DF64 GEN 2 REVIEW: Flaws Fixed?
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- čas přidán 19. 06. 2024
- The DF64 returns with an all-new Gen 2 update. Does it address the numerous flaws of its predecessor?
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Apologies for chopping up the taste test. If you have any questions about the flavor profile, comparisons etc then drop them here!
Cool that you had numerical scores for the OG DF64, this newer version, as well as the K-Ultra. Curious, though: what score would you give the DF64V with its DLC burrs? :)
@@polbeanz899 I would probably give it a 4.10. It just has a bit more potential for flavor separation than K-Ultra.
@@polbeanz899I had the same question. So the DLC burrs in the DF64V score a bit higher than the stock DF64 Gen 2 burrs and even ever so slightly better than the 1zpresso K Ultra. A little below the SSP but still, not bad at all, that was to be expected. Interesting... 🤔 I wonder how the DLC compare up against the DF83 stock burrs. Both the DF64V and the DF83 seem to be pretty good out of the box.
I got better drip from DF64V. If that's due to the lower RPM, DLC burrs, lack of regrinding, or a combination of all these factors, I'm not sure. Espresso was on par. But with the new cast burrs, installed the DF83 pulls way ahead for filter @@yakofdez4698
I appreciated the numerical scores for the different comparisons, too. On the same scale, how would you rate the Ode Gen 2 burrs?
So, the plasma generator here is an ionizer. It's passing current through air at high enough voltage to dissociate electrons from their atoms in the air, and this effectively works to reduce the static electricity built up grinding coffee.
Another great video! Your editing skills improve all the time and it seems like almost every new video is better than the last. Good job!
Thanks, that's great to hear!
Plasma is the 4th state of matter. I have sent an email to ITER to see if they wanted my used ground coffee for their fusion reactors. The fact this grinder produces espresso coffee and matter for infinite energy machines is really impressive.
5:30: a hint on using the bellows: keep the grinder running while you do this! The occasional “stuck chunk” gets unstuck and ground, getting you closer to 16 in 15 out.
thanks for uploading new video🎶
i enjoyed it😊
I need help! I'm looking for a grinder in the $300-$600 range and i want to start doing pour overs and some vanilla lattes on my espresso machine for my wife. What would you recommend this new grinder or the k ultra?... or anything else? Thank you!
Tilting angle of DF is 15deg as same as Niche Zero. Inspiration!
Looks like i found the perfect time to upgrade from my jx pro. Preordered it
Great move!
What burrs should you get with this grinder to make ot more filter coffee forward?
Great review!
Thanks Aaron!
You also do great videos Aron👍
@@PeterGtze thank you!!
I can't decide between the DF64P and the G-Iota GEN2. Which is the better choice?
Great review! Taste wise, how does this grinder (burrs) compare to a Mazzer Mini or Super Jolly?
I'd say they are a good deal more clarity forward and punchy compared to those. I think it's a good development, especially if you're going to use it for multiple brewing methods.
It would sure be nice if you reviewed the Fellow Ode Gen 2 since it appears to be a completely different grinder from the gen 1.
Where can i find the df64 gen 2 in europe? I am kind of lost trying to find a coffee grinder that is sold under diferent brands. If someone could help please. Thanks!
I’ve been using an AeroPress setup with a Baratza Vario W+, and am considering adding an espresso setup. I had hoped to use that grinder for both, but switching back and forth (and especially adjusting grind size) is a pain. So, I’m in the market for a quality espresso grinder that won’t break the bank. This grinder is on my short list along with Eureka and Niche.
Nice review. So many grinders have come out since I pledged for the Sculptor...any thoughts about DF64 G2 vs. Sculptor 064S? Have you played around with the 064S anymore? :)
Gen 2 and Sculptor are my two budget titans. Both are excellent, but Gen 2 would be better if your main focus is espresso and modding. I installed SSP Cast in 064s and was NOT able to calibrate to an espresso grinding range with them. With Ode and DF64 you should be able to get a workable espresso range with SSP Cast. So that's my main worry when it comes to 064s. However, it does perform wonderfully for drip with the cast burrs at lower RPMs
Thanks very much!
Thanks for the interesting review! If the Gen 2 burrs are a 3.75, how would you rate the Italmill DLC burrs in the DF64V? Any more specific taste differences between Gen 2 and V (acidity, body, sweetness...) with a light roast?
Lower RPMs seem to unlock more clarity for pour over, so would give DF64V a 4.10 for drip. They are not far from the likes of SSP cast. Btw, I don't think DLC is made by Italmill. The geometry is identical to Gen 2 stock burrs.
@@coffeechronicler Yep, it's not made by Italmill. I'm curious if you tried comparing with similar RPMs and how much difference the coating makes. I think coating / burr smoothness / friction coefficient does actually affect the grind quality and taste profile, traditionally people always used to say the coating just affects the longevity of the burr but not the taste, but I think there's enough anecdotal evidence now to basically disprove that!
Hi Asser! Any idea on when will it be releasing? I saw it for pre-order, but the site doesn't tell when the grinder will launch. Thank you for this review!
I have heard it should be September, not certain though.
Nice review. So you dont have to alignment burrs? Have you tried to use SSP? Is it hard to instal new burrs and find "zero"?
Thanks! Alignment is good out of the box. I haven't tested it with SSP burrs yet, but installing them will be very straightforward. Setting the "zero point" is also super easy, since you just reposition the metal dial indicator.
@@coffeechronicler thanks!
hi, you mentioned in your DF64V review that the espresso range is big and there is much room for tuning the grind size, and James hoffmann did mentioned that DF64 Gen 1 has limited espresso range.. so my qn is : for DF64 gen 2, is the issue still the same as Gen 1? how much more better is DF64 V? Lance also mentioned that DF64 Gen 1 motor may not be good enough for some SSP burrs, do you still this as an issue for Gen2 (seems that the motor is the same)
I have been pulling shots and using the DF's with different SSPs and other burrs. Motor power and espresso range have never been an issue, so don't think you should be worried.
Where did you irder your DF64 Gen 2 from?
Hi Asser, thanks for the great content as always. Parallel question re 64mm burrs - I understand you had the V1 SSP brew burrs in your gen 1 DF64. Can you comment on how you find these to dial in for filter? Do you have experience of the V2 MP and if so, do you find them more user friendly? Thanks
Thanks! I have the 58 mm version of V1 Brew Burrs and only V2 in 64 mm. So don't think I can really compare them meaningfully.
@@coffeechronicler Ahh my mistake! So you've only ever used V2 in the DF?
Yes, correct
Is it better than the DF64P for Espressolovers?
Thanks Asser!
Did you test the grounds capacity with the dosing ring installed? Would a 30g dose for pour over make a mess?
You can do 50-60g without making mess. Depending on roast degree, of course...
@@coffeechronicler thank you!
What did you replace the declumper with on the original DF64?
Mine has been causing problems would love a solution! Thanks for the help.
I used a thin plastic screen/sheet with a simple cut out flap, similar to what the DF83 V1 came with. In theory you could make it yourself. There are some videos on CZcams about it DIY declumpers.
Great video :)
seems like the price upgrade to the V is better spend towards SSPs burrs
Thanks for this review! I am sure many peoples have asked this already... but I want to ask again: How does the new version hold up against the timemore sculpture 064s or even 078s? Both espresso and pour over-wise, of course. Any thoughts are appreciated!
I prefer it ever so slightly for both methods. But I can see people who value body and texture go the other way. Haven't tried 078s yet, so can't say anything about that one.
Thanks!
@@coffeechroniclerwould you prefer the 064s or the DF64 Gen 2 if you need to switch between espresso (in the morning for milk drinks) and pour over (for lunchtime/afternoon) once per day?
@@mcsons13 both would be fine for that
I think they all come from the same factory in China, put a different label on it.
been following your website for some time, and now your channel. Totally unrelated, I was trying to figure where you are from from the accent (I though Finland), but turns out you are a Dane. Do you have any specialty coffee or work in any I can visit (living in CPH)?
Thanks for the support! I never worked in a coffee shop, but there are plenty of good ones to visit in Copenhagen.
@@coffeechronicler which are your favorites? I've tried many but still missing la Cabra and april
Hey! What are your thoughts on the DF64 gen 2 with standard burrs vs the Ode gen 2 for filter?
Ode Gen 2 burrs are really good. Definitely quite a bit nicer for filter.
Thank you so much for the review, Asser! This grinder looks very nice. Would you recommend it over the DF64V? Thanks again!
Tricky question! DF64V wins on being silent, more compact, RPM and in my testing slightly better flavors. Might be the same given identical SSPs. In daily use, both work great. Maybe Gen 2 looks a bit nicer and more coherent.
I just got the V and I love how small and quiet it is. As someone with limited space and who hates loud noise, these factors have a bigger everyday quality-of-life impact than a tiny difference in flavor that would only be noticeable side by side, so maybe judge the price difference according to that.
Apparently the DLC burrs in the V create a flavor that easily punches through milk, so if (like me) you like milky drinks that still taste of the coffee you used, it might be the right choice. So maybe flavor "characteristic" is a better description than "better/worse"?
@@S3lvah Thank you so much for all that info, S3vah! Very kind of you. And very useful too, what you just said kind of makes me believe the V is a better option for my needs, since I pretty much always drink milky drinks like lattes or cappuccinos. The only thing that puts me off a little bit from the V is those stalling issues some people reported when the grinder launched, I don't know if that's still a problem with the new batches and the new control board (so many conflicting reports on that). Other than than is looks like the perfect grinder: small, beautiful, quiet, customizable and capable of delicious coffee. Thanks again for your kindness and for sharing with me your experience! I really appreciate it! 👋
@@yakofdez4698 I had 1 stall so far, when trying to grind light roast at grind setting 0 (minimum) at 600 (minimum) RPM. No stalls so far at 600 RPM at setting 45-60. 220V (European) version. I'm personally not worried since most people don't recommend grinding espresso at 600 RPM anyway, more like at 1100 RPM. I mean, worst case you could ignore the sub-1000 RPM range and still have a capable grinder that can do 1000-1800 RPM; better than most stuff at this price.
@@S3lvah Good points! It's smaller than it looks in photos.
How would this compare to the V? I ordered the V two weeks ago and now I’m like god damn lol. It hasn’t shipped from Espresso Outlet yet so I can cancel and get this one. Thoughts ?
No, right and wrong here. In some ways Gen 2 feels a bit more polished design-wise, but with V you get RPM control, less noise, smaller size, and better flavors out of the box.
i hope that u show us the clumps crusher for both grinders
Amazing!
Thanks Fran😊
How does the Gen 2 compare to the V in the epresso and the pour over category? Taste wise bit also ergonomics?
Tastewise, I got slightly better results from V for both drip and espresso, but both are excellent. Not sure what you mean by ergonomics?
@@coffeechronicler Thanks! ergonomics, as how is it like to work with. The noice level is a part of it but also how clean is it etc.
I expected the variable rpm to be more impactful especially on pour over.
According to Turin the Gen 1 (Vers 5) and the Gen 2 (Vers 1) have the same motor and burrs.
V is extremely quiet. Gen 2 might be a fraction cleaner due to the new tech. Both have good UX, but the bellows on V feels more out of place and annoy me a bit, whereas it feels nice and natural on Gen 2 @@atzedevries9563
I've been using the GEN 2 for about two months. The grinder leads to a nice espresso when it is clean. I roast at home, so I use fresh City + roast level coffee and not something that's that has been sitting around for a while. Therein lies the top issue with this grinder. *Retention* Despite all the claims, starting with a 20-gram dose, I seen decreasing grind yields almost immediately. How much retention? 1 or more grams stuck to the inclined walls of the dosing funnel, and much more from the exit chute. I vacuum the top and exit chute every 2 - 3 days. The exit chute needs to be brushed clean each time retention grows to unacceptable levels. In all the hyped-up reviews, not one has commented about this flaw. Oh, and the anti-popcorning disk? Beans can conveniently perch on the flat surface. These are flaws.
Hi, have you tried the zerno z1? How DF64 with SSP burrs compare to it? I was prone to purchase zerno z1, but, now, with DF64 gen 2 I fell a little insecure because DF64 gen 2 with the same SSP burrs is half the price. So do you think the extra money for Zerno worth it?
I haven't received mine yet, but should be coming soon, I think if you got the budget for the Zerno and want quality I say go for it. Not to say the DF64v or DF64 Gen2 is not good quality, it should be an excellent value but I doubt it's up to the same level as the Zerno seems. The auger / pre breaker giving a consistent feed rate to the burrs may have grind quality benefits. I'll be putting it up against the Lagom P64 with the same burrs.
Haven't tried the Zerno. Hard to quantify "worth" it. In terms of flavor, I doubt there'd be $600 worth of improvement, but that is the case with all end-game grinders. The last 1-5 % clarity comes at a higher price point.
@@coffeechronicler Thanks for your thoughts!! In the end I chose DF64 gen 2 with SSP Cast Lab sweet. Zerno would be a dream, but my budget can't afford it right now. I'm building my first espresso setup and the price of the Zerno + SSP is about the price of the DF64 with SSP + my target espresso machine (Profitec go). So for my first setup I'm well served and I think with this setup I'll be able to figure out my espresso preference for the future purchase of the end gaming grinder that gives me that 1-5% clarity improvement.
@@BensCoffeeRants Thanks for your thoughts!! In the end I chose DF64 gen 2 with SSP Cast Lab sweet. Zerno would be a dream, but my budget can't afford it right now. I'm building my first espresso setup and the price of the Zerno + SSP is about the price of the DF64 with SSP + my target espresso machine (Profitec go). So for my first setup I'm well served and I think with this setup I'll be able to figure out my espresso preference for the future purchase of the end gaming grinder that gives me that 1-5% clarity improvement.
@@rafaelrocha8046 Nice, I'm sure you'll be happy with it.
You point to your original DF64 but, I have the original DF64 With the unappealing numeral font and it looks quite different. Perhaps you have there a second generation “original”?
It is the V1, but I modded most parts, including the old numeral sticker with the italics font :)
Great review ! This vs the ode Gen 2?
DF if you want to grind for both espresso and filter. ODE if you want the compact filter grinder and minimalist vibes.
Could you disassemble the grinder to show plasma generator realization?
It's just two wires coming out into the chute. This video shows how it looks. czcams.com/video/C2aGpK_1aQ8/video.html
@@coffeechronicler thank you for the link. I'm going to install ionizer to my 1st gen df64
Long line of weird DF decisions continue with that red button 😂. The rest of it looks much better.
Mine doesn’t have a red button
thanks
Great Video. I am looking for my first grinder and I am not sure if I should take the DF64 gen 1 or the Varia VS3 gen 2? The DF64 gen 2 would also be a great option, but I would have to wait till december for it here in Europe. (Thats the first time i know some european shops ship it). What would you do?
me the same 😂, waht you doing now?
@@Ioannis949 still not sure but I think i wait for the DF64 gen2... seems to be the best machine especially for the discount price till october... What do you think?
@@Jakob_K I previously ordered a Giota Df64 V5. I can't wait until December.
@@Jakob_K But I urgently need a grinder
I'm in the same boat😢
64mm grinders have a huge advantage in that the burr options are much cheaper than 83mm. I would love to see you compare df64 gen2 w/ SSP MP, df64v with DLC and df83v2 with standard Itamill steel burrs as they all start to be in comparable price ranges with those burrs. If df64 + SSP MP tastes as good as df83 + standard burrs, that would be a HUGE advantage in favor of df64 gen2.
True. But I'm using DF83 with Lab Sweet 83 mm and must admit that those perform better than the same burr set in 64 mm. Not sure if it's the same across all geometries though.
@@coffeechroniclerI’m a bit old school (loved my Mazzer Major).. traditional gloopy espresso shots, medium, to medium dark coffee.. such as Klatch Belle, etc. Would the DF 83 with the stock burrs be the choice for me? Espresso use only. Nice Vid. Thanks much.
@@coffeechroniclerHave you done anymore testing with 83mm vs 64mm burrs on the two DF models?
How loud is the Gen 2 while grinding in dB?
It depends on the burrs. SSP MPs and stock burrs are screechy whereas the SSP HU or Cast are not anything out of the ordinary. I don't find it horrible (like Baratza Sette, for instance)
When you decide you gonna buy a grinder then another one pops up 😮
I didn’t know David Duchovny reviews coffee now
Love your Danish accent haha
DF is Dong Feng
Plasma generator can be hacked to produce fuel for your homemade space ship.
3D printing is best for prototyping in my opinion.
Once they add a pre plasma you wont even need to roast the coffee beans first.
talk about an upgrade?
you were still not able to tell what that thing does after all, did ya?
it ionizes the particles that are negatively or positively charged...
Hair dryers have bin using this for at least ten years now.
the funny thing is that this gimmik doesn't prevent big and small partikcles from stick together... because with their charge already being neutral, they are not neutralized by it.
What's the point of this over the df64p?
64p doesn't have the same wide adjustment range for coarser grinding
@@coffeechronicler right. Which would you say is a better option for mainly espresso ? Since the e can do both hopper and single dose for lazy days. I imagine they have similar quality and performance.
@@ShayanGivehchian If you have a foot in the single-doser camp, I'd go for Gen 2. Better burrs and just cool UX upgrades all-around.
@@coffeechronicler aren't both standard Ital mill burrs?
@@ShayanGivehchianDid you watch this video? DF64v and This Gen2 don't have italmill burrs anymore.
I heard that the boss of this company love to play league of legend,but play so badly , always has to press D button and F button (flash and heal)at the same time to escape.So named it DF
its a shame these companies dont take a little bit of time, design right and just drop one model...rather than v2,v3,v4
Yes, it's an annoying development and it seems to spread to more and more brands
Niche took too long to make their 2nd grinder (Niche Duo) and I think they missed out as a result. Chinese companies seem to be able to make revisions and updates pretty quick which is good, but maybe not great if you're an early adopter. Still just because something else comes out doesn't make what you have worse than it was.
@@BensCoffeeRants took them over 2yrs to develop and get to a stage were there's only one version they want to release.🤷
It's not real plasma lolll That's just marketing. I'm guessing it's a very basic static charge eliminator
It's an ion generator. Same thing they used in Air filters that weren't actually healthy because they generated too much ozone or something. I don't think that's really a concern with these tiny ion generators though that are only on for brief periods.
It’s probably just a “arc lighter” or something similar.