autistic women: ✨signs & traits✨
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- čas přidán 24. 02. 2024
- This video describes the list commonly seen as "female autistic traits" found in Dr. Devon Price's book called "Unmasking Autism." Before this book, I didn't even know there was a list (previously more referred to around what Asperger's Syndrome might look like in girls and women, with Asperger's Syndrome no longer being a preferred term due to its name sake's history). However, this list is somewhat broad, and doesn't include many additional traits seen in high masking individuals with Autism, and anyone may identify with this list. I believe it's a great starting point to begin diving into the research, lived autistic experiences, etc if you resonate with many of these criteria. I made a vid about 5 months ago with this list, but wanted to update it and reinforce the importance of beginning an autism informed journey if needed or desired.
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When I was a kid in the 90s. In 1991 in 1st grade a guidance counselor decided I needed to be in special Ed. I remember being there a very short time among very disabled kids and I didn't fit there really and mom complained and they put me back in regular. I was always having trouble finishing my little writing assignments as fast and my mom got very angry and yelled a lot and just was so mad I ended up learning to do it at an acceptable speed to keep her from being mad. She stayed onto me about school work and made me study so much I did pretty good. I was picked on so badly. Walked on my tip toes in elementary school. I couldn't make friends. People always laughed at me and I most times I didn't understand what I did wrong. I was called ugliest girl in school by some boys when I was in junior high and just had my self esteem beaten into nothingness. Then in high-school I went through puberty and people started telling me I was beautiful and should model. (I'm 5'11) I made some superficial friends. I didn't know they weren't real friends tho until much later. I never understood game playing, subtext, manipulative tactics until I had to learn the very hard way.
Long story but my point is that guidance counselor knew in the 90s something was off with me but she just didn't know what to call it.
This reads like a mirror…
This was an excellent list.
I would like to add a couple of things.
There is an aspect of "Fawning" where the person pretends everything is fine, sometimes to the point of being oblivious to what is going on around them.(In their own world or appearing to be busy thinking about things)
I suspect many young autistic women have been raped because they were both lagging in emotional maturity and unable to recognize danger in the male companions around them.
Also add to list of music on replay for hours at a time, or watching your "favorite" movies 100's of times, something called comfort reading. One rereads the same series or books over and over sometimes focusing on favorite parts in the story.
Good video👍
🥰🥰🥰🇨🇦
This happen to me😢😢
I can relate to this. I sometimes listen to a song more than 20 times in a row. In my childhood I read a book with nearly 3000 pages several times. It made me feel safe, it was predictable...
I agree. Thank you.
Even after 4 years or so of researching and doing the online tests, this video has cemented it for me as a 60 y.o. So much to say here with my life experience obstacles in relating and advocating for myself, this video is the "knowing" of the internal why I've struggled. wow
Same here at 58. I think I related to all but one of the traits mentioned here. I’m currently getting assessed and it helps to be confirmed in my convictions while going through the process. The ‘what ifs’ sometimes really get to me 😢
I am 51 and coming to the realization that I am most likely on the spectrum of Autism. What you have described is a description of me. I have bitten nails, twirled hair, and have trichotilomania. I have always had behaviors to protect myself against my sensitivity to environmental and emotional issues. In the 70s and 80s it was acceptable for my parents to punish it out of me, which made me withdraw even further. I don't have normal interpersonal relationships, have been married 3 times, and have never achieved professionally what I know I could be capable of. Thanks for this content.
Hi all! This list can apply to anyone (not just women) and while somewhat broad, does tend to be a good place to start your autism learning journey! It should not be used to diagnose, as there are additional required criteria (social communication, repetitive behaviors, etc and other criteria). However, if you are a clinician (like I was) who had never even heard of this list, despite it being referenced as a common female autism traits list - again, I believe this video and Dr. Price's book - are a great place to start, esp if you suspect high masking autism. xo
Do you by any chance have any book suggestions when it comes to women with autism?
I think it's more useful to talk about autism and femininity, autism and women is unnecessarily exclusive
@opalexent But femininity is a social construct. I'm a bisexual woman who is quite masculine in many ways, and parents raised me as a girl. I would not say that I am particularly feminine, though I am a woman and many of this applies to me, for example.
Wow, thank you 🤍
@@nellieshoalsI think you responded to a bot
I remember my parents scolding me a lot for being immature (not that I really was) when I was 12-16 (aka a child), but my brother was allowed to be because he is a boy (he’s 5 years older than me). I was a girl so I should know better. Still irritates me to this day.
and rightfully so!!! The coddling of boys and men is Incredible!!! IMO that's the biggest reason why our patriarchal society is going fast down the drain! - spoiled, coddled men who act toxic not only in their own families but in society at large.
Dr Kim. You’re one of the few people I trust to give clear and concise information that’s trusted. Can you please do a series on codependency?
You ae the reason I now am being evaluaded for Autism with me scoring sky high on every ASD test and every professional telling me they think I am absolutely Autistic. I don't have the diagnose yet, but being evaluaded as a 46 year old women and I have learned more about myself in less than a year than in my whole life.
Congrats
I identified with more than 90% of these traits, as a gay male on the more feminine end of the spectrum. When I mask, I try to appear more straight - but lately it's just been so exhausting, with my voice cracking and me speaking under my breath on a more regular basis. I get the feeling most people see right through me and feel sorry for me that I struggle to be my authentic self in public or any social situations - even around most of my family members.
I'm also a C-PTSD survivor and realize there's a lot of overlap with the autism spectrum, but lately I've just been identifying more with my late ASD-1 diagnosis. I feel like as I get more into adulthood, the proverbial woods seem to get darker - which makes it harder to cry out for help. I've learned to dim my "light" as a means of survival.
I pray for all of those who've been scapegoated most of their lives to be grateful for every moment of respite and refuge you can get. It's getting more rough (and lonely) these days...
Hi- I just wanted you to know you’re not alone and I understand how difficult it can be sometimes- but there are good people and I hope life will show you don’t have to feel lonely- the universe has love for us… deep love and I hope you can feel this in your spirit.
- my heart reaches out to you.
🙂❤
@@SBecktacular Thanks, hon, for sharing light in the way that you do. Even if I do not know you - I won't take it for granted.
✨💚🤗✨
A very helpful video. I have very recently received a diagnosis of ASD (in the UK). I am 44, female. I would advise anyone who suspects they are on the spectrum to seek a diagnosis. It is difficult, but liberating. I was on the waiting list for 2½ years but it was worth it. I can now access services that were previously unavailable and, more importantly, I have answers. Much love to everyone who might read this, you are just perfect the way you are. I wish everyone all the very best ❤ x
I got diagnosed at 47 in the USA. There are not a lot of services but it is still useful to know.
My college friend and I were just talking about this. I sent her your link. Thank you for all you do 💞🙏🏼
I spent years working on trying to fix things about myself that upset other people. And then a kid I related to on every level was diagnosed. I looked into it for myself and now for being an adult and having the diagnosis it makes sense why 3/4 of my life had been teaching and caring for other people with higher support needs on the autism spectrum or brain injuries. I am excellent and translating what upsets those groups because the same things that upset them upset me.
"I spent years working on trying to fix things about myself that upset other people." Oh wow, does that ever hit home!
I watched a lot of videos about female autism because of my child having autism. Your videos are outstanding, calm and precise. I never felt so understood. Especially this one explained me a lot about myself. I felt so bad for nearly never beeing able to meet the expectations of other people. I tried harder and harder, got diagnosis of burnout, depression, ADHD and social anxiety. And half a year ago I finally got my autism diagnosis. I discovered that a big part of my life is just fake and I'm just an actor, fawning and supressing my real self. And now I don't know who I am, have to rediscover myself...
Sounds like soon you could be diagnosed as having fear syndrome. The newest made up buzzword to label you not normal
This really hit home with me. This descibes me to a T. As I approached 40, I made some realizations about myself
As a woman I got diagnosed with autism last year and also was diagnosed with adhd with a retained diagnosis of bipolar 1 disorder. I spent a good portion of my life in the hospital and went through a period catatonic until a couple days ago. Thank u for explaining so well
Thank you, Dr. Kim, for taking time out of your busy day/life to present this topic to us. I'm wondering if my fascination with high masking autism is because I feel like I resonate with the majority of the symptoms 🤔 Thing is, when you get older and look back over your life, this info really helps put so many things in perspective! Too late to change it now, but understanding this helps me make more sense of where I am and where I'm headed. So thank you times 1,000 ❤
All the behavioural things are true for me, and I have aspects from all the others. I was diagnosed autistic in my 40s. It's been incredibly healing, liberating and such a relief - and connected me to a community I relate to more than I thought I could relate to other people 🥰 Anyone who is wondering about themselves I encourage your exploration and you are welcome to connect to community even when you're in the not sure stage - we've been there and we're here for you. 💛
Thought provoking! Thank you Dr Sage🙏
Great video! Thank you, Kim 🫶
At the age of 55 I found out I'm autistic I've masked most of my life I now organise my life to fit I work nights so I don't have to handle too many people all at once I only go where I feel comfortable and life is pretty good now ,my traits were burn out after uncomfortable social interactions,always felt different than other people although looked normal on outside,overthnking as a child hand biting over sensitive prone to being bullied awkwardness
Thank you for sharing your work and your thoughts with us! Your videos are really comforting and helpful.
I really needed your compassion today, I recently spent a few days with a couple of my close friends, who cannot accept my self identification as an autistic woman. I had to defend myself and became very frustrated...
I'm left feeling so unseen, which is a feeling I'm trying to deal with all my life.
Thank you Kim ❤
Hey Doc. Thank you for sharing even with your all struggles 🙏
Thank you Dr Kim. For the most, you identified a lot about my inner world. I've been diagnosed Asbergers for 8 years now, at 42 or something. Accidentally, actually. It's been the best and pretty awful happening to my every day survival... in many ways. Understanding it myself and esp explaining masking in any easy or proper way is so perplexing, wo it seeming as though it's something that I was "sneaky" about, or pretending. Isn't it complicating?! I follow Paige Layle. Very recently, she helped, as did you, to understand it a bit better, and used the term 'mirroring' in addition to the other terms for masking. So often, my inner world is so complicated to process and then to express, that I'm often very unseen.
If okay, I'd like to share her description w you? I'm not certain of the etiquette here. Thank again!
I’ve been looking into autism for the past couple of months trying to understand it and figure if that could be what’s up with me. I feel like there’s something ‘off’ but I can’t help worrying that I may be problematizing things and looking too deeply into it. I suppose that since autism is a spectrum, it’s hard to find your particular niche. There are some things that deeply resonate with me, while others not really. Basically everything you said just hits it for me. I guess one of my biggest struggles accepting that may be it for me though, is that I don’t really relate to hyper or hyposensitivity that the majority of autistic people describe. Not that I don’t have issues with sensory processing, I do, but they are either mild or it takes a lot for me to become completely overwhelmed (a loud room while being tired and upset can trigger an external reaction) and I think I fall into the average range of senses abilities (as opposed to having really good hearing, for example).
Idk! It pains me how much I can relate to while being unable to relate to another bunch of things.
Fabulous video. My son & youngest daughter are on the spectrum but this perfectly describes my oldest daughter too. I believe I'm also autistic and relate to most of the symptoms. Thank you for sharing.❤
The bit I can't relate to is being immature. I was always very mature for my age, very much an overthinker. Didn't have emotional outbursts, just bottled everything up. I had my first nervous breakdown at the age of 17, another at 24 then again at 35. I was severely bullied at school then fell into an abusive marriage then had another disastrous toxic relationship. I'm not a good judge of character but I'm learning. I'm in my 40s now and getting better at coping with life thanks to videos like this which really help ❤
@@thebecbark As a child we often seem very mature as an adult we often seem to be immature.
I think that this is because we don't try to fit in with others of our age as much. So we act a range of ages and what doesn't fit in is noticed. This is not my idea but it makes sense to me.
In my opinion, a lot of these symptoms, like high anxiety, control in order to manage high stress, need for constant stimming etc are just in response to the highly stressful world we live in that was built by neurotypicals and is very non autism friendly. In a more autism friendly environment, like for example a quieter, more renatured or more in tune with nature environment, autistic people would thrive and be calm and functional. This is exactly the reason, why I feel like the dsm never truly gets to the core of what neuro deviances are really about. Or other psychological issues. I disagree with calling them syndromes or illnesses. That's ableist. I identify with audhd by the way
I think that it is abilist not to call autism a disorder. I am on disability. Disability is not a dirty word. Being in nature is calming but I still have executive functioning problems. I still have sensory sensitivities. Being in nature helps but it doesn't cure me. Most people who have autism are disabled. You may not be but you are in the minority.
Thank you for your videos.
These videos are so helpful. Thank you!
I wanted to add as well from my perspective as someone who received a later diagnosis (still a teenager though), but didn't believe it for some time, for me, doing things that were oriented to meeting my needs as an autistic person, a lot of my mental health and daily struggles improved. My sensory issues didn't and won't disappear but I am much better at regulating and meeting me needs now. I gave myself more time for my interests and stopped forcing myself to socialize.
This is great information. Thank you for sharing.
Very helpful! I most likely have it, as well as my mom and my daughter
Thank you soooo much for this.
That end part hits hard
I like others tend to prefer to call the "high masking" autistic traits vs "female autistic traits". For reference I'm a trans woman so was assigned male at birth, yet going through the list I have or had 20 of the 24 traits you listed. Some of the gaps I'm lacking I think could be explained by trauma, and in turn, forcing myself to learn/show particular traits from a very young age as a survival mechanism. I.e. I wouldn't have described myself as "moody" but that was mostly because I was forced to repress extreme emotions (either good or bad) as it usually was not well received by my family or caregivers. The problem with labelling it "female autism" is that it also misses young kids like me who may present as male but don't fit the stereotypical "male" autism.
As a side note, I want to point out how this type of autism can be particularly hard on trans folks to recognize and accept their gender identity. Take the following traits: Ignores or suppresses emotions, unstable sense of self, and is a social chameleon. These all make it difficult to pinpoint our own thoughts and feelings towards our own gender. Acting a certain way when in a certain group, you might feel uneasy with the genre role you're forcing yourself to play for the sake of fitting in, but it's hard to pinpoint the source of that uneasiness, or even what emotion to even call that. Then the following traits: high degrees of anxiety, fears or rejection, and trouble disagreeing with someone else. All these traits make it hard to accept that maybe your gender doesn't align with the one you were assigned at birth. The stress and anxiety of what that will all mean, fears of rejection, uneasiness with disagreeing with others including family/parents when they say what gender they think you should be. It makes it far easier to (harkening back to more traits) ignore and suppress feelings and emotions, ignore physical health, and related to that though not listed (even though I personally think it should) ignore mental health until it becomes impossible to ignore.
I'm a gay cis-male, but still on the more feminine end of the spectrum (emotionally, anyway - and I heavily relate to your experience). Masking as a means of survival is def me - I DO feel like a social chameleon. And I do feel slighted by many of these studies generalizing folks (autistic women), but I understand the umbrella is too broad and extensive to include everyone under the category of women, even if many of us do not personally identify as a woman.
They did a study on autistic girls and boys in elementary school. They gave them brain scans. About 80% of the girls had a somewhat different pattern than the boys. However, about 20% of the boys had the more "female" pattern. And about 20% of the girls had the more "male" pattern.
Almost everything.. and all my life Ive had these problems. Yeah, its "popular" now but Ive been "wrong" since 1982. I have all the problems indicating neurodiversity, but I was asessed and they said I have traits of both adhd and autism but "not enough" and "gave me" bpd instead. ( the powerlessness of having everything I say judged from their perspective in the end makes me into who they say I am, but I have lost myself, see, fulfilment of another symptom..) I see how my life (unusual life with many struggles and losses) and symptoms on a superficial level (if spiced with some judgement..) could give that idea, I do share some struggles of bpd but not that much so its not very helpful at all. I dont know what to do really. I cant get help. I failed at life.
Yeah it's a mess this whole jungle of diagnoses. I read a recent study about inter connectedness of bpd and autism and they found out that almost all of the people tested (mostly female hospitalised with bpd diagnosis) also tested very highly for autism, which kind of leads to the thought that bpd might be how autistic people express attachment wounds of early childhood. Some days, i find it unbearable how clueless modern psychology still is, especially in this field that so many people's happiness and sanity depends on. "Not autistic enough" - for what? For the dsm's random line for when neuro divergence begins and when it ends?
@@mandarinadreux9572 yes I am aware there are so many overlaps and misdiagnosis is common, also that developing any type of PD could be a consequence of neurodiversity in a non supportive environment. Im truly disappointed how my "health" care providers seem to be unaware. No matter my dx, I live my life with the difficulties of neurodiversity and always have, and now also the difficulty of not being listened to and forced to fit a mold of a dx that is a superficial interpretation of me, and a stigma to carry, unfortunately that is still very real, so incredibly unhelpful, well if it did help anyone good for them but I think calling anyones personality a disorder is a damn insult and psychological abuse. Some research also indicate bpd is a neurodiversity rather than a PD. Well. I will just have to find my own way as usual.
also, SO MUCH TRUTH IN THIS ❤
I would be curious to understand more about the relevance of these masking behaviors being subconscious vs conscious, especially if girls are trained at such a young age to mask certain traits of their autism. My question would be: Are these behaviors more valid in an autism evaluation when the person is conscious of them or with things like the rules such as “makes eye contact for this many seconds”, is it possible those types of behaviors by time we reach adulthood are fully subconsciously acted out almost automatically due to girls being trained at such a young age to mask certain behaviors and symptoms, essentially since birth in some ways. I’m not necessarily expecting an answer to this question directly, just wanted to throw this out there! Thanks for the great work you do! ❤
AMAB this resonates to my core I’m 35 now and just barely coming out of burn out. I accept I’m trans and now I know my brain isn’t as unique as I thought if you’re able to describe how I feel
Hi Kim, my daughter was diagnosed with Asperger's when she was 12 years she is now going on for 28 and is being diagnosed with BPD, so it would seem that the coping mechanism has been from being on the spectrum has now lead to BPD what are your thoughts?
Love the Eye Contact by the way. Kim keep up the good work.
We see more when we look within. I was always trying to be better according to their opinions. ❤
facts start @ 5:49-8:45 +9:33
I was labeled as a crybaby until being socially humiliated in 4th or 5th grade. That was when I put on the breaks to attempt to stop crying at various things. In high school, one attention seeking text landed me in forced to go to a therapist; I believe this was 2010. Speed up to in the last year, I've been debating again if I'm an AuDHDer. I've debated with myself about having ASD and/or ADHD for several years on off. Anyways, I was talking to my mom and she says that the therapist from back then said that I had shown signs of Aspergers. Like I did some box filling out and that was the result. I think that I might have been told back then; I'm not fully sure. So currently, I'm debating about do I go get diagnosed? A lot of these signs/traits listed in this video did resonate with me, but some did not or some resonated with me as a kid. But socially at my current state, I'm not sure if the DSM 5 with recognize me as lacking. I'm probably going to compile a binder of sorts pointing to areas that resonate with me, but I don't know if it will be enough. Emotional, Behavioral, and Social ones, I related a lot with. Yes, I had bouts of depression and have some areas of maybe anxiety, but I don't necessarily have the social anxiety. I also do not have rejection sensitive dysphoria though it sounds like that tends to be more often linked or associated with ADHD. Thanks for the video. I ordered the book. "The self imposed rules + unconventional personality" is part of why I was considering ADHD. On one hand, I see myself as being rather chaotic (organized messy/time blindness), but on the other hand, I'm so rigid in doing certain areas of my life the same (same meal 1 for 14 years, same meal 2 for 7 years, same driving routes, same place I almost always put this one thing). Sorry, I got carried away rambling. (oh look, now I've started to say that basically something inside of me is communicating to me it might not be socially appropriate to talk for this long period of time so check in with the others and see if it is alright to continue or assess if they are bored and I shall stop.) But yeah, an area that I like to research Mental Health/Self Improvement.
I had been diagnosed ‘late’ as having Aspergers. There are times when I wonder if the family doctor, Melmed Center, and a psychologist were wrong…..maybe I’m just very ‘high-functioning’? However, I do ‘self-soothe’ by watching the same t.v. shows over and over.
This is pretty vital because it's said that autism is genetic. Thank u.
A bit off topic, though this community is all I've. Today I phoned my mother to tell her I won't go to care for her when she reached age. I cried and grieved the loss. And this marks a new transition for me in my life. Is it normal to feel like an orphan? I feel like I had no parents. 😔
I feel like I never had a mother even though she is alive and well.
@@Catlily5 sorry you've to go through the loss. I hope you can grieve it and find a surrogate family.
@@alexandrugheorghe5610 I spent my teens and twenties looking for mother substitutes. It didn't work well and wasn't healthy. I do have a found family of friends, long term boyfriend and more distantly my siblings.
I hope you can find a surrogate family as well.
This all sounds like me. I said yes to everything, you mentioned. Scary.
Is there an overlap with OCD and autism ?
❤
So many women are suppressed.
Sounds exactly like me.
Im only 9:06 in and i kinda wanna cry cuz so many of these are me
Also, as a child my guardian would constantly insist that I stop what I was doing and say a hail Mary to be more lady like and Mary like...
You might this article interesting
Sounds just like me, and I'm 40 years old. Wow. Tsk..
Wow I resonated with almost everything…
Sigh 😔
🧚🧛💌👩⚕️
Oh yeah!
Born 1974 I was diagnosed ONLY in 2020 (so called LOST Generation)
So I had to find my own solutions and answers...
Before that, there was ALWAYS STRUGGLING, for sure, but I NEVER knew WHAT it was.
BUT I ALWAYS KNEW, I was different (according to the SOCIAL CONSTRUCT of BEHAVIOUR-ISM)
A huge problem is OUR CULTURE, already the idea about how a man SHOULD behave, VS how a WOMAN SHOULD BEHAVE...
But that is a CONSTRUCT.
WHAT IS "NORMAL" ??? That does not actually exist, we are ALL HUMAN INDIVIDUALS.
Thus labeling all those human beings who do not "fit" that generalized idea into categories of "menatal disorders" is SHAMING, GASLIGHITNG, DEHUMANIZING.
It is a LEFT HEMISPHERE PERCEPTION. Putting human BEINGS in CATEGORIES.
(see Dr. Iain McGilchrist THE DIVIDED BRAIN and The MASTER & His Emissary
Brought up in SUCH an environment, OBVIOUSLY women will rather APPEASE, ADAPT, NOT be LOUD, so being shy, or quiet is seen as "womanly" and NOBODY ASKS the RIGHT questions....
Please read Donna William's book on AUTISM & SENSING and Olga Bogdashina's book on
Autism and the Edges of the Known World: Sensitivities, Language and Constructed Reality
It will really shift your whole idea about autism.
IT HELPED ME tremendously to see through ALL That Cultural/Social conditioning we find ourselves in.
why so many people feel proud because they are/think they are autistic? or they are "in the spectrum" or something around those.. It is like a trend. A fashion.
So many making youtube videos like they are professionals.
I think it is a good topic for some video.
Proud? Not usually at first. Usually there is a lot of self hate involved. Pride might be a healthier reaction to the years of self hate.
Some of us are in our 30s, 50s, 60s etc, but sure, we're really concerned about what the latest trend is. Lol.
The behavioural category is once again so stereotyped.
PLEEEASE STOP putting human beings into categories. THERE IS NO ONE SIZE FITS ALL BOX.
WHEN will people understand this??
Categories help us understand our world. It is not good to be too rigid about them though.
@@Catlily5 yes indeed, rigidity is a left hemisphere perception - we need to see a more overall picture
- it all fits together, Alduous Huxley - filtering valve theory with
- what Donna Williams says about the different worlds in the Sensing - the lost instinct book with
- what Dr.Jill Bolte Taylor has experienced in her left hemisphere stroke (as a neuroanatomist researcher!!!) -
- But people ALWAYS chop things up into unrelated things, give it different names, which confuses things more so then all gets so compartmentalized and separated from each other !!! (what the left hemisphere perception does), thus this society fails to see the WHOLE picture in it's entire form anymore!!! (which would be the right hemisphere perception) our society sees things through different lenses and that is basically tunnel vision. Which is real harmful in the end as we see!!!
@@ComingHomeToYourself21 I would agree that the whole picture is being lost. Categories are useful but seeing the whole picture is useful too. And is being missed.
All makes sad and coherent sense to me 🥹😌 (I’ve been diagnosed with ADHD, OCD, GAD, but NEVER once was I questioned about autism) 😑 LOVE your drive to find answers (btw, i can absolutely relate to this trait)