How a Carrier Rose From the Dead and Defeated Japan
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- čas přidán 11. 09. 2023
- The USS Hornet CV-8 and CV-12 are two of the most important aircraft carriers in the history of the United States Navy. These great ships helped to defeat the Imperial Japanese Navy and win the war in the Pacific. This was made using the World War II flight simulator War Thunder (Download it free here: playwt.link/tj3 ). Hope you enjoy! Please like, comment, and subscribe. #WW2 #WWIIHistory #WarThunder
A big thanks to George Retelas and the USS Hornet! Make sure to check them out here:
George Retelas' Channel: / @georgeretelas
USS Hornet Museum Website: uss-hornet.org/
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Hope you guys enjoy. This is a very different sort of video style, so I hope you guys like it. For those wondering: I had to make some changes to the video and reupload, as I had some issues with a later part of the video that had to be fixed.
Too bad you lost some views, but I hope it will be like with the ship: the second one will stay with us longer
@@crawfy48 A+ comment here!
Thank God I thought I was losing my mind. I had watched first 15 min but couldn't find it when I came back to finish watching.
My great uncle Jack, one of my grandpa’s older brothers that served in WWII, was stationed on U.S.S. Hornet (CV-8) as an aircraft mechanic and side hustled as a decal artist. He was there for the Doolittle raids and was rescued twice out of the water twice during the battle of Santa Cruz. I unfortunately wasn’t able to meet him by the time I was old enough to understand any stories that he told family and friends, but I’ve gathered over the years that CV-8 was a special crew much like Enterprise.
I did enjoy this though it was painful. Flooded with memories and stories of the past, not experiences of my own. My empathy is highly sensitive at this time, and due to seasonal affect disorder I'm plunging deep down a dark spiral of depression (nobody's fault it just is what it is). The melancholic melody of the underlying music had grabbed my heart and squeezed mercilessly, the government shutdown looming large like the sword of Damaclese over all our heads, personal life issues and other tings all conspiring to block all the good, love, and light in this world from my perception, all I see is darkness and evil growing. And it is all pulling me down.
This didn't help. But the thought that Hornet still floats a mere 70 miles away, I think will keep that dark spinning funnel at bay. At least fir another day.
This was beautiful, painful,.important, and reality that needs to be told. Thank you.
I didn't even know the 2nd Hornet was now a museum ship. It's too bad that the Enterprise wasn't saved as well.
From what I understand, Eisenhower tried like hell to make it happen, but it just wasn't in the cards. Enterprise was probably the most significant ship in the entire war, all things considered. The US might well have been pushed back to Hawaii without it, especially once the original Hornet was lost. I visited the Hornet in Alameda a few years ago, not as impressive as the Midway in San Diego as far as being a museum showpiece, but the Hornet has actually been there and done that. Midway was a post-war ship only, and never saw battle against a real opponent.
I know right, In my opinion Hornet is probably the closes thing to Enterprise CV-6 in historical and achievements that we can still cherish and hold on too.
I loved getting to go see the second Yorktown and they Laffey on South Carolina along with the submarine there at port. The guide from the Yorktown we had told me and my cousin where the emergency/dive siren was in the submarine and that it was still operational and we had a blast waiting for different groups of people coming thru and we would hit that alarm and watch ppl scatter like Cockroaches hahaha we played with that alarm for hours seemed like. I would love going back to patriots point and taking my 3&5 year old in a couple years when they are a little older. They loved the air base ofd Perdido Key bc my daughter loves planes and she’s just turning 5 in Feb 😊 trying to raise them with the knowledge of history and all that our service men and women went thru to give us the freedoms we have today that sadly this new generation are so dead set on doing away with those freedoms and liberties many fought and died to give us and protect!!
@@kennethbarrett3902I volunteered at patriots point for almost a year, great time! No submarine anymore, but Yorktown, Laffey, and the Vietnam area are still here!
It’s terrible that the government did what they did to Enterprise. Politicians always mess up everything they get involved in. They believed it would cost to much to save her yet they definitely spent more to retrofit or redesign the USS Midway twice. It’s also a shame that there will probably never be another Enterprise or Hornet with the way we are naming ships now.
You know that Marine on the diving board loved his job
This ship is cool but I wish I could also have seen her sister ship Enterprise. Non of the Yorktown class carriers survived until today which really sucks considering the history they carry.
My Uncle, Randolf Boyer, was the skipper of the USS Morris. His ship received over 500 men off of the stricken Hornet in the Battle of the Santa Cruz Islands. I wish I could have met him. He died at sea
My father was an SBD pilot assigned to VS-8 on the USS Hornet (CV-8). During the Battle of Santa Cruz, his squadron was attacking the Japanese carrier Shokaku as the Hornet was being bombed and torpedoed. He hit the Shokaku with a 1000 lbs. bomb but unfortunately his squadron was unable to sink it. However, it did put Shokaku out of the war for almost 7 months. During his return to the US fleet, he was attacked by a Zero which severely wounded his rear gunner. He was able to escape but when he sighted the Hornet it was dead in the water, listing, and unable to land planes. Fortunately he was able to find the USS Enterprise. After an initial wave off and with almost empty fuel tanks he was able to land. He rear gunner had lost so much blood that as his plane was being pushed aside, an Enterprise plane handler pointed at his SBD and said "Look that plane is bleeding!" His rear gunner spent 6 months in the hospital but survived and lived until 2007. After the Hornet sunk, he was assigned to the USS Lexington (CV-16). In addition to the Battle of Santa Cruz, he also saw action at the Battle of Midway, the Battle of the Philippine Sea, as well as attacks on Japanese installations at Truk Lagoon, Hollandia, Palau, Wake Island, Wolei, the Marshall Islands, and the Caroline Islands. He was awarded the Navy Cross, the Silver Star, 2 Distinguished Flying Crosses, and 2 Air Medals.
Wow!! I assume your father has passed away? Very cool.
He died in 2001 at the age of 84. Fortunate our family encouraged him and he wrote down his war experiences before he passed.
@@BP-1988 very cool. If you would like, I'd love to read them. Tj3business@gmail.com
A great family history. Do you think the National Naval Air Museum on NAS Pensacola, FL, would be interested in preserving his part of history? Or an Air Museum near you. His part of history is worth preserving.
Actually you can look up my father in their kiosk on the second floor of the Naval Air Museum in Pensacola (main building). Our family has a number of his items from the war including all of his medals and ribbons. A number of years ago when we visited the museum and I spoke briefly with one of the curators but never followed up. Our family is in agreement that eventually we want to donate his items to the museum. Pensacola is our first choice because that's where he was in flight school in 1941.
This is the best effort I have seen on explaining this area of history. As an Aussie this only cements my respect for the American effort in the Pacific. I wish we had as many ships in our heritage preservation but they either are sunk or "recycled" due to economics. We are only 25 million in WWII we were only 7 million. We did punch above or weight with your help. Your involvement through your family greatly added to this effort.
Aussie punched WAY above their weight. My WWII father told of the reception the Australians would greet them with, thanks.
@@williamkennedy3837 my grandfather felt likewise. He was at Pearl Harbor and was torpedoed in the night battles at Guadalcanal, but he told before I went off to Navy boot camp that all he wanted to remember of his time in the Navy was the R & R port calls in Australia. I didn't have the heart to tell him I had to turn down shore duty to Perth in order to finish the nuclear power training pipeline. Still kicking myself 40 years later for that little lack of judgment.
Respect is due to the Aussie Diggers. They held the line in your part of the Pacific with many sacrifices. My father received a Digger hat with Regimental Crest from his “time down”. A valued possession.
Thank you.@@andreperrault5393
Above your weight indeed !! And still swinging !!
My father was in route to The USS Hornet CV8 when it was sunk. He was trained to fly Wildcats. Instead of being sent to an island, his group was trained in the Hellcat. Started his war on the Essex. Later on his second deployment he finally got to the Hornet. Where he was for Corba!
Oh, that's some not great timing, I must say
What a legacy those two hornets had
Words can’t describe the respect I have for all of the men and women that served in our military, be it WWI or modern day. The sheer will and bravery it took for these people to serve at all is something to behold. May they all rest in peace. And to everyone who is currently serving, thank you.
My cousin was an aviation radioman assigned to VB-2 on the Hornet as part of task force 58. He and his pilot left the flight deck for a bomb run on a Japanese airfield on April 20th 1944 they hit their target but never returned. They were listed as MIA/KIA the next day. I kept looking for the #44 on all the SB2Cs in the video.
Lieutenant Henry Hunter Watson
Petty Officer 2nd Class Paul Eve Flatt
We have a beautiful bronze memorial plaque in the ship's chapel that has the names of your cousin ARM2C Paul E Flatt and his pilot LT(jg) Henry H Watson Jr on it. If you ever get a chance to visit the museum, please let me know. I would be honored to give you a tour. 🇺🇸
@@GeorgeRetelasWOW. That's awesome man. You never know what winds up bringing people together. Great offer 👍
You should do a video about cv-6, the Enterprise, also has an amazing story not too mention made it's way throughout the entirety of the war trolling the Japanese in the process
Fire control in the military isn't fighting fires. Fire control is aiming and shooting the guns.
Fantastic history on the life of USS Hornet CV-8 and CV-12 T3J. Please do the history life of the legendary USS Enterprise CV-6 {The king of the USN}.
Thanks!
Want tot see Yorktown and Wasp also
I visited Hornet last month. She has a certain air about her. She so big, looks so strong. I know its impossible but she gives off the idea that if needed, she would fight for us again.
Dont forget, this awesome Carrier was also involved in the recovery of the Apollo 11 and 12 missions! From WWII to the moon missions, truly a remarkable historic vessel.
Several years ago my son found my grandfathers name on a crew roster for CV-12 when she was commissioned.
Hats off to all who served🇺🇸
Was aboard USS Ranger 69/70. Crew chief on a F4 Phantom. Believe me when you work 12 on 12 off, no problem going to sleep 😴🇺🇸
I can't believe the Hornet is a museum ship and the Enterprise got turned into Toyotas. Don't get me wrong I am happy to see any ship that served us well in the big one, saved from the scrapyard, for future generations to explore. That being said the Hornet we know from famous battles/missions like Midway and the Doolittle raid is sleeping with the fish. Although this version was instrumental in several important battles it was never the belle of the ball like the previous version. Once again I am grateful they were able to save the Hornet I just wish the Enterprise was next to her. The Enterprise fought from day one (when they sent their planes to try to find the fleet that attacked Pearl Harbor) she was the Hornet's escort for the Doolittle raid. She gave it her all at Midway and chased the Japanese all over the Pacific and her connecting seas throughout the war. I will never understand why their attempt to save her failed so badly, but they couldn't raise the money. Every civilian from Hawaii, California and the Pacific NW should have been ashamed they let her go to scrap.
They did the same thing with the USS Yorktown. The original was sunk at Midway, and she also came back with a vengeance. Under CV10 it earned 11 Battle Stars, 12 if you count the one from CV9, and 5 Battle stars from Vietnam.
Do a video like this for USS Yorktown. There was recently a lot of footage released of her wreck.
God Bless, LONG LIVE YORKTOWN.
November 2014 I met several WW2 Veterans on the Hangar Deck of Hornet. One gentleman (who I’ll always remember) was an Electricians Mate on the Cruiser SS San Francisco at Pearl Harbor. On the day. Tremendous memories
I was on the Hornet in Alameda a few years ago. It truly is amazing.
As an Army guy I stayed aboard the second Hornet and that's where I learned respect for my Navy brothers. It's not an easy life.
Still sucks CV6 isn't with us today. Damn shame.
The Hornet might have been sunk but she kicked the shit out of Japan before she went down. I was a Carrier Sailor (USS Indy CV-62) and my all time favorites are Hornet, Yorktown and the Big E. Those men who fought on these WWII ships were cut from a very special mold. Many signed up the day after Pearl Harbor and had this killer focus; they're going to destroy the Japanese Military and then go home. They don't make em' like that anymore. Everything that was instituted during the War is the foundations of our modern Navy. I will always be indebted to those men who went before us and set the bar. Our Wartime Admirals; Halsey, Nimitz and King were the right leaders at the right time. Haulin' Ass With Halsey. Yes, he made some big mistakes but in totality, no other Admiral could've done what he had done. Nimitz, the calm father figure who fully embraced Joe Rochefort and the decoding whiz kids in that basement. Ernie King was in a word a MuthaF***er. Tough, demanding and to be sure, he had to work within a Germany First mandate. I also want to mention Adm. Lockwood and Skippers like Mush Morton. Our Subs were the only attack platforms out in the Pacific until our industrial base caught up. Thank God for our Submariners.
On the swim deal for abandon ship, we would tuck our dungaree cuffs into our socks, button the top button of our shirt and button the shirt cuffs at our wrists. This would actually give us some buoyancy in the water.
Miss the Indy as well. Wasn't ships company 92-96, CAG5, VAQ.
Don't forget submarine Captain (later Admiral) Eugene Fluckey. He helped to revolutionize submarine warfare on the USS BARB, one of the most successful submarines of WW2. I'm reading his book, "Thunder Below", right now. Eugene Fluckey would earn the Congressional Medal Of Honor for a daring surface harbor raid sinking many ships.
Good job George!! I am sure my dad* would have been proud of your video with TJ3! * Commander John W Ramsey USN 1941-1963 VF-11/VF-111. I recall in dad's ship log he always referred to the ship as "The good ship Hornet". Go Hornet !!!
It's great that history is being preserved and anyone on the world can view these videos. George talked about the smells in the berthing area, ventilation in these berthing compartments was not great, there no air conditioning, and he did not mentioned that smoking was also allowed in them. Some of these compartments were very large with over 100 racks - In the mornings after reveille the area was filled with smoke on top of all the other smells. He also made a about a compartment without without access to the outdoors. That is probably true for more than 95% of the ship where Sailors worked and lived.
Thank you for another outstanding historic video.
I was fortunate to explore CV-12 a bit a few years ago when I lived in the Bay Area. What a treasure. So much history. I'm so thankful for all the sailors and aviators who served on her.
I visited her last month, I fell in love.
I finally got the chance to see the hornet in 2022. My Dad worked on the F-14 program with Grumman from 1970- 1994,6 when Grumman merged with Northrup. I have yet to get to see the Carrie in NY harbor. Being as I grew up in East Hampton NY
I met a mechanic mate / gunner who was part of the Hornet Crew who worked with my Grandfather at the GM transit station in Atlanta in 1963. His name was Howard but they called him Hornet Howey or Double H. He wore a USS Hornet CV-8 with Hornet Design Insignia patch on his work uniform. I wish I could remember his last name but I've lost that memory but I remember that proud 5' 7" giant of a man plain as day.
Next time you visit Hornet CVS 12 go to the very aft end of the flight deck and look at the scars from tail hooks hitting the back edge. My shop was the last space under that area. During flight ops at night off Vietnam it was a thrill to hear a tailhook hit. Essex's did take crashes into the stern of the ship, not a joke, look it up!
We visited CV 12 last winter and it was epic experience.
Very cool!
Thank you for visiting the USS Hornet Museum!⚓︎
2nd Yorktown at Charleston same class, have visited it twice
That 5" gun on the aircraft carrier was almost always used for anti aircraft, but it could also be used against a surface target; and, on destroyers through battleships they were used for both. What you showed with the gun is just the projectile, there would also be a brass powder casing loaded in after the projectile. There were 3 types of projectiles, armor piercing, high capacity (high explosive), and anti aircraft. Each type had a different kind of fuse. Armor piercing has a fuse with a slight time delay which initiates on contact, but sets off the explosive charge after enough delay for the projectile to penetrate INTO the armor so it can do the most damage piercing the armor. High capacity has a fuse that sets off the explosive charge immediately after hitting, and was used to damage unarmored targets on other ships or shore bombardment. Anti aircraft projectiles had what was called a "proximity fuse" which turned itself on when the projectile was fired, and then set off the explosive charge when it sensed the proximity of an aircraft, throwing a shower of "flack" in all directions, and damaging the plane, hopefully enough to bring it down. It did not require a direct hit to bring down a plane.
Cannot say enough about this excellent presentation. It is important history to be remembered, otherwise we lose the lesson. Keep up the great work!
Thank you!
My grandfather was a B25 mechanic starting in Australia and island hopping with the planes.
Did he write any of his work experience down? If so, maybe the Air Force Museum might preserve a copy of it? Everyone who was there contributed.
Awesome video man, it may be long but WORTH EVERY MINUTE. THANK YOU. It was a great in depth look at a legendary ship of WW2. I can imagine what it must have felt like being on board. Seeing the ship and imagining what it was like during the war. I'm positive that theres still a strong energy that remains onboard her. I hope to have the chance to visit a ship like that. Thank you again for an awesome video and please keep up the OUTSTANDING WORK YOU DO. WE APPRECIATE IT, I PROMISE YOU THAT. 😊😊
I was stationed on the Hornet CVS-12 (1968-1970) until we decommissioned it at Bremerton,, Washington. It was my home for 2 1/2 years, then I was transferred to Bon Homme Richard CVA-31 for its last deployment to Vietnam.
Fantastic TJ! This mix of documentary film, sim reenactments and on location filming make this a documentary exceeding that one sees coming out in the mainstream.
Thanks for these videos. They're well researched and you're helping to preserve history.
The Reverence shown before the 2 min mark tells me this is going to be good! Passion makes any project better.
This was so awesome getting to see footage of the original Hornet. I read the book that was written about her several times. To actually see her is amazing!
Outstanding as always, thank you TJ.
My pleasure!
This is a most excellent video!! Packed with tons of info. I definitely learned a few things from this video. I would say that you have gone further with Hornets story than most have ever gone!! Thank you so much for these wonderful videos!
Thank you!
@@TJ3 You are very welcome!!
DAM THIS IS A GREAT VIDEO!!!!!!!!!!!!Thank you for all your work preserving history
This was one of the best videos you have come out with since Ive found you I wanna say last year. Hoping to catch ya on some more streams, Ghost out
My grandfather was a crew member. He was already in the navy when the war started. One of the ships he served on was the hornet. He was there for the Doolittle raid and was there when his home sank in to the sea. I never got to meet him.
You did a great job in this documentary! You also did a great job because of you love of history and passion
I subscribed and like.
Well done! We toured the hornet 10 years or so ago. Amazing experience and highly recommended.
Thank you for visiting our museum!⚓︎
Flash back another 13 years before the 1995 decommissioning of Naval Air Station Alameda. To 1982. My grandfather (25 years Navy), my kid brother and I were fishing off an old octagonal pier (The Cove) near the Seaplane Lagoon. Marines stood guard at many of the buildings and Naval Personnel scampered about in either officers khakis or enlisted dungarees. I’d like to think there were men in the “cracker jacks” in this memory but in that early 80’s period there was a stage when they weren’t seen often. The Base Exchange & Commissary were still open. Any flattop birthed at the four primary piers was a legit man o war. Anyhow Papa fell through a missing plank in that fishing pier. Did “the splits”. That was my last year out at the base as I would turn 12 soon and no longer be permitted on-base. (sigh)
One of your best videos ❤ AWG subscribed!
Very well done!! Bravo Zulu!!
CV-2 Lady Lex is my favorite of the early war carriers. I always had the impression Hornet CV-8 had a mix record at best. Especially being next to useless at midway.
Facts
At midway her air group did basically nothing
@@g.t.richardson6311To be slightly fair, CV-8’s air group had no combat experience unlike the other two Yorktown carriers. The reason why they had no combat experience was because of the Dolittle raid. You win some, you lose some. Everything has trade offs.
@@graceneilitz7661 good point
@@graceneilitz7661 on another note, Saratoga’s air group had just as little combat experience but performed admirably flying off the Yorktown at midway
Yorktowns air group was decimated at coral sea and for most part replaced by Saratoga’s
Very good presentation, thank you!
I didn’t know the original Hornet was in service for such a short lifespan. Lots of interesting information in this documentary.
my dad was a tailseat gunner in squadron VS 8 on the hornet and won 3 air medals during the war....thanks for this video!
Always get the top rack. I seen too many times sailors come back drunk and barf near or on the bottom rack or even pee on the floor or on the bottom rack.
Hey cool video! I like how you brought little personal details like the landing cakes ! You dont get that on history channel! Keep up the great work !
Thanks!!
Reading Wiki and 2 things come to mind. Doolittle Raid and Hornet was mighty young to go. Not as young as the Taiho at 2 months in service but a year is service for the Hornet, could probably still smell new paint. War is never much fun.
Awesome video.
Thank you!
A very moving presentation.
I've been to the museum ship three times. An old timer that served on the hornet was there as a guide. He told me a few ghost stories.
I had the pleasure visiting the carrier several times located in Alameda CA. Unfortunately, I believe it's under appreciated by the local residents.
Hornet plus 3
She Was the primary recovery ship for Apollo 11
A good video.
Ive never understood why the navy opted to reuse the same names of ships especially the carriers. The only explanation would be to confuse the enemy should the name of the ship come out.
I've talked to navy sailors who told me after the first jump, many would line up for seconds. People do that sort of stuff for fun. I also talked to a submariner who said the same thing would happen after the underwater escape test.
THAT IS ONE BADASS VIDEO!
Definitely worth watching.
Thank you!
I wish we would have preserved the Big-E the way we did the Hornet.
They should have made a museum out of the enterprise too
So, would a modern day USS Hornet with F/A 18 Hornets be USS Hornets nest?
What piano music did you use in the background? Its sounds amazing and the video is superb
War Thunder has one of the best, if not the best, Yorktown class models I've ever seen. I always give them a flyby when I see them.
And to this day, the LSO is called “Paddles”, though, are their days numbered with “Magic Carpet”?
When the electronics go, if the plane still flies, the naval aviator will still need the expert naval aviator “paddles” to get aboard. Good thought. I don’t know if the plane would still fly if the automatic landing system is down, but I would hope so
Been on the ship its cool
The York town too. I hope you can do her justice too.
Lt Kiberling Led 5 planes from Midway Island. His 5 planes were first to attack. 2 men from this group survive. The plane was so shot up that it was sent to America to find out why plane made it back to Midway island. Commander Waldron pick à fine pilot for this job. Laiter Waldron and his men would dire except 1 that took off from the carrier
What a brilliant title.
A random day you get voluntold to load some bombs under weird circumstances only to find out you contributed to history...just wild to me 😂
6:40 "No coffee needed" 🤣 Could you imagine? "BATTLESTATIONS! Get your coffee first so your good and ready. We got the enemy closing" 😂
One little correction concerning CIC. CIC is not in the Island, which is from O3 to O11, but on the O2 level under the flight deck below the Island. Otherwise not a bad video concerning the history. Bob and I have been with the Hornet since 1998.
Not mentioned here is that this very same Hornet was the recovery ship for 2 Apollo missions: 11 and 12.
Served on USS Saratoga CV- 60
My older brother was one of the original nuke power plant crew, of the Nimitz.
Maybe, I can connect you, if wanted.
And Babcock and Wilcox built her boilers, like they did for countless other ships that served their crews and nation during WW2.
I love History 😊
to all that never came home.........rest in peace......we have the watch..
Take the top bunk. You dont want to be in the line of fire as the drunks above you heave.
My Family was USN and USAC, with SEA BEES WWII and built Ships for WWI in the pacific noth west and LB area. I think the USN should Have a HORNET as Long as we have a USN! In Memory of the Faith, Bravery, and Sacrifice All of Honet and her CREW! was WIlling to Run HEAD LONG Into! Bet you! a next crew! would consider CV13 Lucky!
G ma was a Boeng stenographer and legal secretary? flew all over the world in WWII and after, first Concord, and 747, Then China and a 747!
This is Great! Stuff! and totally in line with what my friends or family told me , and I remeber. I NEVER Knew about launching off the REAR!
and only a Day away!
Windows are tilted on vessels to prevent glare and confusing reflections, The narrator/tour guide needs to know these things!
They also shed water and ice doesn't accumulate easily
11:21 normally, the LSO would be a pilot (yes, I deliberately used it). Go Army!
Had mitchner handled his ship correctly ...and its air group followed the Enterprise air group. .. those 40 plus planes would have hit Hiriu. Therefore her counter strike against the Yorktown would have never been hit. Only VT8 which broke off found and attacked losing all.
The Enterprise is probably the most revered carrier. But at the time the Yorktown was clearly the best carrier. She had already sunk a light carrier, damaged the shokako, and sunk the soryu. Her airgroup was way better trained..
Thanks for this video. Please note that link to George Retelas' channel is not working (at least for me at the time of this post).
Thank you! Fixed! Here you go: www.youtube.com/@GeorgeRetelas
by his jacket he is seabee talking about aviation. interesting.
Provided a launch platform for the Army Air Force to provide the sons of the emperor a real-time preview of coming attractions...That alone guaranteed the vessel's place in the history books...
I watched it the first time before you had to redo it
ah, the story of the screw up by her dive bombers and fighters at Midway were not told; as well as the Guadalcanal landings...
thanks..... but do you remember the Enterprise!!??
I been on her before she was a musician when my dad resigned on her in 1989 or 1990 before we moved
My great Grandfather served aboard that ship.