Ep. 268 | The Best Cartridge for Whitetails?
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- čas přidán 8. 01. 2023
- Perhaps no other topic kicks the cartridge hornets nest harder than crowning the best cartridge for whitetails. The title of this podcast alone has enough click bait to draw hunters like deer to a January corn pile. Tune in as the Vortex Nation Podcast’s usual suspects tackle this impossible question. What’s your go-to cartridge for America’s most popular big game animal?
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![257 WBY MAG - First Shots and Sighting In [Weatherby Model 307 Range XP]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/B7zNBf0bB24/mqdefault.jpg)
I’ve found the most effective cartridge on whitetail is my wife’s 4 door sedan. Good info guys, thank you.
😂😂😂😂
😂
Who says kinetic energy means nothing!!
@@20020x 27.3 million grains going at 88 feet per second is nothing to sneeze at.
Speed and bumper construction killz!
New drinking game: take a shot when Ryan says “folded like a five dollar tent”
That was only 2 shots. How about every time they say WSM
7mm-08 is my choice and I believe ticks all the boxes as it concerns bullet aerodynamics, bullet weight envelope, recoil, effective range (close & long), quality factory loadings, firearm chassis, action, availability, cost, geographies, etc etc. Nosler 140gr AB out of a T3lite. great bullet, great gun, sleeper cartridge. 140's are light enough to not wreck a bunch of meat, yet heavy enough to make up for a bad shot. Partitions would be a fine substitute as well for a little extra insurance. 21inch drop at 400yards from 200yd zero doing 2100fps is pretty damn good for just a "lady's caliber".
One of my favorites it’s just hard to find ammo for these days in my area.
Sort of a .280 on sedatives.
I kid, but 7-08 is an excellent cartridge.
The 7MM-08 is a magnificent round!!!!!
Nah, not a true long range cartridge at all. 7 SAUM all day for long range.
Definitely long range capable. For the question asked…. One cartridge all whitetails…. It has to be the 7mm-08. Shoot one at 40. Shoot one at 440. Load down with 120’s or up with 160’s or bigger. Mine will launch 150’s at 2850. It will take any whitetail at any reasonable range and with very negligible recoil.
I’m just gonna say my 270 win is the best thing since sliced bread for deer hunting.
I stated my case after you stated yours. but yes the 270 is hard to beat when it comes to just killing Whitetail size game
At moderate range I agree.
.270 WSM is the most awesome. Just an improved .270 Win.
West of the Mississippi = .270
East of the Mississippi = 7mm-08
@@DaveL9170 just wish it was easy to find rifles for it right now
I love Ryan’s choice of Barnes TTSX bullets! They’re my favorite…. Especially in 7mm-08
Just loaded some 140s for my 7mm rem mag can’t wait to try them at the range
I despise those fuckin things, had them loaded in 4 different guns for people including myself. They never expanded, just a small exit hole.
@@matttraxler3567 was the tracking far?
@@erinoconnor9306 My bull was little over a quarter mile theirs was similar. 0 expansion.
Damn
Where I live in Maine You are lucky if you can see 30 yd in the woods. Also have a field 300 yd by 400 yd. The 270 Winchester has done it all for me for 20 plus years. The last five years though I have switched to the 7 mm 08. Last fall my household shot several deer useing hornady 139 grain CX superformance ammo from 40 out to 286yds and it is awesome. That combo is king in my woods. Thanks
I also hunt in Maine. I’ve had deer run at 10 yards and seen them out at 100.
I'm in Maine also ..been starting to use 77 grain out of AR ...your right always under 100 yards so I agree
10 years ago is said no way ..after shooting deer with 257 a bunch there's not a huge difference when in that 100 yards
Just curious Jon, with that 7mm08, in the really thick, nasty stuff you think it going to go well through those whippets? Asking for a friend considering changing from his 30-06 to something lighter, I was going to suggest the 7-08, your thoughts?
@@mikemelina7395 I don't think any caliber shoots through brush well. I don't shoot at running deer in the woods but if they're walking I'll pick my openings. Mostly hunt blinds and tree stands. See deer when I'm still hunting but rarely get a shot. 30-06 is great but if you hunt the woods like I do any deer caliber will do.
Ryan talks a-lot about the proper bullet and construction. I would like to see a podcast on his thoughts on different bullets and the construction of said bullets.
The rifle you have is most likely the best (within reason).
He wouldn't do so.
He couldn't say what's good without identifying which is bad.
Gunblue490 does good ones on bullets... Three part series
He’s talked about it in a few podcasts as side notes. He prefers bullets with high sectional density over anything else. I know he mentions he uses Nosler accubonds a lot.
Ryan has said multiple times he’s not too big on worrying about high BC bullets
A well constructed bullet and good shot place is VERY important. The case it’s launched out of and the diameter of the bullet do not matter as much, to an extent. I love the 6.5x55 and I am very confident in its ability to kill elk, moose and caribou, but if I’m in brown bear country I’m taking the 30-06 loaded with 190 gr Barnes LRX minimum. That would make me feel more safe.
@@Nathan-zw7nq Agree on the 6.5x55 Mauser. For Brown bear country, I think a lightweight reliable semi-auto would be better, with enough bullet to penetrate. I want the ability to make multiple follow-up shots through their face in a charge, not rely on one large recoil event with slow follow-up shot opportunity, especially when they stalk up quietly, wait in ambush to pounce, or rush you. A little 12” Grendel AR-15 would be good for that, loaded with 120gr TSX, 129gr ABLR, or 115gr Barnes VOR-TX maybe. Even 123gr SSTs would get it done though blasting through their skull in that frontal 1/3 entrance.
Ruger 10/22, hell yeah
If I could give this convo two thumbs up I would! Precise bullet placement, with the correct projectile is what matters most!
The single most effective cartridge is the one that you can most consistently shoot within the parameters you can ethically hunt.
Precisely said.
ethnically hunt 😂
@@lotgxj9215 dang autocorrect... got it fixed
So... Everyone's favorite answer? It depends?
@@lotgxj9215 🤣🤣🤣🤣 CZcams is slipping.
My choice is a 7mm-08 in the SE. I have bounced around trying to find the "perfect" round, and I keep coming back around to my Savage 14 chucking 140 Accubonds out there at a tad over 2900 from a 22" barrel. Something that I feel is seldom talked about nowadays is keeping a rifle handy, it seems like the market wants push you to Long range precision shooting with 12lb 28" barreled rifles, or the tacticool thing. The beauty of the 7mm-08 is you can get 280 Rem performance in a short action and just as importantly and one of the reasons I would put it above the 6.5 Creed is because it will get its full potential out of a shorter barrel. But if someone told me I could only have 1 centerfire rifle I would pick a 30/06 every time.
I loaded 139gr GMX to 2900fps in a 22” Model 70 Winchester 7mm-08 using Power Pro 2000MR if I recall. Great little rifle. That will kill anything, probably overkill for East of the Mississippi, and plenty for most shots in the West. If you shoot the newer ELD-X or Nosler Accubond-LR out West, it has more effective killing range than most would imagine.
Nosler 150gr ABLR:
0.546 G1 BC 0.275 G7
Hornady 150gr ELD-X:
0.563 G1 0.283 G7
2750-2800fps with a 150gr in the 7mm-08 smokes the .308 Winchester and beats 6.5CM out to 500yds, where it matches up. No problems with barrel life, for those that have that consideration.
I’m not seeing any advantages to the .30-06 Springfield since the solids perform at 1.4-1.5x their weight compared with a cup and core bullet. 139gr GMX performs like a 195-209gr cup and core bullet when looking at penetration.
I’ve been wanting to build a really short barreled smaller frame AR-10 blaster in 7mm-08 just for fun.
If I'm going one cartridge.,.308/7.r64/51. I've lost count of how many thousands rounds of that zi've put downrange,
I have ot say 7mm-08. I hunt in north west PA on a golf course and so there are some extended ranges as well as forests. I have been shooting 120 gr TTSX and pushing them a hair above 3100 FPS. Both deer I shot this year went about 30 yards with very large blood trails
I hunt South Central PA and also use a 7mm-08. It's almost perfect for hunting the woods and the agricultural fields. I've shot deer from 18 to 178 yards and all have dropped on the spot or gone 40 yards or less. I'm shooting a 139 gr Hornady BTSP at 2650 fps.
The 7mm-08 is darn near the perfect whitetail cartridge!!!!! Plenty of power, light recoil, very accurate, and great BC.
My personal fave is the 270 Win. But, in the context of this video, I’m going to have to go with my 1986 push-feed M70 Featherweight in 6.5x55 Swede. With its light weight, 22” bbl, backup irons and loaded with a 120 TTSX handloaded to 3000fps it checks all the boxes for a Whitetail rifle.
Fantastic cartridge! I have one in a Remington 700 Classic. 22” barrel pushing 153gr A-Tips at 2700-2750fps. I keep my 140gr Accubonds around 2850 for hunting.
@@LegacyOutdoors88 I’d like to try accubonds. I’ve yet to take anything with em. In the 6.5 Swede I’d also like to try the classic Speer 140gr Hotcore
A century later and the 6.5 Swede is still a great hunting cartridge.
I’d vote 7mm-08 even though I don’t own one. It’s the perfect combination for whitetail.
Agreed. I love my 7mm-08 it knocks down everything I've shot
I have 7mm-08. Great round, except finding ammo for it is not easy.
Grew up with one in hand for 15 yrs dropped allot of them. Neck shots were my fav 100 200yds no problem
6.5 go with the 143 eldx 120 put a pencil hole through. Old lady barrel rolled one at 150 yds no need for follow up shot
I’ve used 7mm08/260rem/6.5 Swede/ 6.5 CM. Those are all excellent deer sized game cartridges.
For me a 30 30 for the woods and a 30 06 for longer ranges, it's the perfect duo for me!
I'm a huge fan of 6.5 grendel for deer sized game. It will do the job in almost any situation with an accurate shot.
Really? How about drt shots do they drop or run?
@@brett7794 As long as you can put the round where it needs to go.
All of my nephews started out with 223’s for deer when they were little. While it killed deer blood trails were minimal and hard to follow through pine thickets. Then they moved up to 6.5 Grendel and I can honestly say the on game performance was very very good. Far better than my experience with 223. Which they all use 243’s now, but I gotta say I was impressed with the little Grendel.
The .3006 is ubiquitous and powerful enough to deal with skunkapes too. You never know what you’ll run into in the whitetail woods!
Facts👍
I too cast my vote for the 270 Winchester. It seems to have plenty of power and really smacks them, but it’s not crazy overkill either. Moderate recoil, able to reach and kill 500 yards of need be. Most of my shots are 100 or in so I use a heavier 150 grain bullet and it knocks them down real good
Edit: 270 is ballistically superior to the creedmore
And- a bullet is neither flying or simply passing through the air, but falling. It is falling the moment it is shot.
You are correct, if you drop a bullet and pull the trigger on a gun aimed flat both bullets will hit the ground at the same time.
I have to go with the 270 win! Jack O’Conner was not only a great writer but quite practical when it came to calibers! That being said, he did have to admit the 30-06 was a better all around caliber and if it was good enough for Teddy Roosevelt it’s good enough for me
They didn’t have enough bullet development at the time and guys like O’Conner psyched themselves into believing they needed .30-06 for larger game. A quick read of WMD Bell would have been good for him and the US market, but instead we went the opposite direction with Roy Weatherby who saw the .270 Win as a challenge, and made the .270 Weatherby Magnum. 6.5x54 Mannlicher-Schönauer took everything in Africa in Bell’s hands, including giraffe and elephants.
I love the 30/06. My first and favorite deer cartridge.
I love my 30 06 as well.
Somehow you both spelled that wrong, it's 30-06
@@FlabbyBro it's .30-06
A 444 marlin might be a real brush buster.
I wouldn't mind seeing a 10 min talk on the .444 cartridge. Thanks for the great content.
.308 is just hard to beat given performance, selection, and how cost effective it is to shoot (and as a result, shoot more often). I've been very impressed with the Hornady 125 Gr SST Custom Lite for young shooters. Things may change in 5-10 years if the 6.5 Creedmoor continues to gain in popularity, but for now the .308 seems to be the most practical choice for me.
I won a Savage 99 in .308 Win gave it to my Brother and now after 30 years I have it back and its never been fired and really have no need for it. But I don’t hunt out East.
@@sha6mmplease pm me if you want to sell the 99.
@@sha6mm I've had a number of them and they work just fine out west too.
The most practical if, you’re shooting at short distances, on flat terrain.
@@fedup3582 nah, too much wind drift and drop At extended ranges out west.
North Carolina hunter and I'm loving my H&R single shot 30/30 with a Nikon 3x9x40 scope shooting Remington corelok 150 grain. I've used this setup since 2009 with great success.
In the thicker woods where shots are 200 and in. You are hard pressed to go wrong with the 30-30.
This was my first big boy gun as a kid. Loved it. Would have no issues with that being my only rifle.
@@joeyhinton8 Other than factory ammo being.a.pain in the ass to come by for the last couple years. Gonna be acquiring the dies to reload for our 30-30 soon.
Never bothered with it on the past because ammo was $8-$10 a box.
That sure changed fast.
6.5 PRC !! controllable, accurate, medium recoil. It's neck and neck with the 280 ai. Hornady 130 cx. I've been hunting in BC Canada with this and used it on Lions, Wolves, Whitetail, Mule, and Elk. Incredibly capable
I think it will surpass the manbun in popularity... it's a much better round.
I personally love small rifles. With that being said, my choices of calibers follow suit. Browning x-bolt micro midas chambered in 7mm-08 and Remington model 7 chambered in 6mm Remington. I also own large rifles as well. Piney woods with open clear cuts and pipelines are what we have to hunt here in the south. Shots can range from 30-700 yards, though most are with 75-100. Great podcast gentlemen, keep them coming!!!!!
6.5 Grendel loaded with 120 grain federal fusions. it does a fine job on Kansas whitetails at any ethical distance. Virtually no recoil. Love my Howa mini action, small handy rifle. Very easy to get into tree stands or blinds with and has a good enough trajectory to shoot without dialing out to 300 yards. Suppresses great as well. 308&30-06 are a close second and third for me!
I agree it performs very well!
I bought a Rem model 7 the first year it came out. In 7-08. It was devastating on whitetail. That rifle with its scope 4-12 Leupold.was less than 7 lbs. I was teased all the time about it being a ladies gun. It’s a rifle for everyone. In year one I got 2. The next year I was the stander for our drive. I got Four; taking five shots. That bullet went in 7mm wide and came out almost three fingers wide. I shot 140sp’s. It was a delightful shooter. I felt no real recoil and was back on target extremely fast. The following year the changed the barrel and that added weight. It didn’t need that. For an East coast 150 yd shooter it was perfect. I’d take it for Black Bears NP. Pennsylvania’s state record is 830+ pounds and that was taken with a 30-30. The 7-08 has more at any point of reference.
My 270 as an original remington 700 that was handed down to me does well enough that it is hard to decide on something else other than the total rifle weight. My 243 is about 3 pounds lighter as a marlin xs7 so I may go back to that when I do more hiking in the mountains, using a 95gr federal fusion bullet, or 85gr Sierra gameking as they have the same poi, with the Sierra being my most accurate load. Distances I'd expect are 100-300 yards.
7mm08 is superb, but generally not as readily available as it's also superb parent cartridge the 308Win. Both are excellent for killing deer.
I was an avid deer hunter for around 13 years and killed about 40 Whitetail Deer using mostly a 308Win and mostly the high shoulder shot. The 308Win puts them down.
P.S.
A 270Win, or 30-06 would be excellent also and MANY other calibers including the 6.5 Creedmoor utilizing the right projectile.
Ok, Ok, let’s hit the brakes here!
My worthless 2¢, I’ve hunted Texas whitetail for over 30 years. I’ve used the 308 out of different length barrels, 243, 25-06, 300 Hamr, 6.5 Grendel, 6.5 CM, and the 7RM loaded at full capacity and down loaded to 280/7mm-08 levels. All of these calibers work out to 300 yards and some farther. Out of all these “experiences” the two standouts were the 25-06 and the 7 RM. The difference between the 2 is the level of tissue damage. In the end velocity is king and is far more forgiving than a slower cartridge. The 6.5 as a hunting cartridge is pretty average at best. The 30-06 is the standard that all others are measured by for good reason. Ryan nailed it!
25-06 is the perfect deer cartridge. In the midwest I use 7mm-08. 6.5x55 is a wonderful cartridge for many things. The classy answer is no doubt 257 Robert's which shoots like a dream. But the best all-around is 270 win 😁
.25 WSSM and 6.5 PRC are nice. Very hard to find ammo for .25 WSSM though.
If there was an AR-15 with 2.500" COL magwell and magazine, that chambered in .25 WSSM, that smokes the 6.5CM.
Man, the 25-06, the 6.5x55. I had high hopes. I wanted to agree. Even the 257 Robert’s! No body seems to mention it. But the 257 weatherby is an absolute laser to 300 yards with enough energy to send the deer to St. Peter before it runs on adrenaline
Two favorites are the 7mm08 and the 280 REM. They’re honestly just perfectly balanced hunting cartridges. Right in the sweet spot of power and recoil. The .270 is right in there too
White tail -35 Whelen
Mule deer -35 Whelen
Elk -35 Whelen
Moose- 35 Whelen
Mountain goat -35 Whelen
Sheep -35 Whelen
Black bear -35 Whelen
Grizzly bear -35 Whelen
My guns safe shrunk quite a bit after I had my Whelen built 😂😂👍
Here in Maine I just shot my best whitetail deer to date. I used my Christensen Arms Messa LR in 7mm Rem Mag. Hornady SST 154 grain. That is my Long range gun. I just picked up today a Weatherby Vanguard Hush in 6.5 Creedmoor for my coyote/deer rifle with a Burris signature HD 3-15 by 44 mm illuminated reticle. The 7mm Rem Mag has a Riton scope which is excellent.
This is quickly becoming my favorite podcast. I can't get enough!!! Newish shooter just starting to go down the rabbit hole. Thanks for sharing!!
270 win. Gas enough to kill deer at range and more power than 243, 7-08. Not as loud as 7 mag. Better PBR than larger calibers
Just got a tikka 270 and love it. She can reach out with the best with the 120 grain cox. I think it’s 17” drop at 400 yds!
I have a .307 Winchester Lever. It is a great cartridge. Model 94’s in it are getting hard to find. Basically a .308 ballistic profile in a lever. I also shot a 760 pump Remington in .270. That was a great rifle. Still have it. Now I roll bolt actions. I bought the .270 pump because of Benoit’s book. That was great to hear you talk about that. Great Podcast.
25-06 Remington best deer round hands down
It’s so damn hard to find! I want one but it’s elusive.
Only deer I ever lost was to a close shot from an elevated stand in the rain with a 25-06, I believe the 100gr bullet going blistering fast hit the wet hair and started to open before penetration and deer ran off never to be found...proper bullet i.e. Barnes may have prevented that.
Just try and go into the store to buy a box of ammo for it is like winning the lottery🤔😳
@edwardabrams4972 it sometimes comes down to how much shipping are you willing to spend for a few boxes.
Absolutely the best deer cartridge
Drops them like they been hit by lightning
I'm going with 243 Winchester for where I hunt whitetail for the distance of 300 yds and in select a good bullet and good shot placement does the trick everytime I just can practice a long time at the range from the light recoil and place the shot's where they need to be
I had a frieend, 82nd Airborne Security armorer. LOVED the 243!!!!.
I have a number of rifles I have used for deer. My first (as a teen) was a Model 70 in 25-06 Folds deer like a $5 tent Ha!!! Seriously it does. Still, have and cherish that rifle. At the time (Late 1970's) it was a compromise for deer, pronghorn, and varmints. It works. My next was a 30-06, mostly because a friend had one and praised it. Have not taken as many deer with it. After years of military service, I had time to get back into it. I added to my collection a 6.5 Creedmoor when it was first coming out, a nice 4x12 Vortex scope was picked and added. It has been my fav so far. Dakota's area. Now I am looking at a 6.8 Western or 6.5PRC or a 7PRC and cannot choose. I think one of the big reasons people bash on the 6.5 Creed has been it's own success. You go to a gun store and you can't swing a dead cat without hitting a 6.5 Creedmore, it is nearly like that is the only caliber existing anymore.
I think you need to do a podcast on why Ryan hates the 7 mag lol
As someone who shoots 7mm rem mag (and 28 nosler) I 100% agree and need to hear why he hates it so.
Overrated maby? Harder to reload, not much beter than the 280 ai. I agree we need a podcast on this
The new 7mm PRC is a better choice unless you build a custom 7mm RM with an 8 twist and run from a Wyatts mag box if action choice permits. But, I watched my father harvest a bunch of deer in WI out to 450yds with his old BDL in 7mm RM running a 154 Hornady spire point.
I agree. It’s on the low end of big stuff. Love mine. When in doubt take more.
He addressed it some in the 7mm-08 episode I think. Basically he dosen't like how inefficient it is and that it's a belted case, but the funny thing is he seems to like the 300 Win mag 🤷♂️.
There are more than a few perfect whitetail cartridges. .280AI is my by far favorite cartridge, but my 7mm-08 is by far my favorite whitetail cartridge. 140AB’s for years but switched to 120 HH’s and very happy. Very efficient, low recoil, and a dream to load. Out to 300 yards in SE USA with great performance.
Great episode guys, really agree with Mark's evolution theory. Southeast/Mid Missouri hunter here. Most of the terrain is rolling hills and woodlands that range from dense woods to mature timber and small farm lots. My grandpa shot a remington woodsman in 30-06. My father passed on a marlin 336 in 30-30 to me which I used for many years successfully. I've since used a .308 and a .270 winchester. All have been fantastic whitetail cartridges. I keep coming back to my 18in ruger american in .308 with a 1-4x scope. It's handy in the woods or the fields and replicates the ballistics of the .300 savage from a 24 inch barrel. If you want to buy factory ammo in my area you are guaranteed to find .308, 30-06, 6.5 creedmore, and .270 winchester on the shelves at most Walmarts or sporting goods stores.
I always love hearing everyone’s opinion on their selections for whitetail cartridges. I use to be so compassionate and stick behind my choice of .308 Win being hands down the best all around cartridge ever made. These days I shoot just about everything and they have all performed amazing. “Buy them and shoot them all”, has been my quote over the past several years. Living and hunting in Oklahoma I love my Marlin 1894 44 mag for my woods rifle. I alternate between 300 Win Mag, 308 Win, 280 AI, 270 WSM, 270 Win, 6.5 creedmoor, 260 Rem, 25-06 REM as my choices. Bullet selection for whitetail, Swift A-Frame, Hornady ELD-X, Hornady SST, Sierra TGK.
6.5 Grendel anyone? In about 90% of whitetail country, including 300-400 yard bean field shots, it’s a slayer! But other than that, my wife’s 270 does everything I need.
I bought a Howa Carbon Stalker mini action "for my grandkids"; which is funny because the oldest is 3 years old. After carrying it a dozen times or so this year, with one deer down, they may never know it was theirs. 5.5 lbs with a nice, midweight, 30mm tubed scope is hard to leave at home.
I love my Grendel. Dead accurate, lightweight firearm, and still carrying 1000 ft lbs of energy out to 400 yards.
It comes down to actions. A 308 in a long action is a waste but 308 in an AR15/micro action doesnt fit.
If one chooses an AR15 to hunt with (thankfully more and more people every year) then the Grendel is a sweet cartridge for it.
The Grendel is a great whitetail cartridge, but don't forget the 6.8 SPC either 100 Accubonds at 2950 is lethal to whitetails.
I’d agree 6.5 grendel! No recoil and very accurate. In a bolt gun I’ve always picked 223 or 22-250 with Barnes bullets for the same reasons.
In the woods of East Texas my all time favorite caliber is the 7.62X39. I'm always surprised to see the amount of people that claim they need a 30-06 or larger for deer. That's just punishing your shoulder for nothing.
Same reason I like 6.5 Grendel
Most people can't shoot. That's the problem.
@@dr.froghopper6711 I'm waiting on my local Academy to get a Ruger American in 6.5 Grendel in stock. That will probably be my next purchase.
For sure. I like the 154 gr soft points on hogs. Haven’t taken any deer with 7.62 but would expect great result
Most people destroy their AK on the first 2-3 mags. Out to 300 yards the 7.62 X 39 is like a deer death ray even for an old half-blind shooter like me.
30-30 or 308 for woods hunters. 270 for longer range plains hunting.
I do love hunting with my 30-30s I have 3 left to me from each generation of my family starting with grand father great grandmother and great great grandfather but to call it the best cartridge is ignorant. It is a good 100 yard gun. A more modern cartridge is good for 10 yards to 400 yards I can hunt the thick swamp and a field in the same day without switching rifles
The issues 30-30 has are bullet selection and weapon selection. Although there _were_ some bolt action 30-30 rifles, the only options on the market im aware of are lever actions and a few break actions.
This is also a generational thing. I am 54 and got my first centerfire rifle 41 years ago. At that time, obviously, scores of catridges existed. But for a new shooter, you basically had two options at the local gun store rifle counter for a first simple bolt rifle: .30-'06 or .270. I chose the former - a Howa 1500 action in walnut branded as a Smith and Wesson rifle with a Weaver K4 - and still shoot it today. My guess is that in the pre-online gun buying era, the same was true for 75% of people. And now there is a new generation of ballistic advancements and focuus on higher BC bullets that require faster twist rates for modern cartridges the 6.5 CM. If I was that same 13 year old kid today, I'd get a 6.5 CM or a 6.8 Westerner or maybe a 7 PRC. Right now for ammo availability, selection, and price and rifle options at all price levels, hard to be beat the 6.5 CM.
Great episode. Can you do this same argument for elk size game?
Not to steal your thunder, but this should be done for separately for cows and bulls.
6,5x55 Swede is the best over all cartridge, please do a full episode on 6,5x55 Swede and show some modern rifles.
Posting another vote for the .270 Win. I've shot the same rifle for 30+ years.
Hand load 130gr. Speer Grand Slam bullet over 57 gr. IMR 4831.
I'm thinking its time work up new load using the Hornady 145 gr.ELDX bullets.
I hunt Colorado / Wyoming high plains for Pronghorn and Plains Deer (Muleys and Whitetail)....Wind and more wind.
The old .257 Roberts with 117 grain Winchester silver tip - always a great deer cartridge out of the Remington 700 BDL. Mild recoil with good ballistics at most common hunting ranges (under 300 yards). Would love to know what your opinions at Vortex are of the old "Bob" for hunting... Great podcast. I bought a Tikka 6.5 CM 2 years ago and it is truly a fine deer and antelope cartridge for here in MT. Much easier to find ammo for than the .257 Roberts.
they did an episode on this already, watch it
I personally like the 270win it just works well but honestly there are so many good cartridges between a 243 and a 300 win mag that are great dear cartridges.
Ryan talked about his 3006 loaded with the Barnes 130 gr bullet at 3200+, this load will take whitetails at all ranges and the 3006 is the most versatile cartridge ever for the handloader. The old 3006 will handle any game in North America including big Bears, Jack Oconner killed 16 grizzles with the grand old 3006 and admitted that the 3006 is more versatile than the great 270 Winchester.
On that 7mm08 vs 280 comment. Had a chance at a real nice Ruger #1 in 280. After doing some looking around in the reloading manuals. I will say, with the right powder. Getting similar ballistics of a 280 from a 7mm08 is there. Since I already have a Tikka 7mm08, I let the Ruger go home with someone else.
I recently chose a Browning X-Bolt Hunter chambered in 270WIN with 129gr barnes LRX for my dedicated deer hunting rifle in Northern Alberta. Reason: I wanted a flat shooting rifle with a 7”MPBR exceeding 300m but with moderate recoil so I can avoid using a muzzle brake. I also wanted to be able to deliver 1200ftlbs energy with a copper monolithic to 500m. I compared 29 different cartridge/bullet combinations to see what options best suited these specified performance preferences. I compared 6.5CM, 6.5PRC, 708REM, 308WIN, 25-06, 270WIN, 6.8W, 30-06, 7mmRM, 270WSM, 300WSM, 300WM. Before I started the review my guess was that 6.5PRC would win hands-down… boy was I surprised when the numbers came in and the old school 270WIN/129grLRX was the clear winner. The only other cartridge that could match or beat the 270 was the 6.8 Western… but lack of availability unfortunately disqualified it. Sure all the WSM’s beat it for flatness but at the cost of recoil. The 708/145grLRX qualifies in terms of energy and lower recoil but is not nearly as flat. The 270 is a sweet spot cartridge IMO.
I love the 30-06! Can't go wrong with it. Never know the scenario you're faced with. Never a bad thing to have a little more power to back you up. I'm hunting with the 7mm-08 right now and feel confident to take anything in the south with a shorter barrel and a suppressor added
For whitetails, in the dakotas, I have lately been shooting a savage ultralight in 308 with 175g terminal ascent. I have shot them here with a 7mm-08 and a 25-06. I have only shot 1 with Ryan's favorite 7 mag. It was at close range and there was a lot of meat damage.
I cut it in the middle, between 308 and 6.5 creed. I use 7mm-08 for whitetail, but if your not a reloader it’s getting hard to find ammo for.
If I had to buy a new rifle right now, and shoot factory ammo it would be 6.5prc because I see the most ammo and rifles in my area.
Just got my 13 year old a 6.5 for Christmas he loves it. I use a Sears and Roebuck (Winchester Model 70) 30.06 that I love. We hunt here in western ky. Love the podcast!!!
Mainly hunting mountains of WV and bottomlands/ pine Savannah of Eastern NC. I really like my 308. I’m shooting a Remington Model 7 with a lightweight aftermarket stock, and 150gr TTSX handloads. Plenty of power of course, always get complete pass through a BB resulting in good blood trails, and relatively flat shooting for a 308. I plan to take it to Wyoming next year for antelope as well
Good discussion. As a native southern Arizonan and life-long Coues deer hunter, the proper pronunciation is COWS deer, which was how the naturalist Army Dr. Eliot Coues, who identified and named the subspecies while serving at Ft. Whipple in southeastern AZ circa 1860s, pronounced his name. Having said that, probably 90% of AZ hunters say "cooz." And the best cartridge is the one you shoot best, and actually practice shooting and knowing your sights. My current choice is .25-'06 because I have had it for years and it shoots well for Coues deer. To each his or her own.
Area: Southwest MO. Rifle: 7mm-08 with a 140gr bullet is what I've used the last 10 years or so. Fun fun to hunt with but I will pull out the old .30-.30 marlin in 150gr every once in a while for nostalgia sake.
260 Remington, period, and the Winchester model 88 in 308, very handy rifle.
It's not really a "period" if you follow your first answer with a different cartridge.
@@sapago4166 ur stupid
.270 hands down!! Taken tons of deer from 6 yards to 275 yards.
Loved this episode, I can’t believe you guys went thru a whole episode talking about the best deer cartridge and didn’t mention the .260! I hunt in the northeast where a big whitetail buck weighs about 200 pounds, and most deer are around 125-150 pounds. The .260 is perfect for this size game. Also if you asked 10 hunters in this area what cartridge they use 8 would say 6.5 creedmoor and nobody would say .260, therefore too me if you don’t want to follow the crowd it is a great option
For hunting, it IS the better option.
6.5 is a .260
I have a 280 ai but my tikka 260 is the go to for white tails.
Excellent discussion! Very informative.
Great podcast. One small correction though. There is a huntable subspecies of whitetail that most people have never heard that are smaller in size and range than the Coues deer. The Blackbeardii subspecies inhabits the coastal islands of GA. Speaking from experience a healthy southern coastal (3.5 year old) buck will field dress around 65-70 lbs. Mature doe will be in the 40-60 lb range. They are fabulous little deer and live in a really cool environment. The experience of hunting them really cool, too.
7mm08 eastern, 270win western
🤠 Exactly!!! 😁
I like the 270 so much I have 2. A tikka and Rem 700 both with the old Razor LH with the G4. Works well for Missouri deer and Wyoming antalope with 145gr ELDX
Can't go wrong with the ol' Dodge Diplomat. Entertaining video fella's, thank you!
Hey guys hello from Australia
Luv your show I have been watching since you started keep it up you crack me up😅
.308 Winchester is obviously a great choice. It is also right on the heels of the 6.5 Creedmoor ballistically. Compare the ballistics of Federal's 6.5 CM 130gr Terminal Ascent to Nosler's .308 Win 168gr Trophy Grade LR. Very, very close ballistically, and with the higher terminal performance that comes with a .30 caliber.
So many good cartridges for white tail. Don't forget 300 savage and 257 Robert. My all time favorite is the 270 wsm
What I’m using is a Tikka .30-06 super light with vortex razor LHT 3-15 shooting 178eldx @ 2800 here in eastern Idaho. Carry a box of 180 Nosler partitions if I am close to grizzlies. I’m thinking a 280AI might just be about the most ideal cartridge for me. But first I need to be successful with what I got now. Thanks for the longer format video, I enjoyed the rambling. :)
Great episode fellas! My ultimate whitetail deer rifle is the Remington 700 Classic stainless walnut special run 257 Roberts. A 90gr Sierra BlitzKing if in a Texas style deer blind and for all around 120gr Speer Jacketed Soft Point Boat Tail at .480 BC that will take out Whitetails inside 400 yards in West Texas all day every day.
Do an episode to explain Ryan’s hate for 7rem mag…. It must be a fantastic cartridge understanding Hornady’s goal was to beat it with the 7PRC.
Ryan and I just agreed! Amazing. Although I use a 7mm mag for
Deers😆
If you reload 7mm mag, try this load. 140 grain Swift Scirocco over 46 grains IMR 4064. My chronograph shows 2600 fps. About 2400 foot pounds energy. For Elk try Swift A-Frame over 68 grains H-870. About 3200 foot pounds energy. Ouch!) It kicks hard. CHRIS
Over many years i have used 223, 243, and a 30/06. I loved the smaller yet fast calibers and they never disappointed me ever with a barnes bullet! Finally moved up to a 6.5cm and was not happy when using a lead core bullet. I thought it needed more speed to open up faster. Started hand loading a 127lrx barnes and again it did not disappoint. Got a 6.5prc, now we are moving fast enough for the lead cores to work. Just got some 127 barnes for itand just waiting to find the next wondering hog. Stepped up to a 300prc and bought some 208lrx barnes and waiting to load these.... SO! I love the 223,243,6.5cm and 6.5prc for deer. Anything bigger is just overkill and waisted energy. IMO. Ill take accuracy and bullet choise over caliber size any day. Ryan and i would be bffs! Lol!
In my country people love the 243. We don’t have a lot of elk size game so the flat shooting and affordable cartridge is appreciated.
Savage 110 270 Winchester 20” barrel. Switching to the 130 gr cx from a 130 nosler ballistic tip.
Also a cva scout in 450 bushmaster currently with a 250 ttsx in northern michigan.
own 1 "hunting" rifle, had it since 1988 when i bought it new, and i have filled the freezer every year, and its a 30-06. never felt the need to replace it cause it wasnt good enough. from a turned a corner and the deer was literally 10 feet away all the way out to a long range(for me anyways) 450ish yards. always brings home the meat.
Southeast Georgia, I run up 2 loads for 2 different deer rifles. For the thicker swamp area I use a Henry single shot in 30-30 loaded with the Barnes TSX 150s and Leverevolution at around 2350 out of the 22" barrel. For the planted pines and clear cuts I use a Remington model 7 in 243 loaded with the Barnes 85 grain TSX at 2920 with Ramshot Hunter. Our deer range in size depending on the counties and food sources, but are still relatively small so I prefer the smaller 243 with the solid bullet for the longer shots and penetration. For the thicker nasty brush and closer ranges I like the slower 30-30 with the solid bullet for the penetration once again, but also seems to have less meat damage. Am exploring an even slower alternative for closer ranges in the form of a 10mm auto out of a 6" 1911.
I’m actually surprised Ryan didn’t say 280. Easy button for deer is definitely the 30-06. But 280 is the perfect blend. I would like to change my answer. Lol
I agree 💯. 3006 shooting a federal terminal accent bonded. Just kills shit
Hard to make an argument for 30-06 over .270 for whitetail.
@@sbcbaits994 that’s simple. 1. 30-06 has more bullet options x 100. And a heavier bullet that kills more stuff , more dead. Science
280 AI seems to be a handloader's darling, but if you aren't, the ammo selection and availability are almost embarrassing compared to 30-06 or 270.
I know personally that the more I learn about 280 AI, the more I love it, but I also don't shoot nearly enough to justify investing in handloading, and I can't bring myself to consider a 280 AI rifle otherwise.
@@InfamousTactical is take a 300 wsm over a 30/06 though with the exact same bullet selections for 1 as the other
My Winchester Model 70 in .270 Win still gets the job done here in the southeast U.S. I shoot the Nosler 130 grain ballistic tip. Might try the 130 grain accubond someday.
I’m a 308 man but I have hunted with the bloody aut six with great results, just more recoil than I want after 45 years of hunting. I’ve always shot my 308 T the range now I hunt with it all the time, results are the same.
love the show. I own a 270, 6.8 western, 6.5 creedmoore & 300 wsm. love them all.
My nephew used my 30-06 as his rifle was not ejecting this season, so I used my 338 Win Mag. I harvested both a buck and doe, one shot each. My new deer gun, the 338 Win Mag! 😊
That's some big medicine for a whitetail!
Yes it is, but it is sure effective. I was pretending I was on an elk hunt.😊
@J W Is it a Browning BAR, or a bolt action? I shoot .300 Win Mag in a BAR for wapiti, never fired a .338.
@@24kachina It is a Winchester 70 (Alaskan) 338, a popular guide gun. It is fine to hunt with, but a killer to sight-in on a bench. I wear hearing protection when hunting with it. When I shoot hunting, all of my hunting partners know it is me. It has quite a bark.
270 Winchester or 25-06.
I use a .308 AR-10 with a 20" Barrel, Suppressed. Im shooting a 200 Grain Sierra Game King with 42.7 grains of Varget powder at 2504. Its a sub 400 yard gun that drives absolute tacks and is a sledge hammer when it makes contact. Its the kiss of death and its quite enjoyable to shoot.
I like this discussion, I have several deer hunting calibers, seven in total, and while I like the 30-06 as a highly versatile cartridge which I still keep for trophy hog hunts my 6.5x55 (ballistic twin to the 6.5 Creedmoor) and my 7mm-08 are my go to all around guns. Both are fantastic in terms of shooting and harvesting game. If I lived in an area with larger whitetail or mule deer I would probably use my 30-06, 7mm Rem Mag, or 270 WSM exclusively, but here in Texas I find all of those to be a bit excessive most of the time as most of the shots that I take are under 100 yards and on game under 150lbs, the 6.5 and 7mm take them with an authority and with minimal meat damage. My old 270 Win bridges that gap between 6.5mm and 30-06 performance but I have never found a need for that personally, although if I were ever to have to pick one gun for all game that would be a prime contender.
I was going to say 6.5 creedmoor with the 143 eldx, but now that mark picked it I'll probably have to buy a new caliber.
😂
Northwoods of Minnesota, my savage 110 270win is fond of the 130 grain Nosler BT
Missouri hunter here where the longest shot I have is ~200 yards. The Hornaday 300 BLK 110g CX is a great choice. And in an AR pistol for alternative season, it is a great double duty round!
The 6.5Cre is a great bullet. I like the heavier higher BC bullets for more calculable ballistics. It’s the middle cartridge for recoil as well. It’s between the 243 on the low end to the 30-06/7mmMag.
Big fan of the growing 280 AI, Appreciate the 270 Win also. 7mm-08, 6.5 Creed both share a valid spot for Whitetail. Being in Nebraska/Wyoming I like to default to something a little flatter with a little more energy. So 280 AI gets my vote - Never know when your hunting Mule Deer on a StateWide tag. Not that my 6.5 Creed hasn't put those down and even at over 400yds. But really appreciate the 7mm variety
Good bunch of picks.
I got a 280 AI x-bolt. I started shooting the 160 partitions. It hammers deer and hog like a ton of bricks at a range of 10 to 410 yards.
This is one of your best episodes. Love the knowledge, love the vibe.
7mm-08 rules, South Texas, 140gr fusion
Lots of fun! Southern Illinois, near Missouri, agricultural and wood blocks, IF we could use a rifle here, 6.5 Creedmoor, 308, and 243 in that order. Since we can't, the Savage 220 slug with Hornady SST bullet has performed flawlessly FOR ME out to 167 yds. For my Muzzleloader, Same bullet in 240 gr. w/ 120gr BLACKHORN 209 has never failed me. it delivers the payload and they have folded like a 5 Dollar Tent! cheers
Always a fun debate!
It's probably easier to come with a list of "inappropriate" cartridges.
Bullets are fare more important than what the headstamp says.
Three step process,
1. Set up a rifle that fits you and you shoot well in a reasonable cartridge.
2. Practice, practice, practice. In field conditions.
3. Find a deer.
Benjamin you have it right! Here's my list of the inappropriate or at least unnecessary for Whitetails: All the 30 caliber and larger belted magnums, some smaller than that like the 264 Win Mag and a bunch of the new super fast non-magnum magnums like the Noslers. All super meat destroyers.
My personal favorite is a 6.5x55 Swiss out of a Sako Bavarian Carbine, but I've actually taken more whitetail with my old trusty Savage M111 in 270 win, but I currently carry a 6.5 Grendel
6.5x55 Swede.. Swiss is another country 😁
In Sweden and Norway this the most common caliber. I use It for even for elk.