Solutions for Power Injection & Data Signal Boosting - Permanent Christmas Lights
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- čas přidán 16. 10. 2020
- Preassembled DigUno: drzzs.com/shop/
Power Injection:
Power injection means running 2 extra wires from the power supply, and connecting them to the + and - wires on the LED strings at one or more places.
Here are a couple examples:
If the power supply is at one end of the Run of LEDs you can connect the extra power injection wires to the power supply and run them parallel to the LEDs and even put them in the channel with the LEDs. Then at one or more places you splice the +/- wires from the LEDs and connect them to your power injection wires.
The power injection wires don’t have to run parallel to the LEDs. Let’s say your power supply is located in your attic (which by the way is an excellent way to keep it out of the elements and make it easy to access in the future). You can run pairs of wire from the PS to several points along the String of LEDs. Maybe you connect in the middle and at both ends.
In fact, connecting power to your strip in the middle is a good way to reduce voltage drop. Remember the power (+/-) doesn’t have to start at the beginning of the string. The electricity doesn’t travel in just one direction. So connect it to whatever part of the string is easiest or makes the most sense for your situation. However, the Data Signal DOES need to start at the beginning, but the power wires don’t. Power injection doesn’t involve the data wire at all, just leave that wire alone.
Why might you need power injection:
First point is you only MIGHT need it. You also might NOT need it.
In General, if you’re using 12v Pixels you won’t need power injection until you get to about 250 Pixels. Even if you DO have more than 250 Pixels you might not need power injection if you keep the brightness down. That’s for 12v LEDs, 5v LEDs on the other hand need more power injection. If you’re using 5v LEDs, you’ll probably need power injection if your strip has more than 150 LEDs. Now, if you’re not sure if you need power injection, you could connect all the LEDs, turn them on and check for dimming. If you notice your colors look dim or just off as you get to the end of the run, then you need power injection. If you can live with the LEDs being a little less than full brightness you can try turning down the brightness until the dimming and color changes go away. Or just give in and do some power injection.
Be really careful that you don’t mix up the +/-. Most LEDs will be destroyed if you accidentally swap the + and -.
Data Signal:
The data signal comes from the controller. It’s what tells the LEDs what colors to be and when to blink, fade or whatever. There are a few rules to remember about the data signal.
It has to travel in the correct direction. All these LEDs will have some way to indicate the direction the data signal needs to travel. Different companies mark it in different ways. Sometimes an Arrow, sometimes letters like DI. If you’re unlucky and your LEDs don’t have any indicator then usually the female connector is the beginning of the string. If all else fails you can try connecting the data signal to either end to see which is the beginning of the string. It won’t hurt the LEDs to connect the Data signal to the wrong end.
Data Signal needs Strength:
When the data signal starts at the Brain of the controller it comes out at 3v, but the LEDs are generally expecting 5v. That is usually fine unless the data signal voltage drops any lower. What might drop the data signal voltage? A wire that is too thin or too long. So what do you do?
The best thing to do is boost that voltage signal to 5v. There are a few ways to do that. The easiest, is to get a controller that is made to boost the signal. Like the DigUno or DigQuad. You can build your own, or you can buy them pre-assembled. I’ll bet you can guess where to find the links. But, if you don’t want to spend the money for those then you can use what the pros call a Sacrificial Pixel.
Sacrificial Pixel: when the data signal hits the first pixel in the string it is bumped up to 5v (yes, that’s true even with 12v Pixels). So after that first pixel the distance between the first pixel and the rest of the string can be really really far. I tested it and got as far as 40 meters of 20g wire before the signal started to degrade enough to get flickering.
The last thing I’ll say about the data signal is that it can be split. You would do this only if you want all the lights to do the exact same thing all the time. To split it, you just splice in a wire and run it to a new string of LEDs. You can split the data signal anywhere along the string. Those LEDs should also be powered by the same power supply.
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FYI, Blue LEDs have forward voltages at about 2.5 V, green LEDs have forward voltages at about 1.9 V and red LEDs have forward voltages of around 1.6 V. The forward voltage is the minimum voltage required for current to flow through a diode (like an LED). That is why the color shifts toward red when you have voltage drop problems. When the voltage at a pixel is less than 2.5 V, the blue LED can no longer light. When it gets down below 1.9 V, the green LED can no longer light. The Red LED has the lowest forward voltage so it is the last one working.
Great video. Super easy to understand. I'm currently working on my first led strip project and your videos are getting me through the "learning curve" with said electronics!
After racking my brain for days I came across this and it solved my problem. I have 3 strips controlled by 3 different pins and none of them would work properly and kept misbehaving. Put a sacrificial Led in my enclosure with the right next to my esp and it works. Thank you for the valuable information 👍🏼👍🏼
DI is key! I had put in an entire run on a hard to reach gable backwards.. already had wires ran to it and had to pop out and reverse flip around a connection on over 100+ pixels. Good info and just got mine done for the holidays thanks again Drz! Dig Uno and Quad running my entire house from my garage in an old computer case mounted to the wall.
Thank you. Just finished my LED's panic set in about the flickering. Soldering iron back out the tool box. Top man 🤠
Thanks for all the help got my house done!!!! It looks amazing!! Appreciate it
Thanks DrZzs this video fixed my flickering issue!
Thanks for summarizing ! I haven’t tinkered yet to figure out my issue but my LED strip can replicate every color but orange. It is perfect for the first 12ft and then it switches to red instead of orange. Very odd. Total strip has 350 LED’s on a diguno. Will try shortening the distance between the 1st LED and the controller to see if it changes anything.
Thanks DrZzs for wonderful videos. My home wall outlet is 110 V AC, & hooked up with main panel breaker of 15 amps. If I use same outlet to power my pixel controller , how many pixel leds can be hooked up with same controller ? i mean, does 110v AC wall outlet amp capacity & amp being consumed out of DC 12V/5V controller has any relationship ? how to calculate safe amp load?
Hi and great work as usual. What source do you get your 12v pixels from? To date I've only used 5v WS2811 pixels in blocks of 50 however I want some reliable 12v sets for longer runs. Many thanks.
11:24 I know why we need to inject power but I never understood the exact reason and after you mentioned each led has resistance and then boom it clicked it's pretty much a resistor ladder!!
DrZzs
If you connect the positive to one end of the string and the negative to the other end on their respective polarity the voltage applied to the each led would be the same.
Test it out to see if it will allow the leds to still function properly.
Thanks Got the how to for voltage injection. So depending on the number of LEDs you still have to compute for the amperes for all the leds if uou have one power supply? Can you have two pairs of wire in one terminal of the power so that one is in the end and the other on the start? Or better to have separate power on the start and end [since available power supply is single terminal?
Hello sir. I appreciate all the work you are doing. Question, does needing power injection always result in dimming to red? I have a situation where my string just fades to nothing. Thank you for your help. Also, thank you for the 2 data boosters i bought from your store.
So how long have your LEDs been lasting typically? I’m having a problem with regular LED Christmas lights burning out relatively fast... just curious if you have issues with LEDs dying real early or not.
I have enjoyed watching your videos. Quick question as it relates to power injection. Would it be okay to use a separate power supply for power injection only and just run the cords together along the channel? I have always avoided electrical work in my house but I have grown tired of stringing lights every year so giving pixels ago this holiday season so thanks for the great vids!
For power injection, do you need to run both a positive and negative wire from the power supply to the injection point? Or can you just run a positive line? If you have a negative running through the controller and through all the lights inline in that way wouldn't a negative line for each power injection be redundant and unnecessary?
A good way to look at the voltage drop of 12 volt versus 5 volt. A 2.5 volt drop is 50% when using 5 volt but it's only a 20% drop at 12 volt.
Great info, Just wondering I have the 232 touch with on board Mic , where can I download the audio firm ware for it
With regard to the Digi-uno, what side is the fuse protecting? The supply side? If the uno board can handle 15A, why is the 10A supplied? How would one wire 5 - 5m like SK6812 5V-60L, when each string uses 90W each? Just getting confirmation on my thoughts on the last question.
Question. If i have 2 strands connecting and I solder the 3 main wires together, can I just inject power into one set of the extra power wires or do I need to tie into both sets? I’m assuming just one set as power isn’t directional.... am I right?
I've been wanting to put up LEDs on my house for a long time and I'm ready to pull the trigger. Your videos have been very informative and I want to thank you for them. But there's one thing that's got me stumped: proper wire gauge! I want to have a run of about 100' which will be 6 five meter strips. I bought the 5v ones, so I know I'll need power injection, probably between each strip. What gauge wire should I be using for that? I've seen tables that suggest everything form 22AWG to 12AWG. How do I go about calculating that? Thanks!
Are there any problems that would come up if you are using a power supply that is larger than you need. Say like I have a spare 60amp to use, but connect it to just a single strip that only needs 7amp?
I have 5v led strips. If I use a sacrificial pixel I would need a 5v pixel right? Will a pixel work with the strips for level shifting?
Hey DrZzs, is there any way I can connect HassOS directly to GPIO pins for light control? or I should install Home Assistant on Raspbian to have access to the pigpio_daemon?
I currently have HassOS on raspberry Pi 3B+ and wanting to control locally GPIO pins for RGB led lights..
Does this works with apa102 leds or wb? Nice solution. Thx
Can someone help me I'm stuck. I'm fairly new to this I'm telling to do a light show. I bought a light o rama pro and I'm trying to get them to work with my ws2811 smart led strips.i used to have a vss-02-2k-512 dmx to control it but now I'm trying to get it to work on vixen. Do I need to buy something to get it to work or can I hook it up to the light o rama?
So to confirm, you don’t have to put the sacrificial pixel if you have a dig-uno (or dig-quad)? And you can run 3 wire line from the controller (say in the garage), and the first pixel (say up on the roof)?
My very first string of pixel LEDs I bought has one of the LEDs that stays dimly lit with a blue color anytime the 12V power is applied. Is there somewhere I can buy a single LED to replace this bad one?
Have you found any 12mm module/bulb like this that can make a decent Warm White, or only warm white?
What brand of LED strings do you currently suggest using from AliExpress?
What 12v LED strips do you recommend?
I have 4 16.4ft 300 LED Pixel 5v led strip in a row with power injection. I'm having issues with the nobeMCU. When I change the settings on it to give it 1200 led and 65000mh max current, the nobeMCU shuts off and I have to reprogram it on the computer. Is the power too high or the amount of LEDs?
Great Video!
I am dealing with SK6812's for a project. I need to split the strip and wire it around a door frame (about 13 ft of wire). So assuming from your Video it shouldnt matter in terms of data loss? (Since my first pixel ist directly wired to my esp Controller)?
Or do I need to consider anything else?
Can anyone from this lovely community help me out?
You say that you don't need such a big powersupply because the led not going to be on at full all the time? So is it safe to have a smaller power-supply that don't match the maximum powerdraw? No risk of fire or so?
FYI: Same strand lights as Dr. Z. Went from using NodeMCU to Dig-Uno for 6 strands 12v (of 50 x 6=300 “bulbs”) & ALL flickering STOPPED & lights ran perfect till the 7th strand (50 more). At 7th strand I had to power injected at the end. W😳W !!!!!!!!!! I love this Dig-Uno. Just for reference, my old NodeMCU was wired 10” from first “bulb” with small jumper wires. Dr. Z is great!!! BTW, what state is Dr. Z in? Hopefully this helps someone new!
I did a sacrificial led at the control as you said to do, Now the flickering is happening on all the LEDs not just the last group of 50 like before. What happened? I thought putting the sacrificial LED enabled me to run the longer line so I don’t lose signal source. But it just made things worse.
Can I use one ESP8266 for 200ft 12V pixels? Do I need logic level shifter for 12V Pixels?
I’m having a very odd data signal problem, and due to the issue, I have a question. Doesn’t the data signal get pumped up after it passes through a pixel, or does the data signal progressively die the further away from the power supply it gets no matter how many pixels it passes through? I ask because I have a string of lights that is about 30’ from my power supply, I used a sacrificial pixel to boost the signal, and the signal makes it up to my lights, but only the first 8 or so light up and do any patterns. After that, they’re out or blinking random colors/brightnesses. I have tested the board, the lights, and the voltage, and can’t find any obvious issues.
Guys I can’t figure out data boosting, I just purchased a DigQuad and I’m trying to run 50 ft line from my dig quad to my led lights. What am I doing wrong,
I thought this videos shows that you are able to do that? As of right now I’m only able to get like 16ft before my data connection starts acting up. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Do you have any suggestions on how to fit the power injection splicing into an aluminum rail with led strips?
Running a second wire down the rail is fine, but there doesn't seem anywhere near enough space for t connectors or anything like that.
I feel like a connection box between each 5m strip would be ugly and make for gaps in the light array as well. Looking for solutions you or others have come up with.
Im also struggling with this, will try hot glueing the wire inside the profile.
Sorry if this question has already been asked and answered... Can you add LEDs or shorten a ws2811 string if you need to adjust the length? Oftentimes a fixed string length doesn’t always work perfectly to match the length that you’re trying to light.
I just added nine pixels to one end (actually was the beginning) because I had the same concern. It worked out with no issues.
I would like to purchase a led light strip that is remote controlled allowing brightness control, color control, and syncs to music or sounds. I know you can buy one that is like 30 feet long, but it runs on 120V....i would like to know if it is possible to purchase them that runs on solar...or even if I can modify the 120V to run on solar. I also live here in Las Vegas
how about a random blackshep like pixel that has mind of its own 😅 it defers from the rest in terms of effect and color how to solve? im only using 50 pcs of ws2811 like yours
Can we just skip first led on WLED settings? Preferences
How far can you go from the Dig-Uno to the first pixel? And could a Dig-Uno be used in from of something like a Falcon controller to extend the distance to the first pixel?
From a diguno to the first pixel can be really really far. I haven't tested that exactly (but I will). I'd expect 100 ft would be possible.
Hey DrZzs I want to get a logic lever shifter for my LED strips. What kind of shifter do I need? (Which voltage?)
Needs to be rated for the min voltage (input, eg 3.3 volts) and max voltage (output, eg 5 or 12 volts).
I wish I new about dig uno .. ... what to do with all my nodemcu's I'm considering swapping out nodes for the dig...
Why?
Do you have to run a separate wire each time you want to do a power injection or can you run one lone one and keep splicing into it?
You can use 1 cable but just make sure it’s a thicker gauge wire. Thicker wire = less voltage drop
If I'm injecting from a new and different power supply at the far end, can you confirm that the positive wire has to be broken and not continued through but the ground must be linked and continue through?
Try to always use the same power supply for a circuit of LEDs.
I have a "WS2812B RGB 5050SMD 60Pixels/m 300Pixels". I think it uses 15-17amps. How can I use them with the dig uno with only a 10amp fuse?
Should I hook the other end of the strip directly to the 5v 60a power supply?
Okay now I’m confused :). So I want to do my roof even then I want to do like a picture frame around the windows. Can I splice the data wire and connect to the windows or will that now work?
Have an LED related question? Be sure to ask your question in DrZzs Discord led-lighting-diy- Channel on discord! discord.gg/8gvF67h Our LED masterminds, the PixelHeads, generally hang out there and can answer your question(s) swiftly.
I've got 4,5 meters of 5V WS2812B 300 LED strip to deploy behind my TV for Hyperion.
I guess I will need power injection indeed! 😅
What if you’re using a 12v to 5v converter?
Watch wifi range if your a newbie. I still frequently have issues getting the whole strip to work the same and it's usually because a few feet farther I lose connection. These have terrible range! The dig uno really does help because you can mount it closer to the router and further from the leds. Also while your testing its a lot harder to destroy.
good points. I had to put a Wifi access point outside to make sure I got a good signal to a couple flakey controllers. There is also a "pro" model of the D1mini that has a longer antenna to improve range.
@@DrZzs I have a few pro models that don't seem to help at all. I'm going to try soldering an antenna on a normal one soon, maybe that will help. Its tough my experiance with especially the 8266 board isn't great but Drzzs got me hooked!
Hi! My ws2812b 5v light strip with 60led per m lights just 30 nodes, there no dimming at end. Is it also voltage injection or i have other problem?
nope. the problem is just that in the WLED settings, the default is 30 LEDs. You have to go in and change it to the number of LEDs you actually have. :)
@@DrZzs Thanks. You are best!
I followed the beginners guide, got the recommended amperage controllers and have a 60’ run of LEDs that I don’t notice any dimming or flickering. The voltage at the end of the string was still 4.65V. No power injection what so ever. How is that possible?
What voltage did you start with? EDIT: Did you measure that voltage well the leds were white?
Are the 12 volt brighter than the 5 volts? In lux?
Have a look at The Hookup or Quindoors videos on LED strip comparisons.
When I add power injection to any point on my string, it causes all the lights to go out.
I'm using a new quinLEd-dig-quad.
What does this mean I'm doing wrong?
I also see issues after I heat shrink my wires together... They work great, and then I start having connection issues... Any ideas??? Am I melting something?
Sounds like you're getting the power wires reversed on the other end. Double (and triple!) check your polarity. When you heat shrink the connections, do you insulate each wire first? If you're using electrical tape between wires, use more than one layer - a stray copper strand or sharp solder can puncture a single layer. Also, don't heat shrink all the wires together within an inch or two of the end of the strip - the heat shrink can put too much pressure on the side wires, and break their connection to the strip.
@@chrisw1462 Thanks, Chris!!! The issue was the 12v plug I bought... when I was testing the plug and the wires, I was plugging it in correctly, but when I was plugging it into my eve outlets, I plugged it in upsidedown. I didn't realize that reversed the polarity.
you need an australian store :P
I have the same LED light set(s). 12 volt 50 leds per set. I have 4 sets running in series. total of 200 leds on one string. I am running them off of a single 5 volt, 2 amp cell phone charger. I do not have a power injection. my lights do NOT have the voltage drop mis-coloration. I did try to run 2 more sets of 50 leds off of the same controller,(total of 300 LEDS),,NOT GOOD. I blew the controller and had to get another one.
I also have a Small tree with 3 sets of the same lights, and they run off of a 5volt 1 amp cellphone charger. NO ISSUES.
my tree inside has 3 sets of the same LEDS plus a 23 LED ring all running in series from a 5 volt 2 amp cellphone charger.I also have 2 strings of 50 LEDS running parallel. I have these about 15 feet away from the controller. I ran a 3 wire lead from the controller to the LED strips. used a splitter and it WORKS,,, NO ISSUES. no DATA loss,, NO flicker. YUP, you guessed it also uses a 5 volt 1.5 amp cellphone charger for power.
Once you get to 5V you can still get flicker. This video was presented at the Virtual Christmas Summit this year where an actual analysis of the problem was presented along with recommendations on how to solve the problem. czcams.com/video/9ttEAyiyTAI/video.html&ab_channel=VirtualChristmasSummit
Will the sacrificial pixel method work on 5v led strip? It’s for a room and plan to have d1mini about 20ft away from 1st pixel.
Yes !
Yes, it's easy and I have done it
Where's my quad??? Jk got your email I'll be patient I guess uugghh.
So can I buy the parts to make my own Dig-uno or are you just showing making one to be funny? I make boards & repair all the time.
Isn't the input side the side with the chip with 2811?