The TOP 19 Straight Walled Cartridges Compared
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- čas přidán 19. 04. 2023
- In this video, I talk about the top straight-walled cartridges, compare the new competition to the established cartridges, and determine the BEST cartridges for several different categories.
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
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All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely. - Sport
Left out the .444 Marlin. One of the best straight wall cartridges for hammering whitetails. I use a handloaded 265gr Hornady FP for my go-to whitetail load.
I agree, at 11:07, the 444 marlin is on his list. Evidently he removed it off on his later list. I have a T/C Contender in 444 that was a 44 magnum, but was sent back to SSK / JDJ and re-chambered. Also have a Marlin Outfitter chambered in 444.
That's because the case length is 2.25". The maximum case length we can use is 1.8".
The .444 Marlin is a great cartridge, but we can't use it in lower Michigan, and if I'm going north, I'm taking a .30-06 or .308 rather than a short range rifle.
@@Sman7290 I live in WV, so I don't have to worry. I never measured a 444 case, but I would think it is shorter than a 45/70. I own both in Contenders. I always hunted with the .308. Thanks for the reply !
@@Sman7290not all straight wall states limit cartridge length. It's a shame that some do, because the .444 is the best choice IMO, especially with the Leverevolution ammo.
@@Sman7290 Dont have that issue here in South Alabama. .444 is supreme hunting in the river swamps for deer and hogs.
Ron Spomer comes through again with common sense gun and ammunition information we can all use. Thanks, Ron. 👍🏽
What would 460 in encore energy at 200yds
Thank you, Ron.
@@danhughes3626 Ron Spomer really shorted the 460 S&W, with hot ammo from Underwood, Buffalo Bore, Double Tap, etc or handloads the 460 is the power house of any of the straight wall cartridges he mentioned and with a 1.8" case length and 45 cal bullet it fits the straight wall restrictions. Underwood has a load that produces 2,886 ft.lbs of ME in a pistol barrel, if that load was put in a T/C Encore with a 26" barrel it would be a seriously heavy hitter running neck and neck with hot 45-70 govt loads. I did a longer comment on this video with even more details about the 460 if you are interested.
@@chrisdaniel1339 I want to see it
Definitely hard to argue with raw numbers.
Straight wall cartridges. As far as a pistol cartridges. The 44 mag works wonderful on Deer. Better than it has any right to. Elmer Keith did a good job designing that round.
As an IL deer hunter, I love the attention you've given to these new straight wall cartridges. But since they're replacing slug guns for us, I would have loved to see a comparison to 12 & 20 ga slugs.
It would be fun to see. However, I switched from my 870 slug gun, using the lightfield hybrid slugs to using the 350 legend in 2019, and I will never look back.
Ah! Now there is a good point . And which slugs are they all the same?
I don't think many would like to compare their center fire straight wall of choice against the remington accutip bonded slug.
Except it isn't actually available I've been trying to get some for two yrs.
@@JJ-qy8xu For years, I used a Savage 220 slug gun, shooting the Remington 3" AccuTip, and it was dynamite on deer. Now, I hunt in a county that allows rifles, and I use a .375 Win. in the brush and a .308 for everywhere else. Getting bullets for the .375 is the problem, but I did locate a source for them. I don't yet know how well they will shoot out of my M94.
Slugs out of a 12ga can take a charging grizzly down if you hit it in the chest that 450 bushmaster will need a nice shot to the heart lung area or just magdump your ar into its chest
I took a doe late season this past January(illinois 1st rifle season ever) 200 yards best performance yet. Also took a 10pt with a ar pistol opening day and my brother did. Both at 150 yards no tracking required. 350 legend handloads are the best. Can't say much for factory.
You said it best towards the end. People are belly aching about these new cartridges. Just be thankful that we have the opportunity to choose between all of these fine options.
Exactly. Don't like or want one of the new options? Don't buy one, and use what you like. I wish everything were that easy. 🙂
I choose to hunt with 450 Bushmaster when I am in thick woods in Montana. Never had to track a deer or a bear. I don't use the 450 for hunting open country.
Here in Ohio I love using my 45/70, but My daughters .357 mag is a handy dandy little rifle that works just as good at the ranges we hunt at. I have had deer run off a little ways with both. And some that dropped on the spot with both.
I bought a 350 legend during the virus in past years, and I use it for everything. The rifle was cheap, and the ammo is as well. I love mine
I love mine as well but as soon as it got popular the ammo price skyrocketed here in Texas. Great round for hogs.
@Jonathan Head that kinda sucks its still pretty reasonable here in Arkansas, but it has gone up
I've definitely been looking at the 350 legend rifle ✌️ seems to be a little more accurate than the 300 black out 👍
The 350 Legend is a winner and cheap ammo is widely available in Florida. It's highly popular in Ohio, a straight wall cartridge state. Bolt action rifles are cheap and accurate, and the round does not kick much. What more can you ask for?
I built me an AR STYLE RIFLE IN THE .350 legend and I love this gun!
I'm a 45-70 guy myself. Absolutely love that round.
150 years old and still going. making a big comeback actually, its a lot more popular today than it was 10-20 years ago.
@@ChaotiX1indeed it has made quite the comeback. It's resurged popularity has really pushed manufacturers to design new lever guns. as well as redesign old models.
Surprisingly versatile round, stops the biggest bear in a scout rifle package that bush pilots swear by and can be used on mule deer down to whitetail etc.
I had the 444 years ago.. fantastic deer rifle.. every deer I shot never took a step... I loved it way more then the 06 .. 270 ect I had.. the 444 was the 1st rifle I would grab
444 is what I put my vote to. It's a handloaders dream, and based on capability is the best all around North American straight wall cartridge.
With a case length of 2.225 it's not an option for some straight wall only states due to length restrictions.
@@kdmag8858 Who needs those states and their non-sensical rules.
@KDMag 88 yeah but sure hammers deer.. shot many with mine.. none took a step.. shot a doe in the chest directly facing me at 40 yards... came out her butt...I loaded the 240 gr xtp... it was a deer killer
@@kdmag8858 yes it is. Not all states have a length limit on straight walls, Ohio being an example.
Don't assume. At least take the bare minimum to look up what you are commenting on, or in the case of the nature of your comment reach out to the original poster to find out what context he is making his comment under first.
For all of North America, the 444 is probably the best cartridge of the staightwalls. If you hunt in eastern states in wooded areas or keeping your shots within 150 yards a lever action 44 magnum is the best option.
if you dont break all the blood vessels in your head,
@@alonzahanks1182 recoil impulse from the 444 isn't strong enough to do that. Unless you are seconds away from an aneurysm anyway.
@@patrickhenry236 I was blowing up boulders with realy big slugs and having fun.
with a marlin 444
but had to keep going because we were building rock walls out of them
After 80 rounds my nose wouldnt stop bleeding
at 60 i felt like somebody was hitting me with a base ball bat
I made my dad buy a muzzle brake
@@alonzahanks1182 that's not the 444's fault. That one's on you. There is a kid where I work who has kleenex hanging out his nose every other day because he gets nose bleeds during the spring and summer even if he sits still in a chair. I've been shooting the 444 for over 20 years, and have never bled from doing so.
That was your own body having an issue, not the rifle.
I agree. I think the trip4 is the finest lever action round ever produced. It is an all around great caliber capable of taking any and all North American game and would be a reasonable option in Africa, too, if loaded with the proper bullet. I prefer the shorter range weapons. I am not in favor of the hunter shooting game at extreme ranges. To me, that is not hunting. I am not judging long range shooters, I just think hunting is a short range endeavor requiring a different skill from that of doping your equipment/data to hit game at 700 yards.
Love my Henry Big Boy .357. Here in Ohio it’s pretty easy to get within 125 yards of anything you need to shoot, so it is the one I take into the woods every time!
I built a 350 legend AR. I was honestly shocked how limited the recoil was and it feeds flawlessly. I really like the straight wall stuff in that 100 yard mark.
Those setups have been becoming popular in Texas for hog culling.
Same here! This thing is a sewing machine smooth, plenty of knock-down for pigs, more than enough for White-tail with fast dispatch inside 200 yards. I'm very pleased with the round.
I have no problem reaching out to 200 with my 350L AR build, knocks the absolute snot outta hogs.
@@jordanhicks5131 hammer bullets made a 130g option I bet just the velocity increase will really help at 200 yards.
@@jordanhicks5131 Keep knocking those hogs down.
The 460SW from a TC encore 16" is objectively the best of the bunch, but it goes unmentioned
You sir are still my favorite gun commentator to watch, Keep them coming sir! Love listening to you, Peace and Grace!
Many thanks, Zechnar.
Marlin .444 gotta be top 5
444 marlin is the best straight wall going, for any critter you would care to dispatch. Thompson encore rifle with a 26" straight bull barrel, 325 gr hardcast (18-22bh) gas check, at 2300+- will stop pretty much anything on the planet!!
You can hand load the 444 from mild to wild
Great gun . My dad uses it for deer and black bear .
yep
I agree! The 444 is one of the best and most versatile.
I'm a 308 guy and don't live in a State that has requirements of just straight wall cartridges only, but I do enjoy grabbing my daughter's 350 legend and sitting in the stand with it! I had my doubts bout it, but it has proven many times to be very good choice for deer medicine in SC! So for a daddy's gun I'm rooting for the new 400 legend!
Like a 30-30 for the AR. If I didn't already have a marlin 336 I'd get the 350 legend
45-70 getting my vote , but realistically the 38-55/375 Winchester is the more practical rifle , and the 44mag is also a superior utility cartridge
Like he said thought that’s a bench mark of performance, it’s not legal for the places that are limited to straight wall cartridges.
@@jaydunbar7538
They should all be legal in states that only have the straight wall restriction. Not every jurisdiction has the length limitation afaik.
@@jaydunbar7538 Peoples fault for voting in people with rules restricting their hunting firearms
@@cbsbass4142the people who hunt aren’t the people who vote to restrict access to hunting or firearms. They just happen to live in the same state as urban know nothings who vote in droves on issues they don’t understand.
This was pure gold for a ballistics nerd like me. Thanks Ron!
I've got a 20 inch barrel Bushmaster AR in 450 Bushmaster and its absolutely amazing. I shoot it at ranges up 250 yards and its performance for me has been perfect. Absolutely hammers game. Thanks Ron for another great video.
100% agreement! Mine shoots so well I wouldn’t consider another caliber.
getting one
I just bought one. I took it to the range and it kicks like a mule. After I finetune my scope, I think it will be a very nice addition to the collection.
Ill light load the 450 for target shooting. Test different projectiles on different materials too. Pure zinc is a bitch to mould but expands a bit on steel and easier on the barrel than copper. Just under an inch on backside of a 20 lb propane can😊
RON: as always, excellent video. I really LOVE that you do such a thorough comparison of a select group (in this case, the straight walls) of cartridges. Really puts things in proper perspective, without all he ammo company hype. Many thanks!!
444 Marlin with the right projectile.
You got that Right!!! like 185gr. or 225gr.😉
I really like Hornady's 265 grain LEVERevolution out of my Model 444.
444 Marlin. 57.8 grs Vihtavuori N120 with 200 gr XTP 2851 fps.
i love that you know what point blank actually means most people think it means right up close.
Your knowledge, and willingness to share it, is very appreciated! I've been a shooter and hunter for decades, and you always teach me something. Thank you!
Really enjoyed the longer in depth video
I have a Ruger American Ranch in .450 Bushmaster topped with a Burris Compact 2x7x32mm scope. It's a 1 MOA rifle with Hornady Black 250 grain bullets. It's my truck / camp / drift boat rifle in bear territory. It's a great combo and very compact. I was very impressed with the .450 bullet accuracy with factory ammo.
I second this. I have the exact same rifle (with Leupold scope) and mine is a total tack driver as well. Surprisingly accurate to be honest!
Load your own you can dial that recoil down a bit. Testing pure zinc projectiles since softer and cheaper than copper. Nice using one bullet mould for pistol and rifle
Thank you Ron. Absolutely concise, informational and no BS muchly appreciated. Thanks again.
The reason for not allowing rifles in 'shotgun only' area in Michigan is just because of the number of people who hunt deer, not the range of the rifle. We can't use a .30-06 for deer, but it is legal for squirrels. Lawmakers do not know guns or range or hunting.
Thank you Ron for the information. Always valuable.
Another great video Ron, I hunt Northern Minnesota, thick woods. I have a 30-30, 270 and a couple other deer rifles. Two years ago I built a 450 Bushmaster AR fantastic gun just to noisy racking in that first round so I bought a Ruger bolt action 450 Bushmaster. Have crushed 2 deer with them, this past year a 10 pt 217 pound buck, dressed out and after hanging for 5 days. My new favorite woods gun.
I really like my Marlin 41 Mag. 210 XTP at 1,900 fps and Sierra 170s at 2,200! I shot a forked horn (4pt Eastern) mule deer at 75 yards. One shot behind the shoulder did the trick.
When I want less recoil I shoot reduced loads with my 450 Marlin. Still plenty of power for deer out to about 150 yds. Very versatile round if you load em yourself.
As always Ron .
You put out great videos and good information.
I'm in Michigan and have been a Handgun 44 Magnum hunter for the last 20+ Years .
I have now moved to the Winchester 92 in 44 Magnum for hunting.
The 44 Magnum is capable of taking all game available in Michigan.
My go too Rifle is a Winchester 94 in 30/30 .
Not a lot of difference till you go out past 100 yards .
If I was a young man .
Just starting out in hunting and firearm collecting.
I think I would start with a Henry 360 Buckhammer .
You got a little more power & energy over the great 30/30 and you can use it in the straight wall cartridge states .
God bless brother.
Ron
Ron, the 460 S&W is NOT a .458 projectile like the 45-70, its a .452 just like the 45 Long Colt and 45 ACP!
Or maybe you are correct for modern guns/ammo, I guess bore sizes have changed or standardized over the years.
Ron, forget the cartridge marketing. How bout a look at the old "Gould" bullet used in the 45-70. This truly is a legend of a cartridges and legend deer load.
Aaron, what do you mean by cartridge marketing? I'm detailing cartridge/bullet performance potential so viewers can better understand how all compare to one another against a well known benchmark like the 30-30. I include every extant straight wall cartridge I could think of, even many for which rifles are rarely, if at all, chambered anymore. I did not favor or recommend one round against all others. I guess you could say I am "marketing" all straight walled cartridges. Sorry, Aaron, I just don't understand your position.
What about the 375 Winchester ? It's a straight wall cartridge !
I'd take it over the new Remington 360 Buckhammer or the Winchester 350 @ 400 Legend . I'm Old School and don't Change if isn't Broke !
What an excellent presentation - very informative with a great delivery style
Great Video, Thank You for posting the Charts also. I was wishing you had the .45 Colt just to see what it compares too. Thanks again.👍👍
I am just very happy also for all the new choices for my 45/70 . It is a wonderful round now ...... like you said the science is there and I am very grateful!!
For 357 mag/max the numbers were handgun numbers. In a rifle both get a lot closer to 30-30, neither gets there, but much more reasonable. 44 gets similar benefits of too.
I love a number of the straight wall rounds, but I'm hopelessly in love with my 45/70. Just sayin'
Doesn’t matter if they like the 45/70 for the people things like the 350 legend were invented for, they can’t legally use the 45/70. Luckily were I live I can use most anything I want, it’s nice to use a brand new rifle one day and the next day out grab one that’s a century old. Just use whatever i want each day I go out in the woods with no concern if politicians 300 miles a way approve of my choice.
Ditto
My browning 86 is 4570.uses shoots 400g att 2200.i use 400. 1900. U'r right no apologies necessary🦬🐎
Great video as usual. I’ve been using the 450 bm for a few years now in an AR-platform. Packs a lot if punch!!
Always great information. Thanks
Excellent job on analyzing these cartridges
I think 350 400 and 458 bushmaster, are very popular or will because of AR use in hunting
Keep it up with the straightwalls. Even us hunting out in Western Washington State are digging the info! When I see all my deer at 30 yards or less and 350 legend in a single shot is a pure joy to reload (and shoot 9mm bullets through on range day to save a few bucks) videos like these make the 5pm beer taste that much better to cool off with. Keep it up Ron, you da man
Great comparison on all the cartridges... Thank you!
Thanks Ron, very informative
Thanks for the excellent comparison. I just picked up a 450 Bushmaster but not for the usual reasons. I live in the northern plains of MT where most of my shots at deer are 250-500yds. I use a 270WSM for that. I was looking to find a pistol caliber carbine in 45 cal. After much research I decided to go with the Bushmaster. A lot more power and energy than the 45acp and actually cheaper to build in a AR platform than the 45acp.
That's why a chose the 454 Casull.
A Puma lever action & a Ruger or Freedom Arms revolver.
Nice to have one bullet mould for handgun and rifle rounds. Can mould zinc too for any anti lead laws which is cheaper and easier on your barrel than copper is. Will still expand some depending on velocity too. Saeco #945. Zinc is a bitch to size but doable. 45acp non gas checked can still send em 850 plus fps. Gas checked and lubed for 450B. 😊
Love my 450 bushmaster
You skipped right past my 444 marlin Ron. I got a 350 legend..Ok for deer at 150yds
I live my 357 for deer in Southern Michigan. I don't really have an opportunity for much more than 150 in the deer woods around here so the drop at 200 is a bit less than I deal with, but I've taken plenty with good, ethical shots. As a bonus, with 38's it's a great gun for teaching folks how to shoot. I've got a suppressor on it (the barrel was already threaded so why not) so there's nothing scary about it.
Guys I shot a big 4 yr old buck in Ky twice at 25 yds & less with the Hornady .450 Bshmstr. 250gr ftx bullet & neither went through the deer. It has power but will not leave a blood trail.
Maybe hit the range a little more
CZcams unsubscribed me but I just resubscribed..... And I am very happy with a 44 Mag or even 45 Colt (since I handload) for use in a lever action carbine or rifle. Even a 357 Magnum is plenty for white tail or hogs out to a bit more than 100 yards. The standard 44 Mag loading, 240 grain XTP for example is a hammer on deer, hogs and even black bear. If you go with a hard cast bullet instead, it will penetrate much more than ever needed.
I live in Indiana and someone created a wild cat several years ago called the 358 Hoosier. It was basically a 35 Remington trimmed-down to 1.80" overall case length. Same bullets, same powder charge, same everything. We did not have a straight wall limitation but we did have an overall case length limitation. As of a few years ago, all centerfire rifles .243 diameter and larger but excluding a 50 BMG are allowed in Indiana.
Yes .243 and up for private land, but we still have other limitations on public land. That's why I use a .50Beowulf or .44mag.
That is only on private property if you are hunting on public land then you still have to use the limited cartages. I usually stick to my 500S&W magnum seems to work quite well
.357 handgun for 50 yards and rifle for 100 in S.Indiana
Can't believe the 444 marlin wasn't included
It was. It's on the list.
@@RonSpomerOutdoors sorry sir for overlooking it
Love my Triple 4 and I’m still hunting deer with it today after 38 years ! 👍
Ron, I really enjoy listening to you explaining about different cartridges and their characteristics, but one thing many people fail to consider energy dissipation in the animal! A friend of mine and his son use .270 Winchesters for pig hunting and they're always complaining about having to spending 2 hours or so blood trailing a pig. I figured it out for them a couple times, but they just couldn't grasp the concept! When you shoot any animal the only use of bullet energy is when it's in the animal. From where the bullet leaves the animal to wherever the bullet finally stops is wasted energy. With the velocity his bullet is traveling, if the pig was 2 feet thick, the bullet would only spend 0.0017 seconds in the animal. That bullet isn't going to dissipate very much energy in that length of time!
On the other hand, I use a .300 Blackout with a 110 grain bullet! I have never had a passthrough on a pig! The biggest one I've shot, so far, we estimatedher at 350 lbs or more. She dropped like a rock. The smallest was 80 lbs, and a broadside shot, he dropped where he was standing! All the pigs I've shot have been between 80 and 120 yards.
My oldest son was here last month and we went out pig hunting. I callled in one boar and my sun shot it. The two of us couldn't pick it up, don't know what it weighed, but it was a 165 yard shot, and he was laying right there waiting for us!!
This was the longest shot we've made on a pig.
None of these were passthrough shots, which means every ounce of energy was utilized in the body of the pig!
There must be something to this! I would like to know your thoughts on it!
When the .357 Magnum cartridge first came out back in the mid 1930s, one of the things Smith & Wesson did was take the 8 3/8" N-Frame revolver chambered for it on an elk hunt. The .357 magnum cartridge was pushing a 158-grain lead bullet at about 1,500 feet per second out of that 8 3/8" N-Frame, so the loads were a bit spicier back then than they are now, but they scored a clean hit and bagged an elk with minimal tracking.
Given the number of deer that are ethically taken in the US every year with .357 magnum handguns, I think using that same cartridge out of a rifle is plenty adequate as long as you keep your cool, only take shots you know you can make, and use a projectile suitable to the task.
Thanks for another informative video. It is always a surprise when numbers/facts violate traditions. Need those eye openers to make an informed decision.
I really would have been interested in some more info and comparisons to the ole .444 Marlin. I don't think it would have a case length short enough to qualify for what some other newer straight-walled cartridges do, but it has been around a long time and performs really well. Another outstanding cartridge (and perhaps the greatest handgun cartridge of all time, imo) to consider is the .41mag.
The 444 wins. Its flatter than a 45-70. With the right bullet its unbeatable.👍
I love my .444. Leverevolution 265 gr load is a deer killer. Hopefully, we'll be able to find more soon.
.444 with Leverevolution ammo is superior to everything he mentioned. Only limiting factor is some states that might limit cartridge length. But luckily my state doesn't have a maximum cartridge length for straight wall rounds.
The 444 is really limited in bullet selection
@@danapicray9040mould your own bullets
This was the best video on straight wall cartridges.I have watched, thank you so much.
Glad to see you finally give some love to the .450 Bushmaster. I’ve been impressed by its performance since I’ve been hunting with mine and was able to get it in the AR platform which I’m a fan of. 1/2” groups at 100. Tons of energy at 100-150 yards which is the max distance I hunt in Mid Michigan. Thanks again for finally including it in the straight wall debate. I knew it would perform well.
Shot a buck with one broadside and it ruptured the diaphragm even though I took a good dbl lung shot towards the shoulder. Ended up with a nasty gutting job and had to trim a bunch of tainted meat by the time I got it out of the woods. It was my last deer with a .450 bushmaster. Went back to what wasn't broken from before.
@@adksport4023 I took a big doe last year. 155 lbs dressed. 150 yards pass through. Heart, liver shredded. Brisket was mush. 🤷🏽♂️
I ahot a nice buck with my 20 inch barrel ar 450 bushmaster… was a high hit broke the back and broke the sternum and ribs .. made a 10 inch hole across the top 😳 450 is a 45/70 in a ar platform
I’ve had 30-06 turn deer insides into jelly with the Nosler Ballistic tip 150 grain bullets. It’s all about bullet placement. But I think Hornady needs to think about changing the design of their 250 grain FTXs. They are not bonded and the jacket is a shade too thin. The bullets shed their jackets too quickly and dump their energy too quickly.
But if you reload, you can find a better bullet for deer and elk.
@@TexasSheepdawg21that is the reason I am not shooting hornady out of my 450 this year trying out the barnse tsx and Winchester xp
Good episode Ron. I’ve got a couple of these cartridges in a range of files. My favorite happens to be the .450 Bushmaster shooting a 250 grain Hornady FTX bullet in a 22” barreled, Ruger American that I’ve put in a Magpul Hunter stock. It’s a woods whitetail killer for sure. I’ve taken a coyote right at 200 yards with it and several deer. Nice big hole and would channel but nothing I’ve taken with it this far has managed to run. Thanks for all the effort you put into your content Ron. Looking forward to the next one.
Thanks Magnum.
As usual Ron this was an informative article. I would have added some things to it but in all, it was very good. One thing you passed up on is the 350, and 400 Legend cartridges as well as the 450 Bushmaster and 50 Beowulf were designed for AR 15 platform rifles. The majority of hunters using those cartridges use AR platform rifles, especially hog hunters. Also, AR platform rifles shoot softer than say most lever or bolt guns, and second-shot recovery is far less time-wise. One thing you didn't cover however is the availability of ammo. 450 Bushmaster is everywhere as is the 340 Legend, the rest is little to none as in the case of the 50 Beo and the 400 L, and the 458 Socom and 360 Buckhamer ammo almost don't exist. All in all the 450 BM is my favorite brush rifle and I live in Oregon, for hogs, it's the 6.8 SPC.
I would like your opinion on the 6.8 seens like is one of your favorites.
On a 16.5 and 18 inch what the report would compare to ? I got this semi rural area that my shots would be no more than 200 yrds how would the report compare to a 30-30 , .243 or even a 6.5 Grendal ?
I load 130 gr spitzers on the 30-30 and due Ok but that 6.8 is one that i would like to try.
Ideally i would consider 130 grainers at a moderate velocity on the 6.8 to keep my favorite .270 bullets
Not going backwards; just going in circles. Very human.
RON, Home run. Your expanded coverage gives more ammo to future discussions at the range and deer camp. With number of deer Hunters dwindling, a cartridge that has acceptable impact for most recoil conscious and small frame folks, that does the deed at
Do one with the .41 magnum if you find the time. I’m curious of the numbers vs the other magnum Cartriges
Not easy to find one, I didn’t even know they existed till a buddy of mine inherited one from his dad. We did find ammunition on midway USA for him so he could go out and enjoy it.
@@jaydunbar7538 they are still around but pretty hard to find. I know a couple older guys who bought them back in the day who swear by them. The only ammo I’ve seen is online though.
I’m thankful that we don’t have those crazy cartridge restrictions here, but it is good that the industry looks out for those that do. I’ve also heard that variety is the spice of life. Great video!
Indeed. I have to say, however, that these new cartridges are a God-send for those of us in said restricted states; they beat the daylights out of slug guns, IMHO.
The cartridge restrictions are only the southern half of lower MICHIGAN for our state, the rest of the state is high powered rifle allowed. I have shot most of my bucks with a 7mm rem mag, but since I got my 450 I haven't taken it out in the woods
Great information. Thank you
Thanks again for the info mr Ron !
458 win mag is becoming one of my fav rounds. So versatile with handloading. I have 300 gr at 2200 fps for a nice mild deer load. 400 gr at 2000 as well.
300gr@2200 fps for a nice mild deer round…😂 ok 🤪
May favorite straight wall cartridge rifle is my Ruger 44 carbine. It's my only straight wall rifle lol.
Thank you for your educated insight. Very helpful.
Thank you, Ron. Very informative, as always.
I started handloading the 350 legend couple years ago. 22" barrel. 170gr barnes at 2450fps, barnes 180gr ttsx at 2300fps, 200gr barnes ttsx at 2200fps(.36 BC) 250gr at 1850fps. And still testing. Not to mention a 147gr fmj at over 2600fps. It's a very versatile cartridge. I like the 450 bushmaster for up front energy but for deer it's not needed, but very effective.
How did you get 250 gr to go 1850fps? I have to try that
I stand corrected, on my comments, I watched again! I will say that I’m impressed with the 350 Legend, I built two uppers in 350, and have been impressed with the little cartridge, since my stroke recoil is not good for me, and the AR with the 350 is very, very manageable!
I do not think there has been a better deer caliber then a .35, very underrated, one of my favorite rifles is a 350 RemMag, if you reload, you could hunt North America with little issue!
Very informative, thanks for the research which must be exhaustive!
Another great video Ron appreciate it.
.375 Winchester. Such a handy and capable rifle to ease your way through the deer woods.
I live in Idaho, so not a straight wall restricted state, but my favorite straight wall is my .45 Colt. Mainly because of the variety of ammo I can shoot in it without reloading. I have a Rossi M92 16in carbine and a cartridge converted Remington reproduction 1858 "Sheriff" in .45 Colt. My "bottleneck" cartridge of choice is the 6.5x55mm Swedish.
Fellow Idahoan! You've hit the ideal cartridge with the all around Swede. I've got relatives that shot 45Colt out of .410 and ate when times were hard in prr Depression days.
My son has a rossi rifle in 45 colt I think and he loves it.
If I could only have one rifle it would be chambered in 6.5x55, The Swedes designed a great all around cartridge
1894 marlin Cb 45 colt works great for 50/75 yards, especially when loaded with 20gr of 2400, and a 255 gr SWC
Thanks, Ron. I especially appreciate the recoil info.
You missed that the .444 has more energy at 200. Both@ muzzle & 200 velocities too out performs the others. I’ve a .444 in a Winchester Big Bore AE. LIKELY nobody appreciates the recoil. It’s a one shot-Not bad, 2-hmm, 3-I really don’t want to do that anymore off a bench😂. But is a fantastic dogging/bush carry nobody’s ever going to find much easier. With a Skinner site, it’s just a fast snap shooter. Performance is great on moose let alone little whitetail, (considerably better than any SG slug at any range muzzle to 200.)
Seriously the 38-55 Winchester is a great round and is also accepted in the "shotgun" states. It is also one of the best shooting straightwall rounds ever. It was also known as the 38-55 Ballard and was used in shooting competitions due to the light recoil and accuracy. It is available in Buffalo Boar Ammo for modern firearms and will definitely take out a deer or bear without issue.
My old Winchester is a 381 bore so I have to cast and hand load.
Isn’t this cartridge over the legal length of 1.8” allowed in the “shotgun “ states?
@the41shootist it is in Michigan but it seems like some states included it and the 45/70gov
Along with the more modern, and ever-so-slightly more potent 375 Winchester.
It is and this not allowed in good ol’ Michigan -yea!
Gotta love the .450 Bushmaster.
Ron, you missed one of my favorites, the .444 Marlin. My first deer rifle was a Marlin 336 lever action and I knocked down my share of Whitetails with that piece.
Good video as always. Another aspect to consider with each cartridge/ bullet choice is the impact velocity to make the bullet function. The straight walls are plagued by running out of sufficient impact velocity down range to enable the bullet open as intended. There are some custom bullet makers out there producing bullets with lower velocity thresholds. If you find yourself trying to maximize the range of your straight wall cartridge, be mindful of your impact velocity in relation to the minimum threshold of the bullet you are using.
Thanks, great video!
Just based on the numbers the 400 Legend looks like the sweet spot to me. Flatter shooting, more than adequate energy for deer at 200 yards, and manageable recoil.
Great job on the vast comparisons Ron. I would have liked to see the .357 magnum numbers for a lever gun vs. a revolver, since I thought it to be closer to the 30-30. Also, I was surprised to see the .454 casual wasn’t much difference than the .44 magnum. Thanks Ron.
Look in the ammo rifle section, not pistol it is listed differently.
Iowa now allows use of straight-walls for deer season, and this sort of comparison is very helpful for choosing one, thanks!
I live in Marylandistan where we have straight wall restriction (Metro Baltimore/Washington DC). My .450 BM is absolutely wonderful since I installed a recoil pad.
I own a 450 bushmaster in a lightweight AR platform and I would never go into grizzly country without it. 250 grain projectiles going 2200 fps the perfect balance between heavy, fast, and manageable.
I love my 450 AR, taken 3 8 pt bucks so far with it...puts em down
I've been using 350 Legend in my AR rifles and pistols for shooting Texas hogs for several years and it is a great effective little cartridge, mostly use 150 grain Deer Season XP ammo. Use a 450 Bushmaster chambered AR as well just not as often. People were wrong when they said Winchester made a "mistake" in their bullet size and that the cartridge would fail. The 400 Legend will probably be just as successful and I will build an AR rifle and pistol for shooting hogs. Now, if Winchester is smart they will figure how to get a lever gun to function reliably with the rimless 350, they could sell more than they could produce in my opinion, same goes for the 400 Legend. I think if Winchester doesn't produce a lever gun for their straight wall cartridges they may lose some sales to the 360 Buckhammer. Smith and Wesson and Magnum Research each make revolvers chambered in 350 Legend. The ability to have a bolt gun, single shot, pistol and an AR that all use the same ammo is a plus. Winchester could almost completely control the straight wall cartridge market if they produce a lever gun for them. Thanks for the video,
Hate Winchester brass though. Have had case mouth splits in factory ammo. I mean, really?
@@pitchforkpeasant6219 Luckily, I have never had an issue with any Winchester factory ammo. Deer Season XP in several calibers is some of my favorite ammo, has always performed really well on hogs and coyotes.
Great Video! Have been looking for a good explanation of the differences.
I've a 45 colt. Factory loads are probably suboptimal but I like to load to 44 mag pressures.
I have the 350 legend and the 450 bushmaster I use them for deer hunting in Maine. And In my opinion 100% 350 legend fills the role of that old Thirty Thirty Which is taken more dear in the United States probably than any other Rifle . I absolutely love watching your videos it's great to be able to learn and have knowledge of these things. Keep up a good work
Gosh, all of them are good enough. Hard to pick the superior ones.
Ron, here in Indiana, there's one you may or do not know about. It's called the 358 Hoosier. Custom-made bottleneck cartilage. But it is legal here.
Great interview with Mr. Hickok 45!
Based on personal and second hand experience I can confirm that the 350 legend is a wonderful deer cartridge out to 200 yards. I'm also very excited to try out the 400 legend once it comes out.
I can second that the 350 does a great job.
Like that speed on 360 buckhammer. Newer style copper bullets will work better with the little extra speed.
@FranzAntonMesmer I would like to see a 150 to 175 mono copper at like 2600 to 2750 feet a second. That be so cool.