Messiaen's 3rd mode, the all-interval tetrachord, and Giant Steps
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- čas přidán 7. 09. 2024
- A brief description/demonstration of some of my harmonic explorations over the last 6-8 months. Inspired by Australian pianist Sean Wayland.
marchannaford.c...
www.seanwayland...
The arpeggios of the 0-1-4-6 chords sound really neat!
wow so this is the tonality of Messiaen's variations for violin and piano! IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW!
Thanks so much! Messiaen and Carter have had significant influence on my approach to harmony as a composer and a jazz saxophonist. This is brilliant!
The all interval tetrachord is ALSO in mode 2
Plus, if you take any transposition of mode 3 and any transposition of mode 2 and find the shared pc set, you get a 6 note promethius scale which is made up of 2 all note tetras mirrored in the middle
b c eb f g a#b
Excellent, I use this mode quite a lot.
outlandish sound... thanks for the insight! Messiaen's modes are full of endless possibilities...
Just found this and shared with my friends. I really love the process here. I'm also fascinated by the all-interval tetrachord and the last minute of this video really scratched an aural itch for me, so thank you!
Marc,thanks for such a nice post
The symmetry is more easily demonstrated starting from the D, F# or A# in that transposition, like: 234 678 te0 (or D-D#-E/F#-G-Ab/A#-B-C). I don't know why Messiaen graphed his modes out in asymmetrical fashion in his Technique Of My Musical Language, but by realigning mode 3 and upwards (mode 4: e012 5678, mode 6: 2456 8te0), one can pluck the chords out in half the time.
I've written a lot of music using MLT3 in projections of fifths (plus Aug and dim fifths). i.e. CGD AbEbBb EBF#. also a giant steps fan! cheers
This is so cool! Thanks for sharing this.
Awesome! Those Giant Steps improvs sound totally wicked at 2x speed...
This results in some very cool sounds. Thanks for sharing. I REALLY like this! Uh oh... I foresee that I will be exiting into this world for a bit. ;)Thanks again!
THANK YOU for Sharing
you should try playing [0,1,3,7] on G as well because the 3rd mode has both all-interval-tetrachords. [0,1,4,6] on D resembles a Dominant 7 flat 5 omitting the 7th and adding a flat 9 and playing [0,1,3,7] on G is a G minor chord with flat 9. These chords can make a V i progression.
Good video. Thank you.
I am definitely going to use that little run at about 3:30 , it sounds pretty great!
Excellent ! Thanks
Really amazing. Thanks!
Has no one in this comment section listened to Alan Holdsworth? he is all over this stuff.
Thanks Marc, I love it.
About Giant Steps, I have 2 questions.
First chord is B7M.
Do you improvise on the Messiaen’s mode starting by B ?
(b, c#, d, eb, f, f#, g, a, a#).
This mode contains the notes of the B7M chord.
Same for the second chord D7.
Mode starting by D ?
(d, e, f, f#, g#, a, bb, c, db)
This mode contains the notes of D7 : d, f#, a, c
Is that correct ?
And second question :
What voicing can we do ? On the video, you only play the bass notes : B, D.....
It would be nice if you, or someone else could answer me because I love this video and am not sure that everything is clear for me. I really need to understand before going on.
Thank you !
François
when you are playing the Messiaen modes over chords diatonic to more consonant scales, you can either play the Messiaen mode 3 from the chord’s root note or play the mode 3 from the root of the associated tonic of the chord. citing your example, on a D7 chord, you could play D mode 3 for the reasons you mentioned, but also G mode 3, because G is the tonic of the associated dominant. this works in major and minor 2-5-1 progressions because of the presence of the major, minor, dominant, and half-diminished seventh chords in the scale. he’s just playing the bass notes so he can leave the sound open for the melody. if you’d like, you can play typical left hand voicings for the changes (i.e. rootless, shell, etc.). hope this helps!
Jesse Olsson Fine
@@jesseolsson1697not seeing how G Mode 3 works over D7 (D F# A C) there’s no C in G Mode 3
I wonder what other tetrachords can be applied. Or what types of mixes of tetra chords and or pentachords can be used. Love this stuff!!
Thank you thank you thank you!!!
Very inspiring stuff, Marc! Have you experimented with the chord scales from Mode 3 yet? This is where Messiaen's modes get interesting for me. An example from Mode 2 is the string of right-hand chords in Premiere Communion de la Vierge, at the bottom of page 78 of Vingt Regards. Mode 3 should make some very interesting chord scales!
Sounds great!
great im friends with sean too and love his theory
🎉😂❤ thanks for this
Awesome will do, thanks man!
Don't understand most of the material, but I like it!
holy shit that sounds soo cooool!
Cool..lovely if speed it up...thanks a lot
HOLY FUCK THIS IS GREAT
hey, can someone explain to me what it means to play over giant steps? thanks :)
albert vandrejer "giant steps" is a jazz standard by John Coltrane. Does that answer your question?
Interesting but out of context for giant steps. these limited transposition scales never resolve and the whole point of Coltranes composition/etude was difficult resolutions and transpositions.
Fine
And he's playing in 5...
Or he's playing in 4 but soloing using the ratio 10:8 😂
Rag ,Trane and O.M .!
Why is it in quintuplets? There's only 4 notes in a 0146 so it won't work!
what is the exact name of pianist you talk about at the beginning? Thank you!
Sean Wayland
OK now play it at tempo. Thanks!
CZcams has the answer to your request: speed up the video at 1.5 and the solo will sound similar to what you ask.