Video není dostupné.
Omlouváme se.
Rate of Climb Misconception | Altitude AND Speed!
Vložit
- čas přidán 14. 08. 2024
- Get cool MERCH and support the channel at: teespring.com/...
Check out cool military and civilian aircraft models here (supports the channel):
airmodels.net/...
0:00 - Introduction
0:21 - Method Exploration
2:05 - Missing Link!
4:42 - Thanks for watching!
Rate of climb misconception and missing link explained and demonstrated!
Follow me on Twitch!
/ adamtheenginerd
End screen music:
Bitch Lasagna by PewDiePie x Party In Backyard
• Bitch Lasagna (INSTRUM...
New video every other Friday!
Like and Subscribe for more!
%----------------------------------------------------------------------%
Useful links:
Maneuvering Energy Retention spreadsheet:
docs.google.co...
Sea level speed spreadsheet:
docs.google.co...
MEC and climb spreadsheet:
docs.google.co...
Link to my Discord:
/ discord
Follow me on Twitch:
/ adamtheenginerd
Follow me on Twitter:
/ adam5143
Second Channel:
/ @adamtheenginerd2914
Overlay:
forum.warthund...
Yesss graph give me more graphs I love it
I'll deliver!
I only love them when i dont have to make them or have to calculate in Math class lol
How to easily spot the engineer in the crowd. 😉 Nothing can beat a good graph. 😅
Would love to see you and Phlydaily doing a collab video for statistics!
I generally prefer to climb a little faster than is efficient so I'm less likely to get jumped slow
Typically I climb at best climb until the first enemy appears, then transition to 200kts IAS fighting speed and keep climbing
Yeah there's a reason to climb a bit faster than optimal, but not to climb slower than optimal.
I learned that the hard way in my low tier spitfires trying to match the Germans.
There is a reason to climb a bit slower, that s to travel less horizontal distance so you arrive at the battle after your allies have begun engaging the ennemy, which can be a strategy. If you just want to climb though, it s not very much use
@@lamatoutroux5786 You can achieve meeting the enemy later by sideclimbing at your optimal climb speed, and that way you get the best of both worlds.
no dont tell them, i love when someone think they had advantage over me just because they were slightly higher than me, and when i put my plane straight zoom climb into them, they are hopeless because they had no speed even to react
I'll just turn a sharp 90 degrees, it doesn't do much harm to my low energy state, but enjoy zoom climbing and also turning to lose your initial speed advantage xd
Knowledge must be shared.
Clearly you don't understand that altitude means energy, and you bleeding all of your energy in a steep turn and climb makes you hang for a couple of seconds to get wrecked by his teammate.
@@solomonarbc nah bro u dont get my point, when i said "slightly higher" i mean less than 1km above me, and i have to make sure that there are no other enemies around
You aren't "zoom climbing" as you call it if you weren't very recently booming / diving before that so I'm assuming you meant that you were. If you just randomly decided to climb than no, you didn't have advantage at all being below them.
Makes me wanna open matlab and find the most efficient walking speed/calorie burn to get to class
Haha it would be useful code!
so what's the result?
@@theshinken The efficiency doesn't change much until you transition into a jog or run.
I just happen to have finished teaching the relationship between work, mechanical energy and generated heat to my physics students, so I'm very familiar with those concepts but I never considered this about optimal climb speeds. Super informative, thanks a lot!
My pleasure! And yeah there's some pretty satisfying conclusion you can pull just from basic physics!
Adam I just wanna say you're combing physics with my favorite video game is really keeping me interested in math lol. Physics is more fun when it's cool airplanes involved. Keep it up man, great work.
Thanks for the praise! Yeah the physics is what makes me understand the math lol. Pure math is boring imo.
@@AdamTheEnginerd Love your stuff dude. Also helpful because I can watch your videos when I'm supposed to be doing homework and no one can tell the difference. Graphs FTW!
@@astrotrek3534 Hahaha thanks for the love, and graphs FTW definitely!
why do i watch these when i have no clue what is being talked about lol
Because you like G R A P H S?
Plane no just climb, plane climb but also go faster. Faster but lower > higher but slower
Adam. You usually have the slogan of "Be useful!" or something like that. Air RB.
1- Can you explain what type of planes and/or what behaviours do you deem useful?
2- What plane classes fall into which category of usefullness or the opposite? Also detailing which get airspawns, which don't.
3- How can you make otherwise non-usefull planes useful? What requirements should the said plane be adept at?
4- How to make otherwise useful planes even more useful? Perhaps low altitude fighters bombing ground targets before dogfighting?
5- What not to do so one doesn't make an otherwise useful plane non-useful?
6- What should an ideal squad composition be like or comprised of?
7- What's your opinion on slightly heavier twin engine planes which could technically take down foes?
1. The aircraft that help win games, and games are primarily won by wiping out the enemy team, so aircraft that focus on that are the most useful.
2. Fighters are useful, bombers get close to a wasted slot on your team.
3. You're usefulness to your team in a match starts with your aircraft choice before the match. If you misclick and choose a rather useless plane, you should bait.
4. Knowing your aircraft's pros and cons as well as the enemies, being aware of what is going on, leaving bombers for last and not being a lot of friendlies on the same target.
5. Ground pound.
6. If you're in a squad your chances of victory are significantly increased. There's no special squad combo that is effective, just choose fighters.
7. Some twin engine fighters are good, but generally speaking the single engine fighters are better.
Thanks for the reply, though I was seeking more clarification. :)
1. Is there such a thing as way too passive too high altitude climbing? Or is there a certain tactical threat element to it occasionally to bring to the table?
2. Strike fighters? Attackers? Heavy Fighters? Interceptors? What differing factors do these actually bring to the table? As a noob I'd need to ask are naval fighters unique in a way that do they spawn from carriers actually? Mostly thinking of WWII stuff in the game currently.
3. For example how to make a sluggish heavy plane, like some cumbersome heavy fighter useful? Is there a hidden meme fun element in using them to directly go after enemy fighters? Granted there may be weaker armament to work around. Also some may naturally not work, like the Breda 88 for having extremely underpowered engines.
4. What if a plane's ideal altitude of operation isn't too high or unable to climb far? Isn't it beneficial to drop one big bomb onto an enemy base which can be targeted easier than AI units before setting off to attack fighters? Don't get me wrong, I see that killing players is obviously the most important objective, but wouldn't this help out the team in the long run occasionally? Supposedly a bomber died before it's last run near a base you bombed earlier and another one can finish a base off while you are on the other side of the map.
5. This was originally just a question to mirror the one above it, but now I had an idea of asking: if you have any more things to add here.
6. Is there something to strategically gain from comprising a squad out of a high altitude plane, a very fast plane, a dedicated turnfighter plane, and one with tons of forward armament?
7. This one is satisfactory.
1. Not really, if you don't fight then your teammates will be outnumbered and take higher losses while the enemy team takes lower losses.
2. Attackers that go for ground targets that are actually worth tickets can be effective, but it's rare to see. Rest are useful because of airspawn.
3. Usually they have an airspawn which is very useful as well as good armament, so they can rush climbing enemy fighters early and disrupt their climb.
4. If you can't win the game by bombing, it's no use trying. It'll hurt your climb and speed and the enemies will get above you easier.
6. Sure, but I wouldn't spend time micromanaging what squadmates fly though. It won't decide a match in the vast majority of cases.
Adam we re going in a lockdown 2 days from know ( i live in Greece). Please provide more pvp gameplay asap ( a stream will also suffice) . Thanks in advance ;)
Here in America they are FINALLY making school online only (at least my district). Too many kids got corona
Kelgo My school is shutting down next week due to a large amount of students contractions the No-No virus
ΑΛΑΝΙ ΚΑΙ ΕΣΥ ΕΔΩ? ΧΔ
@@dhmhtrhs. Ελα ρε θεούλη!
Have you seen all my other gameplay videos already?
Every aircraft has a best rate of climb (Vy) and best angle of climb (Vx) which is calculated based on avaliable horsepower and total weight. Best rate gives you best time to altitude while best angle gives best altitude over given horizontal distance. All u need to do is point the nose to hit that speed IAS right from take off
Yup.
adam ur video, granted, and my interest in planes and war thunder made me take the aeronautical engineering curriculum at my uni, this will be interesting for my classes keep it up
Damn nice, and thanks I will!
@@AdamTheEnginerd what were the first things you studied in general, I have aerotechnics 101 and right now we're studying airflow tunnels and layers of airflow, we already went trough aerofoils and types of aircraft
Thermodynamics, fluid mechanics, statics, aerospace projects and general classes.
I had your video when I played today. Both fighters and bombers. I found concentrating on keeping the speed up rather than attitude worked. Not by much; but worked. Those fast climbing fighters of the opposition weren’t quite so high. Thanks very much.
Glad I could help!
You showed a very good point and explained it well. Although I disagree with your wording - the 250 IAS P-47 still *climbs* better than the 300 IAS P-47 (as shown by the altitude against time graph), but the 300 IAS P-47 has more *energy* coming out of its climb. The 300 IAS P-47 climbs worse than the 250 IAS P-47 but has a little more energy than it (as climb is strictly speaking about altitude, not energy). But I will be sure to remember to climb a little faster.
Hmm what I meant was that maximizing geometric climb rate isn't what you should be trying to do, it's maximizing energy gain per unit of time.
@@AdamTheEnginerd Yeah
I got a video Idea. Bullets should fly Further at high altitude due to reduced drag. Could be an intresting short video.
I don't think they do in WT though.
I'm reminded a lot of Eugene M. Cliff's paper on energy state models.
Oh? I never heard of that.
Very nice, short video Adam! One thing i did not understand: while the altitude increases the plane needs to accelerate because of lower air density, but with lower drag the amount of energy required to go at higher TAS at higher altitude is lower.
If you're climbing at a constant IAS, the drag force on your plane remains largely the same. This means the power needed to overcome drag actually increases as you climb higher
Thanks!
At a given IAS, drag is the same. That's the point of climbing at constant IAS and why we use IAS.
@@AdamTheEnginerd yeah, so the energy required to keep the IAS costant is the same at every altitude
@@ferrarisuper Hmm no, since as your TAS increases, it requires more and more energy to increase it further since E_k = 0.5*(TAS)^2. TAS is squared.
@@AdamTheEnginerd ok, now is clear! Thank you 😊
I'm back in college again...
Aerodynamics in classes then war thunder at home... Thanks for the neat lesson OP!
My pleasure!
And yeah same haha.
I DID learn something. I've been climbing at a 265kph IAS. I'll have to start trying 300. Ky main issue is coming up against aircraft who I'm holding elevation advantage over, but are able to snap nose up for a good burst (i.e. yak3), and who seem to retain their energy even after the drastic nose up climb to engage me
Well it depends on the aircraft, these speeds and climb rates only apply to the P47D28. 300 would be way too fast for an A6M for example.
Make a video Reviewing the F8F-1(B), and dont stop posting videos, i enjoy to much your work.✌️
It's on my list! Thanks for the support!
Yesssss I’m dying to see Adam use that beast 🙏🏽😁
@@AdamTheEnginerd I Mean like your tipic kinda Review, like with pros and cons, kill counter, only like you know How to do. Just If you want of shure.
In aviation there is what is known as Vy. Best climb rate velocity. It's not angles of climb that determine how fast you climb but the airspeed. And generally you don't want to climb near stall speed because that leads to higher induces drag. So the better thing for people to do in war thunder is to climb at a airspeed higher than you would think. 300 kp/h or higher. As seen in the graphs a higher airspeed = higher energy.
300 is pretty high for most props in WT. 270 or so should be average.
Thank you Adam, great job.
My pleasure!
it would be great if you could make a list of planes optimal climb/supercharger gear speeds!
Climb speed chart is being slowly filled (description), supercharger depends on throttle and speed to a certain extent, so it's not easy to give a single good value.
@@AdamTheEnginerd so why don't you explain how to find the optimal climb speeds so we can help to complete the sheet? i mean you can have a video on how to record this data with wtrti and how to process it with python or idk!
I think one thing we must take into account is the distance covered of each aircraft climbing and the point where they will cross.
Is more or less distance good?
Well.. looks like WT flight models are broken while calculating drag, or higher IAS provides a little more pressure for the engine, so it produces a bit more power.
Last one means greater fuel consumption.
For some planes this could be important
Higher speeds to provide higher pressures to the engine and increases power. Not so much on turbocharged aircraft though.
Informative as always 👍
Glad you think so!
If it works in the game it doesn't mean it works in real life. Beyond the optimal climb speed, there is increased fuel consumption and engine wear (including overheating) and a pointless extra distance covered while climbing. Some planes are designed to climb at a greater IAS for a variety of reasons including power to weight ratio, acceleration in a specific speed range (air intake and injection) and the airframe with the wing loading.
That is not to say that planes designed for high speeds should revert to optimal climb speed instead of a mild climb at around 10 degrees when they have a high IAS already.
So if the planes take off from the ground they should use optimal climb speed, while if they start climbing while having a greater IAS they should climb at a mild angle.
WT is poorly designed as planes lagging behind another one which climbs at a sustained climb speed, in prolonged pursuits in the same direction, level out then dive, accelerate (without any drag penalty) then pull up and voila: all problems gone - it is the WT way of climbing to space in steps instead of a straight line (mild curve).
Euh not sure I follow. There's definitely higher drag if you dive and accelerate instead of keeping your optimal climb IAS, but you'll catch the enemy you're following because your higher speed will allow you to close the distance. You'll be gaining energy slower than your enemy, but you can still shoot an enemy that is 500m above you. That's why that works in WT, and it would work irl.
This was useful...I always thought that maintaining a high speed steady climb was betterer than a slower one or a series of speed killing zoom climbs and now I have proof...
Yup, there is always a certain speed that is best to climb at, and varies only a bit with altitude.
@@AdamTheEnginerd Do you have a video that goes over how to find the best rate of climb? Or is there data publicly out for the best speed to climb at for specific planes?
@@Ayane13b There's a spreadsheet by The__Kiwi, and Adam has started his own spreadsheet too.
I kind of already made a video, it would be "part 1" of this video like I said in the beginning of this video.
I love you and your videos!
Thanks for the support!
i just go vertically up lol
#efficiency.
Pro Tip in WarThunder!
Grind to 10.7 jets. Forget about climbing.
It depends.
I'd rather climb at a higher speed in most cases just so I can have some maneuverability at higher altitudes in case I get surprised or so I can zoom up to someone who thinks they are safe climbing above me while I take accurate bursts at long range. It also helps to be at a higher speed once I decide to level off and gain even more speed. But I've noticed lately that I start off climbing at a higher angle and thus a slower speed right off the runway and at lower altitudes until I get to around 2000m-3000m where there isnt as much drag.
Drag is equal for the same IAS, regardless of altitude. That's why optimal climb speeds are in IAS.
Excellent video. Thanks for sharing.
My pleasure!
as i really was thinking
speed management while i climb
that's a good advice to stay a little fast during the climb
Every aircraft has an optimal climb speed!
In some planes like the Mk.16, I like to climb very fast into the enemy.
It’s not about having the altitude advantage, I know I’m fucked in that. It’s about catching 109s slow and then dragging the enemies down fast
I generally do that more than trying to outclimb an enemy who I know will beat me to alt lol
I try to do that on fast and low alt planes, Mk16 wouldn't really fit that criteria for me.
Adam...... GREAT STUFF!
Thanks Mr FW190!
Great video; squeezing performance out of aircraft can be very fulfilling
Thanks, indeed!
i used to test this, with different prop pitch for the p47d28, after a climb, i would point the nose straight up and not the max altitude.
best proppitch seems to be between 80 and 85% and ias climb speed is 280~km/h
but when fighting other i usually climb at 280ias and once i feel confident i increase speed of the climb in order to throw enemies off, attacking them from below with more energy.
there is an even more exiting trick for the la-7, climb to 1500m and build speed in a shallow climb 5 degree, close the radiotor and lower proppitch to gain 600kph+ ias, then zoom climb into the enemy climb path and take 1 or 2 out from below with an insane energy advantage. You can even drag more enemies down with you and use your superior engine performance below 3000m to absolutely destroy the chances of them winning the match, by either fighting to the death while dragging the entire enemy team with you, or climb back to your allies and join them to fight 8v6 instead of 8v8. both options increase the chance of winning the match by quite a lot. (havnt tried it with a squad yet tho, but can you imagine?)
Those are good prop pitch and speed ranges.
Yeah on low alt fighters I like rushing in as well to either bait or kill slow enemies.
I'm sure players who climb with speed will notice how they sometimes catch the Bois who point their noses straight up, even if they appear to be way above them
You will gain on distance on someone climbing optimally, but they will gain on energy. Long term if you can't get the shot, they'll have the energy advantage.
i feel like I am back in aerodynamics class. This video is McLit, thanks homie.
Haha McLit, my pleasure!
I would like to see Adam using french VB 10-02. It's like underrated aircraft and rarely see it being used
It's on my list!
Good show, thanks for sharing.
My pelasure!
Can you do one explaining compression in a dive?
It's explained in my Roll Rate video. Can maybe do a video on that still though.
I'm sorry Adam. I have sinned. I've started flying American heavy bombers.
Side note. I reasoned that climbing in these heavy bombers would still be useful because you could close the energy difference between you and the potential attacker. What also helps is the fact that very few fighters attack bombers properly, like approachinga bomber from a low 6 o' clock position. If this occurs at high altitude and they dodge and weave between your bullets, they will have a hard time catching up. Meaning that you can actually defend yourself!
But my win rate at 4.7 American has gone down from >60% to 40% : (
4.0-5.0 is rough, too many mg 151s to deal with.
That win rate difference is pretty good proof.
@@AdamTheEnginerd With medium bombers it's a different story. In my B-25 Mitchell I got a 0.5 kill per battle ratio, probably better than some fighter mains.
@@FunkyEspelhoCat You'd be how much easier it becomes if they come in one by one at 6000-7000m of altitude all just sitting at the low 6 o' clock position behind the bomber with a little over 1 km of separation.
There's one thing I don't understand (I haven't watched the 1st video, but haven't got time for that right now). When comparing those climbs, shouldn't both planes be climbing at an angle that allows them to keep the IAS that is talked about, ie. 250 / 300 kph? If yes, then why do they end up at high altitude with IAS different from that? If that's due to optimal climbing speed - how to determine it?
They end with the same IAS, but different TAS! And TAS is the true measure of kinetic energy!
He is at a constant 250/ 300 kph, IAS, he's measuring the TAS (322/ 387 kph) at the given altitude for the final equation. I'm still a little confused with the whole IAS/ TAS thing but at higher altitudes your TAS is considerably higher than your IAS. The way someone explained it to me was the IAS is something like the air flowing around the wings and gives you a better representation of your aircraft's capability in terms of maneuverability when at higher altitudes whereas the TAS is the literal speed you're flying in relation to the ground.
Fantastic video !
Thank you very much!
Cool vid.
TL; DR: Adam, please do a vid on a stock F-86A-5, max uptier.
A question - Adam, can you please show us how to Sabre? Because the stock F-86A-5 can get in the same battle as the F100s, the pre-top MiG-21 and the Lighting, while having high repair costs. Not even speaking about the F-86F-2, that does the same and has even higher repair costs (16K stock compared to 5-6K on the F100D) and the only advantage it has over the F-86A-5 is the cannons instead of Brownings.
I'd really love if Gaijin gave US the A-40 modification of the Sabre since it, at the very least, has AA rockets.
Thanks!
That's too specific, and I wouldn't remove mods on an aircraft to fly it stock. For any aircraft though, if you think it's weak against the competition, then you can fly something else instead.
@@AdamTheEnginerd But how do I get to the F100D then? Cause the Starfighter is just bad at 10.0
Probably F104 is a better deal for the BR than F86A.
Hey Adam!
Could you make a short video about what we see on a planes stat card? I mean, what value is good or bad, what playstyle can I play with these numbers etc. Just a really short video would make it, would be great cuz if you show me how to climb with P-47 (for example) it won't help me when I'm flying my Zero.
Thanks a lot!
(it would also make it just as a part of another video or sth.)
Every value on the stat card is misleading, except for top speed which is usually decent. If you don't trust stat cards, you'll be better off.
@@AdamTheEnginerd ohh, interesting... thank you for the answer
All makes great sense! Good job. :)
Hmm, even if the 300km/h climb is better at gaining energy, isn't it more important to get to a high altitude as soon as possible so that you can engage in combat sooner at your best alt? Sure you might have more energy in a 300km/h climb, but unless you're already in combat you won't make any use out of that extra energy. If the p47 climbing at 250km/h reaches 5km 6 seconds sooner it means it will reach it's enemies sooner than the one climbing at 300km/h.
If the p47 climbing at 250km/h stops its climb at 5km, how long does it take for it to reach 300km/h? If it takes more than 6 seconds then it will lose the race, otherwise it'll win.
Let them think this brother we will smack them for this one
You are only thinking it terms of the Y-axis (it's actually the z-axis but y helps you visualize this better). Think, also, that since it is climbing at a faster speed, it will be able to cross the battlefield faster. Crossing the battlefield faster will let you encounter the enemy sooner.
You meet the enemy faster if you climb at a higher speed and lower angle. Aircraft also climb better at lower altitude, so the higher climb speed means you stay a bit longer at lower altitudes, increasing climb (negligible effect though).
Look at it this way instead. If you are climbing at 300km/h, you can reach the same altitude you'd reach climbing at 250 in the same time by pitching up and converting speed into altitude. Only difference is that for the P47D28, climbing at 300 will give you a tad bit more energy so you'll either be higher or faster than the 250 climb after the same amount of time has elapsed.
@@AdamTheEnginerd And, if you happened to meet an enemy unexpectedly during your climb, your chances of dodging are a lot better at higher speed.
How do I force people who climb at 400kph in migs and G.91s to watch this?
Spam it.
Or don't, I play USA 😂
@@juanordonezgalban2278 all sabres just climb at 20 degrees like props..
I always climb at higher speed.
Why? By calculating the energy conservation theory, it is exactly same, hence I climb at higher speed to cool my hot engine. There isn't any Carnnot's engine in game where the more heat it produce, more efficient engine you've made. If I do so, I ended up paying spawn points.
There's an optimal IAS for every prop. Going faster than that will lead to the same reduction in energy gain as going slower than the optimal speed. Indeed though engine power does not depend on temperature.
@@AdamTheEnginerd I neglect the air compression of the props though....
If I count so, yes I should a bit slower :p
But in every flight, I always do it by feeling lol
All my homies love graphs
Great vid
Haha thanks!
God I love Your videos
Thanks for the love, much appreciated!
wow your channel is very nice, love the merch aswell
Glad you like it!
For the higher Spitfire story, can't it just stall you or bnz you because of his altitude and turn?
No, if it tried to outstall you you'd stall later because you have more energy, so Spitfire would die.
@@AdamTheEnginerd what about a spiral climb or a split s?
In the real airplane world, aircraft are rated at best angle of climb, and best rate of climb. Both are listed as Indicated Air Speed values. I wonder if you could do a comparison of both on the same aircraft in war thunder. Since I side climb most of the time, and once I reach my altitude I'm aiming at, I level off anyway to gain speed. Wouldn't angle of climb sometimes be more advantageous?
You're better off climbing at the best rate of climb, and climbing to the side to meet the enemy later. That'll allow you to be higher and meet the enemy whenever you want, neutralizing the advantage of the best angle of climb.
havent played war thunder in so long... just wait till i get wifi and move my computer into its new dwelling.... i think ill need some rust remover though 😐
Good luck!
Could you do some tutorial on how to play F-86 Sabre (with machine guns) ?
I don't play much high tier jets though, so probably not anytime soon.
This doesn't show the whole picture. After reaching the target altitude, the plane will level out and gain speed. And since the plane that climbed slower reached it's peak engine performance altitude first, it may catch up the "faster" plane speed when the last one reaches the same altitude.
Don't know how this applies to War Thunder's physics, but in real life, the best energy generation climb speed in a prop with constant power setting is the one with less combined drag from parasite drag and induced drag. This varies from plane to plane, but usually is around 240-280kph. You may be slower at every altitude, but if you level up at the same altitude, you will be faster at the same time.
Hmm props don't accelerate faster as you increase altitude, even if we suppose that they both climb to their optimal altitude. That's because thrust decreases with TAS, and TAS increases with altitude with a constant IAS, leading to a decrease in thrust at higher altitude compared to sea level.
The best climb speed is where specific excess power is maximized, so engine power minus drag power (Drag*TAS).
@@AdamTheEnginerd thrust decreases with altitude up to a point where you need all your power to keep level flight. But as you said, energy comes from power. So, the energy you store at every instant comes from (engine power - total drag). Engine power is a factor that depends only on engine RPM. And the drag is the sum of parasite and induced drag (my reference is Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators).
What I meant is that you accelerate faster at higher altitudes is because you have less drags, so an increase of 20 IAS at higher altitudes is more significant than 20 IAS at lower altitude, since it represents more TAS. Ofc, if you're using all your power to produce enough thrust to keep level flight, you won't be able to increase the TAS. But as long as you have enough air pressure from the intake+supercharger to keep high thrust, you can accelerate
Plus I don't know how this implemented on WT, but I'm considering the engine air intake and supercharger rate limited by the max manifold pressure to avoid engine knock
Clearly explained, thx
Btw, shouldn't optimal climb speed slowly decrease as your engine power decreases with altitude?
Yes it should! Actually it should very slightly reduce even if power stays constant due to TAS and drag power increasing for a constant IAS.
@@AdamTheEnginerd In this case you mean the TAS decreases while we maintain a constant IAS right?
@@dsdy1205 As you climb, TAS increases if you maintain constant IAS. His point is that IAS should technically decrease slightly as you climb as power decreases.
Mind blown
Good!
@@AdamTheEnginerd
-Wait, it's all energy?
-Always has been
xD
@@TimmacTR Hahaha nice one!
If you got higher than your enemy, say a Spitfire LF mk IX outclimbs a Ta-152, the 152 would be more likely to just run away than fight you because he sees you're at higher altitude even though he's in a higher energy state. Should I try to climb less in the spitfire and get some more speed so I can meet them head on and they won't just run away?
Yeah that is a trick, it's easier to see that someone has an altitude advantage than a speed of advantage, so they'll be less likely to run away indeed.
I think I'll start trying that then, I have a lot of trouble with enemies simply running off if I get into a good energy state on them. It's a weird balancing act of seeming like you're a potential kill without being so high that they just won't engage.
Yup, gotta give hope!
So, I need to balance angle and speed for optimal climbing?
Nope, just stay at the efficient IAS for that aircraft.
Nice one.
Thanks!
Adam you should do a video on the Harrier when it comes out
Maybe!
I really just want to see you get a ace with it
I was trying to convince people that it is better to climb at a higher speed than climbing at a steeper angle for 5 years now... Cheers
Depends on the aircraft!
This will be SOOOOOO useful
Definitely! Especially in real life.
Bruh I found this out 2-3 years ago when I noticed the little circle at the climb view, I noticed my nose was the little circle and not the mouse. Everyone thought I was crazy saying they're climbing at 15 degrees instead of 20
No the nose is the big circle! Your true heading is the little circle which gives the angle of attack by comparing with the nose (big circle).
@@AdamTheEnginerd the little circle is actually the acceleration vector?
@@ioan-alexandrutrofin4524 No it's your true heading. Your nose is typically pointed higher than your true heading because of the angle of attack required to produce lift to counter weight.
So if someone says to climb at 20 degrees or something the little dot goes there and not the circle?
Guess ive been doing it different
@@Kay_213_ No, most people mean to say point your nose at 20°.
Nice one Adam !
Thanks!
Is there some way to use variables to replace the data so you get the optimal speed for you aircraft? Like in a excel/google sheets?
There are ways to cut down on testing, but like I explained in my rate of climb video, you'll still need to go in test flight to get the prop efficiency.
Rate of climb video: czcams.com/video/eEeBX7XAgsw/video.html&ab_channel=AdamTheEnginerd
@@AdamTheEnginerd If you do a straight line dash from stall speed to top speed, and plot the acceleration against velocity, does that immediately give you the specific energy graph?
@@dsdy1205 It'll give the specific excess thrust curve.
And this is the principle that makes zoom and booming possible
Climbing?
I’d know those curve colors anywhere, Excel ftw
It's Matlab actually haha.
Oh yeah! More deep Knowledge!!! Noice vid😊
Glad you liked it!
What is PEFC again? I couldn't find anything via Google and I think it referred to the propeller efficiency but I'm not 100 on it.
Propeller efficiency!
0:26 anyone else thought about that Nickelback meme or os that just me?
Not just you ;).
Hi, don´t you know how if mountings/pods for additional armament (such as rockets or bombs) affect the drag in game? So the plane after getting rid of its load would perform worse than the same plane without them from the beggining, with means without the pods at all?
If so, how big the effect actually is?
The game tells you when you look at secondary pay loads
Hes asking about mounts without payloads.
Pylons don't affect drag, except for the permanent ones that stay even after the ordnance is released (like the rocket pods on F4U-7).
Is there a way to figure out the optimal climb speed for a given plane that isn't a week of tests and math or finding a spreadsheet and hoping the numbers are accurate? Because everybody always goes higher and faster than I do, and nothing I've changed makes a significant improvement.
does this also mean that energy gain rate is not affected that much at all by the climb IAS? like the difference between 250km/h IAS and 300km/h IAS in your graph seems minimal.
It is, there is one optimal climb IAS for a given aircraft and altitude. The optimal climb speed for the D28 is around 280, so 250 was too slow to be optimal and 300 was too fast to be optimal, both of these speeds are on either side of the optimal climb speed. The optimal climb speed is a few % better than these speeds. If you climb at 225 or 350, you'll climb significantly worse than optimal.
@@AdamTheEnginerd There is a way to know the optimal speed for any aircraft? Does AOA help to know the optimal speed?
@@Maverick966 No, it can only provide a rule of thumb. Around 4 degrees AoA is a decent start.
Wish I could get into matches with you on my team.
One day!
Just the video I was looking for lol
Haha really? Pretty niche though.
Still waiting for my 190 d13 video
It's on my list!
Before I watch this video I prefer to climb at a 15 degree angle on planes and for heavy planes like the p-38, I like to fly straight to gain speed then climb at a 20 degree angle, K
Climb by constant IAS, not angle!
Please Adam, play the Sea Venom FAW, there is almost no videos of it in CZcams
Maybe!
so did war thunder just put ww1 battleships at br 6.0......what even is this? they also showed the trailer of battleships in which a bearcat was attacking it
No idea.
@@AdamTheEnginerd if they added ww2 battleships they will probably end up at top tier i mean put ww1 battleships at low tier and nerf the aa its that easy
Where do you want WWI battleships to go? Battleships weren't really made after WWII. Aircraft carriers made them all but obsolete. WWII battleships will be a couple BRs above the WWI ones, and at top tier will be modern frigates, destroyers, cruisers, and hopefully subs and carriers.
@@zackbobby5550 that's basically the bismarck vs jets kinda unfair
Adam did the WT like real life? like rate of climb and other, if true i want using you video for doing presentation hehe
Yup, the same applies in both.
@@AdamTheEnginerd well thanks i will use you video and research for my studied
Can you please make a video for tip on how to play bombers?
I don't fly bombers.
Question: when on maps with airspawn enabled, should we immediately pitch up and zoom until we decelerate to best climb, or should we adopt the correct climb attitude and wait for the climb ias to drop to the optimum number?
Pitch up to decelerate quicker, then as you near your optimal climb speed you should gradually reduce the angle so that you reach your optimal climb speed, and then continue on that constant IAS.
@@AdamTheEnginerd alright, that makes sense thanks!
So the shallower angle and higher speed are canceling each other out?
You're better off looking at it like I explained in my first rate of climb video, which is the engine power goes into increasing the aircraft's energy after countering drag. So your climb speed should be close to your minimum drag-power speed for a piston engine (prop efficiency makes it so that the optimal speed is above the minimum drag-power speed).
Pls new video of c 205 version3
Maybe!
I didn't understand by watching but still, i'm here.
What didn't you understand?
@@AdamTheEnginerd I mean i can understand by playing. This is me, professor.
I was hoping to look at your plane compared to the horizon when also looking at the IAS meter to compare if I'm usually climbing too steep or too low, but then I noticed your WEP was constantly on?
Is this just a custom test map with unlimited WEP for the experiment?
Well the climb is less than 5 minutes, and it has 12 minutes of WEP.
to add to that, in realistic there is no WEP restrictor
@@xavier4519 Oh I was suspecting such a thing. I literally didn't know that how arcade has it it's not normal.
Are you making these graphs in Matlab?
Yuppers!
Question: is the Vy listed in most flight manuals the best time to climb speed or the highest excess power speed then?
Good question! For props they likely don't do the distinction since it wouldn't give a big speed difference. For jets, I'd say it's highest excess power speed.
@@AdamTheEnginerd Didn't see this reply, thanks!
Plz don't tell the bombers how to climb more Adam lol (good vid!)
Lol I don't know the optimal climb speed of bombers, but if I didn't I wouldn't share it.
Too late, currently flying American heavy bombers quite enjoying it.
What’s the thing with extra information under the speed/alt meter on the left? Where can I get it?
Overlay: forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/483838-warthunder-real-time-information/
so how do you convert all those extra energy to efficiently fight spitfires that have lower energy but higher altitude?
Stay fast and more than a km below them, to bleed their energy when they dive after you. Eventually they will equalise speed at a similar altitude.
Then, how to reverse them? It usually ended in a headon for me
Hmm don't come up from right under them, give them space. If they commit to you, bait to teammates. If they don't, go for them when they go for one of your other teammates.
@@AdamTheEnginerd i see. so wait until they turn away from you.. how about if they don't and have speed advantage?
Adam,I really like your video.
But I'm just a junior high school student in Taiwan, so my English ability isn't very good.Sometimes l don't know what you says in your videos.May I ask you some questions about the game?
To understand your videos ,I think I need to improve my English ability.
Sure, go for it!
What is that information display on the left that he has in game
Overlay: forum.warthunder.com/index.php?/topic/483838-warthunder-real-time-information/
Adam,Do you plan on making a video on the Yak-23 i feel like its sorta an underrated aircraft at 8.0 ive used it and it seems very good even at 8.7 at times. And this was a very nice video thanks for the graphs and explanation
Thanks!
It's on my list!
it was 7.3...
do u have a list of rough best climb IAS per plane?
There exist one spreadsheet that is 10-20 km/h too slow in my opinion. I'm slowly working on a spreadsheet it's in the description.