The Byronic Hero: Isn’t it Byronic? (Feat. Princess Weekes) | It’s Lit
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Edward Cullen. Han Solo. Killmoklknger. Lestat. What do all these characters have in common besides being heartthrobs? They share a common ancestor: the Byronic Hero. Brooding, sensual, violent, intelligent, and single-minded, the Byronic hero has been a staple in literature dating back to the 19th century, but the archetype is all over film, TV and even video games. I see you Cloud Strife, all sad and angsty with your giant sword.
Hosted by Lindsay Ellis and Princess Weekes, It’s Lit! is a show about our favorite books, genres and why we love to read. It’s Lit has been made possible in part by the National Endowment for the Humanities: Exploring the human endeavor.
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Hosted and Written by: Princess Weekes
Director: David Schulte
Executive Producer: Amanda Fox
Producer: Stephanie Noone
Editors: Derek Borsheim, Sara Roma
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Editorial Producer (PBS): Gabrielle Ewing
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"solitary figure who seeks to live out their life in isolation, but is pulled into society against their will...monstrous or dark appearance yet alluring personalities" ok so like. shrek
Underrated comment.
Somebody once told me
the world was gonna roll me,
I ain't that sharp,
call me Ishmael
Yeah, I mean, he fits the archetype pretty perfectly. He literally has "layers" of tough outside broken inside lmao.
S O M E B O D Y O N C E T O L D M E !
Whoa I forgot about shrek 😱
You managed to talk about the Phantom without directly involving Lindsey. Did you lock her up in the basement?
No silly, in the attic
In the catacombs beneath the opera house, perhaps..
Who do you think added that line ;)
@@LindsayEllisVids 😄
🤣😂
Ah finally, the recognition that Megamind deserves.
Megamind is the best. I adore that movie.
@@lilyme3 Yes!!!!!!
YES! Totally agree. That movie is amazing.
Batman
If Lord Byron was alive today he'd be making problematic statements on Twitter.
Yes! and still there would be fans defending him and he would come up with a vague apologies that paint him as a misunderstood romantic UGH
@@ayanomar1408 All the popular tyrants now see themselves as wronged batmen, yes.
He'd be off in Kurdistan fighting the Turks or something
"On a bloodletting cleanse to rebalance my soul after my soulmate escaped our love room again. Why is life so cruel to men like me?"
God yes!
At first I thought byronic ment "ironically bisexual"
Me too xdd
I am glad i am not the only one
😂😂😂
Byron actually was bisexual.
I mean, it doesn't *not* mean that...
“Leave nice people alone! No means no, Byrons!” is my favorite 2020 reprimand.
When you had the 'Vengeance Boy' and the 'Sad Boy' Venn Diagram, I half expected the overlap to be Batman lol
Batman is a Dystopian Byronic hero. So is whatsisname from The Walking Dead, and Riddick, and numerous others I can't think of right now.
@@marchg4114 The vengeance part historically came into this emo rich kid myth (appropriated down the ages from the Europa/Zeus myth, to Odysseus, etc.) when the European rich kids got disillusioned at their inheritance having become a more democratic and less aristocratic world. Rich kids got into wayy more duels and crime and wanderlust as the nineteenth century wore on. The byrony they popularized stuck around, but yeah maybe in the Batman-type version there's even more of a nihilism to that realization that highclass power isn't respected by the plebs, and that wealth doesn't bring the power it was promised to.
I kept waiting for Jason Todd to pop up lol
@@noorzahra988 yep, both his adopted dad Batman and his second son Jason do fit in the archetype.
Me seeing Robert Pattinson's picture:
😳
Does Princess see the future???
“I’m Losing To A Bird!”
I see you creeping into the script Lindsay...
I expected a Lindsay Ellis reference but I would have thought it would have gone to Eric from Phathom of the Opera.
I thought after she said "Phantom of the Opera" for the third time, Lindsay would appear.
Lemirado Parker Phantom AND Beetlejuice references? I spot a Lindsay Stan.
The real question is whether or not a byronic hero would ask the society that has shunned and scarred them to...
"See how they glitter."
Holy crap, I didn't realize that Ada Lovelace was Lord Byron's daughter. That is one hella influential family.
😃 Yeah, I had NO idea either until yesterday!
It's one reason her mother had her concentrate on mathematics. Mama thought it could keep Byron's passions at bay.
Not many people know Byron spoke with a Scottish accent...
I read her mom was determined to not let her become as self-destructive as her father... and humanity benefited. I think some of her math work was using by Alan Turing during WWII
What amazing historical figures, his lineage really made a ripple
TL;DW: The Byronic Hero is just a formal name for the Edge Lord.
Byron was a *literal* Edge Lord.
The Edge Lord is the Byronic Hero with all the redeeming, interesting qualities stripped away.
"...under the misguided belief that you can change him"
I'm in this picture and I dont like it
That's kinda the point, though. Byronic heros still exist within the milieu of Romanticism, albeit Dark Romanticism. So, they are still susceptible to being conquered and converted by the transports of romantic love.
True love holds out the promise of salvation and redemption to the Byronic hero, and the lack of love damns him to continue to bravely bear up within his own personal inner hell, unless he gloriously succumbs to utter despair.
haha don't worry, it's a group photo and we're all in it
I'd posit that Yennefer of Vengerberg from the Witcher series is another good candidate for a female Byronic hero.
Yes!!!
Oh my god!
Word!
Best part, she doesn't get shamed or punished or painted as tragic, without Geralt and pals there to accept, defend and support her, or they gently point out any of her inhumane powertrip behavior for what it is. The Witcher is especially nice about these types of heroes, bad sides and all.
I came to comment land to say "Maybe Dettlaff...", but you pointed out something waaaaaay cooler.
He doesn't show, when you're already late
But remembers your name, on your very first date
He's tall and dark, rarely in the mood
Yet he's passionate, even when he broods
Oh isn't he Byronic? Doncha think?
You need to do that in proper _ottava rima_:
*Tho' late arrived, she saw he was not there;*
*But, when he came, her name he still repeated;*
*As dark and tall, as she was small and fair,*
*But in his air, a conqueror defeated.*
*He made no answer to her questioning stare,*
*But muttered to himself, as he was seated:*
*"Why think they me a hero so iconic?*
*I'm just a fool: but still I'm called Byronic."*
I thought you were doing alanis morissette ironic but more Byronic
A little too Byronic, yeah I really do think.
Like... Geralt of Rivia in the Witcher on Netflix... Derek Hale in Teen Wolf, the king of brooding and hotness.
EDIT: oh Yennifer is the peak byronic hero, I see it now
omg derek hale 100%. i guess that's why it's so funny to pair him with stiles: stiles can be serious about nothing, and byronic heroes are SRS ABOUT EVERYTHING DO YOU NOT SEE MY ANGSTING PAIN
Ooooh good call on Yennifer
Geralt is a perfect example, in the books nit the crummy series.
doesn't she get punished though? like a lot.
Geralt is stoic, but don't think he's very traditionally Byronic. He's too balanced for that, and has functioning relationships to balanced the dysfunctional ones out. That's the one thing that for me, takes Bruce Wayne out of the Byronic heroes list too. Yennefer on the other hand - yupp, she Byronic to the level I think she taught Byron how to be an edgelord.
I'm loving that she referenced Regina and Catra as female examples. I'd say Emily Thorne/Amanda Clarke in the show 'Revenge' is also a byronic hero?? She's relentless in her pursuit of the people she feels have wronged her family, sacrificing everything in the process. She's consumed by resentment which causes her to be self-destructive and very dangerous.
Since Revenge is openly a modern retelling of The Count of Monte Cristo, this makes sense.
Goddamn Regina though. like if we're talking punishing female Byronic characters, Regina seems to have been the writer's favourite cosmic chewtoy XP
Ah, I finished binging the whole series on Hulu last month!
Anyway, good call!
Emily eventually has her happy ending though she does lose her ability to have children (assuming Victoria hadn't lied).
That’s actually perfect because Revenge was based on the Count of Monte Cristo.
I love catra. So deliciously complicated.
I was prepared to defend Zuko but then I remembered all the times he kidnapped someone.
“I’ll save you from the pirates”-Zuko
“It took my uncle 10 minutes to do my hair”- also Zuko
Zuko is 100% a Byronic (anti)hero
That's true, but Zuko also confronted his past crimes and struggled to make amends for them. For me, that is the reason his redemption arc feels so complete: he has to work for it and live with the consequences, with none of that "I spent a lifetime as a genocidal monster but now I do one nice thing and then die heroically" BS.
@@Oxtocoatl13 Zuko's redemption arc won me over so completely, I was actually annoyed when Katara wouldn't forgive him at first.
My brain: She actually has a really good reason to not forgive him right now...
Me: I know, but...WILL SOMEONE JUST HUG HIM PLEASE???
*Iroh hugs him*
Me: *intense sobbing* YES!
@Hiccups But also he makes mistakes. He tries to do better, fails and feels genuine remorse.
Most characters in media aimed kids are either 100% good, 100% evil or used to be bad but then they do one good thing so that redeems them.
Zuko isn't that at all. It takes him several tries to get people to trust him and his past is never completely ignored. (Even in the comics people are still mistrustful of him and the fire nation...which is understandable!)
Oh! Byronic is ALSO toxic! Kinda goes hand in hand.
I've always thought of Bond as a Mary Sue. The author insert is strong in that one
This needs a thousand more likes.
Consider this: the strongest author self-insert is in Dante's _Divine Comedy_
Including darkness idolization and for bond wish fullfillment (doesn‘t sound like bond creator/s being okay...)
Can totally be both!
Timothy Dalton and Daniel Craig's portrayals are more Byronic.
_Byron is not just an author, but an unprecedented cultural phenomenon. His work not only affects the novel, poetry, and drama, but fashion, social manners, erotic experience, and gender roles._
.
So we're talking about the 18th century's David Bowie.
Lindsey isn’t here but we’re still losing to a bird and getting phantom content and Kylo ren feels
I just realized Kylo Ren is a Frankenstein's monster, created by the body-parts of the Seik, Batman, Sasuke and Snape.
I agree with you with James Bond being Byronic hero and Mega Mind too
I find it so interesting that the Byronic Hero as a genre of character had died down during what could basically be considered the harder decades of the 1900s (think the great depression, various wars, post-war starvation and rationing in much of the world), and then picked up again once things were much rosier (the booming economy of the 80s, social justice movements having made great steps in the 60s and 70s, etc.). I wonder if, with the hard times currently faced by society, the genre will taper away again?
It's a bit like how when mainstream music gets "too happy and poppy," it often snaps back to darker, harder, or edgier places.
No idea if this is actually the case, and I have no background in this!
It does make sense when you see literature, shows and movies as escapism. If your real life is bad you look for happy, fluffy stories. If you are privileged and have nothing to worry about in life, angsty stories are really appealing
I've been re-watching a lot of Todd in the Shadows' reviews while I work (music reviews lend themselves well to just listening instead of actually looking when necessary) and it's interesting to see how pop music has changed over the past decade.
So, kind of like how Batman and Superman sort of take turns in the spotlight?
Huh. I wonder how well that idea would correlate to the time frames you mentioned, especially with the various interpretations of those characters, as both have had different portrayals that correspond to different heroic archetypes, including Classical and Byronic for both.
Thanks for the food for thought!
At least for the more aristocratic type of Byronic hero, it's easier to empathize with that societal ennui when the world isn't burning.
@@TheSongwritingCat Exactly. The romantic pull of a Byronic hero comes from a place in which a person can feel comfortable about, and even intrigued by, the idea of 'dancing with the devil.' That's why a young reader's first adolescent crush is often one of these characters. (For me it was Sydney Carton, and of course Heathcliff.) If you're 12 years old, live in the security of your parents' home, and have no real world experience of pain and heartache, then pain and heartache can seem alluring. That allure is GONE when darkness visits you in the REAL world.
"Behind Blue Eyes" by The Who is absolutely about this kind of character.
What a wonderful essay - thank you so much!
In an interesting twist, Anne Bronte, with her "Tenant of Wildfell Hall", wrote what might be called an anti-Byronic Hero novel.
Omg... isnt there a Hark A Vagrant comik about Anne lol.👁👁
Don’t know how I feel about Zuko being associated to Edward Cullen
Right. Why associate Zuko with him 😭😭😭
Exactly! I saw him in the thumbnail and the only reason I clicked on this was to defend Zuko. He shouldn't be here.
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I can see why he is here but... Zuko is the only one whose character develops out of being Byronic. I like to summarise Byronic characters as "bad boyfriend material. no, you can NOT change him, because he does NOT want to be changed NOR believes himself ABLE to change / does NOT even think he is wrong"
Zuko is a brainwashed, abused and angsty teen. Who learns his world view was wrong and then genuinely chooses to stand up for his morals. After watching this video and learning what a byronic hero is I don't really see how this applies to him, other than he had teenage angst. Comparing him to the other characters in this video is does not do him justice.
I used to be obsessed with Byron and thought I could only find meaning through art. Later I started to fall in love with science and became more intensely interested in Ada Lovelace. Turns out, both are pretty formative, important, and worth pouring your interest into.
1. I love Princess as a host.
2. The shaking of the pictures kind of messes with my motion sickness.
3. This trope reminds me of manic pixie dream girl but opposite sexes.
Oooh, good point ! Byronic heroes are literally (haha) Depressed Vampire Nightmare Boys ! Never noticed that before
depressive demon nightmare boy
the manic pixies are the total inverse of byronic, thats kinda a fun dynamic
Any chance of us getting a video on the humble Himbo?
I need a himbo
video
Not sure there's a very strong literary background for Himbos.
@@eoincampbell1584 - Conan the Barbarian.
Eoin Campbell Thor is and always has been the original himbo
I love these! You (Princess) and Lindsay bring such lovely thoughtfulness and strong book-nerd energy to this channel and I love it. I'm usually familiar with many of the things you discuss, but I always learn a lot from you and it makes me want to learn MORE, read more, write more etc, rather than stay content with the knowledge I have. It's great, thanks.
I would say then, that the ultimate, current, female Byronic hero, is Villanelle from, "Killing Eve."
I wanted to agree but she's not really an angsty character bc she's literally a psychopath (aka no feelings)...but I think Yennifer from the Witcher for sure
@@JGVIllustrations I'd agree regarding the first two seasons but by the second half of season 3 Villanelle is kinda angsty
Emma from Jane Austen is a good example i think
Villanelle is a villain, not a hero. There have been plenty of good examples of female byronic heros posited by other commenters and in the video.
@@Misstressofdons ok 🙂
So - is Scarlett O'Hara the quintessential female Byronic Hero? She seems to fit the bill prefectly, including the manipulative aspect.
she is, and id say the other guy, the clark gable fella could be considered one two. really, gone with the wind owes a lot to wuthering heights
Oh definitely! Primo example.
Funny. I thought the same thing myself. I could not identify with her character at all, partially because a good bit of the tragedy surrounding her life was of her own doing. And, being a bit of an American Civil War historian, there was all the history that Margaret Mitchell decided to either rewrite or ignore that I could not get past. The movie was bad but the book was worse in that regard.
Mitchell acknowledged herself that she grew up so heavily steeped in the mythology of the Glorious Cause that she didn't realize the South had lost the war until she was ten.
But Scarlett and Rhett are definitely the antiheroes, given the heavyhanded message that Good Nice People like Ashley and Melanie aren't equipped to exist in the new world.
Even if you removed the gendered tilt to the words most often used to describe Scarlett, I wouldn't call her a Byronic hero. Byronic heroes tend to be a little moodier and more depressive. She has a different temperament. Scarlett is kind of... always on, where Byronic heroes are prone to sudden fits of temper.
Lord Byron Mad, Bad & Dangerous to Know the original 'Bad Boy' Anti Hero.
There's literally not evidence at all that Caroline said that. Her friend, Lady Morgan, said she did later on, but that's the closest evidence. Nothing but a friend saying so later on in her own life when writing a book about her life, and the most important part was being Caroline's friend during her affair with Byron. It's very unlikely that Caroline said that line.
@@Author.Noelle.Alexandria George Washington never said "I can not tell a lie it was I." But it still is associated with him. Just because Caroline may not have said " Mad, Bad & Dangerous to know" about Byron. Doesn't mean but that phrase isn't associated with him.
Byron was also basically the first pop superstar. And he’s a national hero to the Greeks because he help them fight for freedom from the Ottoman Empire.
I love how despite Lindsay's absence, Phantom is still there.
and "I'm Losing to a Bird!"
"The phantom of the opera is there, inside your mind!"
I will always be depressed that no one ever talks about Secretary (where both characters are arguably Byronic and they both get a happy ending) but talk about 50 Shades of Grey.
This is an exceptionally good point.
And, as I understand it was a much better movie than the 50 Shades ones.. not that I know for sure having only seen Secretary and been emotionally grossed out by it.
YES!!! PREACH!!! Specially with that trash “365” out on Netflix now 🤢 🤮
J So James Spader’s character is actually named Mr. Grey, so 50 Shades completely ripped it off.
@@Sharpe1502 OH wow. I did not remember that! YIKES.. I saw Secretary years ago. I mean, I might be misremembering, but the author of 50 Shades was just a fan fic writer who married a movie producer, right? That would explain a great deal.
His daughter was THE Lovelace.
Mind, blown.
I really look forward to these videos, you always teach me stuff i didnt know i didnt know.
Thx
“And your slightly stacker like tendencies” you nailed that one on the head.
Regina was the best thing about once upon a time and I hated it when her plans didn't work out!! I stopped watching after three seasons but i rooted for her.
Oh absolutely. I gave up on Once, once I realized they'd never give her a happy ending. She was my only reason to keep watching for as many seasons as I did.
me an intellectual: ah, the proto-tsundere
I'd say Han Solo is more of an anti-hero than Byronic; I mean, just anti-hero; not Byronic anti-hero; a lot like Clint Eastwood's character in dollar trilogy.
windyhead 7 I agree and anti-hero might even be too much. He never killed for profit/love/fun, stayed with the hero but talked big but never follow through and does not have a history of being a victim.
I think Han Solo was always a loner who needed to find a purpose in life that is more then acting for himself. His arc in the original trilogy was to stick to his new found friends and to realise he was a part of the galaxy and had to do his part. I dont think he's a byronic nor anti hero cus he doesn't have a tragic backstory, he didn't do anything with malicious intent, the bad things he had done were due to his selfishness and self preservation.
Had they handled his son better Kylo Ben would have been a Bryon.
I'd certainly agree he would count as an anti-hero in Star Wars (that is, he's just not heroic: he's a profit-motivated criminal/mercenary, "not in this for your rebellion", doesn't play well with others, etc.) but as the trilogy continues he grows into a proper Guile Hero.
Never would have thought of him as a Byronic Hero before this video.
@@uzma3758
*"If a man hath no freedom to fight for at home,*
*Let him combat for that of his neighbours;*
*Let him think of the glories of Greece and of Rome,*
*And get knocked on the head for his labours.*
*To do good for mankind is the chivalrous plan,*
*And is almost as nobly requited;*
*So battle for Freedom wherever you can;*
*And, if not shot or hanged, you'll get knighted."*
- Byron
Thank you! This was very helpful in understanding the term “Byronic Hero.”
...And now I have conflicting feelings about the Byronic hero. Great.
I'm pretty sure that's the point of the Byronic hero. Do you love him, or leave him and forever wish you'd been The One? If you stay you know he will hurt you, but will it be worth it?
OMG, is this finally a Princess centered video? #finally
I love this episode, especially the nod to Ada Lovelace's genius and your point that female Byronic heroes exist, but aren't treated the same by their creators and audiences. I appreciate that in this episode, the jiggling portrait of Byron is grounded with a generous stationary background. When the full-screen image jiggles, as it does in some It's Lit episodes, I get vertigo. I bet I'm not the only one.
I was ON BOARD with Catra in She-Ra and her redemption arc. And I was a Catradora fan from season 1!
“Wide Sargasso Sea” by Jean Rhys forever changed how I look at Jane Eyre.
I never really thought of Lord Byron as a highly intelligent man... He had a way with words but not more then his contemporaries. I think it was more of a melding of his reputation and literature that gives him his legacy.... His daughter on the other hand. She was highly intelligent.
ME AT 0:00 - "Almost 15 minutes? That's kind of long for an It's Lit video..."
ME AT 14:48 - "Aww, it's over already?"
This comment is so pure and wholesome
I didn’t know Byron was depicted as a Vampire in that novel. I did know he was the personality behind Vampyre
this lady emmits unrestrained fight me energy and I am living for it
I feel like Edwards low on the scale compared to most the other examples listed lol Also LOVE Catra being included!!
Midnight Sun is out and, oh boy! Being in his head underscores the byronic-ness.
Gargoyles and "Tangled the series" both have good female Byronic heroes Demona, and Cassandra both make bad decisions and keep doubling down on them in an effort to prove they were never wrong
Yep, I knew all of my loves were Byronic, and your shout out to FFVII gave me the courage to comment on Sephiroth having those qualities, too. But for circumstances *staples hand to forehead* I always knew I was writing Byronic heroes, too. I wish I'd found your channel sooner ♥
Anyone else think about “Beauty and the Beast” while watching this?
The Ron Pearlman edition...
@@sarahherbison5419 Oh God stop reminding me of it. I showed it to my fiance. Forgot just HOW bad it is
@@scarletharlot8511 hey, leave my Furry Fabio out of this 🤣
No. As someone who read the actual fairytale, the Beast is not a Byronic hero in the slightest. He gives Beauty space and only sees her for like 5 mins a day, she does whatever she wants and she actually has him accepting her choices, which he does happily. Goddamn, Beast was also the only person in that story who wasn't even classist! His mother disliked commoners marrying royalty and he wasn't having any of this classism. Read the story before making these assumptions.
The animated Disney version is Bell centric. I'm not sure the beast counts as a hero at all, let alone byronic.
Your ability to frame classic literature in modern and accessible ways is such a pleasure to watch!
Huh. I guess that's why I liked Jessica Jones so much. I only enjoyed season 1, but I loved watching her character and wanting more women like her.
I think Louis is more the byronic one of the vampire chronicles.
THIS! I was about to comment this too. Now, if you read the whole vampire chronicles there are times where Lestat leans towards being byronic (aka Imma-dig-myself-a-hole-on-the-ground-bc-I-have-no-purpose phase or Imma-lay-on-the-floor-of-this-convent-bc-the-devil-visited-me-and-nothing-has-meaning-anymore phase), but most of the time Lestat likes being a vampire, I mean he's still creepy and stalkerish but he's usually in a good mood and enjoys living through the changes humanity has made, as opposed to Louis who will always brood because he wanted death and not immortality and doesn't try to keep up with humanity. I'm pretty sure that Louis was conceived as a byronic hero archetype since he was a 19th-century wealthy man from a good family that felt responsible of his brother's death and was roaming the streets of New Orleans in an intoxicated state hoping to be murdered bc he wanted to die but was not going to do it himself. Then Lestat comes along, spoils his hopes of dying a tragic death, and steals the spotlight.
Oh wow! Sorry about the bible of a comment, feel free to ignore me. I didn't even realize that I had so much to say about this
@@MeltedBrains89 I can see that. But Louis also reminds me a lot of the Edith Wharton hero-type.
Mr. Edmund Wilson has described the defects of the typical Wharton hero: “.. the male type which most conspicuously recurs ... is the cultivated, intelligent man who cannot bear to offend social convention, the reformer who gets bribed without knowing it in marrying a rich wife, the family man who falls in love with someone more exciting than his wife but hasn't the courage of his passion .... It is a phenomenon unfamiliar to Europe, this connoisseur whose culture is sterile, this idealist whose impulses are thwarted, this romantic who cannot act his romance ....”
www.utpjournals.press/doi/abs/10.3138/utq.23.4.354?journalCode=utq
@BB80Delta dude... We're talking about a vampire, not your love life.
Megamind and Catra!!! Now those are some relatable examples of byronic heroes lol
Come on! Mention Kylo Ren but no Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader? Look at the man! Hot guy with a lot of issues and obsessions with those he loves becomes scarred from his fall from grace until his new obsession, his son, redeems him!
This is an incredible video! Legitimately giggling at Princess Weekes' amazing way of playing up the ~drama~
I'm so glad you did this video (and such a good job on it).
I've always felt that Byronic heroes done well can be the most fascinating characters in literature.On the flip side, done badly they can destroy a piece of work irredeemably.
Very cool video!
But Hey!
It was at one of Byron’s parties that Mary Shelley wrote Frankenstein - single handedly inventing the genre of science fiction and creating a complex story of TWO Byronic heroes.
Props to Mary Shelley!!!
My favorite Byronic Hero is Kogami Shinya from Psycho-Pass.
Ah Bryonic heroes. Can't decide if I wanna be with one or be one or both.
You want to be/be with someone unlikeable, manipulative, and abusive? I hope you recognize how thoroughly unhealthy that is.
No, I recognise how my struggles with my autism have made me throughly unlikeable to outside world and incidently "mad, bad and dangerous to know." Especially as an under diagnosed female on the spectrum with more of the tendencies of the traditionally male spectrum symptoms. In an odd way looking through Byronic heroes and their fatal flaws I have been able to give my therapists a better format for creating a consequences predictor for me. So yeah I connect to aspects of the trope and the man himself. However, by all means read my statement at it's basest form. Not like we are on a literary analysis channel or something.
Same, as an autistic person I’ve always wanted to become Byronic for some reason. Must be the ‘already on fringes of society’ part
One of the best its lit so far!!
This was a FANTASTIC video! Thank you.
That was a great video. I loved listening to you, Princess!
Gosh I love this, and the It's Lit! Series so much. I'm currently a Classical Studies MA student, and did my BA in C.S too, but I did English Lit at A-Levels and fell in love with Mary Shelley and the whole Byronic lead. I cannot wait to get back into it all and read more come September when my degree is done, and this video really cemented that for me. It's been too long!
I am so happy I found the channel I'm loving everything
The best thing about this channel is the presentor. She really makes the subject comes to life in interesting and indepth way.
am i a weeb if i say "squall is a better example of byronic hero than cloud, at least in the original game"
literally made the same comment lol
It's very true.
You right. And if we wanna talk about the original game, Vincent is WAY more Byronic, but he’s a side character and not the protagonist.
@@kamilee4123 This is an underrated comment! ❤
Or Cecil and Kain from Final Fantasy IV.
I knew you knew what you were talking about when you brought out Mega Mind. Subbed.
Don't forget, Kain Highwind, and Squall Leonhart, as well as Kuja from Final Fantasy, Alucard from Hellsing and Castlevania as great Byronic characters! Great vid! Now I know the term for 'em! ❤❤
Sooooo good. Thank you!
Surely Squall is more of a Byronic-Hero than Cloud? 🤔
Cecil and Kain from Final Fantasy IV and Vincent from FFVII are better examples too.
Fun fact: Bertha Mason's room is *not* in the attic. It's one of several famous misreads of "Jane Eyre", sich as misinterpreting the first line to mean that Jane wants to go out (she doesn't), or that the final line is "Reader, I married him" (nope: the novel ends with Jane writing about St. John Rivers, of all people.)
I cannot say how valuable this video was to a podcast I help write and edit that has been delving into a series of books that include gothic themes. So thank you.
Sooo eye opening! Thank you!
Ah, my least favorite hero archetype! So easily turned into edgelord power fantasies
Some people really get the wrong idea about characters like this. Their selfish narcissism and lack of care does the world at large are flaws, not strengths. The point of the character is that they (hopefully) grow past these. Alternate endings might include dying/disappearing (either through narrator/other characters leaving them, or just running off into the proverbial wood), wholely believing they were right, and serving as a cautionary tale. Or, perhaps burning out in a blaze of glory, Pyrrhic victory sort of thing.
The point is that the character either has to grow, or their bad qualities destroy them. Because, edgelord people do not succeed in real life. They either die out on their own, or are destroyed by crushing loneliness and sorrow that they refuse/can't give up
You just read bad literature
Guts from Berserk is for sure a byronic character but I still love him.
Yeah it's weird he wasnt mentioned. Guts predates Cloud.
Guts is also in a new category, the Struggling Hero.
This was great. Had a good laugh a couple of times. Can't believe I've been missing out on this. Glad you guys joined channels together!
This is brilliant analysis.
Never stop.
Interestingly enough, "Paradise Lost" was a heavy influence on many romantic and gothic writers, and Milton's version of Satan fits a lot of the criteria for a byronic figure--- particularly his charisma, backstory, and ultimately self-destructive tendencies. I wonder if he was another influence on on the archetype itself, or more of a prototype.
I nodded real hard when she mentioned Zuko and Kylo Ren
This was excellent. So much so that I watched it twice consecutively and then went on a quest to familiarize myself with Lord Byron‘s poetry and popularized quotes. I had only previously heard of him as an individual. A mere caricature of who he was. I had no idea of anything beyond one or two scandals. You gave to me a more rounded representation and for that, I’m grateful because it propelled me to do a bit of research and I think his literary works may become a slight obsession.
At least, for the time being...
This was an amazing analysis. Thank you for making sense of our secret love for the Edward Cullens in literature in an intellectual and overall respectful way. I mean, they are our problematic favs no doubt about that. This was awesome to watch!!
Lord Byron also died fighting in the to support the Greek War of Independence.
My favorite professor introducing us to Byron: "Byron, ah yes, the original dark edgy boi."
How does this channel have less than one million subscribers? Every show is a hit! Everything is thoughtfully written and masterfully delivered by the hosts. It's criminal that the 1M subscriber mark hasn't been hit yet.
I subscribed for Dr Z's Monstrum, but will stay for Princess' AMAZING perspective on literature. The pop culture references are excellent. Don't stop being awesome!
I can’t believe I never figured out that Cloud Strife is a Byronic hero in FFVII. I mean, he’s like, *textbook* Byronic.
Also squall
So you mentioned Faith from Buffy tVS (love you for that :)) but missed Angel and Spike, THE dark, brooding and tortured Vampires of the same show :D
Well she did say basically all vampires count as well.
Fricking love this channel
Excellent video; I loved the humor and the explanation behind this trope. I learned a lot and hope to see more of you. Thanks!
Great video! I was excited to see female examples. Never thought of Catra that way but it makes sense.
Ah finally, a recent video on Byronic heroes that includes Kylo Ren that wasn’t done by an explicit Reylo. (I say explicit bc idk if she likes Reylo or not, I’m just here. :p)
I was really intrigued to watch this
i really like your videos , thanks for existing ✨✨
The whole thing about Cloud is that pretty much anything that made him a real Byronic hero was a facade he put up to seem tougher like he actually did become a first class SOLDIER instead of just being in the infantry the entire time and some memory joggling with Zack Fair and whatever Professor Hojo did to him
The “Emo Cloud” thing didn’t come along until later, first appearing in the first Kingdom Hearts game (and he was like some weird combo of both himself and the infamously angsty Vincent Valentine) and was later solidified in Advent Children which a lot of people think happened because Cloud had hella PTSD and wasn’t simply being “emo”
In the first game he was a downright goofball, like one of his first lines is “Let’s mosey”
I think it’s more fair to call Cloud an anti-hero than a specifically Byronic one.
Cecil and Kain from Final Fantasy IV and Vincent from FFVII are better examples.
Ah Yes, all of the fools that will forever occupy my heart and hopefully never my reality. I love them so much. Let's not get into the psychology of exactly why.
This is extremely informative, enlightening and helpful. Thank you 😊
Love your personality and delivery! Great well thought out video.