Do You Need High-End Gearing On An E-Bike? | Expensive Vs Mid-Range
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- Äas pĆidĂĄn 30. 05. 2021
- How important is wide-range gearing on an electric mountain bike? Do you need those easy gears in the same way as you do on a standard-assisted mountain bike and how important is cadence on the motor input? In this video, Steve compares a cutting edge wide-range cassette with a smaller range option.
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I bought a Focus Bold2 11 speed Ebike with a 34 front chainring very simIlar to most other Ebikes. This provides very low gearing that means you rarely use the first four gears and on the pavement you are normally close to or in top gear. I installed a 40 tooth front chainring which significantly improved my gearing and still allows me to climb steep grades off road.
Forgot to add - I run Tanus inserts - brilliant - getting away with 18psi up front and 16 on the back - nice and smooth
Having that gear, even just one, seems like a good idea, simply in case you run out of battery power.
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A 10 speed 10-48 is all you need on an e- bike. Have the old sram 8 speed on one of our bikes (34 front,48 big ring), other than to big of jumps between gears it will do the job up any hill
Well, there are options between a 42T 11S and a 51T AXS :) .....
You can go XT 50T or GX 51T ... or even NX has Eagle sized options.
Sure, you can go AXS or XTR and an X01 Cassette, but an XT 51T will cost your 1/5th
BTW Sam Pilgrim gave you kudos for that slab-climb in his video, about 2 weeks ago. :)
Iâd happily trade away the little rings for a more steady spread of lower ratios. Iâm old enough to remember building cassettes (blocks) from individual rings to suit the riding & rider.
When I ride with friends not having an e-bike, I will often go up hills in Eco Mode to stay together. My boost/trail/eco mode settings on my Levo SL are 30/60/80 for doing longer rides.
If you do roads too i usually go up front to 36 and change cheap narrow range casette. 50euros. Its perfect. With e bike you have always more speed even on rocky climbs. Now i actually use the first gear. Modern canyon gearing is so low that fourth gear is as low as needed. I can push the bike if i need lower.
12 speed is completely unnecessary and entails a weaker 12 speed chain not ideal for emtb. Ideal powertrain for an emtb is 11 speed full steel Deore or Sram GX casette that will have the wide range of about 11 to 50 and the necessary Hyperglide and Powerglide that you need for smooth shifting under power!
Everybody makes their own choice, but personally, I would like to have a 12-speed setup but without 3-4 high gears, so eventually 9 speed. Because 98% of my rides without them anyway. Currently, I have XT but in the future, I will switch to SLX to full stell cassette or possibly even to 10-speed Linkglide. Do you guys use high gears on your bike?
@@vladivanov7645 yep, we use the whole range 11-51 with my buddies, but this is due to also riding what my friend calls emtb hard enduro which is steep uphill đ
@@vladivanov7645 but if you use your bike more as a shuttle bike best drivetrain would mostlikely be a 10 speed 10 or 11-44 or even 36. That would be way less costly and also lighter weight when thinking emtbs and having full steel casettes.
It's not only for the low gears and every low one counts on long rides. Consider front chainrings. I was spinning out my 11 speed Levo on transition roads. So 2 sprokets more in front gives you more range and the super low gears allow you very steep climbs. So for myself I'm considering buying the new GX AXS 12 speed instead of my X1 cable 11 speed and swap to a higher (maybe oval) chainring.
Oval doesnt work on most ebikes where the front chain ring free wheels independently of the pedals.
@@CarkeekW thanks - so no oval. Would like to test them. But bigger chainrings will be on the bike đ
My standard full suspension I run a 1x with a 12 speed with 11 to 52 on the back and a 42 fat thin up front - gets me up most things. My first ebike [current] was coming hard tail with a 10 speed 34 up front and an 11 42 on the back - shimano deore group set. 27.5 rims with 2.8 tyres - I was worried that I wouldnt get the flat out speed. Brose motor mid mount. Mainly use eco and on flat have assistance off. The only slight problem when climbing motorcross assents is in turbo mode if you dont keep your wait forward it will kick you off the back! Truly amazing piece of kit - spin the motor. I now go faster - I wont be changing gearing - its perfect.
I've gone for the Rohloff 14speed, no more derailleur's or cassettes to worry about.
What bike have put it on a hard tail or full suspension bike.
Never seen that on a mtb... I don't think even the lowest gear on the Rohloff would get you up there..
I've ridden that climb on a Kenevo 34t front 11-42 rear. At 11stone soaking wet i get up in 2nd or 3rd and rarely every use the 42t cog.
Yeah I definitely need 11 speed. Itâs has some very steep hills where I live though.
Itâs also a 29er and Iâm just over the 100kgs
70% of my riding 8 spd would be perfect.
However I ride in the south east for the most so when I go to Wales and the elevation is far more I need to use eco as much as possible to grind up the hills that's where having that 12 spd comes into play and not drain the battery as much on the longer trails like W2 or the beast.
I will be sticking with my eagle GX axs for that reason and the fact I have perfect gears all of the time !. I look after my drive chain.. full clean after ever ride and I get loads of miles out of a cassette
I have a cheap Haibike Sduro, and I am new'ish to the E-mtb game. I really love these comparison videos! It gives me a realistic view on the componentrys. I always dream about what life would be like with better components on my bike. My skill level is not that high - And these kind og videos makes me NOT wanna upgrade so much :) Thx EMBN - you guys are the best! by the way - I ride a 9-speed 11-36 shimano :P
HUGE value for the cost
I currently run a 10-45 xt cassette I question running more than the 45 as I just see it spinning for me. As far as cheaper cassette at this point that a no for me but while my cassette isn't as inexpensive as I like to be last time I checked the slx didn't have the up and down ramping like the xt &xtr.
I run a 7 speed with BBS02 mid drive 36 tooth chainring, climbs the majority of hills
I replaced the stock 16T (40T equivalent) front chainring on my Haibike Fullseven with a 14 (35 eq). With the stock 11-46 I can now climb up to 30% grade, I don't need anything more. One thing to bear in mind: short gears allow for lower assistance/longer range and make it easier to ride with non e-bikers.
Interesting point. Do you find any difficulty with top end speed as a result (for example down hill on the road back to the car or whatever)? Also, when you say âshort gearsâ can you explain a bit more, because I thought short gearing was where thereâs only a âshortâ change in the number of teeth between each gear to maintain torque (so I thought âshort gearingâ is about how near each gear on the cassette is to the next, up or down, not the number of teeth on the chain ring nor the number of teeth on the biggest or, indeed, the smallest ring on the cassette). Ta!
@@Coolcmsc I had the same question
Ive changed my cassete on 2020 trek rail from 50 to 42t, at front it has 34t. I dont know where do i ever need 50t... The 42 is just perfect!
Rather have and never use. Never know when you explore and find a 45 degree 300 meter long hill
I just bought a trek rail 9.8 xt and I am changing all components from SLX/XT to XTR because theres a huge difference the 4 piston SLX brakes arent half as good as 2 piston XTR I have on my Bulls Copperhead Also the XTR shifts nearly flawless and the XT shifts like a box of umbrellas falling down a stairwell.
I got 50 to 11 cassette and t44 chainring. 70N motor and I would easily climb it on the top of that hill. The key is do we need 12 speed cassette ? I would prefer it 10 speed with stronger/thicker teeth and thicker more durable chain on it.
The Kenevo has a smaller wheel size doesn't it? That will also have a big effect on the gearing... allowing for a larger chain ring up front to compensate.
What number of gears u reckon is ideal? I have 9 speed rear cassette now and wanna prob change for a new cassette, chain and derailleur... Your thoughts? Why did u go 8 speed, better?
"Who'd climb that hill in eco mode?" he asks, err, me. I do everything in eco mode with my average ride being 70+km and 1300m of climbing I need to.
Glad there some else that doesn't just stick it in boost -turbo ,ride there bike properly.
Yep, you've confirmed my findings. If the going gets tough on an ebike, we've got the option to up the motor power. No need for massive 52 tooth cassettes
Really depends where you live. I'm in the Alps near Chamonix where even offroad tracks can get very steep.
Had a something like a 11-42 on my previous ebike and it got really challenging and sometimes impossible to climb some stuff. Now have a 12S 10-51 with 34T upfront and definitely use the whole range. I'm even considering a 32T upfront
Wrong. On tours with >3â000 hm/day we use 52 tooth casettes
@@saltlake6577 guess it comes down to the type of riding you do. I wonder what percentage of emtb'ers are into touring? I imagine that's not the majority use of these bikes?
â@@nicolasmorey-chaisemartin9795 You are correct. We all have different needs.
I live in an area where I would have to drive 100+ km away to get anything over 100 m height from sea level. So, the climbs are short but sometimes punchy.
I had my 1st cassette (SRAM PG-1230 11-50) for 5685 km before I changed it and examining it I have found that I very rarely use the 11 tooth cog and the 50 tooth one. I probably could do 99% of my riding having a 34 tooth chainring and 12-46 (or 48) cassette.
I have tried a bike with SRAM EX1 and the gaps between gears were just a bit too large (and the whole drivetrain is overpriced). Probably 10 speeds would be my sweet spot.
I think 42 or 46 teeth on the rear cassette is enough. More than that and chain slap and cost are serious factors, hence why most racers are on 8 speed set ups, simple and robust. I can get up pretty much anything that can be done on a bike here in the Lakes on my Turbo Levo. The bike is rideable without power, but the 700 watt battery is such a massive upgrade over the 1st generation, itâs hard to run out.
@3:12 "It actually feels quite simple!" *So the downhill-iest Kenevo was better uphill than the less slack bikes??* Amazing and counterintuitive !!
I have a lappeire over volt 527 with 10 speed and road up skiddaw so you don't need 52 cogs , the only time you need them is when the battery dies.
as long as you can get away with turbo on such steep climbs it doesn't really make that much sense to use a 50/52 teeth cog in the rear. I personally use a 10 speed deore 11-36 cassette on the rear and the only steep climbs I can't do are the technical ones which I couldn't do even with a 52 cog due to the lack of skill.
not to mention that with the rides I do I tend to exchange chains at about 6-700 Km. and we are talking about 10 speed kmc e10 chains. not sure how a 12 speed chain would hold up.
take also in account the fact that the industry pretty much "forbids" simpler transmissions. I was looking at the middle-high end spec e-bikes these days, they all came with 12 speed setups.
One thing *I DESPISE* the most? is people referring to who makes the gears... *THEY DO NOT LINK TO IT IF PEOPLE ARE LOOKING FOR REPLACEMENTS FOR THEIRS!*
What sings is the bird not the cage!
Step 1 you need to more training to you can do whit out any assist i run 11 46 xt casette on my Current XC mtb plenty for most hills round where i live a e bike would be heavy pig to ride here.
Steve has way above average leg strength and climbing skills, so I would not expect gearing to make or break the climb for him. Of course you have to work hard with less assistance from the motor, and of course you have to work harder with a higher "1st gear" ratio. You need to put someone like me on those bikes to see if the difference is make or break!
Way above average leg strength?
I doubt he can squat much
Xo 11 speed would have been a better comparison with a 1151 cassette which is about 90 pounds to replace.
Steve, how steep was that test grade? 10%? It's had to tell from the vid.
Definitely not 10% hahaha
Hi Try and buy components, I had to do 1000 mile on the same chain and cassette, chain snapped yesterday, I missed the chain change time as my. chain checker said .75 change time, I fitted a new chain and it slipped in the high gears,
Sad for you mateâŠ. Time for us all to double down on doing the things that really do reduce wear in a chain set. And thatâs more than just keeping it correctly cleaned. Itâs getting much harder to source for some systems. Interestingly, this smaller cassette is still quite easy to find in a cheap steel version.
Iâm starting to be more careful about changing gear whenever I can. Iâve also acquired a new cassette, chain ring and chain.
I sound obsessive. Iâm not, but I do like riding and I canât if the chain set doesnât work and I canât buy a replacement. This is a problem thatâs going to increasingly affect us all in coming months.
@@Coolcmsc I bought 3 chains, 2 cassettes, chin ring a derailleur and half a dozen tyres back in January for this very reason. Much cheaper and easier to source then too.
@@jamesuk9 Very, very wise. In another forum I got a little bit of negative feedback for making a similar pointâŠ. Weâll see whoâs laughing in August. Enjoy your riding, it might be just be you and I on the trails đ€Ł
would be nice to also make the comparison with a bafang 1500w, 52v mtb. Would be cheaper than the bikes on test and also fit with a budget drive train. In other words, would a more powerful mtb, which might be more hassle to build, but cheaper, do the job as good, or better. There might be the problem that a bafang spec bike of this type, may not be allowed on certain trails. Thanks
You said it yourself. Illegal. Why even bring up the subject ?
PS: 1500w is overkill for any form of "cycling"
If the gears can get you up there then what is the comparison? Only if you couldn't get up there and you needed the extra low gear not available on the other bike would the story actually prove anything..
Kenevo weighs 24 kg at minimum i think. With a 700wh battery even more. Any other experiences?
My 2020 size L turbo Levo comp alloy frame has the 700 watt battery and weighs in at 22.35 Kgs with Carbon SQLab Bars and Maxis Assagai tyres. So even with the bigger battery it is lighter than my first 2018 Levo Comp and with the flip chip set to low feels great. Next mods are the upgrading of the Lyric fork internals with a new Charger 2.1 damper and a 160mm air spring to extend the travel. The 700 watt battery gives it incredible range. Hope this helps.
I donât think itâs a fair comparison if drive trains are being test both subject bikes should be the same either Levo or Kenevo not two dis alike bikes. Also there are other cheaper options if you want to go with lower gear setups. This is all subjective if the grade is super steep youâre gonna use boost and a 10/52 cassette or wish your bike has the setup đ
was that a deer i saw at 2 12 ish
The cost of 12 speed cassettes is outrageous. Whatâs the life of them? Maybe 700-800 miles with a decent engine. Thatâs about 6 months for me. I get the cheapest 12 speed cassette I can and even thatâs over ÂŁ100.
I have 7000 miles on my Eagle GX 12-Speed. And I changed my chain once. Do you know how? Simple. I never ever crunch my gears. I never change gear under pressure. Last thing, I always predict, look around and change to the best gear before I hit uphill so I avoid all those crunching which destroys the cassette.
Maybe is worth to mention that I only use XX1 chain. And overall drive train is XO1. The cassette is also latest Eagle GX 12-Speed. I am happy with the setup and I am sure I will get 10k miles out of it before I need a replacement.
Oh by the way, I donât pamper my bike. I ride hard, I just know how to change gears. Happy riding buddy đ
Do you need? No. It's madness having massive range with super expensive drivetrain equipment on the Ebies. Lower range with durability should be pushed for.
Those were the day that bling and lightweight components for normal maoutain bikes,not for ebikes anymore
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Just an other exuse to show off Specialized bikes if anything.
Varies massively per person. Some will be happy with 10speed 11-48. Others will need 12 speed.
Also depends on how much pocket you have. But if your under 100kg and never run out of battery, and your half fit. You dont need anymore than 10 speed
to be honest anyone whos not a pro and is paying 11-12 hundred for a drivetrain needs to take a look at themselves
I recently purchased a 2. hand Giant full-e+ pro and i have don't nothing but THINK ABOUT GEARING! It comes stock 11x2 and the cassette is 11-40T and to begin with i was most eager to go 11x1 but that would make me have to change rear shifter and maybe also drop-off, so i think i will go 11-46T that is tha maximum i can go with current shifter and drop-off... and then se later on if i delete the front shifter... i might just size up the front chain ring a few teeth to get a higher top speed (the bike is un restricted and can cruise at about 38-40km/h but 45 would be nice to have available...)
E-MTB and high speed is a complete bullshit
Not the best way to lay two very expensive bikes on the ground, bloody paperboy
Totally wrong. More gears, less battery power