Yaaaay ! Finally someone talking about the Renarin scene in the past ! Everyone talks about the "You cant' take my pain" scene, but the scene with Renarin touched me way more ! He's so precious I love him
Totally agree about the Sanderlanche !! It was too much for me in OB, it threw me off. Same about the pacing issue : I felt like it was both too long and yet somethings were rushed
Yeees I'm not alone in my ranking ahah ! I have one similar to Jade : WoK, RoW/WoR (ex aequo for now but I'll see on re-read, maybe RoW before WoR actually) and OB
I really enjoyed this video. I was always planning to re-read the first 4 books again before the 5th one is published, and now after being reminded of all my favourite scenes I’m looking forward to re-reading them even more. 😊
#1 Shallan defender here. She didn't "backslide", she never resolved the fundamental issues for her character because that's not how mental illness works. Those feelings of inadequacy will ALWAYS be there, it's how she handles them on any given day that will change. The whole point of her character is that she has not once felt a love that didn't end up getting destroyed. She doesn't know love that doesn't end terribly, so she can't conceive of an unconditional love. She'll always be waiting for the other shoe to drop with Adolin. It's not just about whether she's worthy of love, it's about whether or not it's temporary. Her trying to embrace this dark alternate of herself is her attempting though in the worst way, to get the jump on what she believes is inevitable. If she destroys her own relationships, well then there's a reason and purpose for it and it's less frightening to her.
This was recorded a bit before it was uploaded and your comment was left, so I'm not sure what specifically you're referring to from the discussion (it's also possible that point came up when my connection went out). If I'm remembering correctly, I don't think anyone thinks Shallan's feelings should just go away because poof, she's healed!--because absolutely, mental illness isn't a thing that just magically gets better. You see this with Kaladin's depression as well, and I'm like you where I get a bit frustrated when it seems as though people expect him to just "be better" already. I think maybe what you're touching on is when the conversation was about how it seems like in book four, her arc felt as though it wasn't really just about what we see (which is when we started talking about theories for book 5). Anyway, I know and understand Shallan's character! I don't think I disagree with your assessment of her--again, I'm sorry I'm not completely sure what part of the chat you're referencing.
@@ebnovels oh you're all good! I'm just a huge Shallan fan so take my rant with a huge grain of salt. I was mainly speaking about how in book 4, with Formless being a thing and how it seems like there's almost this drive to destroy all the goodwill she's built up to this point, because she's in this constant state of anxiety waiting for it to inevitably end anyway. She believes she's a terrible person, which I think in a way makes it easier for her to do morally questionable things since she already is in that headspace if that makes sense. I've totally seen a lot of the critique of "backsliding" in character development mostly going towards Shallan, but Kaladin goes through just as much the same said backsliding. Part of it I think is misogyny, but I think particularly with Shallan, her tendencies make her more abrasive.
@@dunnejos8423hey, defend away! That’s what makes these conversations so fulfilling and interesting ☺️ While Shallan isn’t my favorite of Sanderson’s characters, I 1) respect so much of what he’s done in writing her, and 2) find it a bit odd how so much of the fandom seems to very quickly lose patience with her. So again, defend away! 😄 It’s nice to see someone passionate about that character and her mental health rather than dismissive of it because Shallan can-like most characters-be annoying sometimes
Technical difficulties on my end will go away after the beginning chunk. Also, Jessie Mae pops in for the second half to chat about Rhythm of War :)
The internet tried to cancel you over your Dalanar opinions 😂
Yaaaay ! Finally someone talking about the Renarin scene in the past ! Everyone talks about the "You cant' take my pain" scene, but the scene with Renarin touched me way more ! He's so precious I love him
Totally agree about the Sanderlanche !! It was too much for me in OB, it threw me off. Same about the pacing issue : I felt like it was both too long and yet somethings were rushed
Yeees I'm not alone in my ranking ahah ! I have one similar to Jade : WoK, RoW/WoR (ex aequo for now but I'll see on re-read, maybe RoW before WoR actually) and OB
I really enjoyed this video. I was always planning to re-read the first 4 books again before the 5th one is published, and now after being reminded of all my favourite scenes I’m looking forward to re-reading them even more. 😊
#1 Shallan defender here. She didn't "backslide", she never resolved the fundamental issues for her character because that's not how mental illness works. Those feelings of inadequacy will ALWAYS be there, it's how she handles them on any given day that will change. The whole point of her character is that she has not once felt a love that didn't end up getting destroyed. She doesn't know love that doesn't end terribly, so she can't conceive of an unconditional love. She'll always be waiting for the other shoe to drop with Adolin. It's not just about whether she's worthy of love, it's about whether or not it's temporary. Her trying to embrace this dark alternate of herself is her attempting though in the worst way, to get the jump on what she believes is inevitable. If she destroys her own relationships, well then there's a reason and purpose for it and it's less frightening to her.
This was recorded a bit before it was uploaded and your comment was left, so I'm not sure what specifically you're referring to from the discussion (it's also possible that point came up when my connection went out). If I'm remembering correctly, I don't think anyone thinks Shallan's feelings should just go away because poof, she's healed!--because absolutely, mental illness isn't a thing that just magically gets better. You see this with Kaladin's depression as well, and I'm like you where I get a bit frustrated when it seems as though people expect him to just "be better" already. I think maybe what you're touching on is when the conversation was about how it seems like in book four, her arc felt as though it wasn't really just about what we see (which is when we started talking about theories for book 5). Anyway, I know and understand Shallan's character! I don't think I disagree with your assessment of her--again, I'm sorry I'm not completely sure what part of the chat you're referencing.
@@ebnovels oh you're all good! I'm just a huge Shallan fan so take my rant with a huge grain of salt. I was mainly speaking about how in book 4, with Formless being a thing and how it seems like there's almost this drive to destroy all the goodwill she's built up to this point, because she's in this constant state of anxiety waiting for it to inevitably end anyway. She believes she's a terrible person, which I think in a way makes it easier for her to do morally questionable things since she already is in that headspace if that makes sense.
I've totally seen a lot of the critique of "backsliding" in character development mostly going towards Shallan, but Kaladin goes through just as much the same said backsliding. Part of it I think is misogyny, but I think particularly with Shallan, her tendencies make her more abrasive.
@@dunnejos8423hey, defend away! That’s what makes these conversations so fulfilling and interesting ☺️ While Shallan isn’t my favorite of Sanderson’s characters, I 1) respect so much of what he’s done in writing her, and 2) find it a bit odd how so much of the fandom seems to very quickly lose patience with her. So again, defend away! 😄 It’s nice to see someone passionate about that character and her mental health rather than dismissive of it because Shallan can-like most characters-be annoying sometimes