FAIL - Lunchbox Locker Install
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- čas přidán 3. 08. 2024
- WATCH THIS BEFORE INSTALLING A LOCKER!
I finally got around to installing the Lokka lunchbox locker in my Jeep Cherokee and it was a COMPLETE FAILURE!
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We hope you enjoyed this video and will keep in mind that all information included is intended to be purely academic and in fact is only the opinion of D&E. We are not professionals, nor are we qualified to knight you a professional. D&E want to ensure that anyone modify or fixing their own vehicle does so in a safe manner which leaves the vehicle in a legal, roadworthy state. In short, DON'T BE A MONKEY WITH A TOOL BOX! If you don't know what you are doing, leave it the professionals! - Auta a dopravní prostředky
That extra 0.001 was the 6 different applications of grease
I tend to agree. There is clearance I am pretty sure that would work just fine. The reason they eat themselves is because of too much clearance. .006-.020? not exactly a precision piece.
Here's an idea. Fit everything dry then do your measurement. Then take everything back out and lubricate it.
Just doing it. Exactly and whatever you do don’t try to sand on your spacer either let alone a bench grinder.
@@jacobhendrickson8935 when he said “There are some AvE “machinists” yelling at their screen” that described me perfectly. Maybe if he watched some of AvE’s videos he’d know to do a dry fit and not sand those spacers on his unimaginably out of flat wood elf bench.
My washers (in an Australian RC Colorado / Isuzu DMax) were too thick (1.0mm). I had to get them machined to 0.7mm so I could get the gaps that Auto Lokka specify. One of the things I found was that measuring gaps with no lube or oil or grease all give you different results. I favored just using a smear of diff oil on everything.
Great job! But never use grease to hold the shimms in place, just a thin layer of 80w90 will do. Grease is too thick and will not measure properly...
Thanks for the advice! The directions call for grease, but after this experience i think you are correct
good advice. (thumbs up) because I don't know how to do these cartoon faces.
I was thinking the same thing
Also make sure that you have the right face of the shim facing the right way. Some shims have a slight bevel in them (common on older gms so might not apply to you)
@@DEInTheGarage
Where is the follow up video I can’t find it ???
My butchery.....used d30 ring and pinion....all used bearings and shims...even reused the pinion seal. No dial indicator. Set clearance and all on pinion and diff by hand. Installed lock rite no measuring. It lived and i drove the hell out of it.i figured worst case? 150 bux here for a whole d30 from junkyard. I had to have been in the ballpark on all of it. Never blew up, burned up of failed. Lmao true story
Mechanical come to the lord moment: *throws hands up "fuck this shit I don't know what I'm doing!" - been there dood.
haha... that is exactly what happened. Some day you eat the bear, some days the bear eats you..
Good find! Can’t wait to see how an actual working automatic rear locker performs! Thanks for the shout out man! Huge thanks!
Haha.. me too! I am hoping I can find an appropriate sized spacer and get it installed in the next few weeks. Thanks for the advice so far!
you go places in 2wd that you would have thought you needed 4wd :)
@@MrMrsregor This is 100% true. We just had a gnarly snow storm where I am in Western NJ and the 4x4 linkage on my daily is broken so I had to make it to work and home in about 3-4" of snow in rear wheel drive. It was hairy at times, but The XJ did just fine
I know this is a year later. I have watched jtmoffroad's fail witch he says it's a learning experience just buy new. And now I have found your video. I'm very interested in the low cost lunch box locker and have heard bad. I'll search for the finished install hope you have good luck with it cause I want to see a complete install before I attempt on my YJ
Glad to see someone else has commented on the use of grease. Just hydro lock things with gear oil.
AvE would have been proud at how you "machined" your shims it's under the "scumbag offsets" page on his channel😂
Agreed! You made do with what you had.
Great video Eric!
I installed a similar style locking mechanism in a Honda transmission probably around 15 years ago.. the spider gears had a casting line on them that kept the parts from fitting. I literally took them to the belt sander and smoothed them out. Took my time and got them "eyeball" perfect. Trans is still running to this day. Funny thing is I was picturing sanding those "rings" on the bench like you did with the shim. LOL.
Dang, that is a good tip. That might have helped me
Is no one gonna acknowledge that the way it was installed wouldn’t even have turned the axles at all!
@MJW I noticed once i watched the other videos its my bad
Well now I know what locker not to use. Seems like a Spartan locker that is already all together would be the way to go. It actually has teeth on the gears. But I guess that's the difference in a 70 dallor locker verses a 250. dallor locker. Good luck to you man. All of us that know how to work on our own trucks have all been in a similar situation.
I got a Spartan locker and 100% worth it. Took no time whatsoever to do it
Just gonna grease these lightly... half tube of grease later.
My washers (in an Australian RC Colorado / Isuzu DMax) were too thick (1.0mm). I had to get them machined to 0.7mm so I could get the gaps that Auto Lokka specify. One of the things I found was that measuring gaps with no lube or oil or grease all give you different results. I favored juist using a smear of diff oil on everything.
I put the Lokka in my front diff. It won't fit past the crown gear so the whole front axle housing had to come out to remove the axles to get the diff centre out to get the crown gear. I did this over the past couple of weeks. It's back together but I'm not sure yet whether it's working properly. 4WD Systems don't answer emails.
Tolerances are super important glad JTM could help you he is a really awesome guy with a great channel.
Yea man.. JTM saved my locker for sure.
Glad you came to your senses!
Yep.. had to abort that mission.. Shit was getting crazy in the garage
@@DEInTheGarage yep! I hate when Jeep's spiral out of control! Oh well... it Makes for more videos!
.005” - .020” is pretty wide open... I wouldn’t have sweated the loss of .001” with those tolerances. It was most likely the application of the grease that put it over max allowance. The use of the power sander was a big no-no lol. I’ll have to check the next video.
@stangmaster 2 "This is why you don't use power sander when dealing with fractions of fractions of inches".
HAHAHAHA
"AvE machinist type."
Andrew Kahler love that guy. “Gotta get ‘er to chooch properly”
Would mocking it up without the grease just to check your tolerances and then reassemble with grease once you are sure you are in spec be a better idea?
Perhaps... Everything I read said to use grease, but maybe that is the way to go
D&E In The Garage yeah I’ve seen others use just a small dab of grease. Just enough to hold it together during install but I dunno. Been thinking about getting one of these lunchbox locks myself
Did you ever install lockers? I couldn’t find a video showing it so just checking in via the squawk box. I want to know if they’re too loud, and if I should just invest in other style lockers.
Thanks! 🐞❤️🐞
Yea, I ended up selling that Jeep before I could install the locker properly. If you are interested in a really great install video on a C8.25, Vermont Jeepgirl has one on her channel.
You are crazy man! Can't wait to see what else you do to your plow jeep
Great attempt man, good thinking to pull the plug when you did. The way you were going at that grinder, I was hoping that we wouldn’t see your fingers releasing the red schmoo all over your workbench 😉
I bet if you had did a dry fit with no grease on any surfaces it would have measured 1 or 2 thousandths bigger and been in spec.
You don't use the factory thrust washers when using this style locker!!!!.
What do you use then? How do you get the tolerances you need?
If one wheel stuck, how acting this type locker.
Actually I want to know can I install this locker with cutting break( Fiddle break).
I have a Chinese van DFSK, can you place that differential? Or directly I change it for another one that has autoblocante?
PLOW JEEP? WTH? Locker? WTH? I need to be your neighbor! I have so much to learn!
Excellent information sir.
Haha.. thanks for the feedback!.. I wish my neighbors were into Jeeps!.. we might get along better...
Where’s the rest of the locker this would never turn the wheels 🤦♂️
I was wondering this as well, a couple of pieces are missing from this.
I installed an Aussie locker in my Dana 30 with a new carrier and used the stock shims (.003). My clearance between my spacer and pin is .028/.026. so I'm puzzled on assembly when it calls for .006 to .020. any suggestions?
I'm glad now you crawled around the wet floor cause I'll never get that time back lol git !!!!! At least I know never to add a locker to mine bro 😂😂😂just a thought though why not reduce the spacer down 🤔🤔🤔🤔? Your thoughts ?
Sadly, my shop is not equipped for accomplish that with any kind of accuracy. I am certain that if I had wanted ti bad enough I could have gotten that locker to work that day, but I didn't want to cut corners so I am ordering the proper size spacer and will try again.
Have you tried measuring the clearances without the thrust bearings? I've used Spartan lockers in the past. With those ones... It says you don't need the thrust bearings. I threw them in without checking them and they did great. I probably should have checked the clearances but I didn't.
I did attempt to run without the washer, but then the clearance was up to 24 thousandths. I know Spartan lockers a almost identical to the Lokka I have now. Did the Spartan come with its own bearings?
@@DEInTheGarage nope, spartan locker (for dana30 and ford 8.8) comes with the same amount of parts as the lokka locker and the spartan instructions say not to use any spacers, shims, or thrust washers...
If you would have put it together like that it would have been fine. Too tight is better than loose on lunch box lockers.
Wait, you were making it a point that those "spacers", thrush washers had to go back on the same side in the same orientation, then you sanded them down. I can tell you the thrush washers don't care where they go, they are meant to keep the two hard surfaces from rubbing against each other, they are sacrificial, thus you are sanding them down.Also don't these things have springs? Seems like you are overthinking it.
I honestly beleive if you just would have installed it with everything like it was it would have worked fine. Think about it you were adding clearance by thinning the spacers. And just my opinion it would be more likely to round the teeth if it was looser in that area . I would feel more comfortable with it being too tight. And yes i have installed a locker like that in a gm 12 bolt though. Either way good video its educational to see what issues someone has when doing something like this. Im watching locker installs because im about to put a spartan locker in the front of my samurai.
I agree with you ! I think it would have worked as it was. It is when it is too loose that will cause it to round the teeth!
I 100% recommend a Lincoln Lock if you decide to go that way it flat out works IF done right......
The lucnhbox locker I installed 20 years ago said NOT to use the side shims.
It's way better to be to small of a gap than to big u would have been fine to run it the people who have problems are the ones that have a way to big of a gap then it can jump teeth and destroy it I have put them together that was so tight I had to drive the pin in with a hammer and they work way good just don't ratchet as ez
Interesting... thanks for the info!
it's a good idea to have a variety of shims
I have a Factory LSD Chrysler 8.25 (27 spline) in my 94 XJ with a little over 200k Miles. I use it for winter driving with some rare mudding. It's needing a refresh, Would you recommend keeping it with new Clutches or switching to a locker?
I would definitely recommend refreshing your factory setup if possible
Yes i redid my 96 Cherokee axels and put a lock rite locker in the rear and its incredible off road . Didnt call for shims in the rear on my 8.25
I did not use the Thrush washers on my install.locker works fine without washers.
I really wanted to just toss it in and roll with it, but I couldn't bring myself to do it. What brand locker did you have?
@@DEInTheGarage I used the same locker
@@505xjk6 Hmm.. you have definitely given me something to consider. On a side note, how to do you like it for on-road use?
@@DEInTheGarage I have used the other types of locker's and this locker is the same .also depends on the type transmission.with automatics it stay engaged even when making turns.standard transmissions u can use the clutch to disengage or free spool the locker.I like the locker on the pavement
.keep the tire pressures the same on the pavement.
Yeah I did the same. The spider gears had washers and the axles gears had washers too. I have a powertrax no slip. It's great. No clicking. No banging. Locks like it supposed to do. And it made burnouts a lot easier. Before it took 3/4 throttle to burn out with open diffs. Now i can burn out with 1/4 throttle. Crazy
I would have done these measurements without the grease. Just clean.
A lot of times less undesirable work is better than more desirable work. Kind of like driving past 3 gas stations, 6 miles away, just to save 2 cents per gallon on fuel haha
LOL... truth!
Yes, but if you don't go get that cheap gas, gas goes up all around.
Hello it is a AMC20?
First mistake was putting an autolocker on a snow and ice rig.
Better than open and all I could afford at the time
I got this this kit when I built my Dana 60 its not cheap but for what you pay for this they should include the spacer shims (thrust washers) , I was just a bit over the max tolerance .I called the tech line which itself was a task to find !!! I think max clearance between the pin was .170 of an inch and mine was like 175 ,they said yeah that's a bit it much you have to replace them, I said why don't you included a set with the kit? Max thickness for the dana 60 you can get is 30 th and I would and like to get.35th thick for mine. I was told the thickest is 30th and if that doesn't work maybe your carrier is worn! So you basically get 15th a side to be within spec.? I said they made tons of these dana 60s ! no two castings can be exact ? dana has tolerances too when they are cast ! anyway I finally found .30 shims new and that got me around .163 and in spec , but you pay almost 500.00 for this kit and they cant give you shim sets? I'm a few months away from getting this build on the road and then we can see how good this kit is. BUT is I was to do this over I would have just called someone like Moser and I could have had a brand new rear built drum to drum complete for under 3000,00 !!! But the time I found an old dana 60 , then buy new gears. Bearings ,axles tubes,ends,drum kit and locker ....and all the labor and time it took to build this from scratch I'm probably cost me more !!! and I would have not used this stupid power trax kit !!!
You should have been good but that layer of geese was the diff. Also you’ll never get a true “honing” if that spacer with sand paper... better buy a kit or spacers if needed but I don’t think you needed new ones just less grease. Good luck and thanks for the video that you CAN do this without pulling the diff!!!!
I installed a LockRight into a Geo Tracker and it needed thinner shims. I wish they would have made them to where the stock shims work. Guarantee you that some guys just run no shims .
A bunch of people told me to run it with no shims, but I was not game for that
@@DEInTheGarage the stock shims on mine were 0.100 and I think the thinner shim was 0.015. very thin. But id rather have it to get tolerances perfect.
@@DEInTheGarage you should read the directions. You are not supposed to run any shims. I have two spartan lockers.
I have spartan lockers front and rear with no shims and they work perfectly
Should have left the thrust washers alone and adjust the face of the spacer that mates to driven gear. Mine spec'd out nicely and has been running strong in my Mountaineer for over 3 years now.
Nice! Thanks
Interesting I just watched the dude that trashed the used locker just before I watched yours.... Good luck getting it going... But I've never needed lockers to plow with my 03 ram 1500??
No, you just don't know that you ever needed. Kinda like a woman I met one time...
Did u try and measure it without any grease on it ? Also if you’re gonna have to sand something down flat try putting your sandpaper on a thick piece of glass on a flat surface and wetting the sandpaper
That would have been a better way to go, honestly. Very good advise
D&E In The Garage no problem.. I don’t have special tools also.. gotta improvise 👍🏼
looked like you were measuring it wrong
Every kit I've seen they lose the thrust bearings all together. You don't need em. That's why you're just outside of tolerances
any machinist could have taken a few thou off the new gears where it mates to the thrust washer
Does this really work
That would been fine and geuratnee you de grease it all and it would been in spec
Yeah loose the grease
Oh and should have gone with an Aussie locker lol that’s what I have in the rear of my JK
My understanding is that Aussie and Lokka are pretty much the same thing. Certainly identical designs. I guess you have had success with your aussie? How is it on the road?
D&E In The Garage my Aussie is awesome I don’t really notice it on the road unless i take a sharp corner quick. Check out torque lockers they are from the people who make Aussie but it is better
same design as the spartan locker too
Why don't you start with putting the rest of the locker in before you go to grinding shims and bolting in the center pin?
Because if the tolerances were right at the point, they weren't going to be right later. That is the point of this vid. I did a bunch of research and everyone (manufacturer included) agrees that if you don't have proper clearance between center pin and axle gears, it is a full stop for the project
well did you do it? you do not need those spacers
Does anyone know how to put in the yellow little locker springs to hold the spider gears?
very carefully
I have lost rear diffs in trucks , that’s why a real truck had 4wd ! Lock them hubs ! LoL
how did you remove the pin? my molten pin touches the teeth of the crown
You grind the tips off the teeth! It's a common practice when installing a locker without swapping the Ring Gear (adding a locker to a stock axle). Just be very careful to take just enough of the tooth(teeth) off or you'll break them under pressure!!. A little is fine, But too much is bad!!. Go slow and grind a little then try to knock out the pin. It will work!!. Doing it myself right now!.
no washers
Where is the follow up video?? Did you ever install it?
You know those teeth have to engage with something, right. That's not how this works.
Keep it secret, keep it safe klauss. Wtf is going on here klauss. Ur grease was .001 klauss. What in the name of all good and holy is going on here klauss.
you could have pulled the carrier out and put it on the bench.....no?
and dude, sanding the spacer like that is so bad. it will not be perfectly flat when your done.
Thanks for sharing thou.
Yes, I defintely could have, but I wanted to prove the claim that these can be installed "in the driveway". All i can say for my temporary insanity is that i stopped in time to realize my error. haha
Did you ever end up doing it? I can't find the video
I ended up selling that Jeep before i could get to it. Sorry there is not video. VermontJeepGirl on CZcams has a GREAT instal video of a lunchbox locker on a 8.25 if you need one
LMFAOO imagine getting halfway into buddies instal only to find out our guy never even got the thing done or figured out.....
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Soy de costa rica hay quien lo distribuya este loker san jose costa rica Franco, lobo
As a genuine machinist, sometimes you just gotta do what you gotta do.
Don't know about Jokka, but it sure looks like Richmond Gear PowerTrax which is junk. Wears out in a couple years. Just outside the warranty period. If you care about you money don't buy their junk!
Lokka is a great product. Used one for years in the front of a GQ patrol. Set and forget. No airline issues. No electrical connections.
I bet you put that locker in and have no problems. Dry fit. Dry fit. Dry fit.
you are missing parts
Guess you ain't done this before cause you',re guessing. Spartan are the only ones I use. Those shim washers are omitted in Spartain install. Why is your video labled "fail" ?? You only lightly lube with oil not grease on the drive gears. I think these tutorial videos should be sharing knowledge. Not guessing. Hope you learn. Bye
a pinch of salt
There is a reason why people usually put them in the front. They are noisy and are generally horrible to daily drive. If you tow with it, it will take some getting used to the involuntary lane changes while accelerating. A much better option is the Torsen style locker. You get the best of both worlds with that style locker. Costs a bit more and you do replace the carrier, so it would take a next level wrench rating to install but well worth it. I have one in my Camaro and my Yukon and absolutely love it. czcams.com/video/JEiSTzK-A2A/video.html . I have a "lunch box" locker in the front on my Yukon. If I didn't have locking hubs I would NOT install one of these in front either because of the handling problems. I would opt for the much more expensive OX or ARB. I love the locking hubs too bad modern manufactures had to dumb it down for the soccer moms.
Your are no suppose to use spacers
13 minutes gone with no helpful information gained. 👎
Get rid of this video,please.