mitigates reception problems that more distance might bring up. You can of course connect directly at the mixer, but that's probably a longer distance for the transmitter to transmit. And it might be able to do that just fine... but it seems like you had the option to have it really close just using the wedge's feed. With the lack of time dealing with multiple band changeovers, that would've been a quick way to mitigate the chance for trouble.
But if you left the wedge turned on, and turned up too, then could see how that would feedback... being on the same mix... Two different animals connected to the same mix. A live wedge and an IEM.
If that's not what you mean you did, then I guess I'm not following what it is you did.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio yes it was a powered monitor and I left it turned up so got the feedback as soon as her ears got close to the mic
@@GuitarHorse57 Part of that sounds perfectly expected... feedback from having an IEM and a wedge share a mix. Basically, it's because you can do (almost) anything for ears and not get feedback... but a wedge has way more limitations. So if they share a mix, they're just too different to do that without a lot of compromises. And it's compromises that don't even make sense to do if you think about it. IOW- Why compromise an ear mix for a shared wedge mix if the performer can just have exactly what they want in the IEMs if/when the wedge is taken out of the equation...
But her ears getting close to the mic shouldn't cause feedback per se'. Maybe it was just her getting close to the mic itself that was causing the feedback?
That would be more expected as a potential problem based on what I said in the first paragraph. It also tracks that disconnecting the wedge fixed the issue.
Очень полезно если есть не понимание что такое сплит, и как собирать рэки. А вообще я досмотрел до конца только потому, что ожидал не понятно чего. Запили тогда чтоли следующее видео о том как сплитаннуть по входу и суммировать по выходу 6 консолей, причем 2 из них мониторные, а один из foh пультов задействован как программный и принимает на борт микрофоны ведущих и контент необходимый для проведения мероприятия. Чтобы это было интересно я предлагаю такой набор пультов: d-live (use Leonid Agutin band. 1 DM rack foh, 1 DM rack mon); midas pro 6 as foh & midas pro 1/2 as mon; yamaha cl5 as mon console; cl5 as foh live console & ql1 as program console. По выходам с каждого foh пульта надо собрать L,R, mono SUB, Front Fill. Мониторные пульты по выходам: 8 wedge, side fills stereo & 12 iem (2 solo use on midas, 2 solo use on d-live, other 8 using on all monitor consoles and foh live cl5 (the band monitored from foh). По входам: Leonid Agutin band - 48 input ch; band working on midas - 36 ch; band working on live cl5 - 24 ch, and second band using live cl5 it’s cover band - 39 ch. Если ты дочитал до сюда - то у тебя возникли different questions ( зачем это все надо, зачем я это читаю сейчас, and who is mr Leonid Agutin). Если вопросов нет - значит мы встретимся в Барвихе!
Use an antenna combiner if you want clear IEMs without problems.
Definitely a good suggestion for multiple RF units.
In this case, is the XR18 that provides the Phantom Power to the Drums' Mics, for example? Or the FOH mixer?
I'm a little bit confuse because of the splitter. Can we have some problem if the two mixers turn on the phantom power?
Before to watch your video I was thinking if I need to found some Splitter with Phantom Power.
I don't if I you can understand my doubts.
Thank you for the video.
Whichever mixer gets connected to the ISO side of the split cannot feed phantom power. The ISO (transformer) will block it. Normally, you'd feed FOH from the ISO side of the splitter and use your XR18 on the monitor side to provide phantom power where you need it.
If you were to use a passive splitter where there were no transformers involved, then either console could provide phantom power. While, technically, it's good practice for only one console be the console dedicated to providing phantom power, the truth is, even with a transformerless split and both consoles providing phantom power, on modern era consoles everything would be fine anyway.
But if there's some reason you don't want phantom provided from your monitor console, and you're using a splitter with transformers, and so have ISO outputs on it, then connect the ISO side to the console you don't want phantom power from (monitor board in this example). Phantom power cannot pass over an ISO circuit.
That said, standard practice would be for FOH to connect to the ISO side and the monitor board to provide phantom power. But there could be times where you don't want to do that... or probably a more likely scenario, 'can't' do that. Like say a power supply problem on your mon console and your monitor console isn't able to output phantom power. In that case, you'd HAVE to connect the monitor console to the ISO side of the split and have the FOH console provide phantom power.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Thank you very much for your answer. It helps me a lot!
On the Behringer XR18, do you know if there is a limited amount of inputs that provide phantom power? I was watching another video on in-ears and the guy said that on his Behringer XR"16" that only the first 8 channels provide phantom power. I was wondering if it was the same on the XR18. Can't seem to find this info online, nor Behringer is not easy to get a hold of. Thank you !!
XR18 has phantom power available on all 16 mic channels. The XR16 only has 8 XLR mic pre's so that is why it only has phantom on 8 channels.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Thank you for the quick response. I appreciate your input.
@@eddiestarline No problem!
New guy🙋🏽♂️!!! I’m new to the digital audio space…here’s my question. My church is still using an analog board🤦🏽♂️…can I still use the XR18 setup explained in the video? Want to run IEM for Band and singers.
Yes, you can use the setup like in the video to use the XR18 as a monitor console for the band while keeping your analog console at FOH. Once you have that split configuration like the video shows, that FOH split can go to any console you want. Digital... analog... any brand... The two consoles will be totally independent.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Thank you 💪🏾💪🏾💪🏾
Hi, do you know if the xr18 works with a Mac M1. I tried to contact Behringer but I did not get any response. Can you help please?
I don't know why it wouldn't, but I don't have one and don't have any way to be 100% certain.
I use the seismic 16ch splitter and zero issues. For cable mgt i turned my xr18 around and you cannot see any of the cabling. Very sleek
I posted a photo late in the video of a rack with the XR18 turned around. I should've spent more time talking about that option. IIRC I just mentioned users having options on how they configured the rack and showed that photo, but didn't really point out what it was showing. But, yeah, turning it around is a great option to clean things up and perma-connect some things.
It's a great tip!
i have probles with delay on my monitors. Do you have videos from delays or latency?
I haven't done any that focuses on latency.
When i plugged everything in i lost control of my faders, my bass for example wasnt able to be controlled at all by the mixer
Are you using it as a dedicated monitor mixer or FOH and mons?
This video talks about settings for a dedicated monitor mixer:
czcams.com/video/Zf83kolgVzk/video.html
But it sounds like from your question, you want it doing FOH and Mons... Either way, this video might help:
czcams.com/video/xPsSPK6RKzU/video.html
Hey Alan! I would like to create an IEM system for my band and have one question regarding that. How would you go about splitting drums when the drummer (me) doesn't need the whole drum set in the in ears and also none of the band members do. For IEM monitoring our inputs would be kick mic, OH mics (stereo), bass (XLR out from amp), ac. guitar (DI) and 3 vocal mics. But I don’t know how to deal with the splitting if we come to the venue and I would be asking the sound guy to split only the above mentioned inputs for me and the rest (basically rest of the drum set) connect straight to the FOH. Is there a compact and easily approachable way how to do that and not upset the sound guy? 🙂 Or will I have to connect everything to the splitter (so that means to have enough channels available), pass everything to FOH and split to the XR18 only the inputs that I need? Any help or ideas will be much appreciated!
If my math is correct, you have 8 channels that need to hit the monitor console AND FOH. The rest then only need to hit FOH.
If you're sure the other stuff doesn't need to hit the monitor console, then you certainly could make your rig with only an 8 channel splitter in it. It might complicate things, a little, for the sound system provider, but not really a whole lot. The important thing is that you have a stage plot and input list that makes it clear you have 8 lines that need to hit your splitter, and the rest of the lines needs to homerun to the house rig.
I'd also make sure and label the splitter inputs really well, and make sure you label the tails that go to FOH by what is their source (Kick, OH SR, OH SL,... etc...).
None of this is hard, just so long as it get communicated clearly so that the sound provider 100% understands, 8 channels is not all you need, it's just the lines that you need in your monitors, and you have your own monitor rig.
In a rush of a festival changeover, this could get lost in translation. But having an input list showing 16 channels of lines going to FOH, and 8 channels of those going to split first for your ear rig, should make that clear.
And a little text bubble reiterating that cannot hurt- "The band needs XX inputs for FOH. We have an analog splitter for the 8 channels of our input list that we need in our monitor console which are indicated on the input list".
The input list could look like:
1 Kick - Mons- House
2 Snare - X- House
3 Hat - X- House
4 T1 - X- House
5 F1 - X - House
6 OH SR - Mons - House
7 OH SL - Mons - House
8 Bass - Mons - House
...and so on...
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Wow Alan! Than you so much for such a thorough answer. This will really help me to set everything up and not spend extra money that is not necessary for the splitters and other stuff. Just hope if we play festivals that the sound provider won't be too surprised with our "specific" needs. Thanks a lot again and keep those great videos coming! Cheers!
@@honzakalnik What are your experiences now after a year? I'm the drummer in our band and hesitating between these solutions: Split house signals like in the video or bring my own (few) drum mics to be more independent.
@@intruderGER Hey there! At the end we went with Soundcraft Ui24R because of all of the features.
Regarding micing the drums I just go with kick and two mics on the drum set (one below my hi-hat and between snare and aux scare and the second between rack and floor tom aka "wurst" mic). We do our own sound 70-80% of the time at venues that never needed more than these three mics and for the events with external sound guy I just tell him that I have these 3 mics for him to use if he wishes. Also I'll make sure to tell him if he wants to mic the drums for FOH differently he'll need to bring his own mics for that. Everything else we split.
This is the cheapest way to do this but if you want a better IEM setup look at this mixer with the addition of ultranet personal IEM mixers, a little more pricey but up to 8 stereo mixes (maybe more)
Hi everyone,
since our shows progress, we're about to build our own inear monitor system with our Midas MR18. To get rid of the splitter and to have enough outs building a stereo inear monitor system, I think the Midas DN4816-O could be a good solution. With this, you can go directly into Midas MR18 and let also work as a splitter for inear and foh. Right?
I've not really looked into the DN4816, but I'm kind of skeptical of your plan because the MR18 doesn't use AES50 or Behringer's "Stage Connect" interface. IF the DN4816 uses Ultralink, then maybe it can 'talk' to the MR18 (AKA "interface" with it). ...But if not, then I'm having my doubts you can get to where you want to go with the DN just on that step alone, let alone anything beyond that. BUT, and this is a big BUT... I'm not at all familiar with the DN4816. I'm simply telling you the things I would want to make sure of if I planned to interface them. They have to have a common protocol to work together... and I'm not sure they do. So that would be the first thing to look into. And maybe you're already beyond that step...
@@AlanHamiltonAudio I'm looking at this option too. The DN4816-O can connect via Ultranet so I think this should work once you setup your routing on the Ultranet screen on the mixer.
@BindTortueKill and dwhitney31, just wondering if either of you have taken this leap, and if so, does it work as you thought it would?
How much U of Rack Space does the XR18/MR18 take?
It is 3 spaces (3u).
hello , why keeping inear monitor and wifi received outside the rack ? thanks
The wifi is in the rack.
The transmitters can be mounted in the rack or can be separated. It just depends on whether the band has transportation (and manpower) for one larger rack versus two smaller racks. Or maybe each member keeps/owns their own ear transmitter. Obviously, if transportation and manpower to load it and unload it are not an issue, an all-in-one rack is the way to go.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Thanks a lot ! i was thinking that Received are better to put them out, maybe for some interference ?!
isnt true ?
regards
@@OverloadGuitars It might matter if you were using 2.4G transmitters (like the X-vive stuff), but for UHF it should be manageable.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Thanks a lot !!😀
I am confused on the Phantom power and splitter. How do I need to connect a mic requiring phantom power?
If you use a splitter that has transformers, which means one side of the split will be labeled "ISO" or "ISOLATED" then whichever mixer is connected to that ISO side will not be able to supply phantom power. It won't hurt anything if it's accidentally ON from that mixer, but phantom can't pass thru the ISO transformer. Therefore, for the mic to get phantom power it HAS to come from the mixer on the regular (NON-ISO) side of the split.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio ok thank you. And does most splitters or the splitter in the video have that option?
@@danielvibe7139 The rackmount splitter I'm using in the video (ART) does have transformers. Most of the 4 or 8 channel rack units have splitters. I mentioned the budget Seismic splitter in the video that I see a lot of people using, and it does not have transformers.
Some people will swear you have to have transformers in your splitter, but that is not true. In almost all cases a transformerless split will be 100% fine.
@@AlanHamiltonAudiothanks and please forgive me. Im feeling rally stupid asking but i still dont quite understand
1) so the signal splits into 2 and only one of them will pass through the phantop power? Does that mean you can never split for instance oh mics signal to bother the iem and foh?
2) What do you mean by its not true that you need to have transformers? Doesnt it depend on ones needs?
@@danielvibe7139 You're overthinking some of this. The mics only need phantom power from one source. So if you split OH mics (condenser mics) to two consoles, only one of those consoles needs to supply the phantom power to the mic for it to work... Work in both consoles. Once the mic gets phantom power, it is working, it is powered up, so then it can send signal to both consoles. The isolated side of a split simply means that side cannot be the side that provides phantom power. It has to come from the side without the transformer.
Phantom power can't get through a transformer... audio can get through a transformer.
Once the mic gets that phantom power, it'll be working... So at that point BOTH consoles will receive audio signal from the mic(s).
As for transformers... Whirlwind has a pretty good document talking about them. I'll link it below. They have their benefits and can be a bit of a failsafe against issues like noise. But my experience is that a standard passive split is almost always fine if you're just splitting between two consoles. So you can spend the money on a split with transformers, but it isn't always actually necessary that you do. But that said, when we're talking the price of a couple rackmount 8 channel splitters like the ART the cost difference is many time negligible. So just getting one of those is fine functionally and economically. When you start talking about 24 channel, 32 channel, 48 channel mixers and systems, then the price of transformers can add up. Then other factors have to be considered too, like the level of the shows...
Whirlwind doc: www.whirlwindusa.com/tech-articles/microphone-splitters#:~:text=If%20a%20splitter%20is%20to,splitting%20transformer%20as%20described%20below.
You might also want to check out another IEM video I have on the channel-
Another IEM video: czcams.com/video/d2YJw3epXRY/video.html
does behringer splitter have phantom on it?
No, but it will pass phantom power from the console connected to the NON-ISO side of the split.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio okay, thank you. im building in ear for my band but I'm using soundcraft Ui24r instead of xr18.
How does the router have internet connection ?
The router doesn't need an internet connection. Tablet or laptop connects via wifi to the router that is connected (hardwired) to the XR18.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio Thanks for the reply. So with that said. You need to purchase some sort of service for the wifi correct ? Or you running off the venues ? Reason I ask is because what if a venue either has no connection or a crappy one. I'm trying to make my rig self sustainable. Still researching exactly what ill need maybe you can help ?
Not Much info on the web.
Cheers and thanks again!
@@RenegadeModelRailroader Essentially think "Private network". The router connects (hardwired) to the XR18, and your tablet connects wirelessly to the router. Nobody needs internet.
The only time you need the internet is when you first download the app/software to your device (phone/tablet/laptop). Once it's downloaded and installed... you don't need the internet again. Not until there's a new app version you want to download and upgrade.
You put a password on the router so only you and/or the band can connect to it.
Nothing is getting connected to the internet so whether the internet is available or not is a non-factor at a gig (unless you need to download and install the app).
i'm surprised you didn't use a label maker to label the snake haha(fantastic job though)
Hahaha... Good call... But somebody would've probably complained how using a label maker was too expensive! ;)
Label maker is also one of those tools that are expensive and you can never find when you need it... or you are out of labels when you do find it, lol
Forget sending 16 ch analog split to front of house mixer. Just send 16 ch digitally over a single cat 5 cable with UltraNet output from XR18. Or upgrade to X32 Rack and send AES50 to FOH console, digitally over one cat 5 Ethernet cable!
Ultranet is only going to work if everyone has P16's. It also doesn't give you a split to the house rig/provided rig so you lose that flexibility. That's an important part of the equation for larger venues and gigs, like festivals, where you're working with a provided rig, a house console, a house tech, or your own tech has no interest in mixing on an tablet on your stage console.
AES50 based (such as the X32R but no analog split) is not really a viable option unless it's your own complete system. Then of course it's viable, but the XR18 and MR18 don't have AES50. Which that makes it a moot point for building an IEM system around the XR18/MR18.
And the really important part of that equation (AES50) is going back to a provided house rig. The idea is to have your own, consistent, monitor package. You could be handing your XLR tails to multiple system types. Not every system is going to have an X32/M32 AES50 capable system. More importantly, every provider and situation isn't going to allow you to come in and run AES50. Especially, if it's not well-advanced, or you're not the headliner. And even if they would allow it, the situation might not allow for a cable to be ran at 4PM when the festival started at noon, and it's a throw and go for you.
But.... Every system you encounter will be able to take tails from a self-contained mon rig, with no issue. It's no different to the provider other than they don't have to concern themselves with your monitors. It's making their life easier, not more difficult. When done correctly (labeled ends, properly connected on the band end), it doesn't really add complications.
AES50 puts you not only at the mercy of your own routing abilities, but at the mercy of the company providing the sound system's ability to use AES50. And sometimes it can just be finicky and nobody wants to sort out that on a long festival day with multiple bands, not knowing where the problem is, when there's a short changeover time, and several other acts to deal with... and you're the only one wanting to run a band's AES50 and maybe aren't as well versed on it as could be (cable not to spec, routing issues, etc.)
Which is still all moot at the concept, because the XR18/MR18 doesn't have AES50 anyway...
That said, IF a band is carrying their own mon rig AND FOH console (like an X32R and a Midas M32 for FOH) then that scenario makes a lot more sense for AES50 since it's going to stay consistent from gig to gig.
They're only going to hand the provider L-R-S-F (or whatever) which still goes back to the concept that it's as easy (or easier) for the provider than if they were mixing mons (and now house) themselves.
About the worst idea for a touring/traveling act is to think they can carry a mon rig that doesn't have an analog split and will always be able to use their AES50 connection if they aren't also carrying a FOH console.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio I asked a bunch of soundpersonswhen picking an IEM mixer, and everyone just wanted analog tails. Not a single one said they'd prefer to have audio over CAT 5.
@@brianjrobinson Yip. Analog tails are just way more practical for this kind of setup. They eliminate a lot of variables when you aren't providing both your own Mon and FOH console.
99% of the time a Cat-5 scenario is also going to result in a shared gain situation, which leaves one or both of the mixers in a tough spot. Maybe not so much if you have plenty of time for sound checks, but in a 20-minute change over, it's likely going to end disastrous. Not to mention it generally takes longer to set up a the digital routing/patching than it does to patch in your analog connections with how the system is already configured. With an analog tail, you can patch in in under 5 min, if something doesn't work and you don't have a quick fix or you are running out of time, just re-patch like normal and go.
There's another Behringer XR18 or MR18 video now published that focuses on the settings to use and consider for using these consoles as a dedicated monitor console. It is here:
czcams.com/video/Zf83kolgVzk/video.html
I put the ears on the rack backwards so it was cleaner all the cables and snake went out the back
Definitely a good way to go. Keeps things neat and efficient.
isn't there a video that is basic hookup without a spitter? I've watched 7 videos and they are all advanced.
I just realized your initial comment about in ear mons was under the Aux Fed Sub video... I thought you were watching this Monitor Setup video that was published in about that same timeframe. So I didn't give you a link to this one thinking this was the one we were commenting under. Definitely watch this one:
czcams.com/video/5gzsEErKdb8/video.html
You wouldn't happen to be on Talkbass are you?
No, first I think I've heard of it.
Number of us on TB dealing w these IEM issues. Setting up IEM's for my people.
Now sub'd this channel.
You know you can flip the ears on the Behringer & have all the wires inside.
Definitely a good suggestion. I mentioned user options and even show a photo of a a rackmounted XR18 with reversed ear pieces at 8:02 but it kind of gets lost in the video, so it's good to have a reminder about that option.
@@AlanHamiltonAudio it definitely got lost in there, love how clean it is that way.
I just can not for the life of me understand why SHIT QUALITY GEAR IS USED!!! But, perhaps that is why they are still "socking it out" in dank, stinky, bars and Nightclubs where bands play for a crowd from 3 to 27 people for $200.00 a show, where the "sound" operater takes 50% or more of the $200.00 income!!! Behringer and ART...🤣😳!!
Seems harsh... There's nothing wrong with the XR18 or the ART S8. The S8 is a splitter, exactly what COULD be wrong with it? Different transformers maybe? Who will even hear that in a small club, if there's a noticeable difference anyway? And different doesn't mean bad... just different. And it's questionable how much 'different' it will be anyway. Let alone that difference be heard over ambient noise and stage volume in the room. And if it could be heard, would the normal club speakers be capable of really presenting that difference?
And even if they are, we're not talking bad vs good... We'd be talking 'different'. And once the show starts nobody in the crowd would know the difference anyway.
Nobody is making a habit of taking an XR18 into an arena... Nobody is bringing an S6L into a small club either.
Proper gear for the venue... either way it goes.
If you need 16 channels or less, it's hard to beat the XR18 or the MR18.
An AH MixWiz doesn't have nearly the power or flexibility. Plus it's analog in a digital world. Presonus?
A small Yamaha?
Budget... bang for the buck... needs vs wants... It's all a factor.
Dave Matthews band had an X32 rack on stage at the keyboard rig in their current tour.
@@jonathanfegel307 I would honestly say that more then likely that is part of Bud's Rig and setup. With multiple keys, laptop DAW's and the need for multiple patches of I/O's, it is easier for him to have the stage control he wants, and needs. He is running a hardwired mult-out to Countryman DI's, into the stage split-to-FOH(Tommy's)-to-MON(Ian's) snake head.
Which that is more than likely a Whirlwind or a Fiberplex or Avid 3way fiberoptic split snake, they (UltraSound) are also using a lot of Galileo gear for this tour. But they will absolutely 100% not use an open-ended wireless snake for the FOH & MONITOR WORLD sends and returns!!! There is just not enough stability in using an ethernet or Wi-Fi dependent system, especially when they will need redundancy in a wired system. No major Touring sound company is going to chance drop-outs, risk bleed from other sources like a out 30,000 cell phones and airports, taxi and limo services, and again... especially if they are dropping or flying firewire, it is just not stable enough. I am surprised the production team has not tried to talk Buddy out of using his Behringer X32, or anything Behringer for that matter, let's see by tours end if he is still using that signal processing rig, once he has a few "oopoopsies" and or keyboard system failures due to Behringer's less then stellar, but not completely piss-poor manufacturing and sourcing of components for their products!! I tip my hat to the bravery that Buddy is showing, if he is using and or relying on less then stellar, top shelf equipment. I mean after a few crashes, he will either ream Behringer a new arsehole, or upgrade to more stable and reliable signal processing systems. Yes, there is absolutely a place in live sound for Behringer... it is normally called a trash can, but eventually even the local, hard working bands and or venues who can't afford to spend tens of thousands on Avid, Midas, Whirlwind, Fiberplex,
D & B Audiotechnik and many more WORLD class touring rigs and partners will get sick to death of Behringer and other substandard gear, the inconsistencies that come with those manufacturers and start bitching loud enough about it to get changes made to warrant their use in their venues or bands!! But until then.... and that is a very long time from now, until that happens... Behringer crap will be on the lips of everyone who is still slugging it out in the trenches.... AND TO THOSE GREAT LOCAL BANDS AND VENUES DOING THAT.... I SALUTE YOU!!! 🤘🏼🙂👍🏼
ANYWAY, KEEP ON KEEPING ON BROTHER AND SISTER ROCKERS!!!!!!!
PEACE!!!!!!!🤘🏼
@@TheRealBKSchyster are you hiring?
@@jonathanfegel307 No sir... Totally Freelance at this point. But I have checked your channel out, your doing some real world good with "side-by-side" comparisons and you seem to have a foothold in the studio world!! Stay focused, keep doing what your doing in the studio. Here is a tip for you... if your "bread and butter" is getting it finished and in the can... stay with that, get REALLY, REALLY good at that, there is where the real world dollars are at!! There are alot of first class FOH & MON Engineers out there and they're finding work, but that is just that... the ceiling on earning is very finite (veryyyyyyy finite!!) And while there certainly is not a infinite amount of income to be made from Engineering, Recording Engineers in the "live world" is wicked necessary!! For live albums, "critiquing" for band members so as to improve live performances, Rehearsal referencing through Recorded media... the sky is virtually the limit on that...!! It is almost an open ended endeavor where you can write your "own ticket," and create a market resource, especially now that this goofy coronavirus thing is starting to get behind us and "live performances" of every genre is once again popping!! Your smart, you can make that happen!!
ANYWAY, KEEP ON KEEPING ON BROTHER ENGINEER!!!!!
PEACE!!!!! 🤘🏼
P.ost S.cript... This is between you and me here... but the cat Named A. Fr_ _ dman declared that he could hear Sonic quality issues in the Neumann vs. sE mic shootout.... I was going to comment on that, something to the tune of....
"Yeah.... I suppose you, "Mr. F," have perfect pitch and can FART IN A440 too...!!😁😆🤣😉🤫 But, I find it a better joke between you and me!!🤘🏼