There isn't much out there. Rod Langton's 'Signal for Close Action' is excellent but more for the high brow end of the market (detailed and an accurate simulation). The two most playable sets of rules that I have come across are both out of print - the one featured here, Warhammer Historical's 'Trafalgar', and Avalon Hill's 'Wooden Ships and Iron Men' which requires a hexed playing surface but could be adapted.
For 1880-1945 I use Seekrieg V which is the perfect combination of accurate detail and enjoyable gameplay. The work those guys have put into researching all the ships of all the world's major navies is amazing. Don't be put off by the encyclopedic scale of it as the rule mechanism itself can be boiled down to about four sheets of A4. It's the sheer scope of it that occupies the space - and it has carriers, subs, and much, much more.
Have you considered Sails Of Glory? It only comes with 4 ships, so to have a large game you have to buy expansion ships, but the rules are solid, and it plays well.
Awsome game, lovely looking ships, Langton ships are the best looking by far for 1:1200... I play Warhammer Trafalgar quite a bit, as I have half the entire British, French, and Spanish collection that fort at Trafalgar.😎👍
It doesn't take a huge investment to get started, given that you can have an absorbing game with just one ship per side. I enjoy a variety of periods of naval wargaming, but Age of Sail has the added bonus that the models are fun to put together and to paint and look great on the tabletop.
I have a few Sails of Glory ships, but Wouldn't mind getting my hands on some metal ships, and digging into Trafalgar. It was my plan to buy those rules, before the company imploded without warning.
Excellent! I have not seen a naval game with minis on YT before, apart from your Spanish/American game some time back. Hopefully you will do more and maybe show us some of your fleets.
Now you mention it there isn't very much. This period, and the rules, are more visually appealing, but maybe I could persuade Pete to play a simple Seekrieg game in front of camera.
Thank you. Naval wargaming can look attractive to the eye and it is easier to produce a realistic appearance because the sea, unlike the land, tends to be flat at the scales games are played in.
Great to see some Trafalgar action! I've got the rules too, but haven't played the game yet. And beautiful ships and terrain you have there, sir! Most excellent.
I LOVE these models - and have some 80 Langonts myself. Not just big ships, but frigates, Sloops, cutters etc as well.But the difference between yours and mine is the flags and pennants. As the sails show the wind coming from rear, the flags and pennatns should point to the bow, schoulnd't they? ;-))All the very best, enjoy!
This is something I've been wanting to get into for years. I absolutely love this period/theatre, have quite a few books on the subject. Got Trafalgar and a couple of other rule sets but stall at buying the miniatures as they're quite expensive. Yours look great though. I'm going to have to take the....plunge......
Take it, take it!!! The miniatures aren't as expensive as all that when you consider you can have a great game with as little as one ship per side. (And also consider how much firepower the historical counterpart of that ship would have had compared to an entire army on land).
They are 1/1200 scale from Langton Miniatures. Rod Langton won't be at Salute - he rarely attends shows nowadays but I can remember when he did attend Salute. To my mind there is no other range to match and I would recommend that you do not purchase anything that you see at the show. I won't name names but you will mainly find the scale is 1/2400 (and therefore not as easy to rig) and although not immediately apparent the metal will prove to be softer and your masts will wilt. Definitely check out Rod online and purchase from him: www.rodlangton.com/ Having said that, Tumbling Dice did at one time take Langton Miniatures to shows and they will be there, but heed my warning about their own range of 1/2400. Will you be at the paint stand at 1.00pm to meet fellow You Tubers?
Thanks for the info Ralph. Just had a look at Langton, think I'll try one or two of their starter sets but it'll have to be next month - I'll be spent out tomorrow I expect. Also like the sound of their Signal Close Action rules. Looks like I'll be digging out my Alexander Kent books. I should make it to the paint stand so probably see you there.
The mat is from Tiny Wargames, however they no longer manufacture this type of vinyl mat and only produce cloth and rubber backed mats. The islands are from Terrain Mat: www.terrainmat.com/index.html they came with a seascape mat that I purchased from them and I am not sure if you can obtain them separately.
@@RalphAstley Am informed by Richard at Tiny Wargames that he does a lino mat that has that lovely sheen one sees in your video..... is yours the 'Dark Sea' mat, Ralph?
@@darklingeraeld-ridge7946 I think it's just described as 'sea'. There is a 'shallow sea' which is much brighter. Tinywargames have reintroduced the lino mats - for a period they weren't offering them.
I saw a demo at Salute this year. As it parallels the era of their Blackpowder rules I think they are going to call it something like Black Sails - but there may be a conflict there with the TV series of the same name. I'm going to wait before buying it as I regret the expense of Cruel Seas which was very badly proof read and full of errors and now the same thing has happened with SPQR. Warlord will have to pull their socks up for me to invest in any of their new rules from now on.
SPQR starter pack was still a good dollar for mini pack, so unlike many, I regret nothing on that purchase. I am currious about Black Seas, but other non game costs have eaten that budget for a while.
Langton are the way to go: www.rodlangton.com/ Gavin Booth occasionally uploads videos on his work painting these models such as this one here: czcams.com/video/XAZuuB8Cubc/video.html I've found other ranges to be cheaper but often easily damaged and not such a high standard. Hope this helps.
Lovely ships, Navwar do a range of 1200th scale ships as well, which are cheaper then Langton. The flags though should be flowing in the direction of the wind, towards the bow not stern, it looks a bit odd I know but is accurate, although your way looks better.
Thanks Robert. I take your point about the wind direction. A friend of mine purchased some Navwar ships because he was put off by the Langton prices, but the metal is a lot softer and he found the masts tended to wilt.
Agreed Ralph, the Langton models do have the edge in quality, the flag thing was just an observation not a criticism, they do look outstanding and I actually prefer them streaming astern :-)) I tried placing the sails taking wind on the stern beam quarter, which I believe was the most efficient, just angle the mast slightly (wind directly astern was blocked my the sails behind). then you can have the flags streaming at an angle to the bow beam quarter, which looks better then directly to the bow. Thanks for your posts. Robert.
Hi Ian - sorry for the slow response but have been away for the weekend. I am in Plymouth where there is a surprising shortage of naval wargamers for a naval city.
Signal Close Action proved a bit indigestable for me - OK if you want to really immerse yourself in fine detail but not designed for a pick up and play type of game.
Ralph Astley agreed. It seems best played as a team of single ships. Trafalgar does all you want it to with only a few limitations. Very enjoyable! Beautiful scenery, hope to see more.
dont take this wrong, but any flags would be blown in the same direction as wind on the sails ie, wind is blowing the sails forwards, but you have your flags and pennants being blown backwards.. BUT other than that great post
@@RalphAstley i hope my post did not come over as flaming you. and as i said a great post,.. i must admit to not reading all the comments, so was not sure if you were aware, thank you for a great post of the game,, i enjoyed it a lot
@@brianbetteridge8364 Not at all. Sorry if I appeared a bit short - just a bit grumpy today and many people have made the same observation as yourself but not as politely.
@@RalphAstley ah no i didnt take your reply as being ''short''.. i know on the net people take great joy in looking for faults etc that they can point out, just so they can point them out, i simply wondered if it had occurred to yourself. i admit i did not read many of the replies . if i had i would not have repeated the comments, i loved the vid so much so i have just ordered a 3rd rate and frigate so thanks for getting me into naval wargames.. although if i go blind or insane doing rigging i will blame you :-D
@@RalphAstley I do Ships from Star Wars miniatures on my channel. I scratch build alot I even did a Scaled out Immobilizer cruiser but ships like these are new for me. I am very curious on how I would do sails and ropes and keep them small enough so they can still be little game pieces. I love to paint stuff thats super tiny. Just curious on media for the most part. Was thinking foam for the hulls
@@battlefieldcustoms873 Foam seems to me like it would be too soft. If you intend to rig models then the taut lines would pull on the foam and you would have too much slack. I've never heard of anyone scratch building sailing ships but it sounds like you are up for the challenge.
@@RalphAstley I have a good friend who has 3D printed for me and I really enjoy the paint aspect of it. We have the Hull files I am curious to if I am going to just go with my own rule set like I always do haha
I'm afraid they are Warhammer Historical rules and GW pulled the plug on them (just like the Warhammer Ancient Battles rules). The only place you see them for sale nowadays is privately on e-Bay and the price is often prohibitive.
I may be able to do something but not in the immediate future as I have other projects on the go at the moment. I don't think these rules closely follow other Warhammer rules, so don't let that put you off.
Litko released some markers specifically for Warhammer Age of Sail immediately before Warhammer dropped the game - bad timing so I doubt Litko still produce them, but then again they probably sold so few you may be able to obtain them from old stock.
It is no longer available - Games Workshop pulled the plug on Warhammer Historical games many years ago. You may find a copy on eBay but will have to pay a high price for it because of its scarcity value.
They are from Langton Miniatures (www.rodlangton.com). You can also often find them for sale on e-Bay. They are purchased in parts, so masts, hulls, and shrouds are separate, and assembly is required. To rig them is an additional skill required.
The problem being that a description of how the rules work was futile given that they are no longer available and the downloads necessary to play them were on a website that no longer exists. I did think about a run through of the rules but that would have added another ten minutes to the duration and been of interest only to a small proportion of the audience so decided to go with a theme more along the general lines of the fun of Age of Sail wargaming. If you find these rules heavy going what are you comparing them to? I would place them at the accessible end of the spectrum compared to others still commercially available.
The purist in me likes the ship models, but also cringes because the flags and pennants on their masts are not pointing towards the bow of the ship their on. Sailing ships don't go faster than the wind, and the wind is usually behind them, so those flags and pennants never point to the rear of a ship in motion.
Your point has been made many times already. I'm perfectly happy with the flags the way they are. In reality gravity is more likely to cause long heavy pennants to droop in all but the strongest winds and this would not make for an attractive appearance. It also allows for more compact storage of the models. Many oil paintings of the period take artistic license and portray flags and pennants in this way and I do the same. To me the flags are there to allow for identification of the models, which are playing pieces. If I were building models for display purposes I would take more care over how I position flags and pennants.
The ships look amazing. I really need to find a solid naval warfare game to add to the collection.
There isn't much out there. Rod Langton's 'Signal for Close Action' is excellent but more for the high brow end of the market (detailed and an accurate simulation). The two most playable sets of rules that I have come across are both out of print - the one featured here, Warhammer Historical's 'Trafalgar', and Avalon Hill's 'Wooden Ships and Iron Men' which requires a hexed playing surface but could be adapted.
I'd love to find a WW2 one with carriers, subs and warships. This is just going to open up my wallet and put me in the poor house.
For 1880-1945 I use Seekrieg V which is the perfect combination of accurate detail and enjoyable gameplay. The work those guys have put into researching all the ships of all the world's major navies is amazing. Don't be put off by the encyclopedic scale of it as the rule mechanism itself can be boiled down to about four sheets of A4. It's the sheer scope of it that occupies the space - and it has carriers, subs, and much, much more.
Ralph Astley thanks a ton for that info. I might need to add that to my bookcase soon. Then build the table, then the models...
Have you considered Sails Of Glory? It only comes with 4 ships, so to have a large game you have to buy expansion ships, but the rules are solid, and it plays well.
Gorgeous! Lovely ships and islands, a fantastic looking game!
Thanks Phil - I must get back to this period soon, but I have so much else to attend to.
Very thought provoking. Seeing hexagonal dice on the same table for this kind of game was novel.
Thanks Wendell - I like these rules but unfortunately they are no longer published - available on e-Bay occasionally though.
Looks amazing!the ships look beautiful!
Thank you - they are great fun to paint.
Awsome game, lovely looking ships, Langton ships are the best looking by far for 1:1200... I play Warhammer Trafalgar quite a bit, as I have half the entire British, French, and Spanish collection that fort at Trafalgar.😎👍
Thanks. It's a shame that Warhammer stopped supporting these rules as they were particularly good.
Man these look amazing looks so cool , always wanted to get in these
It doesn't take a huge investment to get started, given that you can have an absorbing game with just one ship per side. I enjoy a variety of periods of naval wargaming, but Age of Sail has the added bonus that the models are fun to put together and to paint and look great on the tabletop.
Lovely game, Ralph. I really enjoyed this video. Keep up the great work! -Eric
Thanks Eric - tempted by naval wargaming?
I have a few Sails of Glory ships, but Wouldn't mind getting my hands on some metal ships, and digging into Trafalgar. It was my plan to buy those rules, before the company imploded without warning.
Great looking game Ralph, the mini tall ships are lovely
Thank you. Sorry for the delayed response but have been at Salute and have just got back.
no worries mate, hope you had a great day, look forward to your loot video lol
Excellent! I have not seen a naval game with minis on YT before, apart from your Spanish/American game some time back. Hopefully you will do more and maybe show us some of your fleets.
Now you mention it there isn't very much. This period, and the rules, are more visually appealing, but maybe I could persuade Pete to play a simple Seekrieg game in front of camera.
It LOOKS great - lovely ships, islands, even the sea.
Thank you. Naval wargaming can look attractive to the eye and it is easier to produce a realistic appearance because the sea, unlike the land, tends to be flat at the scales games are played in.
Aye aye, captain.
First time I have seen any sail on a video nice one Ralph . Nice ships as well ! Regards Gav .
Not forgetting your own videos featuring sail of course!
Great to see some Trafalgar action! I've got the rules too, but haven't played the game yet. And beautiful ships and terrain you have there, sir! Most excellent.
Thanks. Such a shame that GW pulled the plug on all their historical games. This one was particularly good.
Very enjoyable game the ships look wonderful 🤗🐻🐉👍
Thanks Karen - I don't often get the ships out but should do so more often.
@@RalphAstley yes another game would go down well👍
I LOVE these models - and have some 80 Langonts myself. Not just big ships, but frigates, Sloops, cutters etc as well.But the difference between yours and mine is the flags and pennants. As the sails show the wind coming from rear, the flags and pennatns should point to the bow, schoulnd't they? ;-))All the very best, enjoy!
Thanks. Yes, you're correct about the pennants but it never looks quite right to me.
Beautiful ships, looks like great fun.
Stig ofthe Dump Agreed, they are quite nice ships.
Thanks. Yes, the rules are just the right balance (for me) of playability and realism.
Very cool :)
Thank you Nick.
This is something I've been wanting to get into for years. I absolutely love this period/theatre, have quite a few books on the subject. Got Trafalgar and a couple of other rule sets but stall at buying the miniatures as they're quite expensive. Yours look great though. I'm going to have to take the....plunge......
Take it, take it!!! The miniatures aren't as expensive as all that when you consider you can have a great game with as little as one ship per side. (And also consider how much firepower the historical counterpart of that ship would have had compared to an entire army on land).
What scale & make are your ships? Going to Salute tomorrow so I might see if there are any about.
They are 1/1200 scale from Langton Miniatures. Rod Langton won't be at Salute - he rarely attends shows nowadays but I can remember when he did attend Salute. To my mind there is no other range to match and I would recommend that you do not purchase anything that you see at the show. I won't name names but you will mainly find the scale is 1/2400 (and therefore not as easy to rig) and although not immediately apparent the metal will prove to be softer and your masts will wilt. Definitely check out Rod online and purchase from him:
www.rodlangton.com/
Having said that, Tumbling Dice did at one time take Langton Miniatures to shows and they will be there, but heed my warning about their own range of 1/2400.
Will you be at the paint stand at 1.00pm to meet fellow You Tubers?
Thanks for the info Ralph. Just had a look at Langton, think I'll try one or two of their starter sets but it'll have to be next month - I'll be spent out tomorrow I expect. Also like the sound of their Signal Close Action rules. Looks like I'll be digging out my Alexander Kent books.
I should make it to the paint stand so probably see you there.
I’m looking into creating my own WWII naval combat where did you get your island and ocean like table top? Inquiring minds want to know
The mat is from Tiny Wargames, however they no longer manufacture this type of vinyl mat and only produce cloth and rubber backed mats. The islands are from Terrain Mat:
www.terrainmat.com/index.html
they came with a seascape mat that I purchased from them and I am not sure if you can obtain them separately.
@@RalphAstley Am informed by Richard at Tiny Wargames that he does a lino mat that has that lovely sheen one sees in your video..... is yours the 'Dark Sea' mat, Ralph?
@@darklingeraeld-ridge7946 I think it's just described as 'sea'. There is a 'shallow sea' which is much brighter. Tinywargames have reintroduced the lino mats - for a period they weren't offering them.
There is a game coming from Warlord games about this period, I think is called Black Seas. This is a great period to play. Nice game Sir. Cheers
I saw a demo at Salute this year. As it parallels the era of their Blackpowder rules I think they are going to call it something like Black Sails - but there may be a conflict there with the TV series of the same name. I'm going to wait before buying it as I regret the expense of Cruel Seas which was very badly proof read and full of errors and now the same thing has happened with SPQR. Warlord will have to pull their socks up for me to invest in any of their new rules from now on.
SPQR starter pack was still a good dollar for mini pack, so unlike many, I regret nothing on that purchase. I am currious about Black Seas, but other non game costs have eaten that budget for a while.
Great looking models!!!! Can you recommend some miniature ship manufacturers?
Langton are the way to go:
www.rodlangton.com/
Gavin Booth occasionally uploads videos on his work painting these models such as this one here:
czcams.com/video/XAZuuB8Cubc/video.html
I've found other ranges to be cheaper but often easily damaged and not such a high standard. Hope this helps.
Lovely ships, Navwar do a range of 1200th scale ships as well, which are cheaper then Langton.
The flags though should be flowing in the direction of the wind, towards the bow not stern, it looks a bit odd I know but is accurate, although your way looks better.
Thanks Robert. I take your point about the wind direction. A friend of mine purchased some Navwar ships because he was put off by the Langton prices, but the metal is a lot softer and he found the masts tended to wilt.
Agreed Ralph, the Langton models do have the edge in quality, the flag thing was just an observation not a criticism, they do look outstanding and I actually prefer them streaming astern :-))
I tried placing the sails taking wind on the stern beam quarter, which I believe was the most efficient, just angle the mast slightly (wind directly astern was blocked my the sails behind). then you can have the flags streaming at an angle to the bow beam quarter, which looks better then directly to the bow.
Thanks for your posts.
Robert.
Looks amazing and a ton of fun
Thanks - yes, great fun.
Great stuff mate.
Thanks - we had fun.
It was a very enjoyable game :)
Yes, great fun. Your conversion into a naval wargamer has begun!
Is there anything else from the British and Spanish Fleets?
No plans at the moment as I am concentrating on other games.
Great looking game and miniatures Ralph! Where abouts are you in the UK?
Hi Ian - sorry for the slow response but have been away for the weekend. I am in Plymouth where there is a surprising shortage of naval wargamers for a naval city.
Ralph Astley, no worries about the length of time to reply lol. Just got my Trafalgar miniatures out of storage because of this video 🙂
Are those 1/600 or 1/1200 ships? They are so well painted!
1/1200 from Langton Miniatures. Thank you.
what a great report. lovely models and lovely scenery. where did you get your mat?
Thanks Craig. The mat is from Tiny Terrain and there is a review of it under my 'Reviews' playlist.
Love this game. Wish I had the courage to try "Signal Close Action".
Signal Close Action proved a bit indigestable for me - OK if you want to really immerse yourself in fine detail but not designed for a pick up and play type of game.
Ralph Astley agreed. It seems best played as a team of single ships. Trafalgar does all you want it to with only a few limitations. Very enjoyable! Beautiful scenery, hope to see more.
dont take this wrong, but any flags would be blown in the same direction as wind on the sails ie, wind is blowing the sails forwards, but you have your flags and pennants being blown backwards.. BUT other than that great post
Thanks for commenting Brian. It was a conscious decision and I have answered this remark on many other comments attached to this video.
@@RalphAstley i hope my post did not come over as flaming you. and as i said a great post,.. i must admit to not reading all the comments, so was not sure if you were aware, thank you for a great post of the game,, i enjoyed it a lot
@@brianbetteridge8364 Not at all. Sorry if I appeared a bit short - just a bit grumpy today and many people have made the same observation as yourself but not as politely.
@@RalphAstley ah no i didnt take your reply as being ''short''.. i know on the net people take great joy in looking for faults etc that they can point out, just so they can point them out, i simply wondered if it had occurred to yourself. i admit i did not read many of the replies . if i had i would not have repeated the comments, i loved the vid so much so i have just ordered a 3rd rate and frigate so thanks for getting me into naval wargames.. although if i go blind or insane doing rigging i will blame you :-D
Have been wondering If I should just custom build my own fleets.
Yes do.
@@RalphAstley I do Ships from Star Wars miniatures on my channel. I scratch build alot I even did a Scaled out Immobilizer cruiser but ships like these are new for me. I am very curious on how I would do sails and ropes and keep them small enough so they can still be little game pieces. I love to paint stuff thats super tiny. Just curious on media for the most part. Was thinking foam for the hulls
@@battlefieldcustoms873 Foam seems to me like it would be too soft. If you intend to rig models then the taut lines would pull on the foam and you would have too much slack. I've never heard of anyone scratch building sailing ships but it sounds like you are up for the challenge.
@@RalphAstley I have a good friend who has 3D printed for me and I really enjoy the paint aspect of it. We have the Hull files I am curious to if I am going to just go with my own rule set like I always do haha
excellent!
Thanks Fraser. Good meeting you at Salute today.
Nice!!!!where can i find a copy (or pdf) of the rules?????
I'm afraid they are Warhammer Historical rules and GW pulled the plug on them (just like the Warhammer Ancient Battles rules). The only place you see them for sale nowadays is privately on e-Bay and the price is often prohibitive.
I picked up a copy of the rules, but I'm unfamiliar with warhammer games. Would you be able to do a game play demo or tutorial?
I may be able to do something but not in the immediate future as I have other projects on the go at the moment. I don't think these rules closely follow other Warhammer rules, so don't let that put you off.
V ery nice ships. Who makes those and in what scale?
Langton Miniatures - 1:1200
Thanks. Again, they look very nice. You did a good job with those.
Excellent models, where did you get the markers from?
Litko released some markers specifically for Warhammer Age of Sail immediately before Warhammer dropped the game - bad timing so I doubt Litko still produce them, but then again they probably sold so few you may be able to obtain them from old stock.
Ty sir
Where do you find this game?
It is no longer available - Games Workshop pulled the plug on Warhammer Historical games many years ago. You may find a copy on eBay but will have to pay a high price for it because of its scarcity value.
I need more explanation of rules.
Maybe I'll do a video specifically on the rule mechanisms in the future, but it's kind of academic as they are no longer available.
where can i find these ships??
They are from Langton Miniatures (www.rodlangton.com). You can also often find them for sale on e-Bay. They are purchased in parts, so masts, hulls, and shrouds are separate, and assembly is required. To rig them is an additional skill required.
miniatures scale? 1:1200? Langton?
Correct to both.
What brand of ships are those please and what scale? Thanks
Langton Models. 1:1200
@@RalphAstley Thanks!
Where to buy ships like these?
Langton Miniatures
I find the rules heavy going. it would have been nice if you had gone into how the game worked.
The problem being that a description of how the rules work was futile given that they are no longer available and the downloads necessary to play them were on a website that no longer exists. I did think about a run through of the rules but that would have added another ten minutes to the duration and been of interest only to a small proportion of the audience so decided to go with a theme more along the general lines of the fun of Age of Sail wargaming. If you find these rules heavy going what are you comparing them to? I would place them at the accessible end of the spectrum compared to others still commercially available.
The purist in me likes the ship models, but also cringes because the flags and pennants on their masts are not pointing towards the bow of the ship their on. Sailing ships don't go faster than the wind, and the wind is usually behind them, so those flags and pennants never point to the rear of a ship in motion.
Your point has been made many times already. I'm perfectly happy with the flags the way they are. In reality gravity is more likely to cause long heavy pennants to droop in all but the strongest winds and this would not make for an attractive appearance. It also allows for more compact storage of the models. Many oil paintings of the period take artistic license and portray flags and pennants in this way and I do the same. To me the flags are there to allow for identification of the models, which are playing pieces. If I were building models for display purposes I would take more care over how I position flags and pennants.