Wagner's Ring Cycle Leitmotifs, Metropolitan Opera Orchestra
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- čas přidán 18. 05. 2011
- Taken from the Metropolitan Opera Live in HD series, members of the Metropolitan Opera Brass section explain and demonstrate Wagner's use of leitmotifs throughout his Ring Cycle.
David Krauss, Billy Hunter, Ray Riccomini, Peter Bond -trumpets
Joe Anderer, Erik Ralkse, Scott Brubaker, Michelle Baker, Javier Gandara, Brad Gemeinhardt, Anne Scharer, Barbara Currie, Julia Pilant, Tony Cecere- Horns
David Langlitz, Demian Austin, Weston Sprott, Stephen Norrell, Pat Herb- trombones
Paul Pollard- bass trumpet
Chris Hall - tuba - Hudba
I had a combined music theory and history class in college - two hours a day, five days a week, for two years. A peak experience.
One week we listened to the entirety of Das Rheingold (Solti Vienna) - we listened for an hour with scores, then discussed.
I was following a terrific trumpet line, when it dropped below middle C and kept on descending! What? So I looked at the full score after class. There were two C trumpets playing the line in the treble clef, then the bass trumpet joined, the C trumpets cut out, and the bass trumpet continued down the bass clef.
That was the first time I heard a bass trumpet do anything. What a thrill!
I love the Walhall theme, could hear this all day.
I love the sound of the Wagnertubas ❤
Disappointed they didn't feature the contrabass trombone in this video, but very nice nonetheless. David Krauss' control on that demonstration was just sublime.
This is a fantastic and very informative video. Thanks to all the great brass players of the Metropolitan Opera Orchestra, and especially David Krauss.
I never knew that Mr. Pollard played bass Trumpet.
I love that ordinary Tubas just weren't good enough for Wagner, he had to create his own version! What a legend, such wonderful music.
He's the only orchestrator that have put a non-existing tone colour to reality, he surely was a legend, so strong of a personality
@@wilhelmorangenbaum163 Berlioz
@@musicworld6803 Berlioz was the first grand orchestrator and developer of the modern orchestra even before Wagner, but as far as I know he didn't conceive a new instrument like Wagner did with the Wagner tuba.
This instrument has nothing to do with tubas though, it's more like a bass french horn. It's also a pretty awfully designed instrument, modern instruments like the euphonium work much better for the Wagner tuba's purpose
My understanding was that Wagner had a sound in his head that couldn’t be filled and so created a “mid instrument”. He was looking for a grand, full range of brass.
Bravo! I am grateful for your engaging and informative commentary. Those who appreciate this subject may enjoy reading my father's doctoral dissertation entitled "The Leitmotif, Sword", Dr. John E. Jenkins, University of Southern Mississippi, 1978. He created quite a controversy within his graduate committee who demanded that he defend his decision to "make seven notes of music" the theme of his dissertation!
I hope that you had the chance to research my Dad's dissertation. (I, too, graduated from USM, '77 :-)
Eva Jenkins that’s a funny story, and entirely believable. Oh those dissertation committees! The same guys who kept giving the Prix de Rome to non-entities while ignoring Berlioz, etc...
God bless your Papa!
@@PTCello So true!
Even more interesting, we were college roommates!
@Richard Wagner yes...and we were college roommates as well!
Learned quite a bit here, and what I thought was used in some of Wagner's pieces was completely wrong, and I'm delighted to find out what is played. Thank you.
Superb discussion and illustration of leitmotifs in Wagner's Ring Cycle. *Bravo*! Thrilling music and informative commentary.
this is very cool! all the knowledge, the instruments!
I see a lot of questions about Wagner tubas and tenor horns(or euphoniums). Differences: 1) euphonium(and baritone and tenor horn) are more similar to trombone with a mouthpiece. 2) the side of valves on wagner tuben is left(as the F horn) and the euphonium(baritone and tenor) are on the right 3) tenor, baritone and euphonium are all in Bb while wagner tuben are in two different keys Bb and F.
To the question of Wagner tubas replacing the usual tubas... they dont! Usual tubas are BASS and wagner tubas are TENOR and ALTO. So they do not replace but add to the sound.
Yes, the Wagner tuba uses a french horn mouthpiece, but euphoniums and tubas also have conical bore tubing, where the trombone, baritone and Wagner tuba have cylindrical bore tubing. There are lots of options in the brass family, which is great for brass players!
@@majcrash Wagner tubas have conical bores.
The only thing i don't get: if we have a low tenor tuba, is the bass tuba exists??
@@user-md3li9hx8g Yes. It's called F Tuba.
Pretty big difference is also Wagner tubas suck to play lol
Thank you for that wonderful explanation of the instruments, leitmotifs, etc. In my mind Wagner is the king of composers for the brass section. I'm sure brass players could give other examples. I know Sibelius is famous for his use of brass.
2:06 In the words of Anna Russell, "So he pulls out the sword that's stuck in the tree that grows through the house that Jack... that *Hunding* built!"
He's VERY House & Garden!
What sweet people. They explain everything very clearly. For the people who have little information (like me) this video is brilliant.
Many horn players don't like the Wagner Tuben, but I always loved my Miraphone B-flat. Couldn't play it enough!
They hate it for good reasons lol
The sword theme is one of my fav. Really good.
Francis I love it too!
Wasn't this theme used in Disney's animated movie "The Sword In The Stone?"
Wow! I've learnt something really new!
I love the Ring and I love hearing about it!
incredible playing
Great! Thank you!!
I want to hear just the rehearsal footage. It sounds absolutely marvelous.
Excellent!
thank you
What I enjoyed the most about this wonderful post is that you don't have to stand that despicable breed of petty dictators known as conductors, just the great guys who make you celebrate music: the members of the orchestra.
Tenor and Bass tuba's according to Berlioz's treatise on orchestration were devised by wagner and are "tubas furnished with horn mouthpieces and to be played by horn players" However the tenor horn of brass bands are different instruments.
@daletherail It's in C, not sure what brand, but the most popular rotary bass trumpets these days are from Thein and Alexander.
@daletherail It is a Yamaha Rotary C Bass Trumpet, really has a nice trumpet sound and not a valve trombone sound (like my Bach does)
Yay, somebody recognizes a bass trumpet.
Nice.
that sword theme is badass
This was awesome, is this part of a special feature?
They don't replace tubas. They are alternate voices similar to a horn, played by hornists, with horn-like mouthpieces. TUBA is a generic term for a horn in this case.
Yagiz if you're reading this I was here first
The instruments are Wagner tubas, trumpets, trombones.
A la tercera tuba wagneriana, le doy hasta que la tetralogía se toque en Tel Aviv...
that was good. why did it end?
RESPECT
Lol at Paul Pollard's peak at the camera at 5:00
"Who the hell gave me this shitty bass trumpet? I said I play te bass trombone, not trumpet, damn it"
Wagner ist mein Lieblings-Komponist der Oper. Allerdings mag ich ihn trotz der Tatsache, er sei ein bösartiger Antisemit. Der Ring des Nibelungen ist mein Favorit. Mag ich vor allem die Walküre. Das Rheingold ist auch ziemlich gut.
Schlechter Mensch, geniale Musik.
This sounds like my USA Olds baritone horn, that I recommended to a compactor.
We have in Our military band the bas-fluegelhorn pitched in B-flat that look the same...I don't know how the Wagnerian tubas pitched but looked pritty similar. Maybe a horn player from Germany who playing brass and knowing the german brass bands instruments...because they use lots of other brass instruments different the french or american bands
Where is the full video of this?
@bradn7
German C trumpets are just made with rotary valves.
How do you realize that you know this piece too well?
When the basstrumpet is playing the "Sword Motif" and you know exactly that this is the first time it showed up in "Die Walküre" and not the first time it showed up in the Ring because you hear Oboe answering in your head.
The first time the motiv shows up it in "Das Rheingold" it is played by a regular trumpet and in a broader rhythm.
And I know this just from having listened to the thing, not through studying the scores extensively.
Singular: Leitmotiv
Plural: Leitmotive
☝️😤👊😋😩
John Williams music incorporates many classical giants, subtly enough so untrained ears think he's created it all from scratch Nothing wrong with that... Just heightening awareness , lighting single candles whilst cursing the darkness.
Case in point, the heavy piano from 4 minutes into the Battle of Hoth (TESB) owes much to the Giants leitmotiv from Das Rheingold. Similarly, the solo English horn from Dune Sea (ANH) is very like Stravinsky's Rites of Spring.
To the uploader: Is this on a DVD that is available for purchase? If so, what is it called?
The instruments are Wagner tubas, trumpets, trombone, French horns..
What brand and key is the bass trumpet?
Is Ieitmotif an english word, cause in germany we say Leitmotiv (means the same).
null 0 yes
@@baileygoff2365 thank you 😊
You are so wrong. The instruments used in this video are wagner tubas, created by Wagner. It's a crossover between a tuba and a horn, played with a horn mouthpiece and the valves are operated with the left hand.
Who is wrong?
Cuando veo este vídeo, o en el que hablan del preludio de Das Reingold sobre el acorde de Mi, pienso ilusionado en el día en que @jaimealtozano nos deleitará con su análisis para legos como yo. 😅
I also look like the use of the contrabass tuba as the dragon theme, just awesome.
That said often i find the use of leitmotifs Mickey mousing. Do i have to hear the Valhalla theme anyone mentions the gods?
I recently read that Olds, King, etc, baritone horns were designed by Foster Adolph Reynolds, using very poor techniques, compared to these Wagner Tubas. Wagner seems to have been derived from military horns of the Ottoman Empire, perhaps via the Indian Empire, plus the ideas of the Saxhorns of Paris France.
Thank you for your information, even for beginners you look like quite normal people! :D
leitmotifs have got a specific gestalt btw.
Well, I had already seen this video when I was trying to understand how a Wagnerian orchestra works (even if this is from the MET) and also when I was studying the leitmotifs (I started to know about this thanks to John Williams and the STAR WARS soundtrack).
I was between 13 and 14 years old when I started here to watch Wagner's Musical Dramas on CZcams (of course, subtitled, although I also know German very well when studying the history of Germany), I had already studied the legends on which they are based and heard the overtures and the preludes (starting with the Ride of the Valkyries, which I think is the only excerpt from the "Ring" composed by Wagner, the others seem to have been arranged by third parties for the concerts).
Now I am 16 years old, and I know everything there is to know about the Classical Genre, now I find this to be something basic, the performers do not seem so bad to me (I no longer like the James Levine recordings or the Wagner productions at the MET ) Even Wagner did not like the word "leitmotif" he preferred to have people guess what the motifs represented, in their minds, nor did he name the motifs since he thought it would be like numbering streets, but this is a good introduction for certain people who want to know about leitmotifs, even for children.
Greetings from Venezuela.
How cute - 16 and you think you know everything about Classical.
Wow!
@@brucekuehn4031 I know you wrote a sarcastic comment, but you think that because of my age I am not free to learn about these things, you do not know it but in my country we have an Orchestra System that has been supported by various conductors around the world such as Simon Rattle, and I was part of a musical nucleus in which I learned to play percussion and wind instruments.
And I didn't say that I knew everything, I only know the most essential, but I'm never tired of investigating.
I have never understand why so many people like the James Levine's recordings so much, I never liked them, I never like him (and I'm not talking about his scandals but about his artistry, or more according, the lack of it). I have always found him overrated, many conductors prior him and contemporary to him were better Wagnerian conductors.
Greetings to you, from another Venezuelan
"Now I am 16 years old, and I know everything there is to know about the Classical Genre"
That's definately something a 16 year old would say. ;)
Are the horns too heavy for the players to hold up properly? They play into their clothing for that muffled sound.
only 4 leitmotive? the Ring has a few dozen important motive - love, ring, curse, spear, gold, nibelung hammering, Alberich’s hatred, renunciation, and many others
I would tamper with the pit. Have some of the brass playing into shells while facing towards the back (looking into the concave) with the 'concave' pointed to the audience. Beyreuth was a beer-town. Looking for other-world sound to be heard by the inebriated. Don't know the works. I'm sure that much could be done beyond the over-the-top staging for an idolatrous public.
Can someone explain to this woodwind player why the trumpets have a characteristic design to them? Is this design more "period accurate" to Wagners's operas? I've only seen this sideways, rotary valve design once or twice in American orchestras.
Rotary trumpets are the standard type of trumpets in Germany, but they have become very popular in American orchestras because of their large capabilities in tone color compared to a piston trumpet. Some of them also come with additional keys that make higher notes easier
Why use rotor trumpets vs piston trumpets?
The main difference for the auditorium is piston trumpets are like signals trumpets with sharp sound while rotor trumpets have a broader sound. See also www.trumpethub.com/rotary-valve-vs-piston-valve-trumpets/ - Heinz
Really? You misunderstand what the tuben was made for... its basically a bass horn with a similar acoustic property to a tuba.... its different to a euph in the way that it has a conical mouthpiece rather than a cup, it is nothing to do with being better than a tuba at all
It's really too bad that more pieces don't use them. It's quite a nice addition. (Not replacement for anything!) The only composers I know that used them frequently were Wagner and Bruckner.
^ Richard Strauss uses them in his operas. Elektra is one example I can think of. He is continuing the operatic legacy of Wagner in that way,
Richard Strauss used them but realized euphoniums were better instruments and changed them to those lol
Yamaha Custom in C
wrong. they are wagner tubas
Por favor no habléis mientras se oye la composición.
I have the full nibelungen tetralogy recorded by metropolitan
Old records from Bayreuther Festspiele are much better. My favorite: Clemens Krauss from 1953. Incredibly good.
It's incorrect to say it sounds like a "high-pitched tuba." If that were the case, then you would just use a euphonium, which is exactly that--a high-pitched tuba (and which sounds similar, but not exactly). It's much more correct to call them lower-pitched horns since that was Wagner's intention. Also, why did the guy say they started life as military instruments? They started life because Wagner asked for them to be made for the Ring.
Yes, Wagner needed an instrument to fill the gap between French horns and tuba. - Heinz
It would be cool if the video would actually be what it claims to be.
they were more like octave down french horns
tell me these are different instruments /watch?v=z9FChZq8Pbg
it does not matter that the valves are on the opposit, and the bigger mouthpice sound better :D
lets say these are modern wagner tubas ;)
They are tenorhorns, so different instruments. Yes they are better than Wagner tubas, but that doesn't take much. And they're actually older than Wagner tubas
No, no, guys. The hand goes in the bell of the Wagner tubby, right up to the elbow!
I wish regietheater would respect this aspect of opera instead of negating it.
01:13
They have tuba tone (what Wagner wanted), which is much different from the tone of the horns. Euphoniums where never part of opera, or symphony orchestration, and also have much different tones than the upper range of tuba.
They have french horn tone, not tuba tone. They're bass french horns. Wagner wanted an instrument that filled the gap between trombones and french horns
Wagnertuba is developed by Vaclav Cerveny 30 years before Wagner used it. Bruckner and Strauss used the instrument before he did. I don't know if the basstrumpet en contrabastrombone are really Wagner's creation? Nice video!
Bruckner and Strauss used it after Wagner, actually. Check out www.wagner-tuba.com/ for more information.
Bruckner didn't use them until his 7th Symphony. They only appear in earlier symphonies in his revised versions. Strauss wasn't using them earlier either. Both of them admitted to being influenced by Wagner, among so many others.
That's some conspiracy type misinformation if I ever read any.
Cerveny built a Tuba that he called "Wagner" after meeting the man. But that is not the same type of instrument. The Ring was written between 1851 and 1875. Strauss was 12 when it was premiered fully and 5 when "Das Rheingold" was premiered.
How on earth would he have used the instrument before Wagner?
Bruckner used them the first time in the 7th Symphony, which was composed in the year Wagner died.
I'm sorry but a leitmotiv and a theme are different. The first one is shorter and has to represent an idea or a place or a character . A theme is a melody and doesn't have to represent a specific idea.
Sorry to contradict you. The 4 notes at begin of Beethoven's 5th are a theme but not a Leitmotiv although very short. - Heinz
am I the only person here for school
If Puccini or Verdi had written the RING, it would have been much shorter--and a heck of a lot better!
They are called 'Tenorhorn' or 'Bartione' and they are played with Trombone size mouthpeaces
not with horn ones like in the video ^^
mostly used in the bavarian and böhmisch traditional music
Is it fair to say that these players are no where near to how the brass players sound in the Cleveland and Philadelphia Orchestras.....?
moog it
I wish the anti semitist junk would stop and we could just focus on discussing Wagners music!!
AMEN! I went to a graduate school where we did not talk about the revolutionary music, we talked about how anti-semitic Wagner was and how we need to focus on that. Bullshit, his music changed my life! I hate to say it, but I don't study music because of how corrupt musicians like Strauss and Wagner were; we are musicians because we can take part in creating their musical achievements.
Not the best comparison but considering the other comments, why not... There it goes. I agree with you, when for example people talk about the Autobahn people don't talk about how bad it is because it was finished by Hitler or that they won't use it because it was built by the nazis, they just focus on the highway
To a certain extent I totally agree agree with that, I think you can just enjoy it. On the other hand, it's not like his antisemitism had no effect on his art/music. I mean, he published writings on "the jewishness of music" and how jews are basically ruining music and German culture. The whole purity of the Aryan race thing wasn't something outside of how he thought about music and art. We even can see how the villains in his operas like The Ring and Parsifal have the same caricatured "jewish" qualities that Nazis later used in their propaganda. It's not like he was the only person who did this or anything, you see it all the time with Charles Dickens as well with characters like Fagan in Oliver Twist. That being said, both of these people were some of the first to introduce me to classical music and literature. Nobody's saying you shouldn't enjoy Wagner, but politics in music has always been something worth talking about and it's worth being informed about just to stay objective.
It's a shame that people focus on Wagner's antisemitism, which has little to no effect on his music's meaning, rather than his socialism, which permeates the Ring from beginning to end.
Wagner tuba
It was just a joke really, not an accurate musical point!
It seems that programming at MET Opera Radio has been taken over by radical feminists. Call it Amy Tan Radio now. For at least a year now, listening to them, you might think that Amy Tan, Fanny Mendelssohn and Nadja Boulanger rank with Mozart, Wagner and Verdi.
(MET Opera Radio is the MET's pay satellite channel.)
It's really an insult to women everywhere to get our noses rubbed hourly in the fact that women have produced only 3 composers of inconsequential piano ditties.
Birric Forcella
And this rant is relevant to the video because...?