History of caste dynamics in Muslims | What’s Your Ism? feat. Professor Khalid Anis Ansari
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- čas přidán 10. 05. 2024
- Caste and untouchability are widely perceived as a Hindu phenomenon - orthodoxically, they are categorised as “illegitimate” in the Muslim community. But the Dalit Muslims facing caste oppression strive for legitimacy. So, what is the complex history and dynamics of castes among Muslims? How is it perceived in the political economy amid scarcity mongering around reservations?
In this two-part episode on What's Your Ism, Sudipto Mondal speaks to Ambedkarite author Shalin Maria Lawrence and sociologist-professor Khalid Anis Ansari about the complexities of anti-caste politics among Christians and Muslims in South Asia.
In part two, Ansari sheds light on the history of Dalit Muslims, religious nationalism, the anti-caste movement in pre-partition India, the caste census, and anti-caste mobilisation within Muslims.
On the Muslim imagination of a sovereign nation, Ansari says, “I think there are also regional histories.” He adds, “The experience of a Kashmiri Gujjar Muslim is very different from the experience of a Shia Muslim or the ones in the Valley. Caste is written all across…There are all kinds of cleavages and contradictions.”
Watch.
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Thanks for this discussion. More power to Sudipto, to explore more isms!
In response to other comments at the time of writing this: if a professor from a reputed university is talking about a problem in a such an analytical way, we got to believe that the problem exists. Being from an UC Hindu family, I was never aware of my own caste, leave alone any caste discourse, for a long time. Our personal anecdotes are not accurate measures of the reality, specially in a sociological context.
There's a clear influence of Hinduism over all other faiths in India. The reason so many people converted to other religions over the last several hundred years, to be treated with respect and equality, still remains a dream.😢
Converts to Islam do not face humiliation and bias from so-called upper caste Muslims, which is still prevalent in Non-Muslim Societies.
Far even today Dalits face racial slur and objection to their entry to the temples. In some cases, the upper caste people replace even the idols, if the Dalits enter the temple as happened in Thenmudiyanur village near Thandarampet in Tiruvannamalai district in Tamilnadu. The upper caste Hindus, installed a new Muthumariyamman idol.
This is what mohammad did he divided people...into momin and kafir...
Islam is curse on humanity it divides
Incredible interview!
The truth has come out by the efforts of such Pasmanda intellectuals like Dr. Khalid Anis Ansari , Ali Anwar , Dr. Ajaj Ahmed , Dr Faiyaz Ahmad Faizy Abdullah Mansoor Wqar Ahmed AIPMM ,Muhktar Ansari ,and Parvez Hanif etc.
Thank you so much for this insightful interview.
Brilliant work!
#power,#politics,#caste good conversation
Thanks!
An enlightening interview that must be heard widely by all interested in furthering the anti-caste discourse in South Asia. Is communal violence always "a strategic violence to erase the question of caste"? Would like to understand how this claim made in the interview applies to the anti-Sikh violence of 1984, or the Gujarat violence of 2002. One saw the 'creation' of a Hindu identity through the deployment of violence in these horrific episodes, but was this violence motivated by the strategic aim of erasing caste? Whilst agreeing that "invisiblizing caste is also casteism" in the above cases of communal violence, was there a casteism at play?
57:51: The exercise of democratising politics so as to allow opportunity to even members of the micro-minority castes has already been initiated by Prakash Ambedkar through his party called Vanchit (deprived) Bahujan (majority) Aghadi (front) : VBA. This has caused tremendous discomfort and antagonism amongst the dominant castes who have had been sharing the spoils of political power since generations confining it within 160 interrelated families. It makes no difference to these 160 families as to which party is in power, be it bjp or congress, they have their tentacles spread in all parties.
Pasmanda Muslims are a new identity that integrates Dalit Muslims (Arzals) and backward-caste Muslims (Ajlafs). The word "Pasmanda" means "left behind" in Persian, and Muslim associations use it to define communities that have been socially and historically oppressed by caste.
In 1945, the Muslim League won 434 out of 496 seats reserved for Muslims in the Constituent Assembly of British India on a policy of creating an independent state of Pakistan. The Muslim League won about 87.5% of Muslim votes.
Here's an interesting fact: The Pasmanda Muslims were in the majority of those asking for the partition of India. Although there were discrimination within the Muslim community, one thing was very clear: they did not want to live with non-Muslims, referred to as 'kafirs.' That was the decisive factor
Bhossari 1945 mein who had the privilege to vote only those who could pay tax pasmanda Kahan sai tax daity thy Dhakkan
46:26: The oppressed castes from hindus converted out to islam and other religion to escape the tyranny of bammanical hegemony but the oppressing castes converts did so only to establish their castes-shops in the adopted religion. That’s why we find castes and casteism in all religions in india be it indigenous or foreign.
Then why is kafir ,momin caste in islam?
Reservations can accordingly be increased to facilitate the inclusion of the backwards/dalits amongst the religions other than hindus and subcategorised on the basis of religion. Restricting reservations to backwards/dalits only from hindus is also communalising reservations and anti constitutional
Great interaction… very insightful… pathetic audio…you guys need a good sound recording setup…
36:44 ; India was never ever a hindu nation. The word hindu was used by the invaders to describe the ppl of india, otherwise for thousands of years indians had only castes identity right from the time when the last buddhist emperor Maurya Brihadrath was treacherously killed by his bamman courtier pushyamitra shung and established caste-based society as encapsulated in manusmriti. But in 1921 when the British decided to conduct the first religion census, the bammans feared that Islam would get the status of being the largest religion of india in the absence of any word which could denote people of all 4 varnas / castes into a homogeneous monolith. The bammans cleverly adopted the word ‘hindu’ to include people of both; the minority 15% oppressor castes (bamman+bania+kshatri) and the majority 85% oppressed castes (obc+sc+st) and thereby succeeded in getting ‘hinduism’ recognised as the major religion of india. Otherwise till then obc+sc+st were never considered as belonging to the same vedic religion as the minority bamman-bania-kshatris.
If you want to see brutal castism you go and see Al barkat education at aligarh.only Syed sk and Khan in management.which constitutes only 15# of total Muslim population.they collect money from 85#populated pasmanda Muslims and hate them to include and to give due share..there must be a change either peacefully or violently.
Converts to Islam do not face humiliation and bias from so-called upper caste Muslims, which is still prevalent in Non-Muslim Societies.
Far even today Dalits face racial slur and objection to their entry to the temples. In some cases, the upper caste people replace even the idols, if the Dalits enter the temple as happened in Thenmudiyanur village near Thandarampet in Tiruvannamalai district in Tamilnadu. The upper caste Hindus, installed a new Muthumariyamman idol.
Bro u r absolutely wrong even Upper caste Muslims use abusive language for lower caste Muslims..Khalid sir is absolutely correct caste is a South Asian phenomenon
Because islam itswlf is a caste group...it divide in two caste kafir and momin...
Where kafir are lower caste and oppressed
Caste system exists in Hindu India only.
I Am Christian ❤️✝️
No Casteism in Christianity
Mr Ansari himself comes from a muslim caste if there is any, most dominant in numbers and representation and calling himself pasmanda if there are any thing like that is utmost hypocrisy
Fekuism=modism=panautism😂😂😂
All syeds are castiest.
Prove maydudi was casteist! To do monkey balancing news laundry is also jumping this low !! Anyone can say anything without any reference it seems and without any counter question, what a joke ! Shameful act ! Where is the balance ?
Reservation only after Ghar Wapsi
there is no untouchables in islam but there r caste muslims in north india who just converted for untouchablity but kept caste system but isn there untouchablity in islam it is big no/// and this we uoroot in five times prayer were it is practically made to stand side by side whilr praying in mosque it is compulsory tfor a muslim to pray 5 times in mosque
Is it restricted to mosque - or does it apply to marriage
@@adityabanerjee7145 islam is a way of life we r made to say God is greater 33 times made to say God is only perfect 33 times all praise belongs to God alone 33 times on all 5 prayers that is 33×5 ..which means Ione dosnt have greatness or perfection or worthy of praise ..per day 5 times trained in islam which will extend to all times ..on all places ...the best of u r the one who fears God..that is the concept..in the Farwell sermon
The Final Sermon:
After praising, and thanking God, the Prophet, may the mercy and blessings of God be upon him, said "O People, lend me an attentive ear, for I know not whether after this year, I shall ever be amongst you again. Therefore, listen to what I am saying to you very carefully and take these words to those who could not be present here today.
O People, just as you regard this month, this day, this city as Sacred, so regard the life and property of every Muslim as a sacred trust. Return the goods entrusted to you to their rightful owners. Hurt no one so that no one may hurt you. Remember that you will indeed meet your Lord, and that He will indeed reckon your deeds. God has forbidden you to take usury (interest), therefore all interest obligation shall henceforth be waived. Your capital, however, is yours to keep. You will neither inflict nor suffer any inequity. God has Judged that there shall be no interest, and that all the interest due to Al-Abbas ibn Abd’el Muttalib shall henceforth be waived...
Beware of Satan, for the safety of your religion. He has lost all hope that he will ever be able to lead you astray in big things, so beware of following him in small things.
O People, it is true that you have certain rights with regard to your women, but they also have rights over you. Remember that you have taken them as your wives only under a trust from God and with His permission. If they abide by your right then to them belongs the right to be fed and clothed in kindness. Do treat your women well and be kind to them for they are your partners and committed helpers. And it is your right that they do not make friends with any one of whom you do not approve, as well as never to be unchaste.
O People, listen to me in earnest, worship God, perform your five daily prayers, fast during the month of Ramadan, and offer Zakat. Perform Hajj if you have the means.
All mankind is from Adam and Eve. An Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab, nor does a non-Arab have any superiority over an Arab; a white has no superiority over a black, nor does a black have any superiority over a white; [none have superiority over another] except by piety and good action. Learn that every Muslim is a brother to every Muslim and that the Muslims constitute one brotherhood. Nothing shall be legitimate to a Muslim which belongs to a fellow Muslim unless it was given freely and willingly. Do not, therefore, do injustice to yourselves.
Remember, one day you will appear before God and answer for your deeds. So beware, do not stray from the path of righteousness after I am gone.
O People, no prophet or apostle will come after me, and no new faith will be born. Reason well, therefore, O people, and understand words which I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the Quran and my example, the Sunnah, and if you follow these you will never go astray.
All those who listen to me shall pass on my words to others and those to others again; and it may be that the last ones understand my words better than those who listen to me directly. Be my witness, O God, that I have conveyed your message to your people."
Thus the beloved Prophet completed his Final Sermon, and upon it, near the summit of Arafat, the revelation came down:
"…This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My Grace upon you, and have chosen Islam for you as your religion…" (Quran 5:3)
Ever read matrimonial page of newspaper?
@@ramraghuwanshi2562 pls b careful while reading i said in islam there is no castevsystem or untouchablity
(49:13) Human beings, We created you all from a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes so that you may know one another. Verily the noblest of you in the sight of Allah is the most God-
@@rmmoheenmoheen8296 then go and try marrying a syeds daughter to halalkhors son
This man don’t understand the difference between ethnicity and caste ! Man ! The moment he tried to link east and west rift with casteism it lost all legitimacy!
IN ISLAM THERE IS NO LOW CAST . WE MADE IT . BUT NOT ISLAM .
Hahaha madarasha chhap ahamadiya or siya 76 firake hai or pakistan me ahamadiya or Siya kya hal use kafir bolta hai
Mughals Emperor Bahadur Shah zafer was banished to Rangoon, his two young kids were denied any kind of education, rest of family killed, lived in poverty and lot of hardship, from bring Ashraf(privileged) to being forced into poverty, what is their caste?
It doesn't work in reality, we all are born equal, but our struggles are different.
In today's world i have seen many lower caste already in higher positions politically, economically and keep writing 'low caste' because they want to continue receiving the benefits. While many others who are not in low or high like many minority people... Are left out. Including high caste Hindus who are forced to live in poverty...
The first census of India was based on caste, religion was problematic, categorisation into majority, minority, tribal, was sinister...
Government should only work for public irrespective of their personal beliefs... This caste/religion favoritism is already burning our cities and distroying lives...
J mondal atleast realised that living with hindus is safe 😊
I am a Muslim and I don’t know what’s my caste , nor anything is written about it in Quran and sunnah ! What the hell is this man talking about ?
Its written in quran that syed r first...
@@ramraghuwanshi2562 evidence pesh karo
Trust me bro se kam nhi chalega
This guy is total liar ! Shameful liar !
What is pasmanda or whatever it is? We're just Muslims. I don't know why under the influence of RSS you're dividing us.
Bhai tu syed ,sheikh,pathan nhi h n tbhi ye bol rha hai 😂
🤣 BJP backed pasmanda don't know difference between discrimination and caste system
Any right wing channel never blame castism honor killings in hinduism
😢 this is bullshit. There is no casteism bro you see Muslim as hindutva see