Old mechanical inverter DC AC
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- These types of mechanical inverter in the 60s was much used in caravans, boats, etc.. before modern electronic inverters, where it was necessary to have a voltage of 220 volts AC.*Inverter characteristic: Pri. 24V DC 5.6A / Sec. 24V AC 4.3A Hz 50 / self-regulated. 1963 Germany.
Very nice professional demonstration - showing only what is needed and nothing more. Good safety tip at the end with disconnecting the battery.
Eric Wasatonic Thanks :)
This inverter produces pure sine wave, much better than any electronic inverter
it produce square wave
It'll be square wave usefull if battery series connected upto 230 vdc, most simple inverter just need a motor and commutators
pure sine not sqare it is just like the grid just smaler
Yesssss
This is a really good video without non-sense.
Very good Very simple adjusting the speed of the motor 50 or 60 Hz (power contacts ) and the power of the transformer is the easiest and cheap inverter as huge as you want Congratulations for your project
This arragement was widely used in Aviation to convertt dc to ac. Also in the civilian live it was known as dyna-motor.
Thanks very illustrative.
Wonderful ideas!!!! thank you. The Planetary Society Argentina.
motor/inverter characteristic: Pri. 24V DC 5.6A / Sec. 24V AC 4.3A Hz 50 / self-regulated. 1963 Germany.
As always, I like your videos, thanks, nice day!☺☺☺
what for cool experiment srched long for this cinde of interesting experiments 👩💻 very nice chanel
nice one !! good score!
i magen heving to lisen to this all day long
Old school type inverters use vibrators, a kind of like a relay with contacts that alternates and then produces pulsated dc and then fed to a step up transformer. Doesn't last though since contacts wears out fast and it's noisy too. Now a days, vibrators are used in a different manner, if you know what I mean lol.
rene kenshin Thanks for the comments to my videos :) This video and others, are only for vision and curiosity, they have no practicality use in the field of electricity.
rene kenshin The one in the video is 52 yrs old, it looks like it is running pretty good!
I have a 1980's winco mechanical inverter 24vdc 1200 watts @120 VAC works great and has never had a problem, why would you think it uses vibrators? I always thought it was just a 24VDC motor turning an alternator.
Ken Barnett I'm not talking about the one in the video, I'm talking about another type of inverter used in the past.
rene kenshin I have no idea how it works, I've never ran it without the cover on, so if you say it uses vibrators it just might!
Car radios up through the 1950's used vibrators to step up voltage for the plate supply of the tubes. Earliest car radios used dry cells for plate voltage, just like early home radios.
I'm really enjoying with your video, every single day I'm watching this video. well done great job you are a big profissor, professional people have to work with you 👍😮
works quite well!
HDXFH Yes, if the batteries would be bigger would work better :)
Muito bom!
Notei que você usa a rotação do motor para gerar a frequência do Inversor sobre um enrolamento menor do transformador!
Interesting upload. I remember I've seen with electromechanical relay and LC circuits. Slightly damped waves and for relatively small powers though
2:32 "Crank it right up" - Photonicinduction
Isn’t this a DC driven AC Generator?
Yes
I'd love to build one.
Very interesting...... circuit
neat what is it called and how does it work if you can tell me any details I would most appreciate it sir
I like it!
Just wondering if you would be interested in doing a tear down video of that motor?that would be very well worth a look.
green N.R.G The description of the motor is written below :)
thanks buddy.
thanks for sharing Electric Experiments Roobert33
Amigo sou do Brasil e fico observando todos experimentos colocado em video.O que tenho a dizer : Se estes videos tiver uma narrativa explicativa ,vai ser de grande valor didático e o mundo ficará agradecido,nós também queremos aprender com você .Você também será um mestre sem fronteiras ! Para que serve , como aplicar , e como fazer, Please, thank you
Amigo, infelizmente, eu não falo Inglês, só posso fazer comentários com google tradutor :)
wow I read about such dc to ac converter motor devices but never seen one until one now ...this probably better than our modern electronic inverters? I wonder if we can still buy a motor inverter like that on the market these days? Im tired of electronic circuits that fail when over loaded
fidel catsro The advantage of this inverter is that the sine wave is perfect, the only downside is the noise ..
Electric Experiments Roobert33
Not entirely right. One big selling point of the electronic inverters is the speed at which they kick in. When they act as a backup, your appliance will keep functioning continuously. A motor like this will take seconds to spin up giving your equipment the outage you have been presumably trying to avoid.
Another problem lies in the efficiency. DC motors aren't exactly known for their efficiency and often require centrifugal air turbines to cool the motor for any respectable load. Couple the losses of the alternator side to that and any mall inverter beats that by a longshot.
maybe if the dc motor can be replaced by a pulse motor with heavy flywheel and the alternator is replaced by a permanent magnet magneto this system can be greatly efficient?
Really wished to find such motor but can't. So much interested in electricity
You can replicate this principle using small DC motor like 775 and car alternator.
old is gold
Very Very good
I'm looking for a similar application to this with which to outfit my Volkswagen with a pure-sine wave mechanical DC/AC inverter. To me, it would be more fun and cheaper to implement than a digital pure-sine wave circuit, plus it matches the era of the vehicle. However, like another user commented, this seems to be a compound device containing an implementation of a mechanical inverter and not just the inverter itself. Is this form factor a necessity, or is this actually two devices in one?
I don't know about this particular one, but someone made one using a dynamotor and a 3000rpm bldc motor (with separate power supply so frequency doesn't lower under load) it had a 2 pole dc motor commutator and a 2 phase slip ring motor commutator.
In total:
One brushed motor (dynamotor) aka (rotary transformer)
One brushless dc motor (rotary inverter)
And 8 carbon brushes (total) to maintain
I have a 24vdc 1200 watt 120 vdc "Winco Pure sine wave inverter" I use it for a step to get into my bed...
The mechanism looks like one iron frame generator or motor, it is not a separate dc motor coupled to an ac generator, but that is what it actually does inside of a single housing, it is the size of a concrete block and weighs about 70 lbs., nothing digital about this thing, I might do a video with an ammeter hooked to the DC and a kill a watt meter on the AC side and open it up to show what is inside, not much to see, just a motor and an automotive style voltage regulator along with the power connects.
Nice explanation sir it's UNIQ one
Great because it is a true sinusoid, bad because the frequency is highly load dependent. Perhaps coupling the 24V ac generator with a good quality bldc motor and driver and a modest flywheel for a highly stable frequency, or precise voltage control?
That would take the "steampunk" spirit away as the beauty of this thing is precisely the lack of modern electronics. If you allowed a BLDC controller, you might as well do a solid-state power conversion from the ground up.
EDIT: To improve stability without ruining it with overly modern approaches, one could equip the primary motor with a centrifugal switch that would stabilize the speed and act as a crude governor.
Robert Szasz His inverter may have that freq issue, I have a Winco 24vdc 1200 watt 120vdc mechanical inverter and it works great, starts right up and I have never came across a frequency problem, but I also use a voltage regulator between the batteries and inverter, I used it for grid tie for 2 yrs without even a hiccup, it just works every time all of the time. Mine doesn't make even half the noise that inverter is putting out either, but mine is circa 1980's not early 60's and made for a wind turbine.
Ken Barnett I was thinking the easiest way to get this device to be more stable. If you don't mind wasting a bit of power self regulation can be done with a couple secondary windings a transistor, and a diode bridge
Actually mechanical inverters are much more stable and dependable than electronic inverters, the inverter he is demonstrating is over 50 yrs old! A voltage regulator between the battery and inverter is a more common setup, however he is demonstrating the inverter using a dimmer to increase and decrease the voltage from 24 vdc down to I'm guessing 12vdc because the output voltage is 240VAC to 120VAC ...
Ken Barnett I'd agree that they are more durable, but if you need precise voltage and frequency control solid state, or a solid state controller is the way to go. If you have plenty of spare power, and can spare the space and weight a fully electromechanical inverter with good stability can be built (giant flywheel, mechanical load feedback) but unless you need something that will survive an emp, solid state, or at least transistorized control is easier.
I was wondering sir what wuld hapen if some one took windings out of alternator and rewinden them more like dc motors that fiel coil culd tehnicaly be pulsed similar to coppy commitator even tought they are slip rings I was wondering if that same alternator culd coppy that dc to ac rotaty corverter? Wuld that laminated iron core interfeare with dc motor capability ? Normal dc motors have pole peaces metal what reaction wuld acure?
What wuld hapen if I rewound stationary windings in 1 direction only makeing 2:1 ratio coils wuld the alternator still work even if the coils are displaced in diferent places?
I was also wondering can you add transformer ore inductors in series with the field wires to make 2-3 phase field?
What?
@@felixbeutin8105 well me engine kinde of refuse to stop so I have faulty back chargeing 12si delco alternator who runs at slow speed so I kinde of have also faulty blinker relay ground sone where me engine cinde of runs in union with blinker relay so thats with key compleately off.
So I was wondering culd I use only alternator as cinde of magneto circuet aperantly there is some how engine runing with out ignition coil positive .
So all that rubbish made me thinking how to make normal alternator to magneto ignition ore make that thing act as some sort of motor on demand .
I simply crosed lot problems with me alternator from failing voltage regulator up to fumeling with hv capacitors up to strange ground problems including suspiciuse blinker relay who for some strange reason acts as ignition .
But mostly I end up with dead baterry .
So is there any way to use capacitor banks instead baterry and send full alternator power to ignition coil?
I have unusual problems ok and those kinde of problems do diferent effects like over chargeing baterrys ,dead baterrys some times they hold charge at cold conditions for days all kinde of crap I experiance with me alternator even electric motor and magnetic brakeing including self ignition wia ground for some reason.
Some effects are great but some are anoying .
So any one know here how to control that deam thing?
Because I acidentaly have all those problems randomly .
Can for some reason the alternators rotor ore regulator ore stationary winding be used as cinde of ignition system and why does this acure ?
Only thing I have in me car us 4 pin gm ignition module ,positive linear dashboard regulator and some 3pin blinker relay that deam thing refuse to stop me car and for some reason it has bade tendency to self acelerate engine with out tuching that deam engine .
So preaty much at this stage Im anoyed any bright electritians here who know what the hell that deam thing is doing and why exactly has blinker relay to do with alternator???
So I want to fry that deam engine with evry thing alternator got so was wondering how to not get shocked with ac and not fry me baterry well the old ac magnetos cold do that but in me case aperantly its litel diferent.
So yeah have unusual problem here
Is that knob control a rheostat?
The wheel at the end of this "inverter"' is a flywheel?
I think the knob control is a switch, either 12v dc or 24v dc
So it’s actually a heavy dc motor with a generator built in? Nice
@quinten van ginderen: Yup! And a clever design, too. In fact, You have on one side of the rotor a normal commutator hooked up to the winding. And on the other side of the rotor there are two or three slip rings also hooked up to the windings 180 or 120° apart whether you need single or three phase AC. No need to couple two units as all are in one.
good
Good
So from what i can tell this is basically a dc motor running an ac generator. However would it be possible to use a much smaller dc motor to run a commutator which will reverse the polarity of the batteries? This way the speed of the motor would also control the frequency of the output (ideal if we want to control ac induction motors) Also the power consumption of the inverter itself would be minimal. Granted the output would be squared but would that affect the total efficiency of an electric drivetrain for example that uses an induction motor?
cyberlord64 Yes, it might also be possible, but you have to to experiment to find out..
That's exactly what I thought. It would work well for the bulbs, not so much for any motors though. It would also place serious wear on any contacts used to break the current flow. Since a converter is considered to be heavy-duty equipment, any commutators should be avoided, or at least well executed.
cyberlord64 I have an old book which describes how a rotary converter uses slip rings (AC side) connected to opposite commutator segments (DC side), which outputs a sine wave from a DC source, although the book describes how to use it the other way round, with the AC producing DC using a commutator . I want to try this using an old universal motor.
Nathan Dance Do you happen to remember the name of the book? i am still curious about this. My attempt using the method i posted in my earlier comment was borderline successful. (I used the commutator of a universal motor myself). Large sparks, high heat, even a little smoke etc... Though in the end i did get a fully square waveform, AND after passing the output through a transformer in reverse did manage to run an ac fan. But i cant imagine running such a setup for longer than a minute, not unless you want to burn down your house...
i would like to know how it works
Yasmine Peerkhan In practice, the batteries do turn the motor which in turn actuates an alternator to 24 volts and then it is transformed to 230 volts using a transformer.
he'll good job well done , can you send me the name of the motor please?
+Saboor Saedi Inverter characteristic: Pri. 24V DC 5.6A / Sec. 24V AC 4.3A Hz 50 / self-regulated. 1963 Germany.
+Roobert33 thank you professor men 👌🏻😃
Why you used the coil in this circut ? What this machine type in video ? Pernament magnet DC?
The coil is a 230V 24V transformer
Ok. This machine in video is machine which type?
That would b perfect with a mechanical way to drive it instead, like wind or water.
Hello, I don't understand why you put a DC-DC motor? if you can put 24 volts to the input of the coil directly.
Jaime Inostroza The dynamo input is 24 volts DC, 24 volts AC out. The DC does not work with the toroid (transformer).
how do they work?
The efficiency of inverter is about %60, right?
Feyyaz Güroğlu Mechanical or electronic?
Yeah mechanical :)
Feyyaz Güroğlu Yes, about 60%
Cool Sir,
Can you show me how to go the other way? I would like to power a 24vdc for a light/heavy hydraulic pump.
Thank You.
Bryan Lawless
bryan lawless It only does the job alternator.
any info on how they work? i need a way to go from 12vdc to 110vac ( for some old us equipment- so 60 hz)
Olá, parabéns pela a iniciativa. Existe alguma maneira de fazer um retorno de recarga para a bateria? Pode me dizer obrigado.
+MrTyssi Não é possível, significa um movimento perpétuo ;)
+Electric Experiments Roobert33 Acreditei que era possível assim o equipamento poderia trabalhar por mais tempo. Muito obrigado,boa sorte.
i wonder how low the efficiency convertion rate
the loss is all heat, and I don't think this is too much hotter than a modern converter
@@tamtrinh174 you forgot the friction, modern mosfet inverter doesn't create friction and can convert over 90% efficiency
@@yoshiakihisha8496 friction -> heat
@@yoshiakihisha8496 modern one doesn't create physical friction, but there is electrical "friction", if you understand what I mean
And connect the earth ♥️@@tamtrinh174and connect a little capacitor starting
What are you feeding the battery with
If I was in the 60s I would just use a 10:1 transformer and use a tiny motor like a casset motor to just alternate the primary of the transformer to generate an AC.
this is not a mechenical inverter ,this is a rotery transformer having two parts in same armature, one side is a DC motor & other side used saperate winding on same armature is uses as DC generator
A DC motor that shares the same shaft with an AC generator
Actually it is a factual inverter, since it "inverts" the DC power into AC, a transformer, transforms voltage and amperage, an inverter creates the Hertz at 50 or 60 to produce AC from a direct current that does not produce a sine.
I recall reading in early 70s some motor homes had these or you could get a mechanical dc motor driven 120v generator before electronic.
Both wound motor generator ???
Yes :)
Wie effizient ist der inverter ? 60% ?
***** Yes, more or less..
who makes it ?
Your momma
@@KeyboardBusterwtf bruh how old are you 😅
This video is not very helpful because you waste most of the time hooking up simple components yet you never bother to explain what they are or why you are using them.
...yes it's an alternator...
iam surprise this video
Hola tiene nombre y modelo del Inversor que estas usando ???
Jesús Ybañez The characteristics of the inverter is in the video description.
Sorry not look
Jesús Ybañez El nombre y el modelo del inversor son la publicidad, YT no permite que el socio de revelar los nombres de los fabricantes.
Where I can get one of this generators today?
⚠ElektronikMaster⚠ I found it at an electronics fair in Italy.
Electric Experiments Roobert33 OK thank you for your information
It's not suitable for high-tech electronic devices since output frequency isn't even near 50Hz.
Very Cool...
I'm going to camp and want to use the car battery to heat up a 6000w 220v showers
Summary: in 12v out 220v 6000w
You can help me
christophersalvato11 That would mean drawing over 500A from the car battery. I'm not really sure how that is supposed to work. A pretty large car battery may be able to power the heater for 10 minutes if you don't include power losses from the inverter and internal resistance of the battery.(Which would probably be too high to deliver 500A continously)
What I would suggest doing is using a gas powered water heater. The second option would be one that uses a low power(500w?) 12v element that heats the water while driving the car. Hope this helps.
christophersalvato11
what is the coil for?
Converting 24V AC to 120V or 230V AC
and full details please
00966581317426 malik irfan saudia arab
What, this is just a DC motor driving an AC generator
+Jeffrey314159 Yes, they are coupled together AC DC
มันเปื้องแบตเคยทำแล้ว
motor speed high in accu 48V
22V in Led and motor
that eficiency was really Low
vary nice video but please send me the name of motor please please
THANKS......
the details of the motor is written in the video description
whish state madam
gareb khanagaz .....mujhy samjh wo please
gareb khanagaz
چل یار انگریزی بولتے ھو
Hh a dc motor and an alternator
True free energy, have eyes but do not see.
This is not free energy lol, it still needs DC power from the battery to convert to AC
ok
Детский сад !
Ye kia ho raha ha bhai kuch bol to sahi
this motor ac is feik this i dont boliv in this motor
Zemir Coralic good for you that you do not believe
Electric Experiments Roobert33 roobert pliz du you sendmi video aaut this motor bikaz i vont bild this praget sime you pliz sori for mei inglis i em from bosnia
pliz esplein me du jou bild this ac motoro. or dhis is orginals motor plis repli encer me
Mechanical type high quality than modern inverters but ineficiency of the mechanical type