Hello Rob, thank you so much for this video. That is exactly what I need to decide wheter or not I want to purchase a SIG 550 series rifle, it helped me greatly and now I know a 551 variant will soon enter my gun safe!
Hi Tom - that’s great news! I was not used to .556x45 and was always pleasantly surprised by the light recoil. I wish you many happy bullseyes 🎯! All the best from Switzerland, Rob
I thought your viewers might find interesting that the trigger guard can swing out of the way for use of the thick winter gloves! Perhaps you could show the internal differences of the trigger groups of the two at some point?
In the US you can own the full auto lower legally. The upper is the serialized portion of the weapon. But to run the weapon in full auto you need a full auto cut upper in addition to the full auto lower. Which is illegal in the US. Although it is not that difficult to modify a semi auto upper so it will operate in full auto with the full auto lower. But, obviously, that is illegal as well.
In Switzerland you can also legally own weapons with select fire (full auto). Here you need to apply for a cantonal ‚exception permit‘ (kantonale Ausnahmenewilligung in German) and this allows you to purchase a weapon with full auto. Such a permit is also required for suppressors. Thanks for viewing and commenting! All the best, Rob
In the Swiss Army people are very conscientious about security; It is difficult to imagine that a weapon was loaded or that it had ammunition with it (except for the pocket ammunition, which is packaged).
Actually, the last sight setting is a 400m zero (thus the white 4), also to be used when aiming at 300m with a six-o'clock hold (front sight touching the bottom edge of the target rather than its middle) - thus the red 3. You'll find the same white 4 and red 3 on a Stgw 57/SIG 510 rear sight, although the two are not the exact same setting there but one or two clicks offset from one another. Of course, if you're using an adjustable iris (or even if you're not), you can zero the red 3/white 4 setting for any hold you like.
Oh, and the weapon is *supposed* to be carried in public by soldiers with the bolt carrier removed, too. That's not always what they actually do, however...
Thank you for this. I am not an experienced rifle shooter (I have more experience with service pistol) and all info is useful. But I have recently joined a new 300m club so am hoping to profit from all the experience around me. All the best, Rob
@@RobWhittlestone You will certainly learn all about "Schwarz 6" (six-o'clock) and "Fleck" (point of aim = point of impact; i.e. the front sight cuts the target in half), then! I hope you have fun!
I live in the Canton of Neuchatel and I love shooting the Fass 90 at 300 meters. I have been using a rifle borrowed at the club, but I'd like to get hold of one to be able and keep my setup. How did you get hold of an army version?
I took training to become a Schützenmeister (Moniteur de tir) (regulated in Tir hors service ). My club's president recommended me for that training. Training is carried out by the army. (Two whole days with several tests.) I also had to participate in Obligatorisch and Feldschiessen (Tir fédéral en campagne) enough times (two times or more in three years) to qualify for the "persönliche Leihwaffe". If you are Swiss then you will be able to have one on loan. You will need to get a Waffenerwerbsschein (WES) as well. The prerequisite is a clean criminal record. As a moniteur de tir you have to help your club maintain safety during the federal events. Regulation 27_016_02_d.pdf (I can only find German) covers the personal loan weapon and the conditions. I hope this was useful. All the best, Rob
I have the US copy of the 551, the Sig 556, which I'm trying to make into an "as-close-as-possible" Swiss Sig 551 clone & was wondering what the barrel twist rate is on the Swiss issue Sig 551. The barrel that came on my US Sig 556 isn't marked, & I don't have the manual, so idk what the twist rate is. I'm guessing it's 1:7 so it can stabilize 5.56mm rounds 55gr & up, but want to be sure. Ty. Just so u know, bought my Sig 556 when they 1st came out & got very lucky cuz it had all Swiss internals (gas block, gas system, bolt/BCG,Trigger group, Safety selector, Bolt catch), & I've since added Swiss handguard, Swiss takedown/pivot pins, Swiss clone rear diopter sight, Swiss pe90 front sight & a Versa-pod bayonet adapter/mount for bipod. I was thinking of swapping out the lower receiver but it just wouldn't make sense since mags cost so much & I already have tons of m16/ar15 mags which the Sig 556 lower was designed to accept. Thanks for any input.
@HermCorps Well I didn't know the answer but looked it up. I read both the German and English language Wikipedia entries and they both agree. The Swiss Stgw 90 has a twist rate ("Drall" in German) of 1 in 10" optimized for Swiss GP90 5.56x45 ammunition. Export models (I guess like yours) have a twist rate of 1 in 7" so they can stabilize heavier NATO ammo like SS109 and tracer. Link to Wikipedia in English en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_SG_550#Features and in German de.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_550#Munition. I hope this was helpful. All the best, Rob
Hi Rob How come that you own a Stgw 90 which still has the Auto fire mode enabled? As you know, our soldiers can purchase their personal gun after finishing their service, but the Government will disable the Auto fire, and rebuild it to Single fire only. So actually, there should be no Stgw 90 with Auto fire in possess of any civilian. (Expect active soldiers, who store their personal gun at home, between their yearly services, of course.) I know that one can buy an Auto fire SIG 550, if he qualifies for an "Exception License" (Ausnahme-Bewilligung). Did you go that route? But still, that wouldn't fit to your statement that you have to regularly take part to the Obligatorisch and the Feldschiessen in order to keep the gun. This does suggest you got yours after you finished your Military service. (Are you Swiss? Your UK English accent, and your name tells at least that you are not a native. :-) ) No offense, but you may be a bit too old to been equipped with a Stgw 90 when you entered active service. I was born 1968, so I still got a Stgw 57 for my soldier's duty. Best regards from Luzern; Andy
Hi Andy - you are right about a lot! I am "new Swiss" ;-) having adopted Swiss nationality 20 years ago. I do not own the Stgw 90 - it's a "Leihwaffe" on loan from the Army. If you become a "Schützenmeister" with training by the Army over two days, AND you have shot at two Obligatorisch and two Feldschiessen in the last three years, you may receive a weapon on loan from the Army. To keep it you must shoot two Obligatorisch and Feldschiessen every three years. You also have to show it cleaned with the cleaning kit once every three years to the responsible department of the LBA. (Army Logistics Support). They check it for faults, correct maintenance, if your cleaning kit needs spare parts, brushes or "Maschinenfett" grease. Then you may keep it on loan for another three years. I hope this was helpful! Beste Grüsse nach Luzern, Rob
Hi Rob Many thanks for your interesting and informative reply! Now I got it. Learned a lot, and like your efforts and engagement. These weapon- and equipment inspections recall a lot of memories from my personal active duty time. :-) Still the same strict rules. Guess they will never change. But that's part of what makes the Swiss character, I guess. Sometimes I hate it, but most of the time I like it and am proud of it. Give me a shout once you are in Luzern, and fancy a chat and beer with another gun nut. Do you know the "Selgis" shooting range in Muotathal? I can be met there quite regularly. Have a great one! Andy
The big difference is the original stgw90 is manufactured around munition with 4000bar gas pressure to shoot. This is only possible with the military guns of the Swiss army, so the Swiss army can use the NATO munitions but the nato not ours. Most nato rifles are designed for 2000 bar use our ammunition the gas pipe is destroyed, which is also the reason that the parts for the gas pipe are different in the civilian version
Hello R. Köppel (Are you the famous journalist?) If you read the Wikipedia article about 5.56x45 NATO and .223 Remington, this appears _not_ to corroborate your statement. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.56%C3%9745mm_NATO#Pressure cites CIP pressure of 430 MPa for NATO and .223 Remington which are the same. The 4000 Bar you cite would be 400MPa. 2000 Bar therefore appears to be much too low for NATO or .223 Remington. Although th GP90 round has been optimised for the Stgw 90, it should still be interoperable with NATO. Note also that they also say you can use 5.56x45 NATO and .223 Remington ammunition in a rifle chambered for 5.56x45 NATO but *only .223 Remington* in one chambered for the civil .223 Remington round. Many thanks for watching and commenting! All the best, Rob
![🥇 SG 550 (Swiss Army Rifle) to 500yds: Practical Accuracy [Stgw 90 - PE 90]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/FL_zcqOFrbI/mqdefault.jpg)
![🥇 SG 550 (Swiss Army Rifle) to 500yds: Practical Accuracy [Stgw 90 - PE 90]](/img/tr.png)
Hello Rob, thank you so much for this video. That is exactly what I need to decide wheter or not I want to purchase a SIG 550 series rifle, it helped me greatly and now I know a 551 variant will soon enter my gun safe!
Hi Tom - that’s great news! I was not used to .556x45 and was always pleasantly surprised by the light recoil. I wish you many happy bullseyes 🎯! All the best from Switzerland, Rob
Great overview, Rob! I am happy to report that these have been returned to non restricted status here in Canada!
The Cosmoline Crate Thanks, Dave! I'm glad they're no longer restricted! All the best, Rob
They weren't even restricted, they were prohibited for a year!
The Cosmoline Crate their going prohib again lol
Very nice explained.
Best regards from a switzerland
Vielen Dank! Alles Gute, Rob in Fricktal
Very interesting video. Thank you for this comparison!
Freundiche Gruesse!
Awesome!
I thought your viewers might find interesting that the trigger guard can swing out of the way for use of the thick winter gloves!
Perhaps you could show the internal differences of the trigger groups of the two at some point?
the welds that run the length of the upper look quite different between the models. Perhaps it is a result of the difference in sheen of the paint.
In the US you can own the full auto lower legally. The upper is the serialized portion of the weapon. But to run the weapon in full auto you need a full auto cut upper in addition to the full auto lower. Which is illegal in the US. Although it is not that difficult to modify a semi auto upper so it will operate in full auto with the full auto lower. But, obviously, that is illegal as well.
In Switzerland you can also legally own weapons with select fire (full auto). Here you need to apply for a cantonal ‚exception permit‘ (kantonale Ausnahmenewilligung in German) and this allows you to purchase a weapon with full auto. Such a permit is also required for suppressors. Thanks for viewing and commenting! All the best, Rob
When you see soldier on the train they should also have pull out the bolt.
In the Swiss Army people are very conscientious about security; It is difficult to imagine that a weapon was loaded or that it had ammunition with it (except for the pocket ammunition, which is packaged).
Actually, the last sight setting is a 400m zero (thus the white 4), also to be used when aiming at 300m with a six-o'clock hold (front sight touching the bottom edge of the target rather than its middle) - thus the red 3. You'll find the same white 4 and red 3 on a Stgw 57/SIG 510 rear sight, although the two are not the exact same setting there but one or two clicks offset from one another.
Of course, if you're using an adjustable iris (or even if you're not), you can zero the red 3/white 4 setting for any hold you like.
Oh, and the weapon is *supposed* to be carried in public by soldiers with the bolt carrier removed, too. That's not always what they actually do, however...
I agree! Now I make a point of looking how the Stgw 90 is being transported.
Thank you for this. I am not an experienced rifle shooter (I have more experience with service pistol) and all info is useful. But I have recently joined a new 300m club so am hoping to profit from all the experience around me. All the best, Rob
@@RobWhittlestone You will certainly learn all about "Schwarz 6" (six-o'clock) and "Fleck" (point of aim = point of impact; i.e. the front sight cuts the target in half), then! I hope you have fun!
the stamping at the magazine well is different, looked like you missed that. why is it stamped different?
I live in the Canton of Neuchatel and I love shooting the Fass 90 at 300 meters. I have been using a rifle borrowed at the club, but I'd like to get hold of one to be able and keep my setup. How did you get hold of an army version?
I took training to become a Schützenmeister (Moniteur de tir) (regulated in Tir hors service ). My club's president recommended me for that training. Training is carried out by the army. (Two whole days with several tests.) I also had to participate in Obligatorisch and Feldschiessen (Tir fédéral en campagne) enough times (two times or more in three years) to qualify for the "persönliche Leihwaffe". If you are Swiss then you will be able to have one on loan. You will need to get a Waffenerwerbsschein (WES) as well. The prerequisite is a clean criminal record.
As a moniteur de tir you have to help your club maintain safety during the federal events.
Regulation 27_016_02_d.pdf (I can only find German) covers the personal loan weapon and the conditions.
I hope this was useful. All the best, Rob
Thanks a lot. I actually realized you had a video where you were explaining the whole process after I posted my comment.
Thanks, Paolo.
I have the US copy of the 551, the Sig 556, which I'm trying to make into an "as-close-as-possible" Swiss Sig 551 clone & was wondering what the barrel twist rate is on the Swiss issue Sig 551. The barrel that came on my US Sig 556 isn't marked, & I don't have the manual, so idk what the twist rate is. I'm guessing it's 1:7 so it can stabilize 5.56mm rounds 55gr & up, but want to be sure. Ty.
Just so u know, bought my Sig 556 when they 1st came out & got very lucky cuz it had all Swiss internals (gas block, gas system, bolt/BCG,Trigger group, Safety selector, Bolt catch), & I've since added Swiss handguard, Swiss takedown/pivot pins, Swiss clone rear diopter sight, Swiss pe90 front sight & a Versa-pod bayonet adapter/mount for bipod. I was thinking of swapping out the lower receiver but it just wouldn't make sense since mags cost so much & I already have tons of m16/ar15 mags which the Sig 556 lower was designed to accept. Thanks for any input.
@HermCorps Well I didn't know the answer but looked it up. I read both the German and English language Wikipedia entries and they both agree. The Swiss Stgw 90 has a twist rate ("Drall" in German) of 1 in 10" optimized for Swiss GP90 5.56x45 ammunition. Export models (I guess like yours) have a twist rate of 1 in 7" so they can stabilize heavier NATO ammo like SS109 and tracer. Link to Wikipedia in English en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_SG_550#Features and in German de.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_550#Munition. I hope this was helpful. All the best, Rob
The SIG 551-1 has a twist of 1:10 the SIG 551-2 1:7
haha i actually have this exact medal you have a picture of on the wall ;)
The army has 20 round mags.
Hi Rob How come that you own a Stgw 90 which still has the Auto fire mode enabled?
As you know, our soldiers can purchase their personal gun after finishing their service, but the Government will disable the Auto fire, and rebuild it to Single fire only.
So actually, there should be no Stgw 90 with Auto fire in possess of any civilian. (Expect active soldiers, who store their personal gun at home, between their yearly services, of course.)
I know that one can buy an Auto fire SIG 550, if he qualifies for an "Exception License" (Ausnahme-Bewilligung). Did you go that route?
But still, that wouldn't fit to your statement that you have to regularly take part to the Obligatorisch and the Feldschiessen in order to keep the gun. This does suggest you got yours after you finished your Military service. (Are you Swiss? Your UK English accent, and your name tells at least that you are not a native. :-) ) No offense, but you may be a bit too old to been equipped with a Stgw 90 when you entered active service. I was born 1968, so I still got a Stgw 57 for my soldier's duty.
Best regards from Luzern; Andy
Hi Andy - you are right about a lot! I am "new Swiss" ;-) having adopted Swiss nationality 20 years ago. I do not own the Stgw 90 - it's a "Leihwaffe" on loan from the Army. If you become a "Schützenmeister" with training by the Army over two days, AND you have shot at two Obligatorisch and two Feldschiessen in the last three years, you may receive a weapon on loan from the Army. To keep it you must shoot two Obligatorisch and Feldschiessen every three years. You also have to show it cleaned with the cleaning kit once every three years to the responsible department of the LBA. (Army Logistics Support). They check it for faults, correct maintenance, if your cleaning kit needs spare parts, brushes or "Maschinenfett" grease. Then you may keep it on loan for another three years.
I hope this was helpful! Beste Grüsse nach Luzern, Rob
Hi Rob Many thanks for your interesting and informative reply! Now I got it. Learned a lot, and like your efforts and engagement. These weapon- and equipment inspections recall a lot of memories from my personal active duty time. :-) Still the same strict rules. Guess they will never change. But that's part of what makes the Swiss character, I guess. Sometimes I hate it, but most of the time I like it and am proud of it. Give me a shout once you are in Luzern, and fancy a chat and beer with another gun nut. Do you know the "Selgis" shooting range in Muotathal? I can be met there quite regularly. Have a great one! Andy
The big difference is the original stgw90 is manufactured around
munition with 4000bar gas pressure to shoot. This is only possible with
the military guns of the Swiss army, so the Swiss army can use the NATO
munitions but the nato not ours. Most nato rifles are designed for 2000
bar use our ammunition the gas pipe is destroyed, which is also the
reason that the parts for the gas pipe are different in the civilian
version
Hello R. Köppel (Are you the famous journalist?)
If you read the Wikipedia article about 5.56x45 NATO and .223 Remington, this appears _not_ to corroborate your statement. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5.56%C3%9745mm_NATO#Pressure cites CIP pressure of 430 MPa for NATO and .223 Remington which are the same.
The 4000 Bar you cite would be 400MPa. 2000 Bar therefore appears to be much too low for NATO or .223 Remington. Although th GP90 round has been optimised for the Stgw 90, it should still be interoperable with NATO.
Note also that they also say you can use 5.56x45 NATO and .223 Remington ammunition in a rifle chambered for 5.56x45 NATO but *only .223 Remington* in one chambered for the civil .223 Remington round.
Many thanks for watching and commenting! All the best, Rob
Koppel is smoking bat shit