Thatcher voted for the decriminalization of homosexuality, but as she made clear in her memoirs, that didn't mean that she was pro-gay rights. Hers was a more conservative position: don't attack, but at the same time, don't condone. Keep it behind closed doors.
Adrian Fisher I agree, but today if you say 'keep it behind closed doors', you're likely to be told that you are a bigot for being against 'marriage equality'. *sigh*
Ciaran Ryan Why must everything be politicised? To turn everything into a political struggle is to risk the important issues being lost in the noise. I'm opposed to the gay marriage law but that's not because I'm homophobic (I'm not scared of gays) but because I don't see how it's any of the governments business who marries who as long as the people are not close relatives, both are above the age of consent (and so able to lawfully enter into contract in their own right) and are not pressured into it. Nobody should be forced to marry them if it's against their beliefs and nobody should be forced to provide goods or services to events they don't agree with as doing so would be a breach of their right to refuse to contract.
Knappa22 Section 28[1] see below for those that don't know it may be seen as an attempt to actively discriminate against gays (of whatever kind) or it could be seen as an attempt to bolster up and support the traditional family unit. It all depends where your heart lies as to how you perceive it. [1]: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_28
Knappa22 the world has not loved the gays since life spread. That’s over 2000 years. But no because you entitled westerner says so, that means they are wrong.
Her initial compassion towards gay people did not extend to an approval of what she perceived as their desire to be accepted by society. She did not single out the gay cause for exemption from her antipathy towards social liberalism. Gay militancy hardened her stance, so was counterproductive where she was concerned. The camp extravaganzas of the gay pride marches can have done little to dissuade her from a less tolerant, accepting stance. Edwina Curry said it was difficult to get anywhere regarding gay rights while Mrs Thatcher was leader. She was an old fashioned woman whose views and feelings towards gay people, it seems to me, were overall quite inconsistant. I hesitate to demonise her. ML
Matthew Parris was my MP, up until 1983, & most of his constituents were perfectly happy with his ability to adequately & properly represent their interests at Westminster. The fact is - regardless of any contrary statement, here - Matthew Parris was quietly sidelined by the Conservative Party & replaced with Patrick MaCloughlin, as West Derbyshire MP, in time for the 6 week run-up to the 1983 General Election. Mrs Thatcher did NOT approve of Matthew's sexuality. Re our MP's competency, which matters so much more than his sexuality, Patrick MaCloughlin is a very poor second, as an MP. Our local hospital - Newholme, Bakewell, is due to close after decades of invaluable service to inpatients & outpatients, alike. Mr MaCloughlin is unconcerned with the hospital's plight, even though he, himself, lives close by, in Matlock. He is one of the most ineffective, complacent MPs in parliament, & he seems pre-occupied with whoever is PM, while he is able to butter up to them. You're a disgrace, Mr MacCloughlin - remember your roots!!
Let me add that sexism and misogyny play a big part in the irrational hate that some still hold. Even the worst male politicians don’t experience that kind of passionate resentment.
This help my admiration for Mrs Thatcher well justified. I am not gay but I do admire someone so conservative in every way to have a caring side. I love her even more.
Ah- yes! Of course Carol. It would have been extradordinarily kind of her to say 'Matthew, I am so saddened to hear that there are gay people who feel that they are not represented by me. I am going to change this.' But you believe that this kind of response wasn't necessary. God bless you.
"It must have found that very difficult to say" sounds almost sarcastic to me, as if she had heard so many gay MPs come out to her that it became a typical occurrence to her.
If you actually think about, it is absolutely possible that her remark meant the exact opposite of what he thought it meant. "You must have found that very difficult to say" sounds like something Edward Longshanks would say to you, right before throwing you out the window. He's also suffering from a severe ignorance of the british character. A true Briton doesn't stop being polite, just because he hates you.
I think it's possibly from the Thatcher years documentary or a similar documentary, I've seen the documentary and this was said as MPs were telling her not to go on in her room in the house of commons, so it was definitely a documentary that focused on the end of her time in power.
I definitely doubt that her reaction was actually meant to be as kind as Mr Parris believes. Pityful maybe, but certainly not compassionate. She uttered - unmistakably - her ruthless and totally antiquated opinion about homosexuality in a conference in 1987. To think that she actually made allowances afterwards or even changed her mind in that matter is more than naive.
Patronizing I would call it. "ooo it must have been so difficult for you, you poor, pitiful creature" ..then walks off discussing any change of policy or general attitude.
***** Saying she preferred paedophiles says a lot more about you, than her .The statement that many MP's are gay is purely wishful thinking on your part no doubt. .How would you know ? Been in the bushes with them ?
why should she mind half of her cabinet were busy buggering or commiting pedrastry and abuse disgusting evil cabinet she had although she made mistakes i wouldnt class thatcher as evil per se its disturbing when things come out in the open 30 years later i just wonder what horrors are being commited at this very moment which will only surface 30 years from now when the current lot start kicking the bucket
He is MUCH too kind to Mrs. Thatcher. She was relentlessly anti-gay and passed anti-gay laws during the AIDS crisis that worsened it. Took Labour to undo the damage.
Correct! I've also been surprised by how so many gay men in public life (e.g. LBC radio) are hardcore tories given the parties history. BUt then again, like many of the most malevolent political figures, MT was apparently very kind in person to a lot of the people she worked with. Just like some of the most progressive politicians have been known to personally be twats. Weird innit?
Adrian Fisher No he's rude and has no people skills imo.No historians should be MPs that's cheating, they belong in museums with Dinosaurs! Not dinosaurs in Parliament!
Collette Post He's blunt, to be sure but being an expert on history he can recognise what's been done before and what happened. But, with regards to the apparent central point of your post, I don't care about your feelings because they're highly subjective. I do however care about your rights as they're not subjective and can be objectively listed.
So she basically said nothing nice, and didn't do anything for the gays, she just didn't openly tell her own party member that she will never support him in the way he really deserved. XOXO ;)
That's not true. Thatcher voted to decriminalise homosexuality. Her Swction 28 was concerned with the rise or AiDS and with public libraries having sexualised books.
Margaret Thatcher had a rather clear standpoint on homosexuality, and one could assume she was almost wholeheartedly against it; though this scenario would imply she considered other parts of one's character more important.
Thatcher voted for the decriminalization of homosexuality, but as she made clear in her memoirs, that didn't mean that she was pro-gay rights. Hers was a more conservative position: don't attack, but at the same time, don't condone. Keep it behind closed doors.
Shouldn't _everybody_ keep their sex lives behind 'closed doors?' what a delightfully Victorian way of addressing these matters !
Ciaran Ryan That's seems reasonable enough to me. What right have I got to force my way of life down anybody elses throat? Live and let live.
Adrian Fisher I agree, but today if you say 'keep it behind closed doors', you're likely to be told that you are a bigot for being against 'marriage equality'. *sigh*
Ciaran Ryan
Why must everything be politicised? To turn everything into a political struggle is to risk the important issues being lost in the noise. I'm opposed to the gay marriage law but that's not because I'm homophobic (I'm not scared of gays) but because I don't see how it's any of the governments business who marries who as long as the people are not close relatives, both are above the age of consent (and so able to lawfully enter into contract in their own right) and are not pressured into it. Nobody should be forced to marry them if it's against their beliefs and nobody should be forced to provide goods or services to events they don't agree with as doing so would be a breach of their right to refuse to contract.
Adrian Fisher From the sounds of it, you are NOT opposed to gay marriage law.
Why prelude this with 30 seconds of unrelated bollocks?
nonsense, but funny nevertheless
He's an attention-seeking traitor tory nonce.
exactly.
he is responsible for this great collection, he has a prelude to all the videos. enjoy it or jog on.
I thought that was brilliant. The dictator of Scotland being ridiculed, wonderful.
He sounds a lot like Tony Blair
Well gay people tend to have a similar sound in their voice 😉
@@ajon6205 😂 true.
@@ajon6205 Blair isn’t
@@ajon6205 say that to Blair’s face in a pub and Cherie will be festively trying hold him back.
@@sjacraneu wot m8?
'Sensitivity' pffft. The long pause was probably down to her trying to calculate the most non-committal response she could give... which she did.
Knappa22 You seem to be one of her haters and so choose to view what she did and said in the most negative way possible.
Adrian Fisher No. The odious Section 28, which she implemented is what makes me doubt that her response here was sincere/goodwilled.
Knappa22
Section 28[1] see below for those that don't know it may be seen as an attempt to actively discriminate against gays (of whatever kind) or it could be seen as an attempt to bolster up and support the traditional family unit. It all depends where your heart lies as to how you perceive it.
[1]: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Section_28
Not only that, but I read it as "well you've got a lot of balls to come here with that." I could be wrong.
Knappa22 the world has not loved the gays since life spread. That’s over 2000 years. But no because you entitled westerner says so, that means they are wrong.
That is the best intro you have made mate, pure class!
Her initial compassion towards gay people did not extend to an approval of what she perceived as their desire to be accepted by society. She did not single out the gay cause for exemption from her antipathy towards social liberalism. Gay militancy hardened her stance, so was counterproductive where she was concerned. The camp extravaganzas of the gay pride marches can have done little to dissuade her from a less tolerant, accepting stance. Edwina Curry said it was difficult to get anywhere regarding gay rights while Mrs Thatcher was leader. She was an old fashioned woman whose views and feelings towards gay people, it seems to me, were overall quite inconsistant. I hesitate to demonise her. ML
Matthew Parris was my MP, up until 1983, & most of his constituents were perfectly happy with his ability to adequately & properly represent their interests at Westminster. The fact is - regardless of any contrary statement, here - Matthew Parris was quietly sidelined by the Conservative Party & replaced with Patrick MaCloughlin, as West Derbyshire MP, in time for the 6 week run-up to the 1983 General Election. Mrs Thatcher did NOT approve of Matthew's sexuality. Re our MP's competency, which matters so much more than his sexuality, Patrick MaCloughlin is a very poor second, as an MP. Our local hospital - Newholme, Bakewell, is due to close after decades of invaluable service to inpatients & outpatients, alike. Mr MaCloughlin is unconcerned with the hospital's plight, even though he, himself, lives close by, in Matlock. He is one of the most ineffective, complacent MPs in parliament, & he seems pre-occupied with whoever is PM, while he is able to butter up to them. You're a disgrace, Mr MacCloughlin - remember your roots!!
SiLoJayLo He is like Eric Pickles a grumbling fat old bloat who belongs in Labour!
Parris left Parliament in May 1986, not before the 1983 general election...
She was a class act. I hate the way she has been demonized.
Yes a very classist, vile homophobic witch who hated the poor.
@@Sam-xu8si
Thank you for this vivid demonstration of demonisation and irrational hate.
Let me add that sexism and misogyny play a big part in the irrational hate that some still hold. Even the worst male politicians don’t experience that kind of passionate resentment.
@@Celisar1 I don't think it's irrational considering she caused heroin useage to spike where I live due to the unemployment of the 80s and 90s.
She was fantastic. And she still is.
The video's great, but I couldn't stop watching the intro! XD. What show is that?
its from a show called "still game"
Still Game.
still game, but its been butchered by a madman
This help my admiration for Mrs Thatcher well justified. I am not gay but I do admire someone so conservative in every way to have a caring side. I love her even more.
Ah- yes! Of course Carol. It would have been extradordinarily kind of her to say 'Matthew, I am so saddened to hear that there are gay people who feel that they are not represented by me. I am going to change this.' But you believe that this kind of response wasn't necessary. God bless you.
Did her introduction of section 28 help your admiration for her?
Sucker.
"It must have found that very difficult to say" sounds almost sarcastic to me, as if she had heard so many gay MPs come out to her that it became a typical occurrence to her.
I was thinking the same lol
Certainly not empathetic enough to change her stance on this subject
Ahhh, bless 'em both......
Best introduction ever!
If you actually think about, it is absolutely possible that her remark meant the exact opposite of what he thought it meant. "You must have found that very difficult to say" sounds like something Edward Longshanks would say to you, right before throwing you out the window.
He's also suffering from a severe ignorance of the british character. A true Briton doesn't stop being polite, just because he hates you.
This intro is so true we need detergent to F off
Is this interview from a documentary? If so, which one?
I think it's possibly from the Thatcher years documentary or a similar documentary, I've seen the documentary and this was said as MPs were telling her not to go on in her room in the house of commons, so it was definitely a documentary that focused on the end of her time in power.
I definitely doubt that her reaction was actually meant to be as kind as Mr Parris believes. Pityful maybe, but certainly not compassionate. She uttered - unmistakably - her ruthless and totally antiquated opinion about homosexuality in a conference in 1987. To think that she actually made allowances afterwards or even changed her mind in that matter is more than naive.
monstrouscarbuncle ,,", Honi soit qui mal y pense " sums you up .
Patronizing I would call it. "ooo it must have been so difficult for you, you poor, pitiful creature" ..then walks off discussing any change of policy or general attitude.
***** If you think that's patronizing , you don't know the meaning of the word . And she did not call him a pitiful creature .
***** Saying she preferred paedophiles says a lot more about you, than her .The statement that many MP's are gay is purely wishful thinking on your part no doubt. .How would you know ? Been in the bushes with them ?
And Matthew Parris thinks this was some kind of approval or 'positive vibe' from her, oh dear...........
raw shire ... like the entire channel
Could you give me the names. Scary
But that's what it was like then.
why should she mind half of her cabinet were busy buggering or commiting pedrastry and abuse disgusting evil cabinet she had although she made mistakes i wouldnt class thatcher as evil per se its disturbing when things come out in the open 30 years later i just wonder what horrors are being commited at this very moment which will only surface 30 years from now when the current lot start kicking the bucket
ghazi ibrahim 1984 I can't wait for Blair's 30 year review in 2027
Could you give me the names? Just about summed that lot up back then. What were his plans,_ a mass televised execution?
Blackmail more like.
Interesting.
He is MUCH too kind to Mrs. Thatcher. She was relentlessly anti-gay and passed anti-gay laws during the AIDS crisis that worsened it. Took Labour to undo the damage.
Correct! I've also been surprised by how so many gay men in public life (e.g. LBC radio) are hardcore tories given the parties history. BUt then again, like many of the most malevolent political figures, MT was apparently very kind in person to a lot of the people she worked with. Just like some of the most progressive politicians have been known to personally be twats. Weird innit?
I'm gay and I LOVE Margaret Thatcher.
+FanOfAyn
yea, she was all man ...... the bitch
Typical of Margeret.
Very loving, caring,sympathetic and understanding. If only more Politicians had her sensitivity.....
Her policies? I guess you missed the entire Clause 28 debacle then! Her own statements have shown her to be anti-gay.
The good thing was she didn’t want it thrown on compared to #RSE nowadays
And yet she still introduced Section 28. The woman deserves her vile reputation
If we still have Section 28 there would be no drag queens in schools grooming children. There would be no LGBT indoctrination in schools.
How I do wish to one day see the likes of Alan Duncan, Margot James, and Crispin Blunt at Cabinet...with David Starkey as leader of the Lords.
If UKIP can get into power then we will see a lot of changes in the UK as a whole.
Anthony Hughes David Starkey wouldn't do well in politics because he seems too principled and makes too much sense.
Anthony Hughes Greening leading the way she's lovely
Adrian Fisher No he's rude and has no people skills imo.No historians should be MPs that's cheating, they belong in museums with Dinosaurs! Not dinosaurs in Parliament!
Collette Post He's blunt, to be sure but being an expert on history he can recognise what's been done before and what happened. But, with regards to the apparent central point of your post, I don't care about your feelings because they're highly subjective. I do however care about your rights as they're not subjective and can be objectively listed.
Remember clause 28, an invention of Maggie Thatcher.
Margaret thatcher didn’t invent clause 28. It started in the House of Lords
It was only Tiny influence
Stroked away in the end wasn't she?
Being Gay is difficult.
I am not Gay but I am really not sure about my Boyfriend.......
She always had a way of turning the focus away from herself, back to the person in front of her or about the broader public good
Lots of people are gay, lots and lots, so many gays, it is hard to know who is not gay. There are so many gays. I don't think so.
Black Squirrel Why does that matter?
Lots? Less than 5% of the population ( a loud, whiny
So she basically said nothing nice, and didn't do anything for the gays, she just didn't openly tell her own party member that she will never support him in the way he really deserved. XOXO ;)
That's not true. Thatcher voted to decriminalise homosexuality. Her Swction 28 was concerned with the rise or AiDS and with public libraries having sexualised books.
@@vikramsureswarannaidu7248 bring back clause 28 and expose certain teaching
What does being gay have to do with being an MP? I don't get it.
Margaret Thatcher had a rather clear standpoint on homosexuality, and one could assume she was almost wholeheartedly against it; though this scenario would imply she considered other parts of one's character more important.