Ashley's Analysis | Motorcycling Special
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- čas přidán 17. 06. 2023
- The DVSA or Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency show us how NOT to overtake while riding a motorcycle in this episode.
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Motorcycle Instructor here. Love to see you making an episode about motorcycles!
At 4:34 is exactly why I don't stop on the exit at roundabouts for pedestrians. No matter what the rules say it's completely unsafe and never will be. The wording in the highway code is "should". implying "If it's safe". Which it never is. So don't do it motorcyclists. On the approach by all means. Never on an exit.
So youve never been the only vehicle in a roundabout? Whilst I agree with you that it may have been safer for the biker to continue rather than stop there will be times when you can stop safely to let peds cross.
Thank you, I have been thinking the same since the new rules came in, but good to have your input here.
Agrees. Ive done so a handful of times but only when i know its safe and I am not goimg to cause a hazard to other road users.
@@zeberto1986 Even if I was the only vehicle I wouldn't risk it. It's hard to be 100% sure you're the only vehicle given the layout of roundabouts. Any other situation I support the rules and actively try to encourage others to do so by leading as an example.
But you'll never catch me stopping on an exit to a roundabout unless it's clearly marked as a zebra crossing.
is it hard for you to do quick mirror check and stop if there's no vehicle following you. Why always stick with some pointless rules. Just react to every situation accordingly. One day some fast pedestrian decide to cross and you with your "never" stop rule run them over
The roundabout clip is exactly why i don't stop in places like that. Despite the rules, no one expects anyone to stop and let pedestrians cross there. They are usually accelerating to exit and the risk of being knocked off is extremely high. If i see pedestrians waiting to cross, i prepare to stop, even slow down to let them take a gap, but never come to a complete stop and offer for them to cross. I understand the introduction of the rules was around protecting the more vulnerable road users, but i think that the crossing change does the exact opposite and puts all parties at a greater risk.
The confusion is assuming a roundabout is a 'junction'. Yes, any intersection can be referred to as a junction but why then does the Highway Code provide specific rules for roundabouts separate to these new rules for junctions? When entering roundabouts it says you must give way to other road users but there is no mention whatsoever that you must stop for pedestrians waiting to cross when exiting a roundabout.
And should only be done if safe, if I knew there was a lorry right behind me I would not stop, he is going to assume you exit roundabout and go, stupid thing to stop like that.
@@johndilloway9762 agree, surely you need to prioritise your own safety too. I wouldn't fancy being flattened by an artic.
@@I-T-S-M-E Thats it why risk being killed to let them cross when they clearly were not just walking straight out like some do expecting drivers to take evasive action, not just an artic another bike behind could seriously hurt you, and for what, 30 secs of the pedestrians time, no thankyou.
I completely agree.
Common sense should apply.
If less than 10% even know about these changes in the Highway Code, can you really expect people to understand this rule??
I’ve left roundabouts recently knowing full well that I ought to give way to pedestrians. But I’m not happy with what is behind me or it’s two lanes and I’d bet the impatient person who’s been behind for a while would use that as an overtake and squash someone. And if the road is extremely quiet it’s actually better to let them cross behind me after I’ve gone than give way , have a after you, no ,after you standoff then someone else arrives
Yep, that's my take on that and I've done the same. If I am fully able to control the lane crossing width, I will stop, otherwise, with apologies to any pedestrians, I'm not going to invite them into risk.
And no offence to any pedestrian, but they may have issues that impair risk analysis. They may have taken and failed their driving test 30 times, or quite simply not be paying enough attention to think beyond someone stopping to let them cross
@@highdownmartin Quite. Pedestrians are considered the most vulnerable for good reason, not just their physical limitations when meeting with metal.
Yea I don't risk it if its short sighted due to a blind roundabout or theres some idiot behind me, and theres usually an idiot behind me in town because most people are idiots
Stopping to let someone cross when coming off a roundabout, or turning into a side road, is fraught with danger. If someone is too close behind you, they will probably not be expecting you to stop and the next thing you know they'll be driving up your exhaust pipe. Not worth the risk.
If the last one is a relatively new rider, then he's probably just fixated on matching the speed of the speeding gardener's wagon in front - likely a loss of awareness of their own speed.
When the police do it , it's called making progress. When you do it , its called speeding....
agreed, it's a common mistake from people who might otherwise obey speed limits.
@@noggintube Actually I think the police call it 'undue care and attention'. 😁
That's exactly what I was thinking 👍
@@brianperryi pulled behind and followed the police once when they passed me speeding 😂 they slowed down 👀
Before the DSA changed to the DVSA, us motorcycle instructors called them the Double Standards Agency.
Now it's the double and variable standards agency.
He had to brake himself so caused other drivers to have to brake. Not the way to do it
@@markellott5620 Haha I like that one
Maybe that's the real reason they changed the name.
Hi Ashley, as a biker I would love to see more motorcycling special videos, cheers.
As an ex courier it gives me the willies just watching and knowing what will happen!!
I’m ex army and worked in a military hospital many years ago. We also treated civilians. In the men’s surgical ward we had all the injured paratroopers on one side and all the injured motorcyclists on the other. Some of the injuries were horrendous and take many months to heal. If you do ride a motorbike, please wear decent gear and drive safely as you are extremely vulnerable.
There is only one good strategy for riding bikes.
*Don't fall off*
more motorcycle content is needed from the UK, currently the best channel is motorcyclelessonsuk . This would help improve safety. Sometime we do need to call out bad road design too. Crossings with bumps are clear for pedestrians but not as obvious for drivers. Highway code has been updated, but seems to be done so to avoid cost of paint and signs. Councils should consider painting. We have lots of foreign and european drivers on our roads who wont know the highway code. Painting zebra crossings is way safer.
Many years ago (late 70s or early 80s) a reporter for The Motorcycle News did an article about how many near misses he had in a whole year of riding.
He did a month at a time of riding with lights on, then lights off, combinations of Sam Brown belt, full Hi-Viz and so on, and recorded how many near misses he had on each journey.
The only month where he had no near misses at all was when he made his motorbike look like a police bike, and he dressed in a similar style to a police rider - which just goes to prove that car-drivers DO see you, but they only take the correct action if they think that somehow they will be impacted if they do not.
He must have been a most unobservant rider. I commuted 120 miles a day into and out of London for 20 years, on bikes ranging from 125cc through to 1300cc, and can count my "near misses" on one hand. Possibly he was looking for them to include in his article rather than keeping out of danger.
The experiment doesn’t isolate ‘looking like a cop’ and the most-visible setup. So it’s not logical to conclude that ‘looking like a cop’ is the cause of the change in driver behaviour.
Motorcyclist here - agree with all of that. You have to be so situationally aware, behave like others haven't seen you, and anticipate.
On the roundabout thing, in the interests of self-preservation I'd have probably continued through. At the very least approached at walking pace to control the traffic behind.
Agreed but still would have slowed
More to the point, unfortunately, according to the Roundabout section of the highway code, it's a 'may' not 'should' - i.e. the wording is 'be aware of pedestrians crossing and you may need to give way to them' - the exit especially is not a junction, the entry is the junction.
@@katierscott8771 exactly and the wording on the driving test, is entering a hazard and exiting a hazard safely,
Agreed as a long time rider I told my daughter when she bought her first bike is that everyone else on the road is out to kill you and they will come at you in every direction except for below.
Totally agree but will add. Are they looking at me? Number of times I see pedestrians and car/van/ lorry drivers and they aren’t looking at you, at which point I am into self preservation mode.
4:35 yeah, this is why I won't be giving way to pedestrians at roundabouts anytime soon. That was absolutely terrifying. I know it's the 'correct' thing to do, but I don't trust other people on the road enough to not crash into the back of me, sorry. It's not worth it.
100% agree with you there. In that situation there is no way I would have stopped. I've been in that situation a few times and each time I haven't stopped. It's all about safety. The pedestrians are safe where they are standing, if I stop then my safety is reliant on the driver behind me noticing and doing the same. Not a position I'll choose to put myself in.
"Should stop if safe to do so" doesn't mean have to A driver has so little time to decide at a roundabout !!!
As a pedestrian I'd rather wait for an appropriate time to cross than expect traffic to stop for me and risk being run over by a car being rear ended. I'm standing on the pavement. I'm perfectly safe there and don't need traffic to stop. That new highway code regulation is putting lives at risk.
@@peter7582 As a pedestrian I would have felt pressured to cross when I may be more comfortable waiting. A stopped motorcycle does not command the space sufficiently to give me confidence I can cross in safety.
Totally agree but is it the correct thing to do? Just because it's a rule, it doesn't mean that it's a good or sensible one. It's something I would rarely if ever do, rule or not. There's no logic or sense behind it.
Ash I think the roundabout rule change is a frankly good intentioned one that won’t work. How many roundabouts have been built with inadequate stoping zones or proper pedestrian crossing facilities? I personally don’t feel safe stopping at the exit of a roundabout with cars behind that probably aren’t paying attention.
was on a road, going straight at a roundabout, when a car turning left dropped anchor, because the one in front of it did, as did the one in front of that - to let a pedestrian cross, as per the new rules
I wasn't going fast enough to be at risk of hitting them, but nearly got rear shunted myself by someone who wouldn't have seen any reason for the vehicles in front to emergency stop, he didn't have room to stop but thankfully did have space to go around
had he not the pedestrian was going to get hit in a multi-vehicle pileup that was entirely avoidable by doing things the way everyone has been taught and how its worked for decades
It might be well intentioned, but I still think it is a stupid rule change. If we lived in a world where everyone joined roundabouts in the correct lane, maintained lane discipline throughout, indicated correctly and didn't cut across or accidentally meander off course it would be reasonable. But that's not the world we live in. We live in a world of aggressive drivers with indicator allergies and sometimes leaving a roundabout with your sanity intact is a challenge. The last thing we need is pedestrians thinking they have right of way to just step out.
@@ianclose123 I think the main issue with it, regardless of the merits/lack of merits of it as an idea is the way the change has been brought in. The principle of "ignorance of the law is no excuse" is all well and good, but the vast majority of people don't have time to check each and every new bit of paper Westminster vomits forth to see what applies
and in this day and age a few "public information broadcasts" in the small hours won't cut it either
I'd question what proportion of drivers, and indeed pedestrians, are even aware of this?
yes drivers will be more aware as time passes and newer drivers are taught this, but since the behaviour is the exact reverse of what used to be taught, and most taught the old way likely are not aware of the chance, coupled with this change puts the most vulnerable at the highest risk seems madness
as noted above the bulk of roundabouts and other junctions were never designed with this in mind and lack the space for even a single vehicle to stop without causing an obstruction, never mind this is the point said vehicle will be accelerating in order to actually clear the junction
if its an issue as specific junctions, put in a pedestrian crossing of some sort, oh yes, except that can't be done as it _would not be safe to do so and could not meet the requirements to do so_ due to the space concerns
what should have been done is at major roads to provide a light controlled crossing a short but suitably safe distance for roundabouts and for other crossing add a pedestrian phase to lights
otherwise people can have all the "priority" they like and it won't help if they are dead or seriously injured because what they thought the law says and what the other party thought the law said differ - it doesn't matter which was right or wrong, the confusion will cause injuries and fatalities
it is an odd rule, and doesn't seem to work well in practice. It involves the ped knowing that they have priority, the driver knowing they have priority, and the traffic behind them knowing that the traffic may stop. Had a few times I've stopped only to get agro from behind.
Its not like local councils have supported the changes either, putting signs near junctions saying "peds have priority", presuming that telling a ped that they have priority will most likely get the ped hit and sue the council for telling them they should go....
as for the clip, I do know the roundabout. From the direction the biker comes from, it goes to 40 just as they enter the roundabout (if you look on google streetview, the sign is turned around). You could have a change in the priority system that roads over 30mph the vehicles have priority, but this seems like another layer of complexity to an already misunderstood and dangerous rule.
@@ianclose123I agree. A friend of mine had an accident a couple of days ago. The car in front of her stopped suddenly for a pedestrian and she was able to stop in time, but the vehicle behind went straight into the back of her car.
It’s policy through wishful thinking, no doubt as a result of paying heed to activist groups and not consulting everyday drivers. We don’t do anything about the illegal no-licence drivers, the aggressive drivers, the people who ignore every rule in the book. - and then we introduce another layer of complexity to confuse both drivers and pedestrians.
Giving way to pedestrians on roundabout exits is potentially dangerous imo, it’s also confusing because many pedestrians aren’t aware of the changes to the Highway Code (neither are motorists) I do it, because I’m following the Highway Code, but every-time I do (when I think it’s safe to do so) I’m looking in my mirrors and I’m ready to try and take evasive action. By following the rules it is increasing risk to the road users and pedestrians, imagine if them pedestrians were already in front of the bike and the lorry hit hit harder!!
Not being aware of the highway code and driving into the back of someone who is doing what they should is dangerous.
Don't blame the victims of negligence.
Totally agree, stopping at a r/bout exit is madness. They need to strike that one as a bad idea!!
It's lack of awareness that is the danger. The lorry driver should have been aware of pedestrians as he was indicating to exit the roundabout. The problem is tunnel vision and lack awareness of the surroundings. It would maybe help having zebra crossing at exits
Agreed, it's a stupid HC rule.
Yeah if the car behind can't see the pedestrian they have no idea you will be stopping. It's the most stupidest of rule, and tbh most of the time I ignore
4:30 pedestrian priority does apply, but I would argue the law should be changed so that it doesn't. The risk/reward just isn't balanced correctly. Higher speeds, poor spotting distances, highly complex situations. It's all a recipe for disaster. This is probably the reason why so many roundabouts in the UK are fenced/barriered. The safer thing holistically would be to change this
5:49 Paragraph 167 of the Highway Code (DO NOT overtake [...] approaching or at a road junction on either side of the road) is there for a reason.
This isn't the first accident I've seen of this exact type under the exact same circumstances and I doubt it will be the last. Care comes from both driver and rider. Both drive at acceptable low speeds would likely avoid this from happening.
Personally, overtaking on single lane carriageways where one lane of traffic is at a dead stand still and the other lane clear every now and then shouldn't be allowed. On par with people parking against the flow of traffic albeit the latter being the more annoying of the two due to how often it happens.
When I was about twelve or thirteen, I had had my BCG injection, which made me very unwell. I was so poorly that I was sent home hour or so earlier.
Unfortunately, I walked off the bus, puked up my school lunch in the gutter, at the bus stop, then head still down - I uncleverly walked acrossed the seriously curved road before my home, without looking or listening.
A young guy on a Yamaha came off his bike whilst swerving to save me. He was cross with me but stopped swearing when I began wailing and puking. His bike was still driveable - thank God Almighty. He calmed me down and saw me across the road.
I will never forget seeing that guy falling off his bike. His leathered body being rolled across the tarmac. I still think about that dude from time to time and just how close I came to dying.
Now that I drive a car, I look for - no, I just assume that there will be a motorbike, especially at junctions and weaving in traffic. Checking my side mirrors and listening for them works a treat and does not take a moment.
I sincerely pray - please God, our Father, Jesus Christ and to the Holy Spirit - that I never ever cause another rider to come off their bike. I could not bear it. 😢😢😢
I am a motorcyclist of over 50 years experience .& no way would I stop just coming off a roundabout with wagon on my tail ,unless it was a proper zebra or pelican crossing , as it’s odds on the wagon driver wont be expecting me to stop ,where no crossing is marked. It’s a stupid place to cross anyway far too close to the roundabout ,drivers & riders already have their work cut out ,without having to stop before they have had chance to straighten up leaving a roundabout . Who ever plans these rules & some of these stupid road layouts ,obviously doesn’t drive or ride any vehicles . All crossing places should be placed a reasonable distance from any junction or roundabout ,it would make things a lot less risky & more safe ,for all concerned, it’s not rocket science . These people can have all the fancy eduction in the world ,but if they have no common sense it’s of no use to them ,& they are a liability to all around them .
Totally agree. I am a motorcyclist myself. I never stop for pedestrians crossing if a vehicle is to close behind that may cause an accident. The change of law is a joke and can only increase accidents. When it does ,it will be the normal thing that no one will take responsibility for their actions.
Honestly I will never give way to a pedestrian on the exit of a roundabout having seen too many incidents happen in person. For me its a completely ridiculous rule that has so far caused more accidents than anything else. On the approach to a roundabout I am happy to do it as that's a place where people naturally come to a stop anyway.
@@Wolfy11188 If someone is already crossing at a junction when the lights change ,naturally I would not go until they were clear ,but for the pedestrians to suddenly start crossing as motorists are still turning off a roundabout & motorcyclists still leaning over ,is asking for a bad outcome . Who ever comes up with this sh💩t about allowing pedestrians to just cross in front of moving busy traffic ,needs sectioning & locking up for the protection of the public .
Agreed on the fact that all junctions naturally divide the attention of a driver. Encouraging people to cross there is a bad idea.
And frankly, if I was the pedestrian and decided to cross there, I would not be happy about a vehicle stopping kinda on the roundabout. Just go mate, I'll make my own judgement and go when I feel safe without you doing dangerous stunts.
I doubt many pedestrians would expect a driver to stop coming off a roundabout exit. That part of the new rules wil cause far more accidents like the one in this video
Alternatively, I've seen a driver accelerate towards a pedestrian who started to cross when the road was clear. The poor bloke jumped for gold to save his skin. If I'd have been closer to the event, I would have submitted the footage to plod.
It's standard practice in most of the world that uses circles.
@@UnbeltedSundew But, but, but Britain.
There's no chance I'm stopping when I'm on my bike unless I'm abso-bloody-lutely sure it's safe for me or a risk for the pedestrians
@@notcrediblesolipsism3851 You shouldn't stop if it's not safe, but I was hit from behind on my bike while stopped at a zebra crossing, and it wasn't a sharp stop either. At what point are we going hold the knobs in cars who can't drive fully responsible for their incompetence?
Just to add to the giving way at roundabout exits debate. I went in❤to the local test centre where I used to take my pupils before I retired from all things driver training.
I asked the examiner about this very subject regarding driving tests, they replied that they do NOT expect learners to comply with this advice/ rule. They say it’s up to the learner but they must know it’s safe to do so, they will not mark them down if they don’t give way, they do expect learners to give way on approach to a roundabout in regards to pedestrians if safe to do so.
4:40 and that's why the new rules are just plain wrong. Protecting the more vulnerable is one thing, but they weren't vulnerable whilst waiting on the pavement. I'm a pedestrian also, and I'd never want someone to stop like that for me. Obviously the truck was in the wrong, but would never have happened if the motorcyclist hadn't stopped on what is a clear road ahead.
Re the DVSA rider, you're quite right that its a 'do as I say, not as I do' attitude.
I was talking to an ex copper about an incident I'd winessed where a police BMW had weaved in and out of traffic, breaking speed limits at will, making risky overtakes. Which, at best inconvenienced other road users at worst was downright dangerous, and which was never under blues and twos. The ex copper responded by saying, the police driver was making progress!
IMO there is no excuse for police not having at least blues on when "making progress"/speeding.
In theory the police rider just might have been attending something urgent but the absence of lights suggests not. It does seem some among the 'advanced rider' community think they have the right to inconvenience others and call it 'making progress ' even if it means breaking some fundamental sensible rules.
I witnessed an almost fatal motorcycle accident the other day, an oncoming vehicle wanting to turn right was edging out slowly across 2 lanes of standstill traffic (this part of the road had keep clear signs) when a motorcyclist was racing down the middle filtering at over 50mph. The motorcyclist somehow saved it by swerving around the bumper of the vehicle. It all happened so quick that I couldn't even beep to warn the turning vehicle.
But I've seen similar incidents many times, motorcyclists should slow down when filtering past stopped vehicles especially when there is a large space between vehicles as there's usually a reason that a space has been left.
Gaps = traps!
I would argue you can't filter at high speed - that's called overtaking? But bikers generally ignore or make up their own rules. If they're so vulnerable then it's about bloody time they drove appropriately rather than it always being everyone else's responsibility.
When they do that they aren't driving for the road conditions. Simple as. I'm not sure in the UK how people are but where I live if it's stand still traffic people get frustrated and switch lanes all the time. Which would leave not room for a motorcyclist to react at that speed.
I highly suspect some motorcyclists are already prepared to come off and have paid more attention to the their surroundings and how safe they would be if knocked off.
As a biker I cannot understand why some riders think it's appropriate to filter at anything above 25mph in standstill traffic, and that's on the very high end for me. We've already got the privilege of skipping through traffic, why would you piss off the other traffic even more and put yourself in huge danger?
Doing my motorcycle 'advanced' training was a brilliant decision. It changed my riding attitude overnight. You can often tell when watching mtorcycle videos which riders are advanced trained and those who are not. Do it, it'll save your life, and potentially others.
Great advice! Who did you do your advanced training with?
@@rufaiajala MAC training, in Hemel Hempstead at the time. This was 20 years ago though.
Currently going through RoSPA aiming for Gold. 100% agree with you.
Agreed. I did the IAM course here in NZ and you can tell pretty much straight away if someone has done training just by their road position and following distance in traffic
I can thoroughly recommend the Bikesafe initiative run by many police forces. Not as long and intensive as IAM or RoSPA - mine was two evenings in a classroom and a hours or so ride out being observed, even a seasoned motorcyclist like myself learned a lot
I’ve had a number of situations now when waiting for pedestrians to cross at junctions has caused more confusion and conflict than it’s worth. Had cars overtake from behind to go into the junctions im waiting for, been beeped at a number of times. It’s wearing thin.
The clip where the motorcyclist stops to allow pedestrians to cross the road at the exit from the roundabout is a good example of why the rule should not apply there
Sure, the lorry driver should have been more observant, but the exit from a roundabout is a dangerous place to stop. You say "if you can stop and give way to them you should" but the word "safely" belongs in there, don't you think ?
thats why it says should, not must.
I agree with you roundabouts are designed to help traffic flow,so to have vehicles giving way to pedestrians is not practical or safe at roundabout
Yeah too much going on on a roundabout to suddenly stop at an exit as that clip clearly shows….that rule needs changing.
It's a good example of why the guidance shouldn't be in place at all. It's flat-out stupid and dangerous. The exisiting common sense approach of "if there is a vehicle approach, let it pass" works for very good reason. The moment you introduce extra, unnecessary things to think about, especially when they cause ambiguity, you're massively increasing risk. Utterly, uttelry, stupid, pointless and deadly.
Exactly you should only ever stop if following traffic is not going to be inconvenienced or surprised by you suddenly stopping. This clip is a poor example of when to implement that new rule.
Ashley, thanks for the videos, both bike and car. I have been a motorcyclist for over 54 years and I’m also a blood biker. I find your videos very helpful, both in improving my own riding/driving and making me aware of the sometimes insane actions of other road users.
The fifth clip is one of those situations that I'm always conscious about. I both drive and ride, and when I'm queueing in the car and something comes out of a sideroad like that I'm watching my mirrors, not the car pulling out, so I can hit the horn if anyone tries to filter past at the wrong moment.
Someone did that for me this week, I was the one turning out of the sideroad, they'd left room because the lights were on red for them. I didn't see the car pull out from behind them and can't honestly say I'd have reacted in time if it weren't for their honk/wave. I was impressed by their observation and quick reaction. Thank you for being similarly alert!
Let's be honest and say that we've all seen some pretty rubbish riding over the years but those of us who ride also have to admit that WE'VE made some stupid decisions ourselves so I believe that this type of content, although entertaining can be put to such good use especially when we see ourselves in others riding and this should help make us better riders. Let's see this type of content more often please. Keep up the great work.
Good to see you have done a motorcycling special. Was going to suggest this, as there is such a huge demand for good content. So much of what I watch is based in USA and they have no clue about what the rules are here. Surprised you have a full bike licence but great. I wish there was more good knowledge on CZcams
The only way you really gain knowledge is by being out there and not getting killed.
Just take it easy and keep looking, watching and anticipating.
I’ve been riding 16 years without an accident (yet) and I’ll never stop on a roundabout to let people cross. Me staying safe is more important than letting people cross the road.
That’s a good point.
You’re way too vulnerable on a bike to risk a rear ending. Even in a car I’d exercise caution. But at least other drivers see cars, sometimes I think motorcyclists in the uk must be invisible, the way other vehicles behave around them.
@@gdfggggg the fact we just nearly saw a biker getting rear ended by a lorry, I can’t believe Ashley still said we need to be encouraging that manoeuvre.
@@mjudec exactly mate, the people standing waiting to cross are safe in that moment, while a biker evidently isn’t. If I was Ashley I wouldn’t be encouraging that manoeuvre for bikers.
@Jarvis241987 no, that's the opposite.of what I said 🤷
Can we have zebra stripes on roundabout junctions so its clear to pedestrians and traffic what the rules are?
I think the same. In Europe most junctions and roundabouts have zebra crossings at the exits
That would take government investment in the public interest. Soon as one of their mates or spouses owns a roadway maintenance company I'm sure it'll get looked at for a definitely not inflated price.
@@racerdeth ooh you lefty cynic. Exactly what I was thinking. Do you want a peerage?
I think the main problem is that when the new rules came in, they only mentioned junctions. It would have been better if they said "junctions including those at roundabouts", so it was clear. Maybe it would be a good idea to have stripes on roundabouts, but we don't have them at other junctions. The bottom line is if a vehicle in front of you is coming to a stop at a normal speed makes you do an emergency stop or makes you hit that vehicle then you are either travelling to close or not paying enough attention. What if that vehicle had to do an emergency stop?
Would be lovely! That's how it is done in Germany and it makes it clear for every road user :)
Gives you confidence in the human race the people running to help the motorcyclist, that are more than likely running because they're trained to help
most trained people would only run if an untrained person was about to do something that made it worse. the thing that caught my eye was even after the crash, likely caused by the motorcyclists making what would be an illegal overtake (overtaking WHILE there is oncoming traffic using the lane) two more motorcyclists overtook.
Doung 50 moh when I hit a car which came out of a give way junction and sent me over the handlebars sliding along on my back. Tiny little village crossroads where I was immediately pinned down by an off duty policeman and told not to move due to possible injuries. As he walked away to direct some traffic, I attempted to get up (raining heavily) when "I'm an off duty nurse... don't move"
Ended up lying in the rain, on the road for half an hour until the ambulance arrived but yeah, thanks for the fast help!
Gosh, that lorry hitting the motorcyclist 4:40 was quite scary. Just imagine if they continued on, that biker could've been under the lorry's wheels in seconds! It was a good thing they stopped and the bike rider was ok, especially as HGVs course the highest risk to others.
And one of the reasons the new priority rules need to be treated with caution. I wouldn't have stopped if an HGV was tailgating me
@@superted6960 agree, but that lorry was waiting at the other exit of the roundabout. He may have high blind spots, but I'm sure he could see the motorcycle as he waited for him at the roundabout and he should've planned more for those pedestrians who were about to cross at the roundabout. Planning is key, and that lorry driver probably didn't assume that the motorcyclist was going to stop.
@@superted6960 I doubt it was tailgating given the speed of the bike prior to stopping, but I'm cautious about stopping for pedestrians on roundabout exits - if it would put them at risk, I don't do it. I agree with the calls to have simple markings put on roundabout entrance/exits to highlight the crossing places.
Simple solution - don't follow the highway code like some drone.
Think for yourself and assess risk.
Stopping here was ridiculous - motorcyclists’ greatest danger is often being hit from behind.
@@superted6960 why do we accept HTV tailgating ?
A lot of people in the comments pointing out this is a good example not to stop for pedestrians on a roundabout exit. In the end you should only be stopping if it is safe to do so and as the driver you have to make the decision of what is safe, if you are confident there is no risk then stop otherwise if you're unsure don't stop.
More importantly, understand that others may be more comfortable stopping so be prepared for the car in front to stop.
As more and more people begin giving priority to pedestrians it will become the norm and it will feel less risky.
For now only stop when you are confident and be ready for others around you to stop even if you wouldn't have.
while being aware the person behind is tailgating is a reasonable reason not to stop, a lot of those sound like people who don't want to have to stop for pedestrians and have latched onto an excuse.
@@kenbrown2808 Nail struck squarely on the head there.
@@PedroConejo1939 for which the response is, if we yanks can do it, surely the more civilized UK can figure it out.
The dangerous thing is slamming the accelerator through a roundabout without regard for pedestrians. We can't keep pushing pedestrian crossings further and further out of the roundabout, it adds a huge amount of distance to any walking trip.
As a pedestrian, I stand well back, in an attempt to indicate to any motorist, that I do not wish to cross. Stopping on the exit of a roundabout, or at the entrance to a side-street is just bloody stupid. It is inviting rear-end collisions.
As a driver, I try not to stop on the exit of a roundabout or when turning into a side road. Obviously if somebody has already stepped into the road or there is another obstruction, I stop.
If there is nothing behind me, making it safe to stop, it is quicker for all if I continue & the pedestrian can cross behind me, most likely, they have seen the gap behind me thus are planning to cross after I pass.
Big changes to highway codes, especially when it directly effects others, should be advertised prominently in town centres. For a year or two after the change.
I don't watch television, but if it's not advertised there it definitely should be.
Watched your videos for months Ashley and glad to say I passed first time with 1 minor thankyou for sharing these videos game changer!!!!!
Great set of clips, thanks Ashley and your viewers for sending in. Always useful for someone who doesn't ride a motorbike to gain an appreciation for what it's like from their point of view.
Many years ago as a motorcycle journo I researched the govt stats on road accidents. I discovered that Police chases of stolen scooters and motorcycles were routinely included in the local accident stats. Even if the stolen bike was pursued off road, it was still recorded as a road accident. Amazing.
Incident
About 30 years ago I remember buying a Vespa to commute on. I loved riding it - and it was so cheap to run. Sadly within 2 years I had sold it and I have never ridden a motorbike/scooter again - because too many people kept pulling out in front of me.
After I was catapulted over the handlebars for the third time, I never felt safe again.
Which is why when I rode, I made sure I had a bike with enough power to accelerate out of trouble. Like when someone reversed towards me as I was overtaking a couple of cars on a dual carriageway. If I'd been on a scooter or a less powerful bike, or indeed a car, I probably wouldn't be here to tell the tale.
Similar for my brother - he had quite a nice bike as well and always rode sensibly - one day someone pulled out on him and he had to put the bike down to avoid hitting them and slid on his back into the curb - a police officer who happened to witness it was convinced it was going to be fatal or serious injuries apparently. Fortunately my brother had invested in a jacket with good back armour and walked away with nothing more than bruises but he gave up biking in reaction to that incident.
The other driver got nothing more than a slap on the wrist.
Skill issue.
Sorry mate but you have to expect everyone to pull out in front of you because they usually do.
@@54356776 Skill issue - is that your way of victim blaming?
@@Rroff2 Indeed, proper clothing is vital. I wince every time I see people riding sometimes quite powerful bikes in shorts and t-shirts 🙄
@05:35 The Learner on the blue bike is not wearing gloves either. As a motorcyclist I don't care how hot the weather is, I always wear leather gloves. I once was at a club meeting where the guest speaker showed us some pictures of riders who came off without wearing gloves. Their skin came off in an instant, and only a few milliseconds later they were down to the bone. The first thing you do when coming off a bike is put your hands out for protection, but without gloves they are not protected. Always wear gloves.
Very true, as a 74yr old motorcyclist who has never had an accident, I have always dreaded damaging my hands. four years ago, I was pulled up by an over zealous cop who ordered me to remove my metal reinforced gloves as they were an offensive weapon. Surely there are not that many 70yr old bovver boys about.
Thanks for the analysis, as a rider I see these situations and just know I wouldn't ever get myself in that situation, although I don't put the words around it as you do. Legal or not, stopping at the exit of a roundabout is just inviting a rear end. 👍🇦🇺
I've been rear-ended on a motorbike when stopping at a zebra crossing, and not even a quick stop either. Some drivers and riders need to wise up.
Agreed......
I've been pushed out onto a roundabout by a driver who didn't notice I was slowing down for approaching traffic!
I know you are now meant to give way to peds on round a bouts but when I'm on my bike I tend not to if the traffic is heavy and moving fast, I feel like I'm a sitting target. When I'm in the car it's a different matter, I do stop as if I get hit doing it I know I will be safe from harm physically. It really hurts getting hit by cars! In fact on my bike I will give way even if I have priority. Been riding bikes now since 1980 and the last time I came off is 1997. Be safe out there.
5:30 Filtering past a van through a junction just seems insane to me.
You see people do it all time though. Usually young men on scooters, bikes etc. No hazard perception what so ever.
In my motorcycle riding class, the instructors were firm on the difference between filtering and an unsafe overtake.
Sadly they usually only learn after being knocked off.
People need to be aware that with all the good intentions in the world and attentiveness to the mirrors the rearward visibility in vans is pretty limited. I didn't realise how bad it was until I started driving one, bikes filtering up the middle are much harder to spot in the side mirrors compared with a car where you can pick them up in the central mirror fairly easily. When dealing with a van from anywhere but the front 180 just assume they can't see you
@DjDolHaus86 and there are still people who haven't driven one and think the driver is just being lazy.
Well done Ashley for giving bikers a higher profile.
My IAM Masters mentor was a biker, and as a motorist (you won't catch me on two wheels, keeping safe with four wheels is hard enough!) I found it really useful to get the biker's viewpoint. More drivers need that mentality!
Enjoyed that one. Must say I cringed a lot of some of the riding. Treat everyone else on the road as an idiot and you will survive. Every time I have been involved with another vehicle I have won the case. Knowing the HC, being observant, there are places to speed and it's not on crowded roads.😊
Sometimes it's not just a case of "Have they seen me?" but also "Now they've seen me but will they act accordingly?" Some people out there will see you but then still act moronic. Maybe they miscalculated you as a potential danger, maybe they have too much ego. It happens.
For context on my opinion, I am an Observer with the IAM and I'm currently waiting for my Masters Motorcycle exam: With the first clip, whilst he reacted well, we can see a lack of experience from the lack of use of the golden rule/limit point and the mix-up of gears and brakes, which also makes for an unsteady corner and rough ride. Second clip, a lot of riders do not care about their safety until it's too late, the backpatch/club riders definitely were filtering at too high of a pace relative to the traffic and were plainly unable to stop safely. Whilst the van driver didn't help the situation, I think something like that was going to happen sooner rather than later. With the DVSA rider in the third clip, I can SEE a decent amount of advanced technique being applied, but extremely poorly. Use of position 3 when going around the van to increase view and to look past the proceeding van was good, but he put himself into a conflict point where he was sticking A: too close to the van ahead and B: too close to oncoming traffic; and the overtake was just shocking, if it pisses someone off like that, it was a bad manoeuvre. Most of the other ones are pretty self explanatory, but want to comment on the R1 rider who did a stoppie and hit the car: he didn't care until it was too late, his only concern was getting home, not getting home alive
I doubt the DVSA rider is advanced. They may have some enhanced training in the same way as non emergency ambulance drivers get, but as they have no exemptions as per blue light riders, they shouldn't have been speeding.
You should ride as though everyone and everything is always trying to kill you, then you might well get home alive.
@@ElectricPics he is and also teaches the police has done For years and advanced has done for years he also has his blue light ticket and is one of the few examiners that can take tests in any and all categories. There is a lot more to the DVSA rider clip that hasn’t been given to Ashley, trust me the guy that took this video has heavily edited it and is not showing what he did to force the examiner to believe the only safe course of action was to get away from the guy filming. Please don’t pass judgment until all the clip has been given to Ashley. 😁👍🏻
@@jamesmaitland1086 Babbling on about someone else's qualifications is irrelevant. What exactly is a 'blue light ticket'? I'm SFJ ERD HS Level 3. As for the DVSA rider, he was plainly driving outside what constitutes safe driving. He wasn't riding an emergency vehicle and if he felt endangered, he had the option to pull over and stop.
@@john1703 You should ride as if everyone out there is thinking up creative new ways to kill you!
More of these please Ash.
For drivers of four wheel vehicles, it’s very useful to see how things look for a two wheel rider.
Completely agree none of us are perfect there is always something we can improve . Being mindful of someone else’s right to get to their destination alive is something I have as soon as I get behind the wheel .👍
Most of the untoward things I see them doing, I consider them to be wholey responsible for.
If I make mad choices, the risks are mine to consider.
Exactly on your head be it
Exactly. And I have some experience in this area.
Indeed, nobody else is in control of you or your vehicle 👍
I have made some bad choices before, and after the initial denial phase that last around 5 seconds it is a case of hands up, that was me
The Lorry is why as a motorcyclist I wont follow this rule on roundabouts, what happened is my exact fear and its already happening to other riders, I would rather pay a yearly fine than be crushed by a Lorry or any vehicle for that matter.
So many people misinterpreting the 'rules' (inc Ashley scarily) thinking that you should give way in that situation. Bonkers.
@@f-godz3342 I'm normally one to follow the rules and technically I still will be, ''when it is safe to do so'' and exiting a roundabout on a motorcycle will NEVER be safe to do so.
Spot on, same here. When I'm in my car it's a different matter though. Different vehicles need to be operated differently.
This is a very informative video, and as a new motorcycle rider myself at a ripe age of 40 years old, I welcome information like this.
Straight after completing my category A license, I went ahead to complete my further training in using the IAM organisation.
A must for any new rider in my opinion.
I totally agree about CBT not being sufficient. When I did it on my way to my full license, i was amazed that after so little training and so little road experience i was now legally able to ride on my own. Didn't seem right at all. And that was with me already having 12 years of driving a car. For a lot of the young ones on CBT, they're not going to have that experience.
In my day, we didn't even have CBT. At 16, we got our provisional licence and could ride anything up to 250cc on L-plates without any training at all. I'm surprised so many of us survived (I'm still riding after 52 years).
@@icouldbewrongicouldberight Less traffic? In some places maybe, but many were as busy as now (certainly feels that way as a Londoner). But as someone who was a motorcycle dispatch rider back in the 80s I can tell you that drivers were as crap then as they are now. It's human nature to go "it was better back in the good old days" but objectively it wasn't.
@@ianmason. Agreed.......
Thirty one years a despatch rider in Scotland and yes, they're all out to kill you!
The roundabout clip with the lorry and bike is exactly why I very rarely would let a pedestrian cross.
You get ignorant people behind you and a lot of pedestrians are hesitant to go. It just causes risk and confusion for everyone.
7:09 ive also noticed the bike has no registration plate meaning it was driving without insurance
Watching your videos around the test centre has helped me pass my full A bike test, it doesn’t just benefit learner drivers. thanks pal
Great job!
This man needs way more views / subscribers.. great video as always Ashley! Im forever forgetting to like videos but i want to change that for your videos at least as you single handedly make the roads a safer place to be.
Makes it far safer for other roundabout users if you simply take it easy on roundabouts.
That first rider going to fast
Agree. Accepting that distances are hard to judge on cams, Ashley often makes the point that overtakes should be completed in half the distance you can see ahead. The motorcyclists speed may well have made a nonsense of that
How can you tell his future dietary choices from that video?
@@richandiben he’s vegan tomorrow
Nope
Two of these clips reminded me of a near miss I had a few years ago; I was pulling out VERY cautiously, from a side road through a stationary queue of traffic; once I could see both ways I stopped and checked - to see a Ducati shoot out from behind a van 200-300 metres down the road, the rider saw me blocking his path and panicked.
He hit the throttle AND the brakes, and the bike span around out of control, bouncing off of 6--7 cars on both sides of the road before sliding to a stop, around 30cm from my car.
It must have been a quiet day, because multiple Fire, Ambulance, and eventually, Police vehicles attended the scene; when the Police arrived, the rider went up and said "Sorry Sarge, I was late for my shift".
This was a 30 MPH zone, in the middle of the town; and he was travelling at at LEAST twice that speed when he came out from behind the van (and still accelerating).
I doubt he was ticketed (they all stick together), but it was an expensive lesson for him - the Ducatti had the sump ripped out, and suffered extensive damage, sliding along the tarmac and impacting the other traffic.
From the number of vehicles he hit, I also suspect getting insurance might have become a bit of a problem at renewal time.
I enjoyed that, though there was some hypertension involved. For me, there's generally two basic m/c errors: first, inexperience; second, overconfidence. They're not mutually exclusive but so many riders let the buzz override road craft. Then, even if both of those are eliminated, there's the failures of other road users, many of whom have never ridden on two wheels and haven't got a chuffing clue. That's where your advanced training becomes a life-saver.
My US son-in-law went on a seven day road trip from California to Los Angeles with a friend. He was riding a fully equipped Indian and looking forward to taking in the views whereas his friend had a Kawasaki Ninja H2 and just wanted to get there.
They parted company on the third day.
At 4:42 there is no way I would have stopped for them pedestrians. I don't care what the Highway Code says in this situation. By stopping, especially if you are on a motorcycle, you are just inviting possible injury by being shunted up the rear. That situation could have been far worse. The pedestrians can just wait until they judge it to be safe to cross. Lets have bit of common sense here.
The highway code doesn't insist you stop regardless of situation and your argument may as well say don't stop at all at pelican crossings , zebra crossings or junctions blah blah.
Note the bike in the last clip wasn't shunted by a lorry and the bag made it to the over side safely 😂
@@MegaMidds Ridiculous to bring pelican crossings, zebra crossings or junctions blah blah blah blah blah into the discussion. We are not talking about them, they are totally different situations. And I am now fully versed at what the Highway Code says as regards roundabouts, I checked online as my copy was a little out of date. It just says look out for pedestrians and 'give them plenty of room'. Stopping in this situation is dangerous and in my view foolhardy.
Who said the bike in the last clip was shunted by a lorry?
Honestly, as a new rule I just find having to give way to pedestrians at a roundabout is just a bit of a mad idea. I get that they're the most vulnerable on the road, but I get the sense that the rule will probably cause more accidents than it hopes to avoid.
I go about as ive not been seen its definitely the best advice saved me many times with cars at junctions mainly but other times to.. and lane splitting if i see a gap i slow down and dont split above 10 15 mph... Good video hopefully it helps or reminds a few more people everyone should be aware at all times on the road
I've had a similar mishap like the van @5:33 on the vid on my Bike involving a car pulling out from a parking space with me filtering past the bunched up traffic, clipped the o/s front of the car as they came out across me. Learnt the hard way to be careful even when you think it's safe!
Another clip where my concerns are confirmed when it comes to the rule about stopping to give way to pedestrians. I know people will respond to me saying we should learn the rules but people wont and dangerous moments like this would've been avoided had the rules not changed and both motorbike and lorry continued ahead.
@@noggintube I would argue that it's hard to feel safe when stopping on a roundabout because too many drivers only look right while making their turns.
I agree that saying knowning the rules is a bit pointless. This particular rule with the equally stupid but far more dangerous so called smart motorways makes me wonder who on Earth is making up the rules now. Crossing the road at a junction or a round about I can take care of my own safety. I am far more concerned about being hit by a cyclisy on a foot path or pedestrian area or failing to stop at a crossing or on red lights.
Agree with Motorcyclists being highly vulnerable but I also think a lot of them "forget" this with some of their antics on the road. The amount of times a Motorcyclist has cut in front of me at the last minute and almost hit a Traffic Island I have lost count.
Mostly Moped and Scooter riders taking silly risks whilst "Filtering". I often find the Motorcyclist isn't paying attention to the traffic that it is carving in and out of.
@@noggintube some of you are but some of you ride around at ridiculous speeds and put yourselves in Danger. I’ve seen many a collision with a motorcyclist and a car driver caused by a lack of common sense by the motorcyclist.
@@noggintube well the % of deadly riding i seen last visit to Wales was shocking high, must been close to 98% of bikes i seen were doing dangerous riding. that whole trip i nearly seen two deaths, bikers overtaking on double lines, one three story sheep truck fully loaded and another truck coming other way last sec clouds smoke from both trucks i thought the biker was dead, prob injured some sheep too, loss to farmer. other one was just as close and many other close calls all passing on double solid lines. i seen that much careless / dangerous riding in think biker roads i though you can start thinking for yourself, and time i got home in my mind biker doing stupid pass i was thinking go on kill yourself it might be entertaining. why should i care when they clearly do not, out 1 month in wales i only seen two pairs of riders doing thing correct and that was out 100's so the figures show most did not care for own safety. think bike now means think for yourself. after nearly seeing two deaths and lost count how many close calls no wonder my thinking change, they made it change. i do everything right my end, if they way over limit and pull out thinking 60-70 they doing and it a 60-70 safe gap but they doing 100 plus not drivers fault, as going that much above many will not be able to tell if its 70- 90- 110 they all look same from a distance and gap needed changes greatly from 60-70-100 plus . dash-cams will be there to cover me, even almost a head on with biker too on my trip to wales biker over taking double solid lines around a corner that was close
I wonder if the statistics on motor cycles takes into account the number who are working for Just Eat, Deliveroo etc. Shoul these companies be allowed to get away with employing learners?
I consider myself a new rider, as always your analysis is spot on. Been a subscriber for awhile now and would love to see more motorbike vids on your channel
Great video, Ashley, thank you. The issue is as you say, inexperience. I am an advocate for no full bike licences until someone has driven for 5 years and no car licence until you have passed the CBT. Many motorists have no idea of the complexities and challenges of riding a motorbike. If they had to do a CBT, their attitude would change. Many don’t realise that filtering is legal and a requirement to “make good progress”. Additionally, many riders get into trouble on their bikes because they don’t engage the most important safety system on their bike…..their brain.
Observation, common-sense, courtesy, and patience can prevent , or at least mitigate the risk, accidents. I always say, that 99.999% of bike accidents are the rider’s fault. My logic is, for example, if you come to a busy junction and there’s a queue of cars waiting to join, you know, that at least one person in that queue will pull out. So if you know that why don’t you reduce your speed and keep the maximum possible distance from them? Similarly, a queue of traffic behind a tractor, again, if you blitz them, at a stupid speed, you know that someone will try to overtake and most probably only uses the mirror for make-up or shaving. Filtering at 70mph past cars travelling at 40mph on the motorways, is illegal and likely to end in tears. Why do it? When I passed in 2003, I was told that you can filter up to the speed of 50mph, but must not exceed the traffic’s speed by more than 5mph. However, I believe it’s a grey area and based on what’s “reasonable” so 40mph faster than the traffic is frankly, stupid.
BTW. I’m also an advocate for a compulsory Cycling Proficiency Test (I did one at school in 1974). I think it’s vital and cyclists should also be insured, with irremoveable lights per mantle fixed to the bike and permanently on! Cycles are becoming a bigger risk to pedestrians than cars and motorbikes. They need to be regulated and controlled properly. ……rant over! Thanks…
Controversial opinion: there'd be less motorcycle accidents if they didn't act like idiots on the road like speeding and overtaking in dangerous places where car drivers wouldn't dream of doing so such as, on continuous lines and on brows and dips etc.
Just because they're in a smaller vehicle than cars shouldn't give them to right to drive with less care than cars do. I'm not saying cars are perfect but if we all played our part to keep everyone safe and do things legally I think there's be a lot less motorcycle accidents!
We saw a car driver attempting to overtake on a blind corner in the first clip. I do agree with you however that most motorcycle accidents are caused by riders being idiots. I don't think that's controversial. I ride motorcycles myself, by the way.
In my experience, (I've been riding bikes for 52 years, and still ride almost every day), most of the irresponsible riding is done either by groups of sports bike riders who are out to show each other how fast they are or, more recently, fast food delivery riders on L-plates, doing things which would get them failed within the first 30 seconds of a driving test.
Motorcyclists do not all act like idiots. I have survived several instances of careless driving by car drivers over the years (and avoided many, many others), and learned from each of them. Most motorcyclists act responsibly, it's just the irresponsible ones who get noticed.
What on *_earth_* makes you think car drivers wouldn't also do all those things? I've seen car drivers do all the things you call out, multiple, multiple times.
Good job using your platform to share those sobering statistics, Ash. People need to know.
Most bikers don't help themselves. If they're so vulnerable then they should ride accordingly. Zero sympathy.
@@duncanarrow What a cunty thing to say.
As a motorcyclist I will NEVER stop at a roundabout for the purpose of allowing a pedestrian to cross the road a few moments earlier than by waiting for a gap in the traffic to do so themselves.
Reason being the pedestrian is marginally inconvenienced by waiting but in no danger, and if I was to stop I would be directly placing myself in danger to the risk of injury from a larger vehicle hitting me from behind.
Forget what the "new" law says - my life is worth more.
before entering a roundabout I agree that's a good time to let the peds cross as everyone is slowing down to stop/give way, however everyone begins to pick their speed up again to match the new roads limit when coming off so can be absolutely dangerous to just suddenly brake and then expect everyone else to have the same reaction as you.
I would never ever stop at the exit of a busy roundabout to let anyone cross.
Regardless of the rules, if you have something shunt into the back of you. The momentum of your vehicle will push you into the pedestrians.
It’s a stupid rule.
You're likely to shunt into the back of another road user because you expect them to have the same disregard for the rules as you do. You don't belong on the road if you can't follow the rules.
@@Pattoe do whatever you want to do, I’m not telling you not to. You can sort out the insurance claim yourself
Stopping to let a pedestrian to cross should only be done if it's safe to do so. The fact that lorry crashed into the motorcycle as a result proves it was not safe to do so.
Absolutely. Blind obedience to a rule without consideration of other factors is just as bad as ignoring the rule.
Totally disagree. If the lorry driver knew that this was the case they would be expecting this to happen. Lack of knowledge, unfortunately.
It looked perfectly safe, providing other road users are paying attention. The lorry did not crash into the motorbike for a few seconds, and was probably fixated on the traffic coming from the right when they pulled onto the roundabout
@@ashley_neal I get your point, but the rider shouldn't have automatically assumed the lorry driver was in possession of that knowledge. Avoiding a collision is more important than being right.
@@ashley_neal stopping at the exit of a roundabout with no traffic, even if the pedestrians are standing there, is less of a likely outcome then carrying on.
Self preservation of the part of the motorcyclist means they should carry on for their own safety, and I'll openly admit I absolutely would have carried on even in my car.
Two people saving 10s to cross a road is not worth risking the life of another human. It's disproportionate and the rule is a Should because of this.
It's not a Zebra, it's a crossing. It's not a Must it's a Should, if safe.
I think it would make a massive benefit for the government to televise the new highway system in a short and brief advertisement, thus reducing confusion by those who aren’t aware of the changes when drivers are giving way to pedestrians at roundabouts and junctions. Just a small thought.
Why? It's not rocket science. Rule 170 of The Highway Code relates to junctions. It says if you are turning into a road, and pedestrians have already started to cross, they have priority so give way. Now I don't know about you but I don't need the HC to tell me this as the alternative is to run them over! Also, even if they are just waiting to cross you are supposed to give way, but don't get me started on that load of nonsense.
Rule 187 concerns roundabouts. It just says watch out for pedestrians who may be crossing at the approach and exit and give them plenty of room. Obviously if they are bumbling out in front of traffic then you have to take the appropriate action. But it does not say you have to stop if they are just waiting to cross as far as I can see. Doing this is ridiculous and could lead to far worse consequences than the example in the video. That wagon only nudged him, he got very lucky doing something that, as a motorcyclist who's been riding 47 years, I wouldn't dream of doing. Just go on your merry way and let the pedestrians cross when they judge it is safe to do so. A few more seconds waiting isn't the end of the world.
I always say if you are paying 100% attention when driving a car then you should be paying 200% attention while riding a motorcycle. Almost zero room for error on a bike.
@06:51 I agree with you wholeheartedly that the motorcyclist took off too fast (I have my A license too) but a Court would look at that and probably rule it 60 - 75% fault on the car driver. Any fellow motorcyclists reading this, it doesn't matter if you're only 25% at fault if you're 100% dead. Ride safe!
I'd argue strongly that these rules are misinterpreted and don't even apply to roundabouts. The highway code shows a picture of a normal junction and says that the rule applies when turning into or our of a junction. A roundabout is a junction, but you aren't turning into or out of it you'd merging on and off. I don't think the rule was ever intended to apply in these circumstances and I won't be interpreting it that way.
I am a rider. One thing that astonishes me is that you don't need to have passed the theory test before you get a CBT. So we have riders on the road who have never needed to learn the Highway Code. It's utterly ridiculous. This is even worse for professional riders such as delivery scooters. They are on the road all day and again have never needed to learn the Highway Code. Shocking.
Stopping coming off that roundabout, no chance and the reason why was just demonstrated perfectly!
I like how the clip used when goving the death statistics for motorcyclists show an incident, that 99% liklihood, was the motorcyclists fault. I've been driving for 2 years and i dont think I've ever had a motorcycle stay behind me, every single one has overtaken at ridiculous speed, often into oncoming traffic.
You may want to try riding a motorcycle and report back on those statistics you made up. Of course there are dunderheads on bikes, but dear God you won't believe how often 4-wheelers will pull out on you, then blame you because it's easier than admitting they chuffed up.
@@PedroConejo1939 my commute to work is 90% 1 straight road, no pulling out on anyone
@@matthewhughes3147 And?
The stats involving motorbikes does not surprise me in the slightest. Whilst I can accept that everyone on the road needs to look out for others, I often feel that motorcyclists seem to think that the HC (or the laws of physics) does not apply to them, speed limits in place for other road users are intended as a minimum speed for bikers, and many other aspects of the HC are willfully ignored.
For some reason here in the states there is an obsession with doing at least 10 miles over the limit or faster. Way too many riders/drivers want to do 15 to 20 over the limit. And I'm old enough to remember when I lived in California, where I lived the majority of my life where I got my license in 1990 at 18 years old and drove the San Francisco Bay area for most of that time, that you would be ticketed for 5 over and if you were caught going 90mph or more your car was impounded and you would go to jail.... Now it seems that standard has fallen EVERYWHERE!!!! From California to Florida, everyone wants you to be going 10 to 20 over the limit even on surface streets.... It's ridiculous, because speed kills. Period. I don't get the shift in attitude when it comes to driving or riding the second most expensive purchase one will make in their lifetime and taking it for granted..... The selfishness, the stupidity, the recklessness, the impatience...... Like what is wrong with society??????? I know, that's the million dollar question....
Have to agree with some other comments here - Giving way to pedestrians at the roundabout exit is dangerous, and shouldn't be part of the highway code. Remember, just because something is 'law' doesn't mean it's a good law, a safe law, or a smart law. To use an old saying, "If your friend told you to put your hand in the fire, would you do it?" Of course not, using this same analogy, "If the law told you to put your hand in the fire, would you do it?" ... the analogy to the fire here, is stopping at the exit of the roundabout, it's like putting your hand in fire. You'll get burned.
The law changed with respect to smart motorways now how many people have been killed because of it. This is another stupid law which in no doubt in the futute will change but how many must be killed before they do change the law.
Motorcyclists are some of the worst drivers on the road, they feel entitled, always be careful around them, it's not worth the hassle
Second only to cyclists.
That last clip was interesting, raises a good point. I've stopped a few times to remove debris that was hazardous. Its worth being very switched on and doing it safely as you could make things worse. Use hazard lights and make sure its safe to stop, park sensibly and keep your head on a swivel, if all that's not possible, best to evade it and ride on.
4:22 I'm not saying it doesn't apply. I'm saying it shouldn't apply, because it puts everyone in a dangerous situation for no reason. And this clip perfectly demonstrates exactly why this rule is asinine to the extreme.
thanks for doing this video. some good lessons here for riders and drivers alike.
I used to drive a motrcycle as my only transport for over 4 years, and it takes 100000% control over your emotions not take advantage of the exquisite acceleration and adrenaline. The amount of mistakes you make as a biginner is so much greater and the consequences are even worse!
As a motorcyclist myself, thank you for this video, Ash. It is much appreciated.
Glad it was helpful!
7:30 the car blocking the carriageway should have been a red flag. Rider just wasn’t paying attention.
Im riding on a cbt...
I wont filter yet because im accutely aware of my inexperience.
Ive been riding for around 6 months now and have made a few mistakes that I know of... I cant help but question how many I may be making unawares.
Saving up for a direct access course and may well book in for some lessons inbetween now and then if i can, because I do have so much more to learn.
i held a cbt for a few years with the intention of getting a bike license after my car license as ive grown up on dirt bikes on tracks and trails but i soon learnt somehow off road bikes on trails is sometimes safer than riding on the road, my mind changed after too many close calls many from impatient drivers with me being limited to 125cc and displaying a L plate made me feel somewhat like a target it it was just not worth it in my eyes but ill still go on a trail anyday
2006, past driving test (with yourself @Ashley Neal ) , the world became an oyster, then as it does, life moves on, I'm going to work everyday going about my business, I get to 2014, the cost of motoring was increasing, car insurance coupled to car finance costs etc was getting way out of hand, bike insurance is/was a fraction of the cost of running a car so I did the CBT during the summer of 2014 to try start saving on penny's.
By December 2014 I'm in a hospital having been in a RTA, no suspicious behavior as proven through the courts, was what amounts to a "wrong place wrong time" scenario (filtering traffic).
I spent 2 months there in that hospital, it was the worst experience I've ever experienced in all my 42 years (at the time, I'm 51 now). I suffered multiple organ failure after the first week after many of my concerns were going ignored, inept and quite frankly awful staff etc (witnessed first hand on many occasions however not all, most were fantastic but there were bad apples). I spent 3 weeks in a coma as a result, was assured they'd save my leg. I awakened to my right leg gone from above the knee and a surgical cut from my groin to my knee of my left leg were they had tried to repair my right leg. It almost cost me my life, no actually, I'll rephrase that, it has destroyed my life. When I was doing the CBT, the fact the instructor assigned to our group during riding practice etc spent more time at the side of the road smoking cigarettes talking about riding, more so then the actual riding, it's hardly surprising I am were I am now that I think back. I wonder how the hell the place were I obtained the CBT was actually able to function, very shoddily run. I no longer ride for obvious reasons but still drive, I intentionally got a slow car so that I drive slow, I actually appreciate driving slow. Being an amputee now, everything I doesn't have an element of speed to it.
for somebody that doesn't really go anywhere due to disability and funds his own car, no mobility, I'm wondering why my car insurance has gone up by £500 this year alone. Are they going to blame that on Russia as well?....
The DVSA bike behaviour does not surprise me at all. A few years ago, I was overtaken by a "Safety" camera van at way over the limit. Your video comment applies to that also.
A good tip I was given about my riding was about filtering to the front of the line at traffic lights and being 1st across when the lights turn green, this quite dramatically ups your chances of being in a collision with Amber gamblers, so sometimes it's best to consider filtering to and staying behind the driver at the front of the queue if safe to.
Also I've heard that motorcyclists involved in accidents in urban or City streets are usually the non fault party, but on county roads are usually the at fault party AND are more likely to be in fatal accidents on county roads as this is where they are more likely to take risks with speeding.
Nice one Ash...MORE please
4:00 is another bit of road in Nottingham that I am always prepared to see the unexpected, those two left lanes are a lot narrower than they look as well. There is a very sharp left turn in to the retail park where the bike goes but the main road carries on bearing left. Combine that with traffic trying to leave the retail park with no traffic lights and people coming around each bit of the roundabout too fast, I'm surprised there aren't more accidents there.
To be honest, I was expecting an Orwellian "two wheels good, four wheels bad" post, but I'm very pleased to have seen a balanced (forgive the pun!) approach. Thanks, Ashley!
Three things, firstly early on I was told to avoid riding with patched gang mmbers as they are notoriously dangerous. Second that guy picking up the rubbish should have parked first, you increase the rik of tipping over doing something like that. Finally when using bus lanes or any other time I was going to the left of vehicles I was always very aware of traffic turning across, it can happen anywhere, more so in the UK here people park on the opposite side.